Can Lyn CLIMB HIS WAY BACK in this series?- Happy vs Lyn - WC3 - Grubby
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 22 ธ.ค. 2023
- Happy is ahead 2-1 in this insane series, and it looks like Lyn will be sticking to his mass Headhunters strategy. Let's see if he can find a way to deal with these Destroyers!
Can Lyn CLIMB HIS WAY BACK in this series? (Live on 19-December-2023)
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Hey, Grubby! Love the commentary on this series, thank you. Could you move the chat window from over the orc heroes so that we can see what items and abilities they have? That’s my only request, everything else is awesome ♥️
Sure thing!
@@FollowGrubby Ahhh, nice Grubby, this is why you're wholesome, because if it's a genuine request, no matter how small or even if it seems to come from even one person, you get out of your way to make them happy. The heart of a real Champion.
PS: There seems to be some space right underneath the hero icons if you shrink the chat a little more, but im sure you can puzzle some things if needed. :)
Grubby is so freaking funny and wholesome naturally. He doesnt even laugh to himself but cracking me up behind the laptop hahaahah. Great commentary i love grubby wc3 commentaries with stories in them.
I watch videos from Back To Warcraft, but I gotta say that it is much more enjoyable to listen to Grubby commentate. My new favorite way to watch Warcraft 3 replays. Way to go Grubby!
grubby. i fricking love your videos. i’ve started playing wc3 again. i was so bad when i was younger and just watching these videos and hearing your perspectives always teaches me something new. i appreciate you, you gosh darn legend.
Love your content man! Natural, funny, and get my nerdy side covered too. Im even learning english from you!
Thank you!
Hi Grubby ! Love your content and thanks for taking the time to the commentary
About the 2-Rax my thoughts are that may be in the early stages you will have the same ammount of headhunters than 1-Rax but, once you engage an UD opponet you always be behind in numbers considering the Road of Necromancy, the Dark Minions and the fast production of Ghouls.
You can notice that in the middle to finals battle were always 2 Berserkers add to the battle, and at the 4th game were the 80-90 pop battle took place at Lyn base because it was a large battle 4 new Berserkers add to the battle
As you once said, this strategy it is not a Warcraft 3 logic and it´s more a Starcraft 1 or 2 logic were the numbers rules the battles
So, yeah, the 2-Rax have little no nule change at the early stages but to the middle to late game give you the enough power to mantain in battle
Insightful casting, as always! If you had told me that double rax hh was going to be meta vs UD in 2005 - I would have rofled.
Freestyler.. what a song, loved it so much as a teenager! Still play it to this day & warcraft. I find you so relatable Grubby, even consider you a friend 😊
Blizzard kept nerfing undead targeting specifically Happy until he finally can lose sometimes.
Grubby love the commentary versus talking about random stuff ❤
Lyn forgot the healing wave in the other games too, instead using a bunch of healing scolls.
I wonder if a variant of Lyn's build would be workable that starts the upgrade to Fortress immediately after Stronghold finishes, like what Undead often does. This would be to get faster Zerkers and 3rd hero. I mean, Lyn's build does it pretty soon, but does have some delay to get other stuff.
I actually though that the reason why he has that build is not intentionally to have mass head hunters early on but to rather have a more flexible option to counter the undead's unit choice.
Like by the time the undead doesn't build a graveyard early, thats where lyn will switch to double bestiary, knowing its mass ghouls.
12:19 me xdd. I'm such a sucker for this type of info.
I think perhaps he held off on using healing wave to preserve the CD. By keeping healing wave, he could mitigate a potential nuke on a hero and guarantee his heroes stay in the fight.
If this is the rationale then that's simply a micro mistake. The TC was already invulnerable for the first several seconds and is in no danger of being focused down after the invul ended as basically all the ghouls are dead and he's far too high leveled to get nuked down in time. Far seer is way too far to get focused and also somewhat expendable after he chains twice. And SH himself has an invul so there's no risk as long as Lyn has somewhat OK reflexes.
Very nice to see Berzerker tech working on UD
I think the double barracks to just to train more headhunters faster. To keep up his early game army over faster tech.
Hey Grubby, long time viewer, fitting that category of liking to watch but don't play much, just wanted to say, as someone who's done these math equations before, they have some interesting points, and i wanted to add some clarity to the concepts you put forth in this video.
First elaborating on the Base Attack speed's interaction with items (BAS)
Firstly, It should be pointed out that between a hero who has high attack (~50) and low BAS, and a hero with low attack (~25) and high BAS, you would still be better off in most cases giving extra attack speed to the hero with more attack, as whilst the attack speed % improvement would be lower, making someone who hits hard hit more often is still going to be overall more effective, even if the effect is muted.
Secondly, if a hero with high attack speed, but low BAS (i.e. has a lot of agility), out attackspeeds a hero with high BAS, they're still going to be the better target for attack improvements, such as claws of attack and orb - BAS doesn't matter if there's no attack speed improvement
Lastly - and most importantly - The case where BAS will matter the most, is when you have available to you, an item that deals damage (orb), and a gloves of haste, and your choice is to give this to 2 heros, who have similar damage and attack speed. This is where BAS will decide who is more effective to put the item on, as the hero who got to their current attack speed through a good base, rather than a good % improvement will do more, such as the example of DR and Lich you gave. You might think "oh, it isn't that unlikely that the 2 heroes will have similar stats and attack speed", but actually, that's a common scenario due to "game balance", which tries to put heroes on similar strength parity.
