Even in the grave, scenes like this are the living proof of the absolute misery Lyanna and Rhaegar's behaviour and selfishness endowed to so many other lives. They messed with nearly everyone. Robert, Elia and her family, Lyanna got her own father and brother killed, and the sacrifices she forced Ned to live with.
@@heyheyheyheyheyhey76 Would you say Robb Stark and Talisa were selfish or would you say the Freys were absolute dipshits who broke guest-right and oaths to their overlords because the Lannisters paid more? Because Robb and Lyanna essentially did the same thing, broke a betrothal for which the medieval custom was to make financial reparation to the injured side. Lyanna was an idea for Robert. She didn't love him because he was already whoring around. I don't think Robert knew Lyanna that well. She was an idea for him- pretty, his bestfriend's sister. In his head he thinks about Cersei's sharpness and thinks he would have been happier with Lyanna, but she wouldn't have been a pliant submissive wife either. Remember Ned compares Arya to her aunt. Lyanna Stark was no lady, she was the Knight of the Laughing Tree & she was disillusioned with Robert's playboy ways. Yes, even before Lyanna dies, Robert was whoring around. When Catelyn goes to the Vale, she meets one of his bastards there. The war happened because Aerys was mad. If he was sane, he would have made reparations to the Baratheon house for a broken betrothal- there are precedents of this in Targaryen history when the children of Jaeherys broke the engagements he made for them - Baratheon was one of the houses- and the king paid them to make up for the insult. So Lyanna & Rhaegar might have Robb Stark level impulsive, but I don't see anyone call Robb selfish the way they call Lyanna selfish. The war happened because Aerys burned Torrhen and Brandon and asked for the heads of Robert & Ned from Jon Arryn who was fostering them in the vale. Yes, Robert was sitting in the Vale after Lyanna was 'taken' and rebelled only after Aerys asked for his head. Stop blaming war on them.
@@RuchiraRambles Would you say Robb Stark and Talisa were selfish?? Yes, completelly, he was an ashole too, if i was one of his soldiers and i had to watch my whole family die only because the man i followed broke his promise, i would be very angry... He could have married to that girls and then going through divorce ONCE EVERYTHING HAD HAPPENED... he could even keep fucking Talisa in secret, but he did the only thing he didn´t had to do, breaking that promise... We don´t know how Robert would have been if he had married with Lyanna, maybe he would have stopped whoring, maybe not, maybe he wouldn´t be a drunk fat ass, maybe he would have been anyway, but we don´t know that... And tecnically, yes, the war started because of king Aerys and because he didn´t handled things right, but if Lyanna and Rhaegar hadn´t escaped, the war wouldn´t started... So tecnically, they are in a way responsable for the war (even though anyone would have reblled to Aerys later, that was a matter of time)...
Robert was betrothed to her, but she preferred Rhaegar, while Rhaegar, betrothed to Elia Martell, preferred Lyanna. Bitterness drove an outlandish lie that he kidnapped and raped her, and thus a rebellion that unseated the Targaryens and replaced a madman with a drunk and tyrant (Tywin) on his shoulder. If Rhaegar had lived and taken the throne from his father (as was likely planned), Westeros wouldn't have gone down the shitter.
She definitely hated him LONG before this, but this is definitely the moment that Cersei wasn't having it anymore with Robert. Hearing his lament for a woman that's been dead for years made her snap. Even in her grave, Lyanna Stark's lies and selfishness messed with the lives of so many other characters. The misery she inflicted onto Ned's life, Elia's family, Robert, you can go on and on.
“How much of our earth has been wet by blood because of jealousy! And at the end of life, what does it all matter? We grow old and the young look at us and can never see that once we made a kingdom ring for love.” -Bernard Cornwell, The Winter King
@TheNorth Remembers Well, im not really sure, but she was betrothed to him, to the man that almost every girl in the seven kingdoms wanted, and i understand that she didnt love him, so she, aware of her duty, choosed to ignore it, and because of that, her father and her brother died, Elia Martel and her whole family went through horrible things, thousands died after, and Ned had to live with sacrifice because of it.
Robert admitting he can’t even remember what Lyanna Stark looks like is the second saddest part of this entire series. The saddest part is she didn’t even love him.
