Game of Thrones Discussions: Strategy, Politics and War
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 29 ต.ค. 2012
- A compilation of the best scenes from HBO's Award Winning series Game of Thrones with the main characters discussing matters of Strategy, Politics and War.
All footage property of HBO.
Video compiled by Geek Clique - บันเทิง
Robert was a drunk, but he wasn't a fool.
Guillermo Rojas Exactly. He predicted exactly what was going to happen with the Targaryens and the Dothraki.
He would most likely make great king if it did not went south with Lyanna, that just made him go on self detructing route.... actually no wait he was not that bad of a king, except for the debt, the kingdoms were totally stable under his rule and common people had peace.
Robert was the best king we saw. There was peace in the kingdom, the peasants were happy, and everyone but the Lannisters and Greyjoys were content. A good king knows what he does not know, and consults his advisors. Bobby B didn’t know much about politics and administration, but he got the best people on his small possible to handle it while he united the kingdom with his presence.
Guillermo Rojas
He also wasn’t really a tyrant, he was just lazy.
I think Robert was right and wrong at the same time, Dothraki at open field will be suicide but I think Westorosi lords were too afraid of Dothraki to think for a strategy to kill them. Dothraki without horses are not really treat
*Jorah discusses the importance of Armour*
*many seasons later*
*Is killed with blunt knife through solid armor by a zombie wearing a fur coat*
RIP good writing.
Shay Michael Exactly. Thank you 🙏🏻
well whigts are 3 times stronger than normal humans
@@FULANODETAL Then how could regular humans hold one down on multiple occasions?
@@seen203 plot muscles
scenes like these were the reason we all fell in love with game of thrones. Not because of "I DNT WANT IT" or SHE'S MUH QUEEN!
When you’re playing as Jon and dialogue choice comes up:
“X” - i did it to save the North
“Y” - i love you
“A” - YOU’RE MY QUEEN!
“B” - i don’t want it
AH NEVUH WUNTED ET. SHE'S MUH QUEIN.
THOSE ELEPHANTS... I WANTED THOSE ELEPHANTS.
FOCKIN CASTLE!
BLOODY COCKSUCKERS
I AM THE THREE EYED RAVEN
I AM NO ONE.
MY DRAGONS, I WAS BORN TO RULE THE SEVEN KINGDOMS.
repeat, and u get season7 and 8
also I FOCKED THE QUEEN
Option E - "You'll always be my queen"
Absolutely! Amazing dialog
Honestly that 5 and 1 speech by Robert is genius. Just the metaphor when he uses his clenched fist.
Its quite fitting to society nowadays:
Society itself is fractioned, splintered, almost every town and village having its own different problems....
where the Government is united as ONE....
@@thegreenreaper6660 and thats why they keep on winning.. while we fight in comment sections.
Robert knew the Dothraki would just deathball every single opposition and either run around taking whatever they want, or eventually fighting their way to the Iron Throne.
But I thought paper beats rock...
In Season 8 when they were showing the previous season they showed that scene. Robert was prophetic.
"We still outnumber them"
Look at Cersei, its like she didn't hear a thing Robert said. The moment the conversation moved to towns and villagers she went deaf.
Well, what can anyone expect anything else from cersei?
@@HassanKhan-sr2tq I would have expected her to be a better actor and not wear her emotions on her sleves.
Sounds like Cersei to me
@@brooklyn560 Its one thing to not care about civilian lives the way others do. Its another matter entirely when you don't even comprehend the concept of caring for small folk.
@@vladtheimpaler9577 Its true, villages and towns are the ones that farm animals and fruits. They are the people that give lords their armies. And they are the ones that house any merchants, knights, or messengers on their way to other places. The person who controls them is the one who would be king.
The real tragedy is that a lot of these scenes were not present in the books. When they actually had strongly defined characters and a well-written plot to lean on, those two could pen some damn impressive dialogue.
Yet when they still had a well written plot like dorne and strongly defined characters like doran they still ruined them
Actually true. In anger, we were many to say D&D can't write, but they wrote some pretty strong dialogues from S1 to S4. One of my favorite was the conversation between Tywin & Olenna in S3 when they discuss Loras & Cersei's union. Those two on screen trying to outplay each other was amazing to watch.
D&D's mistake is trying to cram in everything that GRRM is planning to write about like Bran becoming King or Daenarys going mad instead of creating a more sensible alternate ending.
@@Nemesis_T_Type Honestly, I think DnD were hoping that by the time they were in S4 GRRM would have at least finished Book 6 and was writing the final book. Look where we are now, we're in 2022 and GRRM still hasn't come out with Book 6, if GOT held back and stretched out the show to be as faithful to what little left they had in the books as possible they'd still be entering the phase of running out of material by now.
You really think those 2 wrote most of those "impressive" dialogues and not George?
Season One: "Only a fool would meet the Dothraki in an open field".
Season Eight: "Robert knew me so well." ~ Cersei
@BalFat the field of fire 2.0 even without drogon,the dotharki would won against the lannisters,they are mongols,they are the second people best at bows,only behinf the summer islands people
@BalF Yeah, they are basically the Mongols. Martin makes a point of demonstrating their skill at mounted archery. In single combat, a given knight could defeat most of the Dothraki; but a people who's very purpose is battle will have a hard time losing against an army of conscripted farmhands, whatever banner they fly beneath.