The other simpler and really notable conclusion from attack speed working the way it does
- Gloves of haste will NEVER improve your attack speed% by the amount listed, it will always give less, because every hero has some agility, some notable numbers for remembering how much less effective. If you have "this much" attack speed *before* equipping gloves of haste - 50% = gloves are 66% as effective as listed, 100% = gloves are 50% as effective as listed, 200% = gloves are 33% as effective as listed.
What a banger grand final!!!
Re: attack speed. Unfortunately you cannot say the lich always benefits more than the dark ranger. To make that assessment you also need to include the damage of the attacks since the lich might be overall faster but still benefit less if the damage per hit is far inferior
I wonder if happy could add in 1-2 cloud aboms around 70 supply. A lot of their damage is still going to be heal scrolled but if he can keep them alive for the second fight it seems like they couid really pull their weight
I think Grubby made it clear at 26:31. I think the idea is that Lyn had lightning orb, and he probably will focus the lightning orb to abominations (small number). But still, massing destroyers against berserkers seem like the worst thing to do at that time. If he had 6 abominations instead, it might be a different ending.
Wondering if this build works for other race too cause it seems very effective against UD, feels like a mass marines type of build.
btw, I've seen happy's "repair" trick, actually he doesn't give a repair command to acolyte! it's unsummon button.
when NE changed the meta to immolation creep UD startet tower rushing. it could work to against this build if u scout for it...
grubby i think happy was planning his ghouls would counter the hh and even if they died his skeles would take their place
thanks for the replay sir, but why no minimap? You are a handsome man, but you know.. NVM:)
25:15. The sudden realization of the error of his ways...
Is there a reason we mainly see Orc vs Undead at these high levels? Would love to see Happy or Lyn vs a top Human or NE player...
Isn't that obvious? I would like to have a bold guess is that human main player can't get into the semi or final. XD
It was almost always NE UD. Its because these 2 players are fkn good
I thought it was just because this was the series everybody was recommending for Grubby to cast.
The hero data is covered by chat.
Let’s gooo!! always like seeing happy lose for some reason lol
Trying to analyze and theorycraft how to counter this is interesting and fun. Lyn is making Dark Ranger look useless and yet before I felt like she was the one of the main reasons why headhunters wont work. You'ld think Cryptlord or Panda would be great hero choices but because they are melee they would just get stomped and killed and without silence to control TC he would do whatever he wants. Maybe a Lich first with ghouls could keep FS in check early game because of no shop. But would that be enough because of slower creeping. Maybe fast expansion or T2 push with statue support with DK/x hero . Fun matches to see
pitlord would be insane against that
@@Chrontard Maybe Howl and scroll of protection but he still suffers from being melee and just getting poked to death the only difference is he can get coiled. The lack of dispel for Orc makes me wonder about using undead casters too.
The only reason this worked was because of Happy's bad micro. Him not baiting War Stomp with incredibly fast Ghouls, not getting Destroyer attack upgrades, focus-firing with Destroyers instead of letting the Orb of Annihilation AoE damage all of them, Frost Armor instead of Dark Ritual.
Overall, Lyn's army is horrid because of incredibly fast Ghouls and Dark Minions, Skeletal Warriors that can close the gap quickly and do alot of damage to heroes and Head Hunters, combined with Silence to prevent defensive spells together with Death Coil and Frost Nova aswell and Destroyer AoE it's easy to clear the army fast.
i feel like in dota 2 you want to be forcing out a first blood around the time you hit level 2 so waiting for power spike at level 3 is super passive.
The freestyler thing made me laugh and reminded me of my inner cringelord 😆
Grubby, does the second barracks maybe let Lyn care less about the squishiness of HH as he can remax quicker?
Awesok1: was great watching it on twitch but watched all the gameplay via youtube as i came in half way or snippets during stream. Congrates on lynn this was awesome watching on twitch. But i still think orc buffs doing work KAPPA oops spoiler 🤣
Hey guys is the Pike that have bash chance still in the game ? I haven't seen it from a while .
No its gone alrdy.
Got taken out a few patches ago
I'm one of those nerd he talked about 😂
21:32
SH silenced maybe?
your camera is big mon!
WHERE IS THE NEXT MATCH?
I dont get it why no spirit breaker to deal with the skellys?
no time or resources, I think. he built a beastiary and upgraded hh all the way
stomp nearly wipes out skeletons once L 3
Grubby explained this earlier in the series. Spirit Walker is great against ghouls, skeletons and dark minions. BUT the instant destroyers are out, walkers lose almost all their value. Spirit link becomes destroyer feed, they can't attack magic immune destroyers, and can't even escape in their ethereal form because
@@ambion19 i see so OD is a preemptive counter to SB, but SB doesnt need to use spirit link though right? Can just have one or 2 in reserve to dispel the mass skellys
@@rotyler2177 level 5 is rare though so far TC is the 3rd hero.
In a DOTA 2 early game i tend to build a basilus ring for additional mana regen on the lane, helps a lot for casting spells early game in your lane
Just pitlord, creeplord, dk with skeletons each + destro. Couple of ghouls for the meat and few fiends, banshees. It's true undead army. Debuffing -33% chance to hit and reduce DMG to enemy with pitlord. This Happy wining only because of good micro. It's a pity no good macro to watch at.
There's a good reason no one higher than 2K MMR plays this build. It's terrible and would take like 15 minutes to come online because you need all kinds of units and upgrades. Some dispell really neuters your strategy.
Dk is average
Lich Fast
DL average
CL Average
First!
wow, 1st
SPOILER ALERT
🏎️
Happy is on a serious decline now
please remove chat