Undervolting the SK Hynix GDDR6 on the RTX 3060 Ti makes it overclock way better.
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#Overclocking #RTX3060Ti #Nvidia #voltmod
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I didn't see this commented before, but it's well known that decreasing the voltage of many systems will increase their bandwidth. I agree that it's unlikely to be a thermal issue.
23:04 "at 1.35 volts, it will have much steeper slopes on the rising and falling edge" This is not always the case. Many digital systems will have the same slew rate (slew rate is how steep the rising edge slope is) on the output transistors regardless of their bias voltage. So the rise time and fall time will be less, since it doesn't have to take the extra time to go up or down to the VOH and VOL. so it takes less time to reach the peak, so a single up/down pulse cycle will take less time. This increases the operating frequency and available bandwidth. You can see this in level shifters where the rise and fall times are shorter on the lower voltage side. This will often be expressed as a value of ns/V so the lower the voltage, the less ns it takes to get there.
26:25 "hooking up an oscilloscope to a running GDDR6 memory system would probably cause it to be really unstable" You can make it work out without affecting the stability that much, but such systems are extremely expensive. Since they "only" need to go up to a GHz or 2, you can get high impedance active probes for it.
Ah yes, the next chapter of the summoning ritual
I will try that if we could more 3000 series cards, lol.
Can he summon RTX 3090 card? or just RTX 3060 Ti?
You've gotten pretty good at modifications to the point that you can make your system conform to your wishes!
Considering that Hynix GDDR6 seems to break down a ton, it's sad there isn't a built-in way to undervolt memory, like you can do with the GPU
Something interesting, on the most recent revisions of the 1660 Super from PNY (the single fan version) if you crank the memory speed and voltage all the way down, it has faster memory timings, but mostly for gpu mining
I have some are working @50-55W and memory all the way down, they even run @48W but not that stable only if I decrease the hash
Now running +200 Core. +2000 Mem at 110% powerlimit in Afterburner without any voltage mods. It is Hynix memory on a Zotac Gaming GeForce RTX 3060 Ti AMP White Edition LHR.
In MSI AB, if you double click the number, you can type an exact value. I like setting it that way. With the slider this is not that easy.
One does indeed not simply adjust any slider in a pc. Typing the value is the way!
I just type 99999 in everything and get the rtx 7090 sli performance from my gt 210
@@DeadpoolPlayz 😂
Was there ever a follow-up video to this, showing how to set up the potentiometer under volt, or at least a basic wiring schematic?
The reason for the better OC at lower V is more likely a simpler explanation imo; Hynix chips are made on a finer process node than Samsung chips. Basically the finer the node, the less voltage it needs, and if you use too much voltage, it generates excessive heat, which increases electrical resistance, causing instability and power draw to go up.
This can easily observed if you try mining with a Dell 3060ti; when it boots up, the efficiency is higher, around 440 kh/j, but over the course of 30-40 seconds, you can see rhe efficiency crash down to 400 kh/j as the Temps go up.
Looking forward to your upcoming video showing the hardware modifications you made to your card.
My 3070 is the same way, but I’m only overclocking the memory for crypto mining and incidentally, lower voltages also adds up in savings with the improved efficiency. It was weird because when I tried to just overclock the memory before adjusting the voltages, it would spit out hash errors at a higher rate, but when I bottomed out the voltages first, and THEN cranked up the memory overclock, it clocked even higher than I was able to get it before.
It’s cool you do this stuff just for the fun and bragging rights, but it was a massive boon to my little side hustle, because I don’t waste nearly as much electricity as I did before finding that weird little quirk out
Can you post how you undervolted the VRAM, or where one can find schematics/documentation to do so?
closer and closer to 14000K TS score. Good job didn't expect hynix GDDR6 to behave that way.
This was super fun to watch, interessing stuff.
All the best to Your investigation.
Can't wait to see the video on how you actually did this. If my 3070 has SK Hynix memory I'm totally giving this a shot!
Edit: This is the first time I've been disappointed to discover I have Samsung memory
This is a certified bruh moment
This somehow reminds me of my current Micron GDDR5X on my 1080Ti, On air anything above +500 would lead to worse performance, but once I have it on a waterblock, im running +795 daily without any sort of instability
I find it weird that on graphics cards they allow you to adjust the gpu core voltage but not the memory voltage. Both amd and Nvidia. But they let you overclock the memory.
Some AMD cards do let you adjust the VRAM volts through software
@@ctsd623 which ones?
@@TheMakiran You can adjust vram voltage in rdna2 cards using MPT.