Robert "wanted" her. He idealised her. He also wanted her because it'd bring him closer to Ned, a brother he never had. She'd tie Ned to him. Robert wasn't a fan of his own brothers. He tried to join his house to Ned's again when in the crypts he suggested they should marry their children and join their families. Robert never really knew Lyanna, so it's safe to say he didn't actually love her. Just the idea of her. It was more about the wants. That being said, sometimes I see people saying Robert wasn't a good guy and Lyanna deserved someone better like "Rhaegar." And that Lyanna told Ned at some point that Robert would never stop whoring and be unfaithful to her. Yes, Robert was very flawed but the guy she chose over him was the embodiment of scum. Left his children and wife for another woman so what Lyanna told Ned is pretty hypocritical and backfires.
No, the saddest part is that Robert was so in love with the idea of a woman he barely knew that he couldn't even entertain the idea of loving the woman he took as his wife.
They were always good at small scenes and characters. Arya and Tywin are a good example of that. They're bad at plotting and pulling things together and conclusions.
What ? Yeah you’re one of those Game of Thrones apologists that defend the men who destroyed an almost decade long series in a matter of a few hours of episodes. The men who denied more episodes/seasons because they got bored of it. Look up what they said at the Austin film festival. You can’t defend this shit.
@Abdulla Madjoub No I'd say they're good showrunners and good at small character driven scenes. Writing a season long plot is beyond them when they don't have source material to draw from (although they did also shoot themselves in the foot with the some of the material they did have)
Although I do hate Cersei (and everyone knows she deserves a lot of hatred) I can't help but feel the tiniest pang of empathy for her here. She never even had a chance for a happy marriage because her husband was still in love with a ghost.
while she was in love with her brother jaime? she never gave king robert any children (on purpose) he may have slept with other women openly but she was secretly having sex with her brother even after she married the king you think if he had been faithful and not continue to love lyanna cersei wouldve been a good wife to him? i think not...
SuperGiantRobot Rocket Well when Cersei had that conversation with Ned about "playing the game of thrones", Cersei said at some point about Robert that "Every girl in the Seven Kingdoms dreamed of him, but he was mine by oath.And when I finally saw him on our wedding day in the Sept of Baelor, lean and fierce and black-bearded, it was the happiest moment of my life." So I guess maybe at some point she would have gave up on Jamie, she even says in this scene that she once loved Robert/had feelings for him. So maybe, but just maybe, if they would have had a healthy relationship Jamie would have disappeared from the picture for her.
thesuntrider Yes, but I am saying that maybe afterwards she would have been capable of giving up on Jamie... not in the instant they got married, but afterwards, if they would have had a healthy relationship.
This love story is very interesting, actually. Cersei loved Rhaegar. Robert loved Lyanna. But Rhaegar wanted Lyanna, and Cersei had to marry with the one who killed Rhaegar. Goddam GRRM...
The saddest thing about Robert is that he didn't *really* love Lyanna. He was in love with the idea of Lyanna. Robert barely even knew her. Canonically, he met her once before they were betrothed and even that one time he barely spent any time getting to know her. For him, she was just a construct of everything he idealized in a wife, and a way to make his best friend and the only man he ever truly cared about (Ned) his brother by marriage. He kept telling himself he loved her until he believed it, because it was an easy way for him to explain away his own vices and faults. He's a drunk because he lost the love of his life. He's unfaithful because Cersei can never live up to Lyanna. He skirts his duty as king because becoming king meant nothing when he lost Lyanna. For Robert, subconsciously, his attachment to Lyanna Stark was a red herring to explain away all his deeply rooted problems and skirt his own failings as a king, a husband, and a person. He's really just a sad, miserable man who misses his best friend and stumbled into a kingship he never really wanted. Blaming it all on love lost is just a comfortable lie that he's spent so long telling others that he's begun to believe it himself.
In ways Robert Baratheon reminds me of Gaston from Beauty and the Beast... Loud, a temper, obsessed with looks, a hedonistic lifestyle and were so obsessed with woman that they only wanted for their beauty, didn't see the personality underneath and their obsession ultimately led to their own downfall.
