'Every PM from Nehru to Modi Betrayed Us; If We Don't Change Course, India Faces Mass Discontent'
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In an interview to Karan Thapar for The Wire to discuss his book and its depressing analysis of India over the last 75 years, Mr. Mody says that if the country does not change course dramatically - and pretty quickly - India faces a future of mass unemployment with consequent discontent and even, perhaps, social violence.
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Having gone through the interview, I, an eighty seven year old, retired industry professional, who started working in 1960, have the following comments to make :
Capital intensive investment in heavy industry, by the Nehru Government :
The contents in the book sound like the myth created by anti Nehru propaganda unleashed by the Modi juggernaut.
I would recommend that you read about the so called "Bombay club", which consisted, as members, JRD, G.D . Birla, Purushottam Das Thakur Das, Jamnalal Bajaj and equally renowned Industrialists, whome Nehru commissioned to put up their recommendations for industrialization of the country.
They recommend that, since they individually and collectively do not have the requisite capital to invest in the basic heavy industry, the government should make the investment in it. All the steel plants and Heavy Engineering Industries therefore came in the public sector.
The "socialistic, Nehruvian" policy then created the private sector for manufacturing every consumer product that people in their fifties and sixties now, took for granted !
I am vitness to the fact that my mother's sewing needles and safty pins were made in England, so were my geometry box, the "G" nib & holders, pencils and later my bicycle. My father's fountain pen and it's ink too came from England.
This indutrial devalopment saw women coming out to work, riding cycles, which was not liked by the conservative people at that time.
Working for a multinational engineering company having manufacturing facility in India, travelling all over the east and west,
I have seen, that by sixties, Usha fans, & sewing machines, Bajaj Scooters, Tata trucks and Sumit Mixers, etc, ruling the East African, Middle Eastern, and South East Asian markets as favoured products. By seventies, Hitachi, Siemens, GE etc were, being beaten by BHEL, who won dozens of greenfield projects in the African, Mid East and SE Asian countries. This, would not have been possible without the IIT and IIMs, and the network of The Regional Engineering Colleges created in fifties.
Indians never came across the word "Unemployment", till 1967/68. Soon after the 1965 war and two successive draughts, the unemployment reared it head, when Lal Bahadur Shastri, suspended the five year plan for 3 years.
The 1991 reforms, and subsequently Bajpai's National highways project took care of generating required employment, till the November 2016, Modi's Demonitisation created the current setuation on this account.
I have seen the life expectancy period going up from 32 years in 1947 to around 60 years by sixties. I have lived through the Malaria and TB irradication programs of 1950s, both of them were thumping successes.
The hydro-electric dams, fertilizer factories, manufacture of tractors etc were all Nehru's dreams and aspirations which he replicated on the ground along with the industrial base, both in private and public sectors.
There could have been lapses and policy gaps in Nehru's Prime Ministership, but he can not be compared with Modi, who has nothing to show other than a successful implementation of polarization of the society, and unemployment, beating the 45 years old record.
I blame Indira Gandhi for her anti private sector policy which not only halted the growth of the industry, but precipitated the culture of inefficiencies in the entire manufacturing arena, creating shortages of goods, encouraging corruption and creating avinues of black markets and tainted money.
This happened when we were at a take off stage. It put the clock back by 20 years.
1991 saw us back in the running.
For example:
The lay men don't know that for the last 25 years Indian Automobiles, it's components, Indian steel and aluminum etc are now preferred products in the International markets.
We, make over 2 crore two wheelers and are the 2nd largest exporter of them after Japan, well ahead of China.
Instead of positively exploiting this ready made base, Modi spent his energy on Ram Mandir, the tallest statue, the Kashi Vishwanath corridor, the Narmada water front etc.
Pardon me when I say that I find the first half of discussion totally in line with the current fashion of belittling Nehru employing any means, fair or foul !!
Well said!
This isn't about belittling either Nehru or Modi. The fact is, after 75 years of independence, MILLIONS of Indians are abjectly poor, unable to afford even basic food or clean water, or a place to live in, and are illiterate or semi-literate, and have no access to health care among other things. In fact India is still among the "poorest" nations on earth. You are seeing "development" as the creation of factories and consumer goods, but real development is about empowering the citizenry with education, food, health and opportunities for work. Without this, everything else is useless. An educated and healthy nation is a contented nation. And that is precisely the point the author has made. Learn to look at India through the eyes of the poor and deprived, and you will find that reality very different from the one you live in. A civilization that is incapable of solving the problems it creates, and chooses to ignore its most crucial problems is a decadent civilization.
Thank you - well said !
@@budsurtees4224 Actually, this is precisely about belittling Nehru and Modi. It's literally the title of the video.
Your points are totally valid, but you missed what the OP was actually trying to say: that the author's arguments lack nuance. Do people really expect all of India's problems to be solved in 17 years or 75 years? Seventy-five years is nothing in the history of a nation. Do the promulgation of a liberal Constitution with a clearly established Bill of Rights, universal adult suffrage, the emancipation of women through measures such as the Hindu Code Bill, and so on count for nothing in a country of a billion people?
The only other country which we can compare ourselves is China, which is not a democracy. The democratic set-up is dilatory and messy, it takes one step forward and two steps back, but it's the only way to provide stability and a higher standard of living to the greatest number of people in the long term.
Very true.
Wow! 81 year old person, publishes a book, defends its contents to a very capable journalist and maintains his composure throughout! Hats off!
Wiki says he is 66. Where did you get the 81 figure from?
