Sleeping Bag vs Quilt--Infrared Proof
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 26 ส.ค. 2024
- Flir infrared view of cold spots and air leaks, feature comparison, recommendations, and gear links. Choosing between sleeping bags vs quilts can be a decision with some consequences on your wallet and pack weight. Let me know what you choose. Enlightened Equipment Revelation vs a Feathered Friends sleeping bag.
If you are planning to hike or thru hike the AT, PCT, CDT, SHT or doing any other hiking or backpacking, this gear review with the Flir One Gen3 thermal imaging will be helpful to make the decision.
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Enlightened Equipment Revelation Quilt
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Thermarest NeoAir XTherm
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Feathered Friends
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Ridgerest Classic (2R insulation)
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Ridgerest SOLite Reflective (2.8 R insulation)
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Military Bivy
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Filmed with a GoPro Hero 7 Black (available here):
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Watch this video next about how to best use quilt straps: th-cam.com/video/uYHTA1hDs-8/w-d-xo.html
Flir One Gen 3 Thermal Imaging Camera
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Enlightened Equipment Revelation Quilt
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Thermarest NeoAir XTherm
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Feathered Friends
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Ridgerest Classic (2R insulation)
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Ridgerest SOLite Reflective (2.8 R insulation)
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Military Bivy
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Filmed with a GoPro Hero 7 Black (available here):
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In my opinion this is very misleading. When you roll over in your bag you need to give the bag a chance to regain some loft and retain heat so keep your infra red camera rolling. You are not getting any drafts. When you roll around your quilt you let in drafts which don’t seal unless you rearrange the quilt. It really seems that the outcome of your ‘test’ was predetermined.
I do agree that the bag will loft back up and retain some heat after rolling. Keeping the infra red camera going would have been interesting as well. The results were not predetermined as I am not impartial to one over the other, but I was interested to see that the sleeping bag does allow more heat out when rolling than I may have considered previously. I don't know without some well thought out and controlled environments and more precise measuring, but I'm guessing that the draft into the quilt and the compressed insulation of the bag letting heat out might have similar effects. Hmm.
Agreed!
The IR cam can only see surface temperature not internal. Because it detect infrared rays, not like the thermometer. something funny you can try, is look at a mirror, point the IR cam to your reflexion, and it will read your temperature, means infrared rays can be also reflected and can give false readings
Alex nailed the points here.
Drafts is a big one for quilts as well and the readjustments if you toss and turn are a pain while trying to get quality sleep.
The down is compressed when you turn over which will uncompress shortly after.
Also, considering a tapered or rectangular bag, I have enough space in mine to go turn on my side without pulling my bag, so I never get this cold back effect.
I use a bag that has a toe box zip as well so can open to a full blanket for warmer months or sitting around.
@@AdventuresInReach thanks for making the video!
Not sure if someone already commented but the strap goes under the sleeping pad when using a quilt, not under your body.
For those confused about why the back looks red on the sleeping bag, that’s the main argument for quilts essentially. You can see the heat permeating through the back because you’re compressing the down. Hence why quilts say “forget the back”.
The strap system you see me using is how it's designed by Enlightened Equipment. One strap has a hoop and attaches around the pad. The other attaches around your body. You can put them in either position. I have considered purchasing a second hoop strap and attaching them both.
I used to use my sleeping bag half open as a quilt, because I toss and turn, and because I always sleep with my knees, bend.
Eventually I started bringing a duvet with a homemade strap system, and I felt warmer in it.
I have been delighted to discover top quilts and am definitely going to buy or make one.
It sounds like you practically did make one. A quilt will be a bit lighter though.
I also use this method 👍🏼
I like the idea of the test, thanks for giving it a try! I do think it would be useful for the two bags to be more similar: both brand new (FF looks old maybe, or in any case has poor loft for some reason), both similar amount of down, both similar girth, both differential cut (maybe nunatak or katabatic would make more sense).
I agree that the bags could have been more similar. The FF is a little bit older. They are rated the same and pretty similar loft when laid side by side. This wasn't an exact science, but was intended to show some strengths and weaknesses of the two systems. I'd certainly be open to trying again with other systems and closer specs. Thanks for the suggestions.
I’ve had my FF widgeon down to 3 degrees around 7k feet altitude and had 0 issue with nothing on but compression shorts, wool socks, and a compression shirt, and I have an FF peregrine I can’t wait to test out this winter. I know most manufacturers besides FF and WM are really exaggerating their temp ratings, but I can’t imagine a quilt providing the same warmth…..I also fall asleep and wake up on my back without rolling over so there’s that.
An infrared camera shows difference in temperate. It does not show heat loss. If used correctly you can determine if there is heat loss though. When you sleep on your back in a sleeping bag, you squeeze the sleeping bag with your back against the pad, making this area of the sleeping bag warm (inside as well as the the outside fabric). I am not an expert but when you turn around, the infrared camera is showing you that the area you just laid on is warmer than the rest of the bag. Surely there will be some loss of warmth, because of the loss of loft, but the camera is also showing you that the sleeping bag has become warm while you were laying on it. It could very well be that the inside of the back of the bag stays warmer than the rest of the bag after it has regained its loft.
