Why Lolita is Impossible to Adapt into Film
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ก.ค. 2024
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Most of the essays quoted in this video can be found in the essay collection "Lolita in the Afterlife: On Beauty, Risk, and Reckoning with the Most Indelible and Shocking Novel of the Twentieth Century" edited by Jenny Minton Quigley
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Would you consider the Netflix show Cuties as a branch of Lolita?
🤮👎
There is a channeler that used a sponsor. She got a lot of backlash from her viewers. She never used that sponsor again. So good for you that you choose your sponsor carefully 👏
@@TerraExodus off topic but I don’t understand why the film cuties had to be about twerking like couldn’t they just break dance or a different dance style
@@mariposaguey7657 (I posted this in the wrong section by accident)
Twerking isn't a dance style, is it? They could of done hiphop, break dancing or Kpop.
I imagine the reason Nabokov didn't want any suggestion of a little girl, on his covers, because he knew even the most innocent picture would arouse the sick of mind. The first cover that uses such an image, does not need to sexualise her. The pervert will do that for themselves.
@@Gee-xb7rt i feel like the original film does sometimes sexualize dolores, for instance that opening shot of her toes and him painting them
@@Gee-xb7rtomg brother stop dick riding Kubrick on every comment
@@FinalGirlStudios fr I keep seeing this person's comment in all the replies... I feel like they just came here to disregard everything that doesn't fit their twisted perspective and not watch your video, and try to justify the wrongful depiction of Lolita on film
I completely agree.
@@FinalGirlStudiosI love your videos. The one you did on the last unicorn was so beautiful and one of my favorites ❤
Nabokov himself was a victim of his pedophilic uncle, so writing Lolita was probably like recounting his own story and trying to understand the psychology of a pedophile. It might've been a way for him to process the trauma. It's utterly disrespectful and heartbreaking to see how horribly the victim's story was twisted, especially knowing that Nabokov spent so much time on perfecting the novel and getting everything right. Another person silenced.
woah, really?
@@jaxj968it's never been proved, but it's a very popular idea.
@@AnaSofia-xe2wg It won't be proven unless he had gotten enough courage to say something most don't
@@jaxj968 He didn't outright *say* his uncle abused him. But he did have far too much of an interest in Nabokov.
Yeah this isn't 100% proven, just a very popular "fan theory" I suppose, with some academics postulating it. But academics postulate basically everything, so take it with some grains of salt.
Similar theory I've heard is that the subtext of Catcher in the Rye is that Holden Caulfield has been molested by one of his professors at the boarding school he's at. Which is why he goes on his errant trip, tries to sleep with a prostitute to prove his heterosexuality to himself, and feels so much empathy for the theoretical children he wants to protect in the conceptual Rye he thinks about.
Such theories are pretty valid interpretations; there's a fair amount of implication in texts like these, but there's definitely not enough hard objective evidence to say for sure if its true.
The fact that so many filmmakers and advertisers have just jumped at the chance to portray a 12 year old girl as a sexual temptress and a grown man as someone to sympathize with, while completely ignoring and distorting the author's intention and original story, is just...ick.
Men ☕
Choose the bear!
@@lordnokia4222exactly men ☕
@@lordnokia4222We’re not all that bad!
Jeffrey Epstein. It has to do with the psychology of old, rich men and their money.
Ironically, the way Sue Lyon was completely failed by the adults around her and sexually exploited by an adult man mirrors lolita perfectly.
Yeah sadly, it wasn’t the movie made that point.
Kubrick wanted Hayley Mills for the role, but her father said no. He did her a favor.
"Accuse the other side of that which you are guilty." - Joseph Goebbels
I'd say women have that down to an art.
Personally, I think if you were going to adapt Lolita, you'd want to do it in animation. Not only does this sidestep the problem of destroying a little girl's psyche while putting her in extreme danger, but I don't think it's actually possible to do justice to how the novel's narrative is subtly distorted by Humbert's perspective. Instead, animation gives you the opportunity to actively call attention to the distortion by having the camera periodically switch between Humbert's distorted, sexualized vision and the mundane reality of the situation. The novel could only do what it did by using prose's best advantages to tackle the issue of Humbert's insanity, so I think the only way to do it justice is to use animation's best advantages to do the same, even if it seems like an exactly opposite approach on the surface.
@ville__wtaf.
but i agree
also animation is stereotypically childish which plays into the fact that Dolores is just that a child
I was just about to leave a comment saying this same idea! I think probably the closest option we have to adapt Lolita in an audiovisual medium as ethically as possible would be through animation. You wouldn't even need a child voice actress for her voice, since many adult actresses make voices for children in cartoons all the time.
Remember the Netflix movie Cuties and the criticism it had for sexualizing real human children? I think that would have been averted too if the film had been animated 🤔
@@prospitdreamerI don’t know. These adaptations use the allude to bank on the movie. I feel like that will use it the same in animation. I mean if you seen anime they sexualize young as well. So I think you have to be very intentional with that. This films purpose was to sexualize then actress. They didn’t care to show the true intention of the book
I was abused when I was a little girl between the 10 and 16 years old.
I remember that when I saw the Lolita movie I saw it as a love movie, I really felt that Humbert was a good man and that Dolores knew what she did when she "seduced" him.
When my abuser began to notice me, I remember that I felt excited, I wanted him to kiss me and touch me and I also wanted to get sexual, I myself went to his house and I even hinted that I wanted to have sexual relations with him.... but at the same time I felt absolute disgust and hatred for him, I hated the way he kissed me, the way he touched me, I hated his smell, the taste of his mouth, the color of his eyes and even the way he spoke to me, everything about him disgusted and repulsed me and yet I kept thinking that I wanted to be with him...
I have never been able to fully understand why I was like that, I only know that I was still very young when I was exposed to pornographic films and inappropriate touching (from another person) when I was under 6 years old, but I blocked that memory for many years.
Now I understand that those things made me precociously sexual and over time I understood what grooming was and I understood that the only reason I went to this man's house was because in my own house I suffered physical and psychological violence and I literally preferred anything else to this. Unfortunately that "anything else" was a man who instead of helping me, took advantage and abused me.
Now when I see the movie and read the book I can only imagine the real Dolores, the dirty, disheveled girl, with messy clothes, who only wanted to be loved and who found herself not with a father figure to help her but with a monster.
I'm sorry if it's hard to understand what I'm saying, it's hard for me to express what I feel and what I experienced in my own language, so it's even more difficult to find the right words in another.
I just want to leave testimony that there are no girls who are nymphs, only girls who were exposed to things they shouldn't have at a very young age and who couldn't find help
I'm so sorry such heavy and distressing things have happened to you. I think your comment is easy to understand and thus makes me wish that I or anyone else could have given you the protection you needed. I can tell you've got some level of clarity looking back on things and it doesn't sound like you're blaming yourself, which is good, because none of this was your fault. It was the fault of all the adults in your life who failed you constantly. I'm sure you know this already, but I'm saying it again in case it helps to hear/read.
Your testimony is clear and will stay with me. I hope that from now on, your life is filled with peace, healing, genuine and consensual connection, and safe spaces.
@@scb37889
Thank you very much for your kind words. ❤️
The truth is that I do feel that it helps me to hear that it was not my fault because there are still days when doubt makes me feel scared. The mind can be very cruel sometimes.
On the other hand, now I can say that I am happy, It was very difficult at first , especially to form real connections with the people around me, I used to give my body to my partners without even feeling that I wanted it, and sometimes without even feeling love. But although it may sound cliché, it was the love of my husband that got me out of there. Now I have a beautiful daughter and with the help of a lot of therapy I managed to be a better mother for her. I am happy knowing that she will never feel the abandonment and violence that I experienced and I hope that she can follow that same path either with her own family or being a support for her friends and loved ones.
Im so sorry for what you went through, i had a similar experience with watching films like Leon the professional and seeing how idolised this kind of “dynamic” was. Only to later realise it’s just abuse and was sending the wrong message out to young people.
