Thermalright LGA1700 BCF Contact Frame Plate Weird Results Please Help!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 25 ส.ค. 2024
- #thermalright #lga1700 #contactframe #bendgate #intel13thgen
Thermalright LGA1700 BCF Contact frame plate weird results please help
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This was supposed to make things possibly cooler and prevent the socket bending, well one of those things was true!
Huge thanks to Rick H for sending this over for review
Thermalright intel 12/13th generation LGA1700 anti-bending buckle, curved pressure plate,CPU stress bending correction fixer, fully fitted and fixed without trace installation (black
About this item
[Specification] 54x70x6mm, all aluminum alloy material, main body 20g, overall 55g, with L-shaped screwdriver and TF7 2g, black
[Advanced Technology] A fixed aligner developed for the situation where the Intel 12th generation CPU will bend. All-aluminum alloy anode process, CNC-made anode sandblasting, perfectly avoiding capacitors, giving you the ultimate installation experience.
[Insulation foot pads] The same specifications as the original LOTES insulation protection foot pads are used. Multiple installations will not wear out the CPU cover.
【Easy to Install】With a L-shaped screwdriver, watch the video operation, and the installation is successful in one step.
【Supported Specifications】Intel 12th/13th Generation CPU
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Hi Mike. I have exactly the same issue with my N1 and now I seem to have a CPU issue with RAM as well. I guess I'm going back to the Intel frame.
You tightened the screws down way too much! The reason why the screws were so loose on the original bracket was because that's how tight they were supposed to be!
Contact frame is all about your CPU cooler. Most coolers do not sit firmly or evenly on the stock bracket. The Contact Frame fixes this. So with the frame those people are seeing better temps. However if your cooler does sit on the stock bracket firmly and evenly you wont notice a difference
Mike I recommend you watch the Games Nexus review on this plate. He shows you the contact pressure between the stock clamp and this plate as well as two others. When you mount the plate, turn each of the screws in an X pattern a 1/4 of a turn until you just feel tension. Then turn the screws ever so slightly another 1/8 - 1/4 turn and that should be all you need. You do not want to tighten it down with a lot of pressure. If you over tighten the screws...others have reported Boot up and Memory issues. I followed the Gamers Nexus tutorial and had no problems. Hope this helps. Sorry you are having problems with it. Cheers
cheers RIck, i did make a few adjustments off camera and tried a few different screw points and i probably need to look at this again with fresh eyes to see what the deal is or if the 13th gen socket clamp (maybe for MSI) is just a better design now? or the chips being used are slightly different in manufacture for some reason
thanks again!
@@mikesunboxing Legend !!!!!!
@@mikesunboxing No worries bud
Rick, did you mark your screws or did you eyeball it? It seems a bit daunting. Any tips? I've watched the Gamer Nexus Video and some other ones. Did you also do the reverse turn on the loose screws to "seat them"?
@@ptung88 I did as close to what GN did. The purpose is to lower the brace as even as possible if you can. When I reached the so called Hard Line (when the brace just made contact with the Motherboard}. I gave each screw an additional 1/8th turn to snug the brace to the CPU. As to not cruse the the pins on the socket. I bought the brace mainly to protect the CPU from the stock Intel Clamp which I heard could damage the CPU. Wish they would have made the CPU large and square like AMD Ryzen. Hope that helps. Cheers
The reason for the inconsistency is the BIOS firmware dynamically increasing the volts which in turn increases the wattage and heat. More volts doesn't give better performance it just gives more heat, the only reason they do it is for stability - lower voltages are more prone to crashing. They would rather you run hot and reliable than cool and unreliable, and you can fix that with the right BIOS settings.
With the Thermalright frame on the first test you got 2C cooler while using +10 watts, so in that test the Thermalright was cooling 10w of heat for free. However this assumes the BIOS was running the same voltages at the time of both tests. It probably wasn't because the last 2 tests showed no meaningful difference.
To get to the bottom of it you need to adjust your BIOS settings so that you get consistent voltages during the time of the test. And test on the same day - ambient temps inside the case may have been different the night before.
I didn't tighten mine anywhere near as much as you did. I screwed them down very gently until they bottomed out using only my finger tip and thumb on the shaft of the driver. I think I even slackened them off by ⅙ of a turn. My thermals have been far better than I ever expected.
I will give that a try when I revisit this again
Did you mark your screws like in the Gamer Nexus video ? or did you just cross pattern tighten them slowly? Did you also do the reverse turn to "seat" the screws initially?
@@ptung88 Didn't mark screws, just used the handle of the tool as a guide to how much it was turned. I cross pattern tightened about half turn at a time until seated just using finger and thumb on the shaft of the driver. Then backed off ⅙ of a turn. I figure the friction of the screws, against the tension created by the pushback of the sprung pins is enough to hold them. If you are worried they might be loose don't bother with the ⅙ back turn. While playing Microsoft simulator, I don't think I've seen my CPU go above 60°
@@51im Thanks for the info
The Thermalright frame is a bit different it doesn't float like the Thermal grizzley one the frame sits flush with the motherboard. That said you aren't supposed to torque the screws down you are supposed to stop as soon as you feel the screw bottom out and stop. If you are worried about the screw backing out then I would use a spot of blue threadlock on them (just a tiny amount). I think a better way to design this would be to use shoulder screws with springs under the heads pressing down on the frame from above.
This worked wonders for me. With the stock frame 14600k reaches 92c max cinebench overclocked to 5.9, with the contact frame, never reached 85c with a bit better but neglectable score. At stock speeds never touched 75c. I think i can push my overclock to 6! Amazing product!
I just installed one on my 14700k and im getting 10 degrees lower temps.
I have the same thing. I think it is ridiculous and almost insulting how Grizzly's cost upwards 20-40 dollars when I could get the same results after buying thermalights which was only 12 dollars.
try and watch some of their own videos around their frame, I've seen videos from Jayztwocents I think It was, explaining a bit about why there is a price difference, but one of the bigger ones, is that it is all manufactured and designed in Germany, wich means higher production prices, and their tolerances are smaller, wich also bumps up the prices a bit, its not just because they are trying to suck as much money from you as possible, there is a meaning behind it, and they said they deliberately choose to keep the production inside germany, even at the cost of a higher production price.
