Spray foam insulation nightmare: What can happen if it's not installed correctly (CBC Marketplace)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 9 ก.ย. 2014
- Originally broadcast October 25, 2013
Canadians are installing spray foam insulation in their homes in ever-expanding numbers. It’s sold as energy-efficient, easy-to-apply solution, but when the job goes wrong, it can be a nightmare for homeowners. Tom Harrington takes you inside the walls and up into the attic to explore a home renovation horror story, a foul-smelling foam job that’s driven a family from its home.
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They weren't lying they couldn't smell anything. They no longer have a sense of smell after spraying that sheet a few years, sinus get burned out.
good point
The contractor guy did allude to this in the video.
If the nose don't smell sh*t - you must acquit!
I used to haul pool bleach around Florida filling poly tanks at pool supply stores after awhile you never even smell it anymore. Now I have no smell.
I've been spraying foam for 12 years and still smell it everytime I install it
Introduction of the Product: 3:52
Caution for Contractors: 11:23
Dangers of Field-Fab As Opposed to Pre-Fab: 12:05
Indoor Air Report: 14:24
Remediation: 20:42
21 minutes distilled down into roughly 90 seconds. The rest is just a bunch of "you won't believe what happens next". You're welcome.
Thanks
Omg thank u!
thank you! you're amazing!
thx
The drama should have started with, "It was a dark and stormy night."
People: have terrible health problems from just being _near_ the foam
Camera guy: *touches foam with bare hands, sniff it right up to his nose multiple times, rolls around in foam*
The thing about spray foam, the really bad side effects come from prolonged exposure. The two big side effects that I make sure people are aware of, during the installation process, are developing asthma and neurological damage. What is immediately noticeable with uncured/improperly cured foam is that you'll get a splitting headache within 15 minutes, strained eyes, breathing may be labored, ect.
We had spray foam added to our attic last year, smell was gone in two days. We are in the very hot sunny south and it made a big difference in our cooling bill. Done right it works and worth the payback over time. Choose your contractor wisely.
Foam is great for reaching a high level of insulation in a small space, and spray foam can assist with installing in tricky areas like attics. But spray foam is not always the best option despite what some home improvement channels might advertise. Many (not all) homes can be insulated equally as well for less money and less risk using fiberglass, mineral-wool, cellulose, or even rigid-foam board.
@@izaacmp True that fiberglass insulation is basically the same R value per inch as spray foam, but spray foam adds an air seal which is another layer of energy efficiency the other products can’t compete with.
@@billwilljulz There is absolutely no need for airseal and the proposed added efficiency is just marketing.
@@maxmeier532 I’ve never heard this argument before. Insulation is insulation, but a well sealed home is far superior to a leaky one. Anyone who has lived in an leaky home can attest that they are not as comfortable. Air sealing also helps to prevent moisture and mold in the structure. A well sealed home is recommended not only by spray foam manufacturers (hmm, go figure), but also by the DOE and every building science article out there. Spray foam or not, air sealing is important. People can do whatever they want, but to save energy (and money) and have a healthier home for life, air sealing up front is highly recommended.
@@billwilljulz There will be a vapour barrier like 6 mil or more impervious plastic below the fiberglass in an attic so that's an air seal. We had our headers and basement walls foamed and that's the most useful place for foaming and air leak sealing IMO. We were advised to leave for a few hours, left all windows open (summertime) and suffered no ill effects at all. Loving the basement work and how much BTUs we'll save next winter plus looks way better than the sandstone, cement blocks and poured concrete walls now underneath the foam. Make sure to get the sealant sprayed over the foam to protect it and for esthetics.
This is what you watch in the middle of the night when you should be sleeping
Edit: lmao this crazy, 2 years later I have over 2k likes and I created a chain in comments, I love it.
4:24 am
2:26 pm
1:40 AM here.... Yup.
12:12 AM -word
3:51 am
My god, I came here to learn about the potential dangers of spray foam, not to get twenty-two straight minutes of "DUN DUN DUUUN".
Angela Hsiao Really I heard the music....dun dun duuuun.
Angela Hsiao Welcome to the world of tabloid news. CBC is almost as intelligent to watch as TMZ.
CBC has to decide what kind of show they want to portray. The music makes it sound like one of those Just For Laughs gag shows and takes away from the seriousness of the subject matter. Then again CBC are not known for quality these days. The only thing worse is the other Canadian networks pushing their corporate agenda. Dun dun dunnnn!
Angela Hsiao erm this is a show not news (although news ever becoming like show :/)
Angela Hsiao Same here Angela.
I've seen instances where people put spray foam up in between the rafters. I personally think this is a terrible idea because if you have a leak in your roof you won't know about it for years until the entire roof deck is rotted out.
That's only closed cell foa..
It actually blisters the shingle with the trapped heat on the surface. If you read the fine print warranty disclaimers on shingle they say they will not warranty a roof with spray foam under the roof deck.
I do mold restoration and I see that all the time. And insurance companies don't like to pay to remove it
I have a shop with spray foam against the roof sheathing from the bottom. It was built in 1989 and there have been no problems.
I was thinking of doing this lol this makes perfect sense I didn’t think about it thanks for saving me money
It's interesting to watch content like this that is obviously meant for TV broadcast. Many of us are now spoiled by short, no-drama, no filler TH-cam videos. When we watch these TV programs we immediately think "why are they dragging this out so long".
House was built in 1987. Never finished..I removed the old r11 from the unfinished exterior walls and called TX Energy to apply spray foam.
Originally, the attic was vented with soffit vents and gable vented fan. I sealed up the attic. TX Energy came and sprayed all exterior walls, under the floor joists in the downstairs ceiling, and under the rafters in the attic. There is a temp difference of 2 degrees from upstairs and attic . When it's 108 outside, it's a cool 74 upstairs with the thermostat set at 72 In Winter,, it's 28 outside and 72 inside. Spray foam rocks when installed properly.
GKAtascosa I must say, I'm partial to fiberglass insulation myself. If it ain't broken, don't fix it. Fiberglass has been the industry standard for years, and that's what I stuck with.
I should given more details about why I removed the old R11 fiberglass insulation. It was old..for one. Vapor/ Paper barrier had holes in it..Two, had a bunch of little pink lizards and eggs shells all in it.
Three, I wanted a tight house. I got what I paid for and should pay for itself in energy savings in 2 years.
wish this show had more info and less emotion
info don't sell emotions sell haven't you ever watch CNN?
@@walterheater8096 sad but true.
@@walterheater8096 1) Liberals involved. Jes like CNN, eh?
2) IF IT BLEEDS, IT LEADS.....
anastasia46, yeah, they could have given us all the important facts in about 3 minutes.
CBC is all about the FEAR...
