I find the whole commentary from Chris really on the spot. And it's not the first time I found myself thinking that about his opinions and the way he put them out there.
The Legends module really is a stroke of genius. I couldn't believe how well it worked considering the simplicity of it. Having played Heat both solo and with five and six other players, I think you should always fill out extra spots (so that there are always six cards on the grid) with legends, because they work well and help struggling players with slipstreaming through corners. The only weird thing with the AI is that the blue car always draws the short end of the stick and finish last. If this wasn't based on 60s F1, you would think the blue car is a Williams.
In the 60s they raced with national colours and Blue was the American Eagle which did not do well. In the 1967 season (which the box art most resembles IMO), they retired from 8/10 races and the teams entire lifespan run of 25 races entered had 1 win. Seems accurate, lol!
Everything you all said makes total sense, looks great, sounds like it plays great but even with Zee's explanation I feel like I'd need to play it to actually understand it.
1. Yes, this looks awesome, and I'd love to give it a try. 2. But a couple of those mechanical mechanisms (no that's not a typo) are *completely* backwards! The spot for the heat deck should not have represented anything. Your deck represents the car, so heat going into your *deck* represents your engine overheating. That spot on the board should have just said "Heat" rather than representing the engine. And I promise you that if you slam your transmission down into 2nd or 1st while going at speed, you aren't *reducing* the strain on your vehicle! Your rpms with go through the roof, the temps will shoot up, and your fuel will disappear like magic. I've noticed games seem to think of gears as speed levels rather than efficiency modifiers. You have to reduce *speed* going into the corner, but you only gear down so you can come back out of the corner efficiently. It isn't cooling down your engine, it's actually ramping up the direct power tranfer from engine to wheels. Higher gears actually increase efficiency and let the vehicle run "cool" enough to go at higher speeds. And I love that starting in a higher gear off the line implies a quick burst of speed at the beginning rather than the complete opposite which is reality. But it all seems like it would work together well to make a truely strategic/tactical, dynamic (Mike again with the good word choices!) racing game. And it's good solo?! 👍
absolutely agree. dropping a gear before a corner is not cooling the engine in any way. You're raising the revs to be at it's maximum torque range coming out of the corner. The theme takes a huge hit here for me but I'll still check it out. Hard to imagine it's better than Rallyman GT
Yeah unfortunately while it FEELS thematic it’s the inverse of how gears interact with the engine in reality. Consider, however, that most people have no idea how gears work, especially with so much automatic transmission and that mechanically for the game it simulates the slowing down into corners and speeding up out of them well. I don’t know how you’d implement more accurate gear shifting without completely changing how the game is played and I’m not sure it would works as well. Also I do feel the heat in your “engine” is best thought of as how much you can push the car beyond its normal limit (excluding the gear shifting which as you described is inverted) without causing a catastrophic failure. It’s not a perfect metaphor either, because it implies that driving more conservatively is kind of fixing your car by cooling down but I think it’s just a bit weird if you get really into the theme of how it works. Mechanically it makes sense and it somewhat approximates things though. Unrelated to heat but I do wish they had a qualifying option for the grid order. Personally think it kind of works to do a lap and see how many turns of play each player needs on a solo lap to finish the track.
Actually, if your car goes slow it'll heat up. Race cars need to move in order to get air circulating through them to cool themselves. (I'll see myself out)
I really like the aesthetics of the game and the gameplay looks solid but I can't help but imagine a variant that's a deck builder with wacky races/speed racer antics.
What I find odd is that the heat mechanic makes heaps more sense if it was tire heat - one of F1s biggest elements is managing tire temp where some heat is good but too much wrecks the grip and slows you down or forces you to heat manage. With that they could have then added a pistop mechanic that let’s you dump all your heat if you “change tires”
Not my favourite theme, but it was thematic. I totally share Camilla’s point of view that you need at least one test playthrough. It is an attractive game; the little car pieces are nifty. I could see this becoming a classic game and possibly being in top ten games of the year.
I think if you think about it like the heat on the engine block is potential heat, so thats why it's bad in hand but when you put it back on the engine it goes back to being potential heat the would originate from the engine if created.
That's how I understood it. If it gets in your discard pile/deck, it means you got heat. If it's returned to that pile, you get rid of it, so your car cools down.
Looks cool! I just got my dad Formula D for his bday, and we're going to play it this weekend for the first time. This and Flamme Rouge are both on my list for possible future gifts for him. This one might be too complicated for him though... Thanks y'all!
Downforce is a great racing game with different levels of play, as you can play a simplified variant (in the rules) without the auction portion. My children and parents play it this way all of the time, and we still enjoy it immensely.
There's a good amount of content in there and a competent insert. But if this gets a bunch of expansion maps, I'm chucking the insert and fully utilizing that box space.
Box is well sized. There’s a great insert to sort everything out, the two boards are 3 layers thick and there’s 3 modules of extra content beyond the base game.
I’m impressed! If I understand correctly, You use a revolving deck of cards, but the you don’t buy cards. The cards that clog your deck are actually useful, but only when culled. And to use it, you gotta reintroduce it to your deck! Cards and gears and other systems all affect each other in very few steps
Makes me glad I learned this at a convention for the guy teaching it did great and we even added the garage cards. After just the first play I give this a 9 so I'm excited to hear that it gets better with more plays. Now it just needs to get in stock for me to buy it!
Seems like this might benefit from a Wingspan Swift Start pack type treatment. A small module for beginners that simulates one lap, perhaps a pace lap/formation lap. Or, a Terraforming Mars Prelude-ish module helping to set the game state, like qualifying for position.
It really doesn't. It is not strategic enough. It has none of the sweet positioning and tango of a race that Rallyman GT has. It's even less strategic than Flamme Rouge.
No way. Championship Formula Racing is the only race game that's all about how well you can drive you car. It's top in that category. My favorite racing game is Thunder Alley/Grand Prix. I know, what's his name, doesn't like the game because it's too slow. I got no problem with that.