Your hollow head must be hurting lots 😂
Western slavery democracy destroyed all Indians minds forever...
@@forceboxed"Never let facts get in your way". 😂
He was neither challenged adequately nor did he defend adequately. He is yet another demand side economist who preaches the same old Rajiv Gandhi era education sloganeering.
Just pick up his point on female workforce participation. LFPR works as a boost when there is a productivity gap. To oversimplify it, when almost all smart men are employed, why hire not so smart man when you can hire a smart woman? It isn't keeping all smart women hired to grow the country. Japan grew with low LFPR for women and Cambodia/Burundi/Tanzania would be world's hottest economies.
Nehru was not a God. But he was a great human being and an excellent leader who laid the foundation for modern India. India, with such a huge population, and religious and linguistic diversity, can not be compared with any other country in the world. Despite all his shortcomings, Nehru is the architect of Modern India.
Nehru was a feudalistic leader so India is 150 years behind China in infrastructure development now
@@everuttejon9886 Stop posting the same inane comment in response to every post!
Excellent leader 😂😂. Leader who wasn't even elected but was appointed. The same leader who have made problems in his tenure which are causing problems for modern india.
@@everuttejon9886: Till 1978, India was ahead of China. This is till 15 years after Nehru's death.
Yes, Nehru took the country on the democratic path, freedom and tried to cultivate social justice. However, he has enamored by the Soviet economic model of industrialization (he as much as said it), which now we know where it ended up.. As Dr Modi says, the country should have invested his limited resources on education, healthcare and social upliftment and left the industrialization part to the people, After all, it is not the role of the Govt to run large businesses
I can only admire Karan for these wonderful interviews.Great details and great insights.This is the only you tube channel that brings such high quality intellectual material for us to ponder.
Thanks is too small a gesture of gratitude for this valuable gift.
Very true
I agree
@@venkshenoi371 Correct. In such situations the followers of the leader do not care to listen to the opposition or any analysis of the faults of their leader's thinking and actions! The nation is doomed unless a stronger opposing force emerges. In India such an opposition appears less likely at this time!
Stumbled on the wire today,real journalism is still alive... thanks Mr Thapar,sending love and respect from Africa.
Yes, real journalism is still alive,, but for how long? One by one, free thinking minds are being hounded if they cross the line
I think India is not only BROKEN it is land of despicable despair. Thanks for an excellent interview Mr Karan with Ahoka Mody.
It is indeed. Every year around 2 million Indians migrate to other countries, legally, and thousands migrate illegally, and a vast number of them are Gujaratis. If India is the "vishwaguru" that Modi claims and the "world's most powerful nation" like Rajnath Singh said (strange untruthful utterances from the BJPee liars), then how come so many Indians are eager to leave India?
@@budsurtees4224 One group was in power for 70 years,,,, You voted for them ... Give the new group on power 70 years ?
@@ganeshdore Once again you indulge in ridiculous comparison logic. Just because one government was in power for 70 years (and a lot was achieved during those 70 years despite what your liar leader says), that does not automatically mean someone else should have the same opportunity by right or expectation. Opportunity is directly proportional to achievement. What has the BJPee achieved in 8+ years except building statues, temples, stadiums, an unnecessary new house of Parliament, and stupid things like demonetisation, badly implemented GST (which incidentally was the Congress' brainchild), daily mentions of Hindu-Muslim rivalry, loudly shrieking compromised news channels fomenting religious hatred for dogmatic slaves like you, exhorting people to drink cow urine to prevent Covid, and spending crores to glorify itself in the media? What happened to all that talk of generating crores of jobs, ensuring that every Indian has a proper house by 2022, bringing back stashed black money from abroad, money in the bank for the poor, linking rivers, empowerment of SC/ST, 100 new smart cities, univeral health care and food security, etc? Which single one of these have been achieved in 8+ years? Your Dr Goebbels in fact laughed it off as "jumla" when questioned on it. Which institutions of national importance has it established? Your bias is so remarkably skewed that it would be pointless to even suggest objectivity to you. You're a lost person, and therefore prone to suggestible propaganda.
19th century Indians always trust master American propaganda media with fake news all the times against China and Russia now so India's Economy is Broken and failed country now....Mao 1) educated its mass people and China literacy rate was 90% during 1970 while India only 46%
2) Women participation in workforce..
3) Mao controlled corruption totally ( There is still death penalty for corrupted government officials and Ministers in Chinese constitution).........
.......
Nehru was a feudalistic leader so India is 150 years behind China in infrastructure development now
Jayant Bhandari answers why, what is the problem of this country & its people. It will become even worse.
I congratulate both Karan and Asoka Modi, ex IIT, Chennai for this brilliant a analysis of the sad state our PMs from NEHRU to MODI have let the Indian Masses down.
Mr Asoka Modi has completed 67 today. Congratulations.
In this 50 minutes interview Karan spoke for 33 minutes and the learned professor for 17 . Karan convinced the professor that what Karan read in the book was exactly what the professor had written. The interview ended with the learned professor thanking Karan for not having only read the book but also verbatum quoting from the book. Yes, betrayal is every politician's calling and India facing mass discontent is our destiny.
Strange interviewing technique. Insist that the subject agree with your emphasis and your framing, in fact your actual words rather than his. If the subject/professor manages to get out more than two sentences, be sure to interrupt, re-interpret and override. Too much interviewer ego! Get out of the way, let the professor speak, uncontrolled.
Well put
And still a better interview than the republic channel's shouting matches.