@BalF Just read about the battle of Carrhae when the roman empire fought the Parthians. Romans had better armor and superior numbers, the Parthian cavalry completely crushed 7 legions.
@@ryanmatthew05 U forgot the fact that Parthians had heavy armoured cataphracts. The horse archers were mainly harrassing the legions to disrupt them. Little different than Mongols.
@@ryanmatthew05
Did you actually read about the battle of carrhae or did you just searched " Horsemen army beat heavy infantry army " on google ?
Because the dothraki can't be more dissimilar from the parthian , they don't even use parthian tactics to begin with .
Robert was right about everything
especially about going drunk hunting
@Fox Unix I was almost positive they added something to the wine to make it stronger, figure you'd have to to truly get a veteran drunk like Bobby B smashed enough to lower his reflexes.
@Fox Unix Most likely the wine was discreetly fortified with pure spirits - something like vodka - as it does not change the taste of the wine all too much, while making it drasticly stronger.
Being right without the discipline to act on it is not much better than being wrong.
I really hope the prequel will have a young Robert strong,lean and smart. Cause I honestly think Robert is the Thor in endgame
Season 8 needs the dialogue stretcher! Now!
D & D run to search but never find it
Nice
@@haze3214 They "kinda forgot" to run.
God damn I love Robert quotes, Gods they where strong!
Season 6, 7 & 8
Jorah: "But a man in full plate, the Arrak won't get through the steel.
Season 7 Dothraki Blood Rider rips through Lannister armor like paper
Dan Weiss: "Continuity? Bah! How's the prep for our Star Wars coming along, Dave?"
In reality a broad sword doesn't go through armor either, you have to go for the gaps.
@@MsJavaWolf why jorah emphasised the point
@@huntersw2 Yea but he said it is designed to pierce plate, which is simply not true, maybe in one in a million tries you will pierce plated armor with a broadsword...maybe but I still doubt it, but yes going for the gaps would be the way to go if you have a sword with you.
@@Th3D4rkPho3n1x agreed i just assumed he meant the gaps in the armor not exactly peircing through properly forged armor
I loved that Dothraki guy from the first scene
He was super chill :D
Rakharo
Was a blood rider of Daenerys too so he was loyal and attained higher status
Rack harp was underrated
@@nkl7345 He's still alive in the books, grew a few more inches, and now all of Danaerys' handmaidens argue with each other about who will get to sleep with him. Dude has become a badass. Another quality minor character so easily disposed of by D&D.
@@stevenhancock2822 he really cute
seven hells, I really missed these kinds of conversations between characters
Ironically, the best part of Season 8 was the small council meeting at the end of the last episode because it gave us just a tiny glimmer of Old School Thrones.
@@seen203 Ph fucking gods no, it was terrible ending that totally destroyed what Martin was trying to show all this time. It gave no answers, it sets up stage for another civil war. Giving us instead of good ending a joke suitable for mere sitcom followed by another unfinished joke and a slow cut to Jon fucking off with wildlings. The master of the coin is a cutthroat that wanted to sell life of Hand of The King for a castle and that doesn't know basic rules of economy, followed by maester who broke his sacred vows with Gilly *two times* once for maesters vows and second for Nights Watch vows, then we have the only sane choice in all this shit being Davos and half of the small council not being named yet. The Reach is being rulled by Bronn, a lowlife cutthroat with no heritage. Great, they will be at open rebelion next Monday. The Stormlands are ruled by Gendry, not acknowledged bastard of Robert Baratheon legitimized by mad queen which burned a city and then died, for all they know he could be a random smith from flea bottom. Oh look, now there are two of them. Give me a break, that is a piss poor ending and a piss poor scene being final slap in the face saying *nothing* will be resolved.
“What’s the bigger number 5 or one?”
“Five”
“Five *raises 5 fingers*”
“ One *Raises a Fist*”
(I’m going to use that from now on)
Hopefully not for rock paper scissors
@@naadde owch
Fist is a 0 tho. Lmao
@@DDD-qm1nj a zero?….or 5 united 🤔
@@jmathieson15 lol. Hand symbols are for arithmetic means only. If someone asks you to "signal five", you make an open, extended hand to do it. NO SANE PERSON would make a fist and then say, "oh this is a five, but united". If you're doing this, then congratulations! You're the first of your kind in the REAL WORLD!
I hate to say it but Joffreys royal army idea actually makes sense
Centralised levies belonging to the crown. A standing royal army makes sense, but Cersei was right in showing Joff how his mistakes fucked that idea up.
Cersei isn't stupid, but granted she's no genius either.
When George RR Martin wrote her, she was cunning enough to survive.
When HBO/D&D started writing her she just became dumber and dumber and always seemed to get her way despite doing stupid things.
In a way, the Golden Company filled that role. Granted, they were lured by gold, but in concept that's how it would work.
It does but it would need to be fostered years decades even generations. You cant start something like that right after forcing taxes on your strongest vassals
Idea is stupid enough. Joffrey obviously read about the unsullied or something. Thinking his kingdom should have a standing army.
But standing armies are monstrously costly. They don't have too many wars in the seven Kingdoms, and their medieval economy can't support such an army.
Standing army will also be unable to defend the counties and parishes. People won't be following any particular law but their own purse.
There is a reason feudalism worked for ages.
Ah, back when it was based on GRRMs story.