Yeah sorry, but Downforce and other racing games are done quicker and easier. The HEAT system in this game is great but it confuses many casual gamers to the point of extended turns. Games taking 60-90 to do all the laps especially on the windy tracks like Italy etc. It's a shame as a lot of this game is great, but the length of time I'm sitting there waiting for my next turn its an off put. Also Flamme Rouge is great Kristo :P
Played this last weekend, and loved it. Super game. My one complaint is the price; because it has all those extra modules and extra board, the cost is above what I think it should really be for the weight of game, and will likely detract mass-market consumers potentially discovering & purchasing it. I wonder if they considered a slimmed-down version with expansion modules available separately but decided to just put it all in the one box? I would totally have picked up a "basic" version if it meant lower cost, then bought the extra "expansion modules" at a later date if I played the game enough . At the current price, it's just way too expensive to justify. Hopefully the price will come down though.
Disagree. The base game is way too simplistic. It REALLY needs the other modules to feel complete. Playing with the AI, the upgrade card drafting and the weather is kind of required to make this a complete game. Even then I wish there was a bit more going on.
Not a car guy but my guess is when you shift up and go fast you put stress "heat" on the engine. When you down shift you go slower and put less stress on the engine so it allows you to put stress on it later when you shift up again.
That's how it works in the game, yes, but real gears actually do the opposite. Higher gears actually reduce strain on the engine which *allows* for higher speeds. For instance, if your car gets stuck in first gear because of a malfunction, your engine is going to be roaring, overheating, and burning through fuel way before you get up to minimum safe highway speeds. But if it were to get stuck at a high gear, it would stall out at low speeds for lack of umph. If you slammed a car going at racing speeds down to first gear, the engine would probably explode. And if you tried to start from a standstill in 3rd, it would just stall out and never move an inch. So the gears are actually backwards (like the heat cards) in this game. The game still looks like it works great, it's just backwards from reality on a couple things.
Hi all, Those of you who have played Heat and Flamme Rouge with both Peleton and Meteo expansions, how different is Heat to those? To me it sounds alot like Flamme Rouge with both expansions included. Kind regards Kalle
This was a really interesting review. For the first half I was quite sure you weren’t going to rate it well. Yet you clearly all loved it! I don’t have a racing game in my collection yet, so I’ll definitely be looking at this. Thank you for the review!!
I never felt the game clutchy, everyone fully got it by round 3. I also never told people the heat storage area was the "engine", I just said it is where you keep your Heat cards. My only con is that it felt long, everyone felt game should be over by mid 2nd lap.
I was hoping this wouldn't be a Flamme Rouge reskin, as I simply adore that game. Seems different enough to own both... I really want this game now. Great review as always... thanking you all.
Oh it's the same designers, no wonder it felt similar! "A more complicated Flamme Rouge" went through my head; deck management, bad cards clogging your deck when you do certain things, slip-streaming rules. Even the rule from Flamme Rouge where you always move your cyclist to the right side of the track if possible is more complicated here (and I'm not sure why).
If you go through a corner too fast, you pay heat equal to the difference between your speed and the speed limit. If you don't have enough heat to pay, you spin out and go back to the space before the corner.
This box insert clearly has more room in it already prepped for new content like an expansion. Space for another game board, two more player colors, new road condition tokens and a few more advanced play cards... I wonder what the plans are for this and when.
In the Spanish version of the game, "heat" cards are named "forced engine". I think is a better way to name it and at least for me, it makes more sense.
Interesting, especially since it is addressed in the video at 17:00 that "heat" might not be adequate, but this brings up two new questions, First of all, what is the game itself called since "Heat" is in the title of the English version? Secondly what are the "cool down" cards called in the Spanish version?
I agree 100% with Camilla at 14:10 through 14:40. I've seen about 4 videos and I finally seem to be able to grasp it een though it'sreally not a very difficult game.
Thanks for this review! It looks neat, sort of like a hand management version of Formula D but somehow not sure if it grabs me as much as the excitement of rolling the various multi-sided dice that correspond to your gear in Formula D, and then seeing if you wipe out at the corners when you push your luck. There was a simplicity to that game that makes it somehow pretty fun and exciting every time I play it. Maybe the only downside was that it was a bit hard to catch up if you had several bad rolls in a row but still love it. Downforce (and Flamme Rouge) was alright but just didn't have the same feeling of racing excitement. Will have to try this sometime though.
Definitely agree with the discourse here. I had all the same thoughts, confusions, and criticisms. It's a fantastic game, but the iconography is a bit of a miss in many ways. I particularly feel mystified by the React step having 3 icons on it... when it's really just boosting or cool down, so why the heat icon? Also, while the individual mechanisms are very simple, the mechanics of how they come together and interact is difficult to wrap one's head around at first (and not super easy to explain). And I agree that the primary metaphor behind the key mechanisms and the theme (Heat) is pretty counter intuitive and head-scratchy. Its like taking Death cards out of your heart in order to represent damage and then returning the death tokens to your heart to represent healing.
The reason why there is heat icon in the react step is because once you start playing with the upgrade cards, they have heat as a mandatory cost to play those cards, there's even more icons in the advance upgrades all of which you can take in any order
I agree with everything you guys said about this game, except that I rate it a 10. Yes, it was a tricky to get into, but after 1 lap, it's a total joy to play. Thanks for your review. It did help convince me to acquire this game.
Awesome game! And it is sure that at least a 2 extra cars expansion (and fortunately 2 more tracks along with those) is on the horizon! This game deserved his 8.5 - 9 / 10! No question. Rule wise : Note that, the winner is not the 1st passing the finish line. But the one who goes the further after the finish line! (the only time the 1st passing = wining is if your opponents are still one corner/turn behind you at the very last corner) Sorry, It seemed important to mention it :) Big thumbs up for the IA module wich you want to use in every game to get more cars on the board, as it is so easy to manage and so much better for the theme and feeling. Also allowing the game to be great in solo! Can't wait to have more tracks to make huge championships! Cheers from belgium
I love the idea of Deck managememt, that uses the principals of deck building but the overall list of cards remain the same for each person. Any other game already did it?
