If you enjoy the video, please leave a comment, like the video, and subscribe so it helps the algorithm. Also, please take the time to visit my site and sign up for my newsletter. On my site, I will have a store area, and a Ballistics Testing area with data on rounds I’ve already tested and will test in the future. linktr.ee/ConditionZero
This is one of those videos that proves you can’t skip over the smaller channels when searching. This was the best comparison video of these 3 loads on TH-cam imo.
If you are looking to see the coolest shił out the more popular channels will have all of that but if you want truth yes the smaller channels are filled with it
I really like how you picked the heaviest of each caliber to test as opposed to try to match the bullet weight. To me me that is just a better way to test the ammo
I feel as if this is the fairest way to test each caliber when comparing them to each other. You can always make one caliber superior to another when you take the 'best' grain in this caliber and compare it to the 'worst' in another caliber. I do plan on soon comparing the 9MM+P 124gr HST, .40SW 165gr HST, and .45ACP 185gr HST one day though. The fastest HST in each of the three calibers would be an interesting test. Thanks for watching and leaving feedback! Your support really helps!
I carry HST most of the time and sometimes Gold•Dot or Ranger T-series! The HST is very consistent! I have tested over 300 rounds of various ammo types and barrel lengths! I have never ever seen a HST, Gold•Dot or Ranger T-series come apart! The HST is the most consistent round I have tested! I have tested sub compact, compact and standard barrel lengths! The compact 4" barrel mostly always has the best results! All rounds were tested through 4 layers of denim and 4 to 5 jugs of water! Most rounds stop in 3 to 4 water jugs! The HST always opens up the biggest! The Ranger T-series is a wicked jagged round though! I hope this helps! All my test were done at 10' away!
You're exactly right! It is truly the gold standard is todays markets. I see a ton of people praising the Gold Dots but in my personal, non-professional, opinion, The HST blows the Gold Dot out of the water. The HST is truly a barrier blind projectile whereas the GD tends to give in towards some heavy clothing material and will clog up and act as an FMJ round. Thanks for watching!
HST's Gold dots & Hornady XTP's or there polymer tip JHP's are 4 of the best and if you want cheap stuff that still works Winchester white box.. and in 357 mag the good ole Remington HTP's semi jacketed hollow points are hard to beat.. golden sabers are pretty good in certain calibers too but some faster one's have jacket separation.. Corbon Buffalo Bore & double tap are worth an honorable mention too because they also have some good loads
@@johnryan6658 but they also have better penetration.. depends on what your looking for they perform really well in 45 ACP 10mm and 357 mag.. not all of them have "lousy" expansion either.. 200 grain 45 +p XTP still expands 3/4 of an inch and penetrates better than most 45 loads.. and in 10mm they perform as good as anything.. and the critical defense 357 mag and critical duty also perform really well for a 357.. Hornady makes really good rounds they just might not be quite on the level of HST'S in some calibers but neither is speer gold dots but everyone praises them lol there all 3 the best when it comes to defensive bullets in my opinion regardless of caliber and they all make really good rifle rounds too
@@finalcountdown7658 I would think it would limit penetration some as well. Hopefully I never have to find out but if I do then I pray that shot placement is key, regardless of caliber
@@SuperD00D , the plain energy number doesn't take into account the fact that the .45 has is a larger piston. To get the true effect, you have to take the total expanded diameter into account, because that full diameter is pushing the piston through the gel. The larger the piston, the more effect it has on the target. That's why the block jumps more with the .45acp. It works that way in the human or animal body as well. However, all that matters with pistol rounds is how much material the bullet can move, which still gives the .45acp the advantage round for round. Once you reach velocities in the 1400-1500fps and above, then you have the situation where the stretch cavity becomes part of the permanent wound channel. That's why rifle's and magnum pistols are so much more capable do do far more damage.
Thanks for the best you tube video of the 9mm, 40SW and the 45ACP. Not only that but you used same brand pistols, ammunition manufacturer, same style of bullet and the heaviest grain bullet from the manufacturer. Then you also did a average of 5 bullets of each caliber and the velocity at impact and the penetrations, retained weights, and expanded bullet diameters. The only thing I saw missing was the factory velocity, but I can find that online. Overall a fantastic job. Glad I found your video. I am now subscribed and look forward to your videos. Great job!!!!! Thank you!!!
Right? Two years ago I was buying 200 packs of federal premium 9mm for $33…. Now it’s double that or more if you can find it. Federal aluminum case was $7/50 and I was like “I’m not shooting that through a $1,000 pistol” now I’d probably shoot steel case/steel core Yugoslav +p+ SMG surplus if the price was right.
I can get self defense ammo almost at what I was buying it prior for... it's the ball ammo that's still 20-30 dollars or more a 50 round box depending on brand and caliber, which is ridiculous.
I'm impressed that the HST 9mm ammo performed so well. It looked like all 3 calibers not only penetrated well, but expanded very well. In other videos using same brands, the 40 penetrated better than the 9 and 45.
As TN Outdoors 9 said about 10 years ago...the hst in 45 acp looks like a freakin terantula... But all were amazing...agree with your choice of clothing...
180grains was always too heavy for the .40 S&W. 165 grains gives the best energy dump and will expand slightly bigger. It’s 165gr @ 1130fps for 468ft-lbs of energy. That’s stubby baby 357 mag levels of energy.
When you go on LuckyGunners homepage where he has a lot of testing data the Remington Goldensaber 180gr open up the most with .82 inch followed by Remington Ultimate Defense with .79 inch and another Remington 180gr with .78 inch. From his data 180gr is better.
Spot on. .40's sweet spot IS 165gr full power at 1150fps, like Speer's Gold Dot in that loading. Or WW Ranger T/Ranger Bonded 165gr loads. Same as 124gr is the sweet spot for 9x19 and 200gr the sweet spot for .45ACP.