@@smileandnodd For real. Anyone who doesn't admit the shit show that was season 7-8, isn't an actual enthusiast of the universe. It was some of the worst television I've ever watched, and it was so painful how they butchered the master piece that could've been. I'll never forget or forgive how the piece of shit show writers ditched this show and rushed the ending so they could run off and write for Star Wars
When Robert asks her, "Does that make you feel better or worse?" I think that Cersei's real answer inside her soul is "Better. I won't feel so bad about killing you now."
HelotOnWheels I think she meant what she said about feeling nothing. So she felt no remorse when she killed him, she wasn't relieved or guilty but out lioness feels nothing
I always thought she was lying about not feeling anything, maybe even to herself, going straight to the wine. I assume a situation like this would have prompted conflicting feelings. On one side, she probably felt better/relieved because she knew she never stood a chance and he’d just given her the reason to not feel guilty about killing him. On the other, I can’t imagine it would be pleasant to find out what Lyanna was to him. Being neglected by your husband because he’s still in love with a dead girl is sad enough, but finding out she wasn’t even important enough for him to remember what she looked like must make you feel even more worthless and insulted.
Elizabeth Grace I think he forgets what she looked like because it was so long ago and he’s been through so much. But you’re right, she was absolutely hurt by what he said. That’s the brilliance of Lena. Cersei is cold and brutal but her facial expressions and body language Lena uses is what shows how Cersei really feels and how vulnerable she really is.
Billie Dahling I’m sure that played a huge part, as did the alcohol. That said, I believe it was stated somewhere (maybe in the books) that Robert was betrothed to Lyanna, but knew her very little and had met her just a few times. That would imply that he was more in love with an idea of her than the actual person. I totally agree about Lena. It’s incredible what she did with Cersei, and some of her most poignant scenes really just rely on her expressiveness. Pretty sure that’s what gave Cersei much of her complexity, because there are so many things Lena’s able to convey through facial expressions that Cersei would never say out loud, and would therefore get completely lost.
@@EyebrowsGaming In a rather forced marriage between two people who'd rather not have it at all, it probably sucks knowing it makes the other person's life as miserable as yours.
Isn't this scene such proof that even in her grave, the shit and misery Lyanna Stark has caused to so many other lives because of her own reckless selfish behaviour is real. The lies Lyanna told took a brunt on the lives of Ned and Catelyn, both Cersei and Robert as well as Elia and her family.
One of my favorite scenes of the entire series. Gives you just the faintest idea that if circumstances had been different, these two could have made a decent couple. I also like that Robert doesn't come across as a blithering idiot. I simply think that once Lyanna was gone, he lost all purpose in life, stopped giving a single damn about anything, and just let himself go.
+Veggie Gamer I agree, this is one of my favorite scenes. It shows how Cersei became the way she is, dejected and somewhat aloof. And it's one of King Robert's most serious scenes - as the other commenter said, he doesn't come across as a drunk and a flippant leader. Definitely an under rated scene.
I must have missed this scene and it really gives a new light to their relationship. I used to think she just killed their baby because she always hated Robert but it turns out she was really sad about it. She wouldn't give up the baby's body. Giant strong young Robert had to hold her while another 3 men pried it from her. Really heartbreaking. I can see why she is so protective over Joffrey and Tommen now.
she was hopeful when she married Robert though she had expected that her crush Rhaegar was the king she would marry but young Robert was handsome, strong, manly and women loved him..and when they married she admitted it was the happiest moment of her life.. and she did feel for him once and the death of their son was a blow to her heart
I love the way, that in this scene. When Robert explains about the hole lyanna left behind and cersei looks at him. It looks like she is feeling actual empathy and emotion for him
Well, she was kind of in love with Robert, at least according to the tv show's storyline, so maybe she was actually moved by his words because she loved someone herself but could not truly have him (same thing if we consider her in love only with Jaime, as it is in the books). Anyway she made sure this was the one and only time she ever felt empathy for anybody, since she has been a gigantic bitch ever after...
She is very much capable of empathy. She wouldnt be cunning without it. Empathy and sympathy are different. She felt what Catelyn Stark felt about Bran and empathised. As a mother. That is the real tragedy of humanity. We know sometimes full well what we are doing and yet we do it anyway
it's even more interesting how she can feel down for a few seconds and then go back being the biggest son of a bitch she actually is. By way, amazing pic bro, have you ever read him?
