Apologists can argue all they want but they can't get past the fact their god is only an imaginary character. I know this because I talk to them and their followers daily. Usually the followers.
a persian muslim poet once wrote something along the lines of, "i wanted to ask God why he allowed so much suffering and injustice in the world, but i was afraid he would ask me the same"
The plane analogy is not accurate. Belief in God is more like flying on a plane and saying “there’s someone piloting this plane. I don’t know the name or gender or race of the pilot but I’m sure someone is flying it”
But you say you DO know the name of the pilot, and the gender, and what he thinks and what he wants and his plans and powers, etc. That's his point, you DON'T just say there is a higher power and that's it.
God came into existence when man realized that this well planned cosmos, the nature, our surroundings help us in our survival. So man thought of being thankful, to show his gratitude towards the creator. Man named that creator God… religion and spirituality are totally two different things. Spirituality is about seeking and connecting yourself with the creator of this universe. Religion, I think is more about the cultural aspect. Religion reflects the culture of any particular community.. the way of thoughts align with the way of living. It depends upon the community how flexible or how rigid are they with their thoughts and beliefs.. accordingly, their way of life changed with the time. Religion was meant to connect people with the nature, but rigidity and manipulation sometimes diverted it to some unhealthy directions
Looks like the first time you have access to the Internet. The Palestine problem is about land not religion. Religion, Democracy, Communism, and all other ism are just covers.
"From 320 B.C.E. to present the western world has experienced 1,730 wars...60 of religious inspiration." 3.5% of wars religious leaves 96.5% of irreligious. 134 million during the wars of the 20th century alone. ---"Vol. I-III, The Encyclopedia of War" "100 million in 75 years as a direct result of atheistic, genocidal Communism" ("The Black Book of Communism", Harvard Press) 'WRONG YOU ARE'...BASED IN FACT!!
The problem is dude, is that atheism collapses in societies, so eventually a religion will take them over, due to the birth rates difference. Europe although has become more secular, will almost inevitably it seems, go under Muslim rule, because people have abandoned Christianity for atheism, which in turn has had our natives collapse in birth rates, while Muslims are coming in, in uncontrollable rapid rates, taking over with so many children. The only way to fix this is conservative Christianity
A claim by a mere human. If any deities exist let them speak for themselves IN PERSON. That's also a rather puerile "argument", like all religious "arguments".
@@duncanbryson1167living in such a well planned cosmos and seeing it… thinking that such a great creation exists without any creator?? How logical is it?
@@ksehgal3544 A creator deity or deities may exist but I only have claims made by humans. There might be an argument for deisim but jumping to a specific theism is leap like someone jumping across the Grand Canyon.
You, dear internet stranger, who are reading this comment: Are you having a psychotic break? Did something traumatic and life threatening happen to you recently? If you suddenly feel god, get help
@@supremepancakes4388 very strange, are you surviving in this world without air , without water, without the rain happening, without the sun and it’s energy? You are surviving just because you are fully dependent on these things that the creator has made for us.. should we be atleast thankful to him for it? That’s what we do when we pray… connect ourselves with the creator and express thanks for his wonderful creation
The passenger was definitely wrong to assume the name of the pilot.. but please tell me is it possible to fly an airplane without pilot? You don’t know the name of pilot doesn’t mean that there was no pilot… guessing the name of pilot is as wrong as assuming that is there really any pilot to fly?
Everyone has a different definition of love. Their own projection. It doesnt speak to something real. Because everyone has their own definition. Delusional.
The speaker is right to doubt the existence of a God, however, we need not remain in a state of “not knowing” like a deer caught in headlights. Gautama Buddha said that it’s inconceivable to find a first cause for life, or anything else for that matter. “Without cognizable end is this recurrent wandering in Samsara (cycle of birth and death). Beings are obstructed by ignorance and fettered by craving. A first beginning of these beings is not to be perceived”. The universe is merely an epiphenomenon of consciousness, which itself is dependently originated. Once this is realized, one can stop wasting time on intellectual debates altogether and focus on more important matters, namely, one’s spiritual progress and helping to end the suffering of sentient beings.
Until God comes down and proves to me he is real by doing something humanly impossible, I will continue to assume he doesn't care or doesn't exist and go about my life in the best way I can. If that is not enough for him, then maybe he is not God and it does not matter. *waits for all the religious nutters in the 3rd world and colonies to try and counter argument about belief etc. If a stranger askes for for 300 of you money, and he promises to pay you back 9000 would you belief him? Thought not*.
As a 15 yr old Christian, who likes to listen to opposing views, I will say, especially considering this guys a professor, his arguments seemed extremely weak and unconvincing. So because there’s different understandings of God or different definitions therefore no God? Really? Come on. There’s different understandings and definitions of many things, even things so basic, such as life. And he’s saying no God because secular societies do extremely well, but Christian societies do very bad? Well here in Europe atleast, all our secular societies are actually becoming almost unbearable to live in, due to the immigration crisis, which is a result of secularism, and the low brith rates it’s caused. And the country that’s got the lowest crime rates, and which has infact dealt the best with the immigration, and is one of the best countries to live in, in Europe is poland, which is majority Christian. Which infact, has became a way better country, after the secular communists lost power. So became better when it became more Christian ! Does that speak volumes to how bad this argument he made was? Also saying Scandinavian countries are the best countries to live in is laughable . Sweden is an awful place to live nowadays. And I would point out people who are more religious, tend to have less divorces, have higher birth rates, more family values, better education , less suicides I could go on and on.
Santa Claus isn’t real, and neither is your God. There is zero evidence for either of those characters. You have evolved from a fish. we even found the fish that caught up on land and have its fossil. If you want to know the truth about God go watch on TH-cam. “What Darwin never knew”. After that, you’ll understand the evolution. After that you’ll understand scientist have extreme evidence for the proposition of your evolution from a fish. and if you can still believe in a God after you understand that you evolved from a fish then well good luck
None is debating and killing over different definations of life. Most biologists can agree to some sort of definition lol. Sweden is bad? relative to who? extremely religious countries like Iran, Afganistan, pakistan?
If you were to observe the argument that a decline in faith leads to better economic outcomes; you could very easily argue that the rise of America as an empire after WWII was due to a population with strong faith and its consequently declining status is due to people turning away from their faith... Either way, linking faith to a decline or growth in one contries fortunes is far too simplisitc of an argument to make
You're exactly right, fluctuations in levels of belief in god may or may not impact a countries economic fortunes but either way it does nothing to prove the existence of said God
That 'rise of America as an empire' was SOLEY due to the MASSIVE financial and new land resources plundered after the war. That 'rise' would have taken place REGARDLESS of any society's religiosity. Keep in mind, the speaker's MAIN point was that "IF there is a god, one would think the more religious places on earth would be more happy and prosperous. Why are they not?
It's a very temporal argument. Empires rise and fall all the time. All empires that have ever existed in the past were believers on God or some kind of supernatural deities. And the Secular countries today are all in decline, so the idea that decline in faith leads to better outcomes no longer has the evidence to support it.
First, I wouldn’t say that China is in decline, exactly. Second, the growing secularization of the U.S. is all that has allowed it to stay abreast of other nations in terms of science and technology. Or are you suggesting Oral Roberts U. Is leading the world in those fields?