It's called "out-gassing" and most homeowners are ignorant about it. When the foam is first applied 98% of out-gassing happens in the first 24-hrs. Then about 2% continues to leak over several years (below EPA levels). People should stay away from using foam in a remodel or retrofit. Installers need clear access to the areas to be sprayed and that is not possible just doing an attic.
Back in the 1980s, my husband and I signed a purchase & sale to buy a little house of our dreams. Thank God we had a great home inspector of our own. The house had a slightly fishy smell. Turns out, it was insulated with UFFI, urea formaldehyde foam insulation. Countless companies discovered the more formaldehyde they used, the faster the reaction happened, and the faster the job could be done. We walked away from the house.
So they are worried about the chemicals in the air but still store food in the house
Yeah, i know, theyre crafzy
Yes, the stuff floating in our air, like Aluminum, Barium from chemtrail are probably much more harful in the long run.
And she is wearing a HEPA filtered respirator and not an organic vapor (black filters) one...
Christian L she wears a mask too..drama
As a plumber I just got done diagnosing a leak at a house which crawlspace was coated with this foam. Long story short: The foam concealed a leak and created massive amounts of long-term leaking, dry rot damage. Total foolishness to spray this on pipes and wires which may be serviced later.
THANK YOU!!! I totally thought that when I first saw a video of workers applying this crap, spraying it over all the wiring & the water & drain pipes!
I feel sorry for the electricians &/or plumbers who then have to rewrite or fix or even reroute a pipe later on, after the foam applications! I cringed.
*rewire, not rewrite*
yeah, an installer i spoke with says that industry standard is NOT to install close cell foam in those environments. same with roofs.....
Benjamin Wise close cell or closed cell? there is a difference.
Common sense says use Batt Fiberglass insulation. Glass is about as safe as it gets as Zero outgassing. Sure there are sharp glass if you get it on your skin, but simply don't roll around in it!
They should’ve just sued the company for neglect or liable or deliberately covering it up after the company said it was fine for the second time and after that guy came out and did all those test
That could have taken years just to get to court.
They would have prevailed.
good luck! they probably disappeared.
I see Canadian TV is turning into dramatic over the top editing like here in the US. Congrats, welcome to the club.
Ten years of doing this, never had ANY issues like this. Though I've never installed more than an inch at a time. That, I'm under the impression is where this went wrong. Don't know what product this contractor was using(there are many, many types of SPF) but the products that I've used work really well and are easy to install due to the canalization to slow the reaction giving the foam more time to properly react without excessive exothermic reactions. Like they said in the beginning, like learning chemistry as much as anything. Sad to see any job go south and the foam definitely needed to come out. I would have pulled the dry wall (ceiling) off the rafters and mechanically removed what foam was on the trusses and if the contractor had done this day one, the home owner probably would be ok with this rather than decapitating his house. And maybe could have come to believe in the foam again. Bad contractor decision. Not bad contractor, just didn't handle the fuck up well or soon enough.
Robert Palmore Smart move installing one inch at a time. Especially if you allow like 30 to 45 minutes per layer (easy to do really and the job will be done in only a few minutes longer than 1.5 inch lifts). I agree with you on what should have been done, however, the refusal to accept responsibility and take action means that the contractor has no say in any planned recovery or method of recovery and is still responsible under law.
However I disagree about the contractor. The fact that he refused to acknowledge his bad work and even now refused to acknowldege the physical harm he has caused (which is even described in health warnings in journals and MSDS's) because he failed to address the issue makes him just that "A BAD CONTRACTOR". At this point he can't deny responsibility for the physical harm caused to the family either. Remember that the exotherm caused a change to include formaldehyde which was a guaranteed non-component of his advertisement and sale.
Misrepresentation and or failure to remove the product which violated his advertisement again proves he is a bad contractor.
Robert Palmore Whats the difference with this foam method and using foam boards with bottle urethane foam to seal the sides? I mean in insulation efficiency vise?
I mean sure spraying foam is faster and it will seal all the holes, but personally i still like to work with traditional stone wool or styrofoam boards. New house all ready has plenty other chemicals floating around until it vents those out and settles. Also for future renovation that foam it pain the ass remove.
When foam is sprayed in place, you get 100% adhesion and 100% air barrier as well as if the foam is installed in 2 inches or more, you get 100% moisture barrier. Also sprayed in place with the 100% adhesion will help deaden sound as well as add structural strength. As far as insulation value, if your using urethane board and sealing it, same. Urethane has around 7 R per inch. Different manufacturers have slightly different ratings. Polystyrene (foam cooler stuff) it's around R 5 per inch. Hope this answers your question.
Robert Palmore Thanks for the info. Personally i think 100% adhesion and moisture barrier is a bad thing.. its kinda good when it gives some structural strength, but stopping building from moving naturally and making it total bubble.. no thanks. If i were to do insulation job with this, i would put plastic or something other stuff first and then cut tops of the beams open, so structure can breath and insulation can be removed more easy when and if its needed. Kinda depends from intended use, but in living apartment.. i would not use it, but in special cases. Even roof insulation installation, from below can be done much more easy with standard board UT and with less mess. I take spaying like everywhere its messy job?
I heard those R ratings take only in count one way of heat transfer, so for cant be trusted.. personally i notice those have been little shady, thought i'm not insulation expert, but tiler expert.
A house can be too tight. The best thing is to make it as tight as possible and then use an air heat exchange to ventilate without the loss of heat. I've always done every job like it was going to be installed forever. Messy is putting it politely. Coveralls, head cover, full face respirator with tear offs and gloves. Worth it though. A fell by the name David South who is with www.monolithic.com wrote an article called the R Fairy Tale. Just like you say, the R values are a bit shady. In the real world, Foam's insulating performance is much better than in a lab. Like I will put R 21 (3 inches) in Foam against R 35 (10 inches) of glass any day all day.
I don't like it from a firefighting standpoint. More toxic smoke, thus less time for the occupants to escape.
Lee Huff reminds me of a documentary I watched not too long ago regarding the toxicity and exposure to flame retardant materials in home furnishing during combustion. And thusly, I respect and commend what you do for us, if you’re coming from that standpoint. It was really saddening to see the proportion of firefighters dying early from all the carcinogens and if I recall correctly, the impunity of the manufacturers when trying to hold them accountable was disgusting.
The foam we have now is not even close to the foam we used a few years ago. Also, you air seal a house that good, it greatly reduced the rate at which the fire spreads.
@@trump-wj2nx Seriously??? Keep flipping burgers and let adults talk
@@trump-wj2nx Are you f#@£ing kidding ??? Spray foam insulation is basically solidified gasoline!!
Once it begins to burn it produces huge amounts of toxic soot smoke, which will begin to burn uncontrollably/flashover within a minute or so, of the foam igniting.