I understand what you are talking about I experienced something like it
Thank you for putting this into words...I'm sorry you had to go through that
I present: Lolita but we never actually see her. Not really. Every so often we’d get a small look at a small hand covered in paint, a baby shoe, the outline of a child in a very modest dress with no actual detail. We get to hear her voice once, at the very end when she dies at the end of the novel. We never see her, not even as a teen or an adult. Her actresses are never credited. Each time we see her, she’s of a different skin tone with different hair, if we even see that much of her. I want there to be a movie where Dolores is very obviously a child, but you never see her and you see that she can be any child, and that it is horrifying and it could be any child.
AND NO SEX SCENES JESUS NO NO NO NO NO NONE
I think this would work and be unsettling to watch as the story should be
How about we never see her, like you started with?
I’m still in the camp of “let’s stop making this movie”.
I actually love this.
This would work perfectly and would protect any young actress playing Dolores. The entire film should have a horror element to it, not a romance element.
Seeing Nabokov's pick to play Dolores and the film adaptation's actual actress with the way she was done up to look like a little pinup model is so sinister.
The age gap is literally 2 years, it's so awful
@@nicolelouise7295every time I see the 1962 and 1997 segments, I went back to that… wow Hollywood is screwed up…
ill never get over the fact that they wanted someone who appeared older in the 1962 version, but they still cast a child. why would you cast a 14 year old that looks 16 instead of an 18 year old that looks 16?? there are tons of young looking young adults. they were in the business of unnecessarily sexualizing an actual child.
@@Gee-xb7rtmovies are a visual medium. There is no "only" when you're showing something like that in film
Honestly the actually age of the actress doesn't matter, if she looks to be underage. Sure you're not exploiting a child, but for the perverted the effect is the same.
@@NelsonStJames "sure you're exploiting a child" NO. What a giant facepalm of a comment. OF COURSE the age of the actress matters.
@@Gee-xb7rt you need to watch the whole video first before commenting lil bro
@@NelsonStJames you said it doesn't matter before saying exactly why it DOES matter. If I had to pick one, I'm picking the option where an actual child actor isn't being harmed
The mistake they make is that they depict the girls as humbert sees them. If they depicted them as the little kids they are, and overlayed it with his sick perspective in narration and actions, it would be closer to the spirit of the book.
I agree with the point about it inevitably leading to the victimization of a child though.
The problem is that in our society we often see any girl that has sex with a man as sexualized. She "becomes a woman" even if nothing about her is actually mature, wiser or personally developed. We use similar language with boys too and it's also sometimes used to push situations that are not OK like having to have sex with anyone they can so they aren't a virgin or pedophilia as conducted by adult women (you don't necessarily get that with male/male relationships or pedophilia though in the LGBT space there has been a historical blurring of lines between mentor and lover along with a tolerance for big age gaps- I found the section of The Vagina Monologues where a girl gets a wonderful experience bc an adult woman preys on her disturbing and apparently you're "required" to leave it in)
True. She was an ordinary kid.
It might be closer to the spirit of the book, but film is interpreted entirely differently.
If you depicted them as the little kids they are, how are real life victims going to differentiate between their own innocent behaviour? How will that help them to overcome the idea that they were, in some way, responsible?
@@happinesstan I mean her behavior was innocent, the issue was he wasn't. But the main thing is if it's live action that's a real little girl in the role and people are so gross about the role
that is so correct of him to say "no girls" on the cover. I'm so glad to hear he said that. it needed to stay that way
I’m losing my mind because no one is talking about how Nabokov changed his mind and kept many of the later translations with covers depicting girls, he liked the girls. Moreover, the book to my understanding does contain sexual content between a grown man and this child more than once, doesn’t this contradict the idea that Nabokov was deft and benevolent in his creation of what is essentially CSM? I don’t think he’s innocent, I think Nabokov was an actual creep and people are being gaslit into thinking him and this book are somehow less gross than the movie adaptations. The whole story is gross, it doesn’t need to exist, it doesn’t provide value or entertainment.
The novel is the story of the destruction of a pubescent girl. Even Humbert Humbert, who is obsessed with Lolita and sees her as his romantic ideal, feels a crushing sense that he is consuming her youth and innocence. A movie about a murder doesn’t show an actual murder. So we don’t need to see the actual destruction of a child’s innocence onscreen.
The closest thing to a way to ethically adapt Lolita would be to cast Danny Devito as Dolores.
@@Quinn2win LMAO
Why?
@@zapazapwell he’s a grown ass man. It’s a joke.
LMFAO
@@crystalbugboy Devito is old, but he was never fully grown.
There’s a reason why I picked up the novel with a cover of an old man touching a bouquet of flowers. That’s more metaphorical and befitting of the novel without sexualizing the victim in the novel.
My copy has a butterfly on it, I like that symbol too, a butterfly can be beautiful but will break if you touch the wings.
My favorite cover is the hazy photograph of two beds pressed together. I can't remember what edition it is, but it's in my memory.
@@MMMNemesis Butterflies are like our dreams. They're beautiful and enticing, but if you snatch at them, they turn to dust.
Unfortunately, my copy has a scene straight from the movie printed on it (Dolores in her black two-peice with a suitcase full of stickers and Humbert smiling behind her, holding his hat).
I'm looking to see if there are any places near me that can do costum covers so I can replace it
You could potentially just use a marker to scribble over the girl on the cover, "destroying the fantasy of lolita" through defacing the cover that the author disapproves of (and it would be cheaper than getting it recovered) @@SSDaria
The thing that gets me the most is the fact that Kubrick had two daughters at the time of filming. They were both toddlers, but to be able to twist the themes of the book into the exact opposite of its original intent means he was completely incapable of understanding that he was CONTRIBUTING to a perspective that ignores the rights of his own children.
I mean considering what he did to Shelly Duvall I think he had some major issues with women
Kubrick was a sensational director and a real piece of shit of a man. How these powerful individuals continue to be held up as icons today overwhelms me with feelings of anger and sadness.
If u notice all the characters in his films are scumbags .... definitely not conventional Hollywood heroes.
I always thought the cover should be broken glasses, because the way he sees her is wrong
No kidding. She is supposed to be 12.
Actual convo I had with my boyfriend:
Me: The reason why Lolita has never been adapted well is because it’s never been adapted by a female director.
Bf: But if a woman directed Lolita it would come off like a horror movie.
Me: exactly.
Him: …I love it, that’s brilliant.
I want horror movie Lolita, because it’s the only accurate way to adapt Lolita.
Thank you for coming to my TED talk 😊
I say only women or people who are survivors of childhood SA should adapt the film as they will depict Humbert as a monster
@@billieking2257 Even just a regular woman would have to be damn careful, there's definitely women who participate in the exploitation of young girls (like the Mom mentioned here or Brooke Shields's mom who basically sold her to pay her bar tab)
I don't think even then it would work. Part of lolitas's horror is how easy is to side with Humbert, how manipulative he is. You belive him, bc the majority aren't looking close enough. It isn't until the end that he slips, and you crash into reality.
@@AnaSofia-xe2wg I think you'd have to make serious artistic changes to avoid making it a pedophilic movie. The message of Cuties is anti-sexualization of girls AND directed by a woman who basically made it semi-biographical and yet it still can easily come off as pedophilic
ehh @@billieking2257
seeing the actress that nabokov envisioned as lolita is so harrowing
my jaw literally dropped
is there a time stamp ..
@@bintangmeneroka 16:30 somewhere around there
@@gabirivero1304 jesus christ
@@valenfrida it really is harrowing
lolita isn’t a love story, it’s a horror story
I watched 90’s movie once, and Im never gonna watch it again. So disturbing 😵💫. I love horror/gore but Lolita is something else
It is to Humbert. That's the way pedophiles see the world.
Exactly... Someone needs to make a genre shift music over trailer; would love a whole movie framed like the thriller / horror it is.
I recently watched a film called annette where they had the child who was being exploited be played by a marionette up until the end when they had a real child play her for the final scene and that was actually really well done. I think that would work well for this story too
Annette broke my heart! The soundtrack of course is amazing (Sparks is one of my favourite bands), but the way Annette is exploited reminded me so much of real cases that I was left feeling sad.😢
One of the short animated films nominated for an Oscar this year dealt with this subject too.