@@nvaravind5394 lol yeah. Such low standards
@@sudsymcqueen3369 karan grills people.. its his method
Indeed...I recently moved to Europe. Surprised by the general level of trust in the societies.
Yes, people believe you and trust what you are saying is honest and true.
@@andy4d Loser?
@@dpfrmhell Europe is ethnically homogeneous. India has too much historical baggage with caste,religion and ethnic diversity.
@@power9k470 lmao ethnically diverse you mean Slovakia are not french Spanish are english
@@power9k470 religion theres been religious wars in europe for centuries.germany invaded france 3 times in the space of 70 yrs but when war was over they spoke and played football against another
I am 81 years old and I agree with what your guest has to say. It felt as if he was recounting my life experience Good job Karan and thank you.
....19th century Indians always trust master American propaganda media with fake news all the times against China and Russia now so India's Economy is Broken and failed country now....Mao 1) educated its mass people and China literacy rate was 90% during 1970 while India only 46%
2) Women participation in workforce..
3) Mao controlled corruption totally ( There is still death penalty for corrupted government officials and Ministers in Chinese constitution)........
This is wonderful. I am halfway through and the author is solid on solid footings . Hats off and karan redeemed himself to me by holding modi on the thread. Great 👍
His surname is Mody
Can every PM fulfill all the ambitions of the nation ? Very easy to debate in a comfortable room but can one imagine was the situations during that period .
That's what critics and historians do and that is what is expected of them. This was an excellent and unbiased analysis. Uneducated Indians have this horrible penchant of not taking criticism well and criticize the critic as if the critic has a personal vendetta against any leader. What with the comfortable room? You prefer these two to debate about the past leaders sitting on a thorny cactus just so that they do not feel comfortable enough? Yours is an utterly idiotic comment.
555
its not ambition but equality of opportunity + we are talking over an extended period of time.
Only two PMs have let us down.
1) V.P.Singh.
Implemented Mandal Commission recommendations and brought back the ills of cast system that Mahatma Gandhi fought against. It divided the Hindu society back to medieval period level.
2) Narendra Modi.
Polarised the Indian society, by creating a communal division back to 1946/47 level so much so that we have been set back to stand in the same line, as and next to the Middle Eastern Islamic theocratic States.
The other folly was the demonitisation which broke the back of industrial growth and created record braking unemployment, resulting in pushing 81•35 crore people into destitution, who can not afford to buy food grains and government is forced to give free of cost rations to them.
This guy is a typical babu just like him Ishrat Hussain a desi babu have written a book in 2015 with same premises, These Desi dark skin brown baboons
🇮🇳🇮🇳🇮🇳👍👍👍GREAT INTERVIEW . "DIMAG KA DHAKKAN KHOL DE".👍
Kerala has the best education & health model in the country... why is it that Kerala hasn’t been able to create jobs & grow like Japan... things are more complicated for India than other countries... one thing that is unique to the country is the enormous diversity & social differences... and politicians easiest weapons to get votes are extreme protectionism and extreme appeasement of the social groups...and over centralisation & heavy bureaucracy...
Really good question
What is Kerala's livability index as compared to Gujarat and the other areas in the cowbelt?
I think it is because Kerala is in a Federal union with the rest of India. It cannot grow unless the the rest of India grows as well. This goes for many of the progressive states in India , The political power lies in states that are socially underdeveloped and under-educated and not with the progressive states - and their limited power is diminishing as the lag behind in population growth. This dichotomy is likely to create social tensions if they are not addressed.
@@newyorkskier You nailed it
You have to look at Tamilnadu for these kind of results. Their leaders knew in 1920s. North India was set up for failure and dint want to join them. These leaders need to be celebrated.
Great interview and lot of Clarity. Hope to see more from you Karan. Thanks
Mr Rakesh ....Karan needs to shut up and let the guest talk .
Can you name 5 things Modi needs to do today that is " doable "
Arvind sawant, you deserve bharat rattan for getting phd from WhatsApp University. Only completely blind person will see such achievements in this regime what you saw and wrote. Brother, open your eyes , and mind and then see,how these vagabonds have destroyed this nation.
A very pertinent phrase " marauding environment " used by Prof Modi explains that destructive industrial policy of Narendra Modi.
I am sure even God Almighty cannot live upto the expectations of this author.
Please remember 5million people died of hunger & starvation just before independence. Providing food itself was a big deal during independence not to mention the external threats trying to break India.
Subhash Chandra Bose should have been the first Prime Minister of India. Period
thanks for this interview . ive been recently hearing bjp supporters among my friends literally saying that they have voted for bjp regardless but now they have to deliver on ground realities . this along with the interview with pronob sen is a clear indicator of what is wrong imo
This is a superb interview Every thinking Indian should hear what Prof Modi has to say here.
Completely Agree. Exactly what Arvind Kejriwal has been saying.
This line of argument doesn't not take into account the aspirational aspects of the young in India.
Superbly Incisive, razor sharp and completely immersive discussion.
Throws a lot of light on the past and the present scenario.
Salutes to you !!!
