How fast can your hotend print?

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  • เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 มี.ค. 2020
  • How fast can you print with you hotend? Find out how you can benchmark your current setup and find out if you need to increase printing temperatures when using a hardened steel nozzle!
    Website article: cnckitchen.com/blog/flow-rate-...
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ความคิดเห็น • 319

  • @CNCKitchen
    @CNCKitchen  4 ปีที่แล้ว +41

    Don't forget to share this video on Facebook, Reddit, Twitter and other social media!

    • @Truninn
      @Truninn 4 ปีที่แล้ว +2

      Dear, Stephan, there is a mistake in calculations. Check the first table, the flow rate [2.9, 3.6, 4.8] corresponds to speed of 60mm/sec not to 50mm/sec. And the flow rate 14.4 to speed 120mm/sec, not to 100mm/sec

    • @jubileeYAVEL
      @jubileeYAVEL 3 ปีที่แล้ว

      literally within the first five seconds of the vidio I was thinking about Destin's vidio on it 😃

    • @benikum-5169
      @benikum-5169 3 ปีที่แล้ว

      Warum machst du keinen deutschen kanal ?

    • @devinjason6841
      @devinjason6841 2 ปีที่แล้ว

      i guess im asking randomly but does anyone know a way to get back into an Instagram account..?
      I stupidly forgot the account password. I love any tricks you can offer me

    • @fail_fast
      @fail_fast 2 ปีที่แล้ว

      Hi Stefan, can you please test a copper vs brass nozzle? I'm curious to know if the ~3x specific heat capacity of brass results in better heat transfer compared to the 3x thermal conductivity of copper compared to brass. I'm wondering if the increase in thermal density of the brass will bottle necked by it's conductivity across the threaded interface, or vice versa for copper....Thanks! Keep up the great videos!

  • @rikilshah
    @rikilshah 4 ปีที่แล้ว +313

    If someone asks you "What you do for living?", Don't tell you are merely a youtuber. You are a full blown analyst/researcher! I learn a lot from your videos.

    • @michaels3003
      @michaels3003 4 ปีที่แล้ว +25

      He is an engineer, foremost.

    • @101fng
      @101fng 3 ปีที่แล้ว +2

      Scientific method on full display.

    • @Joey-Jdi
      @Joey-Jdi 2 ปีที่แล้ว +5

      It’s simply called engineering my guy.

  • @kevfquinn
    @kevfquinn 4 ปีที่แล้ว +47

    Something I learned quite early on is that when calibrating E-steps, the speed of extrusion made a huge difference. It's easy to completely mis-calibrate E-steps by using too high a extrusion speed!

    • @CNCKitchen
      @CNCKitchen  4 ปีที่แล้ว +3

      Very true!

    • @liebherk
      @liebherk 4 ปีที่แล้ว +5

      You can remove it from the equation entirely, depending on your printer. For example on the Ender 3, you can just disconnect the Bowden tube from the extruder so it just pushes the filament into air.

    • @NICKLASFARFAR
      @NICKLASFARFAR 4 ปีที่แล้ว +7

      @@liebherk Yes, but then you will ALWAYS have underextrusion with a bowden tube attached, as the tube will always add underextrusion, never reduce it. :)

    • @havenview
      @havenview 4 ปีที่แล้ว +9

      @@liebherk remove it entirely up until the moment you print anything !!! What's the point in that?
      This whole video has demonstrated that you need to evaluate with operating conditions.
      Do your esteps under load, at working temperature and working feedrates or risk getting your volumetrics screwed by false conditions

  • @parrottm76262
    @parrottm76262 4 ปีที่แล้ว +5

    This was very interesting. I have been curious about steel nozzles vs brass for a while. I had not thought that such a temperature increase would affect the overall product so much, but now, it all makes a lot of sense. Lots of great information here.

  • @zoppp621
    @zoppp621 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Your videos are probably my favorite out of all the 3d printer makers. I really like how methodical you are with your testing.

  • @me3dnone107
    @me3dnone107 4 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    Thank you for that test! Especially that the steel nozzle performs nearly the same as the brass nozzle was a highly appreciated insight.

  • @vehasmaa
    @vehasmaa 4 ปีที่แล้ว +6

    Love the scientific approach to question.

  • @TheRoboticXstreamer
    @TheRoboticXstreamer 4 ปีที่แล้ว +30

    Such an amazing channel . Surely helped me a lot . Thanks you for all the effort put in to make such an amazing video !!!