My LE department issues the 147gr HST for 9’s and the 230gr HST for those that desire to carry a .45. My department (10,000+ sworn) has done exhaustive testing for the past 2 decades. They concluded long ago that between these three most popular calibers, one doesn’t perform any “better” than the next one. They all perform nearly identical. What’s more critical is shot placement. You can fill someone up with an 18-round “mag dump” to non-vital areas of the body and it’s still possible that he’s going to keep shooting back at you. But even if a bullet hits a vital organ like the heart, the bad guy can still fight for several seconds, long enough to nearly empty his magazine at you. Unless a CNS (brain stem) shot occurs, there’s no guarantee of an instant incapacitating stop of the bad guy. It doesn’t matter what caliber out of these three was used. Again, what matters is shot placement. That being said, I went back to a 9mm from a 45, because I can carry more ammo on my person and in my gun with the 9mm. The 9mm also offers less recoil and muzzle flip that .40 or .45 for faster follow up shots with more accuracy.
@@turbo-bike7999 True it does have more energy but it penetrates LESS than a 147gr 9mm. Even the 124gr 9mm FMJ will penetrate the 45. That’s actually a downfall of the 9mm, over penetration.
@@colt10mmsecurity68 That goes back to what I said earlier about frontal area and velocity. Too much velocity (big energy number) and without increased frontal area and you get over penetration ie 9mm and 10mm. Too much frontal area and not enough velocity and you get under-penetration. It’s a balance between the two. Something to do with energy equals mass times the speed of light squared. Mass x velocity….I’ll pick a 230 45 @ 900fps over anything tested so far. That’s my personal decision.
@@turbo-bike7999 Watch this… th-cam.com/video/7W5P3eQdCwQ/w-d-xo.html I’ll take 9mm over 45 any day. More ammo on ones person during the gunfight is always better. Ther performance between the 3 calibers is basically a tie. I just prefer to carry more rounds.
One of the best tests I have seen so far. Objective, consistent, and well thought out. I also completely agree with the conclusions: there is no substitute for hitting the target. Do so with the pistol/caliber combination with which you have the best control, accuracy, repeatability, and speed.
After seeing dozens 9mm tests it seems that the federal hst is the best in terms of consistent expansion and penetrarion. Of the various weights in 9mm, it seems that the 124 grain is the best. Its what I use in my edc. Stay safe out there!!!
@@golferpro1241 Where I'm from police use this HST round in their Glock17s & they're shooting criminals 5 or more times & those scumbags almost always survive.
Great video. Those federal hst rounds are awesome. I like to carry them in whatever gun I carry. I carry either my CZ P-10c with the TLR-1 HL light or my CZ 97 45. I love the realistic testing. Great job.
Another excellent video. I like the comparison format. I've never thought that concerning ourselves with bullet weight matters that much when doing these kinds of comparisons. In theory, we should try to control as many variables as possible to isolate our test, but in reality, having an objective standard in terminal performance means that making the weights match each other is irrelevant... either they meet the standard, or they do not. In the case of HST, to the shock of no one, they all meet the standard almost perfectly. Would be interested to see a similar testing format as this one (9mm/40S&W/45ACP) in other brands and loadings
Thank you not only for your support but for your feedback. Feedback like this really motivates me to continue to put in not only the time but money into these reviews. Ammo isn’t cheap in todays times. Nor is it easy to obtain. In this test I decided to use heavy for caliber loads in each caliber. I feel this makes it fair as possible. If I were to use lighter, faster, projectiles in one caliber, and then use heavier, slower, projectiles in another caliber, I would be giving one caliber an advantage over the other.
That is how I see it. They didn't perform the same -there are differences in expansion and penetration but they all performed really well for the respective calibers.
After watching many of these types of tests, it seems the 124 grain HST in 9mm is the best choice for that caliber. The 147 might be a good choice if you are using a suppressor because the velocity never makes it to 1,000 fps. HST in any caliber is a wise choice.
Outstanding video...and confirms for me my decision to EDC 9 rounds of Federal HST .45 in my Ed Brown Kobra Carry, with an additional 9 rounds in a spare mag.
Might be the most outstanding gel test video overall that I have seen. Best camera work especially the close-ups. REALISTIC fabric usage on the gel block. That departs from the FBI's "Denim specs" but is a lot more realistic for what YOU MAY FACE on the street. Presents what you need to make an intelligent choice in caliber and brand. Many thanks.
Yessir! I know it’s been awhile since I posted but I definitely have something in the works. Changing the way I test as well to better suit real life possibilities. Be sure to subscribe with the bell icon as well to get notifications sent straight to your phone!
View the image at 6:22. I own guns in all three calibers, and I carry a 9mm for reasons of concealability, weight, and capacity. That said, if they all penetrate the same, and you shoot them all equally well, you simply cannot argue that the 45 will NOT be doing more damage with each hit. If you can handle the big grip and the recoil, the Glock G21 is an excellent Home Defense choice.
Exactly. My criteria is: 4" barrel, 10 round capacity, 26 ounces or less, points naturally, good ergos, good trigger, rail, night-sights, and .45 Auto caliber. Current EDC is a Sig P-320 Compact in .45 Caliber because it meets the criteria, has never malfunctioned, and I shoot it really well. Another choice would be the Glock 30... but I prefer the Sig. HSTs or Ranger Ts, either one.