Good to see Mr. Karan back from the short break
Am inclined to agree with m ugra’s sum up of the Nehruvian era accomplishments & not lump the great one with Modi, who cannot hold a candle to India’s first PM in the first place. Let me fill in a few blanks over health & primary education which took place at the time which did not find mention here in Dr. Mody’s interview. The government supported 5 year plan policy & block health public sector personnel appointed close even to rural areas resulted in dramatic changes for the better, despite severe limitation for the health workers in facilities provided to carry out their specialised task to their own job satisfaction. The average life span of an Indian rose quickly from 26 years in 1947 to around 60 years , as fairly efficient control over infectious diseases like cholera, typhoid, polio & small pox through preventive vaccinations picked up. Maternal & child mortality dropped sharply , which the southern states added their own effort to contain population explosion, enhancing thereby the quality of life of their own people, as compared to the so called BIMARU states laggardly approach & missed opportunity. Nehru ‘s humanist attitude towards refugees streaming across the border at partition & resettlement as landowners in East Punjab can be easily be connected to that region becoming the granary of stupendous nature, so as to render the country turn from food importer to among the world’s top 5 grain exporters. How hollow it sounds after all this to bring up as an argument that India should have arm twisted its citizens to the Japanese or Mao’s China rapid industrialization tactics. It would only have led to an pained & truncated India perhaps get into internal bloodshed & more fragmentation.
Mr. Karan Thapar. Thanks for the interview. You are the best interviewer We can ever hope for.
There can be no comparison between the first and the present PMs for the reasons that in 1947 this country was born and having nothing, it was difficult to make progress and development and still done fantastic work.
it is difficult to compare..becozz the 1st PM was a sadak chaapp romeo...with his eyes always on dusre ke biwi (remember lady mountbatten)..lol
Agreed, the context in 1947 was vastly different from what it is today. The criticism is that Nehru knew what was needed but he didn't have the courage to put in practice his ideals. What Japan did in the 19th century was known to everyone, including Nehru, yet he failed to uplift the poor millions by providing primary education and healthcare. He went for glory by building the so-called temples of modern India. Even though Nehru is vilified today (for political one-upmanship) it is ironic that Modi is following the same path of self-glorification.
@@stallionspirit1576 tu sadak chaap mawali lund hai...
Born with golden spoon in the mouth can be applicable to our present PM who didn't have to struggle at all and this professor out of the blue criticizing the 1st PM of the country.
@@beryanbeyaan8047 Student: earth ka shape kya hai?
Islam: Flat
Student: Aap ko kaisey pata?
Islam: kyunki mai ch@@tiyon ka mazhab hoon
Thanks for this wonderful and informative interview... U can't miss any of the questions of Mr Thapar... He sticks to his question till he gets satisfactory answer
Quality of interview and questions asked but talking only idealistic theoretical way is not a good interview.
Japan was never ruled by any other country and remained slave unlike India. Size of countries do matter. Country's moral of people is another thing. With so much variety of culture I challange this Modi to do it even today the things he is talking about.
@@purushasuktha5636 Probably for the same reasons you disliked it because of your hatred for Muslims?
Highly appreciate Karan ji to bring this episode with Mr Mody. Good to hear his opinion on successive leaders since 1947 and what India needed from Political leaders.
Today our democracy has been highjacked by Plutocrats where tax rebates are given to cooperate and pay taxes at a lower rate than a college professor. A commoner pays 18 % GST on a parantha. While Richi Richi pays less than 2 % GST on Diamonds.
Well argued.
However, arguing that two to three IIT's for a newly born India was an elitist idea is a bit unfair. It also enabled quality education though to a negligible who could not other wise afford outside side. But, the real failure of the Congress Party, all along from Nehru's time has been, complete indifference towards education and provisioned meager budget provisions in spite of nation wide demand and struggle for at least five percent of the budget for education. As argued, Nehru succumbed to the feudal, zamindar nexus, both on education and land reforms. A mind with a reason should find enough food for thought in the book under reference.
Every person makes some mistakes but you can never compare a colossal leader like Nehru to Modi.
What India is today and whatever it will be tomorrow - all the credit goes and will forever go to the leader of Independent India who was trusted by Mahatma, Sardar and most importantly the people of India to lead, Pandit Jawaharlal Nehru 🙏🇮🇳
Nehru had immense love and affection. He had undefeated support from the people throughout his years as PM. With such immense support, any corrupt and power hungry person would establish dictatorship but Nehru loved this country and he never betrayed it.
Can't stop laughing
You are on Ganja Ganja.Nehru was self centered and you wont accept it but in race with other dumbtard Modi is marginally better.
"Asked to bend, they crawled"
Nehru was an uneducated demagogue. Education about history, economics, philosophy were totally absent in him as they are in this Princeton professor who got his tenure based on his pro Anglo lies
Education is in the concurrent list. It was also the responsibility of the state governments to educate the population. The south of India did exactly this and the north failed. Nehru can’t be fully blamed for this.
Wow a guy who bashes both Nehru and Modi...a rare breed...I loved this discussion
Karanji thank you as always
👍🏼❤️ Excellent discourse.. With all his flaws Nehru was the tallest leader and the best thing to happen to Indipendent India with no comparison with today's PM, we cannot compare 1947 India starting from scratch to today's India with lots of development and also we cannot compare India with Japan those were two different situations. We need highly educated, intellect, broad minded leader from whichever party to repair the damage and take the country forward and make it safe for our future generation to whom we are answerable..
But why did we as a country fail to adopt the Japanese model of development? I think that's a fair question.
@@anuragchakraborty8766 Japanese model of development was possible because Japan had already achieved 100% literacy in the early 1900's. Lot of people say that WW II totally destroyed Japan, that is only partly true- while it destroyed the physical infrastructure, it did not destroy the human capital.
For more you can go and read Meiji restoration which happened in Japan in late 1800's. When American ships landed in Japan for trade, the Japanese emperor at that time was shocked at seeing the level of education and innovation in western societies. He made many reforms at that time including outlawing feudal system, making education mandatory etc. By 1930-1940, Japan was already a world power, comparable to the likes of Italy, France etc.
