Yall Hank Green is NOT problematic lol i love Hank thats what makes it funny. I wouldn't be here without him. Please don't read to much into the list if you know you know
Fiq, would you ever consider being a guest star on a blerd w/out fear live to laugh about the silliness of fandom who don't understand these pop male figures? Specifically the nerds of culture pod that blerd does w/ his friend robo. Think you 2 would connect really well, just think about it
Of topic FD. It is amazing to see one of the most brilliant minds of our time over mixing it up among us humble folk in the BLM chat this morning. Huge respect, Maestro.
"That smug satisfaction of being right is getting us killed" is such a banger line that really perfectly sums up my own frustration with especially online progressive spaces. Everyone wants to be good and right, but so few people actually want to put up where it counts
So feel this. Seeing this play a huge part in the result I expected then the same folks doubling down plus cos playing resistance and talking oxygen from minorities and more expert and experienced people and spaces is terrifying and heartbreaking.
It's messed up how all my lecturers in uni ask practically BEG the class to ask questions. Everyone has learned, especially the younger folk, that if you speak up and incorrect, you'll receive social sanctions for it. I think there's a lot of unspoken trauma from an authoritative education system that smarmy folk unknowingly tap into. By looking like the smartest person in the room, they're essentially pretending to be like those same guardians everyone had for 6 hours every day for 18 years. Marginalisation via education. Reinforcement of class & patriarchy. The annoying thing about this of that I love to learn & teach from others, but as equals. Nothing I say is the final word. Nothing HAS a final word & people don't know how to engage with that without marginalising via dunking or thinking "discourse" is short hand for "Twitter drama." The trolls have gotten mainstream. It's time we taught kids to stop feeding them.
in my experience, the loudest people on twitter are also the ones the least willing to do organising work. especially if it's hard, long-term and you cannot post abt it. and gods forbid you have to engage with people you don't *fully* agree with, or need to try to understand or empathise with them. i've said this before and i'll say it again: it's so much easier to organise with liberals than with leftists, and until the latter do some hard self-reflection on why that is, the world will keep looking like it does.
@@Hasseliathis is a fabulous comment and really makes me reconsider some of the things that I’ve been prioritizing in terms of “intelligence.” Thank you!
One really great piece of Counter-propaganda is the only season of The Promised Neverland. It has a very similar conceptual starting place to Attack On Titan, except the monsters are inside the walls and in fact the whole inner society is just set up to feed them. the key to escape is the very special protagonists realizing that the competitive education system that singles them out as special is part of the trap, and they can’t do a revolution alone, no matter how special they are. That said some liars might try to tell you there’s a second season. Do not under any circumstances listen to them
Part of what i love about kratos in the last two god of war games is that it takes a very straightforward, socially ostracized, angry masculine archetype and portrays his reconnection to humanity and community with stark psychological realism. It dares to say “yes, kratos was a lone wolf rage monster who moved mountains to get revenge, and it left him cold, empty and broken. Now watch him slowly learn to love and feel again and see how much more worthwhile his life is”
Deliberately, the less stoic and more empathetic kratos is across the two games, the more successful he is at fighting for the people he cares about and averting his tragic fate.
@@kylesmith5633 Mostly agree here, but Kratos is just as stoic when he has developed his empathy as when he was reticent to embrace it. Being stoic doesn't mean lacking empathy.
Kratos is a great example all the way back since the first game! Although he was tricked into it, ultimately it was by his own hand that he killed his wife and daughter. And somewhere he knew this, the nightmares he suffered from were him not the Gods. Kratos wasn't just angry in the first one, he was depressed af. "By the Gods what I have become" Kratos refused accountability, he couldn't take the truth and turned all his anger and rage all towards Ares. (Who while responsible wasn't the true cause) He got his revenge and all it brought him was further down the raging rabbit hole. In gow2 Kratos was out of control, lashing out at everyone besides Sparta. Zeus gave him the opportunity to pledge allegiance to him before Kratos spit in his face. So now Zeus is the new target for his rage which results in unintentionally killing his loyal Spartan general (b4 time travel) and Athena sacrificing herself. In gow3 he started to let go of some of that rage, he was still mad but shown lots of mercy for the side gods: Helio, Hermes, Hercules and Hera all were given passes at first. Near the end of 3 Kratos doesn't want Pandora to die for his goal of revenge anymore. Zeus couldn't keep his mouth shut and oops there comes his rage again. In their fight Kratos has to acknowledge his own fear that he was also responsible and finally the power of hope buried under all his rage and regret comes out. He kills Zeus then instead of allowing Athena to manipulate him anymore he says "My vengeance ends now" and he impales the true source of his suffering, he took accountability that he played a massive role in creating his awful situation. Then in the Norse ones he shows remorse and takes responsibility of who he was, he just tries to be a better person and it's amazing to see a depressed broken angry man come out the other side. I never liked the "Greek Kratos is 2 dimensional" bs, he always was a broken character if you took the time to look beyond the superficial gore, violence and anger.
I facking love Kratos 😂 He's a character that never got the respect he deserved until the ps4 games came out. Everyone always was saying he's just an angry rage machine while he was also depressed and suffering just as much. The first game starts out with him YEETING HIMSELF OFF A MOUNTAIN TO ESCAPE HIS SUFFERING! Now he definitely wasn't a good guy, did inexcusable shett but you could relate to that hopelessness and anger he had around him. Everyone was trying to manipulate him, just a pawn for the Gods and later the Titans. You take all the games and it truly was an amazing Greek tragedy.
Lone adult wolves are very rare in nature. Most lone wolves are older juveniles that have left their home packs to find or establish a new pack, but their instincts tell them that they need to find a group and assimilate. That much is quite analogous to young men leaving home (not necessarily physically, but in mindset at the very least) and seeking out their ultimate group of peers that they will settle into adulthood with, where their adult minds will set and concretify, so to speak. The difference between young men and young wolves, is that young wolves understand that they will have to earn their place in their new group by demonstrating good teamwork and usefulness, and understanding that social relationships are both push and pull. Give _and_ take. And that it is infinitely easier to survive in a group that you’re already in than alone, resourceless. And wolves aren’t misogynistic. They are remarkably egalitarian between the two sexes. Because that’s what works best for group cohesion.
Yha the man that developed the whole alpha male wolf structure admitted that it only applied to wolfs in captivity and regretted the study because culture never caught up when we found wolfs in nature act like big family units focused on community.
@@DaisysRules That's all well and good, but there is still a hierarchy that everyone has to understand and follow for the success of the group. Cause everyone has different level of intelligence, strength, experience and general competence.
As a BIG John Wick fan I hate that they've appropriated HIM for their Sigma antisocial fantasy. John Wick isn't even a LONER. He's not a lone wolf. He can get through the movies because he has many allies, his good friend died in the beginning, the man was happily married, he literally killed to be with the woman that he loved and he didn't go crazy after she died. Someone just killed his dog.
@@Alex_Barbosa eh, never said it wasn't. It is totally escapist revenge fantasy. There's nothing wrong with it being that but one must note that it doesn't go through the usual beats of one his wife doesn't get fridged, the whole thing is over a dog, instead of one assassin causing someone hell EVERYONE is an assassin, etc. It subverts some things in the genre. Revenge fantasy? Yes. Edgelord? Honestly, I beg to differ.
@@brandonburns5365 pretty sure I do. There's a difference between loner/lone wolf and someone who just prefers their own company usually/introvert. If John Wick were a true loner he would have never asked Marcus for help, Marcus would not have gladly given that help (betray him then regret it, dying in the process) and it wouldn't have hurt John that Marcus was killed. John does not actively avoid connection, he's a bit intense but he's not closed off.
I am a woman, and I had my "edgelord-like" phase as a teenager. I believe it was loneliness that was the driving force, and I struggled with my identity. I also had undiagnosed autism and ADHD, which also played a factor in not being like "other people". Developing strong social connections and treating my depression and anxiety was the cure for me.
I can relate to this pretty hard. Though I did transition from Goth girl to rainbow social butterfly guy :] Definitely a lot of work, help, and hard truths are necessary
I don't think I ever had a phase. I had a pretty secluded childhood and that just kinda bled into adulthood. Only difference is I started paying more attention to my surroundings and my place in the world and got more depressed by it. I don't feel anything positive by making others feel worse and talking about depressing topics, I moreso just do it as an outlet to vent frustrations. Open to positive messaging but I'm heavily anti-social so most my interaction with others is online, and most online interaction is by nature, detached and negative. So it's a pretty rough cycle. Also doesn't help that at a young age, it's hard to find things to do with others that dont involve drug/alcohol use; which moreso just leads to desensitizing rather than communicating to eachother about actual topics. (Basically all of this can be read as negative, which again kinda ties into the whole, most stuff online is nihilistic in nature). If any1 has advice on how to contact ppl with healthier world views and positive outlets like more community involvement i'm all ears. I live in Madison, WI so there's no shortage of things to do near me I'm sure, I just don't know how to find it bc I never learned how, and taking those steps on my own terrify me.
@@bobzilla-1never related to anything more. Feel like I’ve asked for help as many ways as I can, but it’s like everyone is suffering so comprehensively that there aren’t many people left with answers. Maybe by replying to your comment it’ll boost it a little more. I’m near Oakland, CA. I hope you find some better days Bob. If you ever find your way out here I know some good food spots we can be anti-social at.
@@marcuswrblack Wish I had the disposable income to come visit XD. My broke ass can't afford to do much which is sorta why I spend so much time holed up indoors tryna escape reality. Feel like no one has the answers. We're all just stuck due to bigwigs seeing shorterm profits at the expense of the generation beneath them. (which isn't anything new, it's just worse bc the generation that did to us was instigated by Reagan)
I'm also a woman and I did have the same phase as you (I'm also on the spectrum). Fight Club is still my all time favourite movie because it helped me cope with the grief of losing my grandma (whether it's the correct attitude or not). I haven't really detached completely from that part of myself, because I still want to empathise and validate the feelings and emotions I used to feel in some way.
They need to stop handing franchise vehicles over to people that don't actually love the franchise. It's fine to try and do a twist, but if you don't have a love for it then you don't know where or how to twist it. Some of these directors should be doing off brand satire if they want to shit on a franchise
While watching this video I was thinking it'd be hilarious to do a live action joker in the vein of the Cesar Romero or Mark Hamill animated era jokers.
The way that you're able to both empathize with and roast the fuck out of the people you talk about in the video is one of my favorite things about the stuff you make
@@Fooacta "Doug wants to be a filmmaker, he wants to make art, but he can’t, because he’s a fundamentally incurious person who isn’t much interested in what other people think or feel, and all his ideas boil down to “what if Batman met Mario?” I didn't even have to look that up it's seared into whatever part of my brain keeps track of nuclear annihilations.
Because it’s a western problem. We may not be Them, but to the rest of the world, we’re them. We are educated by them, indoctrinated by them, and in some part accountable in a different way than they are. I appreciate the East so much for their perspective if nothing else. We kinda loony.
As a chronically mentally ill man, if you are valorizing your instability and pain (not just expressing it), you have started down the path that will make you a statistic
This. Same and taking the step of saying "This is me and I need to be the one to do something about this", as fortunate/lucky as I was able to, was a huge step to at least getting a little better.
I honestly want one of these movies with a moody loner who ends up doing something psychotic to valorize his mental issues and pain, but actually meets people willing to level with him and connect with him as a human and gets pulled back from the brink with meaningful friendships and things he learns to value besides his egotistical idea of a cool edgy loner sigma grindset. Just have him meet people throughout the movie, maybe people who relate to his problems or mindset or asocial tendencies or were once where he's at in his twisted ideology who can say "Okay... you took a wildly disproportionate action no sane person would do... And you recognize why that was wrong, correct? Okay. Let's pull back a little bit. This doesn't have to define you or be who you are. You made a mistake. That's human. You don't have to keep doing this or continue down this weird path you put yourself on.". You could even have a Deadpool moment at the end where he hangs up his dark violent vigilante persona, preferring instead to surround himself with the friends he made along the way.
@@gregvs.theworld451 Honestly this is the only way to probably avoid the trap of Nightcrawler and Drive: make the instability and loneliness as pathetic as they appear to others, but valorize actually learning to be better. Make it badass to be kind and self-reflective
Honestly, the Attack on Titan discourse always has me flashing back to being a young weeb steeped in Death Note. The ending frames Light as a pathetic failure who abandoned every principle he had the second he started his journey. And looking at the story in hindsight he lost "the war" in Episode 2. A lot of fans refused to believe he could lose and insist on viewing him as this "dark supergenius", when looking back, he spends most of the series coasting on luck and priveledge.
Bro me too, I remember being like that and actually believing that light should have won, I’m actually ashamed and embarrassed. Death note glorifies him so hard despite a lot of his successes being luck that the perfect series of events happened to occur.
Death Note is unironically one of the funniest things ever made when viewed from this perspective. Like, if you don't root yourself in Light's or even L's perspective on Kira/the series, then you've got comedy gold on your hands. Light is genuinely a lolcow I love him so much 🤣
I remember hating Light very much, since the first chapter. The manga became something only when L came into the picture, and I almost abandoned it when he was killed. At the time I did agree with Light's point that criminals are undeserving to live and that they should die, but then one of his first acts upon being tested on his principles, is to kill a bunch of people that weren't criminals. And all of his "supergenius" strategies work exclusively because he's got a group of very naive people around him that have known him since childhood, or due to one of the death gods being in love. He's a failure from the very start, I finished that sh+t only because I found the remaining volumes on sale lol Also shout out to the most misogynistic portrait of fictional women I've seen in a non-hentai or harem manga, coming to you directly from a female author no less.
That's such a fun thing to think on from a mature mindset. Similar to you, as a pre-teen I found light to be a cool edgelord guy I could idealize myself as. As an adult, I realize he is insufferably conceited and incompetent in what he set out to accomplish.
@@DeadKraken He literally called himself God and killed a woman who was tracking him down who was in the law. Like book 3 of the manga. I don't get how people ended up liking him - the thing with art, is that how you want it to be interpreted and how people choose to interpret it will always be a mystery. Maybe she agrees with that stuff, or she's mocking them and audiences didn't get it.
When you say it's fun to "point and laugh", it's the exact thing that Arthur Fleck talks about in his speech to the talkshow host before offing him. It's “The smug satisfaction of being right" in other words and actions. As someone who could've been at risk of falling into the edgelord pit, but thankfully didn't, we need to embrace and integrate, not alienate edgelords. The way we're dealing with it, including naming & shaming in increasingly more obvious ways in popular media, is counterproductive. Positive engagement and positive rolemodels that can appeal to them is the way to go.
This comment needs more love. I think thats something that often gets over looked. Edgelords needs compassion, they need to be told what they are doing right, not what they are doing wrong. same goes for anyone with any views that you dont like or might see as harmful. How many of these guys are like this simply because they've been mocked for things? often by their "own kind". Its kind of the equivalent of mocking someone because they have a different skills to you to you. Instead how about we have a chat with them? I like the idea in this video that we need movies that show the world as we want it to be, not ones that show how pissed off we are about how we think it is. Imagine a movie or show where the action hero tells his team mate its ok to cry, and its not played for laughs etc infact its seen as a perfectly normal thing and noone even points it out or comments on it... Like the part in "inside out" where they have a moment to actually feel sad or enraged and then someone tells them what they are doing well and they get up and do what they set out to do instead of telling them to "man up" etc. or making them the butt of a joke. and this doesnt just go for edgelords it could be for toxic men, trump supporters, evengelical religious people, homophobes etc. if you spend you time telling them what they are doing is bad/stupid etc you are leading by example, you are mocking them and basically being a bully (at least in their eyes). But i also get it to, its hard to just listen to someone, its hard to see and point out good things.. maybe just the first step is seeing the person first.? what do people think?
A friend of mine sent me "Drachenlord" clips for a period of several months - I ignored those almost entirely. Watching people antagonize and egg on someone like that just feels terrible to me. Same with most reality tv - from what I understand a lot of it is deliberatly made in such a way as to aggravate the people in it and cause conflict, because for some reason people enjoy watching other people lose their minds. Also, if you want to trigger my inner edgelord, bring out the kinds of video that involve "It's a social experiment" or "It's just a prank, bro!".
I’m glad someone has commented this! There’s an African saying that goes like this: “A child who is t embraced by its village will burn it down to feel its warmth. There is so much relevance to that saying and to this comment.
I was able to deradicalize a young man I mentored a year or two ago (it was a team effort honestly). He’s 16 now. He finally got around to watching your videos (I have been urging him to do so for ages) and he absolutely loves them. He told me he wanted to binge them, but he’s been trying to give each one a full day to fully digest before he moves on to the next. Don’t undermine your impact.
My favorite video is of FD talking to Odi it made me realize, ive never sat so long listening to two black men talk together in my life. Everything ive ever learned came from a white face. Also - i hate to ask what is radicalization for black men? i dont understand...
'Hey kid, stop watching this propaganda and instead watch this propaganda' Maybe don't indoctrinate children and let them form their own beliefs? Feel sorry for this kid and hope he gets away from this environment asap
Your channel - and this video - were recommended by TH-cam randomly. I'm grateful. Thank you for this patient, logical, empathetic analysis. Subscribed.
It woulda been weird to see back in the day, more cringe than where it is now knowing what we know now (although there was plenty of speculation and rumor, just no real proof)
As a recovered "sigma" myself the simple cure is just honest love and friendship. I was ostracized and bullied my entire gradeschool childhood. I had 1 friend for most of it but that's not enough and he alone couldn't fulfill my social growth so I became detached, resentful, nihilistic, etc. The appeal of the "lone wolf" archetype is obvious and consuming, you resonate with that character with the solitary lifestyle aspect and idolize the power they wield when you only feel powerless in real life. Once I left school and that closed circuit culture, I realized the rest of the world is a lot bigger (duh). I made friends easily at work and there was none of my former life that was reality anymore. Perhaps that's the difference between me and others that don't escape "sigma" life, I never stopped wanting it to end. I certainly didn't fix it on my own, but other people accepting me opened my heart and mind.
Heath Ledger's death (the actor, who played the Joker in Nolan's Dark Knight trilogy, the version of Joker that started all these edgelord impressions) is really sad, but at least he won't see, what his original character has turned into in the modern culture. I don't even know if i wanna laugh or cry seeing those cosplay clips, I mean, they're not even... Joking...
Yeah I liked Todd Phillips Joker movies but far too many people seem to be missing the actual point of them, as someone with mental health issues I can absolutely relate to Arthur's struggles with health services in the first film as i've been through that myself.
@@jadedheartszthe director hates that the first movie attracted the wrong crowd (edgelords), and he ended up making the second movie as bad as possible to mock those edgelords lmao.
@@jadedheartsz It's so odd to me because I do remember Todd Phillips' cringey “woke killed comedy” rant. I feel like nobody remembers that. I wonder what happened. Maybe he was a bit disappointed with the quality of his supporters.