17:50 Talking about the weather, your becoming British XD
It is really warm though.
@@poppyrider5541 I know but had to make a joke.
Iv got a 3060 TI so relay hope we get some videos that will help me oc my stock card. all the complex stuff is past me.
Hynix memory - NO! Never! Forget in..forewer.
That's weird. Is Samsung memory that different? I swear my 6600xt's Samsung memory OC's better at higher voltages, although not by much.
Interesting! Too bad we can't control vram voltage through software atm. On AMD Polaris we could with control center and asus gpu tweak, but not afterburner and I had no problem running 100mv or lower vram volts at stock. If you care to check Bullzoid, can you try running your card ar 700mv when using the vram UV and see if it downclocks? Stock Amperecards always downclock vram to 10GHz below 725-750mv depending on bin. Maybe you can UV core lower with no vram drop if you lower vram voltage?
Actually what the driver names as "memory voltage" is more of a core floor voltage. From my testings, it somehow linked to the imc in the core rather than the memory
@@TheMakiran yeah, seems so on Polaris atleast.
Man there is a LOT of problems with Hynix vram on 3060Ti (and only on this card). There was a big batch of these RAM chips (supposedly from mid 2021) that are degrading pretty fast. After that not only mining is worse, because chips can not hold the overclocking, but also in regular games people meet black screens and crashes. Google this, even Hynix has admitted the problem. The worst thing about this - when fixing and soldering another fresh chip - others that are near are getting overheat and die in a short period. And while soldering - the chip also gets stress overheat and degrades faster. This was the problem only with hynix and only on 3060Ti, that's what i know. Maybe on this video you were noticing some side-effects from potentially defective vram.
BTW, Nvidia releases 3060Ti on DDR6X, maybe this is somehow in connection with lots of RMA'ed units (while mining plague was huge) and thus worse sales of 3060Ti in comparison to other models.
quality voltage over quantity voltage.. said this earlier ;)
I remember reading a post on Reddit that said in regards to vram that gaming prefers tighter timings and workstation oriented loads prefer the higher clock speeds. I have nothing to prove that claim but it sounds good for some reason
thats probably reffering to DRAM, games want better latency but really dont care about the extra bandwidth (much) but pro apps need phat bandwidth. i doubt GDDR is as latency sensitive since by design its not supposed to have good latency
Very interesting! Definitely will test it on other cards when I can :)
I am overclocking my Zotac AMP 3060ti, and i get the same: at around 1150 / 1200 on the VRAm it is artifacting. But then I tried to go higher and I ended up at +2000 MHz without artifacts and gor 85th place in 3DMark Firestrike with just a i5-12400F and 3200C16!!! Please try this BZ! Edit its in Firestrike Ultra!!
the crash is just trying be a bro and get you over 10 mins for the youtube algo
like that has ever been a problem for me
U should do a mining hashrate comparison lol
hey im wondering what's the model of they sk hynix memory they using in msi rtx 3060ti gaming x lhr should i be worried i hope its not using the x005 hynix memory cause im worried i have the gpu for more than 1 year and 4 or 5 months now i don't see anything weird or issue already undervolted after i got the gpu still performing great my idle temp is around 40c-34c full load doesn't exceed 70c around 65c-67c
Do you think this is the "new" Hynix GDDR6 AIM double date rate? that came out either late 2021? or early 2022? or is this the old Hynix GDDR6 that was out in late 2017?
very confusing to say the least. I did not expect to see a Rog Strix 3060 TI OC gaming with Hynix modules.
I have this GPU and the memory performance is significantly less than the non LHR MSI 3060Ti Gaming X. In fact, the non LHR MSI 3060Ti Gaming X performs almost as fast and the non LHR MSI 3070 Gaming X. I can increase the GPU clock above stock on the non LHR 3060Ti and use the same memory overclock on both GPUs at 1300 and get almost the same performance. The power usage is higher on the overclocked non LHR 3060Ti but it performs the same. This is not the first time I've heard GPUs with SK Hynix DDR6 memory underperforming on memory intensive tasks and benchmarks. This situation may be endemic to all GPUs using this current SK Hynix DDR6 fab since I suspect the Hynix DDR6 is not made in spec and may be set for lower power consumption.
Complete the summoning to get a spatula of Jensen to appear.