It shows heat difference by comparing the colors, temperature (although I had the thermometer turned off), and heat loss as determined by the warmer (white--red--orange) areas. If there is more heat conducting through and showing the greater difference of temp from surrounding air and objects, then it is losing more heat. Just like if you point this at a house the windows and doors show up as warmer because that's where there's less insulation and greater air leakage and therefore more heat loss.
Quilts let in too much cold air imho. Turning around on film while awake is one thing. While sleeping gaps just open on me. Even for summer backcountry use I have switched to a Patagonia ultralite sleeping bag. More ppl seem to like quilts and I do for hotel travel and some car camping but fir backcountry I am sticking w slpg bags. 😬
I agree about preferring sleeping bags, but when I can save a pound and still stay warm, it's no contest to me. I seem to be just conscious enough when turning that i don't let much air in or leave a hole open. It's all personal preference.
In cold weather camping, I'd end up sleeping with my down jacket on and hood up anyway, so the quilt could still work
Absolutely. If it's cold you will have other warm gear to wear. I will probably continue to use my -5 degree F down bag and synthetic overbag in the winter, but everything else 3 season when I might be carrying my gear, I'll stick with the quilt.
Back in 1972 my wife opened up on our Eddy Bauer Sleeping bags, down the side and across the bottom so that they laid out flat and sewed a nylon sheet to the sleeping bag creating a two person sleeping bag, with dawn on top and a sheet on the bottom side. You sleep between the down and the nylon. There is no need to attach the bag to the sleeping pad. Warm air can't gush out when you roll over. The second Eddy Bauer she put in a zipper that goes down the side and across the bottom so it can be used as a traditional sleeping bag or as a quilt. Back than we were not obsessed with saving a few ounces on a longer zipper. We were more concerned with versatility and function. At home they are the down quilt on our guest bed. The obsession with ounces by present-day hikers is overrated.
Just a tip for using a Quilt: You are supposed to put both (!) straps on the air matress and then attach the quilt to it. This way you can turn around without having air drafts.
This quilt comes with two different straps and directions for their use as demonstrated here. One strap is for attaching to the mattress and one for attaching to the body. You can purchase an additional mattress strap but if you put the body one around the mattress is pulls the quilt to the outside edge or underneath the mattress, which isn't ideal. I'm guessing other brands may come with different configurations. The idea with these is so you can easily get in and out, but I have thought about purchasing that second mattress strap.
Also, you wouldn’t think it but if you pull those strap connections down and to the side of the quilt instead of tucked under you you won’t get such a big draft when you turn over, the quilt will stay more flush against the pad instead of raising up when you turn over.
Awesome vid
When rolling around with the sleeping bag. there are a few things to consider:
1. Not everybody rolls with the bag, some roll in the bag. Some sleeping bags even come with a system to attach to the pad, so the less insulated underside doesn't get exposed.
2. If you roll with the bag, the down needs some time to expand. You have only filmed a few seconds, if you filmed a few more, we would see that red spot rapidly disappear.
Dang. This dude done whipped out some science on us.
Loosely scientific. My intention was a good visual and to encourage people to consider which to use. Thanks for the comment.
@@AdventuresInReach i think this was one of the smartest tests you could do to test a sleeping bag's warmth though. I always hear people talk about R value and use fancy words but your giving visuals. which I havent seen any other channels do. Smart thinking sir!
Obviously the sleeping bag became warm under the back in supine position and when he turned on the side you see in the thermal image those warmed areas , I guess if you wait enough time they'll cool it down and become blue, so they are not really permanent leakage areas.
Agreed--that isn't a permanent leakage area, just a large area where heat escapes momentarily each time you roll. The warm part of the bag is presented to the cold air instead of turning inside the quilt where no warm side is presented.
@@AdventuresInReach Bingo , that happened to me last night in a Nordisk -10 synthetic bag . I was warm then turned and my bag was cold it was -6 uk with strong breeze i may need to rethink.
Done both , used a sleeping bag in many weather condtions , some sleeping bags are way out on their temp ratings . Matter of preference what people can use , but when you need to warm up , or stay warm then a good sleeping bag can save you life when your cold or condtions rapidly change
Absolutely. Different manufacturers seem to have different methods of rating their bags and some just don't cut it for their temp rating. I would say that as long as it's properly rated for the conditions, a sleeping bag or quilt could save you. However, when it gets colder I only use a sleeping bag system since I'd rather just not roll much vs having periodic drafts. The periodic quilt preference for me is mainly about saving weight.
Honestly, quilt on sleeping pad seems like a pain. I am a hammock camper so it really isn't an issue to sometimes leak some warm air. Because I have a second underquilt that covers the rest with some overlap.
It took a little getting used to but really isn't a pain. I've hammock camped a few times yet seem to prefer the ground. It gets strapped onto the pad and i just barely have to adjust it when i roll.
I'm a hammock and a tent camper - I love using both. Using a quilt with a sleeping pad is no more a pain than setting up an underquilt with the hammock. I tent camp because I go many places where there are no suitable trees for a hammock.
