The most under discussed aspect of Undertale and Deltarune (Undertale video essay)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 2 ต.ค. 2024
- The gameplay of Undertale is really good but I feel like I almost never see anyone talk about it.
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After playing Undertale, many RPGMaker-esque games started feeling dated to me, in part because of how grindy the combat feels in contrast to Undertale's "meeting a new friend!" attitude. (figuring out a monster's quirks and how they respond individually or combo'ed with others)
Another thing about Undertale's items that I get why you didn't mention because it only work in specific cases, but I really love, is that some items have hidden uses. The first time I played Undertale I couldn't figure out how to spare Muffet, I lost all my health and was down to my last healing itm, which happened to be a spider doughnut I had kept since the ruins for some reason... only to find out that using it instantly spares her lmao, very memorable moment for me
You just need stall until the bettle ends
Her spiders will report that you're ok with spiders lol
You can use the stick to spare the dogs amd endogeny, you can also use it to mettaton to catch it with his mouth increasing the ratings, and maggic to think its an wand.
Hush puppy can spare endogeny
All defense items increase mettaton ratings(with the food of his chain)
i totally agree with your undertale item talk. when i play JRPGs, i try not to use items in battle, because you can stock 99 of each, and it makes any fight easy. by only using them out of battle, it stops it from being piss easy, and makes the healer class way more valuable in a multi-character party system.
In Deltarune's case, one thing I don't like is that sparing enemies does not require as much critical thinking as it did in Undertale, at least, not so far. You may notice that in most Deltarune battles, there are no incorrect acts, or information that throws you off the trail of the solution. You can perform acts in an suboptimal way, but nothing forces you to think about what a specific enemy needs from you to be placated, which leads to enemies in Deltarune feeling less significant. There are some exceptions to this, like the Swatchlings in Chapter 2, which require you to understand that they all need to be the same color. However, as of right now the solutions are very simple.
You could argue that this change was made to shift focus onto your party members, giving them many funny and endearing things to do in every fight. I just don't see why both can't be done at the same time.
We are still technically early into Deltarune's runtime. I admit it would be silly to critique Undertale's combat based solely on how complex it is during Snowdin. I just hope more people are willing to provide critique of Deltarune's gameplay so that Toby may feel more inclined to continue improving. He already identified many of the flaws of combat in chapter 1 and improved them for chapter 2, so I don't doubt that he knows when things could be better.
Adding onto this, the entire act system has one fatal flaw in both undertale and deltarune, and that is that, unless you're fighting a boss, you don't have to engage with the act system at all, i don't remember if the game tells you this, but you can just attack monsters until their name is yellow, and then spare them, completely ignoring the entire system
@@mizzix I don't really have a problem with that being an option. It's inherently risky, and as far as I can tell, most players don't do this anyway.
@@mizzix I mean, in Undertale you never engage with the Act system fighting bosses half the time.
Hell, the only time it effects the spare mechanics is with Mettaton EX.
I've thought about how Undertale was random encounters and Deltarune switched to overworld enemies that run into you, but I don't have any deeper insight into this other than just hearing one person one time complain they don't like random encounters.
Awesome video! Wish my one like counted as 1926 likes so we could get the next one.
5:32 I've heard that "Everhood" is an RPG with rhythm game-esque combat. Could be worth checking out.
9:00 The limited healing ends up being even more important in the Genocide route. With your increasingly large HP pool, most early-game healing items will do very little to aid you in the route's hardest fights. And full heals are *extremely* hard to come by, with only two existing in the whole game (and one of them is a joke item in the other routes, so you could very easily disregard it in Genocide).
The noodles aren't a joke item completely out of genocide.
There's something in the game called serious mode, which removes most jokes from items like changing "ButtsPie" to "Pie". This also decides whether the instant noodles should give you a full heal.
Iirc the fights that activate that are Toriel, Undying, Sans, Asgore and Asriel, though maybe not undyne and there could be some I'm forgetting...
@@revolug gotta love it when people say a spoiler but then say they won't say it because its a spoiler 🙃
My dad won't play Undertale because of the combat (he doesn't like bullet hells) and it kinda makes me sad ngl
Great video! Gameplay really is underdiscussed, though I disagree on one point, I think most people would try to go pacifist on their first playthrough of undertale, as the game heavily encourages it. They may fail to do it on the toriel or undyne fight, but they will be much lower level than the second playthrough (which likely involves a lot more fighting).
You're probably supposed to bring your old preconceptions of rpgs into undertale and do a neutral route first, since gameplay wise killing a monster is seemingly objectively better AND easier than sparing one.
Unless you're playing completely blind though there's no way a new player would do this after even knowing that pacifist is an option
Considering that sparing an enemy gives you no EXP and is usually harder, I'd say it's the opposite of encouraged. Toriel and a Froggit tell you about it, sure, but it's two characters you meet when you've only just started and know nothing about anything, and that's without getting into how the initial encounter with Flowey might make you paranoid about everyone you meet at the start. It's not until you reach the end of the Ruins that you really feel the consequences FIGHTing has, and even then, a new player might still not care all that much about common enemies (I sure didn't).
@@enderallygolem Shin Megami Tensei players trying to recruit froggits:
awesome vid dude!!! very well made.
I loved watching people playing Undertale.
And then I played it.
And then I never touched it again.
yeah! the dodging is alright but ACTing gets stale after meeting an enemy once or twice
@@Temulgeh I love Undertale, but the frequency of random encounters is a genuine problem IMO. I'm glad that you can at least see enemies in the overworld in Deltarune.
Such a great video to only have 260 likes!
I think one thing you really forgot to mention is random encounters. Idk exactly what you’d say about it, but I can definitely say that random encounters are by far my least favorite mechanic in games and I’m glad deltarune ditched it.
Undertale yellow, the fan game that just came out, only does it a little better. With a ton a variety that it never gets stale, and many more “safe zones” that allow a lot more freedom from battles.
Also, highly recommend checking that fangame out because the rhythm comment you made is quite relevant hahaha
this definitely isn't a huge deal but... it really bothers me how king and jevil basically require you to wait them out. i was worried the entire game would be like that and i'm very glad chapter 2 shook things up.
Hey chestnut, what is your opinion on the puzzles? I feel like it is such a huge part of the games while playing them yet nobody talks about them out of game except for in convos like “omg I was stuck on the hotland vents for so long”. So I’d argue that it is even less discussed than the combat system.
Edit: ok I just got to the end so I guess I’ll have to wait until this videos does really well. Since I am getting more views than you on my deltarune videos (which really surprised me like huh I used to watch you and now I am becoming bigger!?!?) I could promote it but even then I think 2K likes are a bit far fetched
I have not seen the entire video, but I wanted to be the first comment 🎉
5:02 no i didn't i forced my eye to stay open, lazy
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