So glad Mike was added to the crew. His picks are always interesting and often introduce me to games I haven't heard of before. Going to be checking out both Dawn of the Peacemakers and Vengeance.
I'm so glad Mike is part of the team. Especially after losing Sam, Mike adds a different perspective in a good way. Chris Yi, not so much. He is really boring and doesn't really add anything to the group. Yawn.
You know they are probably very nervous and anxious to be in these videos. There are better ways to give criticism than you manifest here (edit : talking to tempest fury)
Millennium Blades. If you've played (and got tired of) Mtg, this game is so perfect. It really feels like it was designed for JUST me and I will play it anytime and teach it to anyone.
Absolutely agree with Arkham Horror LCG. Bought it 3 years ago when I first got into board games and I was only able to fully wrap my head around it a few months ago. But man, I am ALL IN. Very fiddly, complicated distribution model, long setup, storage is a beast, you WILL mess up the rules, but so fun.
Lol, this is the exact same scenario I am in. My wife bought it for me like 2-3 years ago. Played it once (don't even recall playing it) and it got shelved. I took it off the shelf maybe a month ago, and we played a 2 player campaign of the Night of the Zealot.....Now I am over here planning to buy all the expansions (periodically) and have already recruited 3 of my other friends to play with. Damn good game! And you are so right...Everyone WILL!!! mess up the rules. I've played 50-60 scenarios since getting into it, and I still find something where I am like "DAMMIT, I was messing that up"
I don't play it myself but I would add Android: Netrunner. Hot damn this game is complex and has a lot to learn with its two completely different sides of play. but I hear that once you properly learn it it's amazing.
For me, Through the Ages is worth the effort. Setup and managing the cubes is hard for new players and I love it. I think I'm drawn to games that are "worth the effort" because I have and like quite a few of the games in this list.
I find civilization style games are better as apps. It’s easier to learn and you can spread the insane game length over a week instead of having to cram it all into one day
Mike, you are awesome. I love the way you introduce and explain your choices, and also the generous way you consider other points of view. You often convince me to give games I've written off a second (or first chance) and most of the time, I realize I missed something key in the first impression. Don't change!
Yes, Mage Knight is definitely the first thing comes to my mind. English isn't my first language, it took me 3 weeks to read and comprehend the rules. But now it stays on my #1 game of all time!
The first thing I though of immediately! The most complex game in my collection, and also my favourite game of all-time. Such a shame that The Dice Tower people don't seem to like it that much.
@@GrandElemental They have this weird tendency to compare *everything* to Gloomhaven. I still remember the short bad review for one of my favourites (Perdition's Mouth): "it does everything right, but it's not Gloomhaven". Oh well...
I’d probably add Too Many Bones, love that game, very hard to teach. Then probably Uprising: Curse of the Last Emperor’, solid game but can be difficult to teach
Nice to see War of the Ring on the list. I’m a HUGE Tolkien fan and that game is as close to Lord-of-the-Rings-in-a-box as I think can be done. I recognized pretty early the problem of not knowing what’s in the decks so I made a “cheat sheet” that details what I consider to be the “game changer” cards in each deck so newbies can at least have an idea of what might happen at the extremes, as well as a couple other player aids. Now if only I had the time and people to play it with 😂
This War of Mine is my pick for this category. It's one of my all time favorite games for many reasons, it scratches a lot of different itches for me (base building, scavenging-survival, story-centric, "dudes-on-a-map", tight resource management)...but it's a lot to set up, it takes up a lot of space, I only play the game solo, so it's a lot of effort for a solo-play game...I love it, but it doesn't hit the table all that often, but when it does, I play it to death for a week or so. For those reasons, it would be on my list of games that are worth the effort.
MattMilder, One of my favourites. Lie every thing about it because it is so emotional;should I starve X because I doubt he/she is not likely to survive! I played the game each day for two weeks p!he and those rats always turn up 😊to steal our food!
Eldritch Horror for sure. A long time to sort out all the decks, but if you keep it organized like that, it's still a while to set up but bearable. One of my favorite games :)
Sidereal Confluence for me. Two hours and change, constant real time negotiation, four player minimum but you really want five or six, huge table hog, tricky to grok on your first learn, and highly asymmetric. But it's such an amazing game.
Arkham Horror: LCG is a great pick. The single worst part of the game is the setup between scenarios. In terms of rules weight, I'd say Scythe should be up there. Most people I teach it to understand the rules, but they don't really get the game until their second game.
Twilight Struggle for sure. Playing against someone else who knows what they're doing is without a doubt one of the best board game experiences that exists.
I was sure something someone would mention Captain Sonar. It seems like the classic example of a game that won’t get as much table time as it should because there is the hurdle of getting 8 players.
Yeah I was saying it in the live chat. High player count, asymmetric play (need to teach four different sets of rules), real time and hidden information. If only one person at the table knows it, its REALLY hard to get to work. If two people know it, it can work but its still pretty tough.
The beauty of Captain Sonar is that you can play it either turn-based (like the 2-4 player turn-based counterpoint Sonar), or in real time. Captain Sonar absolutely SHINES as a real-time game. Yes, the rules explanation takes about 15-20 minutes, and you absolutely MUST have someone that knows the game inside and out to explain it, because each role ties into the other ones so closely, and everybody needs to be on the same page. You also need to coach the players communicating with their team members so that there's less confusion at the table. It's tough, and playing it in real time is probably the best way to play it, with a full contingent of 8 players. Turn-based is probably a good way to learn the mechanics, but the real-time format is what takes this game to a higher level than most other games that can play high player counts.
I have had a surprising amount of success teaching newer gamers Root and getting them into it. It’s a very engaging game and even though it’s mechanics are very all over the place, the fact that your player board walks you through every turn really helps me be able to teach it.
I played the app tutorial for the cats and birds before playing. Really helped out. However, one if my friends played the woodland alliance for the first time and no one knew how to play them. That was rough. Im planning on playing more of the app before we play again to get more clarification on the rule
@@canonblackwell1 yea. We were struggling to figure out how they get points. They are decent at holding a location, but quite difficult to gain new territories as they cant rebel in areas if a suit that they already have a keep for
@@ntmetroid yeah it’s mostly about getting those big turns where you kill a bunch of stuff with a rebel action and then getting a bunch more sympathy tokens out by spreading your meeples out around the map.
My group didn't find Spirit Island to be that difficult of a game to learn. The difficulty (and why I agree that it is a heavy game) is in accomplishing your goals efficiently (or at all). You can really ramp down the difficulty by selecting more straight forward spirits.