I sleep on my sides and I find a quilt (Katabatic Gear) to be warmer than any similar price/temp bag. I can keep my knees warmer since the insulation isn't compressed, and I can warm up my feet with my hands. I can take off/put on socks easier in the bag. I can get out to pee at night easier. I don't sweat as much in a quilt which keeps me warmer and my quilt drier. I like my Sawatch quilt a lot!
Absolutely. These are some good points. To me there's something cozy or secure about being in a sleeping bag, but the weight savings and ability to avoid sweating easier has made the quilt win out for me during three season camping.
I like the quilt idea. Thanks for the videos.
You're welcome. Thanks for the comment. Is this your first time hearing about quilts?
@@AdventuresInReach Yes, this is the first time hearing about them. Great idea. Could have used one many times over the years.
I am a VERY active sleeper, so much so that taking a pillow is pointless because it won't spend most of the night under my head anyway. I use a Western Mountaineering Terralite sleeping bag, because it isn't one of those coffin-like mummy bags, it's big enough to accommodate my perpetual motion without getting cold spots from loft compression. And for as big as it is, it doesn't weigh very much at all. It is expensive, but worth it imo.
Absolutely. The expense is sometimes worth it to save weight and get more specialty gear.
What happens with the face opening when you turn inside the bag?
Watching sleep outdoors using an infrared camera is a great idea. I think looking at the problem this way has potential for the future .... sory google translator :)
Thank you. Glad to hear you liked it. I started looking at other winter gear as well. Feel free to check out this playlist: th-cam.com/play/PLNcpRGw7T0bg3sAVAMp_J8E86oVGCNKp_.html
In my experience the long strap goes around the pad. This keep the quilt snug to your pad and eliminates the loss of warm air if you toss and turn like I do. Hope this helps some others.
Hello. The directions that came with this quilt describe and picture one strap around the pad and one strap around the body. I did recently order and receive a second set of straps so I can have 2 that are attached to the pad. They have movable clips so so the quilt is pulled in above the pad vs being pulled under the pad on the ground.
@@AdventuresInReachstrange. I own three different EE quilts and none of mine came with instructions. In any case, I have never sleep poorly when going under the pad with the longer strap. Keeps the edges down and tight to the pad. Call it a hack or whatever, but it definitely works for me. You do you, and enjoy!
I find 2 advantages with quilts. The first is that it doesn't suffer from compression of the down. In a sleeping bag, the bag around the upper abdomen and shoulders gets stretched causing compression of the down. The second benefit is that, unlike a sleeping bag, down doesn't get squashed and rendered useless underneath you.
For two similar weights, the quilt offers better utilisation of the down, hence better heat retention.
I agree that when comparing quilts and bags of the same weight, the quilt wins out. If you sleep on your back or rotate inside of the bag, I would think that a sleeping bag would still be warmer. I'll likely stick to a quilt for 3 season use, and a sleeping bag when it gets colder and through the winter.
Wrong, even compressed its still an extra layer, and your body warmth is relative to the space around you, if that space is greater like in a quilt then that is more space your body has to heat. As for the stretching thing that is pure nonsense unless you are in a bag way too small. Also every single benefit he claimed in the video of a quilt you can do with your bag, as for the thermal vision, his interpretation is beyond belief bad.
Some brands allow you to shift the down to the top - so you can do the same thing but not have air gaps.
Thank you, that was useful. I strongly dislike close fitting mummy bags, and you give some of the reasons. However, I found your video another convincing demonstration of why quilts such as that would be a really bad choice for me, and I suspect many others.
shouldnt you lock the quilt below your sleeping pad? S2S recommends doing so with all their quilts and will have absolutely no drafts because the quilt is tucked and locked to the edge of the sleeping pad. i've used the etherlight xt with the glow gw2 and it worked great
The quilt concept is the same, but different brands have different methods of attachment. Enlightened Equipment sends directions with their quilts recommending to use them how I show here. They don't want the quilt going between the pad and the ground to wear out or get wet, or creating a wedge of air along the sides.
Nice review! Thank-you!
Thanks for watching!
In a hammock, I use a quilt, but I can't handle lower than 20 degrees. For added layers, I wear down pants & down jacket inside the quilt.
There's really no insulation underneath with a hammock. Have you used a pad or an underquilt in your hammock?
@@AdventuresInReach I have the Hammock Gear 20 degree under-quilt and a Hammock Gear 20 degree top quilt. Hammock Gear brand under-quilts & top quilts are shorter than other brands on the market. The full size under-quilt is a little short and my feet stick out past the under-quilt bottom, so I need some wool socks and stick my feet in the top quilt foot box. I like to pull the top quilt over my head, so I ordered a long version. I am 5' 8", the long version is just long enough to cover my head. If I was over 6', I would buy a different brand. Some people like the top quilt up to their neck then wear a hat, so Hammock Gear brand would be OK.
Sleeping bag is just worth the extra few ounces in my opinion. I couldn’t put up with the drafts of a quilt. I love my lark 10 and I couldn’t live without the hood. I slept in my lark about 130 nights while hiking the pct and absolutely loved it.
It was an adjustment but I found the weight savings worth it. I still use a sleeping bag in the winter though.
