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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ต.ค. 2022
- These were probably the most surprising games to revisit so far. There's a lot of good stuff here. Quite a bit of bad stuff too. But that's never stopped me from liking a Sonic game before.
Fun fact, I was playing a good chunk of these games with my emulator configured incorrectly so I was dealing with some serious input lag for most of my time with these games. I thought that's just how they worked on PPSSPP because other games didn't have the same issue. But when I finally investigated, I realized I'm an idiot. Once I fixed things, it played so much better. There's also a ghosting affect in my Sonic, Knuckles and Shadow footage in Rivals 1 that I also eventually realized how to fix. Make sure to set your settings right, kids.
You can support me here if you want. ko-fi.com/pariah695 - เกม
Two things I didn't mention in the video:
Another thing they took out in Rivals 2 are those blocks you have to push to give 2nd place a chance to catch up. Good. Those are a crappy catchup design.
Second, you can mash your special in Rivals 2 to extend its length, which I actually kinda like. Makes for a bit of a dexterity challenge to mash one button while still pressing the others correctly to maximize the value. That has come up as relevant to some of the routing I did.
Ha ha ha ha! Since the Rivals games weren't released in Japan (rightfully so, sadly), we finally have a video where Pariah695 has to listen to English voice acting!
Yep
@@themissingbits6375 "An American, there's an American among us!"
One of us, one of us
@@HarBoterMan Sonic barely had an audience in Japan at the time.
@@themissingbits6375 basically every single game was developed in japan and, like anime, the japanese dub is actually the original. it's wayy more consistent in writing and voice acting, so i don't blame pariah at all for always going with jp
theres a comforting feeling to the way your videos start and are formatted
It's very lowkey and relaxed yet still top-notch and high-quality content-wise, I love it.
There’s a fun tech in Rivals 2 where if you mash the attack/kick button after going off a speed booster, or gaining a bunch of momentum, it allows you to keep your speed much longer as long as you keep mashing that attack button and can stay on the ground. It’s kinda broken lol but very fun
The story videos for these games are gonna be wild !
Lol I'm just now remembering the card plot of Rivals 1
@@SweaterSwagg rivals story is good tho, becuz it might make him like silver more
I was very excited to see you talk about this one, I never played the first Sonic Rivals, but its sequel was one of my favorite PSP games as a kid. Yes, beating even Little Big Planet, as much as I loved that one!
Played soooo much of rivals as a kid, I actually loved sonic r but rivals was like a dream come true when it comes to on foot racing back then. I really loved racing my friend who had the game and the card collecting was a treat.
Same! I played the crap out of these two games. I think I collected all cards in one and two. Only those that need multiplayer I didn't. Because I had no one to play them with 😢
The biggest regret
@@gamanzhiydanil thé sequel is better
It's interesting that the best way to play Rivals 1 is with Sonic VS Metal Sonic, gives me CD flashbacks. The Rivals games were neat. Which makes it unfortunate that their only legacy is
>Silver and Eggman Nega canonicity confusion
>"I'm going to use this gun and turn people into cards!"
>One of the very few Sonic games not released in Japan, like the Genesis/MD version of Sonic 3D
>and Backbone knowing EXACTLY what they were doing with Rouge's Rivals 2 render
Its really really weird seeing silver curl into a ball. Also ngl I wish more games kinda had that old PSP "sorta is sorta isnt lower poly" look. Honestly Id like to see the cards return with some reworking. Like make it more a mix of the achievement grid sakurai's games have and an art/model gallery that ties the art with other perks. Like you unlock character art or models and some of them might be models/art of costumes they give you for instance or little trinkets or extra side things you can play with or music for the sound test or something. Maybe even some secret characters or soemthing. Would be kinda neat, the idea of character cards with high quality renders and stuff sounds fun.
Like imagine a more current game doing that. You unlock comic cover cards that lets you look at them similar to the ones in the old mega collection. Maybe collecting them all unlocks a small one off comic made for the game or a prologue comic. If you collect cards with art from a specific game gear game you unlock a game gear game like how you would in SA1. Unno there's an idea there with the character card stuff so the game has more things to do as opposed to collecting them being mainly work for works sake.
Nice seeing someone other than me that really likes the psp look of these games.
The modern world is not ready to see how hard Patrick Spaziante went on the old Archie covers
Well that was interesting, I thought you were gonna tear those games apart, I almost feel like giving them a chance now.