  • @TaylorSchumacher255
    @TaylorSchumacher255 3 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    I just got a 3D printer. Thank you for all this amazing videos to learn from. Happy printing!

  • @johnnyricoMC
    @johnnyricoMC 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Thanks for that very thorough vid Stefan. You removed any worries I had about using the Nozzle-X, so I installed one this evening and am currently going through a few test prints to ensure my Z calibration is once more dialed in just right.

  • @MrJules0227
    @MrJules0227 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    I love your easy to follow style on pretty complicated topics. Thank you!

  • @geomagicien9085
    @geomagicien9085 4 ปีที่แล้ว +4

    You have just motivated me to start playing with prusalicer autospeed again to get an even flow pressure

  • @Nifty-Stuff
    @Nifty-Stuff 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    BRILLIANT! I'm terribly impatient and changed to a 0.6 mm nozzle on my CR-10 and increased my temps for this exact reason. I love seeing these really well-thought-out tests and the specific results! I'm thinking about running my own tests to see how far I can push things without too much degradation in print quality. Keep up the great work!

  • @SkydivingKiwi
    @SkydivingKiwi 4 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    Awesome video, Stefan! Love the sharp video, low f/stop shots.

  • @eclsnowman
    @eclsnowman 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    I moved to Steel nozzles years ago, never looked back. Glad to hear the science backs my choice. Great video as always.

  • @jackytigra
    @jackytigra 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Great video!
    I have followed your guide on upgrading to E3D Titan Aero on my CR10.
    I haven't run in to any temp problems yet. I don't try to print as fast as possible but more reliable.
    Looking forward to your nozzle abrasion test.

  • @HobbyHoarder
    @HobbyHoarder 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Great stuff like always Stefan!

  • @StraveTube
    @StraveTube 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Really didn't expect a SmarterEveryDay reference in a CNC Kitchen video - nice callback!

  • @BigBlack81
    @BigBlack81 4 ปีที่แล้ว +11

    Quality content, Stefan. Don't have a printer but want to buy one after printing some of your designs at the library. And holy goodness, do I love these videos that get me thinking about what I want to buy BEFORE I put down money on a system. This is the type of content that NEVER goes out of style. Keep making it.

    • @CNCKitchen
      @CNCKitchen  4 ปีที่แล้ว +3

      Thanks!

    • @BigBlack81
      @BigBlack81 4 ปีที่แล้ว

      ​@@CNCKitchen I actually should thank you here as well, Stefan. Your Knife Sharpening Jig? AWESOME. Printed it all at the library and it really not only came out great but it also showed me many things I want out of my own future 3D Printer setup. Did it on a Makerbot and wasn't totally happy with the results but definitely gave me good information going forward about what printer I want, etc. And the jig works. WELL. Going to be adding some 5000 grit and over stones as well, soon.

  • @lukerickert5203
    @lukerickert5203 4 ปีที่แล้ว +13

    A couple of things to consider from my own work with 3d printers. For one, extruding into free space is not necessarily the same as actual printing, it may scale but I would be very surprised if you don't have a real max flow that is lower than the free space number.
    The other thing to consider is accuracy of hot end temperature measurements depending on the location of the sensor, the flow etc. I have a thermal fea model of this which lets me explore the temperature latency etc in the system.

    • @drrobotsir
      @drrobotsir ปีที่แล้ว

      So what caused the drop of volumetric flow speed during actual printing? Other than the pressure from lower layers

  • @nzalog
    @nzalog 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Always well structured objective tests that have useful info.
    Good job Stefan.

  • @karellen00
    @karellen00 4 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    I noticed the limits of the stock extruder of my cr10-s when I tried to print 0.8 line width with 0.4 layer height. I moved to a volcano hotend to be sure, but then I noticed that it was the cheapo extruder the problem (the space between the teeth on the wheel were even filled with plastic, making it almost smooth!). I moved to an amazing BMG extruder, never had any problem again!

  • @blindside_o0
    @blindside_o0 ปีที่แล้ว

    I recently was trying to figure out how to run the extruder without moving so I could get a test of the MMU and filament tip forming. Thank you for including this code.

  • @Mike01Hu
    @Mike01Hu 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    A useful insight into filament behaviour. Nice!

  • @antalz
    @antalz 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Another great video, keep it up!

  • @avejst
    @avejst 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Fantastic video as ever.
    Great test
    Thanks for sharing :-)

  • @lewisheard1882
    @lewisheard1882 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Was very interested to hear about the nozzle X temp... I avoided buying one after people online said it needed a 15 degree increase!