The various foams available vary so much, from ones that are almost fireproof to foams that burn like gasoline, that it's hard to generalize. Some actually survive fires that burn the sheathing off the wall, but of course, being resistant to burning doesn't mean there are no toxic fumes. People need to know the pros and cons of what they are using before coating a house with it.
Thanks for this great info! I like how both the installers and customers had a point of view.
We had the same problem with a strong fish smell. Luckily we had a very good builder. They tore out all the spray foam insulation that a subcontractor had just installed. A very tedious job. Then they resprayed with a correctly mixed product. That fixed the issue.
So there's a solution? It was just bad installation?
Definetely wouldn’t necessitate an entire new roof like what the homeowner in the video wanted.
@@pting66 For the peace of mind it makes a lot of sense to be decisive and take the roof off. If you want a 100% job, that is the only option. And it's your house. You and the family spend a lot of time in there.
I personally believe that the installation company should totally be liable for the whole reconstruction and removal process of the foam not to mention the health damage misplacement of the family and hardships. clearly they mix there own blends and it's not regulated in pre packaging/ containers that are pressurized which takes the manufacture out of the equation. Pay up company! You guys messed up and you know it. own up.
Cole Bell - Correct. I'm sure there would be a Law firm out there who would do a "No Win No Fee" class action against this (these) companies (or possibly the house insurer).
They do hold their responsibility,at least the company I work for
That's why you have to be licensed and insured
I have a good friend who has been a professional contractor his whole life, since the 70's, and one thing he feels strongly about, is that if you ever let someone onto your property to do any kind of work, large or small, you should ALWAYS get someone who is licensed, bonded and insured, otherwise don't do it. And this guy does not give out advice to people about anything... he's real "whatever", but he will tell people this without them asking. LOL... it's like a grandma spouting out a few pieces of advice to her pregnant daughter in law, like "take a nap whenever you can, cuz you never know when you'll be up all night!" or the like... the daughter didn't ask for it, but as a seasoned mother, you can't help but make sure people know something important like that.
IDK. 15,000 spray foams went just fine but 15,001st turns them into mutants? The guy said they needed to remove 1% of the foam, why didn't they atleast try that and see if it worked before they waked the whole roof off? I think these people might just be flakes.
If they told me they didn’t smell anything, i’d say sure. I’ll put on a mask, and have a nice long chat with them in the bedroom where the chemicals are the strongest
I thought the same thing. "Oh you have a headache? Joint pain? Oh are your sinuses on fire? Oh do you want to remove it now? No? Ok let's stay a little longer. Hello? Oh is it hard to breathe? Hello?" -- Just let them feel what they've wrought.
@@dawnv3436 they're probably numb to it
Daddy Dollaz does it contain methyl di isocyanate or MDI or di isocyanate or isocyanate
@@dawnv3436 The real issue with spray foam is it seals a structure air tight, so if the building isnt built withe correct type of ventilation that draws fresh air through year round, you will just keep breathing the same contaminated air, along with the exhaled viruses and bacteria, because you created a "sick house".
@Daddy Dollaz
The house that I'm restoring had the basement foam, I had go an open the door for the guys until they say it was sabe but still for my opinion too tick.... Guess you what I mean too tick ( 5 in Freaking pipes can't be seen )
There is another factor that wasn't mentioned: attic ventilation.
There should be soffit vents in the attic space that bring air from outside and vent it out the top - with a smaller vent.
Heat rises, and if the attic ventilation had been proper it would accelerate the curing time of the foam and allow those gases to escape upward and outward.
Many homes in Canada do not have this venting because of the cold - but without it, you not only have this kind of problem, but you will also have moisture problems.
Yes when you use foam on the ceiling, instead of the correct roof line then it needs to be ventilated
Exactly what I was thinking.
False building science. Once can deal with moisture without having to ventilate to the outside. I see someone has never heard of a "dehumidifier".
@@basketballjones6782 Funny, he didn't mention that either.
Yeah I bought 5 tanks of closed cell and I did 3 inches at a time of the attic. Starting with the roofing deck mad the rafters. I let two weeks in between worth of cure time in between each 3 inch layer and didn't do too too much at once. I had ridge vents installed on a new roof a few months before I did it. I also installed 4 attic vents that I custom made with leuvers that were 2 feet by 2 feet and I put screen on the back and siliconed them and installed in the square cutout I framed in. I also put two attic fans in that turn on based on temp and or humidity. The cost of both fans and the controller and sensors (6 sensors total) was under $400 because I am good. Lol
I used two stainless fans that I got used from a commercial cookie factory and the motors I just cleaned up and I pressed two new bearings in each fan.
They each will move 2,000 cfm on high and is only 28 inches. I have a 15kw solar system I built from scratch and they run off of them l but I will admit they pull some energy and they are not that efficient compared to some. They are for a cookie factory. They still smelled like cookies when I first got them. But I also used 6 foot long spray wands for the foam and drove the wand down in between the walls where the old insulation still lay and I just let it ride. I filled the walls and let it cure. Them I got under the house in between the joists with 3 inches at a time then again waited 2 weeks to cure or 3 if it was closed like the attic. I went back and put another 3 inches down on the attic and the joists in the crawlspace. Then one more 3 inch layer. After 3 more weeks I shaved the foam flush and boarded up the floor joists under the house in the crawl spaceb and then covered with 5 mill plastic doubled up and used a stapler to pin it down everywhere and then added slats on all the joists where I stapled the 5 mil plastic. Then I taped the slats and edges and sprayed bedliner on the doubled up 5 mil plastic that was drawn thout (tight) and then put a very thick bead of liquid nails heavy duty on the slats and covered those with galvanized steel that is just a hair wider than the slats. The liquid nails overflowed a bit and made a nice even bead on either side of the metal strips.
When it was all dry, I had to use sticks to prop up the galvanized steel and it was a pain, I drilled holes into the steel and through to the joists and I put 2 inch roofing tacks every 6 inches on the metal and drew it all in and then sprayed everything with a thick sealer that is the equivalent of flex seal or red guard but clear. It is for general stuff and made for marine use. But you can spray it light and it actually comes out and atomizes and is fluffy almost and will almost foam out of the gun because you spray it on a very high pressure to get this consistency. I used a lot of hardener to the point it was about dry when I went back to where I started 10 minutes earlier and the curing process was about finished. Lol
My crawl space is tight now.