Very interesting list. I'll toss in Alchemists for consideration, it is a joy to play if you have time and brain power to spare, especially with the expansion. It takes 3-4 hours and you still feel like you didn't have enough in-game time.
The series of games that included Axis and Allies, the Rome one, the Pirate one, Fortress America. All those games had a lot of setup but were a lot of fun to play at the time.
Neat list. I think my personal picks might be - Eldritch Horror. With all the expansions this game is a beast to setup and play, but it’s also my group’s most played game. So much effort but well worth it, we’ve gotten hours and hours of fun out of it. - Legendary Marvel. Set up does take a while, but it’s still my most played solo game. I can’t count how many games of this I’ve played solo, and with so many expansions the variety is crazy - Argent The Consortium. This one isn’t well known, but it’s a worker placement game where you play students in a magical high school trying to please a group of professors who want different secret goals. This game has everything - tons of magic spells to cast, lots of workers with different unique abilities, randomized board setup where all the rooms have completely different types of effects and every game is different, huge decks of magic item cards and decks of allies. The amount of content in this game is huge. Which means teaching the game is rough, as is setting it up. But man, I really loved playing this game the times I’ve managed to get it to the table (which has to be a big table, it’s a sprawler!) I’ve even played an unofficial solo variant and it was fun then too. I think Tom’s review was it was a really good game that was example of having “too much” so it kind of fell off everybody’s radar. But I think it was worth the effort, at least for me. 🙂 - Blood on the Clocktower. This is a Werewolf style game that’s been in prerelease for a while now and should be shipping this Spring hopefully. I love running this game. The moderator actually has a more active role in this than normal Werewolf, and every player has a unique character (here are no vanilla Villagers). So learning all the characters and running the game takes time. But it’s definitely been worth it, I have a blast running these. Heck, I enjoy running the game more than being one of the players! - Roll Player Adventures using characters imported from Roll Player. This one is definitely a “me” thing, but I really love taking characters I made while playing games of Roll Player and importing them into Roll Player Adventures to run them through the campaign. Sure, you could just play Roll Player Adventures with the prebuilt characters or maybe draw random stats or something, but building a character up through a full game of Roll Player is so fun and it really helps create a bond with them that makes you that much more invested in what happens in the Adventures campaign. It’s clearly a longer process doing this but so worth it!
Great list idea, made me have a look at what would be my list- 10. Sleeping Gods 9. Imperium Classic/Legends 8. Twilight Imperium 4 7. 1846 6. Root 5. City of the Big Shoulders 4. Pax Pamir 2E 3. Sidereal Confluence 2. Gloomhaven 1. Kingdom Death Monster Thanks guys, happy new year
Kudos to Zee for AH. Every expansion is like 4 new games with the same theme. Every expansion and new investigator requires you to learn new game play strategies. And you can always just kick back and try something stupid just to have fun.
I've yet to play TI4 after recently purchasing it, but it seems like an obvious choice for this list. I would personally put Scythe up there as well. I don't think base Scythe is actually a particularly great game over the long run, as I think it's somewhat "solved" and also has balancing issues. However, I really enjoy playing solo against the automa deck, as well as the campaign and numerous expansions that mix things up and make it less of a static race in the early game. To me, the experience of Scythe is better than the actual gameplay itself because of all the theme and components. Gloomhaven is also up there for me.
I have TI3 and it only got to the table once. It was a great time, but rounding people up for it is an issue. I think it has been unfairly dubbed as too daunting for many.
The Fenris expansion for Scythe adds a bunch of extra options that certainly shake up the "solved" issue. I guess, too, that good Scythe players will disrupt the set strategies of others. I love TI4 but it's so hard to get "normal" people to devote a whole day to it, even with free food and beer. You have to find other TI4 devotees and then hope they are actually fun people, not oxygen thieves.
I saw Arkham Horror LCG coming from a mile away. Huge fan but I always leave it set up on the table during a campaign cycle. Would love to see Zee play through another one like he did with Dunwich Legacy!
Most Vital Lacerta games (my pick is The Gallerist) and all 18xx games (1862 or 1846 are my picks) are in this category for me. Love 'em, but I had quite a tough time learning to play them.
I was thinking along the same lines. From my list: - Terra Mystica is a lot of symbols and systems dumped into your face the first time, but by your third or fourth game it will have become second nature - Power Grid is _so_ worth the small amount of clumsy mental arithmetic (and the large amount of easy arithmetic) - Twilight Struggle is easily worth the long play duration - Food Chain Magnate is well worth thinking a few steps ahead to judge even simple maneuvers
I think Tom should give the Anachrony big box a try. I recall one of his favorite things about the game was the different modules you can swap in. The big box makes this SO much easier! I also really enjoy the new modules, as it takes my favorite mechanism (the time travel) and makes it even better.
For Mike (and all!) --- Anachrony Fractures of Time is VERY VERY worth the work to expand the game into an entirely new and deeper -- (and more fun) experience. Don't leave it in the box = ) My wife did an ENTIRE month (well, 27 days) of playing every possible configuration of the game, and for us now Anachrony is 'only' a game with Fractures.
Part of what makes some of these games an "effort" is the setup time and part of that is sometimes due to how many people know the game well enough to help set it up. In the beginning Arcadia Quest was difficult because I was the only one setting it up. Once my friends got familiar with it, it became easier because we all pitched in with setup. If one person has to always be host getting things ready, some games become a pain more so than they need to be. :)
Robinson is the best game ever. All setup and mechanics are there to simulate the experience making it more real. Different dice sets, tons of events cards, exploration, strategy freedom… Love it.
Somehow and surprisingly I found this Top 10 one of the most interesting and engaging discussions of any DT Top 10 I've seen. And I wasn't expecting that.
I feel like I’m part of that 10% of people who can teach people MTG. Love that game, stopped playing it for years but such a great game even for us casual gamers
For me, Shadows of Brimstone would be my "worth the effort" game, even though I don't play it much anymore. Tons of minis that all have to be assembled before use, lots of map tiles for setup and tons of cards you use during play. That said, it is amazingly fun to play.
The thing with magic is when someone teaches you, they are teaching you the rules sure but if they "let" you think or just don't mention that there are different formats, the new player assumed that all games of magic are like that and when they try to pay their kitchen table deck against someone's modern deck ...oof that power level difference can turn people off. So RIGHT AFTER teaching them you just have to let them know other ways to play are out there. They can research those on their own buy if they don't know there is something to research or learn about in the first place they will get that blindsided and feels bad moment.