  • @spikekent
    @spikekent 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Great investigation Stefan thank you.

  • @guatagel2454
    @guatagel2454 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    I will test my printer. Thank you!

  • @GoingtoHecq
    @GoingtoHecq 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Good video. I've noticed recently that my 0.8 mm lines from my 0.4 mm nozzle have been leaving gaps between them, and I suspected that heat was the issue. Going down to 0.6 mm was not a problem for print times though so it was a better option than trying to increase my hotend's max throughput.

  • @Dread_FPV
    @Dread_FPV 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    So funny. I upgraded my Anycubic Predator with a Vulcano, and now i see your video :-D
    Greetings from switzerland:-)

  • @iavor55
    @iavor55 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Awesome! As I try to maintain an "optimal" and "ludicrous" profile for quality and speed PLUS i've recently fine-tuned the print temp, I can now try to push my Ludicrous profile to its maximum based on my feeder!

  • @bleach_drink_me
    @bleach_drink_me 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    I have only went as high as 260c with a e3d v6 printing PLA during a speed benchy run. Nice to see data that actually shows it works like I expected.
    This is with a microswiss steel nozzle and a titan extruder.

  • @user-sq3oq2pe7r
    @user-sq3oq2pe7r 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Wonderful. Thanks for your great work.

  • @Marc16180
    @Marc16180 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    This is a wonderful video, and very timely in that I'm considering trying out a Phaetus Dragon nozzle which comes in both "small" and "large" flow rate versions. I decided on "small" since I only use a 0.4 mm nozzle, so that seems sufficient.
    In addition to future nozzle tests, perhaps you could also look at comparing the standard E3D extruder versus Mosquito and Dragon nozzle setups where the flow rate characteristics might be different.

  •  ปีที่แล้ว

    Awesome work. I’ll do this test on my J1 with 0,8 CHT nozzle

  • @agapiosagapiou
    @agapiosagapiou 3 ปีที่แล้ว

    as always: nice work!!

  • @Robotnic25
    @Robotnic25 3 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    I upgraded to a volcano hotend when I broke my stock hotend when I first built my printer. It didnt cost much more than the stock and it was advertised as faster, hotter, and stronger. 3 years later and I am still happy with it!

  • @ameliabuns4058
    @ameliabuns4058 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    god your filament is absolutely gorgous.

  • @santiagoblandon3022
    @santiagoblandon3022 4 ปีที่แล้ว +9

    Once again shining the light of science on popular 3D printing beliefs. Great content, as always ^^

    • @CNCKitchen
      @CNCKitchen  4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      Thanks! Happy to hear that.

  • @TheFreaxTux
    @TheFreaxTux 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    My hotend&extruder setups are pretty much the same as yours. geared dual drive extruder, and v6 hotend.
    I always print my supporters at 200mm/s though. Partly because I can, but also because underextrusion makes supporters easier to break.
    I also print infill at 200m/s when strength is not a concern. With Line or Grid infill, I found They tend to leave just enough pillar-like artifacts that I believe to be enough to act as supporters.

  • @anteck7goat
    @anteck7goat 3 ปีที่แล้ว

    Looking forward to the hardened nozzle test!

  • @somewhereoutthere8801
    @somewhereoutthere8801 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Thanks for the great investigation Stefan, as always very inspiring. I did notice over time that increasing temperature by a delta of say 10degrees would help material flow better on more challenging speeds. I always choose the hotter side, I really don’t get why people print at 185-190 except very slow to get maximum detail?
    However, regarding brass vs steel. I have noticed that I often need to boost temp by 5-10 degrees with Nozzle X to yield same consistent result as brass equivalent. I’ve also run into extrusion issues when switching to PLA after printing PETG or other copolyester. I choose plated copper nozzles for everything except abrasives as I get more consistent output with those, which I associate with better heat transfer.

  • @ghislaincarrier
    @ghislaincarrier 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Great video! I use the output of this method in PrusaSlicer to make sure I don't print faster than the maximum my extruder can support. I wrote my gcode by priming it a little bit, then I retract 5mm and wait 5 seconds using the G4 command. It gives me plenty of time to remove the primed filament before the test starts. After extruding .5m I retract 5mm, wait 5 seconds (G4 S5) then start again with a faster speed.
    One thing I noticed, is the width of extruded filament varies a lot with the speed from .48 to .84 just by varying the speed and extruding in the air. Really cool.