My attic is half done. I have two more tanks to do and was in the attic spraying today. I did all the spaces on top of the ceiling today and hit the drywall with a thick 5 inches because I am getting tired of foaming. I used one tank today and will use the last two tomorrow. I hate that attic now. The crawlspace was better than the attic. So small and the roofing tacks are insane because I have not sprayed in some spots so there is still plenty of nails to poke you when you walk around the spot with no foam. But I will be done tomorrow and wish me luck. I am foaming around the wires for the solar kit I installed and I literally just cut pieces of that round column form for concrete to make the posts for foundation footers and deck footers and I cut a slit in them and put them over the wiring and set the wires inside the tubes that I cut to size. Then I am just spray foaming around the columns so there is a bulkhead of sorts that the wiring goes through instead of foaming the wires in and encapsulating them. It is all I got right now. I am beat and tired of thinking. So tired.
Stick with Fiberglass, Wool Rock, Newspaper and Cotton fiber products. Safer easier to clean and fix.
They also make a gypsum based spray insulation. I would never fill my walls with spray foam, God help you if you ever get an electrical fire.
I construct steel home's and buildings, we have used spray foam in quite a few of our projects without incident for year's now. I feel it was definitely on the installer for not following one or more of the steps on proper installation guidelines.
There is always those companies that do Bad business, Thats' why you gotta do your homework . But we would be in court and they would be paying for that removal.
Yup, my dad installs it for a living. Never had a problem.
Look at all those bubbels inside the foam! This is an indication for not enough ventilation.. foam needs sun and ventilation to curate otherwise nasty trimethylamine compound fishy smell will escape the foam into the building.
There's a good chance that it could have been installer error, but I'd also like to point out that there is a chance that there was a problem with the foam machine. Both are possible, and I've seen both cause issues. Hell, I've even seen a guy put $15,000 of open cell foam in a ceiling that wasn't even bid for it
@@mattcrandall5045 wow..big oops
Wife's grandparents had this done to the underside of their roof. They were persuaded it was a good idea and I remember saying at the time that wooden roof trusses need to breathe. After a couple of years this bad smell fell about the house and tbh the family thought it was the smell of 'old people'. The grandparents couldn't smell it as they lived there 24/7. The whole roof had to be replaced as the timbers in the roof had turned rotten.
This reminds me of the amounts of formaldehyde in FEMA trailers.
July 2021 CBC: Please do a follow up video for customers to carefully choose the right company to do their spray foam project. Keep it focused and brief with 'ten steps to follow before choosing your spray foam (or any other important company, project) company.
I would actually really appreciate that! Ive been looking into spray foam, it can be a great option for bus conversions and rvs, because it can add strength to the structure, and conform to the shape of the vehicle, but ive seen so many diy kits and even people who say “get a professional “ dont tell you what to look for. that really worries me tbh
You will never again run any wires or tubing through this these walls. Imagine the repair bill to replace some wires? Much better ways to seal a residence. I have 2in of insulation on the outside, under the siding.
I think ive seen that old man talking about russian roulette 6 times :/
Yeah lol
his favorite game
this comment is like playing Russian Roulette
Every 3rd like results in someone dying
10 years of spraying foam in maine and never had these problems
"I live and breathe insulation"
Might want to go see a doctor if that's true.
Alyas Grey
Nope, force him to eat and breath much, much, more since he enjoys it so much.
It was a "see how safe it is!" moment
To stripp the home down to frame will cost them more then a demo and a rebuild in labor
Lol so do I .. I'm in my 9th year . who says it's itchy . lol
Yeah he said it and sttudered while he said it. Lol
This is why you do your research on who you have come in. Cheaper is not better! Personally if I had any spray foam going in my house, I would request an experienced installer and ask for photos of previous work.
I feel like they went with the lowest bid and cheaper out
A similar spray foam insulation was used in Victoria, Australia in the late 1970s & was quickly banned after people suffered similar reactions to these people. Also several people died after the foam emitted deadly toxic fumes during house fires.
WOW, the thickness of the foam in the "after removal" video of the Canadians home revealed the HACK job the installer preformed. Grossly over sprayed, this was extremely to thick!!! It pisses me off that the Installer did not own up. Jerks like that give the product and installers bad names. Yes this was an installation nightmare. I own and operate Solid Ground LLC we use polyurethane foam to lift and level concrete as well as seal and support concrete culverts and underground pipe joints. The Polyurethane foam is 100 % Hydrophobic {fancy word for waterproof} as well as providing rigid support for the pipes.
Its is imperative to never spray Polyurethane Foam to quickly, Why? Because you need to let each pass of the gun completely set before you add another layer. Also you need to make sure the mixing chamber is providing the tightest pattern that lays down the thinnest layer of foam. I use a 4242 chamber in my Graco guns. Finally, you need to be patient and WAIT allow for each sequential application to setup and complete its chemical reaction and seal the bond. If you do not wait you will apply it to thick and a heating reaction will occur. I am happy the family has a new roof. Please do not call the Foam guys you used, they suck...
i figured it was the tip, but doubted it was a heat issue with the installer overheating the mixture. more like a pinched tube or unclean tip
Bill Williams Were are you from billy?
Spraying in a ditch is different then spraying in an attic. In a ditch you have no R factor.
Wasn't too thick. Was down in on coat instead of three layers or even 4 layers in an attic
im looking at spraying my basement (rim joists). i was told to spray fast as the gun needs to be cleaned and changed if you wait longer than 20 seconds before spraying. i was told the gun trigger must be pulled all the way or not at all, dont do little bits. and i was told to spray 3-4 inches deep for an R value thats worth having.
after doing research ive found the exact opposite instructions to all these points. i feel there is a definite lack of proper training/education on these products
i have a foam pack 620 that im gonna use tomorrow i think, see how it goes
Probably the 20th time this video has been recommended to me. FINE, I'll watch it.
RoboticusMusic I know. I’ll see the same video recommended for weeks. With all the billions of videos...
I don't even own a home, but it was recommended to me.
Hit the three little dots on the right or the video. Then click "not interested."
+RoboticusMusic >> So.... did you enjoy it? lol
Click the little vertical dots near the video's thumbnail, click not interested.
“There was nothing to tell us that we shouldn’t have been in the house” a good rule of thumb, if the people spraying the foam are wearing hazmat suits, maybe you shouldn’t be there. Anytime you see someone in a hazmat suit, just ask yourself, should I be wearing one of those too? I feel bad for these people but there were a few clues.
True, but then they are told that the guy is only wearing that cause he has close contact and on a daily basis with the fresh spray foam.
In Serbia, we use styrofoam that is totally clean (for walls) and glass wool with special nylon insulation for the roof. No health issues.
Can you post a link to glass wool product?
