Worlds Finals breakdown; DoubleLift vs Regi - Summoning Insight S4E26 (feat. Zven and Richard Lewis)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 16 ก.ค. 2024
- Summoning Insight is the premier League of Legends esports talk show and podcast.
Join MonteCristo and Thorin with guests Jesper "Zven" Svenningsen, Cloud9 AD carry, and Richard Lewis, esports host and investigative journalist, as they discuss the Worlds finals between DAMWON and EDG, Zven's experience on C9 at Worlds, roster rumors, the Reginald vs DoubleLift drama, and more.
This episode was filmed on November 12th, 2021.
Come join the Insight on Esports Discord for in-depth discussion across esports: / discord
0:00:00 - Roster news
0:20:43 - Zven intro + 2021 recap
0:33:05 - Thoughts on C9's year and future
0:48:17 - Blaber and Perkz
0:53:24 - Thoughts on the "potential" Vitality roster
1:01:39 - Worlds Finals
1:23:36 - Lack of content during Worlds
1:34:33 - FPX and TSM
1:47:42 - Zven on the roster drama
2:04:44 - Richard Lewis intro + TSM Holy War context
2:18:33 - Roster decision-making at TSM
2:27:48 - Leena's role
2:36:53 - Reginald's behavior
2:46:57 - TSM coaching staff woes
3:01:10 - The Regi defense brigade
3:17:51 - Price of being critical of TSM
3:37:51 - Final thoughts
3:41:01 - Will the LoL esports bubble pop?
3:43:59 - "Roster leak" twitter accounts
3:51:57 - "The Green Knight" in esports
3:57:03 - What was the best event this year?
4:00:45 - Multi-year contracts
4:01:20 - Favorite signature champions
4:01:42 - LCS to Korea?
4:02:38 - Fan loyalty in esports
4:11:32 - Thorin's ideal episode of "Reflections"
4:11:43 - What if Riot used "regional" patches for Worlds?
4:12:59 - Thoughts on the Dune movie
#LoLWorlds
#LoLEsports
#LoLPodcast - เกม
![แฉ [2/4] 12 ก.ค. 67 เจ้าของไวรัลดังในโซเชียล 'ลิลลี่ เหงียน' ฝันอยากเข้าวงการ โดนหลอกสารพัด | GMM25](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/7zntQK2U8-8/mqdefault.jpg)
Monte is obviously in a good mood after the Broncos beat the Cowboys. He can't hide it.
The Thorin rants in this episode are going to be epic
Lol haven't even watched it yet, its gonna be a banger!
Literally what I came for
I have literally not looked at LoL at all anymore in at least 4 years. But when youtube recommends Thorin ranting about TSM: COUNT ME IN!
Nah...TSM isn't in the title. Creeper.
It says double lift and regi… that’s tsm lol
@@Habeev07 why tf is he a creeper?
Same, I notice a lot of people saying they quit watching League 3-5 years ago.
I hope Thooorin will come back to his statement of 'If Khan chokes on World finals it would be the most Khan way to end his career'
It blows my mind that the yelling man-child goading Dyrus with 3-year old tactics of annoy-then-blame-the-target-for-snapping called Dyrus rude
I think doublelift has flaws, but regi is legitimately a bad person.
Sounds almost like a narcissistic personality disorder but then again long distance diagnosis without actually knowing context sucks. Sad for sure thou that one of the orgs. with the most potential is run by a guy who has managed to drive away even his biggest franchise player. TSM with all their clout and cash could field a legitimately internationally competitive roster if they had managed to build it across the years if there wasn’t so much incompetence at the top
Is he a bad person? More likely he's along the lines of an aggressive asshole. I wouldn't necessarily outright call him abusive and evil as DL portrayed him as.
Regi is straight up arrogant prick. Belittled Dyrus so much, treated him and so many others like complete garbage. I truly hope he gets what he deserves :/
@@ZXbolterZX go watch some of the old tsm footage, and tell me again he isnt abusive.
Comparing DL to Regi is moot. This isnt about DL. This is about Regi and how he has treated so many players terribly/ A lot of orgs treat their players like trash.
The Holy War II
“ We told you so “
That synchronized laugh after Thorin's comment at 13:44 LMAO
The point about the lack of content was so true. First year i got into LoL there were videos on youtube about the players; Chawy and CoreJJ. I got invested in the stories of these players and that made the tournament even better.