@@wigglyk2796japan had genetic gift. Japanese themselves have higher iqs than even anglo saxons and germans. Just think about it. Same with chinese. Though poor and wretched but high on iq. Usually these societies face wars and famines more because of the discontent and rebellious nature of people but when a true govt. or leader comes these places need only 30-40 years to become world powers. Same was the case with germany same with china same with japan and even korea.
खुद के बाप, दादा की गलती निकालना सबसे आसान है।
How many people were empty stomach from 1947 to 1964 and in the current times ? 80 Crores people are still being fed as Labharathi.
Being beneficiary of Nehruvian model of IITs his criticism speaks a lot. Amazing.
What's amazing in that? Shouldn't it be natural. Part of the system, knows the system. Such low standards we have. Praising someone for doing what must be done
In 1947, the country was having very meagre resources and a huge population to be taken care of. Nehru's visionary plans for irrigation, industry had laid an unshakeable foundation for the country. Just like sanghis and chaiwala, it's easy to blame the visionary
You can't say everything was roses when India went bankrupt in 1991 from anti development anti reforms socialism MODI as majority still fears reforms in economy industrialisation we don't deserve good right
......Mao and Chinese communist party initiated ' Combat illiteracy Campaigns ( 1950-1956) in China so they gradually got succeeded since 1960 and became richest country on earth now.....China national wealth 120 trillions dollars and USA national wealth 90 trillions dollars....Where is India's position now?? India national wealth may be less than 10 trillions dollars now.............
..............
Here Nehru is not "blamed". His wrong approach and mistakes are analysed.His emphasis on big Industry under public sector was not really helpful.Even massive dam construction by the govt swallowed big money and resulting green revolution was not commensurate for the capital invested.
And off course,obsession with Kashmir was the ultimate foolishness of Nehru.Stupid war with China for a god forsaken piece of uninhabited Aksai chin, broke our nations will power.
He was great secular democrat.We appreciate him for that.But we need to analyse and assess him and his period objectively.
Everything perceived by the writer is in hindsight. Blaming Nehru is flavour of Modi era.
You can pay obeisance to Nehru as much as you want but he needs to be duscussed and criticised you like it or not
Excellent interview. We know now where our leaders have failed the country. Honestly I don't see any hope for improvement. Late Mr. Sheshan said in the late 1990's that only a revolution may bring a change.
India built education system of IIT's that brought technocrats and slowly made India self sufficient in manufacturing. After 2014 we started to import thing from outside while we could manufacture them.
I live in Gulf and I find the cost of education in India is 1 fifth of what it in the world.
Correct but not quality education is available to masses in india..
What an interview, simply outstanding, may all who are fighting for a good cause strive towards a better and prosperous country and leave aside their petty difference for the time being. Thank you. Sayantan Ray, Kolkata.
Desh mein Sabhi Logon se Nivedan hai ki Aap Sabhi Galat ke Khilaaf Aawaaz Buland Karne ki Kripa Kare.---- Aam Jan Adhikar Manch, Buxar, Bihar.
Nehru was blessed and his actions are blessings for the country that continue to benefit India and will be for indefinite future.
Superb, Karan Sir, as always. This is the way -- to hold a proper mirror.
Mody increased Schools, he himself is product IITs. In limited monetary and fiscal amounts in the coffers
I am not very excited about what Mr Karan Thapar thinks or writes. In front of the camera, he apes Mr Tim Sebastian of BBC, but he is only an interviewer with much less skills. I am not certain if he really understands what he speaks!
@@parathuruthil Forget KT. Or any person. Content and what one thinks of it is important. And we must listen and question and answer all. Left. Right. Center. That is what media and even intellectuals are not doing.
Listen to all. Your holistic truth is known to you.
We all can and must think on our own in 21st century. My POV.
Thanks.
Nehru, believed in the moral life not just as sustaining private life. but also as necessary for the living of any kind of political life..
moral life?? kya sadakchap romeo...nehru antics of having love affairs..all over the place..including dusre ki biwi (lady mountbatten)...morality...lol
@@stallionspirit1576 You know you don't lose anything by being polite and respectful.
@@patmclaughlin107 truth ..doesnt promise to come...and make u feel cozy and nice..truth usually is cruel...there in lies the power of change...
@@stallionspirit9317 "Truth? Stupid motherfucker? Do you have monopoly over truth?" - Oh great. I can see the power of change in action already.
@@patmclaughlin107 I will telll u wat truth sounds like...when I say...u motherfucker! dat is truth..now u can go fact check...lol
No independent journalism only nationalistic journalism,,,
Very correct analysis of India,this matters highlted what is the main problem of country ❤
Dr. Jody’s basic point - education of all children and women, and employment of women - was shared by all prime ministers and other political leaders of India. The problem was the basic recognition that India lacked capital adequacy for industrialization, and the widespread recognition among economists that the best way to generate surplus capital was through agricultural development. In hindsight, India could have achieved higher rate of industrial growth through a more market oriented economic policy - a direction that several economists in India’s policy making in 1950s like John Mathai had called for. So, the basic problem was a blind servility to Marxism and an unproductive and inefficient import substitution industrial policy.
India never had marxism like communist states
It's simply crony capitalism
Major industrial houses like tatas and birlas acquired most of the licenses in the license raj
Marx considers industrialisation as advance stage of society. He never said a country should solely depend on agriculture. Actually it is problem of democratic setup which outs mejority into government. Our majority is rural, so rural elite became ruler espesially in states. My state Punjab is victim of agrarian populism.