Well done vid! I think the bottom line is that with todays bullet technology, caliber choice has become a relatively moot point. While a point of a slightly larger hole over a slightly smaller hole could be made (if one just has to pick nits!), I think spending more time practicing and being able to place a bullet where it's most needed is a much more important issue than caliber choice. Yep, I love my .45's, and shoot them well, but I don't feel the least bit handicapped carrying a 9mm (my carry ammo is the Underwood brand using the Lehigh Defense Xtreme Defender bullets in all of my carry guns). However, I still don't trust the 9mm 147 ammo, especially out of short barreled 9mm's like mine (G26 & S&W 6906). I've experienced too many failures with them so I no longer consider them for carry ammo.
Trained (and used) a Sig P-250 in the military, it was .40JHP then and it still is today. Love the action on this Sig model, very reminiscent of the revolvers I grew up practicing with. Only this semi auto holds 15 instead of 6. The wife prefers it too.
My friend and I have debated 9 vs 45 off-n-on. I used to be a 45-guy but improved bullet technology convinced me to switch years ago. He's also a diehard FMJ as "the" bullet of choice. Recently, this video helped convince him "it's a draw" and I gave him a box of 45 HST for his birthday. 👍
@gengar281645 acp expands larger than 357 magnum also. Are you saying that .45 is superior to .357 solely based off bullet diameter? Size of round doesn’t tell the whole story. The 357 mag will do more tissue damage then a .45 even though it has a small diameter bullet. The only reason I bring this up is because 9mm and 357 have basically the same size projectile. The wound channels are almost indistinguishable, which lines up with what most surgical doctors has mentioned when taking out these rounds. Can’t tell the wound channels apart.
Nice test! I like the consistent "heavy weight" among the bullets approach. Personally I am generally a big fan of heavy for caliber loads. They aren't as fast and therefore generally have less kinetic energy than lighter loads, but they do seem to penetrate and otherwise have more consistent results. To be an even more level comparison, consider using +P in the 9mm and .45 (I know that Federal makes 230 +P HST, and I believe they do in the 147 as well). The 9mm and .45 were originally developed with early generation smokeless powder which was less efficient than modern powders. In later decades after many advances in chemistry, loaders realized they had a lot of extra case capacity with more modern powders which is why +P varieties came into being (to take advantage of that). The .40 was developed much more recently with the latest in chemistry, and so it is basically already "+P" in it's native form and why there is no official SAAMI spec of ".40+P", because it doesn't technically exist although some loaders market hot .40 as such.
There is a .40+p. It's more commonly known as the 10mm. Before anyone loses their shit, I'm making a joke. I know that they're actually 2 different cartridges, and I know I that the .40 was developed from the down tuned 10mm the fbi was playing with.
Great job, you kept it simple, and nothing you judged as one being better than the other. They ALL made excellent defensive rounds and are loaded in all my go to guns!!👍👍
Yessir! With the advancements in todays technology, all 3 keep getting better and better! All 3 will also very much do their job for as long as the shooters does his part!
Your test illustrated what ballistics experts have been saying for years. There is not enough of difference to matter between 9, 40 and 45. Carry what you shoot best.
Not really. 9mm averaging a diameter of 0.632” means the surface area of the bullet is about 0.31 in.^2. Meanwhile, .45ACP averaging at a diameter of 0.841” means the surface area of the bullet is about 0.56 in.^2. This is all from plugging the radius (half of diameter) into the equation for an area of a circle. Then, if we divide 0.56 by 0.31, we get about 1.8, meaning .45ACP HST actually has an 80% larger surface area, and therefore permanent wound cavity vs. 9mm HST. That is a significant difference because while the differences are small in absolute terms, they are big percentage wise, which means a capacity of 10 rounds of .45ACP being equivalent to 18 rounds of 9mm. That is far from being similar. Unless expansion doesn’t really matter, at which point hollow points are pointless and 5.7x28mm takes its rightful place as the king of pistol calibers. lol
@@gameragodzilla it doesn't work that way. You're trying to apply a physics answer to a biology question. A certain percentage larger surface area doesn't equal an equivalent percentage increase in bleeding. Also, it's not just the diameter of the wound channel the matters, but also the depth of the wound channel.
@@johnryan6658 Depth of wound channel only matters so long as it hits FBI penetration standards, so the only measurable difference is the wound channel size. And the increase percentage in surface area translates to increased percentage in tissue damage. If tissue damage size matters, and it should because, again, otherwise hollow points have no purpose, then a larger tissue damage is more worthwhile and .45ACP is objectively superior.
@@gameragodzilla the depth of the wound channel matters as long as there is more tissue to damage. 12" is the FBI minimum, not the ideal. The ideal is more like 15", with anything over 18" being excessive. Too much is better than too little.
@@johnryan6658 No, because again, that can also be cause for collateral damage. So as long as it meets that middle ground between 12" and 18", that's good enough.
That was certainly entertainment that is great testing very fair he did an awesome job he needs to be testing all the time very very fair totally impressed thank you
When all other things are equal, go for diameter. The more tissue damage you do, the better the performance. 45 ACP will give you the largest amount of tissue damage around the path of the bullet just from its diameter
@@berettaxd7566 Oh yes it does. None of these had maximum power loads behind except maybe the 9mm. The 40 was down 150fps and the 45 down a solid 75-100 FPS. Those loads are typical of Federal’s standard pressure loading……but not everyone’s. Winchester T Series in +P to name one.
Penetration depth is a balance between velocity and frontal area. Most full power 10mm loads fold the pedals back against the base or break them off….too much velocity for a given amount of frontal area.
@@turbo-bike7999 Penetration doesn't mean power, if a round goes clean through the target that's wasted energy. The idea round would not fully penetrate and would dump all its energy in the target. You get less expansion with heavier bullets because theyre slower. Velocity gives twice the energy that mass gives. That's what I meant by lighter rounder being more powerful. A quick glance at ballistics charts will tell you this.
My son and I were texting about it I want a 40 or 45 and he called me and we spoke. Beautiful results! I might stay with my 9s because I had a bad stroke in 99 and now I'm one handed.