I've watched a lot of _Lolita_ essays, both of the book and of varying adaptations. I sometimes find myself brainstorming a potential screen adaptation that uses a framing device of a female psychiatrist/therapist talking to Humbert while he is in prison. Throughout the film, the visuals consistently contradict his skeevy voiceover. When 12-year-old Dolores says things like "I should tell the police you raped me, you dirty old man!" you hear Humbert's voice putting on a coquettish tone, but you see Dolores in the car crying and screaming. And every time -- *_every_* time -- you hear him talking about how attracted he is to Dolores, or what he's about to do to her, the camera never shows the young actress. It just lingers in closeup on his leering face.
At the end of the novel's story, Humbert is dead, and there is a reveal. While most of the shots of the psychiatrist were her speaking to Humbert out of frame, she was also having conversations with the actual Dolores, fully grown, with a daughter of her own. The psychiatrist holds Humbert's manuscript, which Dolores has just read. She tells her that such and such company purchased the rights, and it's going to be published.
"What do I care?" Dolores says. "The bastard's dead. And so is Lolita. He was the only one who ever called me that. Now I get to be free."
The final shot is Dolores walking down a street, living her life. Then she sees a display of the books in a store window. It's one of those covers that show the disembodied parts of a little girl -- the legs, or the torso or something. And she looks sickened, but not surprised. She is free of Humbert, but she still doesn't get to control her own story.
Anyway, that's how I'd do it.
just reading humbert's depiction makes me feel disgusted and freaked out, good job!
That's a wonderful idea, this doesn't sexualize her story at all and shows although the experience sticked with her she healed at the end
Get into the film industry ASAP
Yeah it could be done kind of like The Last Duel, where it contrasts the rapist's perspective of what happened vs what actually happened.
I’m pretty sure this is the only correct way to do it. Showing in no uncertain terms that Humbert is an unreliable narrator, giving Dolores back her identity, and calling out the industries that are more than happy to twist the story to suit their own perversions.
The way Harris speaks of what's supposed to be a 12-year old girl is SO disgusting, all while he was sexually abusing a 14-year old. It's horrible how much Sue Lyon went through JUST because she had played the role of a sexualized child and was abused by a director, it's tragic how her life had ended so tragically and she wasn't given an ounce of justice, only being known as an underage "sex symbol" for the rest of her career until 60 years later.
I know it's not just women, but the way SO many young girls in media were made to kiss grown men or either act sexually in the movies they starred in, even when they weren't sexualized, a little girl or boy just BEING in a movie as the starring role, as per Natalie Portman, were prayed upon like a piece of meat by disgusting people, don't even get me started on the age countdowns. It's sad so many of these actors/actresses aren't able to really live normally after that and are often known for being an eroticized object.
Even the ones who managed to move on, like Mina Suvari, Brooke Shield, etc. are STILL remembered for their roles in being taken advantage of. Dominique Swain, even 26 years later, is still being reminded and reminisced as Lolita (1997) on her social media to this day. It's just gross that victims must be represented by THIS kind of media and are blamed for being seductresses or wh0r3s even though they were nothing but children.
@ville__ Hey I remember you! You were the guy who was asking for subs for his birthday. You really slacked off from that :(
@@radvelvetcakezIt's a bot. Responding to them just makes them worse.
Report them
@ville__ using the f slur does not make sense in this context considering that the video is not about anything homosexual
@@mewaw-mp5ht I did and still do with every comment I see. But they're actually not a bot. They previously responded to messages. I'm just fucking around for funsies 😅
I 100% agree and how a lot of these teen movies or shows like in anime and western television has these sexualized teenagers (I mean I only know about those two medias so idk if they do that a lot in other places) but they certainly do this A LOT I mean they may not be actual teenagers (at least for live films) but they are playing teenagers and it’s just gross. I mean I GET some teenagers do things like this but these films make it seem like fun and okay when it’s NOT! I mean if they are gonna have things like sexual things at least make it realistic (like sex education) because the others just seem sexualized. It’s totally whacky.
The novel was inspired by an actual crime. An 11 year old girl Sally Horner was abducted and abused for years. The fact that people have been romanticizing this story for decades is crazy.
Little jack horner sat in the corner
Eating a Horner pie
A lot of people are missing that the predation IS the point for most pedos, not just an accident of being visually attracted to very young-looking women. The fact they cast underage girls in these films when they could’ve cast an adult who just looked young without changing the story line says everything about the Director/Producers
I recall reading the book and wondering how Lolita could have been so unlucky as to be targeted by not one but two pedophiles, who both experience sex with her. My thoughts were largely, "How many people like this are lurking out there? What factored in to Lolita being a target of both of them?"
As someone who was married and then rebounded by a pedophile - I worried there was something wrong with me. I realized grooming even before the first person, took place and I showed signs I suppose.
I read the book recently as an adult. Dolores’ mother was pretty unkind to her. I’m not sure what exactly happened before Humbert showed up but typically pedophiles target children who show signs of being abused/ neglected because they don’t have an adult to worry for them. Humbert groomed Charlotte as well. If a child isn’t being abused, the pedophile will often groom the parent. Dolores’ background gave many indications to Humbert and her second captor that she would be an unfortunate, very easy target.
It's actually a statistic that if someone grew up in an abusive situation or were in an abusive relationship that they would be more likely to end up in another abusive relationship later on. Abusers look for victims with an altered sense of normal so they can more easily manipulate them, and that often involves a history with abuse for the victims.
Predators of all kinds target people with trauma or people that have no one to turn to. Childen are very easily susceptible to this because they're dependant on adults for all of their needs (including emotional needs), have limited rights, as well as have still forming brains and bodies and a general lack of life experience. The truth is that children are already extremely vulnerable, and pedophiles are opportunists. They seek out any chance to effectively get away with it - adversity, uncaring or absent parents, etc. Factors that make children less likely to contact responsible adults or authorities. There was conducted a study showing that psychopaths are able to find people with trauma by seeing their way of walking alone. I assume groomers are very attuned to those things.
@ville__lol
Seeing Catherine Demongeot and Sue Lyon side by side was more impactful than I would have thought. As someone that’s not read Lolita and only knows it through pop culture, it just puts it into perspective so effectively that it’s about a child, not a mini woman.
It honestly makes me sick to see an image of the “ideal” Dolores. It’s one thing to read, it’s another to actually see.
@ville__ you sound like a child yourself tbh
@@brandoncrooks1681 Don't respond to the bots. It makes them worse. Just report
@@mewaw-mp5ht bro ain't even a bot that's the worst part
It’s a book that has an unreliable and criminal narrator, Humbert Humbert. He states he’s a monster several times. It was a criticism of thooose types of people who abuse children in the worst way. There was never meant to be a film, not by Nabokov’s standards.
This reminds me of a Korean drama where the female lead has plastic surgery because she felt ugly as a child and was bullied because of that. During the whole drama they never show her picture as a child - which was a great idea as you don't want to cast an young actresses and embody her has the "most ugly person ever" - specially since there is so much controversy around plastic surgery done to young children in Asian countries.
Interesting. What is the show called?
@@maryam.2890 It's called Gangnam Beauty - it centers on the life of a college student who had cosmetic surgery to evade ongoing derision from her bullies. However, her decision seems to backfire as her peers ridicule her artificial look.
I liked the aspect of them never showing the little girl - you don't get pictures or if you get scenes it only shows her back !
@@martamoreira6326 i ve read some of the webcomic
It s heartbreaking when she mentions she still prefers that treatment over one she got before a lot of plastic surgery
When Lolita was made into film, it was made by a man who was more interested in creating a sexy little vixen rather than exposing the manipulations of the predator Humbert Humbert.
You're hating on Kubrick? Really???
When I watched Leon The Professional, I didn't know what I was walking into. I felt absolutely sickened and disgusted afterwards. When I went online to see if anyone was also outraged about the oversexualization of a minor and pedophilic storyline, I was shocked to see so many people loving and defending the movie. I hate how entrenched all of this is. I feel so bad for Natalie...
I think a lot of people feel differently when they find out more and MORE about the director being a pedo, how more sexual their relationship was in other film versions and scripts, and that Natalie got a crazy and inappropriate letter as a child from a “fan” 🤢 I never watch that movie or any from the director anymore
I believe there are two different cuts of the film. Do you know which one you saw? I haven't seen the film in many years and am unsure which cut it would've been that I saw, but I don't remember there being anything remotely exploitative or Humbert-like in the Reno character's treatment of the Portman character.