Karan: why you need to insist that interviewee agrees with your exact formulation of interviewee’s thesis?
Good to see him back & carefully toeing the middle path......
🙏🙏
From early days means foundation put by 1st PM !!!! Writer is confused and not saying exactly who derailed the industrial development in early days
Great interview. The way I use to discuss with my friends, now I am confident what I am talking is having a support from the society.
Thank you Karan the way you have done analysed and questioned and extracted the answers is very good
Good comment. The interview does not cover kickbacks/subsidies were given by Congress to Ambani? At the same time, how Indira Gandhi killed Tata Airlines and private industry and Mamata Banerjee killed TATA Nano. There is Infrastructure which provides jobs. There is Digitalization that is working. G20 success, WC hosting, Apple manufacturing, Railways modernization, etc. I am not sure how these all get nullified by some Nobel laureate sitting in USA.
I like to remind that Nehru had said in the constituent assembly that school education should be in the hand of centre for mass education because of strong centre and huge money may be spent instead of state. Unfortunately his views were rejected in the constituent assembly.
He couldn't manage with a majority? That's rather sad and on point to call him timid
If each Indian was educated
I don’t think any politician who are sitting on higher chairs, would be there, where they are
I appreciate Mr Karan Thapar and Mr Modi, It is a great discussion. I think our education system and judiciary system needs to be modified as per our present and future requirements
On one side there is talk about Nehru's mistake adopting Socialism & then immediately they criticize the progress of the state of Gujarat that is the most business friendly state of India that promotes capital investment intensively.
Capitalism is the progressive model of development that India has currently adopted & it's on the right path.
Yes the keyword here being Capitalism, instead of Crony Capitalism aka Cronyism. Please understand the difference between the 2.
Karan Tapar sir , To be kind of all, to like many and love a few, to be needed and wanted by those we love, is certainly the nearest we can come to happiness. Happiness is not something ready made. It comes from your own actions.
Karan, could you please let the guy talk? This is a most penetrating analysis of the Indian situation. A few comments: At the start, the problems Nehru faced were truly daunting. There was no money and he was deeply worried (see his letters to Chief Ministers) about food production and food security. In his 17 years think of the many institutions he started. His concentration on heavy industry, dams etc was influenced by the Russian example. Of course Ashoka Mody is correct that Nehru was guilty as detailed. But no one prevented those succeeding him correcting it especially since he left institutions which would allow such plans to more easily implemented. When I first read of Gandhi's take on democracy it was an eye-opener (much like what Modi states in the interview). Gandhji also promoted khadi and hand spinning etc precisely because of the basic need of being employed. Instead of dismissing this as a crank solution, it pointed the way to ensure that employment was the most crucial factor in development; all else flows from that. Just think the amount of money that modern India has but still no policy that concentrates on primary and secondary education. If people were fully employed with a decent income and on the first rung of the ladder, they would have found means for education and health
Well done Karan Thapar ji
In the end I see Mody seem to blame Modi, who damaged Indian environment, economy, health and education. Thus it seem Modi failed at all fronts and far inferior than the first PM JL Nehru.
Asking India to follow Japan is pathetic. India in 1950 was nowhere close to Japan when it industrilised.
He does not take into account of fragility in India post partition and post the riots.
Japan was a nation. India had to become one.
Oh agaya rey defenders of Nehru. Who asked Nehru to accept Nehru-Liyaqat pact when people like Ambedkar asked for complete transfer of population. Why did Nehru allow for Families to hold Land but not individual alone and the implementation of those land reforms? Is it because he was vote Bank politician?
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There is one languages in Japan
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There are 1,234 plus languages in the SubContinent47
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Imagine...
.... medium of instruction
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@@chandrakanthveluri9860 a glass has water, maybe lots of water. Its up to you to criticise that the glass is not totally full of water or to appreciate that it is half or mainly full.
Land reforms took place. Zamindaris went away. Could we have done more to break the hold of the feudals ? Yes. But take a look at Pakistan where no attempt at land reforms was made.
At least we avoided the disaster in Russia and China of Collector farming.
And today out complaint, rightly so, is that out agriculture is not productive enough because of fragmented holdings. Imagine how fragmented the holdings would have been if we had taken land reforms further.
Lastly, 80 % of the land mass in Japan is useless for living or for growing anything. Its too mountainous and volcanic. Japan imports everything. And I mean everything. Including rice. Its has done this for centuries. All the great Zaibatsus ( Mitsui, Sumitomo , etc) have a trading company at its center.
To compare Japan and India is laughable.
@@bikramsen9952 There u go with the usual comparison with Pakistan. So why didn't the same chutiya Nehru didn't heed Ambedkar and Shyamaprasad Mukherjee on the complete transfer of religious minorities and signed Nehru-Liyaqat Pact in a hasty manner? Is it because it benefits his vote bank politics. Very hasty in passing the Hindu code bill but left it to Muslims to decide their own rules on the advice of Maulanas. Our Agriculture is not productive enough coz of not using modern techniques and middlemen eat out the margins of farmers. Why did the so-called Nehru didn't do anything to let go of government control of Hindu Temples? If Hindu temples can be governed by Government administration then why not Muslim shrines and Christian Shrines? Is it written that mismanagement happens only in Hindu Temples but not in other community's worship places? Who the fuck is Nehru to head the government from 1946 to 1951 until first general elections? What is the proof that he has not used his political office to bring his party to power?How did many muslim league Tier-2 leaders become Indian National SCAMgress leaders just after partition? Do I need to come up with their names?