God is not a tyrant. He is a good Father, but I’d be a lying Christian, if I tell you that there are no conditions for having a relationship with Him. Humbling ourselves before Him is one of them, recognizing that He is God, and that He is sovereign. The second condition is repentance, which we can only be convinced of by The Holy Spirit. Trust me, I am former atheist, but Jesus had mercy on me. This is one of His many promises: 2 Chronicles 7:14 if my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land. Seek the Lord while he may be found; call on him while he is near.
Ive thought about the "too much suffering" argument against the existence of a "benevolent" god. The only counterargument i can think of is to consider all earthly suffering as "insignificant" within the context of the cosmos. I think of the child who cries because his ice cream has fallen onto the ground. Or I think of a girl who is in sorrow because her parents left her in summer camp. I wonder if even the worst suffering here on earth is kind of "irrelevant" within the context of an afterlife or the universe as a whole. Then perhaps the cruelty of the sufferings we see on earth is not as potent or significant as we believe it to be. Much like the child crying over his spoiled ice cream? Just a thought
Using this reasoning, couldn’t one say the relatively small number of sins a person could conceivably commit in one lifetime could not possibly be so “significant” as to require an eternity of punishment?
@@DeadInside-ew8qb Yea, thats a good point. But imo within a morality context, the "evil" actions of a sinner isnt quite the same as "pain and suffering". One could argue that sinful acts or immoral acts have intent and motives that come from an individual's heart. Thus its quite fundamental and significant. Whereas pain and suffering is the byproduct of actions (both human and natural) and hence its like an object that has no real moral significance by itself
@@yhp99 but how many instances of “sin” are predicated on the pain experienced by an individual? Pain caused by loss, fear, physical/emotional trauma etc. are largely what drives people to commit most sins.
@@DeadInside-ew8qb "Pain (is) largely what drives people to commit most sins." I would not agree with this statement as there are also desires, envy, pride, ambitions etc that make people do bad things just the same. But I do agree that pain can lead to evil acts and can make people bitter and hateful. But the issue i have with that is there is always the choice at the end of the day in spite of the pain. There are many people who overcome pain to do good. While there are also many who are overcome by pain and do evil. And at the end of the analysis the lowest common denominator isnt pain, but it is the person and their choice to act either good or bad. So to me pain still takes a backseat, and it isnt a fundamental force within the context of morality.
Because India have a treaty with the Vatican church to create wars with its nation creation done through Israel and they fund the many wars with Bank of England. Today they might have change the name but the game remain the same.
@tschorsch pure lack of empathy from our ruling class is the main reason. We have the technology to help everyone or destroy the world. You can't blame religion for that. We need to stop destroying the world and start helping people.
Lots of suffering is not something people allow. Things like natural catastrophes, children being born with painful diseases and so on and so on. You cannot explain all suffering by blaming humans. Just think of all the wild animal suffering that happened gorillas of years before humans even existed.
Can you define your mothers love? Everyone has their definition of love too Coming to the point God is the absolute okay a mathematician can't be defined in terms of numbers if you think you can define the one who created this infinite universe in terms of human logic its impossible especially when you are not aligned with your own conciousness. Let me make it simple for you God created the universe as and created humans gave them free will to learn and explore the ultimate truth that is God himself he didnt created misery he is not responsible for social challanges that lead to suffering humans did and he doesnt intervene in suffering because that is the test every human has to pass on himself you have to realise that you are here to experience life not to be attached to it desire is the cause of suffering he created the universe and created the law of cause and effect and he relaxed and left everything to humans but you western people due to abandonment issues from your fathers have developed a condition in which you see God as your father to fulfil your needs answer your prayers take the sufferings which you created and if he is not doing so so he must be a delusion how convenient.
If God is all, wouldn’t Good be an amalgamation of all? Then to say Good is He/Him is to void that premise. GOD is L B G T Q H (heterosexual). Female. Male. Feminine. Masculine. . . And so much more. . . If you believe in God.
Do you use a pen? Did someone invent it? If a simple pen we use is invented by someone then how can we think that such a big, so well planned cosmos is built by itself? That great creator of this such well planned cosmos is God. People believe him because they respect and be thankful to him for his creation, that supports our survival on this earth
@@FlandiddlyandersFRS a simple pen or pencil that we use is invented by some genius mind… we well accept it without any hesitation… then why is it hard to accept that such huge cosmos is also definitely a creation of some great creator.. that creator we call God..
@@FlandiddlyandersFRS can you also please explain then who created this such well planned cosmos.. where every living organism is provided everything required for their survival? How all different organisms are dependent on one another.. different aspects of nature are so inter dependent.. how little tilt of earth is so important that gives birth to different seasons.. sun is giving energy to plants.. plants are giving oxygen to human bodies.. don’t you think that there is definitely someone who planned it so perfectly.. think this way please.. can a car go on running without anyone planned the streets, red lights, stop signs.. properly.. then how can our planets running at their paths.. sun rises and sets, so many things happening in such planned way in our cosmos… without a planner?? That planner we call God
When someone asks a question starting like this "why would God" I instantly think about asking them this one "so would you be ok if he had shut your mouth?. Because all the misery started right there by us humans. In all questions of this sort, I see an attempt to justify humans rather than trying to find out why we are sometimes so evil. And if you really believe that human beings have a role and responsibility, why would you ask that question even without being a theist?
I just saw a video of a cat that was found suffering in agony in the wild. Are you going to blame humans for that too, the cat's mother or the incredible sky spook 🙄
Society like Saudi Arabia are 💯💯 believers and they live in the best of any kinds... probably you are looking at belief in Christianity perspective only prof.
go back to before they discovered oil then. even they themselves talked about how they where living in poverty and distress. but then, anything can be explained away as a test. what isn't a test at this point, your coffee turning cold?
The gun statement is the dumbest, least factual, statements ever. Amazing how when you open with a complete bullshit comment I have no desire to listen. “It just does t add up”. Yep. Lost me in the first 15 seconds. So dumb.
He's logical is like two people on whether human beings having a brain or not and to Him He is suggesting that we must see the skin only over our heads and never believe or know that there is brain inside that skin because we cannot see the brain itself. This how stupid he's logic is.
We can’t see or touch or feel or smell or hear bacteria with our eyes either, yet with advanced instruments we can. Let me know when we get anywhere near that with god. Until then, shelf your laughable false equivalence and false analogy for a bit, give it a rest for a while before reusing it. 😉
@@ZhangK71 of course you needed instruments to see your brain and we need faith to see God. It's not a false analogy it the its the fact you can't see your own brain with a microscope.
@@DanieBen-qg2bm It’s a faulty analogy because claiming faith operates on nearly the same principle as using an instrument to empirically increase human knowledge is absurd.
@@ZhangK71Obviously its same thing you cannot have knowledge of God without faith, likewise you cannot have knowledge of brain without a microscope. Faith a spiritual thing is not a natural thing that scientist can explain.
What a funny thumbnail !!! God must be sadistic if He/She/It enjoys seeing people in misery.If that is what the speaker trying to say then he is childish and immature.
Morality has changed and adapted to sociological and scientific pressures which shows that morality is man made. Objective morality exists only in the ability to observe our environment and react to experience and knowledge. If you held your morality to the morals of the foundational religions you would be thrown in jail or murdered for watching this video.
@@alinktotheblast40Doesn't get away from IF there is in fact morality ie right and wrong this doesn't come about through random acts of mutation. Can you give me a single stat to back up your claim? Please do bear in mind IF there is a God, not all religions will be following truth.