(Part 1/2)
I love both games, for different reasons. Rivals 1 offers an experience more faithful to traditional sonic experiences. Level design is fairly decent with branching paths, hazards/pitfalls, and set pieces. Although nowhere near as in-depth as offerings seen in Rush. Enemies and placement are a bit of a mixed bag. They often come as reaction/memory checks, which is standard affair. Although, it can be aggravating at times. For examples the egg flyers will shoot a projectile at you way before you get into range, and the homing strength of projectiles are strong. Meaning that you'll often get shot, even if you preemptively jump and such. Or sometimes you'll get jumped if multiple enemies are in close proximity to one another. Sky Park Act 1 is a major example of this. Toward the end of the stage there's a part where two clown bots and an egg flyer are lying in wait. And as I said before the egg flyer will have already let loose a projectile by the time you get close to the first clown bot. If you take to the air then you'll most likely get shot, then punched by the clown. But eventually you can work out how to get around them. And there's the classic of being that the game is in 2D, you have moments of running into an enemy that's directly on the path, but offscreen. Like the spider bot towards the end of Forest Falls Act 1, or the vulture bot on the upper route of Colosseum Highway Act 1. Largely a skill issue, I know. However, there are some instances of unavoidable collisions. In Death Yard Act 1, if I recall correctly, there's a ramp that will launch you straight into an Egg Flyer. And due to a few factors, such as ramps having set launch angles, distance, and speeds, coupled with not being able to use jump dash to redirect, you'll often get wrecked. As well as the fact that the egregious use of those pesky blocks. Where you have to stop and push them into a pit to continue. It was horribly artificial way to break pace. Especially if both rivals got to that spot at the same time. Where it would often devolve into attacks being spammed. The variance of level design and aesthetics are nice. The gameplay feels smooth for the most part, except for the degree of stiffness that is present. Something that is still present in 2, albeit somewhat remedied. Yet, having come with its own set of issues, that I'll touch on in a bit. As mentioned before, you can't use jump dash (pressing jump while in midair for that little boost of horizontal movement) after going over a ramp or a spring. So, there's no option of course correction available. If you try to play Death Yard Act 1 while the 60fps cheat is enabled, launching off of a ramp will result in a death loop. You have to jump over the ramp and jump dash to make it. Whereas if you could jump dash freely as you can in R2, then it wouldn't be a problem. From my experience that's about the only instance where Rivals 1 is impacted. It's a tad bit worse in R2. Back on point, the boost zones (the areas on the ground where you press X to springboard, or O to speed vault. Boost Hoops are the ones in the air) can mess up a run for beginner/casual players. And from time to time, I still get tripped up when switching from playing R2. Because the timing is a bit stricter than you'd expect. Yet another aspect that was remedied in R2. You made mention of there being no real way to defend yourself if the rival is right behind you. That was a big one. In regard to the "combat" aspect of the game. I do like how the attacks have "weight" to them. By that I meant they have actual end lag/whiff animations. So, if you mistime an attack or the rival dodges, then there's a strong chance of you getting punished. Not only that, but you lose speed/momentum when the whiff animation plays out, rightfully so. This encourages the player to be accurate and deliberate when opting to go on the offensive. Something that was changed in SR2, and in doing so it introduced an exploit that affects the experience both positively and negatively. And successful attacks daze the rival for a decent length of time. But you're never really quite out of the race, unless you mess up royally and repeatedly. This is largely due to two factors, which I find to be the crowing factors of SR1's gameplay. The items are designed and function fairly well in SR1. They're speedy in deployment and travel, so you can often use them to meaningfully disrupt your opponent. They barrel down the range along the track, and are only stopped by collisions, whether it be a rival, enemy bot, or environmental (wall/spring). Which is mostly fair. I say mostly because the down sides of the items are that they're heavily geared for offense. And there is only one method of defense, that being the Fire Shield. So, the aspect of item counterplay is all but absent. And in game like this, that's of high importance. Combined with the fact that there is no incoming warning indicator, you're often going to get decked as dodging requires split second reactions. An oversight, for sure. So, items will come barreling at you, or homing in the mine's case, and unless you have a Fire Shield there isn't much to be done about it. Again, aside from trying to time a jump. I guess I should say it depends on where you're at when the attack gets nearby. As the viewing angle at the time can help or exacerbate the issue. I have to mention the good with the bad. And even though I stated these flaws, I still like the system. It comes a sort of vibe check. Which is welcome. Especially considering what the alternative is, and how the nerfed items to kingdom come in SR2. Mostly so that they can function between both Race stage and Battle stages. But the end result was that items became useless. They no longer barrel down track, instead all items fire from 2nd place home in on the enemy at a snail's pace. And even when they catch up, they have to charge before dropping a projectile in front of the rival. Or coming at you in a weird arc. But just by moving alone you can mindlessly bypass all of them. When they could have simply introduced more defensive items. And/or secondary functions to items or characters, that allowed for counterplay. Such as insta-shield. Extra shield types, or bomb items that'll clear enemies/obstructions. (Think of the item seen in Adventure 2) The second factor is the drafting mechanic. The range is pretty generous, and the boost in speed is notable. Again, so long as you're not messing up royally and frequently, you're pretty much always in a position to bounce back. This, too, was something that was removed in SR2. And much to the game's detriment, because it stripped the game of a meaningful comeback mechanic, as well as detracted from the sense of speed. The thought process was probably that the signature attacks would serve as comeback factors. But only half the cast has useful supers. Those being Sonic (Boost), Shadow (Chaos Control), Silver (ESP, random controls), and Metal (Mimicry). More on signatures later. This all came together to make a somewhat rough around the edges, yet very enjoyable experience. Considering that it was the first venture on the platform. And we were fortunate enough to get a sequel.