Socialistic approach was crucial as country was emerging from extreme poverty and lack of education. If prior governments didn’t have social programs to uplift the poor; India didn’t have today’s largest middle class. We would have been under developed for ever.
Great discussion. I had never thought of Indian Govt promoting oligarchy, but I realized that is exactly what the Govt is doing. Common people find it so hard to navigate the complex bureaucratic structure of the Federal and State Governments, yet the same Govt rolls out the red-carpet for these oligarchs and defend them. This is exactly what destroyed Russia, a country which had enormous potential by virtue of its highly educated workforce, technological prowess and unlimited natural resources, all of these things which India has only in a highly diminished quantity. India can only survive as an inclusive democracy and merely throwing crumbs at the common man will not suffice
Well done, Mr. Thapar. Mr. Mody's views were an eye-opener. I hope the people of India get what they deserve, Education, social justice for women, healthcare and jobs. But unfortunately, Mr. Modi's focus was on how to win elections, not how to transform India to offer a viable future for its citizens. What a tragedy in the making for one of the oldest civilizations and one of the world's most hardworking, intelligent and resilient people.
KT is hell bent on putting words (Modi) in his mouth 😄😄😃😃😅
Amazing interview... An eye opener.. gratitude 🙏🏽😊❤️
This interview has shown us the light on how it started and how deep the trouble trouble is .
Were india & Japan comparable in 1947-57 or even today?
he is saying that the literacy/health/human development of india of 1947 was equal to that of japan of 1868 at the start of the maji restoration. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meiji_Restoration
Due to their reforms, within one generation, Japan grew strong enough to defeat the Russian Empire in a war.
At one time India was ahead of most south and south-east Asian countries on most parameters of human and economic development. Since then it has regressed and most of those countries have bested it. Ask yourself how and why.
@@budsurtees4224 its most likely because indian rulers did not think it in their best intrest to educate and develop their populus. likely similar to what is happening in africa in the modern day. there are likely other reasons but one needs to sit down and think about this.
@@ma.nu.22 Yup, just like the BJPee counts on an unedcated public to not scrutinize it and criticize it. There are two groups that prefer people to be uneducated - the clergy/priests and politicians. They abhor intellectuals and educated people (like the BJPee does) because they know such people will not accept lies and propaganda. It's happening in India, so why do you need to refer to Africa?
Not agreed to your views regarding Nehru to Manmohan Singh. If everything is broken how is it intact . Despite betrayal of so many PM country has developed remarkably with this much population.
Per capita GDP of India 2000 dollars , Per capita of UK is 50000 dollars and you call this development?
bro, negative ppl can see bad in best of things. wire has learnt and excels in this art of being negative and running fake propoganda.
@@hirakchatterjee5240 would you consider increase from 200dollars to 2000 dollars development?
When the same logic for Modi too.
How it's intact of it broken for last 9 years ?
Hindu education policy regarding to Hindusthan .
Very objective discussion. Thanks to Mr. Thapar and Mr. Mody.
Now i got a little, why Amrtya sen got noble prize, he is also an economist, and here we have another mr. Modi version...
Thank you Karan Sir, for providing this informative and valuable interview.
Commending Mr Ashok Mody. As usual, Karan is very good. A very good exchange of views and I have been indeed thankful to both.
Until 1990, India and China had the same per head GDP but then India in 1992 surrendered to the IMF-World Bank but China never listened to the IMF-World Bank. It has not privatized. India did. China only instead of a centralized planning had a decentralized planning empowering town and municipal industries. As a result today China's per head GDP is 5 times that of India. We got ruined by the IMF-World Bank.
Don't understand that how intelligent people like you can keep saying that if Patel would have become PM...Patel was an ailing old man who died in 1950 even before India became a republic...this is misinforming public
This guy may be half knicker from nagpur
that same old ailing man..showed more steel...and united india...than sadkchap romeo nehru ...who cudnt do 1 simple task ..of integrating j&k into india properly...samjhey pappu ke chamche..lol
Does the book suggest what must be done? or is it just a questioning? It is true that we missed the trains of electronics and all, but the discussion should have told if the book contains some sort of satisfactory answer. Better discussion comparatively, Yes.
He is clearly telling govt should work towards Basic education, heath care and women's participation in the economy.
@@kavisiddu Then there is nothing new. When there is lot of men's unemployment, why two members of same family should be given a chance? It is totally a trap then. Only Educated high-society will benefit. Secondly Health care and basic education are 200 years old points.
@@0-3480_jasd Just check how much govt jobs created in recent years.. India as a nation born on 1947, they are discussing about it..
Equal Education policy needed for India:
If English medium education is better in India then why not translate all English curriculum and Sanskrit literature in regional languages and provide equal education/information to all? Don't people read PM's Mann kī Bāt in all regional languages on websites? Don't they teach the Bible in all Indian languages? Sanskrit scholars provide Vedic knowledge to westerners in English via translation and transliteration but not the same way to fellow Indians who protect languages and culture in Indic scripts.Gujarat has given great political leaders as well as simple script to the nation and yet Hindi is taught in a complex printing ink wasting script despite it’s simplification into Gujanāgari script.
If pundits were happy with the complex printing ink-wasting Devanagari script they may not have created various scripts under different rulers for vernacular languages to divide the country. Nowadays Devanagari Lipi Parishad prefers a single Devanagari script despite it's simplification into Gujanāgarī script for all Indian languages to slowly eliminate vernacular scripts the way they did with Maharashtra's MODI script.