I got my older brother hooked on Game of Thrones by showing him this scene alone. But the flip side was, he immediately felt sorry for Cersei and thought the audience was meant to root for her. I promptly showed him the first two episodes. He changed his mind about her really quickly.
+Bryan G I too used this scene to get a friend into the show. And Cersei is fairly sympathetic in the show. I haven't watched season 6 yet so don't spoil anything for me, but I can tell after what happened to her in the season 5 finale she'll unleash her wrath against the religious fanatics, and especially with Jaime coming back and the Mountain at her command and stronger than ever. I can't wait to see what goes down in season 6.
this is maybe the most human scene in this entire series. No white walkers, no giants, no dragons, no faceless men... Just two people with a marriage that was broken from the start, very clearly feeling empathy and understanding for each other for the first time, but because of their understanding they know that their empathy doesn't change a thing. Understanding each other, feeling each other's pain, doesn't necessarily mean that you can agree or get along.
This was the only scene over the entire shows run to bring a tear to my eye. I'd read the first book so this additional scene was a brilliant suprise. Honestly season 1 in general I'd say is my favourite season for having the most scenes like this one
Gotta give credit where credit is due. This scene is 100% the creation of the showrunners, it isnt in the books at all and it is maybe one of the best GoT scenes ever
They were pretty good at creating little side stories and characters to give the world more flavour while the main plot was guided by Martin. As soon as they took hold of the main plot as the show outran the books, things started going downhill, culminating in the disaster that is Season 8.
I actually preferred the absolute lack of respect they had for each other in the books where it felt like they wouldn’t even bare being in the same room together. It made Cersei seem so bitter and unwanted which humiliated her over and over again. But I agree that for the sake of television, it was important to somehow manifest a connection between them...
Yeah, Cersei’s hatred for Robert runs far deeper in the books. Which makes sense because in the books Robert would repeatedly rape her in the early years of their marriage, and when she confronted him about it, he blamed it on him drinking to much wine. She loathed him so much, the one time she got pregnant with his child she had an abortion and then after his death, ordered the murder of his bastards. So a scene like this happening in the books wouldn’t make sense, but it makes for good TV.
@@cwc5085 oh cersei murdered the bastards? Wow. See some early show changes I don't mind. To me these changes are equally as good as the book counterparts. But the most important thing about the change...is that its executed well. Equally meaningful and interesting. Some in Season 5 and 6 and pretty much everything that happens in 7 and 8 are hot garbage. Season 7 has a few good likes and some good scenes (despite how we got their being dumb). Season 8 only has a few action scenes that aren't dumb and then a few brief lines of simple yet decent dialogue sprinkled in the beginning.
Weird thing about this scene. This is one of, if not the only, time we see Cersei actually relaxed. No veil, no image, no airs or graces. Not even menace. Even her hair and garb seem at ease - maybe exhausted. Lena Headey is an incredible actress. This was a complex role to play, especially in the first season when subtlety was still a thing. A careful reminder that Cersei was a person once, and might have not degenerated into the monster she became. Gods the dialogue was strong back then.
I look at Cersei and Lena as 2 completely different entities. They look the same physically but at the same don't because the acting is that good if you get what I mean?
Agreed. I think, despite saying she didn't love Robert anymore and it was torture being married to him, I think she loved him deep down - not the way she loved Jaime, but in the way one might have a crush on the popular kid who had rejected you before, and can't get over them. He made her vulnerable, which never really suited her. But he was the one who haf the ability to do it. I think Robert was the only one who held power over her.
Doesnt matter if she loved him or not anymore, they were married for 18 years. He wasnt a complicated man, or a cruel man, simply uninterested with anything. It makes sense why Cercei would feel relaxed around her in a world where everyone is up to something. He is geniunely the only man that wouldnt use her words aganist him, nor she has anything to gain from trying to manipulate him.
How can it be fan service now whenever half the fans are criticising GoT for not getting what they wanted? That D&D are doing the opposite of giving the audience what they expected? That's the antithesis of fan service. Maybe I could understand that argument in S7, but not S8.
NoobSkillz Gaming If people want to argue that’s there’s fan service then I can try to see it, but not if at the same time the writers are getting slated for ruining the shower and not catering to fan’s expectations. The two criticisms contradict each other is all, one of them is probably truer than the other just trying to work out which 👍
"You want to know the horrible truth... I can't even remember what she looked like" hit me hard because alcohol makes you forget things like that. I know from experience.
that wasn't in the book. that was D&D. they are great writers who just got sick of the show and wanted to wrap it up so they could move on to other project.