  • @aesuk9175
    @aesuk9175 3 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    When I calculate the flow rates I get a different amount - .4mm nozzle (or more accurately slicer line width) * .12 layer height * 50mm/s is a flow rate of 2.4mm3/s, I guess this assumes that the bead is strictly rectangular.

    • @marcosmoura911
      @marcosmoura911 ปีที่แล้ว

      I would like to see an answer to your statement. @cnckitchen

  • @nikond90ful1
    @nikond90ful1 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Thanks for the video.

  • @KaptenKlant
    @KaptenKlant 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    As someone who owns both a CR-10 S5 and a CR-10 Max this sort of stuff is very valuable to know, thanks for yet another great video. Experimenting with my monsters isn't cheap so I've settled on temperatures, speeds and flows that don't risk degrading the material by going too hot and won't put too much strain on the printers - the S5 breaks horrifyingly easily. My standard setup for both only differs in speed and acceleration, both run at 229C (modified super strength PLA, not rated for more than 220C) and both do 0.5mm outer walls and 1.0mm inner walls in 0.2mm layers using a 0.6 nozzle. The S5 can't really go faster than 30mm/s without awful results due to its extremely heavy platform breaking the Y motor if acceleration is set anywhere near "normal printer" speeds. The Max seems to do completely fine well over 50mm/s and with very high acceleration for its size thanks to outstanding design. All of the above results in absolute maximum strength super heavy duty prints at reasonable speed and quality, here's hoping some beginner finds the info useful as reference.

  • @TechGorilla1987
    @TechGorilla1987 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    I always find that I am increasing my temps about 10-12 degrees above recommended. I have printed mostly PETG and it likes to print hot. I have not printed PLA in a long time. I REALLY like PETG. I print between 30-50mm/s

  • @moth.monster
    @moth.monster 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    I've been printing just fine at 100mm/s with my single-gear EZR struder and Micro Swiss hotend on my Ender 3.

  • @JasperJanssen
    @JasperJanssen 3 ปีที่แล้ว

    General comment for all of your videos: I haven’t seen this good a systematic approach to various 3D printing questions since n0phead was still blogging.

  • @glados7294
    @glados7294 4 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    A while ago you asked in your Video if the community would enjoy a Video abour fiber reinforcments like carbon fiber, are you planning to do this? It would be pretty interesting
    Btw great Video👍

  • @666cesar999
    @666cesar999 3 ปีที่แล้ว

    I'm really excited about printing Nylon with my Ender 3, I'm going to upgrade my hotend for an all Metal from Micro-Swiss

  • @stang1966gt
    @stang1966gt 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Cool, I was doing something similar Fast n Hot on Ender3 Stock with BMG. Pla 260 0.8noz, 0.4 layer. The extruder bogs and can see the bottom layer lines thinning. Slow down the speed, 50 to 30mms and the extruder catches up and lines widen. Will test your concept!
    I do get blobs on layer changes. Saw your large nozzle test but was confused on the Cura Coasting and how much the values can get adjusted for a tuning test.
    Priline Polycarbonate CF, great material. Do not recall it in your testing but will look again
    Great videos, Tschüß

  • @gregsi
    @gregsi 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    thanks, nice one! I recently got an inexpensive steel nozzle from aliexpress and noticed that I needed to boost the temp quite a bit for PLA from 210 C to 240 C at full fan speed. So I guess having a fan on or off also makes a vast difference as steel has about 8x lower thermal conductivity. Have to do more testing though..

    • @CNCKitchen
      @CNCKitchen  4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      What were the issues that you were facing and why you increased temperatures?

  • @projectanmu4546
    @projectanmu4546 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    im fortunate enough to already have a volcano hotend in my printer (artillery sidewinder x1). I can highly recommend that printer, for the price its really well build and has quite a big usable printing space. just be aware that you need to do some small mods to get the best printing results (like relocating the filament holder and maybe adding braces to the printer for really tall prints)

  • @ianide2480
    @ianide2480 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    I switched to a hardened steel nozzle and an all metal extruder at the same time. It took me a couple of minutes to figure out a few things. So far, all that I have changed is retraction distance to a much lower number (very critical with an all metal hot-end). Nothing has changed in print quality but I don't have to change nozzles anymore if I want to print some wood grain filament and I don't have to change the teflon tubing (it doesn't exist anymore). I have done no extensive testing because it all works great.

  • @GeorgeGraves
    @GeorgeGraves 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    I never would have thought that there would be that much slippage. It almost seems like adding feedback to the system would work. Maybe a small roller above the gear(s) to measure the real filimate use.