@@joeglasner1277 its fiberglass. Just normal stuff sold at home depot
For starters, I work in an industrial plant that manufactures polyurethane cooler and freezer walls. Needless to say I am familiar with the Poly/ISO make up. We go to great lengths to make sure we are working safely with these products. The chemicals and the application equipment are calibrated and checked several times a day. We have ours formulated for a 1:1 ratio. These chemicals are regularly tested when being delivered, in our storage and at point of use. Many factors come into play to achieve proper formulation. Temperature or environment is likely the most critical for us. Our formulation has been known to reach temperatures of °220f while curing. We also maintain a ambiant atmosphere temp of °125 for 45 minutes during the curing process.
My point is this... There are many variables that have to be within range for this chemical reaction to properly create an good end product. We have never received a batch of raw materials that was not good. All errors were done within our facility due to equipment failure or human error. You can say that it is an exact science. I can only believe that that the installers of the foam had their mixture off or possibly found cheap materials. I insulated my own attic with left over test materials 3 years ago and could not be happier with the results. I tested my results for the closed cell foam and achieved an r45 value for 6in for joist.
Besides, with all of the demand for residential foam insulation, the chemical manufactures have been tweaking the formulation. These products are not even the same as they were 6 years ago when this video was made.
Spray foam insulation is murder bro.
I would rather use insulation that has zero risks upon application and can be easily removed. Thanks.
As a spray foam contractor in Wisconsin, here's my advice if you want spray foam in the form of GENERAL guidelines:
1) Never allow a contractor to spray foam when it's too cold or too warm outside (this includes at least 12 hours post application.) Not below 40 degrees (in most cases) and not above 80 degrees Fahrenheit outside temp. (in most cases). Spray foam CAN be applied correctly outside of these parameters if it applied from inside a temperature controlled space and if a skim coat is applied (about 1/2") before the thicker coats are applied.
2) All foam should be applied in layers, no matter what the manufacturer allows. It is best to first apply a skim coat of 1/2 inch, wait 10 minutes then a 2" coat, wait 10 minutes then another 2" and so on. Foam needs time to cure and off-gas.
3) Make sure contractor has incorporated into their proportioner (Spray foam machine) an automatic shutoff should the mix of chemicals be incorrect. The two chemicals should be a 50/50 mix. Most newer spray foam rigs have this feature built in to the machine.
4) In winter, the foam truck should be heated to about 70 degrees fahrenheit 24/7 and in the summer, the rig should never be allowed to exceed about 85 degrees fahrenheit, 24/7.
5) Make sure the contractor tells you to leave the house for at least 24 hours after the work is completed and requires you to vacate the home during the application, animals included of course. If she or he does not bring this up, it is a red flag that that person is not paying attention to a VERY important detail. If that detail is missed, what smaller but also important details will be missed or what important procedures will not be followed?
6) There is seldom any reason to spray foam in open/accessible attics. You can safely and cheaply accomplish the exact same results of attic spray foam (for open attics) with a combination of air sealing the air leaks and blowing cellulose. The only time (in open, accessible attics) you may need to consider spray foam is when heating and cooling systems and duct work for them resides in the open attic.
Spray foam is a valuable tool for weatherizing homes and in certain situations, it is by far the best choice and should be considered but research your contractor.
Very articulate thank you for your comment
@rdbuchli good comment BUT why are the "professionals" putting the burden on consumers? This is why consumers get fed up and end up supporting regulated industries, because industry professionals won't put the burden on themselves for doing things right. Get a license and/or certified, or -- dare I say it -- get your work inspected/audited by a 3rd party. IF you would regulate yourselves, consumers as voting citizens wouldn't support having the Big Bro government look over your shoulder. So don't burden us consumers with details about the spray foam process. You mean well but undermine the value of your profession. If we homeowners should know details like this, then we'd just DIY! and not hire professionals!! See?
@@vap0rtranz Good question. The answer is that while most insulation contractors are indeed professionals, some do not show professionalism before during and after the job. To be fair, mistakes can happen to any contractor as well. All industries and contractors have this problem as we all well know so I would suggest only to do your research for any professional in any field you hire. That's one place where the internet shines in my opinion.
So, in Florida we have hurricanes. It was suggested to me that spray foam can be used not only as insulation, but as a way to bond the plywood to the trusses. Thus making your roof stronger in case a cat 5 monster comes knocking. Your thoughts? Oh, and what about fire retarding? Foam in general is lousy at that. I know there are different types, but the ones rated better must be a lot more expensive?
It seems like a lot of people stay home during and after...my husband works for one and it seems like the people are at home when they work and when they leave.
Great video and information. I am in the roofing business and I have seen several homes sprayed with spray foam insulation. I often thought that the spray foam would cause the shingles to prematurely deteriorate but I never realize that people are getting sick from Spray foam insulation.
Is from improper curing and too thick, no ventilation/ lack thereof... then too thick... and could have been hot that day...
We live in Georgia and had spray foam installed under our roof over twenty years ago with no issues. It lowered the temperature in the attic thirty degrees in the summer.
"I live and breath insulation" yeah maybe wanna rephrase that one :P
I am surprised that no one is foaming at the mouth.
If you're breathing insulation, you're doing it wrong. Doesn't inspire confidence to be sure.
How sad that’s a beautiful home that got chemically sabotaged . My heart goes out to all these people .
Not like it was purposely "sabotaged", but it is a terrible situation.
To be completely fair... even with the air test results the symptoms she claimed are ultra unusual. Also, they acutally should go back with a spray foam... just not the same one. They should go back with an Icynene foam... its probably the safest option and unlike polyuathane foam that takes a day to well over a week to clean out.... Icynene has an exclusion period of only 2 hours.
@@Wingnut353blow in insulation is the way not this trash
I was more impressed by the fact that that huge roof and ceiling were all removed in one piece.
Some people frame roofs that way too. Pretty neat. I myself have assembled sections of the roof on the ground and craned them up into place
@@bolerdweller a lot easier I guess if the wall plate is bolted and not nailed; still impressive lift.
@@linkspider they were probably nailed and hurricane strapped. Either way someone would have had to go around the whole perimeter and sawzall it out. Quite an intense job and all the electrical circuits would have had to be pulled, coiled and rerun afterwards. I've lifted a roof just for higher ceilings, this job is huge when you think it's just because they wanted to insulate the ceiling
@@bolerdweller lot of swearing
My heart breaks for these poor people. A home is supposed to be a sanctuary, where a family can feel safe and protected. This is terrible 😭
Bad contractors are 75%. I was an inspector for 40 years
Plot twist he chooses spray foam in the end with the same contractor
😂
Contractor " disappears " and his truck is found several miles away in a creek
Those chemicals need to be mixed to the exact specs otherwise you're gonna have a problem. It could be inexperienced or lazy installers.
My home was built in 1945. I was offered home spray insulation and I refused quickly on the spot. I was told about all the benefits and still declined. I run 4 window units not all at the same time but surprisingly the house stays rather cool in the summer. Living in south Texas the winters are rather short but it can get cold. Either way my average electric bill in the summer is 145 dollars 55 in the spring and fall about 150 if the winter is colder than expected.