@@Crisping1612 I know all that already. I opted to get the thermalight one for less and it does the exact same thing. Where the product is made is irrelevant if they both do the same thing, plus I prefer the padded contacts on the top and bottom of thermalights frame. So already in that regard they were much cheaper and better in terms of design.
@@honinakecheta601 and then you just buy theat one, no one is forcing you to buy the TG's version, simply saying WHY there is a price difference, and in that regard, yes the place of production does very much affects the price of the product.
@@Crisping1612 well, I bought it. We done?
@@honinakecheta601 sure thing kiddo, you do you :)
Hi Mike, Thanks for sharing! I also have good experience with 12th gen and Asus B660 in combination with Thermalright LGA1700 BCF Contact Frame. I agree that tightening is very important and there are a lot of factors influincing the reults. I saw a drop in temp between 5 and 10 degrees with a max of 60. I use an iao cooler from Arctic (240mm) ambient 18 degrees C. Anyhow Looking forward to the next setup with your Asus and 12th gen CPU.
Thanks for sharing and hopefully if the b660 ever comes back i can use this
i use this exact same frame with my 12600k. I was having the same problem that you are having. I had watched some videos and I don't remember who it was, but the problem ended up being that I had tightened it down too far. There are tiny clicks when tightening it. you should first loosen the screw and listen for the first click and stop tightening it. Do the same and it will be at the correct height and all. Give it a try! I believe it may have been Gamer's Nexxus that had the video I ended up seeing with the Thermal Grizzly one. I went back and re tightened and it works like a dream for me.
Yep, it was GN that did a detailed instruction on how to mount it and this was my first thought when Mike said he screwed it nice and tight. If im not mistaken, GN were actually following the manufacturer's advice, not just coming up with this stuff on their own
The thermal right has no recommendations for fitting where the thermal grizzly does
That final 'pinch' on each screw was too much force. I did the same and had similar issues. Remounting with less pressure sorted the issue.
Thanks for info
Problem here is using a 13500. It's a low power chip. The difference really only becomes largely apparent on say a 13600k 12700k,13700k etc. The bad contact patch is still generally enough for these low power chips
I don't see any improvement for a stock 14600kf.
I was about to say the same... These contact frames are pretty much overkill for an i5. These were made for high-end processors which run way hotter and thus bend much easier than colder ones.
@@harley9698 noob here.... what is ihs please? About to mount my i7-13770K. Thanks
@@wolfsmane The Integrated Heat Spreader (IHS) is the metal exterior lid that makes contact with a cooler using thermal paste.
@@alehksaj6635 Thanks
Mine went down around 10 degrees lower than the stock bracket. So this absolutely helps.
doubt that
I fitted the same thermaltake frame to my 12700k. The thermal paste had more even spread and thickness across the CPU after fitting it, with an almost perfect contact pattern. I wouldn't fit an lga1700 without one.
Is it hard to mess up installing? I’m thinking of moving to intel when I build a new system end of this year
I am the same always use them
is it hard to mess up installing, arguably yes there are "sweet spots" to the installation and could be the first time or could take a few attempts, there are a lot of variables here
@@mikesunboxing ah, I hope it goes well for me when I do it lol. I’m upgrading to hopefully something like the 13900
@@sol-hb8zg just treat everything gently. I read about the lga1700 CPU bending issue before I bought mine and fitted 0.5mm washers under the original clamp mechanism to stop it from applying so much force on the CPU then when my contact frame arrived I gently tightened the screws then backed them off ⅙of a turn. There is still friction on the screws due to the spring tension of the LGA pins.
I did also lap my cooler to make it dead flat but that was done before my CPU even arrived. I didn't do the CPU that is still in stock original condition.
Thank you for the guide. Everything was made clear.
Glad it helped!
I don't understand why Intel didn't fix this problem with the 13th gen boards? This started happening with the 12th gen boards. You'd think they would want to have every advantage against AMD these days when it comes to getting the consumer to choose their products? Especially after the horrible earnings they had last year.
from my results i would say that the 13th gen boards maybe don't need this as much as 12th gen? i don't know but that seems to be what i am finding, will definitely revisit this at some point
@@mikesunboxing hi mike , im using z790p msi mobo&13600k , what's your opinion right know, 13th gen board need this contact frame? and how much it improve
@@IIII_MAD_IIII it is worth doing in my opinion to prevent bending later on
During disassembly BIOS voltage settings were reset to stock. You have go back & reset all your voltage settings in BIOS the way they were before.
This happened due to motherboard detecting CPU was removed & replaced. It thinks it is a different CPU & set settings to guarantee booting. Even though processor was never completely removed electrical contact was broken.
Given the difference in wattage your CPU was likely undervolted by .150 volts before. It is common that 13 gen core i5 processors can be undervolted easily by .100 volts.
What you got is normal. It is the bending of the CPU that will occur over time which you are avoiding. The contact frame is mostly used with the I-9 because it gets so dang hot.
i saw a 7-9 degrees temp drop with the contact frame on my 13900k. Worked pretty sweet for me
awesome glad you got a good result! Out of interest was it a brand new build or had it been in use for a while already?
@@mikesunboxing it was a brand new build. I only tested temps on the new cpu then switched to the contact frame.
The only explanation would be the CPU wasn't perfectly flush the first time and you got real lucky not bending pins the first time you installed the CPU. With the contact frame it's now 100% flush.
Interesting.
Did you check the BIOS settings in between tests? My MSI B460 (Mortar Wifi) motherboard has a setting that sets a different CPU profile depending on the option you "choose": Stock Cooler, Aftermarket Cooler or Water Cooler. And after what I've tested (not extensively mind you, couldn't be bothered with a locked CPU), although the PL1 shown in both the Aftermarket and Water cooling options make them appear to be the same, they're really not: higher power draw in the later one, with marginal gains. And now that Microsoft is enabling BIOS updates with Windows updates I honestly just question everything :D.