"Gods the writing made sense then"
bro would you fuck off im here trying to watch got clips and your whining like a bitch
@@brandonmooneyhan4508 if you're trying to watch a video, then why are you in the comments? And why are you replying to statements not directed at you? You're the only one whining like a bitch.
Thus brandon guy sounds like a bitch bitching about comments
@@brandonmooneyhan4508 holy shit, a normie who dosnt respect good writing
"broadsword...designed for piercing plate" *writing made sense*
"place your catapults right at the front of your lines, even ahead of your defensive ditch"
~ NO ONE EVER
Pretty sure those were trebuchets, so it's actually even dumber. Catapults would have probably been more effective, though.
"Put your sunflowers out in front of your pea pods in Plants Vs Zombies"
Don't forget to send in your whole cavalry to die while you still can't even see the enemies yet.
@@UliaAB trebuchets were effective at sieges though i possibly couldnt understand what it was doing in a pitch battle with the rocks just falling at one place if they had greek fire or an oil shower then it would be fine
@@syedferoz2188 Trebuchets were mainly for offense in sieges, though. They usually were used to wear down structural defenses. They also have a huge dead zone where they can't hit due to their minimum range, and the army they were facing was entirely made up of infantry. Smaller catapults loaded with flaming pitch or something similar would have been the obvious choice. Yeah, I also thought that the complete lack of burning oil on their walls against a bunch of ice zombies was pretty bad writing too. Nothing in that battle made much sense, except for the flaming trench, I guess.
“We should have a standing Army loyal to the Crown, trained by experienced soldiers, instead of a mob of peasants who’ve never held pikes in their lives!”
-Joffrey’s one GOOD idea, and it’s shot down like an enemy plane!
Actually, he had a point about dealing with Dany's dragons earlier too, when he was being owned by Tywin. Even a broken clock is right twice a day.
Meh it’s sorta right but the problem is that they’re medieval so they don’t have enough money to sustain it and what use is there for the standing army? they don’t fight people in essos and insurrections can be put down by the armies lords loyal to the crown provide
It was a good idea at the wrong time so a bad idea. Cuz youre in the middle of a war and millions in debt how are you gonna pay for thousands of extra men and armor and training and housing when your city is overpopulated and starving. Imo it shows how out of touch he is.
Ask the US Army: they managed to pull it off somehow!
Not a good idea since in Westeros they don’t fight outsiders;only themselves.Westeros hasn’t been invaded by outsiders in 300 years,neither does the crown attempt to conquer other places in Westeros.The regions fight each other and as a result the loyalties of the soldiers in that standing army would be moreso towards their regional lords than to the crown.You also have to factor in that regions like the north,the iron islands and drone aren’t too fond of the crown like that.
These are the type of dialogues that made me fall in love with this story. Not the mythological aspects of the show, but the realistic and complex medieval politics, especially displayed in seasons 1-4. I miss it dearly
Exactly. Honestly I saw the decline after Tywin died.
"But a man in full plate, the arakh won't get through the steel" another thing D&D forgot.
yea it because to movie magicy in the end were armor is pointless
i always think of return of the king were orcs rusted arrows and blades were somehow able to go though steel plate
In real life, longswords wouldn't pierce plate either. They could be angled into gaps, or the hilts could be used to bludgeon the enemy via half-swording, but ideally one would use hammers or poleaxes to deal with plate. There's a reason why armored knights on horseback were regarded as the tanks of the day.
John Masters also how 90% plus of the troops would have only leather and cobbled iron
@@MasteringJohn armored knights were too slow they could be killed by pikemen or halberds even by archers through armor piercing arrows or bodkins
@@scottgrasser9737 It looked so silly having all these heavily armored gondorians slain by orcs armed with scrap metal.
All these tiny moments of brilliance. Joffrey's idea about a royal, united, loyal army. Robert's brilliant war mind not fading even after decades of gluttony. None of these characters were perfect, but all had the ability to surprise us. What happened? Where did this show go? So many months later and I still can't believe we were brought so low from these incredible highs.
The2KXperience Under OUR conditions, the idea of a standing army would be great. But Joffrey lives in a feudal system. The Lords and High Lords are too strong compared to the king. Not to mentioned that the country is practically bankrupt at this point. Who’s gonna you for this army? Without pay, they’ll disband.
Robert has driven the country into debt. Joffrey had no money for the regular army. Do you think it never occurred to the Kings in the Middle Ages to create a regular army like Rome? They didn't have money for it.
@@alexanderchristopher6237 The general idea of having a core of skilled and equipped fighters wasn’t bad, he was just thinking too big of a scale. Couple thousand young men from the crown lands outfitted with a decent helmet, a cuirass, a crossbow, a shield and a spear with either an axe or mace as a back up weapon drilled and trained for 6 to 8 months is a lethal unit when put up against the levies most other factions would raise.