Wow, wow! This must be a terrible product. And I don't believe staying away for 24 hr will not solve the problem. Instead, it sounds like a " life long problem." Thanks for the information.
That owner of the spray company should have had to sleep in the bedroom for two weeks or replace the roof.
I never wanted this stuff in my house because I can't imagine trying to run a wire through the wall once its done.
You should never do anything to your house that cannot be easily undone.
Craig Bartlett that doesnt even make sense cause they don’t cover them up for one and second it isn’t gonna make a difference cause if u have any sort of insulation your gonna have to still go through it with the wire and third it’s actually easier to push a wire through oak than anything else.. obviously you’ve never had any experience with it so maybe don’t make up dumb ideas.. everybody uses foam nowadays, it’s the only way to go as far as insulation..
It depends, my house uses flexible conduit, makes it a breeze to replace cables.
I was a telecom guy for 16 years. Dealing with spray foam homes is a nightmare. It was usually a 50+ year old home they had the basement sprayed. I would replace old telecom wires and it was really sketchy drilling in spots where power wires run and you cant see them or move them because of a big glob of foam covering everything.
@@Tom-xy7mx I have owned several houses over the years and never have I had to "replace a cable." The only thing I've done is add stuff that wasn't there to begin with. Flex conduit and raceways are only useful in one residential application: multimedia, where the cables change every 5 to 10 years due to technology improvements. There is absolutely no need to conduit your entire home. Talk about overkill, and added cost. Geesh.
@@famouspotato3617 lol wut? you must have 0 experience if your are spouting this. spray foam is a hard product, fiber glass isn't. you can easily fish a wire through fiberglass but if the space between the studs is entirely filled with foam you are going to have a much harder time. and yes, they DO cover the wires. also, pushing wires through oak? what does that even mean?
Have so much more respect for my new job being a spray foam installator
THEIR TRAILOR IS GREAT, LOVE IT
Formaldehyde is a big indication that the company is using old foam insulation chemicals to get rid of the old stock. By law in a lot of places they almost got shut down by the EPA for off gassing back about 20 years ago until they came up with the nontoxic formula they use now. But unscrupulous companies still mix some in to get rid of the old stock without having to get rid of hazmat fees.
William Kennison this is very helpful to know. Would this new formula be able to cause any of the same side effects? My contractor is saying they use the new formula however we still have odor and started to get sick. We moved out ASAP and am meeting with the company tomorrow.
There is no such a thing as a NONE toxic formula.
The new stuff may be less toxic.
Any unnatural material will be toxic to some extent.
We should not mess with nature but to live in Harmony with it.
@@PeaceNLiebe Any updates in this?
EPA? What's that? Was that like a government agency?
@Tom Cho: Before Trump, that was the Environmental Protection Agency. Now, it's the Everyone Pollute Agency.
Ill stick to old insulation that I can remove with my hands..thank you
@7:12 "It's that fishy odor again, same smell in the bedroom" I AM DONE. 😂🤣☠☠☠
Wow! I never knew… this is very good information to find out when you’re buying a house. My question would be what kind of insulation does this house have and how long was it installed?
What the reporter didn’t say was, what kind of insulation is better/safer…🤔
I feel bad for everyone dealing with this
Typical of north american programming - this video is 21 Minutes long and has about 6 minutes of actual footage. The rest is talking about what you're going to see, and repeating what you've already seen. Plus heap loads of dramatisation of basic facts.
+Marcos 989 This was made in Canada dumbass.
+Art Vanden Berg Lol, you obviously don't know how hockey and football times work. The time is interrupted for faceoffs, goals/ tds, penalties, etc (just how it is). Even though soccer keeps going, stoppage time is added on at the end. Also, they are all different sports, so it's an apples and oranges argument
Also, the stations are paid by companies to run their commercials. It's how the TV stations make money. Same with radio stations. Other countries run it differently, so again, an apples and oranges argument
+SpiderElectron This is just awful to watch, I mean, there are snippets of info scattered across the entire 21 minutes; for a second they say that the smell may come from a wrong mixture of chemicals and show the lab, the other second they are back to the interview for a minute...
+xXYannuschXx Yes and unfortunately more and more programming like this is coming from US and Canada.
+SpiderElectron So very true! Thank goodness we can FF on TH-cam unlike TV.
" when it's installed properly" sounds like industrial standards need to be reviewed
obviously it WASNT installed properly. You dont review industry standards because someone screwed up. Thats what insurance is for
@@churchchris1143 fine, industrial practices then xD. if its so easy to make such a harmful mistake then yes they definitely need reviewing
@@aidanhart9871 drive by wire has killed entire families and its still going to be the Industry standard some day. Flaws happen, engines explode, electronics fail. An industry review isnt even necessary. Anyone in the industry knows it was a bad mix. Companies have insurance so they dont have to pay for a roof and medical. Thats what insurance is for.......F-Ups
Standards are great. The fault was with the contractor and the sprayer.
No, it sounds like industry standards need to be adhered to.
This may have been mentioned in the more than 5 thousand comments but you can sandblast the material off. It's similar to asbestos removal. Wet it, bag it, sand blast the remnants on all structures.
Who on earth sandblasts asbestos? hahaha
@@alexiapepicelli1626 I wasn’t referring to sandblasting asbestos. I was referring to sandblasting the leftover spray foam. The similarities I was referring to are only the fact that with asbestos you have to wet it, and then bag it. You must also wear protective clothing and an N95 mask. I’m sorry you misunderstood.
their trailer is nicer than my house
Come live with me ;) J/K My house is a hell hole xD
ha, i was curious about someone who made this vid about themselves but I like your selections. You're interesting, I'm latching on so I can scour your collection. :)
Mr fathead, maybe you can stay with rolo Larson
Shelia Ellison mine too 😔
i have that same trailer for camping
guarantee you that the installer sprayed the entire cavity of closed cell in one pass
How can you not think it dangers. The man spraying it looks like he's about to cook meth.
They dress like that because the chemicals displace the air when mixing.
@Jure Nefashu yeah but one of the women said her son was in the room below sleeping when they were doing it. Especially in an attic where there's no proper ventelation it should not have been allowed to happen
That might be safer.
I know right!
Have you seen scuba divers?! That dihydrogen monoxide has killed countless people.
I cant see how the company let that happen. I was working in a 600 foot long shop by maybe 200 feet? Anyways we would call in spray foamers to spray a roof at a time. The front bay doors were open, large industrial size fans blowing down the corridors out the bay doors and 2/3 of the shop was quarantined off until it was safe and aired out.