What I would dearly like to have explained to me is this, Use the laws of science, especially physics, to explain how anything can come from NOTHING. Or is it that I do not know what is the meaning of NOTHING? I am not too much concerned with religious definitions but more with scientific explanations and rationalisations, To me, Who or What is responsible for what is, has to be what is described as GOD, ALLAH, or the myriad manifestations of the different "religions " ( Man's relationship with his God ) THERE MUST HAVE ALWAYS BEEN A CREATOR, and THERE COULD NEVER BEEN NOTHING. THAT CONCEPT IS BEYOND PUNY HUMAN THINKING, DEFYING THE MOST RIGOROUS SCIENTIFIC INTERROGATION. Again I ask, HOW CAN ANYTHING COME FROM NOTHING? THE EGO IS ONLY PART OF THE MAN, so IF THE MAN LETS THE EGO BECOME GREATER THAN HE, THEN THE MAN WILL CEASE TO BE, BECAUSE NO PART CAN BE BIGGER THAN THE WHOLE.
The god of the gaps fallacy! Science doesn't know (yet) exactly how everything came into being so let's stick a god in it! But of course then you end up with an even bigger mystery! Because such an imaginary "entity" that "exists out of space and out of time" that "itself" was not "created" and that "created" everything, "out of nothing", the trillions and trillions of galaxies, stars, planets, black holes, etc with the coming into existence, after millions of years of evolution, of the species of big apes called the Homosapiens in mind, has to be even much more complex than the wholeuniverseitself! And it is also special pleading and in contradiction with the statement that everything can not come from nothing. Better say that we don't know yet how everything came into being instead of claiming that an imaginary God or Allah or whatever name they gave to their non-existing celestial dictator did it!
What thinks something must have come from nothing? What if there was _always_ “something”? Not that I believe that necessarily, mind you. But you’re the one claiming it has to be this way and ain’t the other way. You have the burden of answering that question.
Even if Deism were true, a theist will still have all of their work ahead of them to show theism is true. Good Luck with that. Theists can't even convince other theists their theism is true.
Slightly off topic but I struggled with why the good guys often die young, while the evil guys often live long, comfortable lives - how could a loving just God permit this? Then, I realised that the good guys are already closer to God's love than the rest of us and welcome Him even though we grieve their loss - and the reason the bad guys live on, is because God is giving them every chance to admit their wrongs and put them right - but if, after 20, 30, 50 years they still haven't done so then they can't say they weren't given a second chance and shall stand before Him without excuse.
Would it be fair for God to help some and punish others before the afterlife? what is the point of being here and awaiting the afterlife judgment if God is already judging us and giving appropriate treatment as we are being "tested"? wouldn't it make more sense if God is not interacting with us and our environment will determine how we will be tested fairly?
@@notu1529 everyone's different, created by God, each with their own strengths and weaknesses and path through life..... I'm sure you'd agree we're all unique - so why do you demand a one-size-fits-all from God? Each of us has enough troubles and challenges of our own to deal with - I'll settle for God's help in my own life, and leave other peoples' lives to God who knows them best while doing the best for them I can - rather than waste my time telling God what he should be doing for others while ignoring the motes in my own eyes .....none of us are in this world long enough for that.
@@notu1529 and who's to say God doesn't reward the good things we do in this life and punish us also - but not in the way we expect? The onus is then upon us to hear His voice, and follow the path He offers - and there are many, many ways to do it, but too many refuse by making poor excuses..... when their time comes, and they know the time for any deception has passed, what are they going to say?
@@cgo225 my point is that God would lay out the perfect condition for each of us (of course everyone are unique, if not culturally, space and time), sort of like a schema where he then would judge each one of use precisely and absolutely fairly; if God interfere in this test, he would do so in a perfectly fair method.
@@cgo225 "The onus is then upon us to hear His voice, and follow the path He offers - and there are many, many ways to do it, but too many refuse by making poor excuses" is my cognitive dissonance when trying to accept something beyond reason and comprehension by "faith" a "poor excuse"? People have many brilliant reasons to believe in God or not, but it is ultimately unknowable if God is truly outside of reason and comprehension or must be hidden to allow "free will" that is not actually "free"
If you base your belief in God with your economic condition, that's so naive, because God is Love, if you truly love someone, you love unconditionally no matter he's poor or rich...
What are you talking about? Not once has he claimed TO BE a deity. You did not respond to his arguments. The debate is about something that some people call GOD, but without defining this word, it’s difficult to even talk about it. It’s a term that is void of content and context.
So which God is the "real" God? Theism is a fractured landscape of hundreds upon hundreds of city-states, each claiming to worship the One True God (or the One True Pantheon, for polytheistic religions) & that all the other people across the land are fools & heretics. What evidence can you or any other theist offer to persuade a non-believer to sign up for YOUR particular "team" vs. all the other competing teams?
My 18 year old self would have lapped this up. Unfortunately I now live in a world where in Scandinavia and Europe they may be secular but the magical thinking that men can become women when they grow their hair and take pills designed for menopausal women. Same men don’t bleed, don’t give birth, don’t have natural milk ducts, and yet I would bet Professor Zuckerman swallows that dogma wholesale. These atheists aren’t consistent, they pile on religion and don’t critique what fills its vacuum.
what is exactly wrong for a person to be transgender? I can tell you why religion is bad though; it limits human reason in the natural world by being circumscribed by ethos from the non-naturally or non-pragmatically aligned (i.e., religious books). Is it truly pragmatic to be against transgenderism or the LGBTQ+ community as a whole? what is the naturally bound or pragmatic reason for this moral truth and on what basis (consequentialism, deontology)?
If you critique religion as non pragmatic then you could say the same about transgender because transgender poses a threat to the category of women in sport, in prisons by denying or minimising the biological differences that exist between men and women. The consequential harm is asymmetrical in that it affects women more than men. Women have been raped by trans women and women have been beaten in races by trans women and made to feel unsafe when their designated spaces are reassigned unisex and men’s are not because it’s harder to change a urinal. These are social biases based on years of patriarchy. The idea that a woman can be reclassified chest feeder or womb carrier is all to appease a minority. Christians are a minority belief system too. Both believe things in faith the secular religion believe trans women are women that they enter that category through self id like a religious conversion we must all repeat and bow down on the altar of the mantra transwomen are women. It is an ideology that is consistently defended by atheists who are often misogynists yet don’t see this bias in themselves.
I feel you katie. You'd think this madness would be exclusive to the internet but somehow members of my family believe in it too. I would guess that it's the pressure of fitting in and they have not sat down and wrestled with the issue.
@@TryingtoTellYou you yourself probably cant CHANGE how you feel about your gender identity and sexual preference. Im gay and trust me, it hurts when my own family member think im a bad person for it, it makes me want to die or completely remove myself from them because i think they want me dead (its making me crazy). But luckily im able to rise beyond it and accept that they may see me a certain way because of their ideology, but i cant have a genuine "family" relationship with them. THE TRUTH is im not a bad person for being gay, people only think its bad because of outdated/archaic morality the same way slavery is outdated. But just think, who am i hurting, what am i doing that is "bad" by being gay?
that must be really tough but there are religious people who support gay relationships and marriage there are just also the ones who don't. I disagree with that but I also think that they defend heterosexual marriage in relation to children and look I am bisexual but I believe as a woman that there are problems with gay people using surrogates for pregnancy. Less so with lesbian as one partner at least carries the child. But in gay male relationships there have been countless cases whereby women's bodies are rife for commercial exploitation as poorer women in Romania have been unearthed in baby clinics for rich gay men. They are often referred to as "the surrogate" highly dehumanising when you consider this is a literal human physically attached to a literal woman. We know through attachment research the important role of the mother in the 1st year of a child's life, we dismiss that at our peril@@notu1529
With due respect, If you're interested in knowing about God's Definition, you must read the Holy Quran with its meaning. May your confusion be despaired. You'll start to believe in God and be the best version of your life for yourself. We tend to be good for humankind from the realization of self-satisfaction in our soul, we become bad when we are incapable of recognizing this. Without religion, be good or bad, it is a choice for humans, however, good practices of religion bind us to be good humans.