I have 0 known family in this world. I have very few friends and most of whom have started a family and have less and less time for me. I am in a city with the highest unemployment rate in Canada. I have been unable to gain secuirty and love in my life. I live every day in fear and paranoia. Soon again I will be homeless as I have always been on and off since youth. Might have to do something crazy one day so I can be remembered on the news for an evening and forgotten about forever and laughed at afterwards. I wish I could escape this cycle but I dont see a way out if I cant get a job... been applying for years and im not getting calls back......
saw this on nebula and really enjoyed it and wanted to comment- while you only namedropped it a couple times, my favorite tv show is breaking bad, so naturally I’ve thought a lot about the point you ended on. I remember first watching it, anticipating a certain portrayal of Walter White due to the discourse around it, and being kind of blindsided by how firmly the narrative does not take his side and undermines him at nearly every point given how dudes online talk about him. Frankly, I don’t know if it’s possible to make good, meaningful art that is truly immune to being co-opted by those determined to misunderstand it; so much of what a work “means” lives in the realm of subtext, metaphor, and the way an audience engages with it. As artists, you ultimately cede that ground when you present your work to the public. Obviously you control what goes in, but you have very little control of what comes out. Anyways the BrBa-related anecdote that really got this concept through my head, personally, was witnessing years of That Type of edgelord fan be really nasty whenever people tried to analyze the character of gus fring as implicitly a gay man, getting to finally do my victory lap when Better Call Saul confirmed this as not only a legitimate reading but the intended one, and quickly realizing that… nothing changed at all. The dudes who wanted to be homophobic in my comments didn’t throw up their hands and stop because they never cared to listen in the first place. I’ll never claim that it doesn’t feel great to be right but ultimately these media-centric discussions are just byproducts of the kind of shit people would want to be talking anyways.
People consume media through their references. Some are smart enough to be self aware. But most often people dont care At ALL. Take what you want to belive and run with it.
I had no idea Gus Fring could even be misinterpreted as straight. It was so clear that Max was his partner. Insane how people can do so much mental gymnastics to willfully misinterpret something that was so clear in my opinion. Thank you for sharing!
Lindsay Ellis actually explored the idea of how Nazis and fascists tend to incorporate insulting depictions of themselves into their cultures. She mentions the Hammers from The Wall, and how that led to a real life gang, and i think Starship Troopers is name dropped as well. But then she points out that The Porducers escapes all this because ot makes nazis look like schmucks. The Wall and Starship Troopers can make fascism look cool; the Producers cannot. For the record, I love Starship Troopers and the Wall. I hate seeing them co-opted.
@veronicabalzan Same thing happens with the character Eddie Dane in Miller's Crossing. The Coens made that one, and had to come out and explicitly state Dane was gay. Which makes him one of the most badass (but evil) gays ever. Search for the video Miller's Crossing one deag wall bang. Dane is the creep who grabs the woman and says, "Why is it everytime I open my mouth everyone gets smart."
After seeing the Nick Fuentes tweet and vid about "Your body, my choice. Forever", I can't waaaaaait so see men trying to excuse it as "Trolling", as if it's not another word for widespread harassment and as if he's not saying the quiet part out loud.
So far the common response appears to be a "y'all made that up you have a victim complex". I have not yet seen a response to the following proof of the existence of this tweet.
@@lanaloveschocolate Either that or "Fuentes is an extremist and in no way is reflective of shared values among conservatives" Nevermind that shit is everywhere on Twitter now
@@MrOzzificationI think people naively undervalue how many right wingers sympathize with far right ideas. I have no clue how well known they are outside of canada but this Toronto ‘news’ account called 6ixbuzz that started out as a page for posting fights has become a cesspool of the far right in Canada. I have seen posts and comments and dismissed as ‘just being online and not being in real life’ but then you start to notice that these are tend of thousands, even hundreds of thousands of people that believe this stuff and it becomes eery. Honestly why I am certain the Conservative Party will win the next election, because these far right ideas have way more popularity and have seeped into the mainstream.
Now that trump has won they're not going to shield it as "trolling" They are going to be explicit that these are there real thoughts and feelings. And as Trumps presidency goes on it is only going to get worse. I'm ngl you guys might want to take a gun safety course and get armed. Things might get really bad and being armed may be the difference between living and dieing
Come and See is the best anti-war film ever made. It was written by an actual soviet partisan from Belarus who fought the nazis and one of the most infamous nazi brigades that not only included German, but convicted Belarusian criminals convicted of the most horrific crimes like murder and sexual assault and released them on the condition they join the German side., It was filmed by a man who grew up during that time, and the film is shot and directed like a horror film. I'd recommend watching it but be warned it's extremely disturbing and something you'll only ever watch once., it was not released for 10 years because the Soviet Government said that it was "too realistic", because the film was written from the actual experiences of the writer, and the atrocities committed by the Nazis. I would argue it's even better than Apocalypse Now.
@@tedthecommenter5364 Do you mean "partisan" instead of "bipartisan"...? I'm having some trouble imagining the writer of Come and See being all like "look guys the Nazis and the Resistance both have some valid views, let's see if we can settle our differences and focus on the things we agree on"
Ever seen the movie "Jarhead"? There's a scene that explores this idea, where a bunch of marines are watching "Apocalypse Now," and they're focused on the parts of that movie where helicopters are flying around and dropping napalm and bombing houses, and marines are getting hyped up, while ignoring the original point that "Apocalypse Now" was supposed to be an anti-war movie. In fact, I think Roger Ebert talked about that in his review, mentioning that "Jarhead" is an actual anti-war movie, simply because there's no actual war, and the whole movie is just about a bunch of super manly badass marines who become bored as hell and they get in trouble because of it.
That movie is so effective. The most grisly on-screen death happens during basic training, the main characters spend 90% of the movie losing their minds with boredom and isolation, then when they finally get some action, it gets handled by air control instead of them. And then the fight ends and they go back home, scarred emotionally and shaped into a weapon without a target, yet expected to reenter civilian life with gratitude and without incident. And that's how the movie ends, with no catharsis, just a loaded gun of a human being. Then the direct-to-DVD sequel was just "Marines are so cool!" military propaganda.
While I wasn't out for blood, and deployed super late in the conflict, that was pretty much a very real depiction of most deployments, especially mine. I spent most of my time in the gym or watchin anime.
Same thing happening to American History X - I grew up in eastern Germany in the 90s, where Skinhead Youth gangs were quite prevalent. Some of my friends even were Skinheads (but to my knowledge, to them it was more like a youth subculture, none were radical violent offenders, most just got groomed as kids into the ideology via older teenagers) - the favourite movie of our village skinheads was American History X - despite the movie obviously being very critical of that movement. Instead of looking at Derek's inner demons and his potential redemption, they all watched the curb stomping scene on repeat. Art is in the eye of the beholder and said beholder's interpretation can vary greatly it seems.
Full Metal Jacket is another film like Apocalypse Now where the whole is lost because most only watch the first half of the movie. As Jarhead I use to tell people to watch it as that what the Iraq War was like because it was boring as hell for a few minutes of action.
My favorite depiction of masculinity (not edgy in the same way) is Ke Huy Quan's character as Waymond in Everything, Everything All at Once. I've loved a lot of edgy movies and at least seen the whole roster discussed here, but as someone who strays more toward empathy and stubbornly searching for connection. The radical depiction of Waymond as someone who refuses to abandon compassion, love, and empathy even in the face of it bringing more challenges to his character, is something that will stick with me forever. At least to me personally, that role stood in the face of Sigma male fantasy in such opposition to its tenants that it embodies the bleeding edge at the other side of the spectrum.
I agree with that. If we're thinking about a spectrum, I think Cassian Andor is a good example of the middle (in the show). Cassian has a lot of the ingredients to be sigma-coded, and the first couple of scenes even kind of tease you into thinking he will be, but everything he does successfully is in community or within an organization. It's the times when he's off on his own that things go poorly. And the strength of his communities and his relationships is shown fiercely as not just backup for him, but a power in itself. I think this is meaningfully different from the kind of anti-sigma failures FD was talking about, because it's not "look at how being sigma is bad," it's "look how a guy with everything it takes to be ~sigma succeeds in solidarity."
@@MrOtistetrax and once Evelyn relaxes her fist and starts to fight with kindness, he makes headway. It's such a beautiful way of showing that there are more ways to achieve your goal than with brute force.
Recovering edge lord, here. Quit drinking and working on my mental health 11 years ago, recovering from many a things. Your first video on this topic was fire. That and the vid about the NFL had me hooked. You advocate for and educate black and/or ND young men in a way I don't think anyone else is doing right now. I hope content creators start to jack your style, the world needs more of it. Clone this man! The shoutout to Super Eyepatch Wolf made me respect your as a consumer of the arts even more, my dood. Thank you for what you do FD.
Congrats and good luck on your journey of self healing. I’ve been watching a lot of stuff the past couple of years about why and how men are becoming more anti social, would you say that finding purpose and self worth were the main factors on you seeking better mental health? Or was there something else that helped kick start your journey 11 years ago?
The idea that "they will misunderstand it anyway" is a part of making art, and just being public online as a whole, that' I've had to really come to terms with as I get older. I spend so much time trying to make sure I communicate things so "perfectly" that nothing I do can be misinterpreted, and just like the movies mentioned here... it's made everything I do, even the creation process much more difficult. So that really hit home for me! A a black trans person I sometimes forget how much I want to make art" for us, by us" but we're still held down by our own fear of being seen. Great video, it's really got me thinkin!
I'm trans too, and that combination of "nobody who hates me is going to be convinced by anything I make" and "the people I do make it for are extremely paranoid about representation and hate depictions of queerness that aren't 100% positive sparkle rainbow so brave" has artistically kneecapped me for about a decade. At some point you have to let it go. I'm not saying to make art just for yourself and abandon *all* responsibility, but at some point you have to find that balance between being socially responsible and making the art you want to make come hell or high water. Most marginalized people start making art because there isn't anything for them, and they decide to just make it themselves then. That's how it was for me anyway, and remembering that first spark helped me regain my footing a bit. I can't make art that pleases everyone and I don't want to make art that pleases no one. I want to change the world but I am very, very small and I have artistic needs too, it can't all be for the people. All of which to say... god, it's a mess. You're going to be misinterpreted. It's going to be by the people you hoped to reach and comfort. You just have to find a way to be okay with that. Me, I've decided I'm on the side of art, like a wise art imp once said. My priority needs to be making things that I personally think are Beautiful and True. If I do that, I think that's something to hang on to when it hits the fan. As it always will. Solidarity.
I'm a straight white male, and my little brother started transitioning this year and all I want to do is support him, all the media, art, etc that I've found by trans people has really helped me empathize. I doubt that I've interpreted it all correctly, but the more points of view available the more people understand each other.
@@mitchellkraemer9099 Let me tell you something that happened to me. There was this one episode of Brooklyn 99 where one of the characters comes out as bisexual and whatever, it was fine, I've seen it a million times and it didn't affect me anymore. It was a good, decent, standard coming-out story. But then came a joke where the punchline was "you Googled 'how to talk to bisexual friends' didn't you?'" and the other character sheepishly admitted, yeah, that's what he did. Brother, I goddamn broke. I cried like a little girl. Because I realized nobody in my life had ever even gone through the trouble of googling "what is a trans and how do I be?" Nobody could be bothered to put in even that tiny amount of effort. If your brother is anything like me and most of the rest of us, the fact that you care enough to educate yourself in your own time and not put that emotional labor on him in what's got to be a very labor-intensive time... You're a good egg. Thank you. And yeah, art matters. It won't change the world, it won't save us, but it does *matter*
@@mitchellkraemer9099 I think just the fact alone that you love him and you WANT to understand him and connect with him is good enough. You will make mistakes. Everyone does with people they love regardless of their circumstances. But you’re trying to be a good brother and that’s what counts
When it comes to writing about any topic you will just have to accept that a portion of your audience will come away with the unintended message. A part of art is putting yourself out there. If it covers heavy topics then there will *always* be discourse and misinterpretation (sometimes willfull misinterpretation) around it no matter what. But in my opinion when it comes to art if it says something substantial enough that it can produce genuine discussion then that is a sign of good art. In essence, don't be afraid to say something with your art, that is part of the beauty of it.
Everythign everywhere all at once is a rare piece of media for deconstructing this. Alpha Waymond is cool, self sufficient, violent, but its the radical empathy and kindness of the "real" waymond that ends up breaking through and setting Evelyn on the path of reconciliation with her daughter.
The issue is making guys who are already on this path to enjoy such a movie... I really liked it, don't get me wrong, but teens and young men who grew up with violent movies and games won't even bother looking at the screen, I'm afraid.
@@00PlPu00 I liked the movie too and I did grow up with all those things. You're giving men too little credit, we are people too at the end of the day.
Damn, that's the first time I've thought about that, but I knew there had to be something in there with the alphaverse (aside from being the cause of all of this) but usually it'd get lost in the hundreds of other threads that that movie is about
“Everything Everywhere All At Once” is an actual conservative movie, as opposed to Joker, which is a revolutionary leftist movie. The fact that no one seems to get that is pretty incredible.
This video made me feel normal for the 1st time in over a decade...I thought I was the one who was going crazy. Although that may still be the case, I at least I have finally heard some of what I have been observing. Excellent work
Favorite Edgelord movies not in this list: 1. Phantom of the Opera (secret brooding genius upset that the girl isn't into him that way). 2. Dr. Horribles singalong blog
Check out Lindsay Elllis's "O Daroga Where Art Thou" for a great take on Phantom Of The Opera. She straight up refers to him as a basement dwelling incel. EDIT: The title of her video is actually "The Most Whitewashed Character In Literary History." "O Daroga, Where Art Thou" is what shows in the thumbnail.
Look. I maintain that my enjoyment of Phantom is less about my ability to sympathize with Erik and more about the impossibility of sympathizing with Christine, the archetypal Victorian drip of a heroine.
this video made me meditate on certain behavior and characteristics i have developed due to prolonged online use. for me, this is a first time experience, a youtube video with thorough researched content and well-structured arguments. thank you.
Thats actually why Silver Surfer is one of my favorite characters in fiction. Its a subversion of lone wolf. Hes all "woe is me" and stoic when hes alone, but when hes around people, he changes. Surfer is stoked when hes chilling with Reed Richards or Nova or Doctor Strange. When hes with friends he stops being so weird. Im an Autistic dude who was reading proudon at 13. But if im with people i care about my worries of "we need to tear down all social hierarchy and embrace Autonomy, Egality, and equity" fades a little and i can just talk about last nights hockey game or the Rollercoaster i built in minecraft or whatever. So i relate to the silver surfer. The good outweighs the bad and good things exist, even during rough times.
The sad part is that this is the key to solving the problem that's been staring everyone in the face the whole time - all the sigmas and the lone wolves really want underneath everything is the "love and belonging" level of Maslow's hierarchy. Each of the movies FD brings up all either have some character from whom the sigma desires love (Irene in Drive) or community (Tyler Durden), or are otherwise about how the sigma lives ~iN a sOCiEtY~~ that actively others them for things outside of their control (Joker). The most important thing in this video I think is what his interviewee said about the left needing counter-indoctrination. There is no reverse PewDiePipeline - most of the time the left's reaction to edgelord antisocial behavior is to disavow and shun rather than show empathy for things like how that knee-jerk shunning only shoves them further in a corner, or how patriarchy is oppressive to men too. Over the years I've so often heard people say that it isn't the responsibility of marginalized communities or people to educate the ignorant, and I understand the need for safe spaces that aren't meant for arguing with neonazis or videos like this that are targeted at leftists disavowers rather than the sigmas themselves, but at the end of the day there needs to be someone willing to talk down the next Elliot Rodger or else it's going to keep happening.
@@ekki1993 A purely collectivistic society can't solve the problem of people being conditioned into withholding empathy imo. I've seen hyper-individualistic liberals give lots of empathy towards those who don't show solidarity in a way that a leftist might not decide is most appropriate (in the case of people who don't abide by boycotts or strikes, or even towards veterans on the wrong side of a conflict) which reveals to me that although empathy is reinforced or broken down through the specific lens of social conditioning the dominant ideology subjects us to, unfortunately we're all vulnerable to callousness for one reason or another. In the case of a hyper-individualistic society being damaging towards the development of empathy, I still agree with you to a point, it's just that I think human nature is prone to emotional exhaustion or subconscious selective application of empathy no matter the ideological suppositions involved.
@beansworth5694 what are you yapping about? I never proposed a solution, I just clarified that empathy is humanity's default state. Collectivism too, for what it matters. I don't know what's the solution to people having their empathy broken by an individualistic society, nor expect everything to be perfect on any alternative, and it's tiring to have to explain what I'm not saying because you assumed a bunch of stuff I never said.
Creatives and artists are so important for radical change. Not just academics making art. Being an artist means being vulnerable and putting out some shit you might hate 10 years later
This. It’s part of the experience of being an artist. It’s why I don’t trust or find myself drawn to artists who try to stay “apolitical”. That in itself is a political statement. It’s interesting to see how they fare..!
This is why we “as a society” can’t afford to tolerate AI art. Humans need a voice, one that doesn’t end when a program rejects keywords or refuses to put out certain types of content because some megalomaniac can’t tolerate any negative visual representation. AI takes away choice while pretending to give people expression. Really they don’t know what they don’t know or how far they could express ideas if they just tried. If people want political art, then the fight against AI art needs to continue and intensify.
I'm an undesirable male and edgelord whose essentially always teetering into being an incel and am interested in art and making it. I even did an art degree at uni Would anyone be interested in seeing art I would produce I wonder. Would there be an audience for incel art, or would I be shut down for being 'undesirable'
I’m a chick, and I’m new to your channel. I loved your collabs with Fantano. And had to check you out. I enjoy long form content and especially informative, thought provoking content. We need more guys like you in the creative community and black community. Thank you F. D. 🦄💓✨
Lmao people call you a misandrist? I've been recommending you to young men for years now for your well thought out, compassionate, expressive work to help young men. You're one of the first people I think of, when it comes to giving young men, healthy, 'masculine' advice.
Any time they get called out tho is something they can't handle, so they use that as a cop out for them to pretend like he isn't speaking truth, wisdom, and/or shouldn't be heard.
@@GodofPainBelial It's really feeling like it's this for some, but I'd like to hope not a lot, of dudes. I had this convo on another social platform where some guy was parroting the old line again that we won't reach men by making them seem like villains or browbeating them, and I pointed out I believe we can reach gender equality and solidarity among men and women, as well as give men space to voice their pain, but it doesn't happen while also making sure every man's feelings are spared and they never have to think about their role in society, or harm they might have caused, or have any introspection or uncomfortable conversations, or deep sadness at the realization of how shitty the world is to women, often at the hands of men, I could go on.
I remember Lindsay Ellis pointing out a similar problem of, "problematic character still looks cool" and how satire/ comedy can be one of the few truly effective ways of addressing those ideologies. But this makes me realize that it's only a piece of the puzzle.
People won’t get it even if it IS put into a comedy. That’s the point of this video, that no matter how transparent you are, people still won’t understand.
You could make an argument that Elliot from Mr. Robot is the anti-Joker. He's a broken, detached man who's part of a group calling themselves "f society". But instead of acting out with petty violence, he learns to accept love from the people around him in spite of all the shit he's been through. He's the edgelord that grew up.
I think that’s exactly right. And we learn in the end that the Elliott ** spoiler ** we see most of the show wasn’t even a real person. He was just another fragmented piece of the real Elliott that was created to deal with the world. The show literally ends the exact moment when the edge lord part of Elliott decides to let go and give up control of Elliott.