We had our 19th century remodel open to the studs so we closed-cell foamed the whole house, including encapsulating the attic. We went with a reputable, experienced contractor who mixes and sprays it himself. It was not cheap but it was totally worth it.
I work for a spray foam company I have never once seen foam sprayed on the sheet rock in the attic we always spray on the ceiling and side walls. That was weird for me to see all that foam on the sheet rock
i was saying the same thing, i've sprayed it before and it was never sprayed on the drywall itself, only when spraying in interior walls. we'd hang one side then spray. but it was always on the decking. and it was new houses never did do retrofitting with foam
Derek Post yeah it's usually on the roof deck
that's what I asked! why wasn't this sprayed on the roof deck? maybe the ceiling drywall is that bad batch from China back in 2004? and the spray foam mixed with that, causing the smell.
I have been in contracting for 30 years and have never seen spray foam applied to drywall. I also suspect that might be a large part of the issue.
I work for a insulation outfit an we foam board it's not rare like you guys think it is no common but it is done
“I guess it won’t be a long tour” 😂☠️ that reporter lowkey trying to catch a fade lol
I have done demo on a flooded house where the entire "foamed in" floor joists needed removal. NIGHTMARE!! Cutting these huge "plugs" of foam out of the bays was not easy. We sawzalled thru a few pipes and wires...and the dumpster needed constant dumping...never again!
Halfway thru an I'm noticing that these installs look totally unprofessional, like they just sprayed over every item in a dirty, dusty, cluttered attic. I wonder if they bothered removing the boxed Christmas decorations or just sprayed right over them.
It sounds like the ambient air temp is critical at time of installation as well as thickness of the first pass as stated. I can imagine if attic temps are too high, the foam would cure on the edges but not the "interior". As far as insulating flat (not vaulted) ceilings go, blown-in cellulose is a good option in my opinion.
Taco Pro my father owns a spray foam business in Kansas and i have helped him for about 5 years just for reference
It is the fact of that they sprayed it too thick without letting it off gas and this is a story of closed cell foam not open cell btw and temp only makes it cure quicker it curing doesn't cure from inside just quicker but when u spray too thick it traps the curing gasses inside its self that's why this happened also if spray too cold if just doesn't really work well
Also a too thick of a single pass can self combust since the chemical reactions heat up it traps it own heat until it catches on fire
Open cell foam kn the other hand has no limit on the thickness of a single pass
Ok, she's worn two different types of filters on this video.
The purples are North 7580-P100 HEPA and don't protect against chemical vapor but do capture acidic fumes. The magenta stripe yellow are 3M 7093C P100 nuisance organic vapor/acid gas. If they use a tumble dryer in the house, that's the vector of toxicity that would result in the child's rashes since tumble dryers are wet cloth air filters that collect everything out of the air - they're almost as efficient as HEPA.
So in Florida the whole family was let stay inside the house? Wow. Horrible and completely illegal, the stuff is flammable.
I live in uk a concrete house an i could smell that smell for few years had someone rewire the lightswitch an the smells gone now
Hey there,
That’s crazy how fumes/smells can attach themselves to objects (paper, plastic, foam, wood, cinderblock,etc.) for months or years before Finally fading away.
🤔🤔🤔
It’s a blessing that you’re not having to deal with the smell anymore!!!
🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
I hope you and your family are all healthy and happy- post foam installation, and post covid...
Take care, and God bless
Holy sheets. I was literally just torn between spray foam and rolled out foam. Thank God I saw this.
Sealing the upper faces of timber ceiling joists with foam is not a good idea. It will still absorb moisture vapour from below, but not be able to lose it into the attic space. Damp wood will swell, potentially cracking ceilings and more seriously it may well rot over time.
Benzknees bingo
I'm getting ready to build a house this summer we were considering spray foam until I seen this video changed my mind for sure.
I find it really odd that this is so common anywhere in the world. Where I live there's constant talk about construction and how materials and spaces in construction are _essential_ to ventilate ie. formaldehyde etc. to out of the building. Where I live sprayfoam is pretty much only used to insulate something like gaps or perhaps certain areas like ventilation pipe or something. Never ever ceilings or walls fully. It's pretty much standard here to have rockwool insulation to allow breathing of materials. Sure there are particular elements made from basically sprayfoam materials, but they're elements made in factories and have ie. metal on top. Never organic materials. It must even be total hell for electricians and such to work after someone has sprayfoamed...Everything 😂
I know things like this happens every now and then, it's very unfortunate. But I think mineral wool such as rockwool might be a better option for insulation.
Thx - I will look into that product for my project.
@@TheJrzyKat is it expensive?
Not for basements! Great in attics.
I'm gonna stay with rock wool! Been using that for industrial-grade ovens and furnaces for years, and has proven to be efficient!
I don't know why but I can't stand the sound of like styrofoam rubbing on something and the sound of him cutting the foam just about made me go crazy
YESSSS worse than nails on a chalk board for me
For me it's metal surfaces or rough plastics
I have never used it, but I have always had this instinctive feeling whenever I get to come across certain toxic vibes, and the foam coating is one of them.
I normally love the Canadian version of these show and I use them in my business classes...this one was highly emotional and could have benefited from more investigation. I wonder if the original mixtures were not good or was there a problem with the new house (new houses can have problems with other materials). After some extensive soul-searching and research I elected to have a company remove the fiberglass insulation from my crawl space (sagging/falling and gross) and had them spray the perimeter joists and wall area which was less than 2 feet; I also had them spray the joists of the attached basement. That coupled with replacing the single pane basement glass has had a remarkable impact on my energy savings. The smell was noticeable only for the first day and dissipated after 24 hours as the contractor stated (we left every window in the house open for a few days to be sure). A year later and we couldn't be more pleased. The basement holds heat better with no drafts and less bugs. My wife commented the wood stove in the basement does a much better job. The basement has been transformed from a cold, gross eyesore to a valid place for my workshop. In short, pick the company carefully (my guys had a professional setup and they came across as super knowledgeable).
Llllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll mmmmmmm
Fossil fuel? 🤔 That 'sales pitch' eco buzz word is a red flag. Eventally this "eco friendly" product ends up in the landfill.
See Wastebot.
7:10 "Mmmm... its that fishy smell again, same smell from the bedroom". Well said my man
Hahahahaha
Looks at wife
Look out, folks! Don't use the foam contraceptives or lubricants!
Lol
😂😂😂
exhaust fan in attic
solar roof vents can be added to help remove vapors before being allowed to vent into jouse below.
a vacuum pulls air up through cracks, and then air gos up now down.
Thank you. I have fiberglass in my attic and ill keep it that way.
Me too, I’m buying a 66 year old house and the inspector said there’s not enough insulation in the attic, I said it’s fine, been fine for 66 years
I have it in my dutch house as well. Keep it that way. Want no chemicals!