Magic is totally overrated. At our local game store it's the only game played. Weekend dad's playing with their kids and it's so one-minded. Then I bust out with something as simple as King of Tokyo and the kids love it!
@@tempestfury8324 I agree competitive formats are all boring because of meta decks. Commander is the most popular now because you get to build your own experience like Pirate tribal and it is not meta driven. But being both a magic player and board gamer, I can see how people would rather play a bunch of different boardgames than one card game. I like magic for being able to make my own decks and play experience and not he constrained to what is in a box sometimes. But variety is key. I can't get enough Smash Up and Menara lately
I'm perpetually amazed by how much Zee loves Claustrophobia 1643. What with the tons of minis, etc it feels like a very odd pick for him...but I'm not going to say more since it is a damn good game
MTG totally on point. I learned 30 years ago before the teaching expansion "PORTAL" came out. Portal made it easier to learn the basics for sure. Watching people play it at the morning table in High School made it very intriguing.
Mage Knight is considerably harder to set up than KDM (once the models are built of course), but I don't consider either of them being a huge effort. The effort with Mage Knight is teaching it.
For me, Maracaibo. Not necessarily the heaviest game out there, but I had to solo it twice before I felt ready to teach it. But it still hits the table, still discovering new things, and still lots of fun.
I really missed Millennium Blades from this list, also I know you guys are not Vital fans, but I think one of his games should deserve a spot as well, my personal pick would be The Gallerist.
I'm new to this hobby and went to my local shop asking for a good solo game. They recommended Arkham Horror. I got home and set it up and holy shit I was overwhelmed. Glad even the pros feel it is a bit of effort. I don't feel so bad now.
Welcome to the hobby, Snacks! Like you, started in the hobby looking for solo games. Arkham Horror is a great solo game, I like the board game over the card version. But yep, took ages to learn and overwhelming for a new player. Don't be scared of growing your collection. ( I got AZUL at the start of the pandemic, I'm now close to 200 games) You'll find 'bad games' no matter how much they get hyped, for me it's 'Lost Ruins of Arnak' at the moment. I'm trying to get into it, but i just don't feel it. yet, it is hugely loved and popular.
@@warpo007 I picked up AZUL as well. Are you playing that solo? I’m really liking Pandemic Legacy Season 1 so far. Playing through that with my wife. I’m a video game designer and figured board games would be a fun change of pace and maybe I can learn some things to bring to our games. I’m pretty hooked and can’t stop buying games 😂
@@Sgt_Snacks 1) That’s cool that you are a video game designer! You should talk with Richard Ham (Rahdo is his name on his “Rahdo Runthrough” series here on TH-cam. He used to be a video game designer, too. 2) You may really enjoy buying board games now, but wait until you have too many and not enough space (and time) for them. That is where I am, yet I am addicted and I still continue to buy games.
My Top 10: 1. Arkham Horror: The Card Game 2. Aeon's End 3. Gloomhaven 4. Twilight Struggle 5. Monumental 6. Too Many Bones 7. Spirit Island 8. Glory to RomeAnachrony 9. Glory to Rome 10.Sleeping Gods
My #1 is Twilight Imperium 4, and my #2 is Kingdom Death Monsters. Those are what immediately popped into my head. Then after that I'd have to look up my library one by one. Maybe Robinson Crusoe, Oath, Nemesis and This War of Mine.
Yeah, I was surprised no one went for Twilight Imperium. But then again I always forget what their stand on it is -- do they not consider it worth the effort? :D
One game that I love but don't pull of the shelf often enough is Stronghold 2nd edition. I bought based on Tom's review a while back and I wasn't disappointed. Every game has come down to the wire in the last couple of rounds. It does take a bit to set it up and the game is fairly lengthy for a 2 player only experience, but worth it when it does hit the table!
I highly recommend watching a rules explanation video, especially if there is one by the Watch It Played channel. Makes a huge difference in learning new games.
Gotta say, you mentioned it a lot, but Oath is definitely mine. Absolutely ADORE the game, played it over 30 times. Once you can lock your imagination onto the narrative, it is the most satisfying tabletop experience I could possibly imagine.
Without meaning to spoil anyone's list I'd recommend trying MTG Arena on PC if you want to learn Magic. Also noteworthy that there's enough different ways to play that people may find this intimidating but it only takes one that you like to be a really good experience. Drafting is a lot of fun for new and experienced players IMO as the deckbuilding becomes a minigame of sorts and everyone is working under limited circumstances.
Feudum for me hands down. The teach is a slog, the board can get in its own way, and there are mechanics within mechanics, but the player and guild interactions... chef's kiss!
Zee is only half right about Cryptid. Unlike Slueth or Clue or other games of that type, there is space to fix player errors. In fact, one of the best parts of Cryptid is accusing others of not playing their cubes right. This usually happens for one of two reasons: one, you have a perfect knowledge of their rule and you are fixing their mistake like a boss; or two, you are so utterly confused by their rule you have to resort to calling them a cheater to try and make the board state make sense. The second one is way better, and it is why it is one of my favorite games.
I have different pairs of MTG: decks ramping up in rule and keyword density especially to teach it to people in a way that actually makes them want to play it :)
Tom looking great with that button-up and hat! Thanks for the great list! Honestly, I tend to not play or keep a game if setup is too much of a beast or if I have to re-learn the instructions every time I play it.
Spirit Island -- good choice. I love the theme and the games we've played have been great -- but when I look at it on the shelf I groan and pick something else.
I recently taught it to 3 pretty new gamers (prior to this I think horrified was as complicated as they'd played)... 2 caught on quickly but one I was pretty much having to play their turns for them, and by the time the game really clicked for them there was no clawing out a victory. They did all want to play again sometime though now that they better understand the game.
@S R for solo, I recommend picking up the app. In person is still more fun for groups, but having the app do setup and handle the fiddliness is wonderful.
Aliens: Another Glorious Day in the Corps is a lesser known one that takes a lot of time to set up and there are a lot of rules to remember but man there is nothing more thematic and nothing as good at buildimg tension as that game. Balancing your low ammo and watching the motion tracker blips swarm in is amazing
@@matthewpeterson3926 he likes some heavy games, but I'd like to see a DT personality where they play predominantly medium and heavy games, and have it be someone who is occasionally on the big Top 10 lists, not just someone who occasionally does their own videos like Ryan or other guests
Really surprised not to see through the ages 2nd edition. The game has lasted the test of time. Really involved teach but infinitely replayable. This is my #1 desert island game.