I thought the term "clutchy" with regards to board gaming meant games where the winner of the game can be decided by one decisive factor (one strategy, turn, play ect...). For example, a clutch play is one that completely secures the victory. These guys don't seem to be using it in that way. Is there an alternate definition?
We're too old and uncool to use clutch in that sense. I mean it's like when you're driving standard/stick shift for the first time and you are bad on the clutch. It's not a smooth drive, gears grind and the car might stall out. But once you learn the nuance of how to use the clutch, you can drive great.
I think it is one of those multi meaning words. We used to say clutching up or he clutched up to mean he froze up before the race. I too often heard that from an old track coach. 😂
I'm interested in this, but for some reason never can get car racing games to the table.... The theme just doesn't seem to appeal to many people I play with, which is a shame.
Sounds like the best teach would be to “play” a lap open handed with the group and then start again “for real”. With that said, I don’t see why I would play this over Downforce.
@@grog3514 Not entirely true about Downforce, as there are multiple variants in the rules that allow racing without the auction portion of the game. This is primarily how I play with my parents and children, and we still have a great time.
It seems a very different game to Downforce to me. Heat is purely about winning the race and doing the best move for you every turn. Downforce is half a betting game, it's more about manipulating the race to the result you want than necessarily winning the race. Apart from the racing theme, I don't think they are that comparable.
Except in this included variant you are literally trying to cross the finish line first with your car, which makes it a race. Pretty sure Monopoly does not have that official variant in a majority of its iterations, since it is not a racing game. Don't know why this has to be an argument. Just wanted to point out that Downforce also includes a straight racing game in the reprint, for those who don't have the game and might be turned off by labeling it strictly an auction/betting game.
I disagree, this was much more strategic than Flamme Rouge. The designer has evolved since the. And Has re used what he designed into Flamme Rouge but made it much more interesting.
Yeah, but you remove heat from the engine. Even though in reality it means adding heat to the engine. So I kinda agree with them. I have no idea what to call it, instead of the engine.
@@SeenD The way I explained it to people was the engine was the cards rotating through your hand, discard, and play area. So you take heat into your rotation/engine when you push your car to the limit. It's technically not the correct explanation but they immediately understood it.
I think if you think about it like the heat on the engine block is potential heat, so thats why it's bad in hand but when you put it back on the engine it goes back to being potential heat the would originate from the engine if created.
Maybe it should have been coolant. As your engine loses coolant your engine heats up....adding coolant back to the engine cools it down. But I don't think racing cars add/lose coolant during a race so maybe that's not better
Wonder which people prefer between this, Downforce, and Formula D. I'm a big motorsport fan, and would love to get a boardgame with this theme. I guess Rallyman could be in consideration as well.
Those are all great games but get this one. Downforce is mostly a betting game and Formula D can drag if people start counting out their turns. This game plays smoother and feels exciting.
@@grog3514 Well...a little late. :) We got Formula D for Christmas. We've really enjoyed playing it, though, and the kids have asked to bring it out a few times. Perhaps this will be an eventual follow up, but I do love the theming of at least the Formula racing in Formula D. Thanks for the insight!
Wow, this seems really fun. I almost pre-ordered it, but then I realize it's about racing cars. Delete...thank goodness...I avoid yet another game on the shelf that would never be played...whooph! But for you race car fans...it looks groovy 👍
I’m a little bit of a racing fan, but not huge and none of the people I’ve played with are racing fans in any way. Everyone still loves it. Very worth checking out still imo.
This is nearly every mid complexity game and up. Hard to explain, all clicks after a play through. Totally agree that some of the iconography isn’t intuitive until after that initial play through. Lots of strategy and I really fell in control of my car and how I can plan my race to win.
@@Dave286i I know Quest For Eldorado. It’s fun having different cards unlock as you go. But it suffers the same thing that most deckbuilders suffer from; “Hey, I got this thing. Can I use it? No. When can I use it? Eventually”. Like you have ordered the card off Amazon and don’t know when you’re going to get it. I love that Heat doesn’t have deckbuilding in it. For me it’s much more about timing.
I just noticed that the shadows cast by artwork elements on the game board fall in different directions. Not a deal breaker, but a bit disappointing for a DoW title.
I just played this at BGG and I liked it. The rule book is terrible for such a simple game. Also, the gear shifter and player mat are not well made. Formula D does those better. Zee is right about the thematic disconnect with the Stress and Heat cards. The game play is fun and I'm excited to do more when it comes out in the US.
I’m very torn on this. I love Flamme Rouge, but what makes that game fantastic is it’s elegance. This looks interesting on one hand, but I almost feel they went about 20% too far with the rules grit.
Let's talk about the Elephant in the Room shall we? They didn't say anything about Down Force or Formula D and how it compares. Why should I buy this? ...if my fun with Formula D is practically complete? (Just playing devil's advocate there). At first glance this look almost exactly like Formula D with cards.
I think the rules say that if you need to spend a Heat card and don't have any, then you "spin out". Why oh why doesn't it say that you "overheat"?? That's definitely how I'm going to explain it to other people.
It’s because the only time you NEED to spend a heat to prevent a heat is in corners. The best way to think of heat in the engine imo is how much additional stress you can put on the car to push beyond its limits. If you overdo it in a corner, you lose control of the car. Theoretically you might crash out, but they can’t really translate that into a game as effectively so it’s a spin out. Think of it like in a racing video game, you try to corner way too fast and turn hard you either crash or you lose control of the car and spin. That’s what the heat is representing. Any other scenario that may require heat, you’re just not allowed to do if you don’t have available heat. You can run fine with an empty heat chamber too, so it’s not really an overheated car.
Thanks a lot for the review guys/girls, really good stuff. I am not a big fan of racing games but this one is an exception, its a bit tricky to learn but the gameplay keeps being interesting several races in which is rare!