@@shadowofhawk55 and the thing is his idea would be a good one since realistically tywin should have done this but for the lannisters not the king because all of his men are paid or fear his house same with joffrey no one fights for them but if tywin at some point had put the effort into a small trained elite fighting force he would have been better off and so would joffrey it's like bron said alot of the kingsguard after barristan left are very soft for solider's or guards to the point bronn a cutthroat sellsword who is very pragmatic and thoughtful about who he is willing to fight was prepared to take two kingsguard which if the kingsguard lived up to their reputation he would never have been willing to escalate. so i think joffrey while a cruel idiot was reasonbly smart in terms of ideas but he lacked the understanding of things to execute his ideas properly. like imagine if unstead of incompetent the kingsguard were like say the Sardaukar from dune or the disfavored from the game tyranny they have small numbers compared to everyone else but their skill is around 10 leagues above everyone else similar to the kingsguard before all the good members died or were forced out
@@lordsathariel4384 The Core of the Lannister army were actually regulars and career soldiers. The idea itself wasn’t stupid, Joffrey’s wanting to use all of Westeros as his core demographic was stupid. What I would’ve done is gone to the hill tribes and bought kids from them. Give them over to warriors like the Hound for drilling and Joffrey himself to teach the use of the crossbow (cause he is damn good with that weapon) and drill and drill these savage hinterlanders into warriors loyal only to Joffrey. Kinda like Daemons Gold Cloaks but from better warrior stick.
A broken clock is right twice a day, in this case Joffrey is right twice:
“We need a standing army, loyal to the king.”
“What of Daenarys Targaryen and her armies?”
Yeah the Byzantine Emperor Basil II did that when he created the Varangian Guard and it worked wonders for him.
@@mysteryjunkie9808 The Byzantines already had a standing army. The Varangians were a massive mercenary force that SUPPLEMENTED the pre-existing army.
Mark Addy didn't have Robert's towering physique but his booming voice is what I always imagined hearing when the King spoke.
Season 8 was a disgrace to the legacy S1 built.
where you even born when season 1 started?
true
Same goes to Season 6,7 & half of season 5
That's what people don't get. The show set its own standards. Seasons 5-8 were a massive departure from those standards.
@@playea123 george rr martin set the standards^^
The shock on Roberts face at hearing the mad kings last words. No one ever asked, Jamie never told. The death of a king and no one asked any questions, they made up their own stories.
There's an old saying "History is a set of lies agreed upon." Attributed to Napoleon.
Cringe
Strategy: Robert Baratheon
Politics: Petyr Baelish
War: Bronn
Bull$hit: season 8
With Bronn I say he was more aware of the gritty reality of the world, not war in general, just what the commoners go through in war and what lengths they would go to survive or profit.
Bronn was just a skilled thug, not a war expert. He was just recycled the last seasons for fanservice
Hotel: Trivago
For war, i would say stannis
Strategy: Stannis
Politics: Renly
War: Robert
Swords weren't made to pierce armor, they have problems getting through them actually.
Hammers were made to crush armor, which is why they were even used, despite their weight and how slow they are
Think Jorah got confused this mail, which a sword can get through but not always.
@@jacklang3314 would at least make more sense
Armor have gaps. Armpits, neck, some parts of the chest depending of the armor. In medieval times the only way to kill a downed knight was piercing the gaps in his armor, mostly the face and neck. You cant do that with a curved blade.
@BalF yes, well that was not an estoc
@@wellyck i get that, but that explenation does not match up with Jorah's here. He presents them as if they pierce armor, which they do not
That scene of Robert and Cersei was magnificent. Robert was a great character.
This six minute video is 10 times better than 6 hours of Season 8.
Sad but true
"The broadsword is designed for piercing plate"
*Ser Jorah then holds up a European style sword, meant for slicing, and it would probably never get through plate either*
I noticed that too. A broadsword 100% will never penetrate full plate armor.
He could have instead pointed out its versatility, and how it’s easier to thrust and cut into the exposed parts of the armor set like the armpits and groin.
@Guts390 he obviously meant stabbing with a longsword is easier to target
Imagine having a shield a and a sword
Block and stab right towards his throat
Or block and stab his gut under his breast plate
Maybe even swing at his knee armour is weaker at the joints
Plus it worked for the Muslim saracens and they had curved swords
They simply used speed to their advantage
Managed to win the crusades and storm right up to vienna
I always assumed he meant stabbing into the gaps, penetrating the gambeson and any mail armor. Obviously a sword isn't going to punch its way through plate.
@@nraketh but he said "piercing plate". No one, unless you're stupid, calls a gambeson or mail "plate", for tis not plate.
@Sir Knight Errant Yes they can using technique called half-swording. There are good videos on the subject here on YT. Plate, also, can be pierced with warhammers, maces, axes, poleaxes and crossbows
Robert basically predicted exactly what Daenerys ended up doing. She united her armies behind one single purpose. Take the Iron Throne for their queen. They even saw her coming from miles away and did nothing to stop her, aside from a few unsuccessful assassination attempts. While Dany was creating her single army, united behind a single purpose, the armies of Westeros grew ever more fractured and scattered and gradually reduced in size until there weren't even enough men left to defend King's Landing. Cersei had to hire the Golden Company just to be able to match the numbers of Dany's army. And keep in mind, this is AFTER Dany's army has been cut in half from fighting off the Night King. Had Dany been able to use her complete army, she wouldn't have needed Drogon to burn the place down. She would have been able to easily overwhelm them with sheer numbers.
She could have sailed directly to King's Landing on the first episode of Season 7 and taken the capital in a single day.
Ashkar Ibne Awal She kinda forgot tho
I agree with everything you've said though I do believe Dany would have used Drogon regardless of the amount of troops she had.
If Drogon alone could collapse the red keep he could sure as hell have collapsed every gatehouse they wanted to go through.