Great game, but it is not a hard teach imho, 30 minutes max, and you have to pay attention to what people are doing on the first game. It is a time investment (if you play it face to face on the table), but it flows fast. Mage Knight Board Game is much harder to get to the point, where you can play it fluently.
For me, it is Root, FOR SURE! I promised not to buy an expansion until we had a dedicated group for it. Now we do and I just bought The Marauder expansion :D GOOD STUFF! And yes, I always recommend everyone to try the app.
Man. You guys dislike a lot of the stuff I love most. I guess if my job involved playing all the games all the time, my perspective might change. But I love all the extra stuff, big rulebooks, busy looking boards, campaigns, complicated setups and everything else that apparently is considered a burden or unnecessary effort. It's all part of the atmosphere and the payoff. I find that the games I enjoy most, tend to involve these extra efforts, hurdles, or learning curves. Setting up a sprawling, complicated board game is quite literally one of my very favorite things to do in life.
@@keel1701 No. It's a list of games where they feel it is worth suffering through all those things. Is the title of the video "10 Games We Like"? Nope. Did you even watch it?
@@leadbones right, so ten games they like (or even love). In some cases, the "hassle" is what makes it so good for them (Sleeping Gods is a good example of that). But they just don't like the hassle for hassle's sake.
Did they ever say they suffer through these things? Some of these are their favorite games of all time - that wouldn't happen with something that they have to "suffer through".
Personally I'd add Nightfall. It's a bit difficult to teach but then pretty easy to play, scales well with more players, and has a surprising amount of depth once people know what they're doing
I think this is the video: th-cam.com/video/HohcFnhILwQ/w-d-xo.html Zee and Mike play at about 1:20:00. I think Zee explained the basics off-camera though.
Definitely worth the effort Anachrony, Gloomhaven, MtG (like Tom said, go for the preconstructed decks, you'll have fun as well if you just stick to those), Arkham Horror LCG, Spirit Island, Twilight Struggle. Also, but not mentioned: Android Netrunner, Twilight Imperium 4th Edition, Gaia Project !
This was a fantastic top 10 topic; great job, guys! Also super excited to see your thoughts on KDM! For my taste given my love of heavy euro's + war games... and in no particular order: - Arkwright - On Mars - Ortus Regni - Empire of the Sun - Nevsky - Pretty much any 18XX game - Malifaux 3e (seriously one of the best skirmish games you could play but can also be very mentally taxing) - Age of Sigmar 3e (as above except requires more effort since it needs full size armies) - Churchill (specifically playing the full campaign)
![กี่หมื่นฟ้า | Your Sky Series EP.1 [2/4]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/qJbQs_nhjD4/mqdefault.jpg)
So glad Mike was added to the crew. His picks are always interesting and often introduce me to games I haven't heard of before. Going to be checking out both Dawn of the Peacemakers and Vengeance.
+1 Mikes picks are fantastic 👌
Mike has been here for awhile
I'm so glad Mike is part of the team. Especially after losing Sam, Mike adds a different perspective in a good way.
Chris Yi, not so much. He is really boring and doesn't really add anything to the group. Yawn.
You know they are probably very nervous and anxious to be in these videos. There are better ways to give criticism than you manifest here (edit : talking to tempest fury)
I'm actually more a fan of Mike than I am of Sam. Not complaining about Sam, I just really like Mike.
Why Mike is awesome, the only one on Dice Tower that recognizes the magnificence of Spirit Island AND Pax Pamir 2e!
Mike nailed this list. Too Many Bones could have been added along with Cloudspire but, other than that, Mike’s was a great list for this topic.
Zee and Tom raising their chairs to the max height and forcing Mr Delicioustoes to lower his to the min height creates a toxic working environment.
Millennium Blades. If you've played (and got tired of) Mtg, this game is so perfect. It really feels like it was designed for JUST me and I will play it anytime and teach it to anyone.
It is basically Yu-Gi-Oh the series as a game. I like it but it is definitely clunky and swingy and a brain burner at times.
Just about to comment the same thing.
Absolutely agree with Arkham Horror LCG. Bought it 3 years ago when I first got into board games and I was only able to fully wrap my head around it a few months ago. But man, I am ALL IN. Very fiddly, complicated distribution model, long setup, storage is a beast, you WILL mess up the rules, but so fun.
Lol, this is the exact same scenario I am in. My wife bought it for me like 2-3 years ago. Played it once (don't even recall playing it) and it got shelved. I took it off the shelf maybe a month ago, and we played a 2 player campaign of the Night of the Zealot.....Now I am over here planning to buy all the expansions (periodically) and have already recruited 3 of my other friends to play with. Damn good game!
And you are so right...Everyone WILL!!! mess up the rules. I've played 50-60 scenarios since getting into it, and I still find something where I am like "DAMMIT, I was messing that up"
I don't play it myself but I would add Android: Netrunner.
Hot damn this game is complex and has a lot to learn with its two completely different sides of play. but I hear that once you properly learn it it's amazing.
For me, Through the Ages is worth the effort. Setup and managing the cubes is hard for new players and I love it. I think I'm drawn to games that are "worth the effort" because I have and like quite a few of the games in this list.
David Rector,
I am still struggling with the first edition....cubes etc but,rule book is a mess.
I find civilization style games are better as apps. It’s easier to learn and you can spread the insane game length over a week instead of having to cram it all into one day
Mike, you are awesome. I love the way you introduce and explain your choices, and also the generous way you consider other points of view. You often convince me to give games I've written off a second (or first chance) and most of the time, I realize I missed something key in the first impression. Don't change!
Good idea for a list.
The elephant in the room is MAGE KNIGHT.
Yes, Mage Knight is definitely the first thing comes to my mind. English isn't my first language, it took me 3 weeks to read and comprehend the rules. But now it stays on my #1 game of all time!
The first thing I though of immediately! The most complex game in my collection, and also my favourite game of all-time. Such a shame that The Dice Tower people don't seem to like it that much.
@@GrandElemental They have this weird tendency to compare *everything* to Gloomhaven. I still remember the short bad review for one of my favourites (Perdition's Mouth): "it does everything right, but it's not Gloomhaven". Oh well...
I’d probably add Too Many Bones, love that game, very hard to teach. Then probably Uprising: Curse of the Last Emperor’, solid game but can be difficult to teach
With too many bones I thought the effort was from finding it in the first place and then shelling out the premium price (quite worth it though)
I attended a teach at Origins when it came out. It turned me off completely. Just not my thing.