It's very different to Downforce. Heat is a pure racing game, you are racing to win. Downforce is half a betting game, and is about manipulating the race to the result you want. Often it's about getting to certain spots to block others to force them to move you. I don't think they are that comparable despite theme.
Heat is superior to downforce in every way. I am wondering if downforce would be a better game than it is without the blocking rule. Unlike the game boy geek i find downforce very repetitive. It is always the first car to block the corners that wins. Heat is a much more open game.
@@torelaursen4139 Without the blocking rule Downforce is barely even a game. Also it's not true that the first car to block the corners wins, that's like the theory of the leader at the betting lines always wins. It's only true if the others don't do anything to stop them/help them win. After a while players will realise that you should be ganging up on the people in that position, otherwise you are just gifting victory to them. Also note the expansion maps are even harder to do this as the blocking corners aren't right at the beginning, and there's less of them.
Zee with confidence: "There's just not a lof ot racing games." - The others nod their heads, politely, make some gestures of agreement, while (*probably) thinking: "We love you Zee but... what the heck, man!? Where did you bring this one from?" (*) Or this is just my own opinion on Zee's insight, which I projected on them.
Never played classic car wars but don't really see how weapons in a racing game would ever work. Seem like you'd either be in the lead and getting shot, or not in the lead and shooting. Silly kart races are a different matter of course.
Gotta agree with the comment about calling them Heat cards. Thematically it's just silly and makes zero sense. It would have been far better to name the Heat cards as Stress cards, and then name the Stress cards something else entirely.
I think what they are saying was that it felt backwards because the harder you push your engine, you remove heat from your engine and put it in your hand. The section of your board where heat is stored shows an engine symbol and as you overheat, you remove heat from this area. It feels right and thematic when you are doing it, but the symbology makes it seem backwards and hurts the teach.
Way too expensive for what it is and underwhelming to me. I had one random minor slip up in the game I played and my whole game for 30 min was unrecoverable after receiving all the heat cards . I don't like how punishing this game is.
I get what they are saying, but they kind of overstated the "complexity" from your first lap. I agree the iconography could be better, but it's totally minimal. This game is easy and super good.
Perhaps a clarification of the word “clutchy” is in order, as much as it’s being used here. The definition I’m seeing has no relationship whatsoever to this discussion.
This here is a little too random, too many catch-up options, too little jockeying for positions. It's less strategic than both Flamme Rouge AND Rallyman GT.
Don’t really agree here. There is randomness, but it’s pretty influenced by your own actions as a player. Racing poorly increases your randomness through stress, but that’s the representation of you having lost concentration and now anxious to get back into it. The catchup options are really nice to have, because even with them it’s really easy to be out of the race. You NEED to run all 6 cars imo, it makes position jockeying more exciting and gives more opportunities for it. The AI driver module is extremely streamlined and running 1 or 5 AI drivers is pretty much equivalent effort. Most of the positional battles happen out the gate and in corners, which makes sense to me. Sometimes you get a clear leader and it’s a battle for other positions, sometimes the grid stays close until one person has a disaster or someone is able to break out a bit. The strategic aspects are all in the hand and heat management, it doesn’t entirely come through in the first game, but it is there.
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I love these group reviews. So much better than a single reviewer. Keep doing what you're doing guys!
Unless the single reviewer is Tom, obviously
I find the whole commentary from Chris really on the spot. And it's not the first time I found myself thinking that about his opinions and the way he put them out there.
The Legends module really is a stroke of genius. I couldn't believe how well it worked considering the simplicity of it. Having played Heat both solo and with five and six other players, I think you should always fill out extra spots (so that there are always six cards on the grid) with legends, because they work well and help struggling players with slipstreaming through corners. The only weird thing with the AI is that the blue car always draws the short end of the stick and finish last. If this wasn't based on 60s F1, you would think the blue car is a Williams.
In the 60s they raced with national colours and Blue was the American Eagle which did not do well. In the 1967 season (which the box art most resembles IMO), they retired from 8/10 races and the teams entire lifespan run of 25 races entered had 1 win.
Seems accurate, lol!
At the 6 games I played with legends, green always finished last of the legends. :) Often the driver had a 0 or 1 to drive the corners.
My hype in board games does not came from kickstarter campaigns, it came for you guys. Excellent video as always.
Everything you all said makes total sense, looks great, sounds like it plays great but even with Zee's explanation I feel like I'd need to play it to actually understand it.
1. Yes, this looks awesome, and I'd love to give it a try.
2. But a couple of those mechanical mechanisms (no that's not a typo) are *completely* backwards! The spot for the heat deck should not have represented anything. Your deck represents the car, so heat going into your *deck* represents your engine overheating. That spot on the board should have just said "Heat" rather than representing the engine.
And I promise you that if you slam your transmission down into 2nd or 1st while going at speed, you aren't *reducing* the strain on your vehicle! Your rpms with go through the roof, the temps will shoot up, and your fuel will disappear like magic.
I've noticed games seem to think of gears as speed levels rather than efficiency modifiers. You have to reduce *speed* going into the corner, but you only gear down so you can come back out of the corner efficiently. It isn't cooling down your engine, it's actually ramping up the direct power tranfer from engine to wheels. Higher gears actually increase efficiency and let the vehicle run "cool" enough to go at higher speeds.
And I love that starting in a higher gear off the line implies a quick burst of speed at the beginning rather than the complete opposite which is reality.
But it all seems like it would work together well to make a truely strategic/tactical, dynamic (Mike again with the good word choices!) racing game. And it's good solo?! 👍
absolutely agree. dropping a gear before a corner is not cooling the engine in any way. You're raising the revs to be at it's maximum torque range coming out of the corner. The theme takes a huge hit here for me but I'll still check it out. Hard to imagine it's better than Rallyman GT
Yeah unfortunately while it FEELS thematic it’s the inverse of how gears interact with the engine in reality. Consider, however, that most people have no idea how gears work, especially with so much automatic transmission and that mechanically for the game it simulates the slowing down into corners and speeding up out of them well. I don’t know how you’d implement more accurate gear shifting without completely changing how the game is played and I’m not sure it would works as well.