Also, if you're curious about more Thermalright products, my recommendation definitely goes to the Peerless Assassin 120 CPU cooler. It's really good for the price.
thanks yeah checked that setting thanks and got a review of the assasin r se 120 arb coming very very soon
Mr. Mike, I hope on your next run the bracket proves positive for you. I put mine on today, and lost 8c on temps, and system seems way more snappy than this morning before the bracket install. i did take note of the thermal paste pattern on the IHS when i pulled off my cooler still having the stock ILM, and it was a high spot in the middle, with the paste really pooling at the tabs where the bracket clamps down. interesting. For tension I let the bracket stop me with a hard stop and then no 1/8 or 1/4 turn anything after. Waiting for the follow up.
yep need to get this done again, thanks for the feedback on your setup, was it 12th gen or 13th
@@mikesunboxing thanks for your reply. Its on a gigabyte aero G z690 ddr4 board. with a 13900k. a couple of things for you to note, for the tension, let the bracket and board stop you. I miss spoke in my previous comment which i will edit. i dismounted and mounted my cooler 2 times to see the thermal paste pattern. when i took it off while having the stock ILM i noticed that my chip was bowed up in the center from north to south, leaving big pools of tim near the clamp of the ilm and the tabs on the ihs. once i mounted the bracket and pasted the cpu i fully installed the noctua d15s, then removed it i notice that the paste pattern was even across the whole chip and created a great deal more suction when dis mounting. I hope it works out this next time, because so far the bracket lives up to what others are saying. I got the bracket for the bending more than the temps as i tend to use my tech for a long time, so for me its more a preventative measure.
@@RiceNoodlestw That was my reason for buying mine also. Longevity of the system. Cheers
Am I the only one who hates the lack of pins on Intel CPUs ?
They used to have pins, and if the CPU fell into place you could feel reassured.
But today you just have to hope there's no false contact. You can still move the CPU approx. 1 mm in any direction after it's inserted between the notches. How can this not cause a false contact?
I agree totally
Pentium 4 says hi!
Manager "What do you do here?"
Tech "not much everything is working fine"
FIRED!
Manager "What do you do here?"
Tech "Umm I uhhh cReATed REvOluTiOnArY new pins!"
Pretty sure this is how all Windows updates since XP go as well.
im looking for upgrade my i5 10105f to a 12400f, in my country the frame value is almost 30% of cpu value (insane). does 12400f need that frame or only for k versions. ty
It should be fine without it, it is a lower tdp and much easier to keep cool
It's not the board that bends it's the CPU IHS. If you've already fitted the CPU with the original clamp it may have already bent the IHS. Try putting a straight edge across it and see if you can see light between the CPU and straight edge to see if it's warped. They are usually have a dip in the centre between the two clamping lugs where the clamp has pushed down so hard.
Will try that, the cpu isn’t in the pc now so easy to do
@@mikesunboxing I would love to hear back as to whether this was the case
@@WeirdTippy right just checked the 13500 and there seems to actually be a low spot towards the bottom of the CPU, very slightly higher in the middle so that might explain my results
Can you explain like i'm 5? I'm slow and trying to build PC but i don't want this to happen
@@everydaysamething This is maybe easier to advise if we can ask more questions and get direct answers, so feel free to join our Discord chat and we can go over it in more detail discord.gg/XtBTGQ6BDu
Agree to the rules by clicking the emoji and you will get access to the rest of the Discord channels
This makes sense since 13gen performance scales bad after 125~150 watts, my 13600k at stock speed draws 257 watts/w CB score at 24045 points, then I limit my package power at 150W gave me 24018 points. Tuning the power limit in these range consistently gave CB score around 24k pts.
I guess since your CPU were cooled better in the process, so it boosted for longer with a higher wattage, but the CB result didn't improve much for obvious reasons.
more wattage doesn't mean better performance. it never does.
Bro my 13600kf draw 170 watt at 5.3ghz all core, how u have 257 watt?
I did install it on my system and it lowered my temperature around 7• but i did use the Noctua thermo paste instead.
Will using this contact frame void the warranty of the cpu or motherboard?
no it won't
In many ways, I am glad I am long way from LGA 1700 and will be content w/LGA 1151 for the forseeable future.
I just mounted it with a different thermal paste (nt-h2) and the max temp dropped from over 90 to around 80 (82 max on 1 core, the average for the whole chip was under 70) on my i7 13700k overclocked to 6ghz and 4.4 ghz and on cinebench 24 I’ve increased multi core of around 40 points (I don’t remember the single before but it should be slightly higher than online benchmarks), on the other hand when it’s in idle it’s almost the same (from 30 to 27/28 degrees). So for 40€ it was absolutely worth it
great results there!
Hey Mike, do you think this would work with the new 14th gen? I am thinking yes as they still use LGA 1700
i would think so
Checking in to see what this is all about.
it is all a lot of extra fuss that shouldn't be necessary
@@mikesunboxing 100%
The thermalright frame as in video gets tightened down till screws don’t turn anymore.
It’s the thermal grizzly bracket that doesn’t and could take monkeying around to get working right
Thermalright bracket is straight forward and simple. Check was load voltage was with stock ilm and then after you seen increase in temp after. Maybe something with the voltage increased on auto for some reason in bios which causes higher wattage used thus temps.
thanks appreciate it
u need to set up a test thats equal. same clock speeds, voltage, ect. there is way to many variables with boosting. it was a poor test to do.
That makes sense but not really real world use when locking things down. And most people won’t or can’t do that and just want an improvement over the stock out of box experiences
@@mikesunboxing hi mike. Makes a lot of sense in real word use, for the specific part. If you test a product, you remove all the variables. That is the comparison. Then if it makes a difference in real life, is another story.