Same. After watching it, everyone gaslighted me into thinking that the movie was good.
As well as the video said was directed from the director's pedophilic relationship. That man is disgusting.
Yeah you tell me if that wasn’t propaganda right there
I'm 30 and I can't see how a person could look at a 14 year old and think it was okay to try to get them into bed. That 32 "man" was a sick f*ck. I dated a 17 year old when I was 14 and even that was too old for me at the time, but I was so swept up in being wanted by an older guy that I missed all the red flags. It was not a good time to put it lightly...
@ville__ I wish your parents raised you better 🙄
@@lillywakeshimalacombe9746 Why are you give a bot clout instead of simply reporting it?
@lilywhisperer I just did. I hope this gets taken down. ive been seeing this disgusting bot on several channels 😢
@@lilywhisperer you can do both thing you know 🙄
Reported too, hopefully gets it down faster
the fact that REAL CHILDREN were cast in these films makes me sick to my stomach. it is absolutely insane that that was allowed.
The first film had no sexual content to speak of that involved Sue Lyon.
it would have no effect if the victims weren't real kids
@@chcuumritthen they shouldn’t have made the film in the first place
@@Haelinzzi the movies made the book more popular
@@chcuumrit that’s great but was it worth harming the little girls and ruining them for the sake of the movie’s art?
i wrote my master's thesis on this this year! i majored in screenwriting at trinity college in dublin and i wrote a screenplay of Lolita and then my critical analysis was why the screenplay ultimately fails and why it's impossible to adapt. i'm so looking forward to watching this later ahh
@@gilliangracee omg!! That’s incredible. Imagine we probably have a lot of the same thoughts!
I think the only feasible way to have an adaptation of lolita is to never have Dolores in frame or on camera and make it clear that all the ‘lolita’ stuff was humberts delusions and use the fact that the book itself is what Humbert writes while in prison as a framing device to use to draw the line between reality and what humbert sees
@@youraveragetoxicwaste4781 You read my mind! Have her always offscreen. Would we hear her voice, though? Like in "Ben-Hur" where you just see Jesus' feet or whatever.
@@johnpjones182maybe not focus on her feet though lol
@@msjkramey Made me laugh!
I always felt the only way to do a film of Lolita was to focus entirely on Humbert for the first half and not see Delores at all, where the audience imagines what she looks like, indulging in the fantasy themselves. Then have one extended scene where you only see the real Delores as that 12~year old girl, acting in a very innocent, natural, un-Lolita-like way, shattering, hopefully in a shocking way, the fantasy that the audience created along with Humbert. Then finish the film focusing entirely on Humbert again, now with the image of that innocent girl in their heads, HOPEFULLY feeling sickened with what follows. Basically, I’d cut her almost entirely from the film. To me the book was never about Delores, but a sickening self portrait of a man. Unfortunately, even in this form, I doubt you could escape the damaging sexualization ingrained in popular media.
no bc this would be fantastic, i got chills just from reading your comment. i could imagine the moment we see "lolita" as a bucket of iced water falling on the spectator. for the first half of the movie humbert talks about this person and we're charmed by her because we think she's an enchantress, a temptress, a seductress. humbert talks about her as being a vixen, always out to get him and seduce him in every way possible. and then our stomachs drop when we're confronted with the real dolores: a young girl, doing some very young girl things - like eating her hair or chewing on her necklaces or eating boogers or something - and we're just horrified because how in the world could anyone be this monstrous?
That idea could work better for shortfilm
That or to continually go back and forth between the two, with the camera work very different between them. He's living a romantic fantasy, she's in a horror movie
@@inescid265 i understand what you mean but who the hell eats their boogers at twelve years old? dolores isn't mentally disabled, she's a normal 12yo kid and that's not normal 12yo behavior. i get that aging her down would make it seem even creepier and more disgusting, to make the object of affection even younger and acting like a toddler, but there needs to be a way to show that even a kid that appears precocious, intelligent and mature for her age shouldn't be subjected to grossly uneven sexual power dynamics with a grown man, but allowed to grow and develop normally at her own pace with kids her own age.
@@punkbjork heyhey, "eating boogers" was just an exagerated example 😭i agree with everything you say LMAO. it was definitely just an example of how kids do gross things (and dolores, DOES gross things in the book, things that humbert describes as disgusting and childish) that remind us just how childish they are. it was def just an example lol. also i don't think she appeared precicious in any way,, it was all in humbert's twisted mind, and she in any way was a seductress. but yes, i agree with what you said! :)
natalie portman's speech honestly brought me to tears. we have to cover ourselves up to feel safe. when we express ourselves sexually, men feel entitled to our bodies and to sexualize us. even as little girls we aren't safe. it's tough
The way the woman behind her flinched when she described her first fan letter was very telling.
Did you hear where Nabokov got the idea for Lolita? He read about a scientist training a monkey to make art, and the first thing it drew was the bars of its own cage. Pale Fire, Bend Sinister and Ada or Ardor are also absolute must reads.
Also, Kubrick's later films relating to exploitation of kids are much more subtle about it, but very important viewing: The Shining and Eyes Wide Shut
Funnily enough, I just read Stephen King's novel The Shining, and then watched Kubrick's adaptation after I finished the book - and I thought it was garbage. The themes of the novel weren't expressed at all in the film, I was so unhappy with the choices Kubrick made.
the marketing around Kubrick's film is so gross. "how did they ever make a movie of Lolita?" wild. well they... shouldn't have.
My thoughts exactly lmao
Was better to make an animated film probably.
@@NolanSordylmy guy did you watch the video??
you are judging things that happened almost 70 years ago by today's mores. There's no point to it. To say they shouldn't have adapted is silly, if you don't want to see it, don't see it. You are saying because you think its gross, NOBODY should be allowed to see it.
@@katemartin113 the video, is one perspective, surely other views can exist? I
As a woman myself, I never needed the figure of Lolita aka Dolores to BE sexualized. Girls experience sexualization by adults, especially by men from various ages but all while we are still children. I was sexualized and understood it at 12, though reflecting back I was prior to that but didn’t know what was being said to me. At 12, a man who I called uncle was joking to my own father about how he had my school picture in his wallet and another man he worked with saw it. The man then said “oh damn, going for them young now?” And he was serious. My “uncle” then laughed and said “I wish” and kept joking in front of me about how this random man I never met thought I was his girlfriend who’s photo he kept in his wallet. I wasn’t related to this uncle who was in his late 30’s but I was raised to consider him family and was so severely weirded out by this man’s words to me, I would stay in my room any time he and HIS CHILDREN would come over, I changed into baggy clothes when he was around and I would refuse to hug him as I picked up on the fact that he would weirdly ask “where is my hug?” And when I would refuse he would almost grab at me to force me to hug him or pout over me not wanting to be near him.
We all experience sexualization of our person, long before we find our own sexual identity, and these directors do not understand that because they themselves sexualize little girls to various extents and Dolores herself. We don’t need to be told we are desirable to full ass adults. We feel their eyes, we hear their words and sadly, some of us do end up as Dolores. This subject matter should never be glamorized but shown for what it is. A horror movie that is all too real for a vast majority of us.
If it was meant to be a psychological book then it should've stayed that way in the movies, fuc**ng disgusting....
It's disgusting that people defend the movies
I‘m so sorry what happened to you . The thing that baffles me the most is when especially women/mothers don’t recognize this behavior or say anything against it when it happens to children. I experienced smth similar; when I was 11 we went to a BBQ with friends and family and there was a man in his late 40s who recently split up w his wife. Completely out of context they started to make jokes abt that he could date me. He said „No she’s too young“ but w a smile on his face. My mom just sat there and laughed w them. Of course I didn’t recognized it back then but now ,10+ years later, I see how fckd up that was. And one time one of my sisters (17) dated a 29 year old, which I also didn’t consider wrong back then. Just recently I asked my mom what she thought abt it and said that she couldn’t do anything against it anyway and that she really liked that he stand by my sisters side when all of his friends said that this is wrong. So I tried to explain to her why such a relationship is wrong, but I don’t think she really got what I was trying to say .