In early season 7 she didn't have the emotional baggage of two dead dragons, Missandei dead, Jon being a rival, her advisors giving her bad strategies, realizing the North didn't like her, etc.
I got to say a royal army was actually a good idea.
Joffrey actually pretty smart despite being an evil little twat. He wanted to kill Dany before she grew more powerful, the royal army idea, and he wanted to be involved in small counsel meetings. If Joffrey had his way, Dany would have been dead before she could reach King's Landing and you can be DAMN sure those religious zealots would never have gained power. The High Sparrow would have his head chopped off the second he tried anything lol. Tommen was weak and easily manipulated.
I'd almost take a Joffrey/Margaery over what we ended up getting lol.
Well I don't think so. Surely you're thinking about the Hundred Years war which demonstrated how professional armies were superior to levies.
But the Hundred Years war wasn't fought in a country the size of South America. Westeros is too vast to be a centralised state with only one royal army. Furthermore at this point in time, the Baratheon dynasty is still newly established, and it is very unlikely such a law could be passed without causing some if not many lords to rebel, as it would require massive amounts of money to maintain an army of around 50 000 (the minimum required to fight a powerful ennemy invading like Khal Drogo)
Maybee a reduced professional army, that would be completed with levies in war time could be useful. The french did this at the end of the 100 years war with great success. They maintained 10 000 permanent fully equipped horsemen which helped tearing the english to pieces at the battles of Formigny and Castillon.
I don't know if I'm right, but I think this project isn't feasible in Westeros at that point in time. Too many scheming lords and not enough gold.
@@stuffylamb3420
Also Dany escaped at least 2 assassination attempts including one by a wine merchant (who probably heard about the reward offered by Robert Baratheon ) and one by the faceless men. She was only saved by Barristan Selmy and Jorah Mormont. So the Iron Throne didn't just sit there while Daenerys was building its forces. Although they could have send more assassins, especially after Robb Stark's death, when the Lannisters had free hands in Westeros.
Standing armies are expensive, and even if they weren't you'd have to eliminate the loyalty issues from Westerosi society. The only sure way to do that would be to dissolve the nobility as political leaders and instead have centrally-appointed governors. Those governors could not have immediate access to the professional army lest they become imperial Roman governors always trying to rebel which means having some kind of regional militia on the payroll in addition to the national army. Even then it would take decades to weed out feelings of geographic loyalty in the population.
@@kimok4716
Where did you get this information about French having a standing army in the period of the Hundred years war?
Especially 10 000 horsemen.
I always respected robert for his keen war observation
I find it ironic and interesting that Robert and Joffrey had the same idea.
"One... one army, a real army, united behind one leader with one purpose."
it means Joffery has 1% DNA from Robert and other 99% from Jamie
@@rajausamarauf2982 cersie doesnt exist apperntly
@yaniv galmor Joffrey got her stupidity
They might’ve actually gotten along if Robert actually took part in Joffreys life, they clearly have the same idea of how to work armies and could’ve gotten along with that
@@agustinrico3304 Yeah I was always curious about that. Some people think if Robert stuck around to be a father and survived the boar attack that he'd possibly level out Joffrey.
I always thought deep down he wanted to be a good kid but his impulses made him lash out.
Robert wasnt a great king
He's a good king
But he is a great general when it comes to war
Yato Kun “he’s a good king”
@@SSJGreg a great king didnt have crippling debt did he?
Robert was a great war leader, he left the running of the seven kingdoms to Jon Arryn.
Besides with tywin Lannister and stannis book one .
He was neither. Yeah he was good cause he didn’t do anything violent towards other people expect when he’s insulting them. He was only good at crushing down battles.
All he did was drinking and fucking while he let his council run the country without noticing he was losing money into a huge debt
He incested on doubling their taxes.
You mean insisted?
@@jungschiffer8423 no.
"incested"
LOL
@Pedro Caldas I think this flew over their heads.
Joffrey wasn't wrong about a standing army. He wanted to consolidate power, weaken the feudal system, and train a professional army loyal to the crown. And he wanted to take action immediately after news of the dragon's birth. He had the right ideas to keep his family in power, but not the mien to convince Cersei or Tywin.
The first 5 seasons were really about characters doomed by their own faults. That's what made it precious to me.
He didn't have the money, either. The crown was broke and so were the Lannisters. They could have never afforded a standing army. It was a common problem all through all of medieval Europe
It's ironic that the illegitimate, evil asshole king had the best and most ambitious ideas. For all his faults, Joffrey did sometimes think big and a bit more outside the box than most characters. Of course most of these ideas were probably unrealistic but even still. He had neither the wit nor commanding presence to convince others of it.
@@Crichjo32 If only these ideas came to a king who was a better person, with a better position.
"Only a fool will meet the Dothraki in the open field" ...Aaaaah, now I got it better the Long Night battle charge of Dothraki... Obviusly that corpses in White walkers army doesnt have a brain at all....
Only a fool would charge at The Army of the Dead on an open field.
Honestly that is kind of an exception due to the undead just being a huge wave of bodies clashing into them
Seriously though, why would you just charge at a horde of numbers you know far outnumber yours with troops who lack any sense of self preservation. I'm by no means a strategist, but they could've used the Dothraki better by having them skirt around the castle constantly to sweep and kill walkers while the ground troops engaged in combat with the brunt of the white walker forces.