Mr robot is a great example because the protagonist Elliot is severely traumatized, but also very accomodated and had all the chances to heal since episode 1: he got a decent job, his childhood friend, his sister agreed to come to the city to hang out with him, he has a therapist But turns out he fucked it all up since before the show starts, and its all about him realizing how toxic this delusion is, combined with shame for creating it in the first place, without fully blaming himself because he's a victim. it's even better when at the end its revealed that he had TWO edgelord personas, and one of them is the one we see all the time, the "protagonist" or the Mastermind as they call it, that beats up the bad guys and saves the world while also saving himself, while the real Elliot is seemingly just a person who wanted a normal life, and created these personas to help him save the world and rebuild himself
1. I’m commenting before I’ve finished the video. 2. I just want to say it’s very refreshing to see someone with the ability to communicate clearly about complicated/uncomfortable ideas. The world could use a lot more level headed conversations about tough topics these days. Good on you man. 😎
Ok, now that I’ve actually finished the video it really got me thinking. When you brought up the idea of counter propaganda it was a real lightbulb moment for me. The left these days has awful branding. The way “the message” is presented in media these days usually comes off as preachy or cringe. I think it would be awesome to see more media depicting more positive and productive messages but actually manage to stick the landing. I don’t know what it would look like but I think giving young people especially more positive role models and depictions of good societies to aspire to is important.
I think Andor is a great example of the type of media you are saying we need more of. It not only serves as a blueprint for imagining real political action against oppressive systems, but on a personal level it follows Andor from what is essentially a “sigma” worldview, to accepting that he needs others and others need him. It has a great collectivist message while also being the best piece of Star Wars media since Empire.
@@painunending4610the roles and need is are still there for the taking. Community still exists whether they choose to participate or not. These disconnected young men need to get involved
Yes! Andor absolutely is amazing for this! I've seen the complaint that Andor doesn't feel like the main character when his name is in the title. And I would argue that's the point. He starts out deliberately isolating himself and allowing others to suffer the consequences of his actions, and throughout the story realizes that he can be better by actually believing in a cause to help others, as we see him do when he returns to Ferrix
In the same way that “there is no such thing as an anti-war movie”, “there is no such thing as an anti-incel movie”. You can be as direct and as obvious as you want, but some people are still going to see the spectacle and think “war is cool!” or “incel stuff is cool!”
Exactly. It’s like that old question (Roger Ebert’s?) of whether you can even make a violent movie without glamorizing violence. I don’t think you can.
It's a bad point, though - nothing in, say, Come and See or Night and Fog show war as anything but apocalyptically repulsive. Truffaut was speaking from a limited perspective.
Great comment. Kind of unrelated, but it reminds me of an interview with the singer of the left-wing punk band Propagandhi. He said that their concerts were full of neo-nazi skinheads who didn't give a shit about their message, they were just there because they thought the music was cool. Propagandhi literally had to write "anti-fascist, anti-racist, pro-gay, pro-feminist" on the cover of their next album to let them know they weren't welcome. I used to love satire, but I'm honestly amazed by how many people don't get the message unless it's literally directly spelled out.
“Hard times are coming, when we’ll be be wanting the voices of writers who can see alternatives to how we live now, can see through our fear-stricken society and it’s obsessive technologies to other ways of being, and even imagine real grounds for hope. We’ll need writers who can remember freedom - poets, visionaries - realists of a larger reality. “ ~ Ursula K. Le Guin
This thumbnail bothered me so deeply in my soul it took me 2 days to think of the words to formulate just how much it scared me….sadly this is all I can think of lol. Thank you for lettin my sleep paralysis Demon finally retire after 33 years and takin its place. 😂 Edit: Dax definitely deserves the criticism and WAY more, he not just a fake edge lord he also a 🦝
Hi! I would really appreciate if you would take the time to elaborate on the Dax criticism because I can’t put my finger on the feelings I have when it comes to him
Hey, I've been watching for the last year or so and I used to be one of those edgelords; I was well on my way to being a better and healthier person by the time I found myself in here, but I wanted to say that it was a huge comfort to find someone saying things that I had already held beliefs for but lacked the form or substance to direct and verbalize. The intro sort of struck me, since I've also hit the exact same point in my interpersonal relationships. I have friends that fall into that category that I've tried to drag along with me in the journey for introspection and finding peace.. some better, but some have created a resounding mental dissonance between what I believe and preach vs the audience I keep. I found myself starting to ask a few months ago about at what point keeping these friends is reaching out and attempting to help, versus merely humouring bad behaviors and elements. I was already set on ending these friendships that leave me questioning my (in)actions, but this definitely helped settle and cement the choice. Have a good one, whoevers reading this!
Personally, I don't think you need to leave them behind, so much as interact with them whenever you have the bandwidth and try to keep up the positivity.
I just wanna say you were still a good person when you were an edgelord loser. There's nothing wrong with being an edgelord, and we need to stop saying or implying otherwise because it alienates people who many otherwise be your allies
The mention of Driver made me realize that Gosling is typecast as sigma/edglord or adjacent to it. Even as Ken in the Barbie film, let alone Fall Guy and Bladerunner.
@@ElkiLGLike Holland tries to be broody cause of his dead wife, but then that image gets shattered almost immediately when Jackson breaks his arm and he screams a whole two octaves up from his speaking voice. 😂
The thing i find pretty consistent is that people who like to throw around the term edgelord or incel are usually the same people that criticize everyone of every little thing. They can't get through 1 day without insulting people they dont even socialize with. Then they make youtube videos about people they've never had a conversation with so they can insult them and give them "advice". But secretly thetre not interested in helping so called losers. More interested in manipulating and insulting to tear you down. Seems a bit EDGY
Beautifully said and that is what I've thought in the past reading/hearing people comment on said "edgelords" or "incels". As if people don't live in phases or are more complex than what they come off as.
I do think buzzwords are thrown a lot around online, and some people are missing nuance or just want to blame someone. So yeah, I'm sure there's some unfair blame being flung around. However, personally most interactions with people who'd qualify as 'incels' or 'edgelords' have been actively negative. It's tiring. If the issue of people like that is lonliness, the solution is finding community and building self confidence rather than fighting other people. It's not easy, but that's also something you have to do yourself. That's not something you could reasonably expect other people to do for you.
The actor who plays Homelander is great. I was deeply afraid of him the first time I saw him on screen. He is also having the time of his life, rescued from Soap Opera blandness.
@@KalElinabox and? Are their lives not just as valuable as the social wolves? Was that wolfs life not worth living? Did that wolf not accomplish anything? You people need to stop demonising this stuff or you'll just turn people away?
@@painunending4610 they're saying that being social is integral to a person's survival, they need to depend on other people because that's literally how people *live* - we're a cooperative species
@@wayfaringspacepoet so if a person isn't social, has no friends, no family, no relationships his life isn't as valuable as someone with all those things?
I think a big problem with all of these media examples is that all they do is empathize and then condemn and it's like, well wtf are these people supposed to do. I'm a parent, and one thing you learn fast is telling kids (people) what not to do is really unhelpful and doesn't work. You need to tell them what to do. We need media that is empathetic, and then guiding in its message. We need a movie about an Arthur Fleck type where he doesn't become the Joker because therapy works or because an old friend or distant relative reaches out. We need to give these guys something to aspire to. The real crux of this whole thing is these people feel alienated. Relating to them only to say "but screw you anyways" only serves to further alienate them. That is exactly why people who relate to these characters relive the 1st half of all these movies and shows and seemingly pretend the condemnation didn't happen. They felt seen, finally, they felt like they were understood and like someone (or a piece of media) could relate to them, and it you slapped their hand and called them a bad boy as soon as they let their guard down. It doesn't help.
I couldn’t agree more. You can’t slap someone’s hand and tell them “no” about the one and only thing they think they know, and then proceed to not show them an alternative. …I cried during the first Joker movie for the exact reason you described. It was about being seen. I wasn’t proud of Fleck, I obviously, as a normal person, wouldn’t want him to do the things he did and go down the path he took… but the catharsis of seeing him go down the path and do what he did *because* it was all he knew he could do, was undeniable. It was catharsis born from my personal experience of being unilaterally told therapy would help with mental health, only for it to not be helpful at all. I wasn’t looking for coping mechanisms, I was looking for real answers and real reasons for living/to live. I still am. Basically, more work need to be done in media when it comes to communication. You can’t dumb down messages to “it’s okay to seek help :)” or something so simple it becomes inapplicable.
Joker wasn't meant to show him as a hero. He wasn't exactly an irredeemable villain like Joker usually is either though. Not every story is meant to be a fable, they're not all meant to show you the way. Sometimes they just need you to be mature enough to ask yourself the questions. There's a reason it's rated R, it's not for kids.
Not everyone gets a competent therapist, especially when not privileged. Should people who got screwed over by the system just be treated like they don't exist? The time for molly coddling the society was over when the first time a victim of abuse ended up not receiving an adequate compensation and instead being further abused and marginalized. The main problem with Joker is that some people didn't get the message of the movie. The abusive coworker is a guy you meet on 4chan and the comedian guy and Thomas Wayne are false father figures like Jordan Peterson and Donald Trump. Joker isn't a criticism of the Arthur Fleck, it's a criticism of the society. Treating people like shit and then people who are basically embodiment of what is wrong with the society like Jordan Peterson and Donald Trump exploiting some victims of the society while at the same time despising them. Then the abusive co-worker, the thugs on metro harassing a woman, hyper-abusive parents, a parade of predators preying on the vulnerable.
Before anyone listens to the person above me, just go to therapy. Don't let anyone discourage you from looking for help, there is no shame in it and no one deserves to judge you for it
Im sure you have scripts and you plan out your videos, but i love how real and chill this style of video essay is, even you asking your editor to patch in info you aren't sure of. Feels more like a live talk or conversation than than a essay.
I love that you define terms. When I studied philosophy, that was one of the biggest factors in boiling down communication. It was two people using the same word, but with different ideas of what that word entailed. I also love that, at the end, you took the words out of my mouth. We need a counter, but what does that look like? Anti-propaganda, or anti-_this_-propaganda, what does that look like like? We need more media that embodies that. We especially need well-written media that embodies that, but I can't think of a film that tackles it properly. Lastly, I found you from Syntell, and I'm so glad I subbed.
In anime you have Vinland Saga and Vagabond as pretty big examples. Search up the "i have no enemies" video. Villains who grow and kind of 180 their attitude to the point of vecoming part of the main crew also works. Not so much in the shounen "i beat you so now you're my sidekick" way, just characters growing and finding they want to change things for the better. Gaara in Naruto and Zuko in ATLA also spring to mind.
I (brasilian) watched this video on nebula right before a man dressed as the heath ledger joker carrying a deck of cards with him tried to do a terrorist attack at our supreme court, threw a bomb at the famous sculpture outside, it bounced back and exploded on him. He was the only victim of his attack. And if this isn't like, a great representation of what this type of behaviour leads to, Idk what is.
I know I’m beating a dead horse but I’ll say it anyway…. Alpha, sigma, and beta wolfs do not exist in the wild. Only in captivity 🐺🌖💔 Edit for clarity: David Mech, who originally discovered the idea of “alpha males” later rejected, and redacted that term and theory from his work. Concluding that what he observed was actually patriarchal dominance of an alpha pair. Aka that these were family units, or a mom and dad. I know sigmas are not real. I just put them in there to make a jab at the Omega verse whose books I have been recommended on too many occasions. 😂 Another edit: Captured wolves are know for being more aggressive than wolves in the wilderness. This is because they are forced to live with non-related adults. Quote from wolf haven international: “Wolves are wild animals that are evolutionarily designed to live in families, hunt cooperatively, and travel long distances. Captivity can be stressful for wolves because it limits their choices and puts humans in control of all aspects of their lives”
Man, what I love about AoT that you almost touched on is the reality that if anyone promises you a solution to everything, they are a liar and a fool. There are no solutions to everything and progress is a march, not a destination. If you make progress a destination, it fails.
One piece feels like counter propaganda. Luffy has the same dream as Eren, he wants to be king of the pirates because that is the most free man in the world, but it's so different and hopeful. I can't put +1000 chapters into words but those who know know
This. Honestly, Dragon Ball and Naruto are both up there too as examples of counter-sigma messaging. All of these shows have a main character that is approachable, excitable, hopeful and gives people second chances and wants to get along with people to a fault more often than not. They will go to any length to protect and stand by their friends and family, because they're ever grateful for all that they've received from their friends and family. Be it their childhood, emotional, physical or financial support in a time of need, or even helping them get through something they otherwise couldn't no matter how much they could've trained and honed themselves in isolation. Yes, all of these series have those ''main character powers up and becomes a badass moments'' but the devil is in the details. Time and again, the reason our MCs manage to *win* the war in some way or another is because of their strong backing provided by the good reputation they've established through their selfless acts and outstandingly inspiring choices when put under immense pressure. They *choose* not to abandon their friends or turn their back on those in need, even in situations where it is downright suicidal, and the author rewards them either with plot armour *or* (what I like much better) those around them recognizing their exceptional qualities of character and choosing to come to their aid. It is true that more often than not, these characters have some innate talent or power as well, but it can often be interpreted as the potential any troubled young person has. They've the potential within themselves, which grows as they get older and more capable, of doing great good or great evil. The power to endure or break. Both Naruto and Goku canonically lose control of themselves at one point and end up hurting their loved ones, so in that sense the story also reaches out to those who've unwittingly hurt their loved ones. All the magical, spiritual, fantasy bullshit power systems are actually just means to an end for the author to convey the emotional and spiritual growth of their characters throughout their journeys as well as the physical improvements they happen to have (like lifting weights and becoming able to lift more weights, which is something any person can do unless they've some sort of disability). Characters like Vegeta and Sasuke choose to isolate themselves and bottle up their emotions, hiding their trauma and weakness instead of partaking in a group or community of like-minded individuals (they gradually grow out of that habit as the series goes on, with both Sasuke and Vegeta eventually becoming a part of the main cast by the end and no longer being absolute edgelords), and you can see that being an unhealthy way to go about it in both Dragon Ball and Naruto. Both Vegeta and Sasuke, due to their emotional instability and issues over their identity, past and lineage (as well as what they believe they deserved and the injustices they've suffered at the hands of life), end up becoming easy to manipulate and mislead. They get used by other, more cunning characters, not unlike characters like Andrew Tate capitalizing on the insecurity of young men to have them do what he wants, so *he* can profit off of it. Not unlike how Frieza used Vegeta, or how Orochimaru and later Obito manipulated the shit out of Sasuke. These stories not only display the shortcomings of the 'sigma' mindset, but also showcase the benefits of being the stark opposite of that, while still keeping both sides human and capable of mistakes. Neither side is irredeemably evil or incorruptibly good. There are moments where the good guys get villainous, and the bad guys are on the verge of tears after realizing that what they've done was wrong, that they've believed in a fallacy, and they don't know what to do with themselves afterwards. They're all *people.* That's what makes those stories enjoyable to read IMO.
I've been yelling at my friends and family about how we've got so many examples that are critical, "here's what not to do", "look at how bad they are", stories for years now. It's kinda awesome to see the opinion that positive examples are more necessary than ever now reflected back at me.
men who have written movies and books that basically come to the conclusion "war is a waste, it's awful, don't do it" frequently wind up lamenting that their examples are just twisted to support the stuff they're criticizing. alternatives that don't and can't overlap with the edge lord image are critical
This has been my issue for a while. Deconstruction is only step 1, but i could not have put it so persuasively with the skill/experience/wording you've used to communicate this.
This is my first ever video I've seen of yours, and I am so impressed! I loved the breakdown, so well written and perfectly captured my thoughts especially when you went on about how the left *also* doesn't really 'get' the message they're supposed to get, and how it's our job to steer them away from the dark, grimy, redpilled corners of the internet and instead give them positive role models to look up to. I was just having that conversation online a couple days ago and made the exact same points lol. When you started talking about being on Nebula (my favorite platform 👀) all I could think was, "of COURSE this guy is on Nebula!" It seems every creator I fall in love with is on there. Subbed and liked and commented 🫡
"A Clockwork Orange" (my favorite of the genre) author Anthony Burgress hated the idolization of his main character Alex. The last chapter of his novel was banned in the USA because of the message that prison and/or drugs will not change a person, but rather that change has to come from within. The film which is fairly true to the novel, ends right before this last chapter. The way he writes that change is actually incredibly realistic. Alex doesn't become a good person or find God like at the end of Crime and Punishment. No, his narcissism realizes that it is in his best interests to become a functioning member of society with a wife and 2.5 children. I remember being 13 or 14 watching a midnight showing at the Uptown Theater in DC, which has a huge screen and has a balcony. As that first close up shot of Alex appeared, about 20-40 punks stood up and started cheering.
Okay, but that's hardly a politics thing, idle hands and all. Same thing with feminists today not realizing how privileged they actually are, hence why so many only seem to care about their 'right' to be promiscuous and get abortions because being a mom is inconvenient but then shame men for refusing to wife women with a past like that in their 30's. Also I don't see abortion as even being a women's rights issue beyond exceptions like for SA and medical cases, beyond that if the exceptions aren't good enough it's typically because they want to sleep around with the peace of mind of knowing if the birth control fails they have abortion as a safety net, but don't realize how bad the consequences are as far as emotional damage and trauma and how bad it is for getting married and having a family after a past like that, and it's more so men and children that pay the price unless men refuse to wife that, which they should. But then women act like men refusing is violating THEIR rights, you can't make this shit up, like men should have no say in abortion but also have no right to refuse to marry women like that. Abortion is hardly women's rights issue, it's a moral issue aside from the debate about exceptions. Women lost me when not only were the exceptions not good enough, but they also want abortions to be free and easy to get and expect not to be judged for it or shamed for it either. Men can support a woman's right to choose to be promiscuous but not condone it, women act like men not praising and validating them is 'oppressing' them.
The TH-cam algorithm sometimes pushes good videos, and this was one of those occasions. I subscribed and liked and here is a comment to help with the algorithm.
Not a movie character, but Leroy Jenkins was my hero when I was 16. I had changed schools from a public school in Bay Ridge Brooklyn to a private school in Brooklyn Heights, and whereas people in public school were funny in a gut level way like by tripping you going down the stairs or something, private school everything was stifling and analytical, and things just seem to go into endless discussions, which went nowhere. So then here comes Leroy Jenkins, Not caring about any kind of strategy or anything, just getting it over with and going for it and failing. That was so satisfying to me.
@@albusnightspring8057 Leroy Jenkins was an old internet persona (like, late 2000s) who gained his fame by running into a dangerous room in the game ‘World of Warcraft’ while shouting his name .
Reading Attack on Titan during the last few years of its run was kind of amazing if you were part of the monthly discussion. Real life people were separating into yeagerists and anti-yeagerists. You would have people point out cracks in the illusion of Eren's chad persona. Talking about how it made no sense for him to be a tactical mastermind after the timeskip and that there was a lot of evidence suggesting that Eren was essentially powerless to the ultimate outcome of the story (Like how the original holder of the power is literally enslaved to it for millenia...). And people would go absolutely feral over it, to the point that we got a titanfolk subreddit (the AoT version of the Game of Thrones freefolk sub) that went full in on the Eren propaganda. They would call the characters trying to stop a global genocide the Cringevengers. They essentially reflected the in universe factions, and it was fascinating seeing the denialism that the yeagerist readers resorted to when we finally got Eren's true, unfiltered POV. I have a lot to say about the ending of the AoT manga, and I can't keep annoying my friends about it. I'm really sad that it's impossible to recreate the environment that I read the finale in. There was a blurring of art and reality that elevated the experience. It also disturbed me considering the real life parallels to leaders with followers that herald them as the greatest chad masterminds...