God is a non contingent, self existent necessary being. God is not made of parts or matter, God is spaceless, timeless and immaterial God is responsible for all of contingent reality and is the ground of goodness itself. Maybe this guy hasnt done his theological or philosophical homework.
Silly gsp3428, I define your comment as “gsp3428 agrees to pay me one million dollars”. Therefore, you just wrote a comment; therefore, you owe me a million bucks. Playing the definition game for god so your god escapes the divine hiddenness problem doesn’t solve anything. It just shows that you have a very weak intellectual standard and think playing silly tricks is a mic drop against and checkmates atheism. It really isn’t and it really doesn’t.
Silly gsp3428, I define your comment as “gsp3428 agrees to pay me one million dollars”. Therefore, you just wrote a comment; therefore, you owe me a million bucks. And if you disagree, then _clearly_ you haven’t done your homework. 😉 Playing the definition game for god so your god escapes the divine hiddenness problem doesn’t solve anything. It just shows that you have a very weak intellectual standard and think playing silly tricks is a mic drop against and checkmates atheism. It really isn’t and it really doesn’t.
My magic sky fairy is a non contingent, self existent necessary being. My magic sky fairy is not made of parts or matter, My magic sky fairy is spaceless, timeless and immaterial My magic sky fairy is responsible for all of contingent reality and is the ground of goodness itself. My magic sky fairy exists. Checkmate atheists. lol
@@pro29ss You sound like a brilliant guy, that sky fairy part was pure brilliance. Keep um coming, we need to get you to write a book or something, you seem like you have put a lot of of work on this subject and have a tremendous grasp of philosophy and theology. I would put you up there with the great minds that have existed. Sky fairy, just genius.
@@gsp3428 Your sarcasm about his usage of the “sky fairy” trope does not change the fact that he, whatever terminology he used, demonstrated the silliness of defining things into existence using word games.
Yeah this guy has a middle school mindset. If god then why does bad thing happen. As if free will doesn’t exist. And then they’ll say well why do we have free will and then on and on it goes. And the biggest thing they’re missing is that they’re pulling morality from god. Without god then bad is just a subjective feeling. Like it’s not that hard to understand
Without God, morality is a merely biological construct, on a par with hunger, digestion, thirst etc.. and has no more meaning and significance than all the other biological needs and functions.
That is not the main point of his argument, the extension of that reasoning is that if God is unable to prevent atrocities and tragedies of mankind, then it is our responsibility to make society a better place such that regardless of God's existence, we do not need God to make the world a better place. If you are doing your best to help others in your life and your overall impact on mankind has been positive, even if you do not believe in God and there was one, I am sure they will accept you in the afterlife. That is the basis of humanism.
@@will-fm3rj The problem with these humanist ideals (noble as they are), is that when "we" become the sole arbiters of what is "good" and how to make the world "better", then "we", as individuals, assume ourselves to be his/her own God.... you may say ".... but these decisions would be made collectively, by common consensus" - to which the simple counter-argument is "just because the majority decide something is right, doesn't make it so"........ A group of open minded, honest people deciding the earth is made of cheese, doesn't make it so.
@@cgo225 A humanist does not assume themselves to be their own God, a humanist knows there are some things they do not know and other things (e.g. existence of God) which they may never know. How do we know what is good is a difficult question as everyone has their own definitions and perspectives, ultimately there would be actions seen as objectively good (helping people in need) and objectively bad (murder of a human), many other actions lie on a spectrum between good and bad. While some still remain true, the teachings of religions and their morality is often outdated and not adjusted to the technological and societal conditions of modern society. E.g. the power difference between men and women in Islam. In terms of the common consensus, that was demonstrated most clearly by the belief that the earth was flat, spearheaded and enforced by Christianity in the middle ages. Eventually it was science that allowed us to disprove that common consensus, as science relies on logic and factual information and not the belief/consensus of the masses.
Good speech... Why secular Faith can lives peacefully? Sometimes it runs worse... Don't be secular too, i think... But the point here, they live peaceful and full in Faith to God Allah, they are not secular really, because they, follow God Allah words... i wanna make equivalent here too, prof, that's fine, right... Ask to your students that samesex marriage is the biggest sin in this world even in mobile phone only... because it's united...🌐🇬🇧❤️
He's right.
All Gods are imaginary.
👏
Probably, none have demonstrated their existence to me.
Apologists can argue all they want but they can't get past the fact their god is only an imaginary character.
I know this because I talk to them and their followers daily. Usually the followers.
a persian muslim poet once wrote something along the lines of, "i wanted to ask God why he allowed so much suffering and injustice in the world, but i was afraid he would ask me the same"
Brief and to the point - thank you.
It makes sense why humility isn't one of the 10 commandments lol.
Or "Thou shall seek knowledge"
Nicely presented, and raised some valid questions, liked it. No show off at all
Gosh, what a smile! there wasn't much to hope for with such a proposition and these inside-the-box speakers...
The plane analogy is not accurate. Belief in God is more like flying on a plane and saying “there’s someone piloting this plane. I don’t know the name or gender or race of the pilot but I’m sure someone is flying it”
But you say you DO know the name of the pilot, and the gender, and what he thinks and what he wants and his plans and powers, etc. That's his point, you DON'T just say there is a higher power and that's it.
Why is noal harari has not been invited ,his description of how God and religion came into place could've been a very good insight to this debate
God came into existence when man realized that this well planned cosmos, the nature, our surroundings help us in our survival. So man thought of being thankful, to show his gratitude towards the creator. Man named that creator God… religion and spirituality are totally two different things. Spirituality is about seeking and connecting yourself with the creator of this universe. Religion, I think is more about the cultural aspect. Religion reflects the culture of any particular community.. the way of thoughts align with the way of living. It depends upon the community how flexible or how rigid are they with their thoughts and beliefs.. accordingly, their way of life changed with the time. Religion was meant to connect people with the nature, but rigidity and manipulation sometimes diverted it to some unhealthy directions
Correct you are sir. Most of the problems in the world are in heavily religious countries. Palestine comes immediately to mind.
Looks like the first time you have access to the Internet. The Palestine problem is about land not religion. Religion, Democracy, Communism, and all other ism are just covers.
"From 320 B.C.E. to present the western world has experienced 1,730 wars...60 of religious inspiration."
3.5% of wars religious leaves 96.5% of irreligious. 134 million during the wars of the 20th century alone.
---"Vol. I-III, The Encyclopedia of War"
"100 million in 75 years as a direct result of atheistic, genocidal Communism" ("The Black Book of Communism", Harvard Press)
'WRONG YOU ARE'...BASED IN FACT!!