Yes...you do not have be a strategist to conclude that...But you must have a bit sense of humor to conclude that my comment was nothing but a joke on bad writings of D&D...If you still dont get it,please type Irony or ironia in psychology...
@@lancehvu In the middle of the night in pitch black darkness no less. The Long Night was a disgrace of an episode.
Back when GOT had real dialogs...
Robert is basically Thor in endgame
Antonio Dee robert may not be worthy of the hammer but he is worthy of using one.
@@BlackDiamond2718 well, Robert's favorite weapon was the big hammer he used to kill Rhaegar, soo
@@arisnikou04 I’m pretty sure that GRRM based Robert on Thor to an extent. He’s 6’6, a great warrior, he uses a hammer and his title is the Stormlord.
@@MusaMansu Wait Robert is 6/6? Wtf?
@@dayarih1217 yep, in the books atleast
S1 Jorah: "Armor keeps a man alive"
S8 Jorah: Dies getting stabbed by rusted 1000 year old blades swung by withered skeletons right through his plate armor.
To be fair the wights that killed him were just raised and were about 3times stronger than they were when they were a live
"Plot armor keeps a man alive". Fixed it for ya.
@@brooklyn560 How did plate save Brienne and Jaime then?
Chicken Man they had valyrian plot plates as armor
This is the show i fell in love with. Now....ashes....ashes and madness.
Madness, Madness and Stupidity - Tywin Lannister
@@davidmccallum2291 love that from Tywin
That first scene is hilarious because apparently small, probably blunt daggers wielded by wights and reinforced with plot armor can slice through full plate in Season 8. The same plate that saved Jorah in S1.
*ok*
I suppose these weapons become half magical in the hands of these undead, whom themselves become super strong. So even an old, rusty blund blade worked as if made of good valyrian steel...
@@barneydenstad2148 lol no it’s called bar writing
Robert and Stannis were easily the two best generals in the whole show. Even as a drunk overweight king with no real interest in ruling, Robert still had a warrior's mind for battle-strategy. It's honestly no surprise his side won the Rebellion with him at its forefront.
As neglectful as he may be as a king, Robert was very good at his specialization of warfare.
The writers could've rewatched their own show to see what good writing was like. Or maybe read a few GRRM books while they're at it.
Gods the dialogue was strong then
HERE’S THE KICKER. So many of these scenes don’t even exist in the books! D&D and co wrote them! That Cersei and Robert scene. Not in the book. So we KNOW the capability was there. Which just makes the season 8 pill even harder to swallow.
The dialogue was always the best part of the show. Strategy, and sense. Something most of season 7 and almost all of season 8 lacked.
Is funny how in the earlier seasons they took the armor concept with heart, but in the later seasons armor meant shit and could pierce easily like they were wearing regular clothes.
Armour does not make you invincible. Not at all. Especially lower cost armour usually massed produced for the lower ranks soldiers.
@@Stratigoz
one properly fitted and trained knight is practically invincible when fighting one-one or vs a small group
That's why properly fitted and trained knights were slaughtered en mass in sieges and field battles in the hundred years war. Fucking moron.@@artski09
@@ethanbridgett9395 A man at arms or the common foot soldier is not a trained knight, and yes without the right weapon (crossbow / Warhammer) it's really difficult to kill or even wound a knight.
And btw, it's not because Azincourt is one of the most famous battles of the hundred years war, that's what happened in this battle happened everyday.
A man-at-arms is not a trained knight, no shit, hes not a fucking knight, hes a man-at-arms. But he is trained, and very much so. If it was difficult to kill or wound a knight, French heavy cavalry would've have gotten slaughtered in battles they were used in.@@sertonetix
The meme of Robert laughing that goes “when you realize your bastard son banged the girl who killed the night king who took on the Dothraki in the open field.” 😂😂
Robert and Cersei's conversation about the Dothraki and what holds the Kingdoms together and Lyanna Stark's face will always be one of my favourite scenes of the whole series...and it was written as a 'filler' scene because they didn't have enough footage for an entire hour! That's the quality of writing I miss.
Season 8 war strategy:
*DRACARYS*
Honestly, Jorah and Rakhoro's conversation is one of my favorites in the show. It's a meeting of two cultures, with two experienced warriors discussing the pros and cons of their different fighting methods. It's the kind of thing I wish more medieval and medieval-style books and shows would utilize, both to show the diversity of their worlds and to create interesting character interactions.
Joffrey has one of his rare intelligent moments, even if it only lasts that long here. He actually recognizes that the feudal system is ineffective, especially because it allows local lords a great deal of power. However, this reforming spirit comes from a place of believing that he deserves all the power and respect, and he fails to recognize that messing with the North on their home turf is a terrible idea without dragons. Contrast this with Cersei, who is far more conservative, but also experienced. She plays the game well, but has few long-term goals and never does much with her power.
Syrio Forel is amazing, and that's that. He's the perfect character to introduce Arya to combat, and is instrumental in setting up the smol assassin we know and love. The scenes between them also show that, while Arya is stubborn, she's also a quick learner, and once she starts to open up her mind to learning something (especially something she enjoys), her progress is rapid.
Love him or hate him, Robert is an excellent commander, a pragmatic strategist, and a powerful warrior (well, maybe not that anymore, but he killed a boar while drunk so there's that). This is another scene that illustrates Cersei's future failure: she's overconfident. She believes everyone to be less than her, and she thinks that just because she plays the game better than anyone means she can rule better than anyone. In a respect, she's much like Robert: she believes winning and ruling are the same. And the entire realm is screwed because of it (well, that and Littlefinger).