This is the most perfect example of characters who are human. They've both done terrible things and yet they've got their hearts, weaknesses and such, and even admit them here with Robert addressing how he helped make Cersei so miserable, and later Cersei crying with Tyrion when she admits what a monster Joffrey is. It's such excellent writing.
Seriously it pisses me off when people say DND can't write worth shit without the books and this proves that they can write great scenes because this is not in the books.
@@cinemacola6398yes, but this is written based on the books. There is a main storyline, about war, fights, decisions. And all of it is written by Martin. And DND write side stories, scenes and characters, based on that main storyline. And they are good at it. But when they don't have basis, everything falls apart
Robert to Cersei: “I can’t even remember what she looked like. I only know she was the one thing I ever wanted”. (S01-E05) Maester Aemon to Sam: “I was in love once. […] I was very young. […] I could tell you everything about her, who she was, how we met, the color of her eyes and the shape of her nose. I can see her right in front of me; she’s more real than you are.” (S04-E09)
G. Sings.P well to be fair, Maester Aemon did go blind. One could imagine you might remember more if you were to never see something again. Whereas Robert has probably seen hundreds of women after.
This scene actually made me feel sympathy for Cersei. She was in love with a man who never wanted her, a man who preferred a dead woman instead of her, a man who never respected her during their marriage. No wonder why she became so bitter and cruel.
The one thing the show has over the books is how better Robert is in the show. We get incredible scenes and moments like this where they aren't in the first book. And Mark Addys performance is amazing
Exactly, Robert didn't love her and Rhaegar would have never loved her the way he loved Lyanna. She only ever really had Jaime because he understood her the most and was always there as they are siblings. Cercei never believed anyone could love her the way her brother did, so no wonder they had an incest relationship.
You want to know the horrible truth. I can't even remember a time when Game of Thrones had promise. I only knew that i wanted the final season to be the best one ever. Someone stole the white walkers, Jaime's redemption , Cerseis death and Daenerys away from me. And even Avengers Endgame couldn't fill the hole Game of Thrones Season 8 left behind.
“It doesn’t make me feel anything.” Of all the lies Cersei has told, that one breaks my heart. She wanted love, never got it. All she had was lust and duty. Now she has nothing.
I don’t think that was a lie. After 17 years, she truly is at the point where she just doesn’t care anymore. She has given up. She has tried to love him then tried to hurt him, but none of it worked. Eventually, it just stopped mattering to her. She’s only asking now to sate her curiosity.
I love Mark Addy's acting here. The second Cersei asks about Lyanna you can see the change in expression and body language. He's immediately uncomfortable because this is the first time that Cersei openly mentions this ghost causing a rift in their marriage for 17 years. By asking about Lyanna, Cersei is indirectly questioning him about his failures as a King, as a husband, as a person.
What's interesting here is that this scene makes it clear that Cersei and Robert's strained relationship is entirely his fault. Cersei is usually presented as the villain but she was the victim in this situation - made to marry a man she didn't know at a young age and while she did give a chance to love him, he never did the same for her.
Well it's not like he could choose to love her. Sure, the state of their marriage was lile 90% his fault, and he was a very, _very_ flawed man, but unlike her he wasn't cruel. Spiteful, yes, but not sadistic.
@@ysgramornorris2452 The problem was NOT his feelings, but his actions. Of course Robert couldn’t make himself love Cersei, but he could’ve chosen to at least treat her well and with some dignity. Instead, he was physically and mentally abusive to Cersei throughout the whole marriage; in this scene alone it is made very clear Robert drank and whored his sorrows away from the very beginning, all the while knowing damn well Cersei cared for him and was hurting. The books also states Robert raped Cersei repeatedly in the early years of the marriage, but put the blame on the alcohol when confronted by her. Pain is not an excuse to be a dick. Ned and Catelyn weren’t in love when they were wed. As a matter of fact, Catelyn was still in love with Brandon and mourning him, whereas Ned had lost his entire family in one swoop. To further complicate things, there was already a “bastard” between them. But unlike Robert, Ned actually tried to make an effort to be a good, respectful husband, and, in turn, Catelyn opened up to him. Their marriage survived because they WORKED on it. Robert already had the advantage of Cersei being into him from the get go, and instead of trying to be a good husband, he did everything in his power to push her away. Sure, maybe he would never be in LOVE with her, and maybe Cersei would eventually go back to being obsessed with her brother, but a civil relationship sure as hell would have been a better situation for both (and the entire realm) than the fuckery that actually took place.