  • @tribalrhino
    @tribalrhino 4 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    Wow that's really cool, I upgraded my Prusa Mk3 as soon as I got it since I wanted abrasives and I calibrate each filament I use. Prusament galaxy Silver requires 230C and I've never really thought anything of it since I was always told the steel nozzle needs 10+ degrees so to be so far away from Prusa's settings was always just because I have a steel nozzle. I was getting a bit worried that I'd struggle to get my mini tuned with the same filament settings... but based on this, it seems my temperature hike is actually so high for me because of the way I print (very low outer perimeter speed, very fast infill)... which theoretically means I can use all the same profiles :D Oh, except the e-steps will probably be different going from direct drive to bowden. Grrr :(

  • @axegrinder65
    @axegrinder65 3 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    I really like your most inormative videos, thank you. I wondered what is the largest nozzle size practical for e3d printhead?

  • @PartykongenBaddi
    @PartykongenBaddi 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Thanks for this video! It gave me some more data and perspective on the capabilities of my hot end. Now I am pushing 21 mm^3/s on my prusa mk2s with a 0,8mm nozzle and are cranking out face shields in no time. Not that it has to be a competition, but printing hundreds of the same model is a good oppotunity to test out the limits of the printer and it seems that I am currently the fastest in the region. I haven't done the measurements you've done though as my scale only has a resolution of 1g.
    Addition: I got the print time below 1 hour for 3 of our approved face shields with the volumetric flow rate being 22,5 mm^3/s, printed with a temperature of 250 degrees when I would normally be at 210 degrees and a much lower flow rate.

  • @helpimlost137
    @helpimlost137 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Hey just want to put this out there. When testing for maximum volumetric flow rate, it’s not practical to just extrude a specific length until the motor starts skipping. This assumes the maximum volumetric flow rate is the point at which the polymer is not melted enough to be pushed out of the nozzle. First, but not as important, with a stronger motor you may be able to push the filament out at higher flow rates compared to this PRUSA Extruder/hotend combo which was explained in the video because Stefans a frickin genius and his videos are always awesome. Second and more importantly, before you reach this point, you will notice that the filament is not sticking to previously printed layers when making sharp turns or quick movements. This is due to an extreme temperature gradient in the filament at higher flow rates. This temperature gradient will cause massive gaps in the print and will likely result in a failure.

  • @BRUXXUS
    @BRUXXUS 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    I've been using a stock hot end on my CR-10s for a few years without any issues at all. Although, I do print on the upper end of the temperature range of each material and never print faster than 60mm/s. I usually do 50-60mm/s for infill and inner walls, and like 30-40 for outer walls and surfaces.
    Even when using a 0.8mm nozzle, that hotend seems to keep up very well, but at 0.8mm I do slow the print down quite a lot and push temps as high as I'm comfortable with for the material.
    I have converted mine to direct drive and am using a different heatsink and part cooling fan setup which seems to do a good job of focusing the part cooling fan flow directly onto the part and not cooling off the nozzle. Replacing the inner PTFE liner with Capricorn also makes me feel a bit more comfortable printing with higher temps, (within Capricorn's safety specs).
    Last thing, if you actually end up seeing this. May I make a request for a video?
    I've really been curious about testing various 3D printing material creep properties. I can't seem to find much solid research into it and I think it'd be super useful for a lot of people that print functional parts. 😉

  • @lucasvanbeers9906
    @lucasvanbeers9906 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    I have a printer with a 1.4x1x1 meter build volume. It came with a regular V6 hotend, but of course I upgraded to supervolcano. Just to give an example; I can easily use a 1.2mm nozzle, 0.4 layer hight at 200mm/s.

  • @Exstaz
    @Exstaz 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    I am kinda new to 3dPrinting (started in April last year) but I always upped my hotend temp when I boost my speeds to counter underextrusion. I never really tested that it did work but I just assumed I would need to n

  • @nutzy99ify
    @nutzy99ify 10 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Ender 3 max. 225 70 bed and 120mm a second after first layer . Wolverine cowl turned out great. My first 10 layers are at 30mm a second

  • @tomhsia4354
    @tomhsia4354 3 ปีที่แล้ว

    This is why I normally prefer to print at very high temps. For detailed prints, I lower the temps and print at ridiculously slow speeds.
    I go through ABS fan shrouds on my Prusa so frequently I bought a spool of PC blend filament just for the fan shroud and extruder cover.