The problem is dude, is that atheism collapses in societies, so eventually a religion will take them over, due to the birth rates difference. Europe although has become more secular, will almost inevitably it seems, go under Muslim rule, because people have abandoned Christianity for atheism, which in turn has had our natives collapse in birth rates, while Muslims are coming in, in uncontrollable rapid rates, taking over with so many children. The only way to fix this is conservative Christianity
Pitzer Grad loves you Phil!
Amish gave a wonderful explanation in totality - th-cam.com/video/Fb5MWdi5EOs/w-d-xo.html - (4/8)
Thoughtless fundamentalism. Lack of love for neighbours.
May religion just fade away everywhere.
Hi.. do you see air? Is air around you? Can you feel air? God is just like that.. you can’t see but you can definitely feel him around you..
A claim by a mere human. If any deities exist let them speak for themselves IN PERSON. That's also a rather puerile "argument", like all religious "arguments".
@@duncanbryson1167living in such a well planned cosmos and seeing it… thinking that such a great creation exists without any creator?? How logical is it?
@@ksehgal3544
A creator deity or deities may exist but I only have claims made by humans. There might be an argument for deisim but jumping to a specific theism is leap like someone jumping across the Grand Canyon.
You, dear internet stranger, who are reading this comment:
Are you having a psychotic break? Did something traumatic and life threatening happen to you recently? If you suddenly feel god, get help
@@supremepancakes4388 very strange, are you surviving in this world without air , without water, without the rain happening, without the sun and it’s energy? You are surviving just because you are fully dependent on these things that the creator has made for us.. should we be atleast thankful to him for it? That’s what we do when we pray… connect ourselves with the creator and express thanks for his wonderful creation
Please give me a chance. I know research stuff at lows meditation, corona virus, corporate sector at lows meditation, etc.
The passenger was definitely wrong to assume the name of the pilot.. but please tell me is it possible to fly an airplane without pilot? You don’t know the name of pilot doesn’t mean that there was no pilot… guessing the name of pilot is as wrong as assuming that is there really any pilot to fly?
😂 I can easily demonstrate that the pilot exists.
Why are you so dumb?
Is USA an even larger religious democracy than India???
I said the exact same thing....West often substitutes World for West
MAN ALLOWS IT, ignore God and follow satan, HE causes your sorrows.Man has free will, God or satan.
All Gods are imaginary.
Everyone has a different definition of love. Their own projection. It doesnt speak to something real. Because everyone has their own definition. Delusional.
Isn’t he describing the function of evolution? Yet, he’s perfectly okay with it. The duplicity is laughable.
What is the "function" of evolution then, smart guy?
@@FlandiddlyandersFRS
Misery and the fight for survival of the fittest. Evolution is bathed in bloodshed.
The irony is in his own worldview.
because hes evil read the book of Job
Why should we believe anything in The Bible?
The speaker is right to doubt the existence of a God, however, we need not remain in a state of “not knowing” like a deer caught in headlights. Gautama Buddha said that it’s inconceivable to find a first cause for life, or anything else for that matter. “Without cognizable end is this recurrent wandering in Samsara (cycle of birth and death). Beings are obstructed by ignorance and fettered by craving. A first beginning of these beings is not to be perceived”. The universe is merely an epiphenomenon of consciousness, which itself is dependently originated. Once this is realized, one can stop wasting time on intellectual debates altogether and focus on more important matters, namely, one’s spiritual progress and helping to end the suffering of sentient beings.
Well said, good sir.
No information only misinformation 😂
Until God comes down and proves to me he is real by doing something humanly impossible, I will continue to assume he doesn't care or doesn't exist and go about my life in the best way I can. If that is not enough for him, then maybe he is not God and it does not matter. *waits for all the religious nutters in the 3rd world and colonies to try and counter argument about belief etc. If a stranger askes for for 300 of you money, and he promises to pay you back 9000 would you belief him? Thought not*.
👍👌🙏
As a 15 yr old Christian, who likes to listen to opposing views, I will say, especially considering this guys a professor, his arguments seemed extremely weak and unconvincing. So because there’s different understandings of God or different definitions therefore no God? Really? Come on. There’s different understandings and definitions of many things, even things so basic, such as life. And he’s saying no God because secular societies do extremely well, but Christian societies do very bad? Well here in Europe atleast, all our secular societies are actually becoming almost unbearable to live in, due to the immigration crisis, which is a result of secularism, and the low brith rates it’s caused. And the country that’s got the lowest crime rates, and which has infact dealt the best with the immigration, and is one of the best countries to live in, in Europe is poland, which is majority Christian. Which infact, has became a way better country, after the secular communists lost power. So became better when it became more Christian ! Does that speak volumes to how bad this argument he made was? Also saying Scandinavian countries are the best countries to live in is laughable . Sweden is an awful place to live nowadays. And I would point out people who are more religious, tend to have less divorces, have higher birth rates, more family values, better education , less suicides I could go on and on.
Santa Claus isn’t real, and neither is your God. There is zero evidence for either of those characters. You have evolved from a fish. we even found the fish that caught up on land and have its fossil. If you want to know the truth about God go watch on TH-cam. “What Darwin never knew”. After that, you’ll understand the evolution. After that you’ll understand scientist have extreme evidence for the proposition of your evolution from a fish. and if you can still believe in a God after you understand that you evolved from a fish then well good luck
None is debating and killing over different definations of life. Most biologists can agree to some sort of definition lol. Sweden is bad? relative to who? extremely religious countries like Iran, Afganistan, pakistan?
Everything you said is false.
Do your research.
If you were to observe the argument that a decline in faith leads to better economic outcomes; you could very easily argue that the rise of America as an empire after WWII was due to a population with strong faith and its consequently declining status is due to people turning away from their faith... Either way, linking faith to a decline or growth in one contries fortunes is far too simplisitc of an argument to make
You're exactly right, fluctuations in levels of belief in god may or may not impact a countries economic fortunes but either way it does nothing to prove the existence of said God
Whose increase in temporal/fiscal power has gone lockstep with their increase in religion? China?
That 'rise of America as an empire' was SOLEY due to the MASSIVE financial and new land resources plundered after the war. That 'rise' would have taken place REGARDLESS of any society's religiosity. Keep in mind, the speaker's MAIN point was that "IF there is a god, one would think the more religious places on earth would be more happy and prosperous. Why are they not?
It's a very temporal argument. Empires rise and fall all the time. All empires that have ever existed in the past were believers on God or some kind of supernatural deities. And the Secular countries today are all in decline, so the idea that decline in faith leads to better outcomes no longer has the evidence to support it.
First, I wouldn’t say that China is in decline, exactly. Second, the growing secularization of the U.S. is all that has allowed it to stay abreast of other nations in terms of science and technology. Or are you suggesting Oral Roberts U. Is leading the world in those fields?
God is not a tyrant. He is a good Father, but I’d be a lying Christian, if I tell you that there are no conditions for having a relationship with Him. Humbling ourselves before Him is one of them, recognizing that He is God, and that He is sovereign. The second condition is repentance, which we can only be convinced of by The Holy Spirit. Trust me, I am former atheist, but Jesus had mercy on me. This is one of His many promises:
2 Chronicles 7:14
if my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.