@@ysgramornorris2452 At least he could not be drunk while laying in bed with her and don’t insult her laying with many women while her own brother was guarding.
Always preferred Robert in the show as he had no point of view chapters in the book. Mark Addy was a perfect cast and scenes like this and the war stories gave Robert so much more depth.
Wow, Cersei actually being a human. Her conversation with Robert was amazing, cause it shows that under all that anger and hatred, she can feel genuine love for someone.
Just some top notch dialogue and two fantastic actors. Addy's subtle shame when she tells him she felt something for him once, that quiet little "I know" is brief, but says a world about the deep seeded regret Robert has about how he's treated his wife, and choices he's made.
Honestly, one could make the argument THIS was the most incredible scene in GOTs. There was just something so earnest about their talk. Both crushingly sad and liberating.
I’m reading the books now for the first time, and I genuinely feel that this is the only addition to the show that I wished was in the book. It just does such a fantastic job of characterizing the relationship between Robert and Cersei. That said, their relationship in the books and the TV show, is quite different, so I doubt it would have worked. I actually like their dynamic in the show (and Robert’s character generally) far better in the show, personally.
And the sad thing is Robert would've never been happy with Lyanna either, he was never in love with Lyanna herself so much as he was in love with the memory of her, of what could have been. Robert was a player, always had been, the fire and passion that made him such a great warrior was the same thing that made him a terrible King and Husband. He might have tried for awhile to be faithful but in the end he would've cheated on her too
In the first book in Neds point of view, he said Lyanna didn't want to be with Robert because she knew how he was and she knew he already had a Bastard daughter and that even if he did truly love her that love doesn't change a man's nature. So I agree he would've eventually cheated on her too.
Plus Lyanna wasn't in love with him nor did she want him. Cersei at least wanted Robert but was disappointed and disillusioned after years of lovelessness. There was never going to be a happy ending for Robert regardless.
A lot of people, both the characters in the show itself and the people who watch it, say Robert is a fool for acting the way he did with all the drinking and debauchery. He wasn’t a fool, he just didn’t care.
Powerful scene. You can hear deep sadness in his voice when he told her about the horrible truth. It's a great line, delivered in great acting on Mark Addy's part.
"Doesn't make me feel anything." But if you pay attention to her eyes, you notice that she lies, trying hard to pretend, she really doesn't care, so Robert doesn't catch her weakness. Such strong acting in this scene, from both actors! One of the best scenes in the entire series to me.
"What harm could Lyanna Stark's ghost do to either of us, that we haven't done to each other a hundred times over?" Oh, I don't know, maybe secretly married Rhaegar Targaryen and had a child with him, who would have a better claim to the throne than any of your children combined.
"I felt something for you once, you know... Even after we lost our first boy... it took quite awhile actually." Music Kicks in. You feel a lot of empathy for Cersei even though you hate her. That's great writing.
TAZY In the books Cersei would drink moon tea whenever the time of conception would have seen the baby to have been Robert's child, so she could only have Jaime's, though, it was never specified she had this child in the novels. This scene was filmed after the first season was in post-production, because they didn't something to fill time, so the David & Dan with the help of George wrote this. I think this might of been one of the many things he said he wanted to include in the books but had to cut because of how long the original manuscript was. However, in the television series, it's believed she did actively seek means of not getting pregnant with Robert's child, but there was a slip up with whom's she thought it was. Many fans theorize that it was Jaime whom had the babe killed, but Cersei grew to love him before his death despite his parentage.