Mike did say he had Too Many Bones in the same league as Cloudspire, he just went with Cloudspire instead for the list.
Too many bones is a solid solo game, but damn, I hated trying to play it with 2 lol
I think this is the most I've ever heard these guys compliment each other on their picks!
Nice to see War of the Ring on the list. I’m a HUGE Tolkien fan and that game is as close to Lord-of-the-Rings-in-a-box as I think can be done. I recognized pretty early the problem of not knowing what’s in the decks so I made a “cheat sheet” that details what I consider to be the “game changer” cards in each deck so newbies can at least have an idea of what might happen at the extremes, as well as a couple other player aids. Now if only I had the time and people to play it with 😂
Mage Knight, Robinson Crusoe, and A Study in Emerald for me but I agree with a lot of the choices.
Millennium Blades is my pick. Extraordinary game. But a HUGE set up/clean up time. I may only play it on Tabletop Simulator.
This War of Mine is my pick for this category. It's one of my all time favorite games for many reasons, it scratches a lot of different itches for me (base building, scavenging-survival, story-centric, "dudes-on-a-map", tight resource management)...but it's a lot to set up, it takes up a lot of space, I only play the game solo, so it's a lot of effort for a solo-play game...I love it, but it doesn't hit the table all that often, but when it does, I play it to death for a week or so. For those reasons, it would be on my list of games that are worth the effort.
Play it to death... literally! 😆
The deal breaker with that game is if I play it, it only makes me want to play the video game. I have trouble with games based on video games
MattMilder,
One of my favourites.
Lie every thing about it because it is so emotional;should I starve X because I doubt he/she is not likely to survive!
I played the game each day for two weeks p!he and those rats always turn up 😊to steal our food!
Eldritch Horror for sure. A long time to sort out all the decks, but if you keep it organized like that, it's still a while to set up but bearable. One of my favorite games :)
I have the insert and it doesn't take me more than 5 to 7 minutes to set up
Sidereal Confluence for me. Two hours and change, constant real time negotiation, four player minimum but you really want five or six, huge table hog, tricky to grok on your first learn, and highly asymmetric. But it's such an amazing game.
My favorite game that I almost never get to the table.
Legitimately almost sounds like a parody of boardgames when you first hear it described
Arkham Horror: LCG is a great pick. The single worst part of the game is the setup between scenarios.
In terms of rules weight, I'd say Scythe should be up there. Most people I teach it to understand the rules, but they don't really get the game until their second game.
Twilight Struggle for sure. Playing against someone else who knows what they're doing is without a doubt one of the best board game experiences that exists.
I have tried. Multiple times. I just don't have fun in the learning process, so I never have gotten to the point where I can appreciate it.
I was sure something someone would mention Captain Sonar. It seems like the classic example of a game that won’t get as much table time as it should because there is the hurdle of getting 8 players.
There are variants that support fewer players.
Yeah I was saying it in the live chat. High player count, asymmetric play (need to teach four different sets of rules), real time and hidden information. If only one person at the table knows it, its REALLY hard to get to work. If two people know it, it can work but its still pretty tough.
They have a 4 player version available now.
The beauty of Captain Sonar is that you can play it either turn-based (like the 2-4 player turn-based counterpoint Sonar), or in real time. Captain Sonar absolutely SHINES as a real-time game. Yes, the rules explanation takes about 15-20 minutes, and you absolutely MUST have someone that knows the game inside and out to explain it, because each role ties into the other ones so closely, and everybody needs to be on the same page. You also need to coach the players communicating with their team members so that there's less confusion at the table. It's tough, and playing it in real time is probably the best way to play it, with a full contingent of 8 players. Turn-based is probably a good way to learn the mechanics, but the real-time format is what takes this game to a higher level than most other games that can play high player counts.
I have had a surprising amount of success teaching newer gamers Root and getting them into it. It’s a very engaging game and even though it’s mechanics are very all over the place, the fact that your player board walks you through every turn really helps me be able to teach it.
I played the app tutorial for the cats and birds before playing. Really helped out. However, one if my friends played the woodland alliance for the first time and no one knew how to play them. That was rough. Im planning on playing more of the app before we play again to get more clarification on the rule
@@ntmetroid yeah I think it’s harder if no one had played before and the WA is one of the more obtuse factions to try and learn cold
@@canonblackwell1 yea. We were struggling to figure out how they get points. They are decent at holding a location, but quite difficult to gain new territories as they cant rebel in areas if a suit that they already have a keep for
@@ntmetroid yeah it’s mostly about getting those big turns where you kill a bunch of stuff with a rebel action and then getting a bunch more sympathy tokens out by spreading your meeples out around the map.
It would be fun to see you guys do a "Top 10 Games We Are Best At" :-)
Especially if there is crossover 🤣
@@roseability86 exactly!!
My group didn't find Spirit Island to be that difficult of a game to learn. The difficulty (and why I agree that it is a heavy game) is in accomplishing your goals efficiently (or at all). You can really ramp down the difficulty by selecting more straight forward spirits.
Very interesting list. I'll toss in Alchemists for consideration, it is a joy to play if you have time and brain power to spare, especially with the expansion. It takes 3-4 hours and you still feel like you didn't have enough in-game time.
The series of games that included Axis and Allies, the Rome one, the Pirate one, Fortress America. All those games had a lot of setup but were a lot of fun to play at the time.
What is the video in which Zee shows Mike the Rules of Magic the Gathering? Thank you. :D
Zee is an amazing actor. His “this is not worth my effort” face is amazing, and he can keep it up for the whole video!
Neat list. I think my personal picks might be
- Eldritch Horror. With all the expansions this game is a beast to setup and play, but it’s also my group’s most played game. So much effort but well worth it, we’ve gotten hours and hours of fun out of it.
- Legendary Marvel. Set up does take a while, but it’s still my most played solo game. I can’t count how many games of this I’ve played solo, and with so many expansions the variety is crazy
- Argent The Consortium. This one isn’t well known, but it’s a worker placement game where you play students in a magical high school trying to please a group of professors who want different secret goals. This game has everything - tons of magic spells to cast, lots of workers with different unique abilities, randomized board setup where all the rooms have completely different types of effects and every game is different, huge decks of magic item cards and decks of allies. The amount of content in this game is huge. Which means teaching the game is rough, as is setting it up. But man, I really loved playing this game the times I’ve managed to get it to the table (which has to be a big table, it’s a sprawler!) I’ve even played an unofficial solo variant and it was fun then too. I think Tom’s review was it was a really good game that was example of having “too much” so it kind of fell off everybody’s radar. But I think it was worth the effort, at least for me. 🙂
- Blood on the Clocktower. This is a Werewolf style game that’s been in prerelease for a while now and should be shipping this Spring hopefully. I love running this game. The moderator actually has a more active role in this than normal Werewolf, and every player has a unique character (here are no vanilla Villagers). So learning all the characters and running the game takes time. But it’s definitely been worth it, I have a blast running these. Heck, I enjoy running the game more than being one of the players!