All the dads leered at my best friend in 8th grade (we were 13). A creep tried to manipulate me when I was 11 or 12, and I didn’t know what he was talking about, so I argued with him and finally threatened to get my parents involved in the argument about how I hadn’t properly thanked him for a pseudo gift. Years later, I realized what he wanted wasn’t the thank you note I sent. He was noticeably older than his wife.
Yeah... I had a boy from year six sneer at me and made a séxual reference at me when I was in grade 3.... My mum gave me the talk that night because of his comment :/
@@SaMira-gb6vg when I was freshly 18, I dated a 29 almost 30 yo man for 2 years. He turned out to be abusive and we broke up a month ago.. he always told me how much in love he is with me, and I was too. Very much blindly in love. But it was unfair, I didn't understand anything. Not love, not sex, not the world and not myself. While he understood everything.. and he knew it, he knew how naive and innocent I was.
Holy shit seeing those dudes commenting on little girls instagram accounts is so creepy.
The girls in the pre-professional program at my daughter's dance studio have Instagrams that I follow. The comments are more innocent, but if you look at many of the men's profiles they follow only 13 - 15 year old dancers and gymnasts. They know if they say certain things their comments will be filtered, so they keep it PG. But the sweat and heart eye emojis come through loud and clear. 🤮
I first read Lolita just a few years ago. I'm 43. I was blown away by how good it was and how amazingly wrong I was about what I thought it was.
i love how you switch the background clips when nabokov is talking about dolores to his vision of her, juxtaposing when the media is talking about her, a fairly small but powerful difference 🫶
also the work you put into this is insane!! i haven’t seen a lot of your videos but you seriously have a talent for video creation
Thank you so much!!🥲
I’m part of the thought group that believes that Lolita shouldn’t be adapted. However, if someone found a way to adapt it in a nuanced way that both communicates Humbert’s unreliable narration and Dolores’s victimhood, then maybe I’d be willing to do a double take. I sense that most adaptations fall prey to Humbert’s manipulation, and opt to romanticize his abuse often without realizing it.
I think it can be done - but only if ‘lolita’ is never shown on camera and is never in frame, and Dolores is barely ever in frame (maybe the back of the head or an arm or something) which circumvents the physical showing of abuse and having a child actor in those scenes (a petite adult woman would work in this way) - and this distinction between Dolores and Lolita (who is a figment of humberts delusions) would hopefully negate any romanticisation of what’s happening. I also think the framing device of the book being what humbert writes while in prison (iirc) would have to be used more, potentially with an added audience stand-in/voice of reason character to compare humbert to - like reminding humbert (and therefore the audience) Dolores’ age when humbert meets her. It could be another prisoner who humbert shows the book to or something - obviously an adaptation-only character
If it is to be done it can’t be a live action film. Make it an animated film or an audio drama, with an adult actress providing the voice of Dolores. It would also have to be an independent work, not a Hollywood project, because basically every man in Hollywood is a Humbert Humbert.
based on the comments of the people who created the films/the films themselves, it seems like romanticizing the abuse was very intentional. they knew exactly what they were doing when creating those films.
@@youraveragetoxicwaste4781 I think another option would be to show a difference in how different people view Lolita. For example, in AHS, they have an actress switch to show how men have sexualized a certain character. I do believe if you have something like that Dolores could be on screen but honestly, I don't trust Hollywood to do this well unfortunately
@@youraveragetoxicwaste4781 i think maybe you could also possibly do an adaptation of Lolita from Dolores's point of view as a retrospective when she's already fully an adult, and all scenes from her childhood are done as flashbacks with the adult Dolores (and adult actress) standing in for her childhood self, like she's reliving her memories. I think you could also play with whether the adult Dolores responds with the same dialog as her childhood self (and the canonical book dialog) as well, to show how her thought process has shifted in adulthood, while Humbert's dialog remains the same, so it shows how much he was just projecting onto her/not truly seeing her and just seeing his own gross delusions. this is more of an idea for reinterpretation though, and not straight adaptation.
I feel like the book should be assigned reading in high school. It goes to show that flowery and romantic language can be used by monsters just trying to mislead, take advantage, or feign innocence, but that doesn't make them romantic or well-meaning people. It can warn young people to keep their eyes out for that kind of thing, particularly in regards to someone significantly older or more powerful.
Unfortunately a lot of teachers can't even get to read any full books at all with their class let alone one as long as Lolita. Not to mention how hard it is to get anything more adult than YA into the curriculum these days due to not wanting to be "too violent" or "too sexual" or swear. Like the whole issue with Number the Stars being the replacement for Maus or The Diary of Anne Frank
I think that is a bad idea, since many students would not understand that Humbert Humbert is the bad guy. It would be great if it was taught properly, but it seems too much of a risk that a lousy teacher might accidentally cause a group of children to romanticise paedophilia.
@@seanthestewart The problem is a lot of students don't even get proper education on consent and rape or even sex itself. Let alone encounter it in an unreliable narrator
I once read under another video analyzing the 90s movie , that Dolores didn’t really wear these clothes, it’s just what HH wants the audience to believe she wore, since we see everything through his se*ualzing lense. But I highly doubt the director to be this brilliant, since he called the novel a tragic love story.
The nymph era on tumblr was literally not okay looking back like we were literal children um😅😅😅
I think about this a lot, an entire genaration of girls exploiting themselfs for an aesthetic or the desire to be seen and “loved” by am older man
It’s still happening big time!!!!🙃
Yeah, but it's not the children that is the problem, they're just trying to adapt to a sick world.
@@MMMNemesis I don't think they were saying the children were the problem...
What was the nymph era again I vaguely remember
23:36 This point is absolutely perfect. I've never been able to put my thoughts into words for this argument but you knocked it out of the park. Murder is a much more explicit act while pedophilia is very layered. It is a lot harder to go and kill someone than it is for a pedophile to touch a child or even leer at one
Ah yes all the "accidental" touches from coworkers, especially when you're young and (they assume) naive
@@msjkramey you put it so well
@@msjkrameyAnd the staring. I'm eighteen, but dress relatively young. Hair in braids, casual outfit and I carry a plush toy (profile pic) with me.
I was out with my parents when a man, older than my 40 year old parents, stared at me. His head literally turned to follow me when I was walking, he was licking his lips.
I really thought these films and the genre were just creepy fodder for dirty pervs, both young and old, but I decided to just watch this essay anyway. I was thoroughly impressed. I will still never watch any of these movies, lol, but I plan to read the book, now. I love that you were able to help me see the story deeper than the initial surface level that I had before, from the eyes of someone that falls far outside the stereotyped audiences I'd expected. This was really well done. This channel is definitely going to get huge.
Same
The clips are making uncomfortable though as I am not exposed with this stuff(I’m 18) but I want to know real image of sadly turned into sexualize object, which it wasn’t in the book. I am personally have that sweet attitude with romance in general(but I didn’t engage with movies or anything), it’s just in secret way and I want myself to be aware of this serious things because the world different now.
I think the only way Lolita could ever be adapted would be to never show Lolita, just show people’s reactions to her
That's a great idea!
So this is what I think an adaptation could be:
Make the therapist that analyzes Humbert Humbert be the narrator of the film. The framing device is that they (the therapist) reads the manuscript Humbert has written (the story of Lolita). Like other people have said, Dolores is never seen in frame (maybe make the flashbacks in black and white to make it feel more disconected from reality), only an ADULT stand in is used in some frames seen from behind.
The story ends when the therapist finishes reading the story horrified from all the things that happened to that girl. They hear from the detectives in Humberts case Dolores died giving birth. They maybe cry in their office thinking of the horrible life Dolores had. The final scene is Humberts book being published, while the therapist looks with a sad expression at the book cover: a girl with a lolipop (sounds familiar?)
Wow
ooooo I like this idea!
Ok you actually ate that
Brilliant. Simply brilliant.
Whilst this sounds like a good idea in theory, it's really distorting the source material in a way that doesn't allow for the mind-games Nabokov wanted his HH to play with the reader. When you read Lolita, you're supposed to be sort of seduced by HH because of his literary exposition, his cultured references, his own take on the story. But the book is also bookended by other material that tries to pull you out of the reverie by stipulating the facts of the situation as they stand. As if they were the truth in the true crime. What you read as a reader who is taking HH's account and being drawn in the story, isn't mean to even really be what happened. Yes it has been laid out as if this is what happened, this is how it happened and now I - Humbert - sit in a prison cell awaiting trial. But why would you believe any of it? The whole point is to demonstrate that paedophiles are not easy to spot, they don't all give off a creepy vibe, many are cultured and eloquent and can tell you outright lies to your face and have you believe them. They are manipulative and they lie.