Rivals 2 introduced some much needed "Quality of Life" changes, while simultaneously introducing some experience dampening issues. None of which are game-breaking, by any means. But still notable. Having extra modes such as Time Attack, Battle/Competition modes (Act 2s of any given zone), slight changes to move set functionality, and other changes. It's basically similar to the transition from Riders to Zero Gravity. The first games were janky but very fun experiences, just needing polish. With the sequels introducing some degree of polish, but the ultimate experience being diminished in the process. Starting with stage design and such. They introduced more varied level designs. Acts 1 and 3 of a given zone are all unique, in that none of them are copy/paste jobs of one another. And set pieces between race acts differentiate. And level design has strong emphasis on flow. But unfortunately, there were some concessions made in the process. Firstly, gone are the harsh pace breaking sections where you have to clear heavy objects from you path. No jostle spam pits, anymore. Instead, pace breakers come in the form of platforming pieces. Such as dice pillars in Neon Palace act 3, or the roulette switches in Mystic Haunt act 3. While some set pieces are short and maintain or amplify the sense of speed. Such as the hang gliders in Blue Coast act 3, and the lassos in Frontier Canyon act 1. Although levels are somewhat shorter in length, and more linear, in comparison to SR1. Less branching paths, and emphasis on exploration. Combined with an over saturation and reliance on certain set pieces and automation. The barrels in Blue Coast act 1, or the railroad handcars in Frontier Canyon act 3 are at the forefront of that thought. Even the aforementioned hang glider. They each cover pretty decent portions of track. Set pieces are standard fair in sonic games.
(Part 2/2)
So, I take no issue with them being there. It's that those lengthy pieces are in a given act not once, but twice. One of which could have been turned into a meaningful sequence of interaction. Whether it be tight platforming, or dexterity checks with speed, and enemy placement.
Which also leads me to my next point. Developmental changes are often done by way of extremes, and not incremental changes. For example, earlier I made mention of how enemies could be a bit relentless or how their placement was a bit annoying. And the ups and downs of the item system. Well, they saw fit to jump to the opposite end of the spectrum in SR2. Mostly pertaining to offensive items and how they are pretty much useless, as they're too slow. Defensive items are still effective with good placement. Instead of toning down the range and boost of the slipstreaming mechanic, they removed it. And enemies are braindead and appear less throughout the stages. They rarely even attack you, even if standing pretty close to them. Some appear as slight obstructions, such as the snakes in Frontier Canyon/Chaotic Inferno, or the spiked caterpillars in latter zone. But they mostly serve as minor platforming elements, or ways to attack a boss, in the case of Sunset Forest Zone. Some of the polish came in the form of the signature meter, which gave a stronger sense of relevancy to collecting rings. Changes to general mobility. Such as the ability to use jump dashes after launching off of springs/ramps/panels. As well as boost objects now having boost zones, in which you have a larger range to input a vault option. Helping to maintain pace. Which is also a little bit jank, as there are some rare instances where it can get you caught in a loop. Due to enemy hitbox detection being off sometimes, as well as the vault process being automated once you input a command. Most significantly, user signature attacks no longer stops all your momentum. Although, they didn't address the physics at all. Primarily, the spin dash having additive speed gain during downward movement. Also, changes to the jostle system. Such as there being two versions of the homing attack. If you press X>X you will springboard off of rivals/enemies. But, if you press X>O you will go through rivals/enemies, still hitting them in the process. Whereas in SR1 you can only perform the traditional homing attack by pressing jump twice. It's a way to maintain momentum, I suppose. But it was weird, nonetheless. Or, having the option to counter a rival's attempt to attack you. Also, the attack animations (whiff) were made to be interruptible. By way of another action, typically another attack or jumping. Gone is the whiff lag, and repercussion to ill-timed attacks. I can only speculate as to why this was done. Two reasons, the introduction of counters and also to keep emphasis on pacing. As you don't lose speed when attacking. Which introduced a double-edged dynamic, by wat of exploit. If you go perform an attack while going through a dash gate it will significantly increase your speed. As I mentioned before attacks were made to be interruptible, by way of jump or attack. Which means two things: 1) You can spam another attack, to maintain the increased speed for a longer duration. From my experimentation you can do this up to three times, max. The speed will start to taper off after the third boosted attack and return to normal. And 2) You can convert that extra speed into jump canceled momentum. Allowing for some serious traversal and skips, in some cases. I don't like it though, as it artificially increases the sense of speed in a negative