Why are the doors and windows of the Francescini house closed in good weather? All of them should be open to let the gases out. The outgassing doesn't last forever.
One bad job after 15,000 installations? Sheesh, you'd hope your doctor and dentist had such a good track record.
***** The doors and window are shut because they're trying to artificially boost the percentages of any gases that may be there. The list of chemicals in the air didn't match those in the foam at all. Why's that? Off gassing of the glues in the wood in the furniture, the carpets, the foam in the bed, the plastic in everything, etc. They have a problem but not all the foam's problem, I'm thinking.
EXACTLY!! A HRV or ERV (depending on climate) is essential and frequently over looked imho.
+Linda Rossi In a normal situation no one leaves their windows and doors open all the time. what they are doing is natural. opening all their windows and doors is artificially removing the gas making it seem as if there is no problem.
Also the chemicals could have mixed when they where spraying and created new chemicals that the company is not aware of.
MrPepsicola123
"... the chemicals could have mixed when they where spraying and created new chemicals that the company is not aware of."
That's sort of like having a duckling hatching out of a chicken egg. It makes no sense. When the two components of urethane foam-in-place insulation are mixed, the results are fully known and predictable, regardless of the ratios.
***** There are variables that are not available within labs and unexpected, maby the roof had some chemicals already in it. maby the wood was special.
This could’ve easily been a 10 minute video. It wasn’t really informative and most of it consisted of repeating the same exact thing 20 different ways.
Natasha ..hi
That's reality TV for ya
I watch on 1.5 speed. It's a bit less painful to think that I didn't have to suffer as long for a bit of info.
thanks for the warning. this is why i scan the comments first. moving on! 👍🏾
Welcome to TH-cam.
In my opinion a good alternative would be using mineral wool (Rockwool) and covering that with a vapor lock. It requires more work though. But removing that kind of insulation and detecting a roof leak is much easier.
Not to mention that the rock wall won't Lose its insulatory value when it gets wet so after you let it dry out you can just replace it right back where it was taken out
This is crazy, we only use foam to seal around cables that go through a wall or something like it in Sweden. If i ever build a house i use rockwool or tree fibre isolation.
I know. I don't understand how Americans build their homes like that. I'm from Serbian, a poor country, and we always build with brick and isolate with stone wool or Styrofoam. Spray foam is only used to fix windows in position.
That fish smell is what most amines smell like and is used as a catalyst in these foams. They are generally considered neurotoxic among other affects and sensitization is not uncommon for things like isocyanates, also in the foam. Many of these amines are slow to evaporate as well and in that quantity could take years to offgas. These properties are well known to organic chemists and would recognize it instantly on walking into that room, not remotely surprising.
Or his old lady
Precisely friend. I work with such chemicals. That is amines. Not good.
Great industrie! Next step, spray foam removing companies.
Just use mineral wool ffs. Great for insulating, no way of messing this up (besides less efficiency if done wrong), is insulating much better than foam and can't burn.
Even better use foam board. Almost as efficient as spray foam.
foam board is foam
Thanks for this video, I was planning on doing this as a part of roof tar paper replacement. Not any more.
Spray foam insulation was used in thousands of houses in Australia. Then people started dying including installers. It was found to be carcinogenic, specially when it started to break down as it aged. It's second only to asbestos as the silent killer in building construction. We are in the middle of remediating or demolishing affected houses and buildings where it was used, specially in Canberra. The costs will reach hundreds of millions of dollars for which the government is picking up the tab. It was the government which approved its use in the first place.
Wow...added to list another reason I freakin love a and respect Australia so much, I'd love to live there!
Are you sure about that? I haven't read anything like that here in Australia. Perhaps you are referring to Urea-formaldehyde foam. In the 1970’s the use of Urea-formaldehyde foam insulation was prevalent and it took a decade for people to realise it remained hazardous after application. So I imagine there are still some cases of removal of that stuff.
The spray foam in this video is not and has never included formaldehyde. It is polyurethane product created by two materials; isocyanate and polyol resin. Once cured it is non-toxic.
The problem highlighted by this video is that it may not cure if applied incorrectly.
I know this was 3 years ago so any updates? Seems you could make a effective product that you could have lab tested to make sure it's safe and have endless opportunities with this stuff.
I learned a lot about spray foam after working with it for years the main 2 causes of foam problems is spraying to much foam at a time especially when it is cold and the dreaded crossover. Crossover occurs when the 2 different parts of the liquid foam is not mixed at a 50/50 ratio as it leaves the end of the sprayer. Their are a couple of things that can cause this which I will not get into much detail because I could write a book on problems with spray foam. The main problem I have seen that is the worst case scenario is when the two lines caring the two different liquids end up with different pressures allowing one part of the liquid to enter across the interior chamber of the gun and go up the other line. This will cause a restriction of the one line. A technician will clean out the mess in the gun and continue on spraying. Now because of the restriction on one line the foam is not mixed at the 50/50 ratio when it is sprayed thus it will never cure properly and will out gas for years. The proper thing to do is to replace the 10 to 20 feet of hose which is called a whip line to restore equal pressure to both sides. The whip line is like a extra section of garden hose that can be unscrewed and thrown away. When a crossover occurs it usually doesn't travel any further past the whip line which leaves the rest of the line in good condition. So proper cleaning of the spray gun and replacing the whip line will put you back into business. The foam also has to be heated in cold weather to a certain temperature before spraying for a good cure. One last thing, when foam is stored it needs to be stored above a certain temperature so the properties of the chemicals don't break down.
wow thank you so much for detailing that information. now I need a good technician in texas
I wish you would write that book! This is scary stuff!
You should have been the expert for the show. You spelled it out perfectly and now I completely understand. Thanks.
Just use the pink fiberglass, thats been around for decades. Why mess with a good thing.
good detail but old man Bernie Bloom said it simply:
"you're manufacturing this foam inside the home ... when it doesn't work and you're inside the house ..." you fill in the blanks
Quote "I live and breath, aaaaaah, Insulation!"
LOL.
The problem with this is the foaming was done years later.the whole home must be designed for foaming.when done right its great.never do later only on new construction
Once the roof was off, they should have had a SIP (Structural Insulated Panel) installed...and be done with attics for good!
"If it's not installed correctly" So why demonize the foam product and not the company that applied it?
Do you wind up in the hospital if blown in insulation is improperly installed?
@@johnkirby6700 if the blown insulation is fiberglass there is a chance. It just takes much longer to realize.
I haven't even watched this yet. I'm an insulation installer (6 years 5 states), and went "oooooooo this one should be good"
Problem is lot of spray companies are not training their guys and getting certified people to spray very dangerous if spraying closed cell anything over 2" at time can and will start a fire .