Im not concerned with an extra pound. I use my sleeping bag like a quilt most of the time. The extra width of an open bag ensures no drafts coming in. The hood is still useable in this configuration too which is really nice
Absolutely. If you're not worried about weight a sleeping bag is still my preference. I've been more and more weight conscious and switching to a quilt for 3 season made a big difference in my pack weight...and is much warmer than I initially expected.
@@AdventuresInReach definitely.. I was actually considering a UGQ outlaw hybrid quilt because you can zip it up if needed. But I'm not ready to drop 400 on a quilt yet. They look amazing tho
Very cool video and perfect timing as I am making some decisions on this right now. New sub!
Thank you. I would certainly say quilts for lightweight backpacking and sleeping bags for winter.
Cool video, love the "scientific" proof. I love my quilts and am looking for quilt in the 0-15 degree range.
Thank you. It's lightly scientific, and more just interesting to see. I'm certainly happy with mine so far.
I have a quilt i wide, and strapping it to my sleepingpad, there are no warm air coming out. If you want it to make a better closing to the sleepingpad, you should get a wider quilt.
For sure. This is plenty wide for me. There's certainly a balance between fit to the pad and not having too much volume inside to heat. This setup works quite well for me in most any 3 season application.
Nice review! A suitable separate puffy head covering needs to be paired with your quilt, otherwise, most people will never come close to the quilts rated temperature minimum. EE makes such head coverings. If you have to get up in the night, you can wear this thick head cover outside. Can't do that with a sleeping bag!
That is a great point. I've so far been comfortable without one, but also haven't used it down to its rating. I wear a warm hat and am planning to use either a hooded jacket or just wrap/drape my down vest over my head. My only concern with the hood is adding weight back into the system which diminishes why I purchased it. Catch 22. I do like the idea of keeping your hood on when getting up though...
Wear a puffy with your quilt. Buying a good adds two ounces minimum, which takes you towards sleeping bag territory.
If I had to do it all over again I would get a Zen Bivy. I roll around a lot in my sleep. Being big and tall I need a quilt to be comfortable. The biggest bags suitable for backpacking are too tight. Quilts can be drafty if you move a lot like me. I love to sleep in the woods but I cannot say I sleep well. Last time I used my quilt backpacking got my straps dialed in and slept like a baby. I have yet to test it outdoors, but I modified my outdoor vitals top quilt to fit a Zen bivy half sheet.( I sewed on loops ) I don't know how much warmer I will be but I can tell you I will not lose my pillow.
That sounds like a creative solution. I'd be curious to hear how that works for you. The straps certainly do make a big difference once you get them dialed.
IMO a quilt is ok for warmer conditions and even then the draught is an issue. If you are small build and shorter then I see quilts as more usable. But if you are tall and broad then you need a very wide and long quilt that sort of negates the weight advantage. In my experience you need a very large quit to stop draughts as a broad and tall guy who is pure side sleeper it's not a great system at all unless you got a seriously.wide and long quilt which not a lot of manufactures make!. Then the straps you probably need more than two with an extremely long and wide quilt. The faff of straps too is not to be overlooked, they have to be set up perfect to be at all effective which isn't always achievable. If you are a back sleeping shorter slim person then i could see the system working a lot better. A good fitting and we'll designed sleeping bag is much better for me I have found . I won't be going back to quilts , unless I can get a very big one for summer use only.
My quilt is rated to 20F so I also use this in the warmer conditions. My go to setup in the winter is still a sleepingbag with overbag. I just try not to roll much in the winter to avoid losing heat out of the back, as demonstrated here. I certainly agree that if the quilt isn't big enough to pull around you, it won't be very effective.
I think you have misunderstood what you are seeing with that IR camera. You are mostly seeing the surface temperature of object. The reason that we can use them to look at houses and make judgments about the insulation of a house is because the configuration of the house is not changing. We can assume that what we are seeing is the steady state perfomance of the house.
When you roll over in the bag you are not see an increase in heat leakage; instead you are measure how good the sleeping pad was at keeping whatever heat was leaking through the bag. I.e. the bag looks "hot" when you roll over because the pad trapped so much heat in the bag between your body and the pad.
Tldr; your video shows almost nothing at all about the quilt vs the bag rather instead it simply shows how good the sleeping pad is.
Agree
Actually his video did show something about the quilt - how every time he rolled, there was a gap exposing his back.
It appeared to me that your quilt was warmer. White being the highest area of heat loss, then red, then yellow, etc. Would agree for winter camping I would want more then just my pad on my back for insulation regardless of the R value. 3 season prefer a quilt
Correct. The white is the greatest heat loss. It's hard to beat a thick puffy hood, draft collar, and no air leaks when flipping during the winter. I do feel the cold on my back when flipping, but it's not that the quilt is better, just less heat loss in comparison than I expected and a very effective lightweight option.
You are not winter camping in canada with a silly little quilt. Friggin gets to -35°c here. Lol Quilts. We laugh at them in canada unless our granny made us one for our beds in our heated houses. Those are the only quilts we like lol
I agree because in my book they are only for 3 season use. I live in Northern MN and have camped many times at -30F and two nights at -50F. Once its below 20F I'll switch to my -5 down bag, then add an overbag and a summer bag inside.