manner. I say that because both Rivals games came out after Rush did. And you touched on the topic of resource management. I can understand and overlook boost not being in SR1. But being that they included meter in SR2, they dropped the ball by not including boost. That would have meant longer, possibly more intricate stages on par with Rush/Rush Adventure. And a fully implemented aspect of resource management. Like, you can collect rings and use meter to boost. Or you can save up rings for a full meter and use your signature move. And some people have made the argument that Rivals games were targeted for kids. But again, these are post-Rush ventures. Albeit it by a different development team, so that had to have played a large part in it. Just imagine, though. Rivals had the whole 2.5D aesthetic with the dynamic camera angles. Now pair that with Rush's boost gameplay and stage design, and we could have possibly had one of the best exclusively 2D sonic experiences of the modern era. I don't think it's a stretch to say that the Rush and Rivals served as the precursors to Unleashed and Generations. Not in the slightest. Because those elements being boost, and dynamically shifting between 2.5D/3D and 2D viewing angles, weren't present anywhere else in the series. Which is why, to this day, I wish that they'd revisit the series. The feeling was only amplified after Unleashed/Colors/Gens. (Which is why the Rival Rush "feature" of Colors was such a slap in the face. But I digress.) Albeit it as a multiplatform offering, and cross-play. With home consoles, PCs, and hybrid gaming devices coming as far as they have, it could possibly do well. Basically, combine the multiplayer and content flow aspects of Forces: Speed Battle with the gameplay systems and refinements of Unleashed/Generations. And you have something magical. Honestly, they could employ the 2.5D/2D aesthetic of Rivals again, and it would still be lit. Back on track, the signature moves are an element that I like. As it's the major way to introduce character individuality whilst not being too intrusive. But the system needed to be revisited. Because design focus was pretty acute. Sonic, Shadow, and Silver have sigs that are generally strong and widely applicable. Metals' depends on who you're facing, and what zone/act you're in. Tails' is situational depending on the zone/act, too. As it is best used to bypass cumbersome platforming sections, such as the dice pillars in Neon Palace. Or perform skips in some areas. Whereas the others; Espio, Rouge, and Knuckles have little to no use for their signatures whatsoever. As you either, have to be in close proximity to the rival to effectively utilize them. Knuckles and Rouge have moves designed for close combat/defense/area of denial. But being that you're not really spending as much time next to your rival, in this game, they're kinda pointless. I'm not sure why Knuckles' move was changed between games. Because he legit had Hammer Punch from Sonic Adventure 2, and it was a pretty useful move in SR1. They could have toned it down, by not affecting airborne opponents, imo. As there's no incoming warning for attacks, so there would still be a fair chance of landing it. I strongly believe the signature system would have benefited from each character having two options: One primarily focused on offensive application, and the other either on defense/manipulation, or traversal. This is where the game would have benefited from actually expanding the controls and making use of the shoulder buttons. Item usage and primary Signature activation could have mapped to a trigger each. Boost be mapped to square. Jump/homing attack as it is, same with attack/counters. Or they could have it to where the attack button is contextual. Normally it could be the slide (attack)/stomp, and counter when the prompt shows up. And the former item button is now used to active the alternate signature move. Idk, a number of ideas rattling around in my head. Had a lot of time to mull over things. The battle acts were an interesting element but poorly executed, imo. Like they have lap races and that's an awesome callback to the competition mode in Sonic 3, I believe. And the other modes such as Ring Battle, Capture the Chao, and such are standard fair. The stages could have been designed better, maybe less verticality. Such as the Frontier Canyon stage. And the Knockout mode sucks because the combat system is so basic, as well as the aforementioned bad stage designs, and controls that aren't really meant for tight platforming. It makes for a spotty experience, that one can probably only take in spurts. So basically, the sequel introduced some slight pluses, but overall didn't really address the major issues with the prequel. And the music is pretty monotonous, being that they opted for a soundtrack mostly comprised of rock. When Sega titles, specifically Sonic games, are well known for having variety in the soundtracks. One might read all this and think, "Damn, he hates these games." But in actuality, it's quite the opposite. I only can speak to this degree of depth, because I've invested so much time into playing these titles. And still do so, to this very day. I love SR1 for the stage designs, mechanics, enhanced sense of speed, and slightly increased difficulty. While I enjoy SR2 for the expanded roster and content, as well as the refinements. Sidenote: They did us dirty by bringing back Silver, and not pairing him up with Blaze. Lol.