My duty & EDC most of the time, Is the .357-Magnum loaded with Remington 125gr SJHP, My EDC semi-autos are mostly the +P HSTs, and some others like Underwood +P & +P+ JHP. 🇺🇸
I've been carrying my firearms for 2 years now. SHIELD PLUS 9mm and SHIELD 45acp. I did alot of research towards what defensive ammo I should use and EVERYTHING I've watched or read came back to HST being the top. So in all due respect to the "PROS". THATS ALL THAT I WILL CARRY!!!! Everybody CANT BE WRONG, can they???
Excellent bullet test. I agree with your real world choice of clothing material placed on the ballistics gelatine. I might point out not everyone is familiar with Glock model numbers and the caliber of bullets they shoot. When measuring expanded bullet diameters it would have been easier to follow if you had simply labeled (bullet caliber tested) largest & avg diameter with retained weight rather than saying Glock 21 etc etc etc.. look forward to watching another video
They are all good. I would definitely not want any of them hitting me! I'm a fan of larger calibers both the .40, and .45 because they are huge hard hitting rounds...But, I typically carry my 9mm Sig P365, because it is small and easy to conceal. If we could pick our battles I would choose my Glock 22 .40, or Glock 30 .45. But they are heavier to carry and harder to conceal, especially in summer. Great video brother 👍
Finally a fair comparison half these tests guys use plus p,s in some calibers and not in others and different ammo, it would be interesting if you were able to measure the whole wound Channel circumference, that 45 is a big piece of lead
I'm gonna stir the pot and say, in my opinion, I think the 45 is the better choice based on these results because of the diameter of the round. A larger wound channel means better bleed out. Of course, the instant death (heart and head shots) are more about shot placement than penetration (both are needed). As for the test itself, I think this was incredibly fair. Same platform gun, same manufacturer, heaviest for caliber by manufacturer, same (or near same) barrel length for each gun.
I greatly appreciate feedback like this! In my opinion, the .45acp will of course create more bullet crush damage, resulting in more blood loss, faster, but 9mm and .40 both penetrate deep enough to reach vitals creating equal opportunity to generate one shot stops as long as the shots are properly place. It’s all about what you shoot best with.
Great video. I would feel comfortable with any of them, Glock 17 or 22 is with me when I’m away from home. 1911 is my gun when at home or running around town. Love 1911’s, but the weight of the Glocks is nice. I have the same ammo for all 3.
If you enjoy the video, please leave a comment, like the video, and subscribe so it helps the algorithm. Also, please take the time to visit my site and sign up for my newsletter. On my site, I will have a store area, and a Ballistics Testing area with data on rounds I’ve already tested and will test in the future.
linktr.ee/ConditionZero
This is one of those videos that proves you can’t skip over the smaller channels when searching. This was the best comparison video of these 3 loads on TH-cam imo.
If you are looking to see the coolest shił out the more popular channels will have all of that but if you want truth yes the smaller channels are filled with it
A better vid would be to use separate gel for each round
I really like how you picked the heaviest of each caliber to test as opposed to try to match the bullet weight. To me me that is just a better way to test the ammo
I feel as if this is the fairest way to test each caliber when comparing them to each other. You can always make one caliber superior to another when you take the 'best' grain in this caliber and compare it to the 'worst' in another caliber. I do plan on soon comparing the 9MM+P 124gr HST, .40SW 165gr HST, and .45ACP 185gr HST one day though. The fastest HST in each of the three calibers would be an interesting test. Thanks for watching and leaving feedback! Your support really helps!
@@ConditionZero I don’t think Federal makes a 185gr HST for .45. 230 grain only. Standard or +p
@@ryanranard5187 your correct. It slipped by me when commenting
I agree however 147 is technically subsonic in 9mm, I’d rather stick with 135 or below, ideally 124/125 if I can help it.
200 grain guard dog for .45 with Auto Comp makes a great load too.
I carry HST most of the time and sometimes Gold•Dot or Ranger T-series! The HST is very consistent! I have tested over 300 rounds of various ammo types and barrel lengths! I have never ever seen a HST, Gold•Dot or Ranger T-series come apart! The HST is the most consistent round I have tested! I have tested sub compact, compact and standard barrel lengths! The compact 4" barrel mostly always has the best results! All rounds were tested through 4 layers of denim and 4 to 5 jugs of water! Most rounds stop in 3 to 4 water jugs! The HST always opens up the biggest! The Ranger T-series is a wicked jagged round though! I hope this helps! All my test were done at 10' away!
Try the 165gr Ranger T in .40 or 230gr +P in .45ACP if you want a spectacular round. They are both massive expanders after penetrating 15".
Impressed with consistency of expansion and penetration. With the .45, hard to argue with a JHP that's nearly an inch wide!
You can't go wrong with federal HST, it's one of the most consistent defense rounds by far
You're exactly right! It is truly the gold standard is todays markets. I see a ton of people praising the Gold Dots but in my personal, non-professional, opinion, The HST blows the Gold Dot out of the water. The HST is truly a barrier blind projectile whereas the GD tends to give in towards some heavy clothing material and will clog up and act as an FMJ round. Thanks for watching!
I'd add Hornady Critical Defense/Duty.
@@Boutit031 Hornady bullets have lousy expansion.