Intel should have thought of a better way to mount the CPU with possible less chance of damage and thermal issues to the CPU. Hope you get better results with the AM5 brace I sent you. Should at least keep the thermal paste from running down the sides of the CPU? Take care. Cheers
yeah the AM5 stopping the goo going down the sides will be a welcome addition, still need to get the 600 series board for intel and see if the difference is more pronounced with 600 over 700
it came down to $, They already have better solutions for server cpus
@@jeremytine That they do. Still if you already have it...use it for the LGA1700 also. It always comes down to money. Cheers
Yeah ironically this is much safer, the original seems you sre crushing the cpu with infinite force
You got more performance on the tests with the frame! 😁👍🤣
Mike's Investigation is Worthy of a Support comment. Like & a share 🙂
Bristol Mike, P.I. !! This is most worthy of being Supported.
I built a new rig last month (12400F) and used the more expensive Thermal Grizzly one. Since it 'floats' on the CPU without resting on the board like the Thermalright, it was a little nerve-wracking tightening it without over-tightening it but it seems to be working as intended. I built another rig using a Gigabyte B760i this week and cheaped out and used this frame instead. Machine turned on but immediately shuts off. Probably something I've done and not the CPU frame but I've ordered an mATX board, CPU and case to redo it and ordered another Thermal Grizzly frame as well.
I tightened the Thermalright one tightly, like you showed, figuring since it actually rests on the board that should be fine; strange thing is that the ILM didn't seem to be screwed in very tightly at all. The TG instructions say to be careful not to over-tighten theirs, as this can break the traces by smushing the layers. I think the problem is that I somehow mangled the Aeorus ITX board when installing it in the case, either that or overtightening the frame.
I also bought a cheap test bench so I can test it before installing in the case. I might try the ITX CPU to see if it works to determine if it's that or the ITX board that's the problem before op[ening the replacement CPU.
hey sorry to bother so late. any follow up news? i am trying to decide between thermal grizzly or the thermalright but i dont know if the extra price is worth it. 13700k.
get this one save money
I hope you got the grizzly!@@apiestink
@@mikesunboxing Why are you recommending one over the other? You have not even gotten any valuable results. And some are saying that the Grizzly rests on the cpu and not contact with board, this may help with some air flow, and less chance of over tightening. But you suggesting one over other is mind boggling.
Good day, mate. After I installed mine, I used one of the thermal pads instead of paste. My temperature dropped by 18 degrees Fahrenheit. As you undoubtedly noticed, I'm an American PC Gamer. My CORSAIR iCUE NEXUS is set for Fahrenheit to easily relate to my PC's temperatures.
that is very impressive
Sorry not used intel albeit i do recall there were isdues with intrl cpus hence why these plates were available. Why wud reverting back to stock give diff results over 24hours🤔 With all the grief you had with Asus B660 and AM5 usbs think i will stick with AM4 lol Thanks for sharing Mike and Kath🐈👍
Yeah am4 is the much safer and user friendly way for now
I’m with everyone else here, while I’m using amd it it crucial to stop tightening as soon as you feel pressure. This is one of the reasons they specify to tighten each screw 1/4 turn at a time. That way you don’t over tighten. Also, you should like you know what you’re doing but did you disconnect the power supply completely? The amount of movement you allowed from the chip between bracket switching could have caused a power spike damaging the chip. Just my thoughts, hope they help.
Great video ! Its a good warning to those who are embarking on the LGA1700 boards and looking at this kind of thing.
Very true!
They came out by grizzly, now there is a couple of more brands, they do work and help avoid bent pins, intel's bracket is poor and out of date. I have them fitted on my i9 and i7 13th gen pc's and recommend them
Nice one Rick H !!! 🙂
you guys are awesome
People talk about thermal improvement a lot with this retrofit, but improvement of actual CONTACT between CPU and MOBO must have "unknown" benefits, not to mention the prevention of warping. What really makes me wonder is why this isn't standard fair with all MOBOs out of the box (!)...at least for LGA1700...
I would think the issue is the testing method. The CPU temperature needs to be measured using a task that is not dynamic. Cinabench is going to task the CPU in a changing environment. You need a task that is going to be consistent in the usage of the CPU like a game or task. Then look at the differences.
there is that, but also the 700 series motherboards have mostly learned from the mistakes of the ILM on them and seem to flex a lot less, making these brackets pretty much redundant, at least on decent quality boards
I know this video is a year old but I do have a question, should you put a very small amount of thermal paste on the outer edge of the CPU aluminum to help transfer the heat to the The Thermarlight plate.
no, the hotspot for the CPU is lower centre, the sides are pretty cool
Okay, thank you..
The frame will do no good on an already bent cpu. You need to use the frame on a new cpu. That is why your results are bad.
the CPU and board are brand new, only a week or so old if that.
Re: your comment (ca. 4:25-) about the ILM's backplate being sort of welded on to the mobo, so requiring no worry about its falling off, I beg to differ. Mine fell off as soon as I removed the ILM, and keeping it in place was the single hardest aspect of installing the BCF.
what motherboard is that?
@@mikesunboxing Mike, the mobo is an Asrock B760M Pro RS_D4 with the Intel i7 12700 (w/ built-in graphics) and no additional GPU. I didn't do any deliberate testing before/after the installation, but added it, as you noted, for the low-cost peace of mind.
Thank you very much 😊 👍
You're welcome 😊
Mounted this on i7 14700k combined with an Arctic Liquid Freezer II 240 and Msi PRO B760p. The heat difference is minus 2-3 degrees. For example in Myth of Empires i hit almost 100 degrees during loading and the ambient temperature is 20 degrees
When was the contact frame bought? I tried to get one as soon as they were released but was told I had to wait a few days before my seller could send me one. There was a very early batch that had problems and was recalled from the vendors. Some had probably already been sold or vendors just didn't return them.
not sure it was sent in by Rick one of the viewers so can't pin point it completely
Hi Mike and Kath.Gamers Nexus did a deep dive on the Thermal Grizzly plate.there plate is marked with lines around the bolts around six lines and was tightened one line at a time going corner to corner that my make a difference on performance.