But if you've taken the time to read all of this, I thank you for coming to my TED Talk.
As someone who loved his psp and played it everywhere. I appreciated the cards, not because the challenges were exactly fun.
But I just liked looking at the artwork when I didn't have internet.
Hearing the sonic rivals 2 theme hits me with nostalgia like a freight train
Your videos popping up in my subscriptions is always a delight! Thanks for the content you provide, dude 🔥
I always undestood that most people don't see Rivals as a racing game because it looks and plays way more like a platforming game that a racing one, since the Advance and Rush games and even Sonic Colors DS have multiplayer modes that are basicly like Rivals, with Colors DS even letting you play this racing mode in multiplayer and that has itens that work very similiar to how they do in the Rivals games.
*i meant that Sonic Colors DS let's you play the race mode in single player against a CPU, but i just wrote multiplayer instead, as if it's suprising that a multiplayer mode can be played in multiplayer.
That very same interview also reveals these weren't gonna be platform racing games at first, Iizuka suggested the platform racing and trading cards. Rayman M gave me the platform racing brain worm and in my opinion... prefer Rush Adventure. It's unfortuante because just the 2.5D perspective alone could've made for a uniquely good Sonic game. Rivals 2 was like a taste of that, but then the Generations PSP port got cancelled! Oh what could've been.
Edit: Tangentially related but Death Jr. was also an unfortunate IP, and incidentally its diet Invader Zim tone could've very neatly fit a hypothetical side adventure for Silver...
Rivals 2 especially with it's battle arenas gave me some strong Rayman Arena vibes. That game basically has Sonic level design. Very weird, but kinda cool. I'll talk about it at some point.
Also, never heard of Death Jr. Looks neat. Might check it out.
Never got a chance to play these games sadly. No PSP life, so interesting to hear someone who did play them.
I played them. Trust me it's fun
This video kind of reminded me: do you ever plan on reviewing (or mentioning) the Riders trilogy. I don't really know your opinion on racing games, but for someone who seems to enjoy mastering difficult curves, I think you'd love the first two.
They next.
@@Pariah6950 but we can't forget the most important game: Sonic Pinball Party
@@AlphaOblivion7 Oh we can forget it. I've already forgotten. What were we talking about?
this guy is a card ^
no seriously, someone grab Eggman's camera.
Rivals is a perfect example of shoehorning in characters for no reason(story wise, you could have just had a sonic and silver story while keeping the other characters as freeplay)
Something you said about sonic being like avatar the last airbender where we get sonics friends sparingly or never see them again. I'd like to add to that in were we get adventures with the other characters where sonic isn't even involved like the episode Zuko Alone. We're we see a team chaotix game of them just doing their detective work in an open world setting(like the arkham games with the heroes team style), shadow and team dark doing their missions with GUN, knuckles and his days on Angel Island maybe exploring other echidna civilisations around the world and take the master Emerald with him, silver time traveling and expanding on his devastated future or a blaze solo game where we get to see more parts of the sol dimension and what other threats besides Eggman Nega are out there and none of them involve sonic at all(referenced but not in it at all) because even though in is the SONIC franchise it all feels like the entire universe can't exist without sonic. I like shadow the hedgehog because the focus wasn't on sonic and didn't feel like the world revolved around sonic.
Edit: Hell I'd take a sonic adventure that involve sonic and someone else besides tails, Amy and knuckles like a story where sonic and Omega team up to stop eggman or sonic and the chaotix are solving a mystery that turns into a global problem or even a Sonic and Shadow solo adventure where they reminisce on their past and think about how far they have come from adventure 2(basically explore their relationship) or Sonic and silver team up and not them being put against each other all the time or sonic and rouge where she needs him for a GUN mission. Be interesting how sonic bounces of these character because besides shadow(silver to an extent), we really haven't seen what their relationship with sonic really even is.
I forgot you make separate videos for gameplay and story of the games, so I was waiting the whole video for you to talk about how bad the story is. :/
Oh well, it was still fun to watch!
I disagree about the spindash. That thing gives you a huge burst of speed. It's pretty fun to use and really helpful for the final boss. I hate how you cant ram your rival with it, though.