I know exactly what you mean. Those were some wild times. From my point of view, Armin was always supposed to be the hero. He was compassionate, willing to work toghetter with others and even sacrifice himself and his dreams if it meant keeping his friends safe. The yeagerist commentators really hated him for opposing Eren, even though he still wanted to help him see reason. Not to mention the hate Gaby received, for basicly being a gender swapped Eren.
I relate to having a lot of things to say about it but not wanting to annoy your friends about it lol. While I am an anime only plebian after finishing it I haven't really been able to get it out of my mind. While I wasn't there when the schism happened I definitely experienced the effects as when I finished the anime I took to some discussion boards to get everything that had been brewing in my head out there. Its fascinating to see a fandom so polarized that they ended up splitting into two different subreddits. I had stumbled upon the titanfolk subreddit and my god... I hear stories of toxic subreddits but that one seems up there in some of the worst. Scrolling through the posts of that was miserable with the amount of toxicity, cope, and just full endorsement of horrible ideologies. That's part of the reason I cant stop thinking about AoT. It's the fact there is a non-insignificant portion of the community that saw the yeagerists and rumbling and didn't think "This is messed up!" but instead saw it as aspirational and just. Also little side tangent f**k Floch, all my homies hate Floch. He is a really well written character but I hate him he got my fav character killed in the second to last episode it unironically pisses me off when people call him some "based redpilled chad" the man sucks as a person.
@@Denniske87 Armin's entire character was so great. He was constantly trying to reach out to everyone, even the enemy, continuously asking himself why everyone had to fight. The reasons for why people fought were ultimately petty. "Because of history from thousands of years ago (Marley)," "Because of pride and ego (Levi, Zeke)," "Because I already started on this path so I might as well keep going (Eren, Reiner)." If there was any one message to be had from the show, it was the cycle of hate. And how pointless it all is. People can just choose to not kill each other, it's both incredibly complex but also so simple. Maybe Erwin was right, that as long as there's 2 people alive, there will be conflict. But just submitting to that logic as a justification to kill others isn't right.
@@bugjams Honestly, when he mentioned it isnt clear whether Isayama was pro or anti fascism, I had a hard time taking anything he said after seriously. If there ever was a single sign of missing media comprehension, that must be it.
Boots Riley needs to make more stuff. Alan Moore said this about Rorschach in 2008 “You could put a superhero in the real world for a dramatic effect, because they are kind of stupid. They got these tight costumes, stupid names; they’re kind of unbelievable, so if you actually put them in the real world and have people reacting to them the way that people would, you’d laugh at them, you’d be scared of them. It would be a different way of looking at them, so that’s what went mostly into Watchmen. “[Gibbons and I] thought about superhero types like Batman, so I thought, ‘What would he be like in the real world.’ And he’d be very much like Rorschach-if you’re a revenge-driven vigilante, you’re not quite right in the head. Yeah, alright, your parents got killed when you were a kid, whatever, that’s upsetting. But for most of us, if our parents were killed when we were little, would not become a bat-themed costumed vigilante-that’s a bit mental. So, I thought, ‘Alright, if there was a Batman in the real world, he probably would be a bit mental.’ He wouldn’t have time for a girlfriend, friends, a social life, because he’d just be driven by getting revenge against criminals… dressed up as a bat for some reason. He probably wouldn’t be very careful about his personal hygiene. He’d probably smell. He’d probably eat baked beans out of a tin. He probably wouldn’t talk to many people. His voice probably would have become weird with misuse, his phraseology would be strange. “I wanted to kind of make this like, ‘Yeah, this is what Batman would be in the real world.’ But I had forgotten that actually to a lot of comic fans that smelling, not having a girlfriend-these are actually kind of heroic. So actually, sort of, Rorschach became the most popular character in Watchmen. I meant him to be a bad example, but I have people come up to me in the street saying, ‘I am Rorschach! That is my story!’ And I’ll be thinking, ‘Yeah, great, can you just keep away from me and never come anywhere near me again for as long as I live?’”
I was gonna say if he wanted us to hate Rorschach, he shouldn't have had him say "I'm not locked here with you, you're locked in here with me" but then I remembered Zach Snyder probably made him say that
In a metatextual sense, the essence of Rorschach's character is that everyone sees in him what they want to see, what they project. He's aptly named like that.
Fabulous presentation. As a reformed edge lord, myself, I think you've hit the nail on the head. I felt a connection with the dangerous and antisocial archetypes and would live vicariously in my imagination where I was edgy and dangerous
my bf used to be just like you, a lonely teen with adhd who was bullied in school and had 0 attention from girls. he told me he would daydream about being a ruthless vigilante like the punisher all the time if you don’t mind me asking - what reformed you?
@papaversomniferum8508 i saw it from the outside and saw the other people who thought and acted like i did. I did not like them or their attitudes. They were so toxic. I saw the people i was becoming and I hated them
I think Reeves' The Batman may be a step in the right direction. Pattison's Batman starts off as the edgey "I'm vengeance" guy. He is shot and his POV is taken and mirrored by the bad guy. And the whole movie culminates in Batman realizing that his "from the shadows" approach is impotent. That the bat has to become not a symbol of fear, but of hope. Whereas Nightcrawler just break downs issues, it doesn't have the protagonist figure out what's actually wrong or where to go in a broken society.
@@cinemachronicyeah. That movie is intended more as an indictment of the system that enables people like him and points the finger at a culture that is itself sociopathic in its consumption of the type of media he produces. After all, by the end he’s actually succeeded in starting his own successful company, exploiting tragedy and turning it into entertainment.
With Batman I also feel that since non of the Modern movies cover him with the Bat family, we don't see the lighter side like Nightwing who still does the cool street vigilante but isn't a brooding loner. That was the reason characters like Tim Drake become Robin since he know Batman needed a Robin to keep Batman Balance. For years Batman has had a team and even a song that served to be a bigger family then the one he lost but we got none of that in the movies since it's always loner Batman after Batman and Robin from the 90's did so bad
The Batman is seriously one of the best Batman stories ever specifically because it looks at what has become of the character since the Nolan movies and says "Nah, fuck that, actually."
@@MarioUcomics I'm so interesting to how the DCU's take on Batman will shake knowing he'll have the Bat famiuly surrounding him this time. The movie is said to be about Bruce and Damian, suggesting that Dick, Jason, Tim, Barbara, and a bevvy of others should also be around by now.
@@supermansdaddy7019 Wait, people worship Patrick Bateman? In what reality does that make any sense? Guy is literally everything vile rolled up into a character.
@@supermansdaddy7019 Or maybe you are missing the point, which is that the "sigma male grindset" memes that idolize him are a joke and no one actually idolize Lou Bloom or Patrick Bateman.
Watching Star Trek TNG as a kid, is probably why my politics are left. It was inspiring, so much so that I was flabbergasted that we all aren’t pushing for that kind of future.
@@chelscarathey see themselves as the Captain. Absolute power over their crew and changing the fate of whole planets on mission after mission. Steve Shives breaks this down wonderfully, I might rewatch it right now.
@userJohnSmithConservatives just love to pat themselves on the back with their “values”, but put them under the least amount of economic stress within, say, a capitalist economy that no longer favors their economic strata in society and the truth soon emerges … “conservatism” is only about the social hierarchy … that’s what the conservative wants to “conserve”. A rigid unchanging social hierarchy. And as for all those values conservatives ascribe to themselves as the exclusive domain of “conservatives” also exist within a dedicated progressive working class Marxist-Leninist communist society too.
i think you do have the best comment section on this corner of the internet. there are nuanced takes and personal experiences and i actually learn and rethink things here?!? unheard of.
@@aeoligarlic4024 yeah that comment section is too far gone. but i’ve seen him dismiss some flawed but honest opinions as ‘stupid’ bc he didn’t agree, so idk if he’s good at keeping those around.
This is a great youtube talk, not a few hour incoherent ramble to fall asleep. Instead it's actually well structured piece that aims to solve a problem and unlike most youtubers the host can distinguish between their opinion and fact. It is well researched and reasoned. It's like watching someones masters thesis.
@@AG-iu9lvthat's completely wrong, there are more people with masters than ever but it doesn't mean you put the same effort into your career as your thesis. It's very rare for someone to manage to sustain that.
Honestly the people most affected by all this is the young girls who are near these boys, whether it be sisters, classmates or girls just trying to play video games. I think we dont talk enough about the long term effects of constant exposure to misogyny and sexual harrassment posed as jokes on these girls, especially because I've personally seen it in schools starting as young as 5
And those young girls grow up to still have to live around and with people like this. It’s everywhere and it’s exhausting. This mindset goes from the dating pool to political policy to home life to online conversations. A life surrounded by misogyny and misdirected anger and lack of reflection
Your post has big "women are the ones who loose the most in war, they loose their husbands, their fathers, their sons" energy. Yes it's incredibly awful that that happens to young girls and how it affects them for life. But the ones being directly affected THE MOST is the boys themselves. Just to be clear I'm trying to point out that you made a really bad choice of words presenting your idea. I'm not denying what those girls go through. Just that, in a literal sense, no, the young girls are not "the most" affected by all this.
@@inakilukac But it makes sense. The boys affected by this are the "most important part of the problem", to put it in a dumb way, but those surrounding the boys are more affected - especially if you consider that one boy with troublesome ideas can impact more than one person at a time, and more than one boy can impact the same person too. Both young boys and girls are victims of this culture, but only one of them has the active choice of being a part of it. And let's be honest, boys that don't follow the incel culture aren't as hated as the girls are, so yeah, there's that too.
"This is bad" but also "This is badass" Thank you FD for that. You perfectly condensed the problem with all these kinds of films, shows, comic books ect. down to eight words. I love that.
“The smug satisfaction of being right” is enough to satisfy those who don’t have any hope or desire for anything to change. There are many forces at play there. I really appreciate your hard work to shed light and give perspective on things that we need to think about.
What about those that genuinely want to see change, and then feel smug about being right? I'm very much pro-green pro-saving the Earth and I've been trying to get people in my community to stop mowing their lawns and to plant native plants. I have to admit, it feels good when they finally wise up and tell me I was right. Is that so bad?
@@bugjamsWhat you're doing is totally different because you have a point. This guy is saying you're fucked if your point is being correct. Your point is saving the climate and being correct is just a nice thing on the way. Their point is solely to feel correct.
Unpopular opinion (possibly) - if we needed a Joker musical, it should be with Leto's Joker. His campiness would fit so well with an over-the-top musical filled with an insane choreography and a legion of backup dancers doing their best to recreate the glory of Take That's music video for "Shine"
@@blodiaaa6990 I don't know, given that The Joker likes to pull jokes on people and make a meaningless farce of everything, assuming in canon people still have a negative bias towards musicals in the DC Universe, I could see The Joker wanting to do one even harder just to annoy people. I'm sure he'd get a kick out of tying up Batman and trying to force him to watch some kind of Dayman-esque fever dream where the Joker puts his all into the production while making it everyone's problem.
@@blodiaaa6990If they made a Joker musical starring Mark Hamil's Joker from TAS it would be 1000% in-line with the character and everyone would love it. Don't pretend otherwise.
"A Foy Deleloo" I'm francophone, and have been alive for a couple decades now, and this is up there with some of the funniest attempts at French I've ever heard XD Thank you for the laugh! (P.S. "foh-lee ah doo" would be a pretty good approximation of how you'd try this title in English)
Yall Hank Green is NOT problematic lol i love Hank thats what makes it funny. I wouldn't be here without him. Please don't read to much into the list if you know you know
Legit you had me scared Hank had done some shit I hadn't heard of yet. You got me good
Looking forward to the 3 hour video breaking down that whole tier list
Fiq, would you ever consider being a guest star on a blerd w/out fear live to laugh about the silliness of fandom who don't understand these pop male figures? Specifically the nerds of culture pod that blerd does w/ his friend robo.
Think you 2 would connect really well, just think about it
Yeah, we gotta talk about Movie Bob lol
Of topic FD. It is amazing to see one of the most brilliant minds of our time over mixing it up among us humble folk in the BLM chat this morning. Huge respect, Maestro.
"That smug satisfaction of being right is getting us killed" is such a banger line that really perfectly sums up my own frustration with especially online progressive spaces. Everyone wants to be good and right, but so few people actually want to put up where it counts
So feel this. Seeing this play a huge part in the result I expected then the same folks doubling down plus cos playing resistance and talking oxygen from minorities and more expert and experienced people and spaces is terrifying and heartbreaking.
It's messed up how all my lecturers in uni ask practically BEG the class to ask questions. Everyone has learned, especially the younger folk, that if you speak up and incorrect, you'll receive social sanctions for it.
I think there's a lot of unspoken trauma from an authoritative education system that smarmy folk unknowingly tap into. By looking like the smartest person in the room, they're essentially pretending to be like those same guardians everyone had for 6 hours every day for 18 years. Marginalisation via education. Reinforcement of class & patriarchy.
The annoying thing about this of that I love to learn & teach from others, but as equals. Nothing I say is the final word. Nothing HAS a final word & people don't know how to engage with that without marginalising via dunking or thinking "discourse" is short hand for "Twitter drama." The trolls have gotten mainstream. It's time we taught kids to stop feeding them.
in my experience, the loudest people on twitter are also the ones the least willing to do organising work. especially if it's hard, long-term and you cannot post abt it. and gods forbid you have to engage with people you don't *fully* agree with, or need to try to understand or empathise with them.
i've said this before and i'll say it again: it's so much easier to organise with liberals than with leftists, and until the latter do some hard self-reflection on why that is, the world will keep looking like it does.
Anyone else feeling like this kind of thinking starts in schools? Like with grading?
@@Hasseliathis is a fabulous comment and really makes me reconsider some of the things that I’ve been prioritizing in terms of “intelligence.” Thank you!
One really great piece of Counter-propaganda is the only season of The Promised Neverland. It has a very similar conceptual starting place to Attack On Titan, except the monsters are inside the walls and in fact the whole inner society is just set up to feed them. the key to escape is the very special protagonists realizing that the competitive education system that singles them out as special is part of the trap, and they can’t do a revolution alone, no matter how special they are.
That said some liars might try to tell you there’s a second season. Do not under any circumstances listen to them
That sounds cool. Thank you for the recommendation
there is indeed no season 2
Oh shit I did not expect to see you here
More like Mother's BASEDment!!!
I mean if you wanna ignore how the revolution progresses and twists itself in knots, then sure, don’t watch season 2
Part of what i love about kratos in the last two god of war games is that it takes a very straightforward, socially ostracized, angry masculine archetype and portrays his reconnection to humanity and community with stark psychological realism. It dares to say “yes, kratos was a lone wolf rage monster who moved mountains to get revenge, and it left him cold, empty and broken. Now watch him slowly learn to love and feel again and see how much more worthwhile his life is”
Deliberately, the less stoic and more empathetic kratos is across the two games, the more successful he is at fighting for the people he cares about and averting his tragic fate.
@@kylesmith5633 Mostly agree here, but Kratos is just as stoic when he has developed his empathy as when he was reticent to embrace it. Being stoic doesn't mean lacking empathy.
@ i don’t disagree, its on oversimplification to say less stoic. I guess more emotionally available is a better way of putting it
Kratos is a great example all the way back since the first game!
Although he was tricked into it, ultimately it was by his own hand that he killed his wife and daughter. And somewhere he knew this, the nightmares he suffered from were him not the Gods. Kratos wasn't just angry in the first one, he was depressed af. "By the Gods what I have become"
Kratos refused accountability, he couldn't take the truth and turned all his anger and rage all towards Ares. (Who while responsible wasn't the true cause) He got his revenge and all it brought him was further down the raging rabbit hole.
In gow2 Kratos was out of control, lashing out at everyone besides Sparta. Zeus gave him the opportunity to pledge allegiance to him before Kratos spit in his face. So now Zeus is the new target for his rage which results in unintentionally killing his loyal Spartan general (b4 time travel) and Athena sacrificing herself.
In gow3 he started to let go of some of that rage, he was still mad but shown lots of mercy for the side gods: Helio, Hermes, Hercules and Hera all were given passes at first. Near the end of 3 Kratos doesn't want Pandora to die for his goal of revenge anymore. Zeus couldn't keep his mouth shut and oops there comes his rage again. In their fight Kratos has to acknowledge his own fear that he was also responsible and finally the power of hope buried under all his rage and regret comes out. He kills Zeus then instead of allowing Athena to manipulate him anymore he says "My vengeance ends now" and he impales the true source of his suffering, he took accountability that he played a massive role in creating his awful situation.
Then in the Norse ones he shows remorse and takes responsibility of who he was, he just tries to be a better person and it's amazing to see a depressed broken angry man come out the other side.
I never liked the "Greek Kratos is 2 dimensional" bs, he always was a broken character if you took the time to look beyond the superficial gore, violence and anger.
I facking love Kratos 😂 He's a character that never got the respect he deserved until the ps4 games came out. Everyone always was saying he's just an angry rage machine while he was also depressed and suffering just as much. The first game starts out with him YEETING HIMSELF OFF A MOUNTAIN TO ESCAPE HIS SUFFERING!
Now he definitely wasn't a good guy, did inexcusable shett but you could relate to that hopelessness and anger he had around him.
Everyone was trying to manipulate him, just a pawn for the Gods and later the Titans. You take all the games and it truly was an amazing Greek tragedy.
Lone adult wolves are very rare in nature. Most lone wolves are older juveniles that have left their home packs to find or establish a new pack, but their instincts tell them that they need to find a group and assimilate. That much is quite analogous to young men leaving home (not necessarily physically, but in mindset at the very least) and seeking out their ultimate group of peers that they will settle into adulthood with, where their adult minds will set and concretify, so to speak.
The difference between young men and young wolves, is that young wolves understand that they will have to earn their place in their new group by demonstrating good teamwork and usefulness, and understanding that social relationships are both push and pull. Give _and_ take. And that it is infinitely easier to survive in a group that you’re already in than alone, resourceless.
And wolves aren’t misogynistic. They are remarkably egalitarian between the two sexes. Because that’s what works best for group cohesion.
Yha the man that developed the whole alpha male wolf structure admitted that it only applied to wolfs in captivity and regretted the study because culture never caught up when we found wolfs in nature act like big family units focused on community.
destroying misogynists and incels with zoology facts is crazy
I've never related to wolves, I'm just lone me
I've always related more to pandas
@@DaisysRules That's all well and good, but there is still a hierarchy that everyone has to understand and follow for the success of the group. Cause everyone has different level of intelligence, strength, experience and general competence.
Queerbaiting is out, sigmabaiting is _IN_
I've been from disassociated with those people for so long that I forgot what sigma even meant for a sec.
What the hell is Sigma
@@nibblesnarfer
It's a mother named Sig? Sig, ma?