HST's Gold dots & Hornady XTP's or there polymer tip JHP's are 4 of the best and if you want cheap stuff that still works Winchester white box.. and in 357 mag the good ole Remington HTP's semi jacketed hollow points are hard to beat.. golden sabers are pretty good in certain calibers too but some faster one's have jacket separation.. Corbon Buffalo Bore & double tap are worth an honorable mention too because they also have some good loads
@@johnryan6658 but they also have better penetration.. depends on what your looking for they perform really well in 45 ACP 10mm and 357 mag.. not all of them have "lousy" expansion either.. 200 grain 45 +p XTP still expands 3/4 of an inch and penetrates better than most 45 loads.. and in 10mm they perform as good as anything.. and the critical defense 357 mag and critical duty also perform really well for a 357.. Hornady makes really good rounds they just might not be quite on the level of HST'S in some calibers but neither is speer gold dots but everyone praises them lol there all 3 the best when it comes to defensive bullets in my opinion regardless of caliber and they all make really good rifle rounds too
Watch how far the block moves backwards when it is shot. 9mm, a little, 40 more, 45 even more. Amazing how nobody takes that into consideration.
The .40 had slightly more energy than the .45. Essentjally equal. 363 vs 360
But, the 45 moved it more.
@@SuperD00D
@MemphisMojo15s According to what FBI, NATO, or any test does how far gel moves back makes a bit of a difference in incapacitation?
@@finalcountdown7658 I would think it would limit penetration some as well. Hopefully I never have to find out but if I do then I pray that shot placement is key, regardless of caliber
@@SuperD00D , the plain energy number doesn't take into account the fact that the .45 has is a larger piston. To get the true effect, you have to take the total expanded diameter into account, because that full diameter is pushing the piston through the gel. The larger the piston, the more effect it has on the target. That's why the block jumps more with the .45acp. It works that way in the human or animal body as well. However, all that matters with pistol rounds is how much material the bullet can move, which still gives the .45acp the advantage round for round. Once you reach velocities in the 1400-1500fps and above, then you have the situation where the stretch cavity becomes part of the permanent wound channel. That's why rifle's and magnum pistols are so much more capable do do far more damage.
An excellent round in all three calibers!
Thanks for the best you tube video of the 9mm, 40SW and the 45ACP. Not only that but you used same brand pistols, ammunition manufacturer, same style of bullet and the heaviest grain bullet from the manufacturer. Then you also did a average of 5 bullets of each caliber and the velocity at impact and the penetrations, retained weights, and expanded bullet diameters. The only thing I saw missing was the factory velocity, but I can find that online. Overall a fantastic job. Glad I found your video. I am now subscribed and look forward to your videos. Great job!!!!! Thank you!!!
Excellent informative demo and very well presented. Now if we can just start getting some of that ammo back on store shelves at decent prices again.
Sgammo usually has 50-packs for decent prices
Right? Two years ago I was buying 200 packs of federal premium 9mm for $33…. Now it’s double that or more if you can find it. Federal aluminum case was $7/50 and I was like “I’m not shooting that through a $1,000 pistol” now I’d probably shoot steel case/steel core Yugoslav +p+ SMG surplus if the price was right.
I can get self defense ammo almost at what I was buying it prior for... it's the ball ammo that's still 20-30 dollars or more a 50 round box depending on brand and caliber, which is ridiculous.
Good job dude.Quick,fair,to the point.I get tired of 20 minute videos that could be done in 5-10 minutes.Thanks.
I'm impressed that the HST 9mm ammo performed so well. It looked like all 3 calibers not only penetrated well, but expanded very well. In other videos using same brands, the 40 penetrated better than the 9 and 45.
This one of the best test vidoes I've ever seen. I hope you make more content.
Great presentation! Thanks for using heavy grain weight for each caliber to keep it uniform.
I like all of them, but that .45 though...😳
Cool video. I've always been a fan of the 147gr hst. Very reliable, excellent performance
As TN Outdoors 9 said about 10 years ago...the hst in 45 acp looks like a freakin terantula... But all were amazing...agree with your choice of clothing...
180grains was always too heavy for the .40 S&W. 165 grains gives the best energy dump and will expand slightly bigger. It’s 165gr @ 1130fps for 468ft-lbs of energy. That’s stubby baby 357 mag levels of energy.
When you go on LuckyGunners homepage where he has a lot of testing data the Remington Goldensaber 180gr open up the most with .82 inch followed by Remington Ultimate Defense with .79 inch and another Remington 180gr with .78 inch. From his data 180gr is better.
Spot on. .40's sweet spot IS 165gr full power at 1150fps, like Speer's Gold Dot in that loading. Or WW Ranger T/Ranger Bonded 165gr loads. Same as 124gr is the sweet spot for 9x19 and 200gr the sweet spot for .45ACP.
My LE department issues the 147gr HST for 9’s and the 230gr HST for those that desire to carry a .45. My department (10,000+ sworn) has done exhaustive testing for the past 2 decades. They concluded long ago that between these three most popular calibers, one doesn’t perform any “better” than the next one. They all perform nearly identical. What’s more critical is shot placement. You can fill someone up with an 18-round “mag dump” to non-vital areas of the body and it’s still possible that he’s going to keep shooting back at you. But even if a bullet hits a vital organ like the heart, the bad guy can still fight for several seconds, long enough to nearly empty his magazine at you. Unless a CNS (brain stem) shot occurs, there’s no guarantee of an instant incapacitating stop of the bad guy. It doesn’t matter what caliber out of these three was used. Again, what matters is shot placement.
That being said, I went back to a 9mm from a 45, because I can carry more ammo on my person and in my gun with the 9mm. The 9mm also offers less recoil and muzzle flip that .40 or .45 for faster follow up shots with more accuracy.
Interesting they give you the option between 9 and 45.
The 45 is much better at barrier penetration and hates changing direction…….it simply carries more energy.
@@turbo-bike7999 True it does have more energy but it penetrates LESS than a 147gr 9mm. Even the 124gr 9mm FMJ will penetrate the 45. That’s actually a downfall of the 9mm, over penetration.