Enjoy hearing Zvens perspective because he seems like such a relatable guy. He isn’t trying to create a public persona he is just trying to be authentic in a inauthentic environment (public eye.) Thank you Zven
Lol “basically Zven… how could somebody look past Jensen” damn that was a good one that went right over everyone’s heads
I don't get that one
@@ghostaccountlmao Zven was BMing Jensen during LCS Finals opening ceremony 2 years ago and some fans were flaming him for it.
ahhahahah thats funny af actually
@@RiveliusPL 2019 spring finals zven mocked jensens height for anyone who didnt see
"went right over everyone’s heads" niceee
SwordArt: From a worlds finalist to not even making worlds in NA.
Spoiler:
Only possible on the Talent Suppression Machine.
Anyone that scams Regi out of millions is a winner in my books.
I mean SA wasn’t that good in the first place compared to other lpl supports. Guy just was a big name with a good agent and fucked regi; which makes him a great guy in my book.
@@zzdog2200 swordart was good in his prime in flash wolves a decent jungler that played well around karsa and maple top 10 in the world in his peak when he went to tsm it was like a football team hiring a player with 37 years old and paying him max contract its either for marketing or insanity in this case it was the 2nd
@@zzdog2200 I mean SN went from world finalists to not even knowing what letter the word "macro" starts with after they lost SA. He was very obviously doing something on that SN roster that he couldn't do on TSM. I'd expect him to be back in the LPL next year and play for a legitimately good team and his team will be good enough to completely shit on every single NA team aside from maybe the rumored TL superteam.
@@hampustornros its not that though, the rest of lpl changes so often. none of the top 3 lpl teams last year were in top 4 this year which shows its not just a suning support change since JDG and Top esports both didn't make worlds.
Been waiting for this banger
Sven volunteering to join the 2nd Crusade is fucking hilarious. I stan Sven for this.
13:54 the way they both just start laughing is pure gold, tons of meme potential in there for sure
Monte, Thorin, and Richard Lewis together never disappoints
I want to say I appreciate thorin's joke about Zven overlooking Jensen
Time stamp or estimate?
De ras wunna had me waiting days for this vid so i could hear thoorin go in. Shouting u all out from the beautiful island of Barbados!!!!
The day has come boys
Anyone else get the subconscious banger alert
As someone who enjoyed most of the Dune books, I could definitely appreciate the stunning cinematography while understanding that it would be almost impossible to do enough actual storytelling for a good movie. You guys rightly pointed out that it would indeed benefit from the TV series format allowing more time to be allotted to important world and character building, and having the first book done in 2 movies absolutely feels rushed in every sense of the word. There's just not enough time to build the story up properly, regardless of which scenes you pick to show in 2 and a half hours. So honestly, knowing that I think made me able to appreciate the movie more, and I'm definitely looking forward to the next one. I think like Monte said, I can fill in a lot of the details from the book in my head since I really know what happened, and they didn't actually stray so far from the source material (like Game of Thrones, even in the seasons which have corresponding books written) as to ruin the adaptation for me. I can understand Richard's criticisms, the actor for Paul wasn't necessarily what I would have pictured when listening to the audiobooks, and they may have been able to do a better job of pacing and scene selection even within the time constraints. That said, I think it was very enjoyable for what it was, and I will probably end up seeing the next one in theaters, and hope that it at least gets a 3rd movie as well. After all, if the films are successful enough, might that give us more chances for a full on Dune TV series on HBO/Amazon/Netflix or something? THAT could be sick if they get the right people for it, and would at least alleviate the issues that I think are inevitable when trying to do a feature film adaptation.
The critically salivated over Villanueve film is about as thrilling as oatmeal. All the oddity, kink, and terror of Lynch's panned original is completely drained for this lifeless husk of a film where the main focus seems to be ensuring that not a hair on Chalamet's head is ever out of place. The Fremen woman they chose to act as the exposition machine is utterly terrible, just spewing lines that clearly mean nothing to her, and grinning Zendaya thinks she's in a big budget Nickelodeon movie. What an overhyped pile of garbage.
i respect swordart. why? because he got the bag and dipped after a year. didnt need to win the lcs and didnt need to attend worlds. just played 2 splits and got those bags
Zoomer mindset. No morals.
during his break in Taiwan SA streamed for a while. He brought up the work ethics of TSM when he was expressing his views on the Maoan situation. He slighted hinted that he had problems working with some of his teammates back at TSM, but he didn't talk about Regi (prob due to contract etc.)