Westerners learn Sanskrit in English via translation and transliteration and challenge Indians but Indians are not allowed to learn Sanskrit the same way in vernacular languages.Why not make the same efforts in teaching mother language as you do for Sanskrit? How is modern Sanskrit going to be better than Vedic Sanskrit in providing knowledge? Does the government spend an equal amount of money on the promotion of all state languages?
India needs to create more jobs for Indic translators to provide equal education and information to all in Indic languages.
Also India has more English speakers than Great Britain and yet Indian English doesn't have itś own Indian English dictionary with pronunciation key to challenge IPA with highly phonetic Indic alphabets. sanskrit-ai.com/threads/mappings-for-devan%C4%81gar%C4%AB-indic-roman%C4%81gar%C4%AB.333/
Since Sanskrit has complex grammar and lengthy sandhi words in sentences it may not be good for effective speech, for rhyming poetic words as well as for voice to text typing, dictation and effective translation without lengthy interpretation.
If India's four percent of pundits can earn livelihood by praising Sanskrit, performing rituals and reading Satyanarayan Katha to villagers, why should they learn Sanskrit the hard way ? Sanskrit is taught in schools and colleges and used in Vedic rituals but how many of these people are fluent in Sanskrit?
NCERT prefers to provide education in Hindi and Urdu but not in regional languages. Why? If Hindi can be written in Urdu script then why not in regional scripts the way Sanskrit can be written?
Newly added Sanskrit on Google Translate could pose a challenge to Indian pundits who traditionally impart Vedic knowledge to Westerners through translation and transliteration tools but not to fellow Indians who defend scripts and culture in local languages.
India needed Macaulay to acquire Sanskrit knowledge through translation and transliteration in each language the way he had achieved in English.
Excellent interview. Both sides very eloquent and convincing. K. M. Shrimali
Mr. Karan thanks for such a good interview with a great person … its time now to take it seriously and implement..I hope the present responsible people must look into the facts discussed during interview and take it positively for the better future of our Great country…The standard of education must be improved at the primary level …child labour must be treated as heinous crime
As much as I respect the way Karan Thapar conducts interviews I must say most of them have a pushing message
Are we facing disaster Are we facing disaster many times here & there
Eventually the interviewee gives in & says Yes for Gods sake Yes
We are always with neutral and intellectual media.
Wasn’t Nehru and his govt the reason for the Kemdriya Vidyalayas? If yes, then he started public schools.
“We need to stop these rubbish BA and MA degrees.” - Nehru
This makes me think Nehru was smarter than I think he was.
thats why his great gand kids did the same
Nehru was definitely the best. I disagree with the guest. His ideas are very isolated
19th century Indians
People like me in mid sixties went through the same education system-government owned vernacular schools , and did reasonable well in life( well paid MNC job et al) though I belong to a family of second generation of educated people . The circumstances under which Nehru took over would have overwhelmed anybody else - it was nation at civil war & patrons of that war were at Nehru's throat every moment those days
Exactly…Congress did well keeping the country together despite n number of differences. Unfortunately, after 2014 Congress failed to defend Nehru and that is where they lost the plot but fortunately things are starting to look a little bit better giving me hope of a mature secular India.
Great. Cant believe our country still have such a great journalist.
Mr. Modi. Up bringing children is itself an important work. There are many women who are educated and choose to stay home. I known some women who are Medical professionals and stay home.
Absolutely fantastic in nailing the truth. We've been let down by successive governments since Independence. All because the egos of our PMs (barring few rare exceptions) came before the development and progress of the people.
In the early 1980s, both India and China were relatively in the same place. The only difference was a little man called Deng Xiaoping - the man who jettisoned all ideological baggage and focused on turning China into a global power. His single-minded mantra to lift China from the morass was education, healthcare and infrastructure for the masses. Rest as they say is history.
In India, unfortunately we have had egoists, demagogues and outright corrupt as national leaders who has had no concern for the common people; they were busy protecting their self-interest, in other words, their grip on power. And for the last 75 years these leaders have taken the public for a ride. And still continues to do so till today. We ourselves are mainly responsible for blindly following these venal and petty-minded characters.
Nehru modelled on Soviet style not American or Western. Countries who followed American style became rich and modern such as Japan, South Korea and even China followed it since the 1980.
While countries who followed Russia remained backward such as North Korea, Venezuela.
Agneepath violence was such an example but Indians have huge patience. Millions died in famine during British period but people didn't protest much.
This speaker is partially pregnant...and is trying to be on both sides...! Non sense arguments he has presented
Anyone speaking against Nehru wl b the best friend if Modi. Even if Modi has not delivered
care to say how modi has not delivered?
Human Resource development is far worse today than it was 7 decades ago; particularly in the primary and secondary levels.
Corruption, self entitlement, capitalism, extreme religiousness, Ego, Caste, selfishness, etc etc.
Many thanks Mr Karan for such a meaningful interview. The book depicts the true picture of our country. We should be concerned about - where are we heading for, and what kind future are we creating for our children. Can the whole of interview be translated into Hindi enabling crores of people to understand its essence. Thanks again.
Job situation in 2018 is much greater than what it was in 2012. Won't the people understand who they are voting for?
Nehru was blamed for not focussing on primary education. Don't accept that. South India story is different. Kerala and TN did extremely well. So did Karnataka and Andhra Pradesh.
North india doesn't want education. They want only politics.that is why India is ruled by north Indians and south india is feeding by paying heavy revenues to the country