It appears that the quilt consistently gapped when you moved from back to side. The infrared shows a big heat loss. Because two different products from different companies were used, this isn't a valid test. I did a test that used one quilt/bag. I made a bag that opens under my body. I tested using a Govee thermometer to measure my body temperature. In sleeping bag configuration I was over 2 degrees F warmer. See the test on my channel. Tom Loves DIY.
Great video, but I never understand the choice between Quilts or Sleeping bags. Every time I look for a quilt that has a comparable temperature rating as my sleeping bag, it's around the same weight. Sometime a few grams lighter (I'm talking max a 100 grams) or heavier (max. 300 grams heavier). So I never get the point about weight savings. There don't seem to be any and I think a sleeping bag is more versatile than a quilt, just because of the hood. Can anyone show me examples for comparable temperature ranges where there actually are major benefits for the quilt?
I also prefer sleeping bags because of the hood. However, my experience looking has been that quilts win out with lower prices for the same weight. Sleeping bags of the same weight and rating need to use lighter/more expensive materials for the same rating.
Another thing you have to compare is the temp. Most cottage quilt manufacturers temps are comfort. A lot of sleeping bag companies are lower temp ratings. So if we look at a Mountain Equipment Xeros bag. It’s rated for 10 degrees Fahrenheit with 800-fill it weighs 38oz (1077 grams). Now if you look at a hammock gear economy quilt which is rated for 10 degrees Fahrenheit with sewn foot box, 800-fill, and pad straps it weighs 29.44oz (834.61 grams). Which no that’s not a big weight savings. HOWEVER right now that bag is discontinued at a price of $478 and the hammock gear quilt is $257. That’s a substantial savings. If you want to spend $400+ you could get 850-fill or 900-fill and possibly a lower degree quilt (depends on manufacturer) which will drop the weight even more. For instance I have a Warbonnet Diamondback 10 degree that has a sewn foot box in 850-fill that weighs 24oz (680.38 grams). And It only cost $315. Im not saying quilts are better than bags but the savings in money and weight are there.
When ultralight camping 300g is a LOT which is why some people talk about the weight difference.
@@TomCashTV No, I mean the quilt is heavier... not the sleeping bag.
I have a Zenbivy quilt + sleep system that in my opinion takes care of the weaknesses of a quilt system that you pointed out. I’d like to see you do another comparison of the Zenbivy system vs a sleeping bag. Nice filming!
Thank you. I would love to compare the Zenbivy...now if they only want to lend/donate one... Any connections? There's so much gear that would be interesting to test, yet expensive to purchase. I'll certainly keep this in mind if I get a chance to test one.
I don’t hike, I canoe/kayak or motorcycle camp. That means weight is not a major issue. After being too cold to sleep while camping along the Blue ridge Parkway a couple of years ago in my bag, I had my wife make me an oversized traveling quilt. Now I put the quilt under my bag, and then wrap it around me (and the bag) as I sleep. Alternatively I use it as a liner for my tiny tent, basically insulating it. I don’t camp in brutally cold weather like you do, but I can spend a night in the mid 20’s without suffering. Adding a dog or two would probably make it toasty warm!
That sounds comfy. Have you tried adding more insulation under you?
@@AdventuresInReach I have used an air mattress with a thin closed cell mat on it at times. On the bike I usually just lay on top of my my riding gear (or wear it, if its really cold).
Are you feeling cold from the ground? You may also consider what type of down is in the quilt. The down used for sleeping bags are the under feathers that are more "downy". Quilts meant for in home use often have more full feathers. They are still warm, but certainly do not match the warmth of the puffy feathers.
@@AdventuresInReach my quilts are low tech and made out of cotton, hardly the best material. I would prefer wool batting, but Joni is allergic to it. If it’s really cold (and here that means in the 20s) I use layers: quilt on the outside wrapped around me, a wool blanket as an insulator, and my sleeping back inside that. If I am sleeping in my kayak I leave the sleeping bag unzipped, for obvious reasons!
@@clydeosterhout1221 It sounds like you're already pretty well wrapped up. You might need a new down sleeping bag or a hot water bottle.
Am I the only one, who can see that the sleepingbag is moisted at 2.38. If the down is moisted then the heat retension is gone, so I have my doubts whit the test.
Hello. I took the bag out of its large storage sack inside about 15 minutes before filming. It was dry. That may be some shifting of down that you are seeing.
Thanks, i learn a lot.
I reached the opposite conclusion from this video - the sleeping bag looks SO MUCH better than the quilt. You are disregarding all the rearranging you have to do to get the quilt to cover everything as you switch sides plus the setup to the sleeping pad is so much harder. On the trail and in the dark, this sounds like a horrendous option to have to deal with. Meanwhile, its easy to put a sleeping bag on a pad and quickly get inside it and sleep (no readjusting if you wake up either). I get cold easily so having my head be completely covered (I only leave a tiny hole in the sleeping bag head for air to go out) by the sleeping bag (sometimes I’ll wear a hat/jacket hood too) is super important which lacks versatility as well. And a sleeping bag is just as versatile as a quilt if you unzip it fully. So quilts only win when it comes to weight (I don’t see real warmth differences esp since you didn’t give the down time to refluff). I’m an ultralight backpacker so I love to cut weight but I will gladly give up some ounces for warmth/comfort.