You were so close, Ned. You understood Littlefinger's lessons, but failed to realize that you needed to give him the best offer as well.
Bronn really was the best option for running the city guard. He knows how both sides of the law work, he can fight and command men, and he takes zero crap. Not to mention, he's paid by Tyrion, and together they're a highly effective combination.
Bronn survives until the end, because he knows exactly how the world he lives in works. It's kill or be killed, and he can't allow himself to be attached or sentimental towards anything or anyone. He has no honour, because as we see with Ned, that will just get you killed. Bronn is about as morally grey as you can get. He's not evil, but he also will cut your throat if someone paid him enough money to do it.
Season 8's contribution: "dID yOu KNoW eUnUChs hAVE nO CocK LEL xD"
These convos were the real hook for me..this logic and strategy was something I hadn't experience on screen.
"It's a neat little trick you do, you move your lips and your father's voice comes out." Haha that's great.
I love how GOT is a fictional place , but applies every bit to our world... great writing.
I feel bad for Robert he wasn't cruel or unjust and he kept the peace for seventeen years, overthrew the mad king, crushed the Greyjoy rebellion and he was strong and good at making enemies into friends. He was just not interested in schemers or backstabbing which he says to cersei in a great conversation and even if you think that he was a drunk fool, look what happened as soon as he died the realm torn itself to pieces over schemes and plots and none for the better. Robert posessed the three most important features the power to keep other families in check and if not, the strength of leadership to quell uprisings fast and lastly the ability to reintergrate an enemy quickly back into the fold.
''Only a fool would meet the Dothraki in an open field''
Night King: and i took that personally
That first scene aged well.
also the dothaki are basically multiplying like ants. They are everywhere.
They use a respawn cheat.
They respawn whenever the plot needs them to
@@flagflow1232 Winterfell: "What you're seeing is basically the end of the Dothraki"
Kings Landing 2eps later: *hundreds of Dothraki flood the city streets*
Robert was the best King. I don't know why everyone always acts like he was just a fat drunk he was achually wise strong and certainly no fool
The main problem with King Robert was that he bankrupted the realm with his constant tourneys and whoring leaving the crown 6 million gold dragons in debt to the iron bank by the time Ned Stark became hand of the king.
He also attended only 3/4 small council meetings in his 17 years as king, leaving many who saw him regularly with a dim view of his tenure as king.
@@Makkajakka ,yeah sure but the tournaments kept the people entertained. And Robert was wise enought to know that he was not good at ruling so he left his small council alone filled with competent men capable of ruling well.
@@tim6870 well, entertainment isn't the only thing needed to keep the people in line.
@@alexanderchristopher6237 well the people never revolted against him he was the last undesputed king
@@alexanderchristopher6237
The crown was bankrupted not the kingdom which was flourishing under king Robert's reign
Jorah: "It's *armor* not a steel dress."
Syrio: "Now we begin the dance."
Syrio was so much fun. Of course, they loaded him down with cool lines, since he wasn't around for long. He taught Arya the value of speed and skill over strength. Unfortunately, he also taught her that no one she cares about was safe. And of course, "what do we say to the god of Death"? I always thought that hearing this line again reminded her of him and helped give her strength.
I love how witty Robert is. He is a true Baratheon
The 5 versus 1 discussion with King Robert is one of my favorite from any show.
King Robert only man that could dominate Cersei.
We saw Jaime dominating her pretty well aswell
he didnt , Cersei fucked her brother under the king's roof lol
also tywin
@@wokeaf1337 That's because Robert didn't give a shit about her or what she was up to.
Um... I'm pretty sure she killed him but ok LOL
Meanwhile in the season 8... soldiers outside of the walls, dorthakis dying for free vs the nk, etc
Its amazing that Joffrey actualy came up with a clever idea of establishing a standing royal army and had a really good point.
Clever but impractical
@@TheSchemer1 Depending on the level of development of the Seven Kingdoms. Feudalism was introduced becouse medieval countries were administered too ineffective and were not developed enough to organise and finance standing armies. But if the Seven Kingdoms could tax the population efficiently, a centralised army could be introduced instead of private household armies, increasing the stability of the Realm.
Joffrey making sense about the standing army is one of the weirdest experiences in my life
Geoffrey wasn't dumb, but he was extremely cruel and as soon as he had power he didn't have any experience in how to use it and acted as the child he was.
Those words of Robert resonated in the mind of Cersei when she saw Danerys of House Targryean- 1 ruler,1army(dothraki+unsullied+3 dragons) march to Red Keep and brought her down.
Joffrey’s idea of a Royal Army is actually pretty good. And effectively what we have today.
Logistically impossible in a medieval world
@@jackparker8602 It's not logistically impossible. Many civilisations such the Romans, the Mongols, the Timurids and the Byzantines had unified and disciplined militaries that were loyal to the monarch/emperor and not the local feudal lord.
@@jackparker8602 Not really, it's literally what followed after feudalism
GRRM: And what did the mad fans say about s8 after you stabbed them in back?
D&D: The same thing they'd be saying for hours. "Re-write it all!""