Also I do feel the heat in your “engine” is best thought of as how much you can push the car beyond its normal limit (excluding the gear shifting which as you described is inverted) without causing a catastrophic failure. It’s not a perfect metaphor either, because it implies that driving more conservatively is kind of fixing your car by cooling down but I think it’s just a bit weird if you get really into the theme of how it works. Mechanically it makes sense and it somewhat approximates things though.
Unrelated to heat but I do wish they had a qualifying option for the grid order. Personally think it kind of works to do a lap and see how many turns of play each player needs on a solo lap to finish the track.
We just played this at BGG Con and REALLY liked it
Actually, if your car goes slow it'll heat up. Race cars need to move in order to get air circulating through them to cool themselves.
(I'll see myself out)
Hmm strange they thought it was unintuitive.I thought with Zees explanation I can pretty much play this game already.
The overview had me thinking that this is a clunkier flamme rouge so interested to play it to see what the guys saw
I really like the aesthetics of the game and the gameplay looks solid but I can't help but imagine a variant that's a deck builder with wacky races/speed racer antics.
What I find odd is that the heat mechanic makes heaps more sense if it was tire heat - one of F1s biggest elements is managing tire temp where some heat is good but too much wrecks the grip and slows you down or forces you to heat manage. With that they could have then added a pistop mechanic that let’s you dump all your heat if you “change tires”
Not my favourite theme, but it was thematic. I totally share Camilla’s point of view that you need at least one test playthrough. It is an attractive game; the little car pieces are nifty. I could see this becoming a classic game and possibly being in top ten games of the year.
I think if you think about it like the heat on the engine block is potential heat, so thats why it's bad in hand but when you put it back on the engine it goes back to being potential heat the would originate from the engine if created.
That's how I understood it. If it gets in your discard pile/deck, it means you got heat. If it's returned to that pile, you get rid of it, so your car cools down.
Looks cool! I just got my dad Formula D for his bday, and we're going to play it this weekend for the first time. This and Flamme Rouge are both on my list for possible future gifts for him. This one might be too complicated for him though... Thanks y'all!
Downforce is a great racing game with different levels of play, as you can play a simplified variant (in the rules) without the auction portion. My children and parents play it this way all of the time, and we still enjoy it immensely.
Just got the game myself and exited to get it on the table. Disappointing that the box seems oversized for the physical content though
There's a good amount of content in there and a competent insert. But if this gets a bunch of expansion maps, I'm chucking the insert and fully utilizing that box space.
Box is well sized. There’s a great insert to sort everything out, the two boards are 3 layers thick and there’s 3 modules of extra content beyond the base game.
WOW! Glad to see that everyone likes this game so much! Added to the top of my Christmas list.
I’m impressed! If I understand correctly, You use a revolving deck of cards, but the you don’t buy cards.
The cards that clog your deck are actually useful, but only when culled.
And to use it, you gotta reintroduce it to your deck!
Cards and gears and other systems all affect each other in very few steps
Makes me glad I learned this at a convention for the guy teaching it did great and we even added the garage cards. After just the first play I give this a 9 so I'm excited to hear that it gets better with more plays. Now it just needs to get in stock for me to buy it!
It was a hot game at Tokencon and it was the only game that was constantly being played all three days. And there was two copies always being played.
Seems like this might benefit from a Wingspan Swift Start pack type treatment. A small module for beginners that simulates one lap, perhaps a pace lap/formation lap. Or, a Terraforming Mars Prelude-ish module helping to set the game state, like qualifying for position.
This game knocks every other racing game out of the park😊 excellent
It really doesn't. It is not strategic enough. It has none of the sweet positioning and tango of a race that Rallyman GT has. It's even less strategic than Flamme Rouge.
No way. Championship Formula Racing is the only race game that's all about how well you can drive you car. It's top in that category. My favorite racing game is Thunder Alley/Grand Prix. I know, what's his name, doesn't like the game because it's too slow. I got no problem with that.
@@KristoVaher Just can't get over that constantly shifting is faster than staying in 5th gear in Rallyman.
Yeah sorry, but Downforce and other racing games are done quicker and easier. The HEAT system in this game is great but it confuses many casual gamers to the point of extended turns. Games taking 60-90 to do all the laps especially on the windy tracks like Italy etc. It's a shame as a lot of this game is great, but the length of time I'm sitting there waiting for my next turn its an off put.
Also Flamme Rouge is great Kristo :P
@@TheBrokenMeeple hm, so sorta like Automobiles? Where players can think thru multiple ways to lay down their cubes which often can take awhile.
Played this last weekend, and loved it. Super game. My one complaint is the price; because it has all those extra modules and extra board, the cost is above what I think it should really be for the weight of game, and will likely detract mass-market consumers potentially discovering & purchasing it. I wonder if they considered a slimmed-down version with expansion modules available separately but decided to just put it all in the one box? I would totally have picked up a "basic" version if it meant lower cost, then bought the extra "expansion modules" at a later date if I played the game enough . At the current price, it's just way too expensive to justify. Hopefully the price will come down though.
Disagree. The base game is way too simplistic. It REALLY needs the other modules to feel complete. Playing with the AI, the upgrade card drafting and the weather is kind of required to make this a complete game. Even then I wish there was a bit more going on.
Not a car guy but my guess is when you shift up and go fast you put stress "heat" on the engine. When you down shift you go slower and put less stress on the engine so it allows you to put stress on it later when you shift up again.
That's how it works in the game, yes, but real gears actually do the opposite. Higher gears actually reduce strain on the engine which *allows* for higher speeds.
For instance, if your car gets stuck in first gear because of a malfunction, your engine is going to be roaring, overheating, and burning through fuel way before you get up to minimum safe highway speeds. But if it were to get stuck at a high gear, it would stall out at low speeds for lack of umph.
If you slammed a car going at racing speeds down to first gear, the engine would probably explode. And if you tried to start from a standstill in 3rd, it would just stall out and never move an inch.
So the gears are actually backwards (like the heat cards) in this game.