You can't tell me DL dating regi's ex has nothing to due with his salt levels at doublelift.
Oh it for sure does regis ego is giant there's no way he ever let's that go
"Yo Peter, Did she complain about size yet" "No, mine's bigger" "Ok, We never needed you at TSM actually"
Definitely numerous factors.
@@gmka3920 regi the type of dude to argue during sex
@@Joedirt32
That made me laugh harder then it should have
Zven is such a good guest to have imo
always like hearing zven talk
Godbless these people. Drama getting uncovered.
loved this episode
The show we've all been waiting for... 🍵
Regi's collective emotional maturity, if turned into liquid, could fit in a colander.
that's a convoluted metaphor.
@@jp-sn6si Funny mental image though
regi is the jerry jones of esports. the best line in this episode.
When are monte and thorin going to start a sponsored book club?
I thought I was a TSM fan up until Bjergsen left. Then I realized I was just a Bjergsen fan
I can't believe Riot also missed the obvious Aaron vs Kkoma bo5 draft showdown ...
EDG Aaron was not coach in world, EDG was Maokai. Aaron was in China
it was Maokai vs KKoma
Is hilariously amusing that people came out to defend Reginald in the span of 1-5 hours on November 11. They legit say similar shit almost like they were asked to say it or paid to.
Any video that has thooorin, richard and monte....you better believe im watching this wntire show!
All it took to get Rich on the show was a summoning ritual that included 5 cases of beer and a bottle of top shelf whiskey, and Reginald being Reginald in public again.
I've been fckin fiending for this
I fear Thorin is my dopamin dealer xD. Love the episode.
I used to be a big TSM fan but over many years it's just been harder and harder to like them. I honestly don't really give a shit about esports anymore and a big part of that is because of TSM
I started as a TSM/C9 fan then whent to FNC,OG and C9 and now i am a C9/G2 fan. I dont hate on FNC and TSM but it is aways the same whit thouse teams:
A the players look good intil they drop the ball when it matters;
B the orgs do some dum shit that makes you whant to dislike them;
C there is aways some player drama in the end of each year.
It gets tiring to suport thouse teams.
Esports needs an ATP style tour with 3-4 majors/worlds every year.. Domestic circuits, continental circuits and world events along side points systems to rank teams in an official matter to allow seeding to the prestigious events.
Instead of the different courts you would get in Tennis, different formats could be used to differentiate what you're testing for in said tournament, allowing for diverse winners due to the different formats testing different things
I.E Bo1 group into single elem brackets vs a open bracket double elem
The constant testing eventually leads the correct format being used for each titles worlds/major event.
What's the dnd reference at 03:16:10 ? Am a sucker for that lore, would like to read up
I mean it's not just the dollar amount that Regi has cost his team with this, the cost in momentum is huge. Think about CLG, when LCS started they were one of the top 3 teams in NA, but over time mismanagement and poor decisions by Hotshot or whoever else was calling the shots at the top slowly allowed their prestige to slip and now they're one of the joke teams of the league. Would a top player go to CLG now unless he had no other choice? Probably not. It's only one year, but it doesn't take too many more instances like this for Regi to put TSM on the path to CLG-hood.
I get what you mean but I think tsm has a different type of fan base than clg had.
I think tsm fans are generally speaking more “fans” meaning they don’t have a clue and will like it either way. Therefore streamers will want to be there, players don’t want to work against this big fan base. As a new player you get so much attention just because there is “tsm” in your stream title. (At least that’s how it used to be, idk)
So I think it’ll take a little bit more than for clg, but I agree that this could be the beginning of it since a lot of people were fans because of bjergsen, and also people who are only fans might not stay if tsm keeps losing with boring rosters which no one of those fans knows the names of the players on it.
Looking rough if they don’t get it together.