Something I appreciate about how this game handles playing the same game multiple times is that the ranks are shared between the characters. So, every time you play the next story, you have the opportunity to get a higher rank.
i actually had both of these games inn middle school and loved them, i wish they're revisit this format and refine it because theres a ton of untapped potential here
Oddly enough, this was the first Sonic game I ever fully beat and 100% completed. I actually love the Rivals games quite a bit. A lot of that is due to my nostalgia for them, but at the same time I think they are just a couple of decent Sonic games with some nice looking level themes, music, some unusual character interactions in Rivals 2, etc.
I remember hating some levels because of buttonmashing(like that desert mine stage in R2). But overall really liked the game. And also liked tag and flag capture modes
I Absolutely Love your Discussion Series On The Sonic Games & Can't Wait For More To Come. But May I Ask What Plans You Have After You Cover All The Games?
Was your stand-in for rings this time "lungs"? Like the body organ? Or am I mishearing you?
Lums from rayman
@@Cuck-Lord Oh! Thanks. I never played Rayman, so I didn't know about the collectible in that one. The closest I've gotten to it was probably the first Mario & Rabbids game. That makes far more sense than what I was hearing.
Lums are from Sonic. Rayman has precursor orbs.
Sonic races in a car because Sonic canonically thinks it's cool, said by Sonic himself on Twitter. I suppose his friends like to partake in Sonic's activities.
Evil characters like Eggman only join the race for the prize. That or setting other characters for traps, mostly Sonic. 💯💯💯
Yoooo loving the sonic series reviews my guy! Any plans to do sonic riders? Just curious
That card mechanic in Rivals 1 was a pain for a completionist like me when I played the game earlier this year. The game will continue to give you duplicates of cards you already have, even if you've already maxed that particular card's stock. In addition, each mission and cup actually has a *finite amount* of cards to award. I remember trying to grind out the last handful of cards I was missing, only for the game to eventually stop giving me cards on the mission I was doing so I had to switch to another one. I assume this is part of the reason why the missions are structured the way they are with the three difficulties and such.
I assume they limited it like this to encourage the game's connectivity mechanics. Obviously you can link up with friends to race one another, but you're also able to trade cards. And I really hate that the game can just (potentially) lock a player out of a complete card collection in such an arbitrary way. I did eventually get the cards I needed on my own, but I can only imagine what it might be like to exhaust every mission's stock of cards only to have one or two still missing just because the RNG decided not to give you the one you needed. You basically have to turn off auto saving and reset if you don't get any new cards to prevent a mission's stock from running out.
I never played the Rivals games so I don't have anything to add, but I just want to say that when you called the rings "lums" at first I thought you said they were collecting lungs and it caught me really off guard
Can’t wait to hear your thoughts on Riders.
Me too, I really liked the first one's gameplay and story!
Rivals 2 was the second Sonic game I ever owned. Heroes was my first. I remember playing as Tails the most? I think? Eh. It's been so long I can't remember
Same here, though my first game was s3&k
I now wanna play sonic rivals
Love your vids btw
Played R2 as a kid & had fun but could NEVER beat it despite how easy most of it was. I jus thought it was alr but this vid makes want to try BOTH again lol. The story vids on these will be interestin
sonic rivals was my first sonic game and i would love to see a full 3d take on it, maybe if frontiers does well there's a chance..
also surprised how you're able to produce these long videos in such a short time
Check out Sonic Battle R. Might be kinda what you're looking for.
I like how the first Sonic Rivals game allows you to wear costumes and that Metal Sonic gets a Neo Metal Sonic costume, so technically this is the first official sonic game where you can play Metal Sonic's Neo form in a game for the first time (originating from Sonic Heroes)
Holy shit, is this why Sonic Generations 3DS's rival battles are like that?
(Also, will you be covering the Dimps handheld versions of Colors and Gens separately? Gens 3DS was actually the one I played at the time due to not owning a PS3/360, so it's a version I feel gets overlooked more than it deserves to.)
I absolutely love this game especially 2 "Race to win race to win!"~
I mean, if you really want a good sonic foot racers, then just play the Adventure 2 multiplayer mode. The sonic levels are literally what we've been asking for.
I loved these games were pretty good for the time
Can't watch the full video now, so I'll make a second comment much later, but I want to say how enjoyable and great it is to see basically non-existent but worthwhile Sonic topics like this covered. This and content from KingK and OreoGod is the type of things I would cover if I were a (Sonic) TH-camr.
So based on the first few minutes you emphasize the point that Sonic has other racing games besides the same few people bring up. I've been saying that for years. But in extension, it's not just Rivals either. Sonic Forces: Speed Battle especially is another one. Before that, there were multiple others, such as Runners. All of them had sequels too. Mobile platform isn't a small demographic anymore, and Sega have been putting highly notable effort into Sonic releases on it for a longtime (even releasing HD remakes of the first 3 classic games on it before anywhere else). Sonic even completely dominates Mario on this front. So yeah, and specifically on the sub-topic of "on-foot racing" but separate from something like Classics/Advance/Rush, the mobile platform is where Sonic is known for this best.