The game still looks like it works great, it's just backwards from reality on a couple things.
Hi all,
Those of you who have played Heat and Flamme Rouge with both Peleton and Meteo expansions, how different is Heat to those?
To me it sounds alot like Flamme Rouge with both expansions included.
Kind regards
Kalle
This was a really interesting review. For the first half I was quite sure you weren’t going to rate it well. Yet you clearly all loved it! I don’t have a racing game in my collection yet, so I’ll definitely be looking at this. Thank you for the review!!
I never felt the game clutchy, everyone fully got it by round 3. I also never told people the heat storage area was the "engine", I just said it is where you keep your Heat cards. My only con is that it felt long, everyone felt game should be over by mid 2nd lap.
I was hoping this wouldn't be a Flamme Rouge reskin, as I simply adore that game. Seems different enough to own both... I really want this game now. Great review as always... thanking you all.
Oh it's the same designers, no wonder it felt similar! "A more complicated Flamme Rouge" went through my head; deck management, bad cards clogging your deck when you do certain things, slip-streaming rules. Even the rule from Flamme Rouge where you always move your cyclist to the right side of the track if possible is more complicated here (and I'm not sure why).
@@Naeddyr It's for theme....keeping cars on the inside of the turn. For me, I like the thematic nod over the slightly simpler rule in Flamme Rouge
@@paulwilkins4332 I guess that explains it.
I too love the group reviews. This one looks really great! On the Wish List it goes!
Star Wars Podracing version next? Great review and can’t wait for my Amazon delivery this week 😊
I've been looking for the right racing game to get, and I have high hopes for this one. I'm hyped that they all liked it!
This+ galaxy trucker= the anime Redline board game.. would be rad!
Are there additional negatives to blowing thru a curve besides taking on heat? A spin out or something? Loss of position?
If you go through a corner too fast, you pay heat equal to the difference between your speed and the speed limit. If you don't have enough heat to pay, you spin out and go back to the space before the corner.
This box insert clearly has more room in it already prepped for new content like an expansion. Space for another game board, two more player colors, new road condition tokens and a few more advanced play cards... I wonder what the plans are for this and when.
In the Spanish version of the game, "heat" cards are named "forced engine". I think is a better way to name it and at least for me, it makes more sense.
Interesting, especially since it is addressed in the video at 17:00 that "heat" might not be adequate, but this brings up two new questions, First of all, what is the game itself called since "Heat" is in the title of the English version? Secondly what are the "cool down" cards called in the Spanish version?
I agree 100% with Camilla at 14:10 through 14:40. I've seen about 4 videos and I finally seem to be able to grasp it een though it'sreally not a very difficult game.
Thanks for this review! It looks neat, sort of like a hand management version of Formula D but somehow not sure if it grabs me as much as the excitement of rolling the various multi-sided dice that correspond to your gear in Formula D, and then seeing if you wipe out at the corners when you push your luck. There was a simplicity to that game that makes it somehow pretty fun and exciting every time I play it. Maybe the only downside was that it was a bit hard to catch up if you had several bad rolls in a row but still love it. Downforce (and Flamme Rouge) was alright but just didn't have the same feeling of racing excitement. Will have to try this sometime though.
Definitely agree with the discourse here. I had all the same thoughts, confusions, and criticisms. It's a fantastic game, but the iconography is a bit of a miss in many ways. I particularly feel mystified by the React step having 3 icons on it... when it's really just boosting or cool down, so why the heat icon? Also, while the individual mechanisms are very simple, the mechanics of how they come together and interact is difficult to wrap one's head around at first (and not super easy to explain).
And I agree that the primary metaphor behind the key mechanisms and the theme (Heat) is pretty counter intuitive and head-scratchy. Its like taking Death cards out of your heart in order to represent damage and then returning the death tokens to your heart to represent healing.
The reason why there is heat icon in the react step is because once you start playing with the upgrade cards, they have heat as a mandatory cost to play those cards, there's even more icons in the advance upgrades all of which you can take in any order
I agree with everything you guys said about this game, except that I rate it a 10. Yes, it was a tricky to get into, but after 1 lap, it's a total joy to play. Thanks for your review. It did help convince me to acquire this game.
Great game. No matter if you're a beginner or an expert everyone can enjoy and keep up with the leaders due to the slipstream mechanic.
This or Flamme Rouge if you don’t have either yet?
We all knew Mike liked the art without watching the video.
That said, I agree.
Awesome game!
And it is sure that at least a 2 extra cars expansion (and fortunately 2 more tracks along with those) is on the horizon!
This game deserved his 8.5 - 9 / 10! No question.
Rule wise : Note that, the winner is not the 1st passing the finish line. But the one who goes the further after the finish line!
(the only time the 1st passing = wining is if your opponents are still one corner/turn behind you at the very last corner)
Sorry, It seemed important to mention it :)
Big thumbs up for the IA module wich you want to use in every game to get more cars on the board, as it is so easy to manage and so much better for the theme and feeling.
Also allowing the game to be great in solo!
Can't wait to have more tracks to make huge championships!
Cheers from belgium
My copy will be here before Christmas !!! Yeah !!
I love the idea of Deck managememt, that uses the principals of deck building but the overall list of cards remain the same for each person.
Any other game already did it?
picked this one up at Essen spiel. Great racing game indeed.
I thought the term "clutchy" with regards to board gaming meant games where the winner of the game can be decided by one decisive factor (one strategy, turn, play ect...). For example, a clutch play is one that completely secures the victory. These guys don't seem to be using it in that way. Is there an alternate definition?
We're too old and uncool to use clutch in that sense. I mean it's like when you're driving standard/stick shift for the first time and you are bad on the clutch. It's not a smooth drive, gears grind and the car might stall out. But once you learn the nuance of how to use the clutch, you can drive great.
I think it is one of those multi meaning words. We used to say clutching up or he clutched up to mean he froze up before the race. I too often heard that from an old track coach. 😂
Thought I didn't need more racing games, but this one looks really good.