  • @TheDgdimick
    @TheDgdimick 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Love the video, however, Maths is hard this morning, would be nice to see the numbers broken down to the Dumbbell numbers for me, Temp, Layer height, print speed (50mm/S, 80mm/S, etc). Maybe after some coffee.. Maybe..

  • @arnecl9566
    @arnecl9566 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Nice video once more

  • @ameliabuns4058
    @ameliabuns4058 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Finally! i was hyped for the video ;3
    I have set my second tool to be a volcano and the first to be a v6. tho I have 0.4mm on both cause prusaslicer is annoying at times. I'll be switching to a tilting dual extrusion mechanism soon so probably have to say goodbye to the volcano.

  • @MDealer
    @MDealer 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    V6, Volcano and Super Volcano comparisons would be nice! I've seen a lot of opinions on forums, but no hard facts so far.

  • @gregoryp203
    @gregoryp203 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    thank you for this. I built a corexy which can easily print at 100mm/s. Using a V6 style hotend with BMG extruder , filiment was skipping when I printed at .3mm high and 100mm/s . I never realized the V6 was working in the upper bounds of throughput. I have upgraded to volcano recently , still seeing what it can do. I was disappointed at the end of this video there was not a comparison of the volcano.

  • @MultiDenissined
    @MultiDenissined 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    you are a genius

  • @capblueberry7899
    @capblueberry7899 3 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    God bless and have a good day!!

  • @yeastdonkey846
    @yeastdonkey846 2 ปีที่แล้ว

    When did you remove the filament after the 500 mm extrusion? Was there the oozing at the end that might impact the result? Loved the video, keep it up!

  • @faxxzc
    @faxxzc 4 ปีที่แล้ว +5

    The Duet has such a feature called "nonlinear extrusion", it does exactly what you want, increasing the flow depending on the throughput

    • @CNCKitchen
      @CNCKitchen  4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      Oh cool! Didn't know that.

    • @pacolucas7512
      @pacolucas7512 4 ปีที่แล้ว

      @@CNCKitchen So does marlin with the linear advance parameter

    • @tommy11490
      @tommy11490 4 ปีที่แล้ว

      @@pacolucas7512 Linear advance is also present in Prusa mk3s AFAIK. But Stefans results shows considerable variantions. The flow dependent extruding multiplier should definitely be a thing!

    • @KucharJosef
      @KucharJosef 4 ปีที่แล้ว

      @@pacolucas7512 Linear advance is just for the speed transitions (compensates the lag of molten plastic due to pressure in nozzle and other things), it doesn't compensate for the slippage in extruder in any way

    • @efahrenholz1
      @efahrenholz1 3 ปีที่แล้ว

      I use linear advance and autotemp. It seems to work pretty well.

  • @MarksGoneWicked
    @MarksGoneWicked 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    🤔 I've been printing at 200°C @60mm/s the last couple of months. I don't think I've seen any skipping, just a little under extrusion. Definitely going to up my temp a little. Good info as always.

    • @gamerbrosmaximuz7125
      @gamerbrosmaximuz7125 4 ปีที่แล้ว

      I print at 230c and have never had any issues, but if you use really high end filament you may want to lower it to 220c

    • @MarksGoneWicked
      @MarksGoneWicked 4 ปีที่แล้ว

      @@gamerbrosmaximuz7125 that's 10 degrees hotter than my eSun PLA+ lists, and 20 degrees hotter than my Hatchbox PLA lists. What brands do you use?

  • @1Wolverine2
    @1Wolverine2 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Fantastic work as usual.
    I have something to point out tho. When calculating volume rate while printing I think one should take into account the width of the extrusion line instead of the diameter of the nozzle. So it would be extrusion width x layer height x speed.
    What do you think about it?
    Back to the hotend discussion. I recently replaced a V6 block for a Volcano. By replacing the standard extruder (single sided arm + spring) for a BMG I could increase speed by 15% at the same temperature with the V6 block. After installing the Volcano I went from 70 mm/s to 90 mm/s and was able to reduce the temperature from 225 to 215 without any issues. I think it's well worth it. If nothing it's a lot more forgiving in terms of tuning speed and temperature.
    Keep up the awesome work.

  • @yonutz333
    @yonutz333 3 ปีที่แล้ว

    Excellent video as usual! Can you please also provide the excel files for those graphs you made since i want to recreate your experiment partially...