Considering the frat FD is apart of it’s on brand. 😉. Lol
Oh boy, I have a lot to learn
Uncle iroh from Avatar the last air bender has un-ironically been my role model for the last 8 years, we need more uncle irohs in media
F yea😢
Senshi from Dungeon Meshi is legitimately peak masculinity to me and nobody gets it when I repeat that point to my friends.
Thors first, then Thorfinn from Vinland Saga are peak masculinity in anime.
@@dunadan1995 Bread! Bread! Bread! BREAD!
Lmao
As a BIG John Wick fan I hate that they've appropriated HIM for their Sigma antisocial fantasy. John Wick isn't even a LONER. He's not a lone wolf. He can get through the movies because he has many allies, his good friend died in the beginning, the man was happily married, he literally killed to be with the woman that he loved and he didn't go crazy after she died. Someone just killed his dog.
@@brandonburns5365Do you?
Like, does a loner check with their friends to see if they're all loners together?
John Wick is just stupid edgelord revenge fantasy though
@@Alex_Barbosa eh, never said it wasn't. It is totally escapist revenge fantasy. There's nothing wrong with it being that but one must note that it doesn't go through the usual beats of one his wife doesn't get fridged, the whole thing is over a dog, instead of one assassin causing someone hell EVERYONE is an assassin, etc. It subverts some things in the genre. Revenge fantasy? Yes. Edgelord? Honestly, I beg to differ.
It's the same thing that happened with Neo
@@brandonburns5365 pretty sure I do. There's a difference between loner/lone wolf and someone who just prefers their own company usually/introvert. If John Wick were a true loner he would have never asked Marcus for help, Marcus would not have gladly given that help (betray him then regret it, dying in the process) and it wouldn't have hurt John that Marcus was killed. John does not actively avoid connection, he's a bit intense but he's not closed off.
I am a woman, and I had my "edgelord-like" phase as a teenager. I believe it was loneliness that was the driving force, and I struggled with my identity. I also had undiagnosed autism and ADHD, which also played a factor in not being like "other people". Developing strong social connections and treating my depression and anxiety was the cure for me.
I can relate to this pretty hard. Though I did transition from Goth girl to rainbow social butterfly guy :]
Definitely a lot of work, help, and hard truths are necessary
I don't think I ever had a phase. I had a pretty secluded childhood and that just kinda bled into adulthood. Only difference is I started paying more attention to my surroundings and my place in the world and got more depressed by it. I don't feel anything positive by making others feel worse and talking about depressing topics, I moreso just do it as an outlet to vent frustrations. Open to positive messaging but I'm heavily anti-social so most my interaction with others is online, and most online interaction is by nature, detached and negative. So it's a pretty rough cycle. Also doesn't help that at a young age, it's hard to find things to do with others that dont involve drug/alcohol use; which moreso just leads to desensitizing rather than communicating to eachother about actual topics. (Basically all of this can be read as negative, which again kinda ties into the whole, most stuff online is nihilistic in nature). If any1 has advice on how to contact ppl with healthier world views and positive outlets like more community involvement i'm all ears. I live in Madison, WI so there's no shortage of things to do near me I'm sure, I just don't know how to find it bc I never learned how, and taking those steps on my own terrify me.
@@bobzilla-1never related to anything more. Feel like I’ve asked for help as many ways as I can, but it’s like everyone is suffering so comprehensively that there aren’t many people left with answers. Maybe by replying to your comment it’ll boost it a little more. I’m near Oakland, CA. I hope you find some better days Bob. If you ever find your way out here I know some good food spots we can be anti-social at.
@@marcuswrblack Wish I had the disposable income to come visit XD. My broke ass can't afford to do much which is sorta why I spend so much time holed up indoors tryna escape reality. Feel like no one has the answers. We're all just stuck due to bigwigs seeing shorterm profits at the expense of the generation beneath them. (which isn't anything new, it's just worse bc the generation that did to us was instigated by Reagan)
I'm also a woman and I did have the same phase as you (I'm also on the spectrum). Fight Club is still my all time favourite movie because it helped me cope with the grief of losing my grandma (whether it's the correct attitude or not). I haven't really detached completely from that part of myself, because I still want to empathise and validate the feelings and emotions I used to feel in some way.
FD Signifier is in his insane thumbnail era
I really wish I can clean my brain
@@NStarks007Same haha😭
its just a regular thumbnail for the Joker
🎉
and i’m living for it tbh
Honestly I just wanted the joker to commit crimes using props from a prank store dumpster while telling off hand joke for an hour.
👏 take 👏 the 👏 edge 👏 out 👏 of 👏 superhero 👏 movies 👏 again 👏
They need to stop handing franchise vehicles over to people that don't actually love the franchise. It's fine to try and do a twist, but if you don't have a love for it then you don't know where or how to twist it. Some of these directors should be doing off brand satire if they want to shit on a franchise
While watching this video I was thinking it'd be hilarious to do a live action joker in the vein of the Cesar Romero or Mark Hamill animated era jokers.
A little edge or bite is fun. But, like everything fun, it commonly tends to be repurposed as a crutch for lazy writing
@@Nodiee1really only applies to DC movies
The way that you're able to both empathize with and roast the fuck out of the people you talk about in the video is one of my favorite things about the stuff you make
A level of erudite savagery I've only ever seen in Dan Olsen's review of a review of The Wall
@@clementinedanger The phrase "fundamentally incurious" put the fear of god in mfs
That video is so intellectually spicy I wish i could sprinkle it over my tacos @@clementinedanger
@@Fooacta "Doug wants to be a filmmaker, he wants to make art, but he can’t, because he’s a fundamentally incurious person who isn’t much interested in what other people think or feel, and all his ideas boil down to “what if Batman met Mario?”
I didn't even have to look that up it's seared into whatever part of my brain keeps track of nuclear annihilations.
Because it’s a western problem. We may not be Them, but to the rest of the world, we’re them. We are educated by them, indoctrinated by them, and in some part accountable in a different way than they are. I appreciate the East so much for their perspective if nothing else. We kinda loony.
Fiq, I can't believe you changed the thumbnail. That original thumbnail of you and joker makeup was art.
Oh god, onision jumpscare......
I know! 😂
I'm so upset FD had to remind me Onision exists lmao
Yes! We need a trigger warning before putting him on the screen
Oh god not that guy
Reading the comments before I watch the video has never worked out well for me but this time it was definitely the move
As a chronically mentally ill man, if you are valorizing your instability and pain (not just expressing it), you have started down the path that will make you a statistic
This. Same and taking the step of saying "This is me and I need to be the one to do something about this", as fortunate/lucky as I was able to, was a huge step to at least getting a little better.
As long as I live, I won't be a statistic.
@@scottbuck1572 Valorizing is perfect word for this.
I honestly want one of these movies with a moody loner who ends up doing something psychotic to valorize his mental issues and pain, but actually meets people willing to level with him and connect with him as a human and gets pulled back from the brink with meaningful friendships and things he learns to value besides his egotistical idea of a cool edgy loner sigma grindset. Just have him meet people throughout the movie, maybe people who relate to his problems or mindset or asocial tendencies or were once where he's at in his twisted ideology who can say "Okay... you took a wildly disproportionate action no sane person would do... And you recognize why that was wrong, correct? Okay. Let's pull back a little bit. This doesn't have to define you or be who you are. You made a mistake. That's human. You don't have to keep doing this or continue down this weird path you put yourself on.". You could even have a Deadpool moment at the end where he hangs up his dark violent vigilante persona, preferring instead to surround himself with the friends he made along the way.
@@gregvs.theworld451 Honestly this is the only way to probably avoid the trap of Nightcrawler and Drive: make the instability and loneliness as pathetic as they appear to others, but valorize actually learning to be better. Make it badass to be kind and self-reflective
Honestly, the Attack on Titan discourse always has me flashing back to being a young weeb steeped in Death Note. The ending frames Light as a pathetic failure who abandoned every principle he had the second he started his journey. And looking at the story in hindsight he lost "the war" in Episode 2. A lot of fans refused to believe he could lose and insist on viewing him as this "dark supergenius", when looking back, he spends most of the series coasting on luck and priveledge.
Bro me too, I remember being like that and actually believing that light should have won, I’m actually ashamed and embarrassed.
Death note glorifies him so hard despite a lot of his successes being luck that the perfect series of events happened to occur.
Death Note is unironically one of the funniest things ever made when viewed from this perspective. Like, if you don't root yourself in Light's or even L's perspective on Kira/the series, then you've got comedy gold on your hands. Light is genuinely a lolcow I love him so much 🤣
I remember hating Light very much, since the first chapter. The manga became something only when L came into the picture, and I almost abandoned it when he was killed. At the time I did agree with Light's point that criminals are undeserving to live and that they should die, but then one of his first acts upon being tested on his principles, is to kill a bunch of people that weren't criminals. And all of his "supergenius" strategies work exclusively because he's got a group of very naive people around him that have known him since childhood, or due to one of the death gods being in love. He's a failure from the very start, I finished that sh+t only because I found the remaining volumes on sale lol
Also shout out to the most misogynistic portrait of fictional women I've seen in a non-hentai or harem manga, coming to you directly from a female author no less.
That's such a fun thing to think on from a mature mindset. Similar to you, as a pre-teen I found light to be a cool edgelord guy I could idealize myself as. As an adult, I realize he is insufferably conceited and incompetent in what he set out to accomplish.
@@DeadKraken He literally called himself God and killed a woman who was tracking him down who was in the law. Like book 3 of the manga. I don't get how people ended up liking him - the thing with art, is that how you want it to be interpreted and how people choose to interpret it will always be a mystery. Maybe she agrees with that stuff, or she's mocking them and audiences didn't get it.
When you say it's fun to "point and laugh", it's the exact thing that Arthur Fleck talks about in his speech to the talkshow host before offing him. It's “The smug satisfaction of being right" in other words and actions. As someone who could've been at risk of falling into the edgelord pit, but thankfully didn't, we need to embrace and integrate, not alienate edgelords. The way we're dealing with it, including naming & shaming in increasingly more obvious ways in popular media, is counterproductive. Positive engagement and positive rolemodels that can appeal to them is the way to go.
Its always stunning to me how many people fail to grasp this concept, but it’s like anything else anymore “well not me… but somebody else!”
Too bad it takes less effort to shame and insult people than be empathetic.
This comment needs more love. I think thats something that often gets over looked. Edgelords needs compassion, they need to be told what they are doing right, not what they are doing wrong. same goes for anyone with any views that you dont like or might see as harmful. How many of these guys are like this simply because they've been mocked for things? often by their "own kind". Its kind of the equivalent of mocking someone because they have a different skills to you to you. Instead how about we have a chat with them? I like the idea in this video that we need movies that show the world as we want it to be, not ones that show how pissed off we are about how we think it is. Imagine a movie or show where the action hero tells his team mate its ok to cry, and its not played for laughs etc infact its seen as a perfectly normal thing and noone even points it out or comments on it... Like the part in "inside out" where they have a moment to actually feel sad or enraged and then someone tells them what they are doing well and they get up and do what they set out to do instead of telling them to "man up" etc. or making them the butt of a joke. and this doesnt just go for edgelords it could be for toxic men, trump supporters, evengelical religious people, homophobes etc. if you spend you time telling them what they are doing is bad/stupid etc you are leading by example, you are mocking them and basically being a bully (at least in their eyes). But i also get it to, its hard to just listen to someone, its hard to see and point out good things.. maybe just the first step is seeing the person first.? what do people think?
A friend of mine sent me "Drachenlord" clips for a period of several months - I ignored those almost entirely. Watching people antagonize and egg on someone like that just feels terrible to me. Same with most reality tv - from what I understand a lot of it is deliberatly made in such a way as to aggravate the people in it and cause conflict, because for some reason people enjoy watching other people lose their minds.
Also, if you want to trigger my inner edgelord, bring out the kinds of video that involve "It's a social experiment" or "It's just a prank, bro!".
I’m glad someone has commented this! There’s an African saying that goes like this: “A child who is t embraced by its village will burn it down to feel its warmth. There is so much relevance to that saying and to this comment.
I was able to deradicalize a young man I mentored a year or two ago (it was a team effort honestly). He’s 16 now.
He finally got around to watching your videos (I have been urging him to do so for ages) and he absolutely loves them. He told me he wanted to binge them, but he’s been trying to give each one a full day to fully digest before he moves on to the next.
Don’t undermine your impact.
How did that process work for him? What did you try first?
How’d you do it?
My favorite video is of FD talking to Odi it made me realize, ive never sat so long listening to two black men talk together in my life. Everything ive ever learned came from a white face.
Also - i hate to ask what is radicalization for black men? i dont understand...
you bluepilled him with soy
'Hey kid, stop watching this propaganda and instead watch this propaganda'
Maybe don't indoctrinate children and let them form their own beliefs? Feel sorry for this kid and hope he gets away from this environment asap
YOU SAY MONDAY UNC 😭 NOW I GOTTA SCRAMBLE AND FIND SOMETHING TO EAT TO THIS
I ate avocado toast sandwiches with vegan sausage. Great pairing
@@yossarrian You eat avocado toast sandwiches with vegan sausage. I eat avocado toast sandwiches with vegan sausage.
We are not the same.
What a funny problem to have lol
Cooking breakfast w F.D. in the background >>>>>
I'm finishing off a bag of Goldfish Mega Bites Cheddar Jalapeño flavour :]
Dont ever change the thumbnail, I had found the best video essay to watch then I saw THIS on the sidebar and immediately clicked lmao
Aaaand, he did...
Noooo he changed it 😫
what was the thumbnail? rn it’s ‘losers’ superimposed over some characters
@@elimejah It was Chris Chan fuxin his PS3.
@@elimejahit was FD in full Joker cosplay lookin crazy. If you scroll down his community page you can see the photo.
Your channel - and this video - were recommended by TH-cam randomly. I'm grateful. Thank you for this patient, logical, empathetic analysis. Subscribed.
Whenever you allude to the Diddy video it feels like a Marvel movie Easter egg teasing Thanos pulling up to Earth
It woulda been weird to see back in the day, more cringe than where it is now knowing what we know now (although there was plenty of speculation and rumor, just no real proof)
im the woker baby
“Why so queerious?”
@@ellodianlamb I like the puns
Im a worker baby
I like you
Why so wokeious Batman?
As a recovered "sigma" myself the simple cure is just honest love and friendship. I was ostracized and bullied my entire gradeschool childhood. I had 1 friend for most of it but that's not enough and he alone couldn't fulfill my social growth so I became detached, resentful, nihilistic, etc.
The appeal of the "lone wolf" archetype is obvious and consuming, you resonate with that character with the solitary lifestyle aspect and idolize the power they wield when you only feel powerless in real life.
Once I left school and that closed circuit culture, I realized the rest of the world is a lot bigger (duh). I made friends easily at work and there was none of my former life that was reality anymore. Perhaps that's the difference between me and others that don't escape "sigma" life, I never stopped wanting it to end. I certainly didn't fix it on my own, but other people accepting me opened my heart and mind.
Happy to watch this while its still the first thumbnail
Something tells me I won't have to change this one
@@FDSignifireThis thumb is _fire_
@@loglorn This is what Playboi Carti does to a man.
plz don't change it, it's amazing
@@P0rk_Sinigang anong problema kay playboi carti?
Heath Ledger's death (the actor, who played the Joker in Nolan's Dark Knight trilogy, the version of Joker that started all these edgelord impressions) is really sad, but at least he won't see, what his original character has turned into in the modern culture. I don't even know if i wanna laugh or cry seeing those cosplay clips, I mean, they're not even... Joking...
Yeah I liked Todd Phillips Joker movies but far too many people seem to be missing the actual point of them, as someone with mental health issues I can absolutely relate to Arthur's struggles with health services in the first film as i've been through that myself.
Say that again...
@@jadedheartszthe director hates that the first movie attracted the wrong crowd (edgelords), and he ended up making the second movie as bad as possible to mock those edgelords lmao.
It's sad because i love heath ledgers joker, he did such good job so i hate to see that get overshadowed by edgelord fanbase.
@@jadedheartsz It's so odd to me because I do remember Todd Phillips' cringey “woke killed comedy” rant. I feel like nobody remembers that. I wonder what happened. Maybe he was a bit disappointed with the quality of his supporters.
Lets gooo 28% ladies rise up
I was honestly so surprised??? Like I'm always recommending this dude to my friends!
👋
👋🏾
@@stuffinsthegreatwell a lot of fds vids are about men so makes sense he mostly has male viewers
🎉
I have 0 known family in this world. I have very few friends and most of whom have started a family and have less and less time for me. I am in a city with the highest unemployment rate in Canada. I have been unable to gain secuirty and love in my life. I live every day in fear and paranoia. Soon again I will be homeless as I have always been on and off since youth. Might have to do something crazy one day so I can be remembered on the news for an evening and forgotten about forever and laughed at afterwards.
I wish I could escape this cycle but I dont see a way out if I cant get a job... been applying for years and im not getting calls back......
You need someone to talk to Mann?
saw this on nebula and really enjoyed it and wanted to comment- while you only namedropped it a couple times, my favorite tv show is breaking bad, so naturally I’ve thought a lot about the point you ended on. I remember first watching it, anticipating a certain portrayal of Walter White due to the discourse around it, and being kind of blindsided by how firmly the narrative does not take his side and undermines him at nearly every point given how dudes online talk about him. Frankly, I don’t know if it’s possible to make good, meaningful art that is truly immune to being co-opted by those determined to misunderstand it; so much of what a work “means” lives in the realm of subtext, metaphor, and the way an audience engages with it. As artists, you ultimately cede that ground when you present your work to the public. Obviously you control what goes in, but you have very little control of what comes out.
Anyways the BrBa-related anecdote that really got this concept through my head, personally, was witnessing years of That Type of edgelord fan be really nasty whenever people tried to analyze the character of gus fring as implicitly a gay man, getting to finally do my victory lap when Better Call Saul confirmed this as not only a legitimate reading but the intended one, and quickly realizing that… nothing changed at all. The dudes who wanted to be homophobic in my comments didn’t throw up their hands and stop because they never cared to listen in the first place. I’ll never claim that it doesn’t feel great to be right but ultimately these media-centric discussions are just byproducts of the kind of shit people would want to be talking anyways.
Twin Peaks
People consume media through their references. Some are smart enough to be self aware. But most often people dont care At ALL. Take what you want to belive and run with it.
I had no idea Gus Fring could even be misinterpreted as straight. It was so clear that Max was his partner.
Insane how people can do so much mental gymnastics to willfully misinterpret something that was so clear in my opinion.
Thank you for sharing!
Lindsay Ellis actually explored the idea of how Nazis and fascists tend to incorporate insulting depictions of themselves into their cultures. She mentions the Hammers from The Wall, and how that led to a real life gang, and i think Starship Troopers is name dropped as well. But then she points out that The Porducers escapes all this because ot makes nazis look like schmucks. The Wall and Starship Troopers can make fascism look cool; the Producers cannot.
For the record, I love Starship Troopers and the Wall. I hate seeing them co-opted.
@veronicabalzan Same thing happens with the character Eddie Dane in Miller's Crossing. The Coens made that one, and had to come out and explicitly state Dane was gay. Which makes him one of the most badass (but evil) gays ever. Search for the video Miller's Crossing one deag wall bang. Dane is the creep who grabs the woman and says, "Why is it everytime I open my mouth everyone gets smart."