But honestly it’s a miracle people still joined tsm even though it was public ally known how shit and toxic it is to work there 🤷♂️
@@zentrix4161 It's true, they have a certain degree of insulation because of the blindly loyal fanbase, but i was thinking more from a prestige perspective, you're right that even if TSM lost that prestige they'll likely not be in danger of losing the TSM faithful, at least for a while, there are plenty of orgs who've retained massive fanbases without having major success, Curse managed to do it without ever getting better than 4th, but from a talent acquisition perspective, losing the prestige really hurts them.
Now there's an argument to be made that TSM haven't been a seriously competitive team for a while, but their name has always been thrown around in that sort of fashion, i always hear people say "well you can never count TSM out". However once you've lost the reputation for being a team that has a serious chance to compete for the title every split you also lose your ability to attract a certain kind of player, the Perkz's, the Alphari's, The Capses the top tier players who are hungry for success to make a name for themselves and not just looking to cash out, they aren't going to consider coming to you. Or they're only going to come when they're in their rookie form and use you as a stepping stone to get somewhere else but you're not going to get another franchise player like a Bjergsen or a Rekkles who'll commit to staying with you. People *will* put up with being abused if it produces results, not saying that's right, just that it's true, however they won't put up with it for 5th place which is where TSM is likely to end up with leadership decisions like this.
I really think this is the start of the real downward spiral for them. And the beauty is that they absolutely did it to themselves.
@@Arkaine197 yes absolutely. I wasn’t talking about perkz and caps cause I don’t think they’d ever go to tsm since they never produced good results internationally. I was more thinking about new players or na players who are good, but not world class.
Like you mentioned, young players will only use them as step to their next team because of the brand (if anything is left of it then).
Like I said, I think as well that they are going down if they don’t immediately change anything.
Happy to see it.
I started playing and watching in s5 and obviously I was a tsm fan to some degree even though I’m from Europe, simply because my friends told me about them and they had bjergsen who had all these outplay highlights and managed to actually compete internationally sometimes.
When I found out more and more about what was going on behind the scenes I started to hate that team so much. Especially because they cater to fans who barely play and don’t understand anything what’s going on and just follow the big brand, who will blindly follow, while being such a toxic shitty workplace.
People kinda get “tricked” into being a fan. If they’d actually know what is going on a lot of people would leave it.
(Not talking about the hardcore tsm subreddit people. They are lost.)
Now that bjergsen is out and doublelift brought that topic to a bigger audience I think a lot of casual fans will leave. Like you said, well deserved. They did it to thenselces
You guys are hopeful but money talks and TSM have a lot of fucking money.
Amazing stuff
I love how Richard referenced Dungeons and Dragons
Zven and Dick Lewis. The perfect show. Thank you
what were they talking about in the last SI that was sponsor by C9 ?
I love how Richard recognizes the toxic behavior being normal in Kitchens
Worked in more than a few before esports.
To adapt the first book, you'd need at least ten hours, I completely agree that it should have been a tv show. I feel that they did a decent job with the screen time they had
the laugh shared at 13:54 is a laugh only shared by longtime friends
that was fucking beautiful
Haven't watched esports in years but i'm always good to come back to shit on TSM.
Fucking banger episode. The most honest people in the biz.
Régi just comes in like
"You think you can milk meeee" 😂
To be fair, DWKs strength has always been teamfights and they were losing the majority of 5v5 teamfights throughout the series. If you are known as the best team-fighting team in the world and yet you keep losing at it, how can you play to your strengths?
I mean their strength is not necessarily teamfighting alone - Its the 2v2 of Canyon and Showmaker as well the 3 man Squad of Beryl, Showmaker and Canyon both invading and covering Canyons jungle then rotating to topside to get them ahead whilst Ghost plays things like Jhin, Kaisa, etc and plays weakside - The problem for DK is that Scout and JieJie had Canyon and Showmaker for most of the series and Flandre is arguably the best weakside toplaner in the world so putting him behind particularly on Graves largely means nothing.
@@jamescalder5115 Thats true too, and that's with DWK prioritizing Showmakers picks throughout the series by either early or counter picking.