Their first born was Gendry (so he isn't a bastard, just like Jon isn't) That's gonna be the next big twist I reckon so he will have more right to sit on the Iron Throne than anyone alive 😉
Except in the books Cercei was in love with Rhaegar, didn't like Robert, and abort their first child out of spite because he had called her Lyana's name
I love this scene so much, it has to be one of my favourites in the entire show and that’s hard to pick - The lines “I can’t even remember what she looked like” and “And seven kingdoms couldn’t fill the hole she left behind” - I’ve had quite a few loved ones die in my life and I’m only 25, I lost most of them to cancer over 10 years ago and that line really hits home - those lines are probably the most accurate descriptions of grief and loss you’ll ever hear. - it’s been so long since they died and so long since I last saw them I have trouble remembering their faces Those of you reading this and if you haven’t experienced it - You’ll understand one day
This is why people loved game of thrones.. The interactions between characters, powerful Dilougs, amazing depth to backstories, the grey area of human nature.... Not the bloody dragons or expensive battles hell the first three seasons had only one major battle scene and still they were the best... Sure dragons and huge battles are amazing but these scenes were the stuff which attracted such vast audience
even though lyanna probably was not in love with him I feel for Robert. loving someone beyond reason ... is never healthy ... it makes you very vulnerable. The never ending pain of not being able to be with that person slowly destroys you ... no wonder he failed at ruling ...
What a tremendous scene between Lena Headey and Mark Addy. Wonderful talent. I feel his heartache every time I see this. I wish we would have seen more of the complex and deep character Robert Baratheon was (fingers crossed for some origin prequels). And Lena does an outstanding job in this performance showing the loving and perhaps, dare I say, innocent side she once had. It feels so genuine and so painful. I loved the exchanges like this between these actors. They never disappoint.
The interesting thing about it is, that this scene isn't even in the books, but it's one of the best written scenes of this season. They WERE able to write brilliantly and empathically... Wonder what actually happened.......
I have heard that the show runners wants to get the show over and done as soon as possible by that point in order to have a chance at one of the Star Wars movies. They ended up not being chosen, so their decision backfired.
Hearing that Cersei loved Robert at some point is really sad, if he had just let go of that grief he could’ve actually been happy with her and raised his own kids
Another point given that context: I think this is the reason Cersei does show something of a soft spot for Sansa. She sees herself in her. A young woman betrothed to a would-be king, who doesn't realize the monster within their object of affection.
I thought this scene made Robert seem delusional. It's clear that he was only ever in love with the idea of a woman who had zero interest in him. Lol. It's like hearing someone cry about an unrequited crush from high school 20 years ago. Super unrealistic.
@@orochimaru527, i mean, S2-S4 also have equally strong writing and character development. I’d say S1’s strongest attribute compared to those seasons is the pacing and the way the story slowly unfolds. Plus the smaller scale of S1 allowed each plotline to get an equally strong amount of needed screentime
In the books it is even sadder, as Cersei genuinely liked Robert in the beginning but felt betrayed when on their first wedding night together Robert mentioned Lyanna's name.
The way Cersei gulps down her pain with wine when Robert said "No". The way she keeps a straight face & leaves!! This show is one off the best for all time for a reason.❤❤ Such powerful performances!
this is in my opinion the greatest piece of dialogue in all of tv history.. the acting, writing, emotion, lighting, impact, heartbreaking realness.. it all ties into a masterpiece that i haven't seen anywhere else.. everything is perfect in every aspect
Perhaps one of the finest examples of a masterfully crafted scene, the writing, the dialogue, the lighting, the delivery, the direction and how much it contributes insight to the two characters who are hopelessly imperfect in their lives. I guess one of the points the scene tries to make is that even in an imagined and fantastical world like Westeros characters are only humans whose actions are the result of their struggle driven past and failures, regrets, anger, spite are all the basest human emotions which define our lives. A brilliant and profound piece of storytelling.
TheUndyingCrystal The constant stress of financial woes is enough for someone suffering from depression to end it all, it's often the catalyst in fact.
Someone's said it here before, but compare this to what Maester Aemon says in a later scene. Aemon can picture his beloved clearly, even after so many years, because he genuinely loved her. Robert cannot remember Lyanna's face because it was mere infatuation
One of my favourite show-only additions. Such a shame that the writers were unable of recreating the magic in the later seasons. In just a few short minutes, we're given more insight into Robert and Cersei's complex, naunced relationship than we ever did in the books, elevated of course by Lena and Mark's incredible acting.