- Roll Player Adventures using characters imported from Roll Player. This one is definitely a “me” thing, but I really love taking characters I made while playing games of Roll Player and importing them into Roll Player Adventures to run them through the campaign. Sure, you could just play Roll Player Adventures with the prebuilt characters or maybe draw random stats or something, but building a character up through a full game of Roll Player is so fun and it really helps create a bond with them that makes you that much more invested in what happens in the Adventures campaign. It’s clearly a longer process doing this but so worth it!
Great list idea, made me have a look at what would be my list-
10. Sleeping Gods
9. Imperium Classic/Legends
8. Twilight Imperium 4
7. 1846
6. Root
5. City of the Big Shoulders
4. Pax Pamir 2E
3. Sidereal Confluence
2. Gloomhaven
1. Kingdom Death Monster
Thanks guys, happy new year
Kudos to Zee for AH. Every expansion is like 4 new games with the same theme. Every expansion and new investigator requires you to learn new game play strategies. And you can always just kick back and try something stupid just to have fun.
00
I've yet to play TI4 after recently purchasing it, but it seems like an obvious choice for this list. I would personally put Scythe up there as well. I don't think base Scythe is actually a particularly great game over the long run, as I think it's somewhat "solved" and also has balancing issues. However, I really enjoy playing solo against the automa deck, as well as the campaign and numerous expansions that mix things up and make it less of a static race in the early game. To me, the experience of Scythe is better than the actual gameplay itself because of all the theme and components. Gloomhaven is also up there for me.
I have TI3 and it only got to the table once. It was a great time, but rounding people up for it is an issue. I think it has been unfairly dubbed as too daunting for many.
The Fenris expansion for Scythe adds a bunch of extra options that certainly shake up the "solved" issue. I guess, too, that good Scythe players will disrupt the set strategies of others.
I love TI4 but it's so hard to get "normal" people to devote a whole day to it, even with free food and beer. You have to find other TI4 devotees and then hope they are actually fun people, not oxygen thieves.
I saw Arkham Horror LCG coming from a mile away. Huge fan but I always leave it set up on the table during a campaign cycle. Would love to see Zee play through another one like he did with Dunwich Legacy!
Most Vital Lacerta games (my pick is The Gallerist) and all 18xx games (1862 or 1846 are my picks) are in this category for me. Love 'em, but I had quite a tough time learning to play them.
I was thinking along the same lines.
From my list:
- Terra Mystica is a lot of symbols and systems dumped into your face the first time, but by your third or fourth game it will have become second nature
- Power Grid is _so_ worth the small amount of clumsy mental arithmetic (and the large amount of easy arithmetic)
- Twilight Struggle is easily worth the long play duration
- Food Chain Magnate is well worth thinking a few steps ahead to judge even simple maneuvers
I think Tom should give the Anachrony big box a try. I recall one of his favorite things about the game was the different modules you can swap in. The big box makes this SO much easier! I also really enjoy the new modules, as it takes my favorite mechanism (the time travel) and makes it even better.
For Mike (and all!) --- Anachrony Fractures of Time is VERY VERY worth the work to expand the game into an entirely new and deeper -- (and more fun) experience. Don't leave it in the box = ) My wife did an ENTIRE month (well, 27 days) of playing every possible configuration of the game, and for us now Anachrony is 'only' a game with Fractures.
Part of what makes some of these games an "effort" is the setup time and part of that is sometimes due to how many people know the game well enough to help set it up. In the beginning Arcadia Quest was difficult because I was the only one setting it up. Once my friends got familiar with it, it became easier because we all pitched in with setup. If one person has to always be host getting things ready, some games become a pain more so than they need to be. :)
Mike "The Voice that Moves Mountains" DiLisio.
What's the video they refer to with Zee teaching Mike how to play Magic? Having no luck finding it in search.
th-cam.com/video/HohcFnhILwQ/w-d-xo.html
Robinson Crusoe is also worth the setup.
I only play this solo now. And EVER time
I decide to play this, I have to reread the rules and get in a headspace.
Overrated game
Robinson is the best game ever. All setup and mechanics are there to simulate the experience making it more real. Different dice sets, tons of events cards, exploration, strategy freedom… Love it.
Somehow and surprisingly I found this Top 10 one of the most interesting and engaging discussions of any DT Top 10 I've seen. And I wasn't expecting that.
I feel like I’m part of that 10% of people who can teach people MTG. Love that game, stopped playing it for years but such a great game even for us casual gamers
For me, Shadows of Brimstone would be my "worth the effort" game, even though I don't play it much anymore. Tons of minis that all have to be assembled before use, lots of map tiles for setup and tons of cards you use during play. That said, it is amazingly fun to play.
Completely agree! Love many of their games
Agreed! But the game series got sooo much better! Forbidden Fortress is simply gorgeous and brilliant!
@@tempestfury8324 forbidden fortress was more balanced and tighter for sure. but still unwieldy as hell
The thing with magic is when someone teaches you, they are teaching you the rules sure but if they "let" you think or just don't mention that there are different formats, the new player assumed that all games of magic are like that and when they try to pay their kitchen table deck against someone's modern deck ...oof that power level difference can turn people off. So RIGHT AFTER teaching them you just have to let them know other ways to play are out there. They can research those on their own buy if they don't know there is something to research or learn about in the first place they will get that blindsided and feels bad moment.
Magic is totally overrated. At our local game store it's the only game played. Weekend dad's playing with their kids and it's so one-minded. Then I bust out with something as simple as King of Tokyo and the kids love it!
@@tempestfury8324 I agree competitive formats are all boring because of meta decks. Commander is the most popular now because you get to build your own experience like Pirate tribal and it is not meta driven. But being both a magic player and board gamer, I can see how people would rather play a bunch of different boardgames than one card game. I like magic for being able to make my own decks and play experience and not he constrained to what is in a box sometimes. But variety is key. I can't get enough Smash Up and Menara lately
I'm perpetually amazed by how much Zee loves Claustrophobia 1643. What with the tons of minis, etc it feels like a very odd pick for him...but I'm not going to say more since it is a damn good game
I actually like the original game better....going against the grain.