Seek the Lord while he may be found;
call on him while he is near.
generally good fathers dont drown most of their children
@@S.D.323 God drowned the world because the world was very corrupted, full of murderers, rapist etc
Who told you that you are a Christian jesus christ wasn't or was he
@@S.D.323
Exactly....the story of Noah
Ive thought about the "too much suffering" argument against the existence of a "benevolent" god. The only counterargument i can think of is to consider all earthly suffering as "insignificant" within the context of the cosmos. I think of the child who cries because his ice cream has fallen onto the ground. Or I think of a girl who is in sorrow because her parents left her in summer camp. I wonder if even the worst suffering here on earth is kind of "irrelevant" within the context of an afterlife or the universe as a whole. Then perhaps the cruelty of the sufferings we see on earth is not as potent or significant as we believe it to be. Much like the child crying over his spoiled ice cream? Just a thought
Romans 8:18
Using this reasoning, couldn’t one say the relatively small number of sins a person could conceivably commit in one lifetime could not possibly be so “significant” as to require an eternity of punishment?
@@DeadInside-ew8qb Yea, thats a good point. But imo within a morality context, the "evil" actions of a sinner isnt quite the same as "pain and suffering". One could argue that sinful acts or immoral acts have intent and motives that come from an individual's heart. Thus its quite fundamental and significant. Whereas pain and suffering is the byproduct of actions (both human and natural) and hence its like an object that has no real moral significance by itself
@@yhp99 but how many instances of “sin” are predicated on the pain experienced by an individual? Pain caused by loss, fear, physical/emotional trauma etc. are largely what drives people to commit most sins.
@@DeadInside-ew8qb "Pain (is) largely what drives people to commit most sins." I would not agree with this statement as there are also desires, envy, pride, ambitions etc that make people do bad things just the same. But I do agree that pain can lead to evil acts and can make people bitter and hateful. But the issue i have with that is there is always the choice at the end of the day in spite of the pain. There are many people who overcome pain to do good. While there are also many who are overcome by pain and do evil. And at the end of the analysis the lowest common denominator isnt pain, but it is the person and their choice to act either good or bad. So to me pain still takes a backseat, and it isnt a fundamental force within the context of morality.
More to the point, why do people allow it.
Because India have a treaty with the Vatican church to create wars with its nation creation done through Israel and they fund the many wars with Bank of England. Today they might have change the name but the game remain the same.
There are many reasons, but religious zealotry is one of the biggest, if not the biggest.
@tschorsch pure lack of empathy from our ruling class is the main reason.
We have the technology to help everyone or destroy the world.
You can't blame religion for that.
We need to stop destroying the world and start helping people.
people are c$%^s
Lots of suffering is not something people allow. Things like natural catastrophes, children being born with painful diseases and so on and so on. You cannot explain all suffering by blaming humans.
Just think of all the wild animal suffering that happened gorillas of years before humans even existed.
Zuckerman. Color me shocked.
Can you define your mothers love?
Everyone has their definition of love too
Coming to the point God is the absolute okay a mathematician can't be defined in terms of numbers if you think you can define the one who created this infinite universe in terms of human logic its impossible especially when you are not aligned with your own conciousness.
Let me make it simple for you God created the universe as and created humans gave them free will to learn and explore the ultimate truth that is God himself he didnt created misery he is not responsible for social challanges that lead to suffering humans did and he doesnt intervene in suffering because that is the test every human has to pass on himself you have to realise that you are here to experience life not to be attached to it desire is the cause of suffering he created the universe and created the law of cause and effect and he relaxed and left everything to humans but you western people due to abandonment issues from your fathers have developed a condition in which you see God as your father to fulfil your needs answer your prayers take the sufferings which you created and if he is not doing so so he must be a delusion how convenient.
If God is all, wouldn’t Good be an amalgamation of all?
Then to say Good is He/Him is to void that premise.
GOD is L B G T Q H (heterosexual). Female. Male. Feminine. Masculine. . . And so much more. . . If you believe in God.
May i ask the atheist, when you came the understanding that you infact have no freewill - what changed in your life?
Reality finally hit.
@@Former_Pastor What change occured after reality finally hitting?
When I understood that freewill is an illusion, I became melancholic, less judgemental (suspended admiration and condemnation of people).
@@50H48 Christ teaching presents this circa 2000 years while still maintaining agency
@@daveyofyeshua then I suppose you do not need Christ to draw the same conclusions to be a good human.
Do you use a pen? Did someone invent it? If a simple pen we use is invented by someone then how can we think that such a big, so well planned cosmos is built by itself? That great creator of this such well planned cosmos is God. People believe him because they respect and be thankful to him for his creation, that supports our survival on this earth
A "pen" 😂
You've got to be joking, right?
@@FlandiddlyandersFRS a simple pen or pencil that we use is invented by some genius mind… we well accept it without any hesitation… then why is it hard to accept that such huge cosmos is also definitely a creation of some great creator.. that creator we call God..
@@ksehgal3544 All Gods are imaginary.
@@FlandiddlyandersFRS can you also please explain then who created this such well planned cosmos.. where every living organism is provided everything required for their survival? How all different organisms are dependent on one another.. different aspects of nature are so inter dependent.. how little tilt of earth is so important that gives birth to different seasons.. sun is giving energy to plants.. plants are giving oxygen to human bodies.. don’t you think that there is definitely someone who planned it so perfectly.. think this way please.. can a car go on running without anyone planned the streets, red lights, stop signs.. properly.. then how can our planets running at their paths.. sun rises and sets, so many things happening in such planned way in our cosmos… without a planner?? That planner we call God
@@ksehgal3544 🤭 What makes you think is was "created"?
When someone asks a question starting like this "why would God" I instantly think about asking them this one "so would you be ok if he had shut your mouth?. Because all the misery started right there by us humans. In all questions of this sort, I see an attempt to justify humans rather than trying to find out why we are sometimes so evil. And if you really believe that human beings have a role and responsibility, why would you ask that question even without being a theist?
Exactly. Why would the debates ignore completely the free choice of Man to visit misery to his fellow man?
I just saw a video of a cat that was found suffering in agony in the wild. Are you going to blame humans for that too, the cat's mother or the incredible sky spook 🙄
What kind of magic pie man in the sky allows suffering? A made up one to soothe the smooth brains of religious dimwits.
Society like Saudi Arabia are 💯💯 believers and they live in the best of any kinds... probably you are looking at belief in Christianity perspective only prof.
Except if you're a woman, gay or a non believer.
go back to before they discovered oil then. even they themselves talked about how they where living in poverty and distress. but then, anything can be explained away as a test. what isn't a test at this point, your coffee turning cold?
The gun statement is the dumbest, least factual, statements ever. Amazing how when you open with a complete bullshit comment I have no desire to listen. “It just does t add up”. Yep. Lost me in the first 15 seconds. So dumb.
He's logical is like two people on whether human beings having a brain or not and to Him He is suggesting that we must see the skin only over our heads and never believe or know that there is brain inside that skin because we cannot see the brain itself. This how stupid he's logic is.
We can’t see or touch or feel or smell or hear bacteria with our eyes either, yet with advanced instruments we can. Let me know when we get anywhere near that with god. Until then, shelf your laughable false equivalence and false analogy for a bit, give it a rest for a while before reusing it. 😉
@Danielcool😂 sayeth your thinking
@@ZhangK71 of course you needed instruments to see your brain and we need faith to see God.
It's not a false analogy it the its the fact you can't see your own brain with a microscope.
@@DanieBen-qg2bm It’s a faulty analogy because claiming faith operates on nearly the same principle as using an instrument to empirically increase human knowledge is absurd.
@@ZhangK71Obviously its same thing you cannot have knowledge of God without faith, likewise you cannot have knowledge of brain without a microscope. Faith a spiritual thing is not a natural thing that scientist can explain.