@@colt10mmsecurity68 That goes back to what I said earlier about frontal area and velocity. Too much velocity (big energy number) and without increased frontal area and you get over penetration ie 9mm and 10mm. Too much frontal area and not enough velocity and you get under-penetration. It’s a balance between the two. Something to do with energy equals mass times the speed of light squared. Mass x velocity….I’ll pick a 230 45 @ 900fps over anything tested so far. That’s my personal decision.
@@turbo-bike7999 Watch this… th-cam.com/video/7W5P3eQdCwQ/w-d-xo.html
I’ll take 9mm over 45 any day. More ammo on ones person during the gunfight is always better. Ther performance between the 3 calibers is basically a tie. I just prefer to carry more rounds.
That 40 expanded as much as some 45 acp rounds and the 45 expansion is massive lol
That is what I'm seeing. They all expanded well for their respective calibers but clearly there is a visual diffence.
Thank you for the time and effort to do this.
One of the best tests I have seen so far. Objective, consistent, and well thought out. I also completely agree with the conclusions: there is no substitute for hitting the target. Do so with the pistol/caliber combination with which you have the best control, accuracy, repeatability, and speed.
Great test. I like that I can see all the wound tracks side by side.
Finally, a realistic test of the 3 rounds my department issues. Thank you!!!
After seeing dozens 9mm tests it seems that the federal hst is the best in terms of consistent expansion and penetrarion. Of the various weights in 9mm, it seems that the 124 grain is the best. Its what I use in my edc. Stay safe out there!!!
How have they worked in actual shootings? Thanks
@@golferpro1241 not good, they are terrible when they meet bones ...
@@golferpro1241
Where I'm from police use this HST round in their Glock17s & they're shooting criminals 5 or more times & those scumbags almost always survive.
Thanks for doing this side by side comparison. It was cool & educational to see the results.
Great video. Those federal hst rounds are awesome. I like to carry them in whatever gun I carry. I carry either my CZ P-10c with the TLR-1 HL light or my CZ 97 45.
I love the realistic testing. Great job.
Another excellent video. I like the comparison format. I've never thought that concerning ourselves with bullet weight matters that much when doing these kinds of comparisons. In theory, we should try to control as many variables as possible to isolate our test, but in reality, having an objective standard in terminal performance means that making the weights match each other is irrelevant... either they meet the standard, or they do not. In the case of HST, to the shock of no one, they all meet the standard almost perfectly. Would be interested to see a similar testing format as this one (9mm/40S&W/45ACP) in other brands and loadings
Fantastic. Excellent data. Was going to do the exact same thing tomorrow between the 40 and the 9. Heaviest grain HST.
Thank you not only for your support but for your feedback. Feedback like this really motivates me to continue to put in not only the time but money into these reviews. Ammo isn’t cheap in todays times. Nor is it easy to obtain.
In this test I decided to use heavy for caliber loads in each caliber. I feel this makes it fair as possible. If I were to use lighter, faster, projectiles in one caliber, and then use heavier, slower, projectiles in another caliber, I would be giving one caliber an advantage over the other.
Great demo!!!, Very interesting In how all the rounds acted. Also shows how consistent the ammo expansion is throughout the caliper range.
That is how I see it. They didn't perform the same -there are differences in expansion and penetration but they all performed really well for the respective calibers.
After watching many of these types of tests, it seems the 124 grain HST in 9mm is the best choice for that caliber. The 147 might be a good choice if you are using a suppressor because the velocity never makes it to 1,000 fps. HST in any caliber is a wise choice.
Just the video I needed. Great job.
Outstanding video...and confirms for me my decision to EDC 9 rounds of Federal HST .45 in my Ed Brown Kobra Carry, with an additional 9 rounds in a spare mag.
Might be the most outstanding gel test video overall that I have seen. Best camera work especially the close-ups. REALISTIC fabric usage on the gel block. That departs from the FBI's "Denim specs" but is a lot more realistic for what YOU MAY FACE on the street. Presents what you need to make an intelligent choice in caliber and brand. Many thanks.
THANKS FOR YOUR TIME AND EFFORT with these tests!
This is a great video. Very well done. I believe this level of knowledge could take this channel pretty far. Be creative, be different, and continue.
One of the best bullet comparison videos Iv seen. keep it up bro
Yessir! I know it’s been awhile since I posted but I definitely have something in the works. Changing the way I test as well to better suit real life possibilities. Be sure to subscribe with the bell icon as well to get notifications sent straight to your phone!
Lutstanding video loved it. It helped me out with a few choices
View the image at 6:22. I own guns in all three calibers, and I carry a 9mm for reasons of concealability, weight, and capacity. That said, if they all penetrate the same, and you shoot them all equally well, you simply cannot argue that the 45 will NOT be doing more damage with each hit. If you can handle the big grip and the recoil, the Glock G21 is an excellent Home Defense choice.
Exactly.
My criteria is: 4" barrel, 10 round capacity, 26 ounces or less, points naturally, good ergos, good trigger, rail, night-sights, and .45 Auto caliber.
Current EDC is a Sig P-320 Compact in .45 Caliber because it meets the criteria, has never malfunctioned, and I shoot it really well. Another choice would be the Glock 30... but I prefer the Sig.
HSTs or Ranger Ts, either one.
Wow this Ballistic test is top notch straight to the point with all the information needed. Suscribed
Well done vid! I think the bottom line is that with todays bullet technology, caliber choice has become a relatively moot point. While a point of a slightly larger hole over a slightly smaller hole could be made (if one just has to pick nits!), I think spending more time practicing and being able to place a bullet where it's most needed is a much more important issue than caliber choice. Yep, I love my .45's, and shoot them well, but I don't feel the least bit handicapped carrying a 9mm (my carry ammo is the Underwood brand using the Lehigh Defense Xtreme Defender bullets in all of my carry guns). However, I still don't trust the 9mm 147 ammo, especially out of short barreled 9mm's like mine (G26 & S&W 6906). I've experienced too many failures with them so I no longer consider them for carry ammo.