Man, the best I could do with my 1080 Ti was 10754pts, and that's watercooled and overclocked. And, which CPU where you using, I didn't watch the entire video yet but my 5900 gets 13303pts in this very test, I wonder which one you had 😎
This makes me think the Hynyx memory is produced an a node which is too good for GDDR6...
kinda blows users don't have the ability to adjust the voltage of their gddr6, variance within that product sku or other manufactures' memory may well benefit from ± .1 - .25v. You might be able to give the difference in memory bandwidth significance by allowing your cpu to better utilize gpu memory by enabling "Resizable BAR" and its related settings within your bios.
Also with afterburner, you can lock in the voltage/frequency curve you set (core mhz) by clicking the little cellular bar looking thing to the left of its value, then clicking the right-most square along the function and tapping "L". Doing this and enabling "force constant voltage", "unlock voltage control", and "enable low level IO + hardware access interface = kernal" under settings should keep your core clock (possibly vram too) thermally locked along what it says it can achieve.
might help you get them higher numbers we all desire. good vid
I have my Kingston with SKHynix ddr3 1600 1.65v running at 1333 1.36v which is low compared to normal 1.50v for 1333
This has pretty much nothing to do with this cool video, just wanted to share.
Good finding !
Have you any experience with undervolting the GPU? About to buy this card and use it with a 450 W (Seasonic Platinum) power supply, and am keen to save those watts!
hey, I got a few of these cards for crypto mining CFX.
Having a hard time getting an OC that works on them with Hive Os.
Do you have any guide for this ?
Hey man, could you please do another video on optimizing DRAM timings with a Ryzen 5000 series CPU on a Gigabyte x570 motherboard?
Somehow I just can't figure out what I'm doing wrong. My specs are: 5950X ; Gigabyte x570 Aorus Xtreme ; 4x8 DDR4 3600 Samsung B-die CL16 ; FCLK 1800 ; RTX3090 ; PBO enabled, SMT disabled. Thanks!
what settings are you trying to run?
@@ActuallyHardcoreOverclocking I'm actually not sure, I was using the "DRAM Calculator for Ryzen 1.7.3" for my 3700X with the same DRAM, and it was running perfectly fine, but now it doesn't seem to work with the 5950X. On my old setup I was running an MSI x570 motherboard, so it might just be one specific setting in the Gigabyte UEFI which I don't understand correctly...
PS.: I can send you screenshots of my last DRAM settings if you find that helpful.
@@DC9V That would help tons with any sort of diagnoses. Knowing what its doing could very much help in figuring out Why its not doing.
I'd like to see you do a 5000 series video also there seems like there's some differences from the 3000 series, but the information is hard to find. Also I'm having a problem with my b-die getting unstable above 1.4v for some reason
lower voltage and higher performance? Sounds like a mining dream. haha
right? if you can lower the heat of G6x chips..... while getting higher clocks? thats a million dollar idea
Hynix does seem to like running a bit weird indeed. My 3060 Ti with Samsung VRAM can totally bench +1200 to +1300 on the VRAM (8100 effective as per Afterburner). It is a lot more prone to crashing than artifacting like crazy though. My core is a lot worse, can only do around +150 before crashing.
Can probably tell if its Vref (noise or not properly 1/2 of vddr) or VDDR noise by adding capacitance to VDDR.
Impressive.
what HW are you using for voltage control?
@@paranoidnela :). Thanks. I am aware of that. wanted to know where he bought the parts from. Is that a 10K Ohm potentiometer?
Was there ever a follow-up video to this, showing how to set up the potentiometer under volt, or at least a basic wiring schematic? Are there any online resources for this? I have basic soldering skills
Interestingly, but probably unrelated, to get the best performance when mining on Samsung chips, like 3070s; you need to reduce power by 60% and drop core by 500Mhz then add +1GHz on memory. You do not get the same benefit by just boosting memory speed, you need to reduce card power. Mining is mostly related to memory performance, the card just has to do the bare minimum. Now I'm wondering if reducing power just stops the GDDR6 getting extra voltage under load and keeps it cooler.
Do the cards have some inbuilt heat monitor for the memory that clocks them down when heat builds up?
technically some of the timings can loosen based on memory operating temps. There's no way for the card to control the memory voltage from what I can see.
@@ActuallyHardcoreOverclocking It might be worth running a miner to see what hash rate you get with different voltages, you are essentially just testing the memory speed at that stage. T-rex miner is a good, modern one, the can be set to dump the performance data and has benchmark mode. It will also account for error correction as you will get invalid shares. Also, lot quicker than TimeSpy.
EDIT - oh balls, you have LHR rate card. EDIT2 - doesn't matter actually, it's only LHR on eth algo, just select a different algo?
@@lucidnonsense942 Mining voltage per clock is completely unrelated to gaming voltage per clock.
Much of this has to do with load. A greater load requires greater voltage per clock.