MTG totally on point. I learned 30 years ago before the teaching expansion "PORTAL" came out. Portal made it easier to learn the basics for sure. Watching people play it at the morning table in High School made it very intriguing.
Mage Knight is considerably harder to set up than KDM (once the models are built of course), but I don't consider either of them being a huge effort. The effort with Mage Knight is teaching it.
I sort of have a hard time getting it to click with players because a lot of the time they don't get the 'playing a card sideways' mechanic
I really really want to see Pax Pamir Catchapalooza! Perfect time to do it because the new printing from the Kickstarter just shipped.
For me, Maracaibo. Not necessarily the heaviest game out there, but I had to solo it twice before I felt ready to teach it. But it still hits the table, still discovering new things, and still lots of fun.
Spirit Island is definitely worth it. I'd also add in Dawn of the Zeds.
My personal addition to this would be the Pathfinder Adventure Card Game. I love that game, but there's a lot of setup to get it together.
I really missed Millennium Blades from this list, also I know you guys are not Vital fans, but I think one of his games should deserve a spot as well, my personal pick would be The Gallerist.
Millennium Blades would definitely be one of my picks. Assembling the store decks can take a while, and stickering up all the money is a nightmare.
I'm new to this hobby and went to my local shop asking for a good solo game. They recommended Arkham Horror. I got home and set it up and holy shit I was overwhelmed. Glad even the pros feel it is a bit of effort. I don't feel so bad now.
Welcome to the hobby, Snacks! Like you, started in the hobby looking for solo games. Arkham Horror is a great solo game, I like the board game over the card version. But yep, took ages to learn and overwhelming for a new player. Don't be scared of growing your collection. ( I got AZUL at the start of the pandemic, I'm now close to 200 games) You'll find 'bad games' no matter how much they get hyped, for me it's 'Lost Ruins of Arnak' at the moment. I'm trying to get into it, but i just don't feel it. yet, it is hugely loved and popular.
@@warpo007 I picked up AZUL as well. Are you playing that solo? I’m really liking Pandemic Legacy Season 1 so far. Playing through that with my wife. I’m a video game designer and figured board games would be a fun change of pace and maybe I can learn some things to bring to our games. I’m pretty hooked and can’t stop buying games 😂
@@Sgt_Snacks 1) That’s cool that you are a video game designer! You should talk with Richard Ham (Rahdo is his name on his “Rahdo Runthrough” series here on TH-cam. He used to be a video game designer, too.
2) You may really enjoy buying board games now, but wait until you have too many and not enough space (and time) for them. That is where I am, yet I am addicted and I still continue to buy games.
I would be interested in a top 10 games that aren’t worth the effort (maybe one already exists?)
That could be a long list.
My Top 10:
1. Arkham Horror: The Card Game
2. Aeon's End
3. Gloomhaven
4. Twilight Struggle
5. Monumental
6. Too Many Bones
7. Spirit Island
8. Glory to RomeAnachrony
9. Glory to Rome
10.Sleeping Gods
My #1 is Twilight Imperium 4, and my #2 is Kingdom Death Monsters. Those are what immediately popped into my head.
Then after that I'd have to look up my library one by one. Maybe Robinson Crusoe, Oath, Nemesis and This War of Mine.
Yeah, I was surprised no one went for Twilight Imperium. But then again I always forget what their stand on it is -- do they not consider it worth the effort? :D
1. Twilight Imperium 4th Edition
2. Twilight Struggle
3. Star Wars Rebellion
4. Merchants & Marauders
5. SpaceCorp
@@OnDragi Sam and Roy were not in this video so you are not going to get Ti4.
Does anyone have a link of this time where Zee taught Mike how to play MtG ? I'd love to have a look, but can't find it.
Feast for Odin, Jaws of the Lion, All the Pandemic Legacies, Cooper Island
One game that I love but don't pull of the shelf often enough is Stronghold 2nd edition. I bought based on Tom's review a while back and I wasn't disappointed. Every game has come down to the wire in the last couple of rounds. It does take a bit to set it up and the game is fairly lengthy for a 2 player only experience, but worth it when it does hit the table!
I thought of Stronghold as well.
An excellent Top 10, really enjoyed watching this.
Took us 4 hours to figure out Wingspan. Once we figured it out, it was really great, but somehow understanding the rules was just hard.
I highly recommend watching a rules explanation video, especially if there is one by the Watch It Played channel. Makes a huge difference in learning new games.
Wow! There are so many "how to play" videos. Easy peasy.
Gotta say, you mentioned it a lot, but Oath is definitely mine. Absolutely ADORE the game, played it over 30 times. Once you can lock your imagination onto the narrative, it is the most satisfying tabletop experience I could possibly imagine.
Can someone find a link to Zee teaching Mike Magic? I would love to see that! They mention it at 58:06.
Without meaning to spoil anyone's list I'd recommend trying MTG Arena on PC if you want to learn Magic. Also noteworthy that there's enough different ways to play that people may find this intimidating but it only takes one that you like to be a really good experience. Drafting is a lot of fun for new and experienced players IMO as the deckbuilding becomes a minigame of sorts and everyone is working under limited circumstances.
5. Race for the Galaxy
4. Heroes of Land Air Sea
3. 1822mx
2. Innovation
1. Millennium Blades
Feudum for me hands down. The teach is a slog, the board can get in its own way, and there are mechanics within mechanics, but the player and guild interactions... chef's kiss!
I considered Feudum, but it’s been a long time since I’ve played it, so I didn’t go with it in the end.
Feudum feels like a normal to good euro with 3x the teach
Great video. 3 games I’m familiar with that didn’t make the list are I would pick are millennium blades, black rose wars and Kemet.
Great lists you guys, I think Tom was particularly spot on with his picks.
Zee is only half right about Cryptid. Unlike Slueth or Clue or other games of that type, there is space to fix player errors. In fact, one of the best parts of Cryptid is accusing others of not playing their cubes right. This usually happens for one of two reasons: one, you have a perfect knowledge of their rule and you are fixing their mistake like a boss; or two, you are so utterly confused by their rule you have to resort to calling them a cheater to try and make the board state make sense. The second one is way better, and it is why it is one of my favorite games.
Waiting on the fold out maps for Gloomhaven. Only reason I haven't bought it yet. JOTL is currently my favorite game.
of my 200 game collection. Spirit island is favourite hands down.
1:05:59 Couldn't agree with you more, Mike 👍🏻 Love love love Root 😃 One of my favorite games of all time, if not my favorite. A unique game for sure.