Sleeping bags are great as well. I use them during the winter because you can't beat a hood. However, the quilt is super light, surprisingly warm, and my go to choice for 3 season backpacking. The setup on the pad is pretty quick and easy and when on a trip I leave the bungy in place so it only requires clipping 2 clips before it's ready. The rearranging is sometimes annoying, but it's worth it to me. During a roll the sleeping bag feels cold on the back until it's lofted, while the quilt gets the a draft along the pad when rolling.
I've camped in 30 degree weather with my 20 degree quilt and an xlite pad. I was warm af! I went out with the same set up and it dropped down to 24. My back was cold af! Haha ! Need to upgrade my pad for winter. Ha!
Well, the Xtherm is warm. Otherwise you can just use a foam pad under yours. That generally makes a huge different.
the moral of the story: if you toss and turn constantly, you're >generally< gonna be colder.
sleeping bag: you dont let the down loft back up
quilt: you always have gaps cos you dont zip (newer ones seem to)
desgined will merge both options, imo. maybe have a wide sleeping coffin (whole thermarest pad width and strapped in) with a petruding mid for knees and either side design.
temp control should be strictly under user control via debliberate venting
I've been considering a quilt for some time. I did the Uintah highline trail in August(only month without significant snow at altitude) with a sleeping bag and was just bitter cold with every layer on that i had packed. I realize now it was my cheap pad with no insulation but for similar reason i am distrustful of quilts. I went out there alone hoping to die but not quite in that way.
One reason that quilts exist is that the insulation in the bottom of a sleeping bag doesn't help much when it's compressed, instead of being lofted. Therefore insulation you are laying on is of very little value. A high R-value sleeping pad will do much more than laying on a thick sleeping bag. If you have a cheaper, lower R-value pad you can always add a foam pad underneath for additional warmth. The best is something like Thermarest NeoAir Xtherm.
Yeah, but. There is always what brand sleeping bag did you compare to the quilt? I've used Western Mountaineering bags for 25 years and never regretted it.
The sleeping bag is from Feathered Friends brand, and the quilt is from Enlightened Equipment. I still use a sleeping bag during the cold months, but during the summer I don't miss bags and enjoy the weight savings.
I've never had a bad night's sleep in my 20 degree bag, and it cost about $100 less than a comparable quilt from REI. Even when temps got into the mid teens, I was comfortable. Sure, it weighs 9 oz more than the quilt, but are those 9 oz worth $100? I don't think so. I only wear under shorts and a short sleeve shirt to sleep in, too.
The problem is that ir cameras like flir have a real time temperature range adjustment, therefore the red in the sleepingbag image could be 60F while being 75F in the quilt image...
I agree that they generally (many have built in thermometers) show relative temperatures vs actual. However, the videos were shot within the same time frame, in the same temperature, with the same person inside, with the same camera position so the colors are going to be very close to representing the same thing. It's also a visual of where heat is escaping.
Extremely misleading. Witt FLIR cold is good no? So when you turn in the quilt tons of cold air gets in, ie looks good on the film. The draft in the quilt is its Achilles heal.
Correct in that cold is good in this case as it shows where less heat is escaping. When I turn there' is some air exchange. Yes some cold air gets in, but also warm air escapes and it shows as the warmer colors in this case. I agree that the draft and the lack of a hood is the Achilles heal. However, when comparing rolling with the bag vs inside the quilt, the quilt seems to look and feel warmer.
I wanted one for my cottage. I dont have cental heat. Some rooms are warmer than others. If there is a power issue. I want to stay warm. Sometimes my feet like air. IDK.
That sounds like a cozy idea. I periodically use mine inside.
Sleeping bags are WARMER, quilts are roomier.
I use a quilt 3 season primarily based on the weight savings. I continue to use a sleeping bag during the winter. I did this video primarily to show the places that heat is lost in each, although I was surprised by how much heat loss occurs when rolling in a sleeping bag. Either way, in the winter I want a sealed bag with a hood. If it's really cold I just don't roll as much.
Great rendition, would you do this again in a hammock?that would be interesting....
I am working on a thermal imaging camera one in a hammock, but I think it's different than what you're requesting. Stay tuned and let me know.
@@AdventuresInReach ill be there fer that...
A Quilt was design for hammock
camping...not ground sleeping...you can sleep in one the ground but a sleeping bag in most cases is going to be warmer...
Whether on a hammock or pad, the insulation beneath you gets compressed and doesn't have much value. This quilt, like many models, are designed with elastic straps that are intended to go around a sleeping pad. An underquilt is certainly designed for a hammock. I still use a sleeping bag in colder weather, then just try to avoid rolling much if it's really cold.
At the extremes, a quilt isn't an option and nether is ultralight camping. You don't need infrared to know this, I tested it for you.
You only need to spend one night cutting firewood and doing cardio in the dark while trying to keep from freezing to death to know I'm telling you the truth. Hopefully you're the sort to learn from other peoples mistakes.