Nabokov took great pains to create a story that would leave the reader feeling disappointed and disgusted in themselves for having allowed themselves to be seduced by HH. (Likewise those who say Lolita isn't a love story are wrong. it is a love story, but only because it is a story fabricated by HH to try to explain away and almost legitimise his own actions. It's his love story because it's his romanticised version of events.) Why would we believe that there was even such an altercation with Quilty at the end? It's supposed to show HH on something of a heroic arc going after not only his nemesis but the man who took Dolores. HH needs for the reader to see *some* redemption in this monomaniacal pentapod nightmare of a man, after everything he has confessed to. The bit where he swears he loved Dolores when he saw her slightly older, married, barefoot & pregnant...why would he tell you that if he wasn't looking for redemption?
It's the very fact that all of this is written down the way it is, that makes the idea of a film adaptation not only grossly unethical (I don't care how much you don't immediately involve a child in the more disturbing scenes of this film, but no smart parent would want their child to even be associated with it in any way. If you only have the 12 year old girl act in innocuous scenes, unless you remove her identity altogether and only shoot her from behind or the neck down, you are going to have the film and all its associations forever intwined with the child involved who will eventually be seen as 'that Lolita kid' once it gets released.
And if you don't show the very young face (the way this video showed a clip of Catherine Demongeot) then you lose the impact of what it truly means to have to think of such a young child being abused in this way. Just as we do when we actresses in their teens in an aged-up version. It completely loses all the impact.
Starting off with a therapist as the initial focus point doesn't work as a vehicle for the content of the book. In order for it to be in keeping with the text, it will still have to be shot in much the same way that both other films were, with us the viewer as a third party observing all involved. It will still have to follow what HH wrote and the minute you show it on screen it becomes more indelibly 'true' than anything written down. The book is probably my favourite book ever written and I was in my early 30s when I first read it. I'd avoided it for years because it sounded as though it was going to be some really sleazy filth that I had no interest in reading. But I was eventually convinced to give it a go by various BookTubers whom I respected for their honesty. I'm incredibly glad I did. But I'm also glad I waited until I did, with a few decades of reading experience and many year of studying texts critically, before allowing myself to get taken on the absolute rollercoaster of emotions that Nabokov took me on. I hated how he made my almost sympathise with HH at some points, before realising that he was doing so to make a point. To show how people are convinced of lies and manipulated by paedophiles; especially those who are charming and educated and well-spoken.
it's not a book for the uninitiated to truly grasp with. Nor would I suggest it to people much younger than I was, unless in a university setting where the book is studied and examined thoroughly in order to show what is and isn't being said; what did or didn't potentially happen. I don't believe this can ever be truly conveyed on screen and agree with the statements in this video that some art is simply not suitable for more than one medium. By all means read the book, but do so with critical thinking, discretion and discernment. Nobody needs another film of this book to be made in order for the story to have impact or hit home.
It's possible to adapt it but not in a way that stays true to the source material. Even minor changes like aging dolores up a couple years or changing the POV will drastically affect audience's perception of the story. It's too specific to be changed and too sick to be filmed. There's no way a faithful adaptation could be done without harming any actress the studio pick in some way, even with the brightest intentions. Some things are better left in their original form. This is one of those things.
Honestly, I agree with you
Although there has to be SOMEONE who is very young looking for their age. For example, I, an 18 year old, often get confused with a 14-15 year old
I’m guessing there’s someone in my age range who when styled, can pass for that age, or even younger
It’s definitely possible to be faithful and not be exploitative. If you go about it very objectively and subtle, you can make those harder scenes more so as implications. Like we know what he’s about to do, but we never see it. All the while, visualizing “the male gaze” by making Humbert stare just barely off camera, making us the audience uncomfortable and understanding the implications, at the same time never shooting Dolores in any sexual manner. Always keep that aspect of her set in reality to really hammer the point home without exploiting her.
Animation?
@@beewest5704 Or at least Lolita is a jittery white cutout, without a face or a body. Sometimes when she is feeling something, happy or angry colors filter through the space but she's never really there. Humbert Humbert never really sees Dolores
This is one of the most well thought out and articulate video essays I've seen on any film here on youtube and to do it on such a sensitive and delicate topic is just an amazing testament to your talent as reader and writer. I cant believe I've never seen any of your content before this. Freakin Bravo girl👏
This is so excellently made- from analysis to editing!
A film adaptation should never have been made based on Lolita, at least not in live action with a real child. I think an animated film or an audio drama where Dolores is voiced by an adult actress could work and has the potential to be very powerful, even subversive in the case of an animated film. But Hollywood is teeming with pedophiles and I don’t trust any of them to do it right.
I think for an animated adaptation of lolita it's not really necesary she speaks, I do not think it's even necesary she apears on screen, What if we just see her feet? Or what if we just see her shillouete? I mean, it's film, we DO have options, these men are just excusing themselfs
@@MMU_U You can do so much with animation there could be a whole film done like the Freaky Fred episode of courage the cowardly dog. You never see anything but you know damn well what happened
I recently read Jennette McCurdy's book and I don't think any child actors should be in Hollywood. Like full stop no child actors.
I think if anything, men are to stay the hell away from the original source material. They have shown to be untrustworthy of making the film it needs to be, which is about a sick, disgusting old man preying on a child.
If anything, as I said in one comment, the only people that can truly be trusted with this source material is if they are survivors of being SA'd as a child. They will actually know how to make Humbert a monster and show that NONE OF IT was ever okay.
@@dumpsterDeityreal
In order for Lolita to be accurately adapted to film, it would need to be shot like a horror movie with Lolita ad the main character, but Hollywood seems to only ever portray it as a romance with Humbert as the MC.
I disagree. The entire point is to show it from Humbert Humberts perspective, but his perspective is meant to be so clearly warped that the reader feels disgusted by him and feels sympathy for Dolores. You're meant to get into his psyche, and see how twisted and what an unreliable narrator he is from within his own head. I think if they did it from Dolores' perspective, it would be an entirely different piece of media. In Nabokov's book, Humbert rants for pages and pages about all sorts before we as the audience are even introduced to Dolores, so by the time we are we already know what kind of a filth he is
@@spidercider8909 except movie watchers are inherently, not stupider but putting less effort into analysis. Movies are generally a casual thing for the majority of people. If you adapted the source material identically, the average movie watcher would not be able to pick up on the unreliable narrator aspect unless you made it SUPER obvious. You’d essentially be making what looks like a movie in support of pedophilia.
Which is why movie adaptations of novels are so hard. When it comes to narrative methods, novels are a _tell_ and movies are a _show._ You simply can’t accurately adapt most novels into movies because novels rely on internal dialogue and movies rely on visual expressions
@@emilybarclay8831 "movie watchers are stupid and don't put effort in to analyze what they're consuming" jeeze talk about pot calling the kettle black.
@@NolanSordyldid you really just take the phrase
"...movie watchers are inherently, not stupider..."
and quote it as
"...movie watchers are stupid..."
to argue about it???
Are YOU stupid????
it wont work even in the book she's rather an object and not subject there is nothing in her to be an mc it accents on the pedo
this entire video is SO well thought out and worded. thank you for making this!
I feel so grateful for having a Lit teacher who introduced this book more as a psychological horror than anything else. I remember so vividly being able to see the horror behind the prose. And then I remember the classroom's stunned silence as he read contemporary reviews and told us about the movie adaptations.
Brilliant video, I'm really happy to have found your channel recently and am enjoying how much you're making me stop and really LOOK at the media I consume. Very excited to continue through your channel!
When I was 14, I was gr00med by a 40 year old man, and at the time I didn't understand that it's not normal and thought I was loved and that I'm in power in this situation. He used to compare me to characters like Mathilda from Leon, the main character from the Lover, Angela from American Beauty and many, many others. He also used to send me video clips from Lolita's film adaptations, comparing me to them. Media like this is used by pdffiles to s3xualize young girls, those are not just silly movies and they actually have impact on people
It seems that ANIME is used by a lot of groomers today.