Yes I did watch that video due to the manufacturer tolerances the grizzly needs a bit more care and attention and tweaking to get it just right.
With the same CPU it's not pulling more than 134w and still have 20000 points in r23 benchmark but I'm wondering why your CPU is pulling that much of a power(hence more heat) before and after the contact frame...
probably a weird bios setting somewhere
EDIT: Forgot to mention I have done no OCing or anything. The only changes in the BIOS I did were a little more aggressive fan curve for the case fans and turning on the XMP profile for my RAM 4800 to 6000.
I recently got a 14700K and I'm using the Deepcool LT720 on an MSI Z790 Gaming Pro Wifi board. When idle it usually sits around 25-30 C. However, when doing Cinebench 23, it gets up to about 90C after 5 minutes then very slowly rises a couple more C before the end of the 10 minute cycle. I also tried Prime95 and it straight up got into dangerous territory (100C) on that within a minute or 2. I was very surprised and had to kill P95 really quick because I was afraid of damaging something. The Deepcool fan speeds showed max on the pump, as it has been from the start, and the fans getting up to 2277 or so. I also tried just a normal video encode in Handbrake and it got up to high 80s then around 90 as well. The LT720 is mounted top side with fans as exhaust and all the case fans (2 bottom intake, 3 front intake, one back exhaust) are set to a reasonably aggressive fan curve so the air flow seems pretty good.
Would you recommend getting one of these plates for this or some other advice to lower the temps? I don't know much about contact plates, underclocking, etc. but I'm kind of afraid for the longevity of my processor with these numbers and I feel as though I should do something.
undervolting is the answer, these cpus are designed to hit these insane temps unless restricted
Hi mike, any good result again using the contact frame with 13500+b760 tomahawk. cuz i have the same proce+mobo combo and planning to buy the same contact frame. i hope you got better temps this time
still using it now with 13900k and idles around 30c and maxes out high 70s with 360 aio and stops the thermal paste going everywhere, so i would use one for that reason anyway
i have used the exact same contact frame with my 13500 too. got weird instabilities and crashes. Now i uninstalled it and used the original bracket and no problems at all.
seems to be a tension thing, but it shouldn't have any flex to it really being a solid metal lump
Everyone keeps complaining about your torque on the screws. Well when i install the motherboard in a case i crank the mounting screws all down snug. The lga bracket sits on the board where the screws are so what's the difference? I did mine on a 14900k and i snugged them just with my fingers. I think these brackets are machined different from the factory and some are a couple thousandths of an inch off, causing more or less pressure on the cpu pins. I do feel like it was pressing too hard on the cpu before the screws even stopped. I had weird results too, on only a week old computer build, where i think the frequency dropped in the stress test. Ive also had just a couple weird crashes, but could be related to driver bugs since all parts are new. I saw no temp improvement. I bought this cuz the 14900k just barely hits 100c after a while.
thanks i am glad you see what i mean with this
I run a 13900k, and just got this contact frame.. but I went Balls to the wall for my thermal paste and got some Thermal Grizzly. I ended up scoring higher. One thing I can think of though, is you might get a higher temp when you put fresh paste.. You might get better thermals at time goes on. And one of the things the contact frame does is stop is from Bowing!! It's even pressure on the cpu rather then juston those 2 contact points.. At this point in the game, intel and AMD need to rethink the mounting, and make it 4 points of contact. Or adopt something like the contact frame.. It wouldn't be hard to make something that clamps all around the cpu. As I believe AMD did that with the threadripper cpu's
Those two small tabs on either side of the Intel cpu's are still the only place the new bracket is putting pressure on. AM5 has tabs all the way around their cpu's.
Wow, I was thinking about using one of these in my next build, but I'm not so sure now. After you reset to the original configuration, and the numbers stayed high?? That will make you scratch your head. Maybe the Thermalright Frame needed to be tighter? I'll be curious to see what you discover.
Seems after some research and trying other methods the best way to lower temps is to undervolt and set power limits the temps are much better and uses less power with better performance
@@mikesunboxingis it difficult to undervolt a cpu ? I'm curious about this and wym by setting a power limit ? My i5 12400f already has a power limit set on
there is some news about intel blocking undervolt for intel cpus. the undervolt you made might have been undone. that might explain the increase in power draw.
for the record I managed to Undervolt my 13500 by -0.160v offset and runs cinebench r23 at 150w with 21000 score. cpuz bench at 112W and 8660 score.
nice one, and thanks for the info
I'm using a 13900KS on my Asus Z690-A D4 motherboard, the Silicon Potential is 112 and comes with 1.62V Core VIDs to hit single core 6.4G duo core 6.2G quad core 6.1G, and all core 5.9G (E cores all core is around 4.6-4.7G). Cooled by an Asus 360mm AIO, the CPU with contact frame and Coolermaster CryoFuze Nano thermal paste in my daily usage normally draws 290-350W from idle to gaming, and constantly stays around 45-98C respectively. I think it definitely helped, when I used to use a 12100 before my upgrade to 13900KS, even when drawing 105W I'd reach 90C with it.
for 600 series boards i think it makes a much more noticeable difference as the clamps aren't as stiff
@@mikesunboxing So real, and also i feel like more recent boards may have this issue addressed. I recently impulsively built a new system using an MSI Z690 Force WiFi and a 12900K when they are on dirt cheap combo sale to make a media PC, and even with an Asus 240 AIO, all core fixed 5.1G @1.349V with 290W cap, I never surpassed 80C in daily usage unless during benchmarks. This is even without the bracket. When I checked with CPU-Z it says the motherboard is a 2.0 rev. one, so the board makers must have done some homework in between.