Im sold, just preordered it. Looks amazing
I think the heat mechanic is genius
A little late, but another minor detail...it's not days of thunder. Thanks for the video! Great job.
I'm interested in this, but for some reason never can get car racing games to the table.... The theme just doesn't seem to appeal to many people I play with, which is a shame.
Sounds like the best teach would be to “play” a lap open handed with the group and then start again “for real”. With that said, I don’t see why I would play this over Downforce.
This is a racing game. Down force is a racing themed betting game with racing elements. Everyone technically controls all the cars.
@@grog3514 Not entirely true about Downforce, as there are multiple variants in the rules that allow racing without the auction portion of the game. This is primarily how I play with my parents and children, and we still have a great time.
It seems a very different game to Downforce to me. Heat is purely about winning the race and doing the best move for you every turn. Downforce is half a betting game, it's more about manipulating the race to the result you want than necessarily winning the race. Apart from the racing theme, I don't think they are that comparable.
@@kcthebarbarian I used to play Monopoly as a race with a racing variant too. Yet Monopoly is still not a racing game.
Except in this included variant you are literally trying to cross the finish line first with your car, which makes it a race. Pretty sure Monopoly does not have that official variant in a majority of its iterations, since it is not a racing game. Don't know why this has to be an argument. Just wanted to point out that Downforce also includes a straight racing game in the reprint, for those who don't have the game and might be turned off by labeling it strictly an auction/betting game.
Love Flamme Rouge. Just need Heat now.
It's less strategic than Flamme. Beware.
I disagree, this was much more strategic than Flamme Rouge. The designer has evolved since the. And Has re used what he designed into Flamme Rouge but made it much more interesting.
Thanks! Great review.
If you like racing, definitely try Charioteer, GMT games, Matt Caulkins designer. It’s a real race.
17:30 I guess the way I think about it it's not so much that you pay heat but that you take heat. And the engine space is just there to store it.
Yeah, but you remove heat from the engine. Even though in reality it means adding heat to the engine. So I kinda agree with them. I have no idea what to call it, instead of the engine.
@@SeenD The way I explained it to people was the engine was the cards rotating through your hand, discard, and play area. So you take heat into your rotation/engine when you push your car to the limit. It's technically not the correct explanation but they immediately understood it.
First time i've seen this game. Will now buy it based on your review👍
I like how Kickstarter has become a dirty word.
Looks like the price is $60 at GameNerdz. Not sure if I see the value yet, but may watch some other reviews to get a few more viewpoints.
Thanks for the review. Ordered it just now (so my wife can give it to me for Christmas) 😉😎
how do you feel about Heat compared to Downforce?
Downforce plays much faster - they didn't mention that this game is 60-90 min with a big group of new players.
@@TheBrokenMeeple It does not take 90 mins to run 2 laps unless everyone is a first time board gamer.
Oh you mean the target audience for the most part ? This is not a game intended for heavy gamers to be playing constantly.
Ok...I now may be sold on this game. It seems less...lucky?...than Formula De, which I like. Great review everyone!
Great breakdown, gang👏 Sold-o🎲
I agree with Zee on the heat cards. I heard about the game the first time and wondered what they were thinking there
I think if you think about it like the heat on the engine block is potential heat, so thats why it's bad in hand but when you put it back on the engine it goes back to being potential heat the would originate from the engine if created.
Maybe it should have been coolant. As your engine loses coolant your engine heats up....adding coolant back to the engine cools it down. But I don't think racing cars add/lose coolant during a race so maybe that's not better
In the Spanish version of the game, the heat cards are called "forzar motor", or "forced engine". Is that a better way to name it?.
@@Max-pj9km that seems odd. There may be more to the way that is used though.
@@pfcravt yes, but that's how this type of card is named
Wonder which people prefer between this, Downforce, and Formula D. I'm a big motorsport fan, and would love to get a boardgame with this theme. I guess Rallyman could be in consideration as well.
Don't forget Thunder Alley! ;)
Those are all great games but get this one. Downforce is mostly a betting game and Formula D can drag if people start counting out their turns. This game plays smoother and feels exciting.
@@grog3514 Well...a little late. :) We got Formula D for Christmas. We've really enjoyed playing it, though, and the kids have asked to bring it out a few times. Perhaps this will be an eventual follow up, but I do love the theming of at least the Formula racing in Formula D. Thanks for the insight!
@@evanb6862 oh yeah, formula D is still fun! Rolling that giant die in 5th gear is a always a thrill!
Rallyman's a solo racer.
Seems to feel like rallyman gt. That game (rallyman gt) had the racing feel, and strategy.
Thanks
Wow, this seems really fun. I almost pre-ordered it, but then I realize it's about racing cars. Delete...thank goodness...I avoid yet another game on the shelf that would never be played...whooph! But for you race car fans...it looks groovy 👍
I’m a little bit of a racing fan, but not huge and none of the people I’ve played with are racing fans in any way. Everyone still loves it. Very worth checking out still imo.
I can concur that this is an amazing game! Thank you for the great review!
This is nearly every mid complexity game and up. Hard to explain, all clicks after a play through.
Totally agree that some of the iconography isn’t intuitive until after that initial play through.
Lots of strategy and I really fell in control of my car and how I can plan my race to win.
How is this solo?
Crazy I also gave this an 8.5
This is the best racing game out there. Period.
Do a test lap first and race for pole position.
With the modules it is amaaazing!
do u know quest for eldorado? more fun, propper deckbuilder
@@Dave286i I know Quest For Eldorado. It’s fun having different cards unlock as you go. But it suffers the same thing that most deckbuilders suffer from; “Hey, I got this thing. Can I use it? No. When can I use it? Eventually”. Like you have ordered the card off Amazon and don’t know when you’re going to get it.
I love that Heat doesn’t have deckbuilding in it. For me it’s much more about timing.
They will definitely bring outs other tracks
I just noticed that the shadows cast by artwork elements on the game board fall in different directions. Not a deal breaker, but a bit disappointing for a DoW title.