His arguments are very, very simplistic. Seems he never listened to a high level debate with for example John Lennox.
Idiocy, hyperbole and projection are the only way religion makes sense.
@@user-wt5bf4rw7e As I said, listen to some videos with John Lennox, and you will know that's not true.
What a funny thumbnail !!! God must be sadistic if He/She/It enjoys seeing people in misery.If that is what the speaker trying to say then he is childish and immature.
Well if he can prevent it and doesn't stop it then yes it would be classified as a psychopath.
Thanks for proving theists are morally bankrupt.
Objective right and wrong ie morality proves God exist
The most religious countries have the worst morality. So going by your statement, god doesn't exist.
Morality has changed and adapted to sociological and scientific pressures which shows that morality is man made. Objective morality exists only in the ability to observe our environment and react to experience and knowledge.
If you held your morality to the morals of the foundational religions you would be thrown in jail or murdered for watching this video.
@@alinktotheblast40Doesn't get away from IF there is in fact morality ie right and wrong this doesn't come about through random acts of mutation.
Can you give me a single stat to back up your claim? Please do bear in mind IF there is a God, not all religions will be following truth.
@@TuntunGamerLet's test your hypothesis, in 1941 German in which you were born, would *you* have been against the killing of the Jews. Yes or No?
@@TuntunGamerany joy on the question above?
What I would dearly like to have explained to me is this, Use the laws of science, especially physics, to explain how anything can come from NOTHING. Or is it that I do not know what is the meaning of
NOTHING? I am not too much concerned with religious definitions but more with scientific explanations and rationalisations, To me, Who or What is responsible for what is, has to be what is described as GOD, ALLAH, or the myriad manifestations of the different "religions " ( Man's relationship with his God ) THERE MUST HAVE ALWAYS BEEN A CREATOR, and THERE COULD NEVER BEEN NOTHING. THAT CONCEPT IS BEYOND PUNY HUMAN THINKING, DEFYING THE MOST RIGOROUS SCIENTIFIC INTERROGATION. Again I ask, HOW CAN ANYTHING COME FROM NOTHING?
THE EGO IS ONLY PART OF THE MAN, so IF THE MAN LETS THE EGO BECOME GREATER THAN HE, THEN THE MAN WILL CEASE TO BE, BECAUSE NO PART CAN BE BIGGER THAN THE WHOLE.
The god of the gaps fallacy! Science doesn't know (yet) exactly how everything came into being so let's stick a god in it! But of course then you end up with an even bigger mystery! Because such an imaginary "entity" that "exists out of space and out of time" that "itself" was not "created" and that "created" everything, "out of nothing", the trillions and trillions of galaxies, stars, planets, black holes, etc with the coming into existence, after millions of years of evolution, of the species of big apes called the Homosapiens in mind, has to be even much more complex than the wholeuniverseitself! And it is also special pleading and in contradiction with the statement that everything can not come from nothing. Better say that we don't know yet how everything came into being instead of claiming that an imaginary God or Allah or whatever name they gave to their non-existing celestial dictator did it!
What thinks something must have come from nothing? What if there was _always_ “something”? Not that I believe that necessarily, mind you. But you’re the one claiming it has to be this way and ain’t the other way. You have the burden of answering that question.
Even if Deism were true, a theist will still have all of their work ahead of them to show theism is true. Good Luck with that. Theists can't even convince other theists their theism is true.
What makes you think something came from nothing? Did your God come from nothing too?
There has always been life in the universe .... there was no beginning ✨
What a poor representation of America.
Same way different people have different definitions of u
Nonsense.
Slightly off topic but I struggled with why the good guys often die young, while the evil guys often live long, comfortable lives - how could a loving just God permit this?
Then, I realised that the good guys are already closer to God's love than the rest of us and welcome Him even though we grieve their loss - and the reason the bad guys live on, is because God is giving them every chance to admit their wrongs and put them right - but if, after 20, 30, 50 years they still haven't done so then they can't say they weren't given a second chance and shall stand before Him without excuse.
Would it be fair for God to help some and punish others before the afterlife? what is the point of being here and awaiting the afterlife judgment if God is already judging us and giving appropriate treatment as we are being "tested"? wouldn't it make more sense if God is not interacting with us and our environment will determine how we will be tested fairly?
@@notu1529 everyone's different, created by God, each with their own strengths and weaknesses and path through life..... I'm sure you'd agree we're all unique - so why do you demand a one-size-fits-all from God?
Each of us has enough troubles and challenges of our own to deal with - I'll settle for God's help in my own life, and leave other peoples' lives to God who knows them best while doing the best for them I can - rather than waste my time telling God what he should be doing for others while ignoring the motes in my own eyes .....none of us are in this world long enough for that.
@@notu1529 and who's to say God doesn't reward the good things we do in this life and punish us also - but not in the way we expect? The onus is then upon us to hear His voice, and follow the path He offers - and there are many, many ways to do it, but too many refuse by making poor excuses..... when their time comes, and they know the time for any deception has passed, what are they going to say?
@@cgo225 my point is that God would lay out the perfect condition for each of us (of course everyone are unique, if not culturally, space and time), sort of like a schema where he then would judge each one of use precisely and absolutely fairly; if God interfere in this test, he would do so in a perfectly fair method.
@@cgo225 "The onus is then upon us to hear His voice, and follow the path He offers - and there are many, many ways to do it, but too many refuse by making poor excuses"
is my cognitive dissonance when trying to accept something beyond reason and comprehension by "faith" a "poor excuse"? People have many brilliant reasons to believe in God or not, but it is ultimately unknowable if God is truly outside of reason and comprehension or must be hidden to allow "free will" that is not actually "free"
If you base your belief in God with your economic condition, that's so naive, because God is Love, if you truly love someone, you love unconditionally no matter he's poor or rich...
tell that to my uncle dying of Parkinsons.
What?! That is what you took from his arguments? I’m sorry, but that is absolutely moronic.
@@20shourya you tell him coz his ur uncle not mine....😂
@@HenieJayomaThanks for demonstrating that fundamentalists are morally bankrupt.
If "god" can be synonimized with "creator", the most plausibly existing god is a talented teenager in their parent reality mom's basement
He is speaking is he not? He has defined a word, has he not? This man is God. Not the right one though.
What are you talking about? Not once has he claimed TO BE a deity. You did not respond to his arguments. The debate is about something that some people call GOD, but without defining this word, it’s difficult to even talk about it. It’s a term that is void of content and context.
@@ZlaRah By believing God is a delusion, you are essentially converting to his relegion. The religion that is athiesm.
So which God is the "real" God? Theism is a fractured landscape of hundreds upon hundreds of city-states, each claiming to worship the One True God (or the One True Pantheon, for polytheistic religions) & that all the other people across the land are fools & heretics. What evidence can you or any other theist offer to persuade a non-believer to sign up for YOUR particular "team" vs. all the other competing teams?
the fallacies of this guy are off the scale.
Such as?
God is absolutely real fool can't understand.
Can't understand your punctuation 🙄
Which deity is real? Cultures have believed in thousands of deity’s all throughout history but the one you believe in is correct? Who’s the fool?
All Gods are imaginary.