  • @printingotb521
    @printingotb521 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Love this test! I usually increase temp a lot when printing fast and with wide/thick layers (I like to use a small nozzle Ø as if it was larger).
    What I would really like to learn is how much difference does it make to print say 0.6mm wide lines at 0.2mm layer height with a 0.4mm nozzle VS printing with a 0.6mm nozzle and the same width/height. The larger diameter hole should reduce back-pressure. But at what flow rates may we use a 0.4 nozzle instead of a 0.6 nozzle and getting the same result? It is my opinion that we don't need nozzles of may different diameters.
    Looking forward to your next video as well!

    • @rakshithb5806
      @rakshithb5806 4 ปีที่แล้ว

      You can print wider tracks using smaller nozzle diameters within limits of nozzle geometry and can actually speed up the printing process. He talks about printing larger extrusion widths using smaller nozzle diameters in his video on extrusion widths . . check it out.

  • @DavidMulligan
    @DavidMulligan 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    @CNC Kitchen you mention that we need to take into consideration underextrusion while tuning e-steps or extrusion multiplier. This is also a consideration when tuning the extruder motor driver current. Right now the current to my extruder driver and motor on a clone BMG dual gear extruder is set way too high because it never skips, it just pushes the bowden tube out and I need to tune that current down to the point where it is capable of skipping instead!

    • @TechGorilla1987
      @TechGorilla1987 4 ปีที่แล้ว +2

      I cured the bowden tube pushing out by getting better air line fittings from a reputable dealer. The connectors I have now BITE the tube WELL and ONLY let you pull the tube out when you engage the release. The old ones I had, I could just tug the tube out. I use Capricorn tubing exclusively.

    • @scottwillis5434
      @scottwillis5434 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      There are some little clips that go between the release ring and the body of the fittings. They hold the release ring on the fittings out, which keeps the fittings from releasing and the tubing from loosening. Are you using them?

    • @DavidMulligan
      @DavidMulligan 4 ปีที่แล้ว

      @@scottwillis5434 Yes I use the clips which came with my extruder and hotend. I might have printed one of the two but I do use them and they are very firmly in place. This is good advice so thank you for bringing it up. I do really believe I have my driver current too high. I failed to mention that the I had a full clog when it ripped my bowden tube out. I just want my motor to skip instead!

    • @DavidMulligan
      @DavidMulligan 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      @@TechGorilla1987 This is good advice. As far as I know I am using authentic Capricorn tubing as well. I say it that way because I bought it bulk from a reputable authorized dealer but recently Alex Kenis had a bad experience where he received either a bad batch or fake tubing. th-cam.com/video/PAHMAojpZvo/w-d-xo.html I need to get more so I will probably get some from Capricorn directly if shipping to Canada isn't prohibitive.

  • @franklinvega6847
    @franklinvega6847 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

    I have a question, is there any data about the maximum volumatric flow that can go through a nozzle just extruding? No layer height, no width, no printing at all. Just putting the hotend in the air and start it to extrude just as the beginning of the video. Can't we know the maximum volumetric flow of material coming out of the nozzle?

  • @zmast333
    @zmast333 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Did this test today. My tips:
    - If you hear the extruder making tick noises or you're seeing major differences as the VF increases, check the filament is properly tightened. Turns out I had my screw turned the wrong way so it was set at minimum spring load.
    - Get a precision scale and check repeatability. If needed, average 3 measurements each time.
    On my Anycubic Chiron, original hotend/extruder, with PLA at 220°C, here are my results:
    8 mm³/s is used as baseline
    16 mm³/s gives -7% extrusion
    24 mm³/s gives -14% extrusion
    I'm planning to upgrade the hotend to an E3D Volcano. I'm not sure if I'll need to upgrade the extruder, at the moment it's doing its job.

  • @357Maxim
    @357Maxim 3 ปีที่แล้ว +5

    Thanks for the good work Stefan ! I am watching nearly all your videos on a streak :)
    On the chart at 1:29, when I multiply [Nozzle diameter]*[layer height]*[speed], I get a value consistently ~17% lower than your [Flow rate].
    What is the reason behind it ?

    • @johnecker
      @johnecker 3 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      Same

    • @michaelframe2849
      @michaelframe2849 2 ปีที่แล้ว

      +1
      In your tabulated drawing the first row. You have your flow at 2.9 with .4 nozzle at a .12 layer height. Using the formula 2.9/(.4*.12)= 60.417 and not 50. Are you reducing result by some safe margin?