For me Robert was an excellent King, he listened to his advisors and had experience.
pretty cool how later in season 1 jorah gets saved by his armor in a fight he was otherwise clearly losing
that was the first and last time armor did its purpose in game of thrones
@@ahmedbader6866 almost agree. i mean merryn trant woudn't have been able to grab syrio's wooden sword and hold it properly without a gauntlet. and there would be jamie's golden hand trick vs the dornish soldier(Though alright that's not armor per say). Other than that it only maybe cushioned some hits (mb grey worm vs sons of harpy comes to mind) and forced fighters only to cut along certain angles....but yeah... not really worth it. And as Jorah points out the broadsword is also good at thrusting, and we saw a fair few deaths by thrusts
Also the mountain vs the hound , ser gregor's armor worked for a time but then all logic went through the window when the hound thrust his sword through the plate armor
@@ahmedbader6866 if i remember correctly, it can be done, and right below the chestline, is one of the places where it is possible to stab through plate armor
@@CastlesKingSide No. The only thing that can get through plate armor consistantly to kill with a piercing blow is something like a lance at full gallop, or a poleaxe. It is actually really hard to kill a man in plate armor.
Nobody:
Joffrey: the north should be punished because they are doing nothing.
"Armor makes a man slow, but also keeps him alive." You couldn't tell when the White Walkers were piercing through his armor like knife through butter.
A professional standing army...that was the best idea Joffrey had in his entire life.
Who woulda thought this video would have such importance to real fans of the show 7 yrs later. Well done on readin the future.
Bronn is now in charge of the Reach, providing food for the rest of the six kingdoms. His family will become the wealthiest ever.
Syrio Forel: What do you say to the god of good writing?
Dan & Dave: Not today
“We’ve got as many armies as there are men with gold in their purse “.. soo true in every way in any time anywhere in the history !
That 5 to 1 is some real shit. In most professions
Joffrey kind of reminds me of Radovid from the Witcher. Brutal, ruthless, but clearly very gifted.
Of all scenes, Robert's has proven the most foretelling;
In real life, his metaphor was EXACTLY what happened to Napoleon Bonaparte in his experience during the 1st, 2nd, 6th coalitions, his campaign in Italy, and the Hundred days campaign.
Singular, solidified, coordinated, unity behind 1 leader can match odds stacked 10 to 1 against
God this is such an amazing, clever, patient show, I can’t wait to see the last couple of seasons bet they’ll be great!
🤣😅😂
Everything was amazing when George R.R. Martin kept an eye on dumb and dumber. Remember that he supported D and D with the scripts of the first seasons.
@@wokeaf1337 yes . Thst dumb ass maybe doesn't finish it in his lifetime
This comment section is gold
Robert: “Only a fool would meet the Dothraki in an open field.”
Jorah: “King Robert is fool enough to meet them in open battle.”
Always liked that Jorah, someone we’re shown to be wise and militarily sharp, underestimates Robert in this way. Everyone looked at Robert as a fool, but he was just tired…
He probably tried to get on the good side of Dany with that line about Robert
Joffrey's Royal Army idea actually makes sense. Its the start of the formation of modern nation-states. With a regular army loyal the central govermment rather than various local forces who can shift sides quickly.
We DO SEE this happening in the show
Funnily enough medieval armor isn't actually all that heavy. Your average knight in full plate could full sprint 20 yards with relative ease. To veteran knights armor was practically a second skin that offered full protection, mobility, and drip. The only real hazard was being prone to heat strokes during particularly hot weather.
That, and Saxon archers.
Love hearing these types of discussions in any kind of fictional universes. Just something about hearing characters discuss tactics in war and craftsmanship in weaponry always catches my attention.
Really loved the language back and forth with Jorah and Rakharo, felt very organic
Can you believe season 8 came from this very gem
Cersei and Robert talking about fighting the Dothraki was the best war convo we had in Season 1.
Robert was a man of war, he knew that world better than most, but because hes a bad king, everyone dismisses him.
He knew it was best to smother an ember rather than let it grow into an inferno.
Great vid man
In a way, Joffery was right at the beginning of his discussion with Cersei, at least the centralized royal army, especially against someone like Dany as it would be much more efficient and actually bring the nation closer together tactically and financially. It would also lower the risk of rebellion as all soldiers are brought in from various regions to fight for the central government and also increase life / decrease casualties as they'd be professionally trained.
Joffereys royal army idea was actually pretty good
it's ignorant of the realities of westeros, you can't just snap your fingers and completely reverse feudalism.
No it was not. There never was any profesional army in the medieval Europe not because nobody thought of that but beacuse it just cannot work in the feudal system. Vassals had immense problem to even provide levies to their liege lord, but providing them with men to be in profesional long standing army would surely make them happy. King who would try to impose this would not be king for long.
The Idea of taking a child's opinion about war and politics seriously is bad joke.
@@technokokos the Swiss got pretty close, but they were a mercenary army.
If the Han empire can do it so can the 7 Kingdoms
These few scenes of dialogue are so captivating to watch, that it made history class fun.
When they talk about warfare and politics, it is actually pretty cool. You learn this stuff from taking history classes and playing Age of Empires and Sid Meier's Civilization. The Byzantine Empire had armored horses which meant they could run through pikes and infantry and greek fire which is wildfire for these guys to burn down ships. Genghis Khan had a trained army on horseback that used terror to force opponents and subjects to submission. So many concepts of war and politics are what made our civilizations and moved our history. Amazing how they made the show.