I just played this at BGG and I liked it. The rule book is terrible for such a simple game. Also, the gear shifter and player mat are not well made. Formula D does those better. Zee is right about the thematic disconnect with the Stress and Heat cards. The game play is fun and I'm excited to do more when it comes out in the US.
I’m very torn on this. I love Flamme Rouge, but what makes that game fantastic is it’s elegance. This looks interesting on one hand, but I almost feel they went about 20% too far with the rules grit.
Let's talk about the Elephant in the Room shall we? They didn't say anything about Down Force or Formula D and how it compares. Why should I buy this? ...if my fun with Formula D is practically complete? (Just playing devil's advocate there). At first glance this look almost exactly like Formula D with cards.
I think the rules say that if you need to spend a Heat card and don't have any, then you "spin out". Why oh why doesn't it say that you "overheat"?? That's definitely how I'm going to explain it to other people.
It’s because the only time you NEED to spend a heat to prevent a heat is in corners. The best way to think of heat in the engine imo is how much additional stress you can put on the car to push beyond its limits. If you overdo it in a corner, you lose control of the car. Theoretically you might crash out, but they can’t really translate that into a game as effectively so it’s a spin out. Think of it like in a racing video game, you try to corner way too fast and turn hard you either crash or you lose control of the car and spin. That’s what the heat is representing. Any other scenario that may require heat, you’re just not allowed to do if you don’t have available heat. You can run fine with an empty heat chamber too, so it’s not really an overheated car.
Thanks a lot for the review guys/girls, really good stuff. I am not a big fan of racing games but this one is an exception, its a bit tricky to learn but the gameplay keeps being interesting several races in which is rare!
No comparisons to the other great racing games? How does it stack up to Downforce?
It's very different to Downforce. Heat is a pure racing game, you are racing to win. Downforce is half a betting game, and is about manipulating the race to the result you want. Often it's about getting to certain spots to block others to force them to move you. I don't think they are that comparable despite theme.
I specifically compared it to Downforce and other racing games in my review that you might want to watch.
Heat is superior to downforce in every way.
I am wondering if downforce would be a better game than it is without the blocking rule. Unlike the game boy geek i find downforce very repetitive. It is always the first car to block the corners that wins.
Heat is a much more open game.
@@torelaursen4139 Without the blocking rule Downforce is barely even a game. Also it's not true that the first car to block the corners wins, that's like the theory of the leader at the betting lines always wins. It's only true if the others don't do anything to stop them/help them win. After a while players will realise that you should be ganging up on the people in that position, otherwise you are just gifting victory to them.
Also note the expansion maps are even harder to do this as the blocking corners aren't right at the beginning, and there's less of them.
@@TheGameBoyGeeks thank you for your reply and recommendation. I watched your review last night, and it was quite helpful.
This review has Tom all over it . Wish he was in on this one .
Well, Tom got Monster soup instead!
And now Helsinki too, all from the same designers
Zee with confidence: "There's just not a lof ot racing games."
- The others nod their heads, politely, make some gestures of agreement, while (*probably) thinking: "We love you Zee but... what the heck, man!? Where did you bring this one from?"
(*) Or this is just my own opinion on Zee's insight, which I projected on them.
If u could only choose 1 - This or Formula D?
They should have named it fuel with fuel cards
„I feel the need… the need for speed!“ 😂
28:19 -- Zee LOL
Now, all they need is a weapons expansion.
Never played classic car wars but don't really see how weapons in a racing game would ever work. Seem like you'd either be in the lead and getting shot, or not in the lead and shooting. Silly kart races are a different matter of course.
Gotta agree with the comment about calling them Heat cards. Thematically it's just silly and makes zero sense. It would have been far better to name the Heat cards as Stress cards, and then name the Stress cards something else entirely.
Heat seems perfectly thematic to me. The harder you push your car, the more the engine will overheat.
I think what they are saying was that it felt backwards because the harder you push your engine, you remove heat from your engine and put it in your hand. The section of your board where heat is stored shows an engine symbol and as you overheat, you remove heat from this area. It feels right and thematic when you are doing it, but the symbology makes it seem backwards and hurts the teach.
Mike and Chris staring at the camera when Zee was talking at the outset with slight nodding…do they get coached on that. :)
Way too expensive for what it is and underwhelming to me. I had one random minor slip up in the game I played and my whole game for 30 min was unrecoverable after receiving all the heat cards . I don't like how punishing this game is.
Super fuuuun!
I get what they are saying, but they kind of overstated the "complexity" from your first lap. I agree the iconography could be better, but it's totally minimal. This game is easy and super good.
Unfortunately, it's just barely not better enough to replace Rallyman GT in my collection. Barely!
FormulaD but with cards...
Yeah... the dice mechanics is so fun, but there is that euro banner that wants to replace all dice with cards, and it usually feels forced.
Perhaps a clarification of the word “clutchy” is in order, as much as it’s being used here. The definition I’m seeing has no relationship whatsoever to this discussion.
Chris has excellent taste in clothing.
Looks fun! Kinda feels like Candy Land with car complications. Great for beginners!
I don’t see that. Beginners of what?
This here is a little too random, too many catch-up options, too little jockeying for positions. It's less strategic than both Flamme Rouge AND Rallyman GT.
Don’t really agree here. There is randomness, but it’s pretty influenced by your own actions as a player. Racing poorly increases your randomness through stress, but that’s the representation of you having lost concentration and now anxious to get back into it. The catchup options are really nice to have, because even with them it’s really easy to be out of the race. You NEED to run all 6 cars imo, it makes position jockeying more exciting and gives more opportunities for it. The AI driver module is extremely streamlined and running 1 or 5 AI drivers is pretty much equivalent effort. Most of the positional battles happen out the gate and in corners, which makes sense to me. Sometimes you get a clear leader and it’s a battle for other positions, sometimes the grid stays close until one person has a disaster or someone is able to break out a bit. The strategic aspects are all in the hand and heat management, it doesn’t entirely come through in the first game, but it is there.
This or downforce?