You summoned Raid Shadow legends
Hello mate , i own an Asus 3060Ti Tuf OC V2 , and it uses Hynix memories , randomly i came across some posts on internet talking about 3060 ti dying if OCing the memory if it has hynix memorie chips , anyways they mostly talk about GIgabite cards with memory code 005 if im not wrong , it got me a little worried , im currently Ocing the memory to 900+ and never exp any issue with it so far after almost 2 years ~ , by any chance you know what hynix chips this model uses or if the romur is true or not etc Please answer this if u can mate
GDDR6 notoriously hot
Miners figured out that undercoating hynix gddr6 makes it clock better quite a while ago. Around the 1660super launch
@@sonacphotos yea multimillion dollar operations who can make and get custom software and firmware, whose entire business model revolves around gddr and HBM reliant algorithms and harvesting block rewards with as little power usage as possible, can't figure out a soldering iron and a voltmod. ⁷
At about 27:00 you said that probing gddr6 voltage with will make the voltage dance, and that there are special probes that can do it without a problem, what makes those probes better/more expansive?
Better shielding probably or built in caps/resistors. Connecting a probe essentialy creates a parallel circuit to the loop and voltage changes in parallel. Something something kirchoffs voltage law something..
I meant probing the datalines. The issue is that connecting anything to high speed signals affects them(daisy chain motherboards clock worse because of the extra dimm slots simply being there). You'd need something like this: www.tek.com/oscilloscope/dpo70000-mso70000
7:30 does the overall power limit in Afterburner (not the core curve editor) not also lower the memory voltage? I don't have any way to check, but my 3060Ti (Aorus Master v1 non-LHR) holds a +1500 mem clock at 55% power limit, 131W under load.
you should be able to check what memory chips you have with GPU-z? Cards with Samsung VRAM regularly hit around 2100MHz VRAM clock.
@@ActuallyHardcoreOverclocking sure enough, Samsung GDDR6 lol. sensors says it settles in around 2069MHz 😎 though the info tab claims 2119MHz. seems Aorus left the reference clocks as the defaults though
I have a 3060ti with sk hynix memory and it’s bench stable at +1500. 24/7 stable at +1300. I dunno why I’m typing this comment.
Because a year from typing it you get a thanks from me.
Isn't that the same with all chips. Chips get assigned a safe voltage that guarantees that all chips work at. but most chips work on lower voltages and lower voltages makes them more efficient and create less heat so they run better. i undervollted my 6900XT from 1175 to 1050 and it run 120 mhz faster no changes made and it overclocks 190 mhz further.
There may just be a chip that gets to hot and with the lower voltage it does not.
My 6900XT was hitting it's highest clocks with a +200mv core voltage offset.
@@ActuallyHardcoreOverclocking Nice mine just doesnt see stable under 1025 at all and i always go up a step from not stable so 1050 seem to be as low as i can go. then again im not realy trying i find a good sweet spot these days and leave it there. I'd rather be gaming after waiting 9 months to get a gpu.
my undervolted 3060 ti Ventus 2x OC(V1) LHR wont even do +750 on the memory, this mod might be in my future.
Why is there so much headroom for memory overclocking on the GPUs?
Interesting to get back to gpu overclocking 😊
what about rtx 3090 undervolting memory? my have 112°C watercooled.. i will need order some thermalpads :(
Wonder what price difference between GDDR6 & GDDR6X
first
second
@@sahin199999 I lost by 4s this is a competitive field. I’ll take third good sir
Last
Please Dude, Could do some tests in mining, hynix in mining consume more energy
Of course it couldn’t crash at the beginning of the test
Got a A2000 6G with Hynix vram. It sucks, for example timespy graphics score is 5% lower than those samsung vram version.
Maybe this is a consequence of lower temperatures at a lower voltage, not actually the lower voltage?