My 18 year old self would have lapped this up. Unfortunately I now live in a world where in Scandinavia and Europe they may be secular but the magical thinking that men can become women when they grow their hair and take pills designed for menopausal women. Same men don’t bleed, don’t give birth, don’t have natural milk ducts, and yet I would bet Professor Zuckerman swallows that dogma wholesale. These atheists aren’t consistent, they pile on religion and don’t critique what fills its vacuum.
what is exactly wrong for a person to be transgender? I can tell you why religion is bad though; it limits human reason in the natural world by being circumscribed by ethos from the non-naturally or non-pragmatically aligned (i.e., religious books). Is it truly pragmatic to be against transgenderism or the LGBTQ+ community as a whole? what is the naturally bound or pragmatic reason for this moral truth and on what basis (consequentialism, deontology)?
If you critique religion as non pragmatic then you could say the same about transgender because transgender poses a threat to the category of women in sport, in prisons by denying or minimising the biological differences that exist between men and women. The consequential harm is asymmetrical in that it affects women more than men. Women have been raped by trans women and women have been beaten in races by trans women and made to feel unsafe when their designated spaces are reassigned unisex and men’s are not because it’s harder to change a urinal. These are social biases based on years of patriarchy. The idea that a woman can be reclassified chest feeder or womb carrier is all to appease a minority. Christians are a minority belief system too. Both believe things in faith the secular religion believe trans women are women that they enter that category through self id like a religious conversion we must all repeat and bow down on the altar of the mantra transwomen are women. It is an ideology that is consistently defended by atheists who are often misogynists yet don’t see this bias in themselves.
I feel you katie. You'd think this madness would be exclusive to the internet but somehow members of my family believe in it too. I would guess that it's the pressure of fitting in and they have not sat down and wrestled with the issue.
@@TryingtoTellYou you yourself probably cant CHANGE how you feel about your gender identity and sexual preference. Im gay and trust me, it hurts when my own family member think im a bad person for it, it makes me want to die or completely remove myself from them because i think they want me dead (its making me crazy). But luckily im able to rise beyond it and accept that they may see me a certain way because of their ideology, but i cant have a genuine "family" relationship with them. THE TRUTH is im not a bad person for being gay, people only think its bad because of outdated/archaic morality the same way slavery is outdated. But just think, who am i hurting, what am i doing that is "bad" by being gay?
that must be really tough but there are religious people who support gay relationships and marriage there are just also the ones who don't. I disagree with that but I also think that they defend heterosexual marriage in relation to children and look I am bisexual but I believe as a woman that there are problems with gay people using surrogates for pregnancy. Less so with lesbian as one partner at least carries the child. But in gay male relationships there have been countless cases whereby women's bodies are rife for commercial exploitation as poorer women in Romania have been unearthed in baby clinics for rich gay men. They are often referred to as "the surrogate" highly dehumanising when you consider this is a literal human physically attached to a literal woman. We know through attachment research the important role of the mother in the 1st year of a child's life, we dismiss that at our peril@@notu1529
With due respect, If you're interested in knowing about God's Definition, you must read the Holy Quran with its meaning. May your confusion be despaired. You'll start to believe in God and be the best version of your life for yourself. We tend to be good for humankind from the realization of self-satisfaction in our soul, we become bad when we are incapable of recognizing this. Without religion, be good or bad, it is a choice for humans, however, good practices of religion bind us to be good humans.
We're not interested in fiction.
God is a non contingent, self existent necessary being. God is not made of parts or matter, God is spaceless, timeless and immaterial God is responsible for all of contingent reality and is the ground of goodness itself. Maybe this guy hasnt done his theological or philosophical homework.
Silly gsp3428, I define your comment as “gsp3428 agrees to pay me one million dollars”. Therefore, you just wrote a comment; therefore, you owe me a million bucks.
Playing the definition game for god so your god escapes the divine hiddenness problem doesn’t solve anything. It just shows that you have a very weak intellectual standard and think playing silly tricks is a mic drop against and checkmates atheism. It really isn’t and it really doesn’t.
Silly gsp3428, I define your comment as “gsp3428 agrees to pay me one million dollars”. Therefore, you just wrote a comment; therefore, you owe me a million bucks. And if you disagree, then _clearly_ you haven’t done your homework. 😉
Playing the definition game for god so your god escapes the divine hiddenness problem doesn’t solve anything. It just shows that you have a very weak intellectual standard and think playing silly tricks is a mic drop against and checkmates atheism. It really isn’t and it really doesn’t.
My magic sky fairy is a non contingent, self existent necessary being. My magic sky fairy is not made of parts or matter, My magic sky fairy is spaceless, timeless and immaterial My magic sky fairy is responsible for all of contingent reality and is the ground of goodness itself. My magic sky fairy exists. Checkmate atheists. lol
@@pro29ss You sound like a brilliant guy, that sky fairy part was pure brilliance. Keep um coming, we need to get you to write a book or something, you seem like you have put a lot of of work on this subject and have a tremendous grasp of philosophy and theology. I would put you up there with the great minds that have existed. Sky fairy, just genius.
@@gsp3428 Your sarcasm about his usage of the “sky fairy” trope does not change the fact that he, whatever terminology he used, demonstrated the silliness of defining things into existence using word games.
👎🏻
Yeah this guy has a middle school mindset. If god then why does bad thing happen. As if free will doesn’t exist. And then they’ll say well why do we have free will and then on and on it goes. And the biggest thing they’re missing is that they’re pulling morality from god. Without god then bad is just a subjective feeling. Like it’s not that hard to understand
Exactly I feel this debate was set up to be rly one sided towards the athiests
Without God, morality is a merely biological construct, on a par with hunger, digestion, thirst etc.. and has no more meaning and significance than all the other biological needs and functions.
That is not the main point of his argument, the extension of that reasoning is that if God is unable to prevent atrocities and tragedies of mankind, then it is our responsibility to make society a better place such that regardless of God's existence, we do not need God to make the world a better place.
If you are doing your best to help others in your life and your overall impact on mankind has been positive, even if you do not believe in God and there was one, I am sure they will accept you in the afterlife. That is the basis of humanism.
@@will-fm3rj The problem with these humanist ideals (noble as they are), is that when "we" become the sole arbiters of what is "good" and how to make the world "better", then "we", as individuals, assume ourselves to be his/her own God.... you may say ".... but these decisions would be made collectively, by common consensus" - to which the simple counter-argument is "just because the majority decide something is right, doesn't make it so"........ A group of open minded, honest people deciding the earth is made of cheese, doesn't make it so.
@@cgo225 A humanist does not assume themselves to be their own God, a humanist knows there are some things they do not know and other things (e.g. existence of God) which they may never know.
How do we know what is good is a difficult question as everyone has their own definitions and perspectives, ultimately there would be actions seen as objectively good (helping people in need) and objectively bad (murder of a human), many other actions lie on a spectrum between good and bad.
While some still remain true, the teachings of religions and their morality is often outdated and not adjusted to the technological and societal conditions of modern society. E.g. the power difference between men and women in Islam.
In terms of the common consensus, that was demonstrated most clearly by the belief that the earth was flat, spearheaded and enforced by Christianity in the middle ages. Eventually it was science that allowed us to disprove that common consensus, as science relies on logic and factual information and not the belief/consensus of the masses.
Good speech... Why secular Faith can lives peacefully? Sometimes it runs worse... Don't be secular too, i think... But the point here, they live peaceful and full in Faith to God Allah, they are not secular really, because they, follow God Allah words... i wanna make equivalent here too, prof, that's fine, right... Ask to your students that samesex marriage is the biggest sin in this world even in mobile phone only... because it's united...🌐🇬🇧❤️