Ultimately, Sonic has always had racing in its DNA since the first game. People ignore the very first type, racing against "the clock", which is the most recurring format for Sonic games. Then it's racing using motion-based objects, mainly cars (which is another poorly covered topic that has people primarily only acknowledging Sumo Digital's car-based, Sonic Team's Riders, and occasionally Sonic R, and rarely the Drift titles. That's not where it ends though). Final one is on-foot racing against actual rivals instead of the clock.
Weird ass fact: Riders is the only non-on-foot racing series where Sonic is slower than the thing he's using and actually needs it to keep up, while in other titles he does it for fun or because the rules tell him too.
Oh boy 1am!
One of the few Sonic games I never played due to getting a PSP very late and it breaking before I got the chance
HE CALLED THEM LUMS LETS GOOOOO
i remember playing sonic rivals 2 and racing with a friend as a kid and it was pretty solid fun for about half an hour or so. i wish that they would make another spin-off game where sonic and friends are running again because to me, it seems there's so much more creative design choices that can be made there. sonic should make the kart racing genre his own instead of trying to fit in
I found the Rivals games to be pretty underrated. Well the 2nd one anyway, the 1st was alright. Basically I liked Rivals 1, but 2 is what 1 should have been in the first place. Every review I've ever heard (until this one) about these two games are "Eh, they're not too good and are exactly the same" and I'm like Rivals 2 is like 1, but so much better, they are not the same. And I just cringe if I see the IGN scores for these games. Rivals 1 has a 7.2 or something like that, but Rivals 2, being the much better game, gets a 6.5 or something? A lower score? It made zero sense. Only thing I could think of is it was probably a different person playing the 2nd one, but still, Rivals 2 is far superior. The only things I would say Rivals 1 does better is that because it has less characters, that is kind of less of the same playthrough and Rivals 1 did have a custom menu thing where you could change the color themes based on certain characters. But Rivals 2 does so much more than 1. Anyway, while they're not my favorite Sonic games, I still think they're underrated and deserve more love than they get.
The first time i heard the racing theme of Rivals 1 was actually in a fan game. I didn't even know it qas Sonic music at first. It wouldn't be until i checked out of pure curiosity years later. It was a really bizarre feeling.
I've admittedly not played it that much. I think i dabbled with Rivals 2 one time and only 1 level. Most of my knowledge of it is second hand.
Always thought it was weird how much recycled assets are in this game.
I do like Race to Win though.
Sonic R was underrated tbh.
Can you feel the sunshine?
Are we getting another string of Sonic videos now?
lums? pariah rayman video? 😳
Holy shit, why is everyone always on Iizuka's case? Like yeah, I get that he's been associated with some dumb moves in the past, but he's mostly been a positive force in this franchise.
To my knowledge, the 3 Sonic games he has been most involved with were SA2, Heroes, and Shadow. SA2 and Shadow were pretty polished and didn't have any glaring design issues, and while Heroes was janky he was also one of the main level designers on it. He almost worked himself to death to get it done, and the level design is probably one of Heroes' best qualities.
He's constantly berated and mocked by the fanbase for decisions far out of his control, even Stealth from Headcanon vouched for him on those same grounds. Hell, if it wasn't for him Frontiers wouldnt have gotten the delay and it'd probably turn out a comete disaster.
Can't wait for us to get to the Unleashed review so Pariah can finally stop bitching about Sonic Jank (TM)
Calm down. I don't have a hate boner for Iizuka. Just pointing out a fact. Every game he's directed has been very unpolished and plagued with tons of major technical and design issues. Shadow is the only partial exception. SA2 is not exempt. It's very rough. And he also directed SA1, which is even worse. I know it's not his fault. But that doesn't change the track record. When I play an Iizuka Sonic game, I know there's a good chance I might fall through the floor.
I've also praised Iizuka in the past. I think he's a good level designer. I had lots of good to say about his level design in Heroes. And I gushed over his story in Shadow a ton. I'm just being fair here. Praising what's good and criticizing what's bad. And I did kind of mean it when I said it was nice to have that familiar Sonic jank (TM) in Rivals. Makes it feel like a 2D Adventure game more than a Classic game with bad physics. Some series are just like that. I would never want a SWERY game that worked well. The shittiness is part of the charm. And IIzuka's games also have that. If they remade SA1 and I could no longer spindash up walls, then it's not SA1 anymore.