Quilts are my jam until it dips a bit below freezing unless it's being used over-top of a sleeping bag.
I agree. I don't use a quilt or go lightweight during the winter. The quilt is really only for traveling light during 3 seasons.
the sleeping bag underneath you is crushed and offers no insulation as no loft. The thermal camera is showing your body heat going straight through the thin compressed sleeping bag when you roll over.
Absolutely. With a quilt you don't roll the insulation over so you don't have heat escape from your back. That isn't necessarily better, but still functional when going lightweight.
Quilts are a great excuse for me to carry a buffalo systems DP Hood and a wool balaclava. People won't let me wear them around town
Ha. That's funny! I hope you tried walking around town with one... maybe while wearing shorts...
I would like a video on the straps for the quilts.
The straps are pretty simple. With this quilt there's only a couple options with the one attached to the pad on top or bottom...or putting both around the pad. It's a matter of preference. I have a few videos I'm working on but will keep this video in mind.
I will be honest. I think I didn't understand the purpose of those straps when I got my quilts because I didn't see their importance. Didn't realize they were an important part of the gear.
It wasn't until I saw this video like, "Ohhhh, that's what those are for!" I went back and bought new ones. Lol thank you!
Breathing out inside a bag makes a lot of difference - may change temperature inside quite a lot.
Absolutely. Raised moisture levels in the bag certainly makes it colder. Thanks for the comment.
Fact~!
You bet. I found it interesting to see for myself.
No, No this is a mess, just get a blanket big enough to wrap like a taco. I have a flees+fiber fill combo with little magnets to close. You need something between you and an air pad. Your body heat will never heat the pad enough to be warm.
I like the magnet idea. However, any insulation that you lay on compresses and doesn't do much for keeping you warm. The pad is the insulation for underneath you. That's why hammock camping is cold unless you use a pad (which is awkward) or an under-quilt. The pad I'm using is a NeoAir which has a high R rating. I've used this quilt system below freezing and been toasty the way I demonstrated.
Interesting
Thanks. It was cool for me to see the comparison as well. This Flir camera is pretty fun.
You shouldn't be rolling with the bag since the bottom of the bag has less fill then the top side. You should ideally turn inside the bag while the bag remains still around you.
Manufacturers of sleeping bags (with hoods) recommend to have the bag roll with you. The reason is so that your nose and mouth remains in the hood's hole so the water vapor from your expiration is expelled outside of the bag. Breathing inside the bag and increasing the humidity will make you cold and clammy, as well as reduce the effectiveness of the insulation. In warmer weather this effect wouldn't be a big deal. In cold weather, breathing out of the bag becomes a big consideration.
Nice comparison buddy 👍🏼
Glad you liked it!
Below 40 deg sleeping bag. Above 40, quilt.
Wow. Living in Minnesota, 40 could be any point during the summer. Upper 20's is my cutoff.
@@AdventuresInReach I guess I've been lucky regarding nighttime temps in Minnesota. Of course the occasional dip doesn't figure into my decision, but to each his own.
This test was fairly subpar. The camera shows heat loss relative to the image not total. White in one video is not the same temperature a white in another video. For the quilt, why don't put all straps under the pad vs some around your body? I assume that would eliminate if not greatly reduce your drafting concerns
You are correct in that the camera shows relative heat. However, since my body and the outside temp remained within a degree through both tests the colors are showing the same comparative heat. I didn't put both straps around the pad because that quilt is specifically designed to have one strap around the pad and one around the body. Testing as designed is the best representation.
Very neat! Thanks for sharing this, I really enjoyed your review style. Subbed 😊
Thank you! I have plenty more ideas like this in the works.
Sleeping bag all the way. Quilts are a marketing gimmick, IMO. The idea that they are more comfortable to sleep in is a myth. If you are tossing around and kicking out in a quilt, you aren't using it properly and it won't keep heat in. Either you're sprawled out and cold or planked out and warm - you don't get both.
Weight savings is also questionable at best. Quilts shave off some material but it's mostly nylon and down which weigh next to nothing. It usually comes down to shaving off a couple ounces of zipper weight. Most of that becomes a wash due to more established sleeping bag companies having access to the best quality down while the cottage companies making quilts get last consideration from suppliers. Sad but true reality.
Thanks for the comment. To be clear, I wasn't advocating for one over the other--just showing some of the pros/cons. I always reach for my quilt now when backpacking because it's certainly lighter than my sleeping bags, and lighter than other bags I researched when purchasing. However, I still use a sleeping bag in the winter every time. If it's too cold I just minimize my rolling. Happy camping!
You attached the quilt incorrectly. The end has to be put over the sleeping mat. It's clear that it doesn't work properly.
The quilt is attached as indicated by the included instructions from Enlightened Equipment. The quilt is strapped down with two straps which avoids having any insulation between the pad and the ground.
And now test Top quilt with Underquilt in hammock 🤔
Yes, that would be good as well. I generally seem to lean toward tents instead of hammocks, and don't have an underquilt at this point, but I'll certainly keep this video idea in mind.