I feel like I'm just used to getting my storylines from youtube now that I don't even notice anymore how Riot drops the ball. I watched that 40 minute video about Scout so I was totally informed :D
Oh baby I'm ready for the roasts that are about to ensue
Plot twist Bjergsen has a NDA with reggie worth millions
Sven saying its below his paygrade is the biggest fuckin flex. mans a fuckin legend
Zven* ffs... saying sven will make people think of svenskeren
That's my boy Jesper
How can they fucking do a 4.5 hour show? Madness!
That synchronized laugh at 15:55 was great
16:20 what drink is that? Never seen that kind of can
It's cool the zven didn't throw akadan under the bus even though he got in a fist fight with him. Zven probably understands the pressure regi put on akadan and forgives him.
"it's actually below my pay grade" fking legend
13:54 LMAO that synced laughter is so perfect
Damn and I was just thinking haven't seen Montecristo in a while LOL
Thoorin my man, im searching a old video, something called "season 4 Worlds fiesta" with Alex Ich, IWILLDOMINATE and a bunch of other guests. Tell me buddy, did you remove that masterpiece? Keep the good work white fellah. God bless.
btw. so what was the story with Quaz and him leavin TL? I forgot.
He was high on molly all the time
@@edwardkielbasa5950 was it molly I don’t think I heard the drug named
I remember for sure he said he bought MDMA pills.
Why did sven get benched after spring?
I don't think that it's so much that bjergson coasted and more that when it came down to it, he was focused on not being the reason the team lost instead of being the reason that the team won and take the career risks associated with that type of playstyle.
Monte referencing Hyuna killed me lol
hats off to regi v regi line
3:30:46 And when Mark heard Richard's words, he launched an independent investigation. LUL
TSM did start out as a League of Legends team led by Regi, Except that Regi himself didn't transform from being a team leader from a group of friends that were teen/young adult, into a grown adult that is now a CEO of multi million dollar e-sports team. He probably is stuck in his old mentality because it did bring him so many trophy's and glory in the past. I am also pretty sure he is genuinely nice to all his close friends and families, but so are most people. I just hope that he matures honestly, cus quite honestly I just want this industry to keep growing, and TSM as well as all the other orgs are all essential to the growth of this industry,, better to hope for their maturity than cursing them for being incompetent.
Thorin uncensored the best lol at least he just get through the point without bullshit.
waiit so SI is not with c9 again is about that episode?
I hope Zven role swap to Sup is viewed as him wanting to be a team player and being dedicated to the game. Oh btw, Vuncan vs Zven, omg that's just hype to think bout xD
I WAS SCREAMING FOR C9 TO PLAY SENNA ALL PLAYOFFS AND WORLDS. It would have put them over the top in so many team fights with the ult over the top and especially helping Fudgefactor* in the the top lane. Sit back and FARM that range. IDC if she was gutted* she still scales immense and has a GLOBAL!!! Somehow they still made quarters... Zven was a Senna main 2020...
if TSM was a publicly owned company Regi would be kicked out of it after those roster signings in 2020. Just like Steve Jobs was kicked from Apple back in a day
Thorin and Monte have been fighting a long battle with Reggie for YEEEAAAARS and they get no recognition. Double lift comes out and says something 1 time and gets a standing ovation 😂😂 the shit that happens in this scene is insane
"It's really hard to perform in a team and country you're unhappy in"
Explains what happens to many of the great Korean players when you remove them from Korea too.
And the line about Perkz missing his family is why my friend retired.
I really love listening to monte talk but christ is it hard to tolerate Thorin
Your voice is great monte
TSM is the Cleveland Browns of the LCS.
Busting in like the 1/2 coolaide man 😂
Ofc you can blame the teams. Especially the NA orgs who've overspent for years and raises salaries to unsustainable levels. If teams werent hyper inflating player values this past 4 seasons we would be in better situation.
Yow montes back
I think what china did was good they got an audience into their studio for live view party and had casters there as well casting as if it was a live event
That ad timing was so strange.worlds of lol and we get a animated series ad then right in to pick and bansxD
3h mark: will never buy a team item,simply i have more interest in players then teams. Say i was a selfmade fan i would have 5 diffrent team jerseys/hoodies x 3-4,mousemaps and so on from the last 5 years. Within 2-3 years every player,coach,sub,rookie might be switched out, who the f am i supporting with team items the owner?
Zven's "jesus christ" after Thorin's "soon it'll be ok to hit chinese people" is me every time someone makes a shite joke. I get that so much.