I do personally disagree that he's mostly brought positive to Sonic. He's done many things that I don't like. Not just recently either. I've consistently said in my videos that I disagree with the direction the Adventure games pushed the series in to. And as the director, that falls on his shoulders.
@@Pariah6950 Lol sorry about that, idk where that came from. I didn't mean to come off as saying Iizuka was some perfect guy or anything, I just feel like I only ever hear people talking about how much he sucks and how much he ruined Sonic when he has done some good for the franchise.
And if I came as insulting you or anything I definitely didn't mean to, the older Sonic games are definitely janky af and in that sense they really aren't up to the standards of most video games of their time. You're an excellent reviewer and you've opened up so many facets of Sonic to people like me who never knew they were there. Thank you for that.
It's all good. I am also guilty of giving him a harder time than he probably deserves. It's hard to say as we don't truly know who exactly makes the decisions.
He was the director of Shadow, so assumedly he's the one that said let's give Shadow a gun and do all that dumb crap. But at the same time, corporate meddling is a thing. Could be some executive telling him to make a Sonic game like GTA3 because that game made a gazillion dollars. And this could apply to everything that's happened to Sonic in the past 2 decades. Who knows? I don't. But I do think some blame has to be put on him. Too many problematic products have been associated with or attributed to him.
@@Pariah6950 with all the crit you're building up through these vids I really can't think of someone I wanna hear more talk about what the issues are plaguing the series and what your ideas would be to correct them. Everybody who has big criticisms seems to more or less know what we want, can just point to webms of Sonic Utopia people always post, but have a harder time vocalizing it outside of just 'momentum' and also are probably guilty of brushing over what good the 3D Sonics did do, like I was before I saw your Heroes vid tbh.
@@Amgitstigma I have thought about doing an "Armchair CEO" video for Sonic, basically what would I do if I had total control of the series. Might do that at some point if people are interested.
Are you gonna cover fan games like Sonic and The Fallen Star and stuff like that? or maybe that's too much work i guess.
I will be covering many fan games after the official stuff.
@@Pariah6950 that's great to hear.
5:48 hey first footage edit in a pariah video
Foot racing game? Sa2. And i wish more games has this feature
sweet, which is next? unleashed or riders?
Sonic rivals 2 was my first sonic game
Question: do you think the “prompts telling you which way is optimal” feature would have fixed Advance 2 for you?
Probably not. The prompts work because the mechanics slow you down and make a button press launch you in a certain direction. Advance 2 is more physics based, so a simple timed button is not going to do the job.
25:20 did you just mix sonic and rayman up in terms of the main collectable
0:03 i've always hated it when people bring that point up. In what world does running on foot require the same set of skills as piloting heavy machinery? Why doesn't Usain Bolt compete in F1 since he's so good at running? Why doesn't Michael Schumacher compete in Track & Field since he's so good at piloting a car? These are two completely different sports with two completely different set of rules, people
I think I remember playing Sonic Rivals on... Somebody's PSP. was it my cousin's???
I remember buying both games for my vita
Cool
5:34
The norm for really rushed Sonic games.
I kinda have a hard time considering a 2D game a racing game
Why is he calling rings "lums"? This isn't Rayman! Though I guess they aren't _that_ different, huh. 😅 Especially Origins and Legends. Just kinda throw me off-guard.
why do you call them lums?
Lums is the thing you collect in Ray man
Personally I think this was one of the worst instances of he cast being so unlikable before 2010's era. In fact I'd say it's Rivaled (see what I did there?)by Free Riders in terms of the horrible treatment of the cast. All of their issues could be solved if they just talked it out and worked to stop the threat, instead they just bicker and act like jerks toward one another. Some like Shadow are even out of character in Rivals 2 toward Rouge for instance and vice versa. This isn't like Mario Strikers where the character's grittier tone fit the atmosphere of the game and the cast is known to change their roles all the time.
No story mentioning💀💀
The graphics literally look like sonic generations 3ds but better
That's because the PSP is more powerful than the 3DS.
I'm one of the 5 people who actually owned both Rivals games
In addition to both games never being released in Japan, the poor quality of both games together with Nights: Journey of Dreams reflect all the reasons why Segastudios USA dissolved in early 2008.
Honestly Sonic R's low poly charm and music makes me enjoy it more than Rivals despite it being messy.
Stop spoiling us with your sonic content we do not deserve it
Im.. gonna stick with the first Riders game, Rivals has too much linearity and quick time events to find them enjoyable.
i'd say I even prefer R because it has the opposite of that stuff, I have full control of my character, janky as it might be and alternate paths to take in a course.
That and the music is much better, like, there's no contest, if you honestly prefer that "Race To Win" earworm over "Woking Out" nah man, get outta here..