Assuming all settings were the same, the contact frame is going to give you anywhere from 0-10c less temp. It’s possible your stock retention bracket is already providing a level surface for your heatsink and that’s why there is zero improvement. People get reductions in temp only if their stock retention frame is causing the cpu to bend/warp and make it no longer a flush surface for your heatsink. I would think most retention brackets would cause this, but it’s certainly possibly to get a hold of one that doesn’t, at least initially. After you add in heating and cooling cycles from normal pc use plus time, you may then experience further bending.
help me i want to buy i9 13k with z690 msi ace with EK Nucleus AIO CR360 do i need contact frame for this kinda build im new pc building
@@syrex471 yes, you will want to purchase a contact frame and I highly recommend the Thermalright LGA1700 Contact Frame. I just installed mine the other day and it’s much easier to screw down without over tightening and putting too much pressure, like you can with the Thermal Grizzly 12/13th gen contact frame. Just remember to save your torx screws from the stock retention bracket when you remove it so you can install the contact frame and also keep your cpu in the socket so that you don’t drop something into the socket and damage pins.
@@syrex471 also, I would get a Z790 motherboard instead of a z690, the z790 supports higher speed ddr5 memory than the z690. I personally would get an Asus z790 motherboard. Second choice would be MSI.
Thanks for advice but I have rtx 3090 and ddr5 6400 unbuffed even if get 8000mhz ddr5 I will get dimishing returns and 3x the price this thing the best can only utilise on rtx4090
To all who know better, is it possible to damage the socket pins if overtightening? Thanks
possible but unlikley. you are more likely to bend the pins away from the intended pad target on the cpu and cause processing errors or crashing or no boot
@@mikesunboxing Thanks. I did pretty much like you, I tighented them when the screws were just about to stop but didn't forced past it, I just didn't wanted to leave them loose. I have not tested it yet
Weird. I could understand the higher temps if there was a contact problem but not the extra wattage?? However I have seen funny VRM/wattage problems after changing the CPU fan while in the case. There's not as much support between the mounting posts as if the board is flat on a desk and that flex can maybe crack a tracking.
Thnaks!
Only thing I can think is the room your testing in now is hotter than the room you took the original temps in...
Same room and pc in the same position maybe a couple of degrees different in room temp at the most, temps are usually quite stable
hello mike : there are some tips , N1 you have to tighten the contact frame in a cross pattern X like 1-4-2-3 or 1-4-3-2 and 13thgen cpus run hotter and ar more power hungry. N2 I recommend using the arctic mx 6. N3 check the ihs, it may be bent or concave. N4 check the bios setting (some bios have water cooling mode , it may fluctuate the wattage), check the cpu lite load. N5 do not expect an improvement less than -10c ( thing mod only inprove the temps -5c/-10c) no mater the previouve results . I wish you the best of luck , be well.
thank you sir
@@mikesunboxing You wellcome .
If you have any more doubts about the contactframe, you can watch the video on my channel, I'm already on my 12th application of the contact frame in 2 months, I'm from Portugal and as we have a warmer climate and some customers started asking me to put contacframes on new builds, i plan to buy some Torque screwdriver and i will find the torque contact frame for sure.
As you may already know the best video so far is gamernexus on the matter. Btw just subscibe to you chanel.
Love you video on the Thermalright Assassin X ,a perfect application of the coller.👏
Greetings from portugal
Be well .
@@fexergametech Thank you! And welcome to the Channel 🙂
this is correct.
best pattern is X cross tighten
Literally using a cross pattern while securing damn near anything is common sense.
Now a year later how did you end up solving this issue?
was just a matter of finding the right tension on the frame, and because the bend on the CPU can be different for each cpu it takes a bit of work
@@mikesunboxing Thank you
if you did less than several minutes of cinebench then your results might have been heavily influenced by the state your computer was at just before the test. Try this again with the standard 10minute cinebench run to get more realistic numbers
Any follow up video for this?
i have been using them on and off and it seems unless you are using a cheaper more flexible motherboard this doesn't seem to make a lot of difference, although cleanup is a lot easier
@@mikesunboxing oh ok thanks. Because i have z690 e. Just using stock bracket and just xmp 1 enabled my temps are in 55 to 65 when gaming. So i guess i dont need it. Do you have video tutorial on how to OC my 12700k? I tried the ai overclocking but some game crash on 5.2 ghz at ai overclocking, i want to do it manually, just to make it 5ghz i just dont know how.
@@Tylenol888 head over to the discord chat and someone will help you
@@mikesunboxing ok thanks.
This is what I experienced.
When I used the Thermalrigh LGA 1700 Contact Frame my A1 Ram Slot is not working.
But When I put back the Intel LGA1700 Contact Frame my A1 Ram Slot is working as fine.
yes that seems to be quite common
@@mikesunboxing Oh I see, I wanted to use all of my RAM Slot.
So I would put back the intel default lga1700 contact frame.
I am experiencing no issues. My current setup is core i5 13500 MSI Z690 tomahawk Wi-Fi ddr4 and I am getting around 50 degree Celsius while gaming and in cinebench r23(10min stress test) am getting 67 degree Celsius peak temperatures using deepcool LE520 where as on my my previous setup I had B660 Aorus Pro AX and I was getting the same temperatures in cinebench but less temperatures while gaming due to difference bios settings. MSI fan curve is quiet as compared to Aorus. I think I don't need to get this contact frame.
if i had to guess, you tightened the bolt totally before doing the others, so its uneven now. As far as I understand it, you would snug the corners, then tighten a bit then a bit more till its tight. It may be that one contact is just a bit more squished than the others?
They should design one with shoulder bolts with springs under the heads that press down from above. That way pressure would be from the springs and not screw tension.
@@atomicskull6405 the whole process was nerve racking. I was going to chicken out and return it... But then I realized that my heat sink also has screws just like this one. And it would be dumb not to install it. So I did. Basically turn each one a quarter turn till snug, then a quarter turn more and that's it. Clean cpu, cooler, add the goo. Then carefully tighten the cooler. I used my fingertips on a drive till it was snug and couldn't turn more with the force of finger tips. Then crossed my fingers... My last coolers all had that easy to use snap design. That would have made things a lot more confident feeling.