  • @osmarbernateloya416
    @osmarbernateloya416 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Just in time, I had a little bit of problem configuring this

  • @creamofbotulismsoup9900
    @creamofbotulismsoup9900 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    I have tested the volumetric speed with a 1mm nozzle, but I just go by when the print quality starts to degrade and back it off a bit to be safe. My max for the PETG I use, at a 250C hotend temp, on my cheap Chineseum v5 is about 18-20mm3/s using 1mm brass nozzle. I haven't tested PLA as extensively but I can push at least that amount and still get nice prints at like 210-220C. I use a cheap single gear extruder similar to a Titan and haven't had any problems with skipping even going above 20mm3/s with a 1mm nozzle.
    One thing to really watch out for on Prusa Slic3r is the max volumetric speed setting, if it is set to low it will lower all of the speeds including the TRAVEL speed, they really need to fix that, it drove me nuts for a bit until I figured it out, that setting shouldn't touch the travel speed at all IMO.

  • @ytfpv2627
    @ytfpv2627 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Could you run a comparison test with other upgraded E3D hotend parts like a copper heat block, the titanium heat break to see if they make an appreciable difference?

  • @fadilalsayegh7637
    @fadilalsayegh7637 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Great stuff Stefan!!.. I noticed that you have a low extruder idler tension, do you think that affected the results? As the gears would slip earlier..

    • @CNCKitchen
      @CNCKitchen  4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      Of course it's also dependent on the pretension that's why I said that this has to be done for each particular setup. Using too high of a tension can also be detrimental.

  • @wojciechiwanski71
    @wojciechiwanski71 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    I would like to be able to play with such settings in Prusa Slic3r :)

  • @yogimarkmac
    @yogimarkmac 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Don't forget that the back pressure on the nozzle is much higher when actually printing compared to these tests, and of course will also depend on speed and layer height. I suspect that this would significantly change the extrusion rate and shift those curves quite a bit.

  • @LukesLaboratory
    @LukesLaboratory 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    If possible, I'd love a comparison with multiple common materials as well as hotend designs as well.
    chart ALL the things! PETG is particularily tricky it seems, I have to baby it when I use standard brass, but upgrade to plated copper and all problems dissapear, but there aren't any similar effects with PLA.

    • @CNCKitchen
      @CNCKitchen  4 ปีที่แล้ว

      Interesting. Didn't notice a big difference between copper and brass nozzles myself. Did both use the same geometry inside?

    • @LukesLaboratory
      @LukesLaboratory 4 ปีที่แล้ว

      @@CNCKitchen I'd assume so! Both genuine e3d nozzles on standard V6 hotends

  • @Saxshoe
    @Saxshoe 3 ปีที่แล้ว

    extrusion weight as a function of Temperature and Extrusion speed seem like a great opportunity for a 3^2 factorial DoE

  •  4 ปีที่แล้ว

    My extruder is kind of slow, so I usually do up the temp from 205-210 to 225-230 if I really need/want to print fast. The problem, of course, is that its depdendent on the place in the print. If there is bridging or overhangs I manually lower the temps. This should really be in the extruder, as always!

  • @j.g545
    @j.g545 3 ปีที่แล้ว

    still waiting for that nozzle comparison:)

  • @Andreas-gh6is
    @Andreas-gh6is 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    I am wondering if, for example with ender 3, changing the hotend to e3d clones is a good idea. Sure, e3d v6 takes Vulcano and/or all-metal hotends, but I wonder what the differences are otherwise.

  • @X2Brute
    @X2Brute 3 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    I find myself wanting to see the equivalent with a volcano hot end for comparison

  • @Chrissi33004
    @Chrissi33004 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    When youre done with all your analysis, can you publish a video where you calibrate a 3D printer the best way possible? Youre always thinking about things other youtubers miss (for example that the extruder lets filament slip without a skipping noise), a comprehensive guide on how to calibrate a 3D Printer the RIGHT way would be really nice.

  • @KiR_3d
    @KiR_3d 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Interesting! Although I'm using Volcano already...

  • @nathanp5877
    @nathanp5877 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    I'm looking to buy a 3d pen, to makeshift something up quick. what model do you prefer?

  • @mroek
    @mroek 3 ปีที่แล้ว

    Did you ever publish that hardened nozzle test that you mentioned? I can't seem to find it.

  • @xBenedictumx
    @xBenedictumx 3 ปีที่แล้ว

    @CNC Kitchen we have ender five pros at the lab and are having a real hard time with the single gear extruder. What dual extruder would you recommend?