After seeing the Nick Fuentes tweet and vid about "Your body, my choice. Forever", I can't waaaaaait so see men trying to excuse it as "Trolling", as if it's not another word for widespread harassment and as if he's not saying the quiet part out loud.
So far the common response appears to be a "y'all made that up you have a victim complex". I have not yet seen a response to the following proof of the existence of this tweet.
@@lanaloveschocolate Either that or "Fuentes is an extremist and in no way is reflective of shared values among conservatives"
Nevermind that shit is everywhere on Twitter now
@@MrOzzificationI think people naively undervalue how many right wingers sympathize with far right ideas. I have no clue how well known they are outside of canada but this Toronto ‘news’ account called 6ixbuzz that started out as a page for posting fights has become a cesspool of the far right in Canada.
I have seen posts and comments and dismissed as ‘just being online and not being in real life’ but then you start to notice that these are tend of thousands, even hundreds of thousands of people that believe this stuff and it becomes eery. Honestly why I am certain the Conservative Party will win the next election, because these far right ideas have way more popularity and have seeped into the mainstream.
I don’t like that Fuentes dude
Now that trump has won they're not going to shield it as "trolling" They are going to be explicit that these are there real thoughts and feelings.
And as Trumps presidency goes on it is only going to get worse.
I'm ngl you guys might want to take a gun safety course and get armed. Things might get really bad and being armed may be the difference between living and dieing
The problem with the edgelord movie is the same as making an anti-war film.
Come and See is the best anti-war film ever made. It was written by an actual soviet partisan from Belarus who fought the nazis and one of the most infamous nazi brigades that not only included German, but convicted Belarusian criminals convicted of the most horrific crimes like murder and sexual assault and released them on the condition they join the German side., It was filmed by a man who grew up during that time, and the film is shot and directed like a horror film. I'd recommend watching it but be warned it's extremely disturbing and something you'll only ever watch once., it was not released for 10 years because the Soviet Government said that it was "too realistic", because the film was written from the actual experiences of the writer, and the atrocities committed by the Nazis. I would argue it's even better than Apocalypse Now.
@@tedthecommenter5364 Do you mean "partisan" instead of "bipartisan"...? I'm having some trouble imagining the writer of Come and See being all like "look guys the Nazis and the Resistance both have some valid views, let's see if we can settle our differences and focus on the things we agree on"
@@humphreyspellingbee1732 sorry i was really high when i wrote that comment and still am, Partisan is what i meant you are correct, ill edit it
@@tedthecommenter5364 Go watch Come and See while high as your punishment for that typo then
@@humphreyspellingbee1732 His punishment is watching the cow scene on a loop.
Dude you’re the real deal. I honestly put you on my ‘makes me really think about it’ content creators list. Appreciate your mind!
Me: "sees thumbnail"
Also me: They got unc bro...what time line is this 😂
It all started with Harambe's death
Ever seen the movie "Jarhead"? There's a scene that explores this idea, where a bunch of marines are watching "Apocalypse Now," and they're focused on the parts of that movie where helicopters are flying around and dropping napalm and bombing houses, and marines are getting hyped up, while ignoring the original point that "Apocalypse Now" was supposed to be an anti-war movie. In fact, I think Roger Ebert talked about that in his review, mentioning that "Jarhead" is an actual anti-war movie, simply because there's no actual war, and the whole movie is just about a bunch of super manly badass marines who become bored as hell and they get in trouble because of it.
That movie is so effective. The most grisly on-screen death happens during basic training, the main characters spend 90% of the movie losing their minds with boredom and isolation, then when they finally get some action, it gets handled by air control instead of them. And then the fight ends and they go back home, scarred emotionally and shaped into a weapon without a target, yet expected to reenter civilian life with gratitude and without incident. And that's how the movie ends, with no catharsis, just a loaded gun of a human being.
Then the direct-to-DVD sequel was just "Marines are so cool!" military propaganda.
While I wasn't out for blood, and deployed super late in the conflict, that was pretty much a very real depiction of most deployments, especially mine. I spent most of my time in the gym or watchin anime.
Same thing happening to American History X - I grew up in eastern Germany in the 90s, where Skinhead Youth gangs were quite prevalent. Some of my friends even were Skinheads (but to my knowledge, to them it was more like a youth subculture, none were radical violent offenders, most just got groomed as kids into the ideology via older teenagers) - the favourite movie of our village skinheads was American History X - despite the movie obviously being very critical of that movement. Instead of looking at Derek's inner demons and his potential redemption, they all watched the curb stomping scene on repeat.
Art is in the eye of the beholder and said beholder's interpretation can vary greatly it seems.
Go back to sleep, grandpa. The McRib will be back soon.
Full Metal Jacket is another film like Apocalypse Now where the whole is lost because most only watch the first half of the movie. As Jarhead I use to tell people to watch it as that what the Iraq War was like because it was boring as hell for a few minutes of action.
My favorite depiction of masculinity (not edgy in the same way) is Ke Huy Quan's character as Waymond in Everything, Everything All at Once. I've loved a lot of edgy movies and at least seen the whole roster discussed here, but as someone who strays more toward empathy and stubbornly searching for connection. The radical depiction of Waymond as someone who refuses to abandon compassion, love, and empathy even in the face of it bringing more challenges to his character, is something that will stick with me forever. At least to me personally, that role stood in the face of Sigma male fantasy in such opposition to its tenants that it embodies the bleeding edge at the other side of the spectrum.
Preach. His “this is how I fight” line brought me to blubbering tears the first time I saw that movie.
@MrOtistetrax gets me every time too
This is also my answer! I love that movie so much.
I agree with that. If we're thinking about a spectrum, I think Cassian Andor is a good example of the middle (in the show). Cassian has a lot of the ingredients to be sigma-coded, and the first couple of scenes even kind of tease you into thinking he will be, but everything he does successfully is in community or within an organization. It's the times when he's off on his own that things go poorly. And the strength of his communities and his relationships is shown fiercely as not just backup for him, but a power in itself. I think this is meaningfully different from the kind of anti-sigma failures FD was talking about, because it's not "look at how being sigma is bad," it's "look how a guy with everything it takes to be ~sigma succeeds in solidarity."
@@MrOtistetrax and once Evelyn relaxes her fist and starts to fight with kindness, he makes headway. It's such a beautiful way of showing that there are more ways to achieve your goal than with brute force.
Recovering edge lord, here. Quit drinking and working on my mental health 11 years ago, recovering from many a things.
Your first video on this topic was fire. That and the vid about the NFL had me hooked.
You advocate for and educate black and/or ND young men in a way I don't think anyone else is doing right now.
I hope content creators start to jack your style, the world needs more of it. Clone this man!
The shoutout to Super Eyepatch Wolf made me respect your as a consumer of the arts even more, my dood.
Thank you for what you do FD.
Congrats and good luck on your journey of self healing. I’ve been watching a lot of stuff the past couple of years about why and how men are becoming more anti social, would you say that finding purpose and self worth were the main factors on you seeking better mental health? Or was there something else that helped kick start your journey 11 years ago?
I’m sure that wasn’t easy and I’m happy for you man
You can try to educate them, most will be far behind and end up sub-par citizens anyway. These people are a lost cause
Is ND neurodivergent?
@@RussOlson-pl3kf Yes
The idea that "they will misunderstand it anyway" is a part of making art, and just being public online as a whole, that' I've had to really come to terms with as I get older. I spend so much time trying to make sure I communicate things so "perfectly" that nothing I do can be misinterpreted, and just like the movies mentioned here... it's made everything I do, even the creation process much more difficult. So that really hit home for me!
A a black trans person I sometimes forget how much I want to make art" for us, by us" but we're still held down by our own fear of being seen. Great video, it's really got me thinkin!
I'm trans too, and that combination of "nobody who hates me is going to be convinced by anything I make" and "the people I do make it for are extremely paranoid about representation and hate depictions of queerness that aren't 100% positive sparkle rainbow so brave" has artistically kneecapped me for about a decade.
At some point you have to let it go. I'm not saying to make art just for yourself and abandon *all* responsibility, but at some point you have to find that balance between being socially responsible and making the art you want to make come hell or high water. Most marginalized people start making art because there isn't anything for them, and they decide to just make it themselves then. That's how it was for me anyway, and remembering that first spark helped me regain my footing a bit. I can't make art that pleases everyone and I don't want to make art that pleases no one. I want to change the world but I am very, very small and I have artistic needs too, it can't all be for the people.
All of which to say... god, it's a mess. You're going to be misinterpreted. It's going to be by the people you hoped to reach and comfort. You just have to find a way to be okay with that. Me, I've decided I'm on the side of art, like a wise art imp once said. My priority needs to be making things that I personally think are Beautiful and True. If I do that, I think that's something to hang on to when it hits the fan. As it always will.
Solidarity.
I'm a straight white male, and my little brother started transitioning this year and all I want to do is support him, all the media, art, etc that I've found by trans people has really helped me empathize. I doubt that I've interpreted it all correctly, but the more points of view available the more people understand each other.
@@mitchellkraemer9099 Let me tell you something that happened to me. There was this one episode of Brooklyn 99 where one of the characters comes out as bisexual and whatever, it was fine, I've seen it a million times and it didn't affect me anymore. It was a good, decent, standard coming-out story. But then came a joke where the punchline was "you Googled 'how to talk to bisexual friends' didn't you?'" and the other character sheepishly admitted, yeah, that's what he did.
Brother, I goddamn broke. I cried like a little girl. Because I realized nobody in my life had ever even gone through the trouble of googling "what is a trans and how do I be?" Nobody could be bothered to put in even that tiny amount of effort. If your brother is anything like me and most of the rest of us, the fact that you care enough to educate yourself in your own time and not put that emotional labor on him in what's got to be a very labor-intensive time...
You're a good egg. Thank you. And yeah, art matters. It won't change the world, it won't save us, but it does *matter*
@@mitchellkraemer9099 I think just the fact alone that you love him and you WANT to understand him and connect with him is good enough. You will make mistakes. Everyone does with people they love regardless of their circumstances. But you’re trying to be a good brother and that’s what counts
When it comes to writing about any topic you will just have to accept that a portion of your audience will come away with the unintended message. A part of art is putting yourself out there. If it covers heavy topics then there will *always* be discourse and misinterpretation (sometimes willfull misinterpretation) around it no matter what. But in my opinion when it comes to art if it says something substantial enough that it can produce genuine discussion then that is a sign of good art. In essence, don't be afraid to say something with your art, that is part of the beauty of it.
Everythign everywhere all at once is a rare piece of media for deconstructing this. Alpha Waymond is cool, self sufficient, violent, but its the radical empathy and kindness of the "real" waymond that ends up breaking through and setting Evelyn on the path of reconciliation with her daughter.
The issue is making guys who are already on this path to enjoy such a movie... I really liked it, don't get me wrong, but teens and young men who grew up with violent movies and games won't even bother looking at the screen, I'm afraid.
@@00PlPu00 I liked the movie too and I did grow up with all those things. You're giving men too little credit, we are people too at the end of the day.
@@anitaremenarova6662 I am a man ;) I clearly mentioned "guys who are already on this path", didn't I?
Damn, that's the first time I've thought about that, but I knew there had to be something in there with the alphaverse (aside from being the cause of all of this) but usually it'd get lost in the hundreds of other threads that that movie is about
“Everything Everywhere All At Once” is an actual conservative movie, as opposed to Joker, which is a revolutionary leftist movie. The fact that no one seems to get that is pretty incredible.
This video made me feel normal for the 1st time in over a decade...I thought I was the one who was going crazy. Although that may still be the case, I at least I have finally heard some of what I have been observing. Excellent work
Edge lords are the ones that will scream how much they’re like Rick, from Rick and Morty…. But the whole time they’re actually Jerry.
I wish I was as cool as Jerry.
They could never be Jerry
Whatever you say Summer.
You genuinely thought this was a zinger
Lol.accurate.
"Intention doesn't always match or change impact." Excellent point there, sir.
Favorite Edgelord movies not in this list:
1. Phantom of the Opera (secret brooding genius upset that the girl isn't into him that way).
2. Dr. Horribles singalong blog
Dr horrible is peak 😂 a classic truly
I've never thought of Phantom of the Opera in this way and I think you just ruined it for me 😂
Check out Lindsay Elllis's "O Daroga Where Art Thou" for a great take on Phantom Of The Opera. She straight up refers to him as a basement dwelling incel. EDIT: The title of her video is actually "The Most Whitewashed Character In Literary History." "O Daroga, Where Art Thou" is what shows in the thumbnail.
Yes, but Phantom of the Paradise, the Brian DePalma rock opera version of Phantom.
Look. I maintain that my enjoyment of Phantom is less about my ability to sympathize with Erik and more about the impossibility of sympathizing with Christine, the archetypal Victorian drip of a heroine.
this video made me meditate on certain behavior and characteristics i have developed due to prolonged online use. for me, this is a first time experience, a youtube video with thorough researched content and well-structured arguments. thank you.
Thats actually why Silver Surfer is one of my favorite characters in fiction. Its a subversion of lone wolf. Hes all "woe is me" and stoic when hes alone, but when hes around people, he changes. Surfer is stoked when hes chilling with Reed Richards or Nova or Doctor Strange. When hes with friends he stops being so weird. Im an Autistic dude who was reading proudon at 13. But if im with people i care about my worries of "we need to tear down all social hierarchy and embrace Autonomy, Egality, and equity" fades a little and i can just talk about last nights hockey game or the Rollercoaster i built in minecraft or whatever. So i relate to the silver surfer. The good outweighs the bad and good things exist, even during rough times.
The sad part is that this is the key to solving the problem that's been staring everyone in the face the whole time - all the sigmas and the lone wolves really want underneath everything is the "love and belonging" level of Maslow's hierarchy. Each of the movies FD brings up all either have some character from whom the sigma desires love (Irene in Drive) or community (Tyler Durden), or are otherwise about how the sigma lives ~iN a sOCiEtY~~ that actively others them for things outside of their control (Joker).
The most important thing in this video I think is what his interviewee said about the left needing counter-indoctrination. There is no reverse PewDiePipeline - most of the time the left's reaction to edgelord antisocial behavior is to disavow and shun rather than show empathy for things like how that knee-jerk shunning only shoves them further in a corner, or how patriarchy is oppressive to men too. Over the years I've so often heard people say that it isn't the responsibility of marginalized communities or people to educate the ignorant, and I understand the need for safe spaces that aren't meant for arguing with neonazis or videos like this that are targeted at leftists disavowers rather than the sigmas themselves, but at the end of the day there needs to be someone willing to talk down the next Elliot Rodger or else it's going to keep happening.
Oh my goodness yes! Brilliant encapsulation of why I love Surfer but could never put into thought/words. Well done you. :)
I'm the same way, plus when my pets come and show me some love.
Surfer is the goat.
Somehow i relate to your story... 😭
Fd calmly explaining his thesis
Me on loop: I'm the Joka babyyy
WHY SO SERIOUS!?!
Fd calmly explaining his thesis
Me trying to get past the thumbnail that will haunt my sleeping and waking hours
hey have you ever wondered what it'd be like if the joker could beatbo
At this point i cannot blame any satire for appealing to the people its critiquing.
It happened with literally every single piece of satire in history
“Satire is a sort of glass wherein beholders do generally discover everybody’s face but their own.”
-Swift
@@Justanotherconsumer since when has taylor been writing bangers
like it's on the audience at that point
True. Look at the New Norm for example
"Pull themself up by their bootstraps."
Man, what a great video. I gave up on The Boys for a reason I couldn't quite articulate, but intuitively felt. You articulated it exactly.
@8:50 an edge lord will deny your right to be nonbinary and then get pissed when you categorize them as the wrong kind of incel? thats hilarious
@@fatfurie empathy is a learned skill.
@@zacharybosley1935on the contrary. It's part of human nature that gets severely damaged in an individualistic society.
@@ekki1993 in that case, it's a skill that can, and oftentimes must be relearned.
@@ekki1993 A purely collectivistic society can't solve the problem of people being conditioned into withholding empathy imo. I've seen hyper-individualistic liberals give lots of empathy towards those who don't show solidarity in a way that a leftist might not decide is most appropriate (in the case of people who don't abide by boycotts or strikes, or even towards veterans on the wrong side of a conflict) which reveals to me that although empathy is reinforced or broken down through the specific lens of social conditioning the dominant ideology subjects us to, unfortunately we're all vulnerable to callousness for one reason or another.
In the case of a hyper-individualistic society being damaging towards the development of empathy, I still agree with you to a point, it's just that I think human nature is prone to emotional exhaustion or subconscious selective application of empathy no matter the ideological suppositions involved.
@beansworth5694 what are you yapping about? I never proposed a solution, I just clarified that empathy is humanity's default state. Collectivism too, for what it matters.
I don't know what's the solution to people having their empathy broken by an individualistic society, nor expect everything to be perfect on any alternative, and it's tiring to have to explain what I'm not saying because you assumed a bunch of stuff I never said.
0:24 onision jumpscare
Thanks for the trigger warning😂
thanks for the trigger warning
I saw this right before it happened, doing gods work out here
hey i remember that guy…i remember him dating a 17 year old and being abusive to his ex. the early internet was something else.
@@researchaccount999 the way that isn't even the whole story, that's how bad onision is
Creatives and artists are so important for radical change. Not just academics making art. Being an artist means being vulnerable and putting out some shit you might hate 10 years later
This. It’s part of the experience of being an artist. It’s why I don’t trust or find myself drawn to artists who try to stay “apolitical”. That in itself is a political statement. It’s interesting to see how they fare..!
This is why we “as a society” can’t afford to tolerate AI art. Humans need a voice, one that doesn’t end when a program rejects keywords or refuses to put out certain types of content because some megalomaniac can’t tolerate any negative visual representation. AI takes away choice while pretending to give people expression. Really they don’t know what they don’t know or how far they could express ideas if they just tried. If people want political art, then the fight against AI art needs to continue and intensify.
As a creative, I needed to hear this. Sometimes I feel what I do is useless and a lot of people hate on the arts
I'm an undesirable male and edgelord whose essentially always teetering into being an incel and am interested in art and making it. I even did an art degree at uni
Would anyone be interested in seeing art I would produce I wonder. Would there be an audience for incel art, or would I be shut down for being 'undesirable'
@@painunending4610 ropemaxx
I’m a chick, and I’m new to your channel.
I loved your collabs with Fantano. And had to check you out. I enjoy long form content and especially informative, thought provoking content. We need more guys like you in the creative community and black community.
Thank you F. D. 🦄💓✨
Lmao people call you a misandrist? I've been recommending you to young men for years now for your well thought out, compassionate, expressive work to help young men. You're one of the first people I think of, when it comes to giving young men, healthy, 'masculine' advice.
One of the oldest tricks in the book. Just invert it!
Me too, I share FD with other young (and older) men freely. For exactly these reasons.
Honestly, FD is one of the best real-world examples of non-toxic masculinity.
Any time they get called out tho is something they can't handle, so they use that as a cop out for them to pretend like he isn't speaking truth, wisdom, and/or shouldn't be heard.