@@mikesavad From what I have read about the thermalright frame you are supposed to turn the screws until they stop and no more than that not cinch them down. I personally would put a bit of threadlock on the last couple threads as a precaution against them backing out.
The coolers I've seen that use screws all have shoulder bolts with springs on them. It's the springs that apply pressure not the screws so how tight they are has no affect on cooler pressure against the CPU. Al long as the shoulder bolts are bottomed out the springs all apply equal pressure.
Did u fixed it?
yes you just need to be really careful with the mounting pressure
Hello Mike. I was investigating about this matter yersterday and I got mine today. What I can tell about your particular case is that you’ve been very careless installing it… I was sweating while whatching you install it. My theory is that you installed it with uneven pressure or too much pressure and that damaged some pins or perhaps the circuits tracks that communicate to the cpu. Steve from GN said that if you do something wrong you should experience memory or voltage problems, thats why you got same results when returning to stock ilm. In my case i’ve been very careful during installation and got same temperatures but with higher scores on all the benchmarks. My conclusion is that pin contact improved a bit and the temperatures remain the same because my 13400f is not hot at all and it was just fine before. Also, my board is an asus b760.
Btw. Next time dont do this with the mobo mounted on the case… remove it and do it on the table, hold the backplate at start… we are talking about very low tolerances here, so I find that removing the mobo from the case its very important to this matter. When I got the contact frame attached to the mobo and processor I used a level to check if they were perfectly flat on X and Y axis. Just my two cents
my whole point is that the instructions contain zero information on torque or how tight to do it. In Steves video Mike even says keep going until a hard stop
@@mikesunboxing I didn’t go that far because when I removed stock ilm I noticed that it wasnt that tight at all. So I just tightened them enough to feel some resistance and both backplate and contact frame were perfectly seated with no play. And yes, the instructions sucks. Why don’t you contact thermaltight? Maybe they listen to you and make an installation video…
It's a sketchy install but it worked for me i believe, ill have to look closer at Cinebench. I put this in my 13700k/4080 build on a carbon z690 and my liquid stays at 30c while gaming at 144fps for hours. 30k Cinebench score, Can't beat the price either. This is after a week of gaming so I have yet to see long term.
I have my thermalright coming in tomorrow, can you give me a concise answer to how far you tightened, and what order you tightened each screw in?
@@pogchungus It doesn't matter where you start just tighten all 4 down equally with finger tightness, then gave it a super light torque corner to corner. Just remember to alternate from corner to corner like when putting on a car tire and not in a circle. Double check all the bolts a 2nd time and remember it doesn't take much pressure.
I have one but not going to void the mobo so I am using a 12600 just fine will wait for 14th gen as 13th obviously needs them to look into it further.
Mine can’t get nice and tight for me 😢 idk what wrong
This is maybe easier to fix or at least advise if we can ask more questions and get direct answers, so feel free to join our Discord chat and we can go over it in more detail discord.gg/XtBTGQ6BDu
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Reduced my temps by 6-7°c so works great tbh. I know many others who swear by it.
is yours 12th gen or 13th? seems the difference is more with 12th gen or slightly cheaper motherboards with less dense layers
was it a new build or you already used the cpu for some time before installing the contact frame? I just received mine but I have already been using mine without a frame for about a year now
following your explanation very carefully, it seems that ONLY the first install (with the intel clamp) was different; all the rest reproduced results, so i would see the difference there. COULD be, that this first install bent everything just "right" and worked best until you removed and replaced it. what this doesn´t explain to me is the power increase, but maybe you check your bios for intermediate changes, since it might have "learned" different (memory) specs after the cpu reinstallation.
only thing I can say is that you screwed down that contact frame SUUUUUPER tight.
Every instructional video I watched said to screw it down with the same force the factory screws were screwed in. and mine were feather tight.... as in It was basically loose. and that's how I tightened it down. I could see your fingers straining when you tightened those down... especially how you tightened the first one down to the max in one go without going screw by screw getting slightly tighter each round.
my point is that they don't include any instructions that tell you what to do, yes there are opinion pieces online, but nothing in writing from the actual manufacturer, just some basic ikea like drawings
@@mikesunboxing I have this, and I agree the instructions could be better, but I also think you cranked it down way too much. Generally, recommendations are 90 degree turns in a cross pattern until you feel resistance, then 45 degree turns until **JUST** tight. You don't want to tighten down more than what the original bracket had. Hope this helps.
I can use that contact frame with fan air cooling normal ? Or only with water cooling it's worked?
Fine for air or water cooling
Seems like your cooler is not really build for 13th gen, i use a Noctua NH-U12A chromax black (has more pipes to transport heat) on my 13700k and its fine, no contact frame
I have a Dell XPS 8950. Only one side of the cabinet comes off, so I can not access the back of the motherboard. Is the back portion of the ILM frame attached to the motherboard or will it drop when I remove the 4 screws of the ILM?
it is attached so you shouldn't have too much trouble
It MAY be attached. In my case it wasn't, and immediately fell off.
Hello, i have had this issue too, i have an i5 13600K on an MSI Mag Z790 Tomahawk DDR5 mother board. Well apparently MSI thinks it's ok, to push as much power as possible into the CPU, even if the 13th series i5, my i5, the 13600k has a max TDB of 181W. First cinebench score pushed it at 225W and my Noctua NH-D15S With Dual Fans, managed to keep it around 89-91 degrees Celsius. The issue was, that when i first set it up, MSI BIOS asked me what kind of cooler i have, and i answered AIR TOWER. This turned on the MSI [i don't care about Intel's specs mode] and pushed it over board. So i went back to bios, and selected STOCK COOLER and between brackets i've seen 181 W. Reran the cinebench test and my cpu didn't go above 76 degrees. I will repaste it when i get to do it's cable management with the Noctua NH-2 Paste and i expect it will drop by maybe 1 degree if a mirracle happens 2. Obviously didn't use a contact frame, voids warranty, i think.
stock cooler setting is a blessing
Hi Mike, not judging or criticizing, but I was wondering why you didn't do the "reverse turns" on the loose screws to "seat" the screws properly.... and you seemed to tighten the screws in a cross fashion almost nonchalantly. Does it really matter? Some people are stressing super hard about the technique involved in, installing this contact frame.
yeah the mounting of the thermal grizzly one has made a lot of people consider the mounting pressure issue. In theory the thermalright has been machined to be tightened down to the hard stop, so this should in theory mean that the uneven mounting is avoided.