"I think i don't like games."
- Zee Garcia (33:18)
I am surprised no one has mentioned Advanced Squad Leader. It's HELL to learn the rules, but it is a great game. (YMMV)
I completely concur with War of the Ring. I'm just sad it's hard to find people willing to learn it...
I have different pairs of MTG: decks ramping up in rule and keyword density especially to teach it to people in a way that actually makes them want to play it :)
Can we get the deck lists?
Nemesis, Vast/Root, Gloomhaven, Eclipse, Star Wars Rebellion, Android Netrunner, Wasteland Express Delivery Service, Magic the Gathering
Hi! Could you upload the link to "Garcia teaches Mike Magic the Gathering", please? I'd like to watch it. Thanks!
Tom looking great with that button-up and hat! Thanks for the great list! Honestly, I tend to not play or keep a game if setup is too much of a beast or if I have to re-learn the instructions every time I play it.
Spirit Island -- good choice. I love the theme and the games we've played have been great -- but when I look at it on the shelf I groan and pick something else.
I recently taught it to 3 pretty new gamers (prior to this I think horrified was as complicated as they'd played)... 2 caught on quickly but one I was pretty much having to play their turns for them, and by the time the game really clicked for them there was no clawing out a victory. They did all want to play again sometime though now that they better understand the game.
@S R for solo, I recommend picking up the app. In person is still more fun for groups, but having the app do setup and handle the fiddliness is wonderful.
Aliens: Another Glorious Day in the Corps is a lesser known one that takes a lot of time to set up and there are a lot of rules to remember but man there is nothing more thematic and nothing as good at buildimg tension as that game. Balancing your low ammo and watching the motion tracker blips swarm in is amazing
I am a retailer and Sleeping Gods is already out of stock from our distributors. I really hope they're doing a reprint!!!
Apps for some complex games can lessen the learning curve. I actually enjoyed the tutorial in the Through the Ages app.
Arkham Horror #1! Zee, I found Arkham Horror LCG from watching your 2016 top 10 and I've been into hard since Halloween.
I sooo wish they had a voice for someone that would suggest a Lacerda, 18xx, or heavier economic game like Arkwright. Happy to at least see Pax Pamir.
I think Chris Yi’s voice would be interesting on this one, he likes the Lacerda games; he would have a unique perspective
@@matthewpeterson3926 he likes some heavy games, but I'd like to see a DT personality where they play predominantly medium and heavy games, and have it be someone who is occasionally on the big Top 10 lists, not just someone who occasionally does their own videos like Ryan or other guests
War of the Ring has to be #1 for me. XWing is close. Gloomhaven is close too.
x-wing the miniatures game? that is probably one of the easiest games to teach (hard to be a master though)
I agree with War of the Ring. But X-wing miniatures?🤔
Great list! Mine is twilight struggle. I'll check out the root app
Really surprised not to see through the ages 2nd edition. The game has lasted the test of time. Really involved teach but infinitely replayable. This is my #1 desert island game.
Great game, but it is not a hard teach imho, 30 minutes max, and you have to pay attention to what people are doing on the first game. It is a time investment (if you play it face to face on the table), but it flows fast. Mage Knight Board Game is much harder to get to the point, where you can play it fluently.
I got play Anno 1800 and I really enjoyed it. Playing with experienced players really helped because they explained the paths to my husband and me.
I am one of those weird guys that loves the sorting of cards for Legendary, haha, and Aliens is my favorite!
Great video. Thanks guys!
Will we get a reaction video from Tom when he gets his voice back were says everything he couldn't say live.
Mike you really hit the nail on the head with Arcadia Quest at #4. Great game to finish a full campaign.
I love the idea for this list. This is really great stuff! I've got a couple new ideas for games I'd like to check out.
For me, it is Root, FOR SURE! I promised not to buy an expansion until we had a dedicated group for it. Now we do and I just bought The Marauder expansion :D GOOD STUFF! And yes, I always recommend everyone to try the app.
Android Netrunner!
Man. You guys dislike a lot of the stuff I love most. I guess if my job involved playing all the games all the time, my perspective might change. But I love all the extra stuff, big rulebooks, busy looking boards, campaigns, complicated setups and everything else that apparently is considered a burden or unnecessary effort. It's all part of the atmosphere and the payoff. I find that the games I enjoy most, tend to involve these extra efforts, hurdles, or learning curves. Setting up a sprawling, complicated board game is quite literally one of my very favorite things to do in life.
Wasn't this a list of games they like?
@@keel1701 No. It's a list of games where they feel it is worth suffering through all those things. Is the title of the video "10 Games We Like"? Nope. Did you even watch it?
@@leadbones right, so ten games they like (or even love). In some cases, the "hassle" is what makes it so good for them (Sleeping Gods is a good example of that). But they just don't like the hassle for hassle's sake.
I'll have to rewatch it, but at ay point did they say one of these games had an "burden or unnecessary effort"?
Did they ever say they suffer through these things? Some of these are their favorite games of all time - that wouldn't happen with something that they have to "suffer through".
Personally I'd add Nightfall. It's a bit difficult to teach but then pretty easy to play, scales well with more players, and has a surprising amount of depth once people know what they're doing
Can't find the video of Zee teaching Mike MTG... anyone?
Came here for the same thing 😅
I think this is the video: th-cam.com/video/HohcFnhILwQ/w-d-xo.html
Zee and Mike play at about 1:20:00. I think Zee explained the basics off-camera though.
Definitely worth the effort Anachrony, Gloomhaven, MtG (like Tom said, go for the preconstructed decks, you'll have fun as well if you just stick to those), Arkham Horror LCG, Spirit Island, Twilight Struggle. Also, but not mentioned: Android Netrunner, Twilight Imperium 4th Edition, Gaia Project !
Actually Netrunner was mentioned by Tom as not worth the effort.. I really don't agree. ;)
This was a fantastic top 10 topic; great job, guys! Also super excited to see your thoughts on KDM!
For my taste given my love of heavy euro's + war games... and in no particular order:
- Arkwright
- On Mars
- Ortus Regni
- Empire of the Sun
- Nevsky
- Pretty much any 18XX game
- Malifaux 3e (seriously one of the best skirmish games you could play but can also be very mentally taxing)
- Age of Sigmar 3e (as above except requires more effort since it needs full size armies)
- Churchill (specifically playing the full campaign)
AoS is a great pick. Even playing Path to Glory requires a significant money and time investment to get 600 points.