Hollywood is full of it.
Woody Allen, Jerry Seinfeld, Roman Polanski...
@@user-od5fh3gn4d well that’s because anime contains a lot of inappropriate relationships between adults and children, and excuses them by saying “she’s actually an 1000 yr old alien with the mind of an adult, her 5 yr old appearance is just her earthly form”
@@real_cheritaOh yeah, the 1000 y/o loli trope..This is why I don’t watch animes with those kinds of “plots”. It disgusts the ⱧɆⱠⱠ outta me, and makes me very uncomfortable knowing these young looking girls are being fantasized about.
@@user-od5fh3gn4dI was groomed with anime as a baby lesbian. My groomer especially liked Happy Sugar Life. Because according to her she was obsessed with me and protective because she was afraid men would "touch" me. PDF-files are so weird, man.
Why would that mom let their toddler eat the hot dog at all without cutting it up and in half??? That's such a choking hazard even if it's meant to be innocent!
I feel like if they ate a giant lollipop peverts will also sexualize. I don’t understand mothers like. Even one sexual comment should make her stop. So sad that she uses her child like that and that outsiders care for the safety of her child than she does herself
It's not innocent. There are so so so many pedophiles out there. Those mothers minds are as twisted and they present their kids that way so they get views from all these evil adults.
She's doing it on purpose, it's disgusting
i really don’t think there’s any way it’s innocent :(
She’s doing it for the perverts she has her model too and the SAVES ARE INSANE
cant put into worlds how much i loved this video. very insightful, heavy, and well-made. 16:25 - 17:27 made me cry. this was randomly recommended to me and i didn't realize that you also made the chloe sevigny, female rage obsession, and black swan videos which i also loved and think about a lot. new subscriber!!
The way I’ve been trying to explain this to so many people you’re a really great speaker ! I like you
I first watched the 1997 version when I was 13 and could be described as a "nymphet." Back then, I was drawn to the taboo and saw it as romantic. At 18, while in therapy, I revisited the novel and both film adaptations. It became clear how disturbing the story truly is. I didn't hate the movie at that point, but I began questioning its portrayal. Watching behind-the-scenes footage, I was horrified to see Jeremy Irons actually slapping Dominic Swain during rehearsals for the "Murder me like you murdered my mother" scene. At 24, I'm frustrated by how Nabokov's story was twisted to fit the kind of man he portrayed when he created Humbert Humbert.
I've also seen comments on other videos accusing Nabokov of being a pedophile and claiming he spoke lustfully about young girls in interviews. However, I haven't found any evidence of him doing so. People often overlook that Nabokov himself was a childhood sexual abuse victim.
Rant over! I just wanted to add my thoughts. Brilliant video! 🥳
I have a copy of the book, and there is a letter at the beginning of the book that nabakov wrote and either I misread what he said or he said it sarcastically but he said something like, “ I get why people are attracted to Lolita” or something and it was so off putting to me. Granted, I haven’t read the book in ages and never finished it, so I could be misremembering, though I don’t think I’m quite ready to touch the book again 😅 if I’m wrong I am willing to admit it.
Heartbreaking to hear about how grown men couldn't help but be awful to child actresses and make them so uncomfortable to the point it scars them for life. Imagine the point of a story flying so far over their heads that they think Lolita is a romance.
@ville__its been a day since your first comments on this video why are you still doing this
@@peterfalkfan its a bot 😭 dont respond to it, report its comments
@@peterfalkfan I'm surprised TH-cam didn't automatically take it down considering those words are blacklisted.
Unfortunately the most likely (or the only) people that would seek out a role like this in the first place are people who would be comfortable portraying the actions and the mindset of the character. When you're acting you try to get into as similar as a mind set as you can with the character so it's pretty much doomed from the beginning I'm afraid.
J.K. Rowling read the book and called it a "tragic love story!" And she writes children's books!!
Wow. The whole video essay was incredible. But that last bit… I got chills. Thank you for your insight
one of the best videos i've seen on this topic! great job
My 13yo niece expressed an interest in watching Lolita because of the coquette aesthetic and, as someone who's been victimised sexually by adult men and overexposed to 🌽 and erotica on social media, that idea made me feel a way. Terrified, sick, angry- not angry at her, but FOR her. She's so young and I fucking hate that I can't protect her from the normalised hypersexuality of the internet. With that being said, I would MUCH rather her read the book when it's age-appropriate for her to do so. At least there's less of a chance of her misinterpreting the narrative
Tell her to watch my video and then watch the movie lmao
My ten year old niece said the same. Scared the shit out of me. I'm angry at my own abusers but if ANYONE hurts her like that, they'll be seeing hell
Coquette/nymphet girlies are practically THE WORST way to be introduced to Lolita: from a bunch of teen girls who romanticise it 😨😨
It's at least a little relieving that they are at least talking to y'all about it. I am glad that they have an adult (presumably) that they can trust enough to confide in. I think most kids would just look it up themselves and possibly find not so great parts of the internet. I don't know how many kids would rather read an old timey novel than just see a movie. There's a chance she might just watch it anyways without telling you about it. If I were you I'd still have a conversation about this but look into more appropriate media that does still show the aesthetic, since that's the reason for her seeking this out.
If she expresses interest in reading the book, read it with her! Make sure she's reading between the lines, help her learn how to analyze the text she's reading. This is also what we learn in school but when we're told to annotate, to share our thoughts on the school books we read, we so often forget they're teaching us critical thinking and we put our minds to sleep. Engage with her and encourage her critically reading!
You made a lot of good points and I agree with you. I grew up in the 80s and I remember watching Pretty Baby and Blue Lagoon as a young girl. I remember thinking,as a young girl, that there was something really wrong about how sexualized Brooke Shields was in those 2 movies. Pretty Baby in particular is really bad. I also remember watching The Professional with Natalie Portman and I remember how they sexualized her. Im glad things have changed as much as they have since then.
I recently watched Pretty Baby and I was SHOCKED that anything in that movie was approved to air…I can’t even tell you the plot or theme but I CAN tell you that I watched a child marry a 40 year old man and get paraded around on a pillow like a virgin to be sacrificed 😐
@@real_cherita I know, it's really shocking. I was around 7 when Pretty Baby came out but I didn't see it until it came on HBO so I was probably 10-12 yrs. old. I knew it was wrong,of course, and I was confused by it at that age.
@@Minlaroo Its incredible that Brooke Shields turned out to such a decent lady after all this.
I even remember feeling somewhat odd about Jennifer Connelly's supposed infatuation with David Bowie's character in Labyrinth.
@@personaldove Even Bowie opposed it to a degree. There's a kiss scene in the book that he refused to even talk about having in the movie because Jennifer Connelly was 14-15 and he was 39, insisting that she was too young for anything like that.
@@dx.feelgood5825 Pretty sure Labyrinth isn't based on a book? There was a novelisation after the film was released, maybe that had a kiss scene? There are a lot of weird rumours about Labyrinth but from actual facts about filming, it doesn't look like anything physical was planned to happen, luckily!
This is done so well. It makes me want to read the book, but not enough to do it. You did a great job.
Your channel is one of my favorites, I’m so glad it exists!
I watched a short documentary about Sue Lyon not long ago she wasn’t able to attend the Lolita movie premier in New York in 1962 because of her age. She stated that “ her destruction as a person dated back to that film”. She also said that she was exposed to temptations that no young girl should ever undergo. 💔 We have enough Lolita adaptations… to many. Not one more child should ever be exploited in such a way ever again. The ending to this video says it perfectly.
omg this reminds me of the movie i forget its name but an older woman gets her childhood journal and how its a story of her grooming. A romanticize version and the real version shes been groomed, she is a child. THE TALE thats its name, i may have to watch this and edit this comment after I watch it.
The Tale is such a good film.
She sees a picture of herself at 13 years old and has a memory with that girl in it. Then her mother reminds her that she was 15 in that particular picture. The film flashes back to the same memory, but this time with a younger actress.
It shows how mature we think ourselves at that age, but how little we actually are. And predators will use that to manipulate you, as happened to the main character in the film.