Trained (and used) a Sig P-250 in the military, it was .40JHP then and it still is today. Love the action on this Sig model, very reminiscent of the revolvers I grew up practicing with. Only this semi auto holds 15 instead of 6. The wife prefers it too.
Good straightforward no BS test. Thanks.
Well done, unbiased tests, have seen 2 of your videos, subscribing.
My friend and I have debated 9 vs 45 off-n-on. I used to be a 45-guy but improved bullet technology convinced me to switch years ago. He's also a diehard FMJ as "the" bullet of choice. Recently, this video helped convince him "it's a draw" and I gave him a box of 45 HST for his birthday. 👍
@Gengar Getting him to admit even that much was a win. 😄 But he now loads the HST in his mags and that's what really counts. 👍
@gengar2816 The 45 was about 93% larger than the 9mm. That's impressive.
@gengar281645 acp expands larger than 357 magnum also. Are you saying that .45 is superior to .357 solely based off bullet diameter? Size of round doesn’t tell the whole story. The 357 mag will do more tissue damage then a .45 even though it has a small diameter bullet. The only reason I bring this up is because 9mm and 357 have basically the same size projectile. The wound channels are almost indistinguishable, which lines up with what most surgical doctors has mentioned when taking out these rounds. Can’t tell the wound channels apart.
@@ryanranard5187Are you saying the 9mm is equal to the 357 mag or 38 special?
I love all 3 of these rounds! Great vid! Thanks
Thanks for watching! Be sure to subscribe and hit the bell icon for future content notification
Well done. Thank you. Revealing & helpful info. All will get the job done if put in the correct spot.
Great video. Just the facts, and no BS. Thanks!
Great job on your video!
Gets right to the point!
SUBSCRIBED!
Thank you! I’m not much of a talker and always appreciate videos that get to the point myself!
Very well done and informative video. Thank you for the good information.
Nice test! I like the consistent "heavy weight" among the bullets approach. Personally I am generally a big fan of heavy for caliber loads. They aren't as fast and therefore generally have less kinetic energy than lighter loads, but they do seem to penetrate and otherwise have more consistent results.
To be an even more level comparison, consider using +P in the 9mm and .45 (I know that Federal makes 230 +P HST, and I believe they do in the 147 as well). The 9mm and .45 were originally developed with early generation smokeless powder which was less efficient than modern powders. In later decades after many advances in chemistry, loaders realized they had a lot of extra case capacity with more modern powders which is why +P varieties came into being (to take advantage of that). The .40 was developed much more recently with the latest in chemistry, and so it is basically already "+P" in it's native form and why there is no official SAAMI spec of ".40+P", because it doesn't technically exist although some loaders market hot .40 as such.
There is a .40+p. It's more commonly known as the 10mm.
Before anyone loses their shit, I'm making a joke. I know that they're actually 2 different cartridges, and I know I that the .40 was developed from the down tuned 10mm the fbi was playing with.
Great simple test. Thank you.
Great job, you kept it simple, and nothing you judged as one being better than the other. They ALL made excellent defensive rounds and are loaded in all my go to guns!!👍👍
Yessir! With the advancements in todays technology, all 3 keep getting better and better! All 3 will also very much do their job for as long as the shooters does his part!
Thank you, appreciate the effort.
Great test !
Thank you so damn much. I’ve been trying to tell people it that all 3 calibers perform identical. This is the clearest evidence
I’ve always advised to carry what your comfortable with. All 3 choices will do the job just fine.
Noticed the 45 moved the whole package further than the others. Probably doesn't mean anything in the real world but I found it interesting.
Hey great choices for weight comparisons
Your test illustrated what ballistics experts have been saying for years. There is not enough of difference to matter between 9, 40 and 45. Carry what you shoot best.
Not really. 9mm averaging a diameter of 0.632” means the surface area of the bullet is about 0.31 in.^2. Meanwhile, .45ACP averaging at a diameter of 0.841” means the surface area of the bullet is about 0.56 in.^2. This is all from plugging the radius (half of diameter) into the equation for an area of a circle. Then, if we divide 0.56 by 0.31, we get about 1.8, meaning .45ACP HST actually has an 80% larger surface area, and therefore permanent wound cavity vs. 9mm HST. That is a significant difference because while the differences are small in absolute terms, they are big percentage wise, which means a capacity of 10 rounds of .45ACP being equivalent to 18 rounds of 9mm. That is far from being similar.
Unless expansion doesn’t really matter, at which point hollow points are pointless and 5.7x28mm takes its rightful place as the king of pistol calibers. lol
@@gameragodzilla it doesn't work that way. You're trying to apply a physics answer to a biology question. A certain percentage larger surface area doesn't equal an equivalent percentage increase in bleeding. Also, it's not just the diameter of the wound channel the matters, but also the depth of the wound channel.
@@johnryan6658 Depth of wound channel only matters so long as it hits FBI penetration standards, so the only measurable difference is the wound channel size. And the increase percentage in surface area translates to increased percentage in tissue damage. If tissue damage size matters, and it should because, again, otherwise hollow points have no purpose, then a larger tissue damage is more worthwhile and .45ACP is objectively superior.
@@gameragodzilla the depth of the wound channel matters as long as there is more tissue to damage. 12" is the FBI minimum, not the ideal. The ideal is more like 15", with anything over 18" being excessive. Too much is better than too little.
@@johnryan6658 No, because again, that can also be cause for collateral damage. So as long as it meets that middle ground between 12" and 18", that's good enough.