@@GodofPainBelial It's really feeling like it's this for some, but I'd like to hope not a lot, of dudes. I had this convo on another social platform where some guy was parroting the old line again that we won't reach men by making them seem like villains or browbeating them, and I pointed out I believe we can reach gender equality and solidarity among men and women, as well as give men space to voice their pain, but it doesn't happen while also making sure every man's feelings are spared and they never have to think about their role in society, or harm they might have caused, or have any introspection or uncomfortable conversations, or deep sadness at the realization of how shitty the world is to women, often at the hands of men, I could go on.
I remember Lindsay Ellis pointing out a similar problem of, "problematic character still looks cool" and how satire/ comedy can be one of the few truly effective ways of addressing those ideologies. But this makes me realize that it's only a piece of the puzzle.
This crowd is generally not capable of good comedy and satire.
People won’t get it even if it IS put into a comedy. That’s the point of this video, that no matter how transparent you are, people still won’t understand.
Which video
God I miss Lindsay Ellis..
She’s still doing stuff on Nebula!
You could make an argument that Elliot from Mr. Robot is the anti-Joker. He's a broken, detached man who's part of a group calling themselves "f society". But instead of acting out with petty violence, he learns to accept love from the people around him in spite of all the shit he's been through. He's the edgelord that grew up.
I think that’s exactly right.
And we learn in the end that the Elliott ** spoiler ** we see most of the show wasn’t even a real person. He was just another fragmented piece of the real Elliott that was created to deal with the world.
The show literally ends the exact moment when the edge lord part of Elliott decides to let go and give up control of Elliott.
Yeah, the show is aware of Elliots obnoxious edginess, and watching the world fall apart in season 2 after he "saves" it is pretty funny.
1000%, the show even goes through the extra effort of showing that the FBI were on to fsociety the entire time(more or less)
And then killed the other Elliot lol
Mr robot is a great example because the protagonist Elliot is severely traumatized, but also very accomodated and had all the chances to heal since episode 1: he got a decent job, his childhood friend, his sister agreed to come to the city to hang out with him, he has a therapist
But turns out he fucked it all up since before the show starts, and its all about him realizing how toxic this delusion is, combined with shame for creating it in the first place, without fully blaming himself because he's a victim. it's even better when at the end its revealed that he had TWO edgelord personas, and one of them is the one we see all the time, the "protagonist" or the Mastermind as they call it, that beats up the bad guys and saves the world while also saving himself, while the real Elliot is seemingly just a person who wanted a normal life, and created these personas to help him save the world and rebuild himself
1. I’m commenting before I’ve finished the video.
2. I just want to say it’s very refreshing to see someone with the ability to communicate clearly about complicated/uncomfortable ideas. The world could use a lot more level headed conversations about tough topics these days. Good on you man. 😎
Ok, now that I’ve actually finished the video it really got me thinking. When you brought up the idea of counter propaganda it was a real lightbulb moment for me. The left these days has awful branding. The way “the message” is presented in media these days usually comes off as preachy or cringe. I think it would be awesome to see more media depicting more positive and productive messages but actually manage to stick the landing. I don’t know what it would look like but I think giving young people especially more positive role models and depictions of good societies to aspire to is important.
I think Andor is a great example of the type of media you are saying we need more of. It not only serves as a blueprint for imagining real political action against oppressive systems, but on a personal level it follows Andor from what is essentially a “sigma” worldview, to accepting that he needs others and others need him. It has a great collectivist message while also being the best piece of Star Wars media since Empire.
pretty low bar if empire is the comparison
Thing is that a lot of men nowadays aren't needed and thus don't feel the need for others. They're not Andor, they're a faceless Stormtrooper
@@painunending4610the roles and need is are still there for the taking. Community still exists whether they choose to participate or not. These disconnected young men need to get involved
Yes! Andor absolutely is amazing for this! I've seen the complaint that Andor doesn't feel like the main character when his name is in the title. And I would argue that's the point. He starts out deliberately isolating himself and allowing others to suffer the consequences of his actions, and throughout the story realizes that he can be better by actually believing in a cause to help others, as we see him do when he returns to Ferrix
@@Blanktester685 If you have a piece of Star Wars media that sets a higher bar, I'd love to hear about it.
In the same way that “there is no such thing as an anti-war movie”, “there is no such thing as an anti-incel movie”. You can be as direct and as obvious as you want, but some people are still going to see the spectacle and think “war is cool!” or “incel stuff is cool!”
Exactly. It’s like that old question (Roger Ebert’s?) of whether you can even make a violent movie without glamorizing violence. I don’t think you can.
War cannot be valorized without the knowledge of its atrocities.
Rocky is anti incell IMO
It's a bad point, though - nothing in, say, Come and See or Night and Fog show war as anything but apocalyptically repulsive. Truffaut was speaking from a limited perspective.
Great comment.
Kind of unrelated, but it reminds me of an interview with the singer of the left-wing punk band Propagandhi. He said that their concerts were full of neo-nazi skinheads who didn't give a shit about their message, they were just there because they thought the music was cool. Propagandhi literally had to write "anti-fascist, anti-racist, pro-gay, pro-feminist" on the cover of their next album to let them know they weren't welcome.
I used to love satire, but I'm honestly amazed by how many people don't get the message unless it's literally directly spelled out.
“Hard times are coming, when we’ll be be wanting the voices of writers who can see alternatives to how we live now, can see through our fear-stricken society and it’s obsessive technologies to other ways of being, and even imagine real grounds for hope. We’ll need writers who can remember freedom - poets, visionaries - realists of a larger reality. “ ~ Ursula K. Le Guin
Aka woke garbo
At what part of the creative journey is one tired of seeing inspirational quotes instead of inspirational people?
If this is your best analysis of this topic, I don't think you can complain with the audience not getting your point.
This thumbnail bothered me so deeply in my soul it took me 2 days to think of the words to formulate just how much it scared me….sadly this is all I can think of lol. Thank you for lettin my sleep paralysis Demon finally retire after 33 years and takin its place. 😂
Edit: Dax definitely deserves the criticism and WAY more, he not just a fake edge lord he also a 🦝
he is also a raccoon
Hi! I would really appreciate if you would take the time to elaborate on the Dax criticism because I can’t put my finger on the feelings I have when it comes to him
@ watch any Anthony Fantano video about him, he sums it up pretty perfectly
@@ScruFaceJeanOfficial you forgot he was also a janitor 😂
Happy to see you here!
Hey, I've been watching for the last year or so and I used to be one of those edgelords; I was well on my way to being a better and healthier person by the time I found myself in here, but I wanted to say that it was a huge comfort to find someone saying things that I had already held beliefs for but lacked the form or substance to direct and verbalize. The intro sort of struck me, since I've also hit the exact same point in my interpersonal relationships. I have friends that fall into that category that I've tried to drag along with me in the journey for introspection and finding peace.. some better, but some have created a resounding mental dissonance between what I believe and preach vs the audience I keep. I found myself starting to ask a few months ago about at what point keeping these friends is reaching out and attempting to help, versus merely humouring bad behaviors and elements. I was already set on ending these friendships that leave me questioning my (in)actions, but this definitely helped settle and cement the choice.
Have a good one, whoevers reading this!
All the best on your journey internet stranger. I'm sure your new worldview has improved the world around you, I hope that continues.
Personally, I don't think you need to leave them behind, so much as interact with them whenever you have the bandwidth and try to keep up the positivity.
I just wanna say you were still a good person when you were an edgelord loser. There's nothing wrong with being an edgelord, and we need to stop saying or implying otherwise because it alienates people who many otherwise be your allies
The mention of Driver made me realize that Gosling is typecast as sigma/edglord or adjacent to it. Even as Ken in the Barbie film, let alone Fall Guy and Bladerunner.
Though Ken from the Barbie movie is, ironically, a great deconstruction of a sigma edgelord. Showing why to move on from that worldview and how.
That's why watching The Nice Guys was such a surprise for me. He's playing such a goofy loser, it's great!
@@ElkiLGLike Holland tries to be broody cause of his dead wife, but then that image gets shattered almost immediately when Jackson breaks his arm and he screams a whole two octaves up from his speaking voice. 😂
His characters always deconstruct that cliché in some ways. The Driver maybe less so, but he is still a fairly layered character.
He's a nice sensitive guy with friends who cares about other ppl in fall guy tho
The thing i find pretty consistent is that people who like to throw around the term edgelord or incel are usually the same people that criticize everyone of every little thing. They can't get through 1 day without insulting people they dont even socialize with. Then they make youtube videos about people they've never had a conversation with so they can insult them and give them "advice". But secretly thetre not interested in helping so called losers. More interested in manipulating and insulting to tear you down. Seems a bit EDGY
Beautifully said and that is what I've thought in the past reading/hearing people comment on said "edgelords" or "incels". As if people don't live in phases or are more complex than what they come off as.
I do think buzzwords are thrown a lot around online, and some people are missing nuance or just want to blame someone. So yeah, I'm sure there's some unfair blame being flung around.
However, personally most interactions with people who'd qualify as 'incels' or 'edgelords' have been actively negative. It's tiring.
If the issue of people like that is lonliness, the solution is finding community and building self confidence rather than fighting other people. It's not easy, but that's also something you have to do yourself. That's not something you could reasonably expect other people to do for you.
Good point 👏
The actor who plays Homelander is great. I was deeply afraid of him the first time I saw him on screen. He is also having the time of his life, rescued from Soap Opera blandness.
I hope he got paid a bajillion dollars to hawk that mobile game
11:30 It's so funny that they adopt the Wolf as their symbol, since it's such a social animal.
Lone wolves are skittish and often die early.
Right? If wolves were individual by nature, we'd just call lone wolves "wolves". We specify "lone" wolves because that's unusual.
@@KalElinabox and? Are their lives not just as valuable as the social wolves? Was that wolfs life not worth living? Did that wolf not accomplish anything?
You people need to stop demonising this stuff or you'll just turn people away?
@@painunending4610 they're saying that being social is integral to a person's survival, they need to depend on other people because that's literally how people *live* - we're a cooperative species
@@wayfaringspacepoet so if a person isn't social, has no friends, no family, no relationships his life isn't as valuable as someone with all those things?
I think a big problem with all of these media examples is that all they do is empathize and then condemn and it's like, well wtf are these people supposed to do. I'm a parent, and one thing you learn fast is telling kids (people) what not to do is really unhelpful and doesn't work. You need to tell them what to do. We need media that is empathetic, and then guiding in its message. We need a movie about an Arthur Fleck type where he doesn't become the Joker because therapy works or because an old friend or distant relative reaches out. We need to give these guys something to aspire to.
The real crux of this whole thing is these people feel alienated. Relating to them only to say "but screw you anyways" only serves to further alienate them. That is exactly why people who relate to these characters relive the 1st half of all these movies and shows and seemingly pretend the condemnation didn't happen. They felt seen, finally, they felt like they were understood and like someone (or a piece of media) could relate to them, and it you slapped their hand and called them a bad boy as soon as they let their guard down. It doesn't help.
I couldn’t agree more. You can’t slap someone’s hand and tell them “no” about the one and only thing they think they know, and then proceed to not show them an alternative.
…I cried during the first Joker movie for the exact reason you described. It was about being seen. I wasn’t proud of Fleck, I obviously, as a normal person, wouldn’t want him to do the things he did and go down the path he took… but the catharsis of seeing him go down the path and do what he did *because* it was all he knew he could do, was undeniable. It was catharsis born from my personal experience of being unilaterally told therapy would help with mental health, only for it to not be helpful at all. I wasn’t looking for coping mechanisms, I was looking for real answers and real reasons for living/to live. I still am.
Basically, more work need to be done in media when it comes to communication. You can’t dumb down messages to “it’s okay to seek help :)” or something so simple it becomes inapplicable.
That is because the virtue signallers Only Care about "sending a message", they never cared aboubt anybody else.
Joker wasn't meant to show him as a hero.
He wasn't exactly an irredeemable villain like Joker usually is either though.
Not every story is meant to be a fable, they're not all meant to show you the way.
Sometimes they just need you to be mature enough to ask yourself the questions.
There's a reason it's rated R, it's not for kids.
Not everyone gets a competent therapist, especially when not privileged. Should people who got screwed over by the system just be treated like they don't exist?
The time for molly coddling the society was over when the first time a victim of abuse ended up not receiving an adequate compensation and instead being further abused and marginalized.
The main problem with Joker is that some people didn't get the message of the movie. The abusive coworker is a guy you meet on 4chan and the comedian guy and Thomas Wayne are false father figures like Jordan Peterson and Donald Trump.
Joker isn't a criticism of the Arthur Fleck, it's a criticism of the society. Treating people like shit and then people who are basically embodiment of what is wrong with the society like Jordan Peterson and Donald Trump exploiting some victims of the society while at the same time despising them.
Then the abusive co-worker, the thugs on metro harassing a woman, hyper-abusive parents, a parade of predators preying on the vulnerable.
Before anyone listens to the person above me, just go to therapy. Don't let anyone discourage you from looking for help, there is no shame in it and no one deserves to judge you for it
Im sure you have scripts and you plan out your videos, but i love how real and chill this style of video essay is, even you asking your editor to patch in info you aren't sure of. Feels more like a live talk or conversation than than a essay.
I love that you define terms. When I studied philosophy, that was one of the biggest factors in boiling down communication. It was two people using the same word, but with different ideas of what that word entailed.
I also love that, at the end, you took the words out of my mouth. We need a counter, but what does that look like? Anti-propaganda, or anti-_this_-propaganda, what does that look like like? We need more media that embodies that. We especially need well-written media that embodies that, but I can't think of a film that tackles it properly.
Lastly, I found you from Syntell, and I'm so glad I subbed.
I love that starts with ad hominem and then goes "its just a prank bro" because he is hateful but he wants the mask of civility back on.
In anime you have Vinland Saga and Vagabond as pretty big examples. Search up the "i have no enemies" video.
Villains who grow and kind of 180 their attitude to the point of vecoming part of the main crew also works. Not so much in the shounen "i beat you so now you're my sidekick" way, just characters growing and finding they want to change things for the better.
Gaara in Naruto and Zuko in ATLA also spring to mind.
I (brasilian) watched this video on nebula right before a man dressed as the heath ledger joker carrying a deck of cards with him tried to do a terrorist attack at our supreme court, threw a bomb at the famous sculpture outside, it bounced back and exploded on him. He was the only victim of his attack. And if this isn't like, a great representation of what this type of behaviour leads to, Idk what is.
Wow, why am I hearing about this on a TH-cam comment section instead of from Josh Strife Plays (to save the Brazilian airplane industry)
I know I’m beating a dead horse but I’ll say it anyway…. Alpha, sigma, and beta wolfs do not exist in the wild. Only in captivity 🐺🌖💔
Edit for clarity: David Mech, who originally discovered the idea of “alpha males” later rejected, and redacted that term and theory from his work. Concluding that what he observed was actually patriarchal dominance of an alpha pair. Aka that these were family units, or a mom and dad. I know sigmas are not real. I just put them in there to make a jab at the Omega verse whose books I have been recommended on too many occasions. 😂
Another edit: Captured wolves are know for being more aggressive than wolves in the wilderness. This is because they are forced to live with non-related adults.
Quote from wolf haven international: “Wolves are wild animals that are evolutionarily designed to live in families, hunt cooperatively, and travel long distances. Captivity can be stressful for wolves because it limits their choices and puts humans in control of all aspects of their lives”
Do we not in fact live in a society? Is society not a type of captivity?
No...Guess not.....
@@katakesh8566I was just about to say this. The society we are doomed to be forced to be apart is captivity. I’m upset people don’t understand this.
@@mcclorei9we're also not wolves. And who's the universal captor? Wolves have social structures and dynamics in the wilderness, too.
sigma wolves aren't even a thing. tbh when that whole segment describing them came on I had omegaverse flashbacks 💀
There are alphas in other types of animals though if I’m not mistaken like chimps
Man, what I love about AoT that you almost touched on is the reality that if anyone promises you a solution to everything, they are a liar and a fool. There are no solutions to everything and progress is a march, not a destination. If you make progress a destination, it fails.
04:52 FD FINALLY channelling some lil Bill energy on main
One piece feels like counter propaganda. Luffy has the same dream as Eren, he wants to be king of the pirates because that is the most free man in the world, but it's so different and hopeful. I can't put +1000 chapters into words but those who know know
this makes so much sense omg
🫡 King shit right there.
For a while now I've thought that Luffy is a shining beacon of masculinity
This. Honestly, Dragon Ball and Naruto are both up there too as examples of counter-sigma messaging. All of these shows have a main character that is approachable, excitable, hopeful and gives people second chances and wants to get along with people to a fault more often than not. They will go to any length to protect and stand by their friends and family, because they're ever grateful for all that they've received from their friends and family. Be it their childhood, emotional, physical or financial support in a time of need, or even helping them get through something they otherwise couldn't no matter how much they could've trained and honed themselves in isolation.
Yes, all of these series have those ''main character powers up and becomes a badass moments'' but the devil is in the details. Time and again, the reason our MCs manage to *win* the war in some way or another is because of their strong backing provided by the good reputation they've established through their selfless acts and outstandingly inspiring choices when put under immense pressure. They *choose* not to abandon their friends or turn their back on those in need, even in situations where it is downright suicidal, and the author rewards them either with plot armour *or* (what I like much better) those around them recognizing their exceptional qualities of character and choosing to come to their aid.
It is true that more often than not, these characters have some innate talent or power as well, but it can often be interpreted as the potential any troubled young person has. They've the potential within themselves, which grows as they get older and more capable, of doing great good or great evil. The power to endure or break. Both Naruto and Goku canonically lose control of themselves at one point and end up hurting their loved ones, so in that sense the story also reaches out to those who've unwittingly hurt their loved ones. All the magical, spiritual, fantasy bullshit power systems are actually just means to an end for the author to convey the emotional and spiritual growth of their characters throughout their journeys as well as the physical improvements they happen to have (like lifting weights and becoming able to lift more weights, which is something any person can do unless they've some sort of disability).
Characters like Vegeta and Sasuke choose to isolate themselves and bottle up their emotions, hiding their trauma and weakness instead of partaking in a group or community of like-minded individuals (they gradually grow out of that habit as the series goes on, with both Sasuke and Vegeta eventually becoming a part of the main cast by the end and no longer being absolute edgelords), and you can see that being an unhealthy way to go about it in both Dragon Ball and Naruto. Both Vegeta and Sasuke, due to their emotional instability and issues over their identity, past and lineage (as well as what they believe they deserved and the injustices they've suffered at the hands of life), end up becoming easy to manipulate and mislead. They get used by other, more cunning characters, not unlike characters like Andrew Tate capitalizing on the insecurity of young men to have them do what he wants, so *he* can profit off of it.
Not unlike how Frieza used Vegeta, or how Orochimaru and later Obito manipulated the shit out of Sasuke.
These stories not only display the shortcomings of the 'sigma' mindset, but also showcase the benefits of being the stark opposite of that, while still keeping both sides human and capable of mistakes. Neither side is irredeemably evil or incorruptibly good. There are moments where the good guys get villainous, and the bad guys are on the verge of tears after realizing that what they've done was wrong, that they've believed in a fallacy, and they don't know what to do with themselves afterwards. They're all *people.* That's what makes those stories enjoyable to read IMO.
@@howdypartner8326 When does the video essay drop?
I've been yelling at my friends and family about how we've got so many examples that are critical, "here's what not to do", "look at how bad they are", stories for years now. It's kinda awesome to see the opinion that positive examples are more necessary than ever now reflected back at me.