Gotta ask. Where do we get the brown n white knitted hat. TY
Yeah, that's my favorite. I actually bought it from a little old lady at a knitting shop in Iceland. I got off the plane and realized it was a bit colder than what I packed for (Iceland was a stopover while headed to Sweden) and that shop was the first place I found.
What if you just use fleece blankets?
I've always heard and experienced that a fleece blanket adds about 10 degrees Fahrenheit of warmth to a sleep system. A fleece blanket on it's own would not be adequate for anything besides the warmest of nights inside a tent with little breeze. Without having something to block breezes, no drawstrings to keep it closed around you, and minimal insulation value, fleece would not be the best choice. Fleeces warmth to weight ratio also leaves something to be desired over traditional down or synthetic fiber insulations. All that being said, I have spent the night in the woods during SAR missions or a wilderness survival class with only a blanket or debris hut, and stayed "warm enough", but I wouldn't choose those experiences if given the option of using a traditional bag/quilt.
That's not how I use my sleeping bag. When I turn over, I turn inside my bag and my bag stays the same way.
Absolutely. Some people do. Sleeping bags with hoods are intended to have your nose and mouth breathing out of the hole so you don't introduce additional moisture inside the bag, which is why I demo turning the bag with your body.
a cheap thrift store quilt & make it a sleeping bag by
adding a zipper or just stitch it shut & then do it again
& save $200 by MAKING 2 of them
Absolutely. If someone has the time and talent then go for it! I would guess that the difference would be noticed in the weight as it seems unlikely to find a lightweight down sleeping bag in a thrift store that could match the weight of a purchased quilt, but maybe you could get close enough.
If you turn the other way ( so your nose faces down while turning) you wont pull the quilt off your back and you will remain nice and warm.
The other side just ends up pulling up. Any time you roll and create a spinning effect on the quilt it does seem to create a small or brief air leak.
As a 62 year old who gets up to piss 4 to 7 times a night - sleeping bags SUCK !!
Ha. I could see that. You might just need a bottle or 3.
IR? You’re clearly the the right guy to be give anyone advise. Do it the right way with a thermal image and get back tp us.
I found your comment is a little confusing, but am inferring that you don't think I should give advice. I didn't intend for this to be a solidly conclusive scientific experiment, but rather an interesting look and understanding of the strengths and weaknesses of 2 sleep systems. There would be a lot more controls, measurements, steps, and constant environment needed to be fully scientific. If you have experience with a thermal imager I am certainly open to any constructive suggestions for next time.
That pad is so effing loud
Ha! Yes...yes it is. It's actually a lot less noisy than it was when it was brand new. It's warm, lightweight, and comfortable, and I sleep pretty sound so it doesn't bother me too much. However, if you camp close to others, them may complain.
You literally turned your quilt into a sleeping bag lol
That's basically the idea to make it like a sleeping bag without the weight of the bottom.
When you unzip a mummy bag it is essentially a quilt…. End of video comparison.
Well yes...unless you want to save weight and have that unzipped mummy stay snug around you and tighten around your neck...
quilt looks miserable
I've enjoyed mine! It's great until winter camping, then I go back to a sleeping bag. It's much les miserable to carry!
One quilt, one bag in one situation does tell all. C'mon most sleeping bags unzip all the way just like your quilt. all quilts are not smaller than all sleeping bags. you are showing a lot of bias here. I am not saying which is better, I am saying the one size fits all mentality is wrong.
✨🧸✨ 👶👏🛋️
I certainly do get a good night's sleep.
Absolute nonsense.
My opinion, I think quilts are one of the stupidest inventions for outdoor use, right up there with trowels and inflatable pillows, ✌️
That's funny. The average quilt seems to be lighter than the average sleeping bag and I have been surprised with how warm mine is since I was pretty skeptical before using it. I was laughing because I also carried a plastic trowel on my AT thru hike, used it as a stake every night, and kept it till the end as part of my 9 pound base weight. I also sometimes carry a pillow now if I'm not out as long and don't care as much about gear weight since food weight is less. I respect opinions and have no issue with any approach as long as people are getting out there. Thanks for the comment.
@@AdventuresInReach you are welcome, every one is entitled to my opinions ✌️
That's funny.
I roll in my bag not with my bag zero heat loss zero draft.
Bags are meant to have the hole around your face so that you blow your moist breath outside of the bag and prevent condensation inside. That means that if you switch sides, you would need to roll your bag with you, or have a much bigger opening. Either way--rolling, having a big hole, breathing inside all have their compromises. I still prefer a sleeping bag in very cold temps, but use a quilt to save weight in three season weather.
$300 yeah right not meeeeeeeeee hike&bike sleeping bag free 5 years still going every winter ❄️🥶🥶🥶🥶❄️ 🥵🥵🥵🥵🥵🥵🥵🥵🥵🥵🥵🥵🥵🥵
Absolutely. If you have gear that you're happy with, I certainly wouldn't switch either. I had back surgery a few years ago and focused on dropping weight. A quilt was a great way to accomplish that for me.
@@AdventuresInReach it's still going keeps me warm when I need it I will try new heated sleeping bags 2024 see the difference there is 2 I'm gonna buy