Sooo do you think this might work on my 3070ti ftw3 card? I've been wanting to hard mod something and this seems fairly not so bad like I might not kill my card lol I also have a gigabyte 3060ti as well that might be easier on? Idk lol
i would try to find what VRAM chips you have. if it's sk hynix, try it out and let us know ;)
@@Oats4761 I just tore the gigabyte 3060 ti oc edition apart and it has Samsung memory *to my surprise* And my 3070 ti has micron memory it looks like. I guess I'll have to do a lot of probing and research before I try anything
the 3070 ti has g6x right? I don't know if it behaves the same as G6
@@kuyans3889 3070Ti is G6X, it runs a lot hotter so when OCing memory I'd make sure to swap thermal pads
@@AA-kx5es yeah i know that, OP was just asking if undervolting the memory on the 3070 ti would yield the same result shown on this video. I was just pointing out that the 3070 ti has different memory to the 3060 ti
This word needs to get out! Before I looked into it I thought more voltage meant more clock! Wrong! I undervolted my ryzen 5 3600 to 1.2 and set clock to 4300mhz and it runs steady and 20 degrees c less. Like seriously wtf! Why are ppl out here telling ppl to overvolt and overclock when it seems all chips run at lower voltage and do more clocks. It’s legit shocking to me
same with the GDDR5 on my AMD cards . It is almost always the lowest voltage that works best for me. I doubt that improving thermal pads would help but make it worse since the GPU chip could add more heat to the memory chips than lessen it though the one on the rtx 3090 is another story
How did you adjusted the vram voltage on your card?
@@TheMakiran it depends on the cards and operating system. I have AMD Polaris cards and vram voltage only works in Windows not Linux based OS.
@@zodiacfml What is called the memory voltage in the driverr isnt actually the vram voltage, is acts like a core floor voltage
wait what the hell wasn't the 3060ti meant to have gddr6x memory? EDIT: nope, only 3070ti 3080, 3080ti and 3090.
PCB: Frànkenstien edition.
I'm looking at the Micron data sheet and it says max is 1.2v? (I thought the +-3% was just the fluctuation range around the averages of 1.135v high power mode/1.125v low power mode, but I've probably misunderstood the data sheet).
Is Samsung/Micron GDDR6 safe to run at over 1.1393v then? My Samsung GDDR6 is still scaling well at this voltage, but I don't want to go beyond this if it's going to Bojo it.
Sounds like regular power and temperature issue -- lower voltage lower power lower temperature
any update on the gpu memory swap/upgrade?
Could someone speculate on why this is the case? My 3080 (Gigabyte 10 GB Vision OC) drops frames in VR when at factory voltages but if I limit the voltage through MSI afterburner's voltage curve editor by 100mV it cleans up the performance significantly and everything runs buttery smooth. I'd be interested to hear what this community thinks about it (I've heard that this is the case for other 30 series owners too).
Bouncing off power limit?
@@DarkLinkAD Quite likely, to me it seems unusual that a power limit bounce would result in a dropped frame though, especially if the frames are capped and there is plenty of headroom to exceed that frame limit. Its feels strange to have improved performance (or at least stability) when undervolting an appropriate amount and this video is a nod in that direction. I can't for the life of me explain it though, maybe 30 series cards just have really poor power management.
@@zealeigh If its powerlimit, increasing the limit will have similar results without underclocking/volting.
If its temperature, increasing fan speed may help.
This is why I prefer static fan speeds and static clocks/voltages. Pretty easily to tell when you dont have the middleman changing it up o you.
IIRC DR. Disrespect had a similar issue you described with his 30 series and reverted to his previous cards
@@zealeigh Sorry bout your troubles though, I feel your pain. My Gigabyte RX460 killed itself, appearntly its a faulty design, the board trace shorts between layers... I did notice that the vram was closer to hdmi port and hdmi had been unsually hot since day 1, the other models have vram on the other side.
Check the temps. Repaste chip repad VRM if temp is the culprit.
Pretty Switches.
dont know if hynix ddr4 would relate to this but from my experience, getting djr 24/7 stable at anything over 1.3v is an utter joke, so i can see how trashnix would be better with less voltage on gpus. only hynix wouldnt know there own ICs
CJR memóriák jók a Hynixnél.A DJR "gyengébb" bizonyos dolgokban.
Keep calm and decrement VMEM.
fkn hardcore
any help with 3950x low score at timespy?
disable SMT
@@ActuallyHardcoreOverclocking wow i didn exept that you will awnser :D tnx btw is have anypoint to disable smt at all or only for the benchmark?
@@powerBusa1340 just for some benchmarks.
@@ActuallyHardcoreOverclocking ok tnx for the awnsers
Miners Rejoice !
maybe the heatsink is not properly cooling the mem chips when you undervolt there is less heat...
try this with gddr6x pls )
Oooo
it is SK Hynix memory crap, they made bad HBM memory too.
hmm
Buildzoid teaching Nvidia and AMD they're dumb and lazy with voltages.
I like Samsung ddr6 because it rarely takes down the drivers and just shows a lot of artifacting/gives you plenty of warning so I never had to reinstall drivers. With my Hynix gddr6X 3080ti, my drivers get corrupted very often without warning when messing with the mem or just using my mining profile for gaming on accident