Don't yell, lol
@@tachobrenner my apologies
Poe's Law in full effect, sadly. Hopefully we can get better about this as FD concluded with.
men who have written movies and books that basically come to the conclusion "war is a waste, it's awful, don't do it" frequently wind up lamenting that their examples are just twisted to support the stuff they're criticizing. alternatives that don't and can't overlap with the edge lord image are critical
This has been my issue for a while. Deconstruction is only step 1, but i could not have put it so persuasively with the skill/experience/wording you've used to communicate this.
This is my first ever video I've seen of yours, and I am so impressed! I loved the breakdown, so well written and perfectly captured my thoughts especially when you went on about how the left *also* doesn't really 'get' the message they're supposed to get, and how it's our job to steer them away from the dark, grimy, redpilled corners of the internet and instead give them positive role models to look up to. I was just having that conversation online a couple days ago and made the exact same points lol.
When you started talking about being on Nebula (my favorite platform 👀) all I could think was, "of COURSE this guy is on Nebula!" It seems every creator I fall in love with is on there. Subbed and liked and commented 🫡
"A Clockwork Orange" (my favorite of the genre) author Anthony Burgress hated the idolization of his main character Alex. The last chapter of his novel was banned in the USA because of the message that prison and/or drugs will not change a person, but rather that change has to come from within. The film which is fairly true to the novel, ends right before this last chapter.
The way he writes that change is actually incredibly realistic. Alex doesn't become a good person or find God like at the end of Crime and Punishment. No, his narcissism realizes that it is in his best interests to become a functioning member of society with a wife and 2.5 children.
I remember being 13 or 14 watching a midnight showing at the Uptown Theater in DC, which has a huge screen and has a balcony. As that first close up shot of Alex appeared, about 20-40 punks stood up and started cheering.
This is one of my favorite facts
I love that the conflict of fight club was “we have it so good that were bored”
It so perfectly caught that hunger for conflict that found such bloody outlet in Iraq.
"We have no great struggle, no great depression..."
Okay, but that's hardly a politics thing, idle hands and all. Same thing with feminists today not realizing how privileged they actually are, hence why so many only seem to care about their 'right' to be promiscuous and get abortions because being a mom is inconvenient but then shame men for refusing to wife women with a past like that in their 30's.
Also I don't see abortion as even being a women's rights issue beyond exceptions like for SA and medical cases, beyond that if the exceptions aren't good enough it's typically because they want to sleep around with the peace of mind of knowing if the birth control fails they have abortion as a safety net, but don't realize how bad the consequences are as far as emotional damage and trauma and how bad it is for getting married and having a family after a past like that, and it's more so men and children that pay the price unless men refuse to wife that, which they should. But then women act like men refusing is violating THEIR rights, you can't make this shit up, like men should have no say in abortion but also have no right to refuse to marry women like that.
Abortion is hardly women's rights issue, it's a moral issue aside from the debate about exceptions. Women lost me when not only were the exceptions not good enough, but they also want abortions to be free and easy to get and expect not to be judged for it or shamed for it either. Men can support a woman's right to choose to be promiscuous but not condone it, women act like men not praising and validating them is 'oppressing' them.
Look, call it what you want but when that boredom gets people killed it's no longer a laughing matter
@@silvercakes I can if they adopted a puppy, things would start looking up for them.
@@SheoGotSomeCheesekeep being unaware
The TH-cam algorithm sometimes pushes good videos, and this was one of those occasions. I subscribed and liked and here is a comment to help with the algorithm.
Ahh thanks for the shout out FD
It's a call out to us all I think. And if we manage to make that change it's be a relief probably at the end of the day
Not a movie character, but Leroy Jenkins was my hero when I was 16. I had changed schools from a public school in Bay Ridge Brooklyn to a private school in Brooklyn Heights, and whereas people in public school were funny in a gut level way like by tripping you going down the stairs or something, private school everything was stifling and analytical, and things just seem to go into endless discussions, which went nowhere. So then here comes Leroy Jenkins, Not caring about any kind of strategy or anything, just getting it over with and going for it and failing. That was so satisfying to me.
Isn't Leroy Jenkins the rat from flushed away
@@albusnightspring8057
Leroy Jenkins was an old internet persona (like, late 2000s) who gained his fame by running into a dangerous room in the game ‘World of Warcraft’ while shouting his name .
LLEEEEEEEEEEEERRRRROOOOOOOOOOOOOOY Jeeeenkkkkkkiinnnnnnsss!!!!!
@kyledilbert6424 fun fact, they paid homage to Leroy Jenkins in Dark Souls, with an NPC by the name of Paladin Leroy.
It's Leeroy. I thought you were talking about someone else at first.
Reading Attack on Titan during the last few years of its run was kind of amazing if you were part of the monthly discussion. Real life people were separating into yeagerists and anti-yeagerists. You would have people point out cracks in the illusion of Eren's chad persona. Talking about how it made no sense for him to be a tactical mastermind after the timeskip and that there was a lot of evidence suggesting that Eren was essentially powerless to the ultimate outcome of the story (Like how the original holder of the power is literally enslaved to it for millenia...). And people would go absolutely feral over it, to the point that we got a titanfolk subreddit (the AoT version of the Game of Thrones freefolk sub) that went full in on the Eren propaganda. They would call the characters trying to stop a global genocide the Cringevengers. They essentially reflected the in universe factions, and it was fascinating seeing the denialism that the yeagerist readers resorted to when we finally got Eren's true, unfiltered POV.
I have a lot to say about the ending of the AoT manga, and I can't keep annoying my friends about it. I'm really sad that it's impossible to recreate the environment that I read the finale in. There was a blurring of art and reality that elevated the experience. It also disturbed me considering the real life parallels to leaders with followers that herald them as the greatest chad masterminds...
I know exactly what you mean. Those were some wild times. From my point of view, Armin was always supposed to be the hero. He was compassionate, willing to work toghetter with others and even sacrifice himself and his dreams if it meant keeping his friends safe. The yeagerist commentators really hated him for opposing Eren, even though he still wanted to help him see reason. Not to mention the hate Gaby received, for basicly being a gender swapped Eren.
I relate to having a lot of things to say about it but not wanting to annoy your friends about it lol. While I am an anime only plebian after finishing it I haven't really been able to get it out of my mind. While I wasn't there when the schism happened I definitely experienced the effects as when I finished the anime I took to some discussion boards to get everything that had been brewing in my head out there. Its fascinating to see a fandom so polarized that they ended up splitting into two different subreddits.
I had stumbled upon the titanfolk subreddit and my god... I hear stories of toxic subreddits but that one seems up there in some of the worst. Scrolling through the posts of that was miserable with the amount of toxicity, cope, and just full endorsement of horrible ideologies. That's part of the reason I cant stop thinking about AoT. It's the fact there is a non-insignificant portion of the community that saw the yeagerists and rumbling and didn't think "This is messed up!" but instead saw it as aspirational and just.
Also little side tangent f**k Floch, all my homies hate Floch. He is a really well written character but I hate him he got my fav character killed in the second to last episode it unironically pisses me off when people call him some "based redpilled chad" the man sucks as a person.
@@Denniske87 Armin's entire character was so great. He was constantly trying to reach out to everyone, even the enemy, continuously asking himself why everyone had to fight.
The reasons for why people fought were ultimately petty. "Because of history from thousands of years ago (Marley)," "Because of pride and ego (Levi, Zeke)," "Because I already started on this path so I might as well keep going (Eren, Reiner)."
If there was any one message to be had from the show, it was the cycle of hate. And how pointless it all is. People can just choose to not kill each other, it's both incredibly complex but also so simple. Maybe Erwin was right, that as long as there's 2 people alive, there will be conflict. But just submitting to that logic as a justification to kill others isn't right.
@@bugjams Honestly, when he mentioned it isnt clear whether Isayama was pro or anti fascism, I had a hard time taking anything he said after seriously.
If there ever was a single sign of missing media comprehension, that must be it.
Been following you on Twitter for a while this is the first vid of yours I watched. NICE WORK
Boots Riley needs to make more stuff.
Alan Moore said this about Rorschach in 2008
“You could put a superhero in the real world for a dramatic effect, because they are kind of stupid. They got these tight costumes, stupid names; they’re kind of unbelievable, so if you actually put them in the real world and have people reacting to them the way that people would, you’d laugh at them, you’d be scared of them. It would be a different way of looking at them, so that’s what went mostly into Watchmen.
“[Gibbons and I] thought about superhero types like Batman, so I thought, ‘What would he be like in the real world.’ And he’d be very much like Rorschach-if you’re a revenge-driven vigilante, you’re not quite right in the head. Yeah, alright, your parents got killed when you were a kid, whatever, that’s upsetting. But for most of us, if our parents were killed when we were little, would not become a bat-themed costumed vigilante-that’s a bit mental.
So, I thought, ‘Alright, if there was a Batman in the real world, he probably would be a bit mental.’ He wouldn’t have time for a girlfriend, friends, a social life, because he’d just be driven by getting revenge against criminals… dressed up as a bat for some reason. He probably wouldn’t be very careful about his personal hygiene. He’d probably smell. He’d probably eat baked beans out of a tin. He probably wouldn’t talk to many people. His voice probably would have become weird with misuse, his phraseology would be strange.
“I wanted to kind of make this like, ‘Yeah, this is what Batman would be in the real world.’ But I had forgotten that actually to a lot of comic fans that smelling, not having a girlfriend-these are actually kind of heroic. So actually, sort of, Rorschach became the most popular character in Watchmen. I meant him to be a bad example, but I have people come up to me in the street saying, ‘I am Rorschach! That is my story!’ And I’ll be thinking, ‘Yeah, great, can you just keep away from me and never come anywhere near me again for as long as I live?’”
That’s why I love Alan Moore.
I was gonna say if he wanted us to hate Rorschach, he shouldn't have had him say "I'm not locked here with you, you're locked in here with me" but then I remembered Zach Snyder probably made him say that
Moore is fucking king. A true based sigma make.
Do you know about Boots Riley's "I'm A Virgo"? It's buried on Amazon Prime. I just found out about it last month and it's really good!
In a metatextual sense, the essence of Rorschach's character is that everyone sees in him what they want to see, what they project. He's aptly named like that.
Fabulous presentation. As a reformed edge lord, myself, I think you've hit the nail on the head. I felt a connection with the dangerous and antisocial archetypes and would live vicariously in my imagination where I was edgy and dangerous
my bf used to be just like you, a lonely teen with adhd who was bullied in school and had 0 attention from girls. he told me he would daydream about being a ruthless vigilante like the punisher all the time
if you don’t mind me asking - what reformed you?
@papaversomniferum8508 i saw it from the outside and saw the other people who thought and acted like i did. I did not like them or their attitudes. They were so toxic. I saw the people i was becoming and I hated them
@@papaversomniferum8508you dating a guy who used to be like that???
I think Reeves' The Batman may be a step in the right direction. Pattison's Batman starts off as the edgey "I'm vengeance" guy. He is shot and his POV is taken and mirrored by the bad guy. And the whole movie culminates in Batman realizing that his "from the shadows" approach is impotent. That the bat has to become not a symbol of fear, but of hope.
Whereas Nightcrawler just break downs issues, it doesn't have the protagonist figure out what's actually wrong or where to go in a broken society.
Nightcrawler is about an actual sociopath, i dont think it really fits the bill of edgster movie
@@cinemachronicyeah. That movie is intended more as an indictment of the system that enables people like him and points the finger at a culture that is itself sociopathic in its consumption of the type of media he produces. After all, by the end he’s actually succeeded in starting his own successful company, exploiting tragedy and turning it into entertainment.
With Batman I also feel that since non of the Modern movies cover him with the Bat family, we don't see the lighter side like Nightwing who still does the cool street vigilante but isn't a brooding loner. That was the reason characters like Tim Drake become Robin since he know Batman needed a Robin to keep Batman Balance. For years Batman has had a team and even a song that served to be a bigger family then the one he lost but we got none of that in the movies since it's always loner Batman after Batman and Robin from the 90's did so bad
The Batman is seriously one of the best Batman stories ever specifically because it looks at what has become of the character since the Nolan movies and says "Nah, fuck that, actually."
@@MarioUcomics I'm so interesting to how the DCU's take on Batman will shake knowing he'll have the Bat famiuly surrounding him this time. The movie is said to be about Bruce and Damian, suggesting that Dick, Jason, Tim, Barbara, and a bevvy of others should also be around by now.
I still remember that interview you did with Kahmal. Made me respect both of yall so much more. Really enjoy your video essays.
The fact that ANYONE thinks Nightcrawler’s main character is someone to aspire to scares me.
Lou Bloom is basically Patrick Bateman as a reporter, so it makes sense edgelords missing the point would worship him.
He's on his grind and working on himself or something
@@supermansdaddy7019 Wait, people worship Patrick Bateman? In what reality does that make any sense? Guy is literally everything vile rolled up into a character.
@@supermansdaddy7019 Or maybe you are missing the point, which is that the "sigma male grindset" memes that idolize him are a joke and no one actually idolize Lou Bloom or Patrick Bateman.
@@acompletespiral People don't worship Patrick Bateman. It is ironic and a joke.
Watching Star Trek TNG as a kid, is probably why my politics are left. It was inspiring, so much so that I was flabbergasted that we all aren’t pushing for that kind of future.
Very much agree. I think one of the wildest people that exist art the Conservative Star Trek fans. Like... what were you watching????
@@chelscarathey see themselves as the Captain. Absolute power over their crew and changing the fate of whole planets on mission after mission. Steve Shives breaks this down wonderfully, I might rewatch it right now.
@ you must be conservative because you’re only contribution is “everyone is wrong;no I don’t have evidence”. LOL
But seriously, what’s the appeal?
@userJohnSmith Holo Deck. Food Replicator. Literally nothing else matters. 😏😏
@userJohnSmithConservatives just love to pat themselves on the back with their “values”, but put them under the least amount of economic stress within, say, a capitalist economy that no longer favors their economic strata in society and the truth soon emerges … “conservatism” is only about the social hierarchy … that’s what the conservative wants to “conserve”. A rigid unchanging social hierarchy.
And as for all those values conservatives ascribe to themselves as the exclusive domain of “conservatives” also exist within a dedicated progressive working class Marxist-Leninist communist society too.
The more I watch FD, the more I see his cool teacher and school/community mentor vibes. It’s awesome.
You have such a nice voice dude i could listen to these all day
i think you do have the best comment section on this corner of the internet. there are nuanced takes and personal experiences and i actually learn and rethink things here?!? unheard of.
Yeah I love it down here
It's nice right? See what happens when a creator sets the right tone from jump? Relax for a bit my friend
And not EVERYTHING is turned into a quippy joke. It's sad looking at fantano's comments when the man genuinely wants to discuss important matters
@@aeoligarlic4024 yeah that comment section is too far gone. but i’ve seen him dismiss some flawed but honest opinions as ‘stupid’ bc he didn’t agree, so idk if he’s good at keeping those around.
This reeks of total narcissism. Like loving the smell of your own farts.
This is a great youtube talk, not a few hour incoherent ramble to fall asleep. Instead it's actually well structured piece that aims to solve a problem and unlike most youtubers the host can distinguish between their opinion and fact. It is well researched and reasoned. It's like watching someones masters thesis.
He has a masters, so it makes sense that this would feel like a thesis.
@@AG-iu9lvthat's completely wrong, there are more people with masters than ever but it doesn't mean you put the same effort into your career as your thesis. It's very rare for someone to manage to sustain that.
Honestly the people most affected by all this is the young girls who are near these boys, whether it be sisters, classmates or girls just trying to play video games. I think we dont talk enough about the long term effects of constant exposure to misogyny and sexual harrassment posed as jokes on these girls, especially because I've personally seen it in schools starting as young as 5
And those young girls grow up to still have to live around and with people like this. It’s everywhere and it’s exhausting. This mindset goes from the dating pool to political policy to home life to online conversations. A life surrounded by misogyny and misdirected anger and lack of reflection
Honestly the people most affected by this are the young men that ARE affected by this.
Your post has big "women are the ones who loose the most in war, they loose their husbands, their fathers, their sons" energy. Yes it's incredibly awful that that happens to young girls and how it affects them for life. But the ones being directly affected THE MOST is the boys themselves.
Just to be clear I'm trying to point out that you made a really bad choice of words presenting your idea. I'm not denying what those girls go through. Just that, in a literal sense, no, the young girls are not "the most" affected by all this.
@@inakilukac But it makes sense. The boys affected by this are the "most important part of the problem", to put it in a dumb way, but those surrounding the boys are more affected - especially if you consider that one boy with troublesome ideas can impact more than one person at a time, and more than one boy can impact the same person too. Both young boys and girls are victims of this culture, but only one of them has the active choice of being a part of it. And let's be honest, boys that don't follow the incel culture aren't as hated as the girls are, so yeah, there's that too.
This is striking.
Great video as usual FD-commenting to congratulate and boost the almighty algorithm.
"This is bad"
but also
"This is badass"
Thank you FD for that. You perfectly condensed the problem with all these kinds of films, shows, comic books ect. down to eight words. I love that.
“The smug satisfaction of being right” is enough to satisfy those who don’t have any hope or desire for anything to change. There are many forces at play there. I really appreciate your hard work to shed light and give perspective on things that we need to think about.
What about those that genuinely want to see change, and then feel smug about being right? I'm very much pro-green pro-saving the Earth and I've been trying to get people in my community to stop mowing their lawns and to plant native plants. I have to admit, it feels good when they finally wise up and tell me I was right. Is that so bad?
@@bugjamsWhat you're doing is totally different because you have a point. This guy is saying you're fucked if your point is being correct. Your point is saving the climate and being correct is just a nice thing on the way. Their point is solely to feel correct.
Unpopular opinion (possibly) - if we needed a Joker musical, it should be with Leto's Joker. His campiness would fit so well with an over-the-top musical filled with an insane choreography and a legion of backup dancers doing their best to recreate the glory of Take That's music video for "Shine"
We will never need a joker musical
@@blodiaaa6990 I don't know, given that The Joker likes to pull jokes on people and make a meaningless farce of everything, assuming in canon people still have a negative bias towards musicals in the DC Universe, I could see The Joker wanting to do one even harder just to annoy people. I'm sure he'd get a kick out of tying up Batman and trying to force him to watch some kind of Dayman-esque fever dream where the Joker puts his all into the production while making it everyone's problem.
@@blodiaaa6990If they made a Joker musical starring Mark Hamil's Joker from TAS it would be 1000% in-line with the character and everyone would love it. Don't pretend otherwise.
Oh yeah, for a moment i forgot that he's literally the vocalist of 30 seconds to mars.. it would fit his job description too 😂
4:55 was really healing for me to hear. Thank you.
"A Foy Deleloo"
I'm francophone, and have been alive for a couple decades now, and this is up there with some of the funniest attempts at French I've ever heard XD Thank you for the laugh!
(P.S. "foh-lee ah doo" would be a pretty good approximation of how you'd try this title in English)
Being forced to learn French in school for twelve goddamn years was worth it just for Foi Delalu.
tbh the deux is best approximated as "duh"
I don't speak French and can't be bothered to look it up, but does folie á duex just mean folly of two?