Good job conducting a fair and non biased test. Let the science speak for itself.
That was certainly entertainment that is great testing very fair he did an awesome job he needs to be testing all the time very very fair totally impressed thank you
Great video. Thanks for sharing.
Thanks for watching!
Awesome video, exactly what i was looking for
When all other things are equal, go for diameter. The more tissue damage you do, the better the performance. 45 ACP will give you the largest amount of tissue damage around the path of the bullet just from its diameter
I don't have an ax to grind and I came to the same conclusion. The .45 met depth and expanded the most .
Nice review. Well thought out and executed.
Thanks. This was very informative and well done.
Nice. I still have a relatively large stockpile of the 9mm and .45 in both standard velocity and +P. My favorite carry load.
Good comparison video
I greatly appreciate the video, keep them coming if the comment at the end doesn’t settle the caliber debate I don’t know what will
This is top notch man
You deserve many more subscribers. Great video.
Dam good video, absolutely one of the best on the subject
Another great presentation. Loving your content brother!
Enjoying the content, man. Keep up the good work.
Another good comparison might be to use the most common bullet weights used for defense, not just the heaviest.
124 gr 9mm
165 gr .40
185 gr .45
These are the best weight in full-size
Yea its a common misconception that heavier equals more power. Which is false.
@@berettaxd7566 Oh yes it does. None of these had maximum power loads behind except maybe the 9mm. The 40 was down 150fps and the 45 down a solid 75-100 FPS. Those loads are typical of Federal’s standard pressure loading……but not everyone’s. Winchester T Series in +P to name one.
Penetration depth is a balance between velocity and frontal area. Most full power 10mm loads fold the pedals back against the base or break them off….too much velocity for a given amount of frontal area.
@@turbo-bike7999 Penetration doesn't mean power, if a round goes clean through the target that's wasted energy. The idea round would not fully penetrate and would dump all its energy in the target. You get less expansion with heavier bullets because theyre slower. Velocity gives twice the energy that mass gives. That's what I meant by lighter rounder being more powerful. A quick glance at ballistics charts will tell you this.
Very well done sir! Keep up the good work.
I’ve watched so many videos comparing these 3 calibers and this is the best one so far. Very interesting results. 👍🏻
We are not all Glock fanboys. Please state calibers, not Glock models.
Cry about it! 🤡
My son and I were texting about it I want a 40 or 45 and he called me and we spoke. Beautiful results! I might stay with my 9s because I had a bad stroke in 99 and now I'm one handed.
Modern ammo has really closed the gap...if there was ever much of one...between these three calibers.
Crazy how close they are with each caliber.
Every thing was fair well done vid thanks for sharring 👍
My duty & EDC most of the time, Is the .357-Magnum loaded with Remington 125gr SJHP, My EDC semi-autos are mostly the +P HSTs, and some others like Underwood +P & +P+ JHP. 🇺🇸
I've been carrying my firearms for 2 years now. SHIELD PLUS 9mm and SHIELD 45acp. I did alot of research towards what defensive ammo I should use and EVERYTHING I've watched or read came back to HST being the top. So in all due respect to the "PROS". THATS ALL THAT I WILL CARRY!!!!
Everybody CANT BE WRONG, can they???
Nice. I can watch these all day.
Common sense, professional video. Thanks !!
Great video!
I'll still stick to 45acp....it does a good job of stopping someone even if the HP doesn't open up....
Excellent bullet test. I agree with your real world choice of clothing material placed on the ballistics gelatine. I might point out not everyone is familiar with Glock model numbers and the caliber of bullets they shoot. When measuring expanded bullet diameters it would have been easier to follow if you had simply labeled (bullet caliber tested) largest & avg diameter with retained weight rather than saying Glock 21 etc etc etc.. look forward to watching another video
They are all good. I would definitely not want any of them hitting me! I'm a fan of larger calibers both the .40, and .45 because they are huge hard hitting rounds...But, I typically carry my 9mm Sig P365, because it is small and easy to conceal. If we could pick our battles I would choose my Glock 22 .40, or Glock 30 .45. But they are heavier to carry and harder to conceal, especially in summer. Great video brother 👍
Nice job! 👍
Love the fairness. All heavy for cal. All glock. And all same bbl
Good video. Fair video.
Great video 🤠
Finally a fair comparison half these tests guys use plus p,s in some calibers and not in others and different ammo, it would be interesting if you were able to measure the whole wound Channel circumference, that 45 is a big piece of lead
I'm gonna stir the pot and say, in my opinion, I think the 45 is the better choice based on these results because of the diameter of the round. A larger wound channel means better bleed out. Of course, the instant death (heart and head shots) are more about shot placement than penetration (both are needed).
As for the test itself, I think this was incredibly fair. Same platform gun, same manufacturer, heaviest for caliber by manufacturer, same (or near same) barrel length for each gun.
I greatly appreciate feedback like this! In my opinion, the .45acp will of course create more bullet crush damage, resulting in more blood loss, faster, but 9mm and .40 both penetrate deep enough to reach vitals creating equal opportunity to generate one shot stops as long as the shots are properly place. It’s all about what you shoot best with.
Why? The .45 penetrated the least. A larger diameter channel creates more bleeding, but so does a deeper channel.
Damn good test. All did about the same except for expansion. I’m an old 40 guy, But have a G17-5 on order. Kudos
Great job 👍
VERY INFORMATIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Great video keep em comin buddy..lets see one with my carry ammo, Federal Syntech Defense 9mm
I currently only have some in .45ACP. Ill see what i can do. Thanks for watching!
Great video. I would feel comfortable with any of them, Glock 17 or 22 is with me when I’m away from home. 1911 is my gun when at home or running around town. Love 1911’s, but the weight of the Glocks is nice. I have the same ammo for all 3.