And for the scenes where she was abused, they used an adult female body double and superimposed the child actress's face. It's still harrowing to watch play out. But no one can say the film sexualized the character/actress
It's so good but such a haunting watch. She publicized all the on set lengths taken to protect the child actress, but like the video says it still looks like what it is since we don't see the body doubles and etc. I watched the movie in pieces. I love when the adult her meets the child her part.
I just want to say you did PHENOMINALLY in making this video. The amount of work you put into this is amazing! Thank you for making this, this is SO important to talk about!
amazing video essay, you explained everything so well, I couldnt help but feel so much discomfort but it was probably because you finally named something I didnt know I felt. ive had my share of SA/gr00m situations and have lived my younger life believing i was good for nothing more but being a nymp----, its been some time but that feeling never truly leaves your body eventhough i know plenty better now thankfully. you naming it and shedding light on the issue gives a lot of recognition. thank you for making this video ❤
Masterful essay as usual. This made me feel seen. I was introduced to Lolita when I was about 12. My older brother was in a Kubrick phase himself and I watched some of it but it scared me to see a girl my age being chased by a middle aged man. I’m writing a screenplay that involves girls dealing with the aftermath of abuse and this video really gave me a lot to think about. It’s a long shot that it will ever be sold much less made … but I don’t want to hurt anyone especially young girls who might portray my characters.
My husband, who has not even read or watched Lolita, was so absolutely shook at the idea of 'making them married'. This whole thing should just be a red flag on the people making the movies and supporting them....
That was a sign of the times. As long as you married the girl then it was okay because at least she wasnt ruined, very sad times indeed.
People’s opinion on Lolita is a tell tell sign of if they are creeps or good people. It’s like a character judgement on if they can be trusted or not.
In what way? It's a great novel. A comic novel btw.
The way you present information is so interesting! I’m glad I found your channel! (and, unrelated, but you are gorgeous btw! When you stopped for the “sponsor” part, I was like, whoa! lol 😂)
The cover of the book I have depicts the black and white drawing of a girl in a fetal position as if she was crying but you cannot see her face, she has in her back this key like piece like those that you have to twist in toys to make them walk or talk, she is in the bottom of the cover surrounded by a white circle, the rest of the cover is pink, even though it doesn't respect Nabokov's request of the cover's design I think that it kinda does justice to the theme of the book since the girl depicted is not only not sexualized but it seems like she is suffering.
I remember watching a documentary here on TH-cam called the Lolita Riddle. It went in depth with his themes in his writing and where he got the inspiration from. Also it went more in depth with his childhood too, he had an uncle who was abusive towards him. As you keep watching it, it makes sense why. I highly recommend it.
This is the first video of yours I have watched. I am truly so impressed by your story telling, your editing, this video has straight up opened my eyes to so many concepts regarding my own personal life, the media, and Lolita. Holy shit literally thank you for making this please continue making videos 🩷
this video is really great, and that last quote at the end from Tom Bissel is absolutely killer. i'm glad i watched this!
I have the idea of telling the story through two pov’s. One of humberts with a young looking adult actress and one of an outsider that sees dolores as the 4 foot 9 tall little girl. That way the viewer realizes how warped humberts mind is and sees how the reality is actually so disgusting and disturbing
Oh tht would be so good... yk weirdly ivthink a british dark comedy could fit this
Idk, i think that could take away from the psychology of p-dophiles and humbert.. 30:20 explains it well imo. I don’t think Humbert or other p-dophiles are delusional in that they see children as adults or adult-like, they see children as s-xual
The fact that "nymphette" is used for like every actress now when it was a pedophile's term for preteens is just so sick. He very specifically says what ages and that they don't look like women. Lolita is described as a tomboy and a slob in sneakers and yet "Gothic Lolita" is an incredibly frilly little girl outfit
Lyon's birthday is tomorrow. Rest in peace
Good video
rest in paradise
She's dead?
I really really appreciate you. Thank you for your hard work and integrity
I was just talking about this book yesterday night with my friend, I’m glad you agree with our perspectives hahah, love your videos girl ❤️
17:07 =Upon seeing Nabokov's ideal Lolita, I just realized how I once looked like that child... Something happened to me at 12 years old... And made me realize I almost became some old geezer's Lolita if my mom hadn't been there to put a stop to it...
Halfway through the video and I would love to see adaptation of Lolita where it’s from Lolita’s point of view and it’s a psychological horror!
Call it “Dolores”
wow, i just have to say; this video essay is truly amazing. I cant begin to imagine how much time and passion was poured into making this. I rarely comment on TH-cam videos but I just had to on this one. Keep doing what you're doing. i found this video incredibly enlightening.
@@ruthbroker1870 thank you so much!! 🥲🫶🏻
Thank you for making this essay and engaging with Lolita's content so seriously.
I loved this video. It’s so disturbing the way Natalie Portman was viewed for a while and how recent that was. I hate that men are attracted to underage girls it is one of the things in life that disturbs me most😢
It's just as disgusting. when grown women do it to little boys . And I hate how it's literally tolerated by current society ( example: Aaron Johnson who was under 17 when he met his now wife Sam Taylor-Johnson , she had inappropriate relations with him as a minor while he was working for her as an actor, she disgusts me ,she divorced her husband to get with that boy she was 23 years his senior and the media covers for her , same for the current french president Emanuel Macron, his wife is a p**ophile , she met him he was 15 she was his school teacher, she se**ally abused hum at that age , her husband divorced her, she got together with him oficially even before he was 18 yo, this is only one of the reasons why the french hate her guts and the people who vote against him say someone like him who's gone through this type of trauma and still is in couple with his abuser , is not fit to lead the country .
Yeah even as Padme men were being absolutely awful. We can't exist in peace.
I've always hated both film adaptations of Lolita because I felt that they irreversibly damaged the novel's legacy by existing, not to mention the casting and sexualization of underaged actresses, but I think this is the first time I've heard of James B. Harris and his grooming of Sue Lyon. It's honestly disturbing how much they mirror Humbert and Dolores, to the point where, especially tragically, James even outlived Sue just like Humbert outlived Dolores in the book. The biggest difference between Sue and Dolores is that Sue was eventually able to speak out about her abuse, whereas Dolores died before she could. I know it's hard to return to a normal life after experiencing such trauma, but I hope for Sue's sake she was able to in some form. May she rest in peace.
One of the best TH-cam videos I have seen in along time! Well researched, reasoned and expertly presented.
Wow, brilliant video essay!! This is one of my favourite books and I also enjoyed the 90's film adaption, but you've changed my mind on it!
I love that you mentioned Mysterious Skin because I instantly loved it after happening to watch it when I was younger (maybe 20s or late teens)…so underrated, it really drawn me into the story and I was a bit sad that people were not talking about it…
THANK YOU for the best critique of these films I have yet seen, and I’ve seen a lot of them. I love the book Lolita, but I also have a 12 year old daughter and am also the victim of childhood sexual abuse. The idea that anyone would ever ever ever call Lolita a love story makes me want to punch a hole in the wall.
Really, really good essay! 👏 Thank you for breaking it down like this.
this video opened my mind up a lot. thank you for posting and sharing your thoughts!!!
Jesus Christ. I've only seen the Adrian Lyne version once, and that was more than enough. I barely remember it but always thought it was grosser than Kubrick's. Your clips validate that. As I said, there is nothing overtly sexual about a young girl, lounging in the solitude of her garden, in her bikini or underwear. But putting the sprinklers is most definitely the film, sexualisation Dolores.
I think if I was tasked with adapting Lolita, I'd hide Lolita for the entire movie. You'd only see Humbert's desires and hear his monologues, stare at his expressions of lust. Then right at the end its revealed Lolita is a dog or cat. And yes, there are sex scenes. So everyone who was 'seduced' by Humbert gets a wake up call.
The fact that this version it's so extreme (for the implied zoophilia) and works wonderfully in translating the message it's both wonderful and kind of sad, because depicting a child being abused isn't enough to think so...(Either way I am sure there isn't a way to ethically adapt the book in film for the actress)
P.s. sorry if my English isn't good 🙈
This video essay is one of those where even my adhd brain stays glued to the screen without blinking, absolutely amazing work to say the least, just wow. Also love how you narrate things ❤
This was a wonderful deep dive. Keep up the good work