🤣
riot should hire Gbay to do their shoulder content, his documentary before worlds about scout is really good content.
Ha. Imagine riot actually putting effort into telling good stories before matches. Let gbay do his own thing without being tied to Riots stupid whims
TheLoos3Goos33 Riot could have written a whole freaking book just from group A. FPX v C9: can perkz get his revenge? C9 v DWG: can C9 show their growth, or will DWG slap them and perkz down again? DWG v FPX: The last 2 world champions meet. Can khan and DWG defeat nuguri? Is doinb really better than Showmaker? RGE v C9: can Rogue finally take down perkz? Did they improve enough to finally take down the best EU has ever produced? RGE v DWG: how would it have looked like if RGE had went to MSI? MAD took DK to game 5, could RGE maybe have won against them? So many potential for storytelling, and this is just from ONE group.
Yea the dude that says Eastern players are not creative like western players should really be hire by riot...rofl.
Dude also thinks Marin carried Faker...LOL.
lady macbeth
Regicide
i wasn't ready
Unfortunately fans can never remain objective and just look at all the evidence given and just think themselves for once.
@1:11:30 First Monte said DK's game 1 draft was arrogant, then he said DK's drafts later were cowardly. Hmmm....
People have been dyeing to see a lol match live again when they are able to do it again it will be massive engagement
I was just the other day thinking wtf ever happened to montecristo and DoA and googled them.
Miss those two. I have never played Lol before but used to watch it a lot, though haven't since 2017 I think? Been awhile... Ever since Samsung Galaxy went from last place team to the finals of the next world, then winning worlds in a dominant fashion seemingly all because of a patch change, at least I remember that being the reason constantly cited for why good teams were doing bad and bad teams were suddenly dominating when nothing else had changed.
If the worst team can become the best team because of a patch, then wtf is anything!? Who's skilled and who's just skilled at a current meta? Is anything real!? Am I real!?
I just stopped caring...
That OG team with soaZ, amazing, xpeke, niels and mithy turned me into a hardcore LEC fan from Australia..
Back then LCK, LCS, and LEC just felt... different.
I dunno, it doesn't feel like it's nostalgia, but it might be.
@@planescaped nah its just Nostalgia, LEC is still fantastic and production constantly improves
Personal opinion 100T is FAR better than they got to show. They were in the same group as EDG and T1 (the #1 and what most would consider the 3# best teams of the whole event) and still managed to end up with a respectable 3-3 record.
I believe they would've popped off and easily placed top 2 in any other group.
I think the biggest reason rekkles can't find a team simply comes down to the fact ADC (in my opinion) is the easiest role competitively. (Not to be confused with the easiest role in soloq) My evidence for this is the fact we've had many rookie ADC's in every region except maybe China do incredibly well recently. Upset, Gumayusi, FBI, Johnsun, the list goes on. If I'm a team owner I wouldn't consider a veteran ADC worth the money given this pattern.
Did you just call Upset a rookie? xD
@@burnbobquist8999 Huh, I thought he was a rookie but you're right he's not. I could have sworn I heard lec casters saying he was a rookie, replaced rekkless, and overperformed this year.
Upset is known as a top tier adc for at least 2 years. Fbi was a proffesional midlaner since his ability to play other role at the same level (also other laners played adc but didn't find such succes). Gumayusi is indeed a new player but this one example is an exception to the rule. Out of 20 new adcs in Korrea in the last 3 years only 2 or 3 were succesfull: teddy, gumayusi and viper. The other are still veterans adc. Also an example contradicting your statement is alao that veterans are still good and playing at the highest level: Zven, Reckless, Doublelift, Uzzi. Good adc players can make a difference as much as other players in other roles. I remember when T1 lost to Geng? (Amazing team) in the finals because in game 5 the adc (varus) flashed ulted Faker ending up killing him and winning the entire series, tournament and trophy. So if you want to have a mid tier adc and pay 200k instead of having a top tier adc for 2 mil but solo winning the finals, you are free to choose.
Mentats and butlerian jihad stuff isn't relevant to the main plot of the book. It was an easy thing to cut. And they still leave enough there for those who read the books to appreciate it within the movie. The mentats looked dope
People should now talk about how LFL will be boosted in viewership