It could also be that after 600 series boards had so many problems the 700 series are now made stronger to not bend and really not need the mounting frame
@@mikesunboxing well I’m running with an ASUS z690 D4. So I’m wondering if it will be necessary?
And while I haven’t mounted or turned on my pc yet, I have already assembled the cpu, mobo, and air cooler. So, has the damage been done? Is there any point to undo what I’ve done and apply the bracket?
@@ptung88 from what i am seeing the 600 series boards appear to be effected more than 700 series, so i would probably recommend it for 600 series boards, 700 series for me the jury is still out on that
@@mikesunboxing
But if it’s already been bent, does the contact frame help “straighten” it out for better contact or what?
Or should I leave it as is ?
@@ptung88 i just re installed mine and noticed that there is a definite either dip or raised section in the centre so hopefully now after a while the more even mounting might level things out, i would install one ASAP for all LGA CPUs regardless of board just to be safe in the long run
Do you have more information about what happened? I have a 13600k and I was thinking of mounting this kit. I love your videos! greetings
seems it is because the CPU and board are new and also 13th gen not 12th so not as badly effected
Your wattage increased with the contact plate installed. This increase temps.
and hopefully performance
You tightened the screws too much, you are supposed to go 1/4 turn in a cross pattern till the screw feels tight then stop, if you tighten too much then the cooler won't do correct contact with the CPU and also you could bend the pins, the fact that you put the stock retention back and still have bad temps shows you are over tightening the screws.
That is not mentioned in any documentation that the frame is supplied with, so just following the instructions provided as many potential buyers will do
@@mikesunboxing With this particular contact frame that shouldn't be an issue because unlike the grizzly version it has two pressure points on the top and bottom. So the amount you tightened it wouldn't have made a problem
@@honinakecheta601 yes i just rewatched my install and the one steve / mike did and they also screwed down to the hard wall of resistance as i did, i also depth checked my CPU and there actually seems to be a very slight high spot in the middle which would seem to counter act the pressure from the stock and aftermarket ILMs
What are these 3 notches (holes) inside on your version of the frame for? I do not have them.
i think it is to stop it hitting the screws or fixings on the mounting
What’s the difference in the external design between the old and new?
the old one says 12th gen, newer version says LGA1700
@@mikesunboxing noticed it has three indents on the inner edge now too 😊
I just got a brand new 14700K and got the frame but I'm still not sure if I want to install it.
What would you recommend I do for that cpu considering I'm not planning any OC.
I'm mainly worried about the bending part and how it might overheat later and that bracket will not be useful at that point.
Thanks
if you have it, i would install it especially if it is a 600 series motherboard
@@mikesunboxing Thanks for responding, it's actually a Z790 motherboard, but I already installed it, it was super simple.
Unfortunately I can't report the results yet as I got a cooler that doesn't fit my case (Arctic Freezer II 280mm with Corsair 5000D, not enough room for top mounting), so I'll only know when I sort out the cooler issue.
I'm running 13700k with the contact frame. mine drops temps by about 3-5 degrees. I have discovered that if I ran the cpu before the contact frame using the intel stock bracket I did have some issues. but if I used it without using the intel bracket first I saw more positive results.
that makes a lot of sense
thank god they removed the awful 'Intel 12th' and swapped it to LGA 1700.
yeah that looked pretty naff
If it was AMD I could understand the baffling result.🤣
Thermalright also makes one of these CPU contact brackets for AM5 CPUs. I think they're a really handy thing to have (provided they're installed properly; they should come with better instructions, really). I found it at Amazon and saved it in my cart for any future AMD build that I might endeavor to undertake. 🤔
there is my next video then :-) thermalright AM5 the metal strikes back
first have to say those pastes are junk..you can argue all you want about paste dont matter but use thermal grizzly and ill bet temps go down,,,now the tests after applying the contact plate were better also running hotter but pay attention to that power draw then look at your clock speeds ill bet its "turboing" much faster than before hence the increased score so yeah more power more heat...
good points james
I heard it was more needed for i7 and i9
the higher core counts will make the issue more evident
Have you done the update video yet?
sort of, more to come
Good informative review. If they really lowered temps then wouldn't high end motherboard manufacturers include these from the factory?
also i think the extra metal mass surrounding the cpu actually might slow down the dispertion of heat?
seems that some boards need it more than others so i am interested to test out an older b660 board when i can
Right bro that may be the reason because if you see the original setup that has a very large area uncovered so the heat dissipate easily ..
And do the processor really bending i have installed core i5 12400f with msi b660 wifi ddr5 mobo
And my temp max under full load is only 64 degree.. i run the benchmarking for 1 hour and the max temp is 64 in room temp 27 degree ..
So i believe not to tamper the setup thats why even i had the bend correction frame i didnt install it
Also i believe the pressure of the cpu cooler with the processor preventing the ihs from bending ..
You should really revisit and redo the entire test. I think you really screw in a bit hard, but it could be something else. Frankly, I'm surprised it even boot or without any memory slot loss.
you cant overtighten it, it is solid metal screwing into more solid metal. I think what you are trying to say is that the frame is not perfectly machined and i need to loosen the screws to allow for imperfections.
this is same problem I had with 2 contact frame I'm worried now should I install them or use Intel contact?
Did you found any fix?
i took it off and re tightened it slightly less and it works as it should
@@mikesunboxing ok I'll try it
@@mikesunboxingis your wattage back down to normal now?? After less torque on the screws? How about temp? I have a 14900k on all new pc build so i only ran 1 test before installing the contact frame. But it seems the cpu frequency is lower. And no temp improvement. Still will hit 100c