The subtle foreshadowing here about Robert’s death is done masterfully. “17 years is quite a long time.” I think Cersei already started planning his death. Hence why she wanted to talk about Lyanna. She wouldn’t have gotten another chance.
While I think she's always had the idea in the back of her mind, as a contingency plan if nothing else, it's more likely she acted on it once Ned started snooping around and eventually discovered the truth about her and Jaime. By then, it was do or die.
@@enderman_666 Exactly, she had no choice if she wanted to live, in the show at least. In the book it is suggested she had tried to get him put in situations were the possibility of him being killed. When he was going to participate in a jousting for Ned's tournament. Cersei forbade him from participating thus causing him to against her "wishes", which is what she wanted. He was out of shape so he would likely lose. Ned had to talk him out of participating. However, from her perspective she REALLY had to actively end his life after Ned informed her of his knowledge. Apparently she had to kill him sooner than what she would have preferred, bit the idea was always there. In the show this particular scene inadvertently made her choice to kill him a lot more easier as she had no qualms about doing. But I am not sure if Robert telling her that he did feel for her would have changed anything.
Cersei would have been way better had Robert been nice to her and loved her, or at least given their relationship a chance, although I despise Cersei, I can't imagine the pain she must have gone through with Robert, she was already being treated like a piece of meat by tywin, marrying her off to the highest lord to make an alliance ,I mean she's no saint but she did have a difficult life
@@TTUploads Cersei in the books and Cersei in the show are very different. George Martin had been talking about this when filming for the first season was just about to begin. He wrote about it on his blog. They chose Lena Headey because she could show Cersei more human than she was in the books. This was the plan of Martin and the showrunners from the beginning. So Cersei didn't kill her friend on the show.
I absolutely love this scene. The emotions are so raw....so real. It really flushes out the characters, especially Robert. How on the surface he appears to have the world at his finger tips.. He was always a desirable person, strong, charismatic, good looking, aristocrat, good friends/allies etc. and now he's king, gets his choice of women, drinks and parties at his leisure. But you realize that he's a hedonist because he's trying to heal from something that won't go away: the pain left behind from the death of the women he loved. 7 kingdoms couldn't fill the void she left behind. Bravo! great acting and writing
It's a great scene. They make a very good job of it, and there's a certain tenderness to the honesty, even though they don't love each other, there's an openness that's quite wholesome in a strange way.
The best non-book scene of the entire series. It’s so stunningly good and insightful to both of these characters it’s one that I’ve taken as canonical book, despite not being in the books.
This was both the first and last one-on-one scene these two shared together, and yet so much history was shaded in. You feel like you watched their entire relationship in this one scene.
Robert didn't even know Lyanna, he was projecting a lot onto her. The "one thing he ever wanted" was someone he barely knew, and had idealized. And then he lost her and then "seven kingdoms couldn't fill the hole she left behind". Robert never had her, nor before her death, nor after. Robert was never whole. The king of Westeros was just a miserable man his entire life.
This is one of the best changes they made to Robert’s character. It helps give him a little more debt, and wipes away whatever thoughts Ned had of him and his sister. Throughout Ned’s chapters, he often wonders if Robert actually loved Lyanna for who she was, or simply because she was beautiful. Ned even wonders wonders if Robert’s whoring would have ended, or even begun had his sister lived to be his wife. I love how the show makes it abundantly clear how much Robert truly loved her. Every time she’s brought up, he transforms from the stubborn king he’s known to be, to a broken man still hopelessly in love with a woman he can never have.
@@spanishflea634 I think this version of Robert deeply loved her. The book and the show are two completely different beasts. You can see how her her death still haunts him. In the book, Robert often said that he loved her, but we never really got any deep emotional scenes like this to really hammer that in. I kinda agree with Book Ned, that had she lived, Robert still would have been unfaithful to her.
I love that pause between Cersei’s asking Robert if there was ever a chance for them to work things out and Robert’s “no”. Like…he knows the truth would crush Cersei and he doesn’t want to hurt her but is ultimately forced to say it because it’s the first time they’ve ever been honest with each other.
The way this scene makes you feel, the way it paints a picture of how incredibly rich this world was and currently is. I miss that feeling, the dialog was everything in this show.
I think he's 14, so is Robb Stark. Sansa is 11 and Arya 9, Bran 7 and Rickon 3 or 4. Why even Dany herself is only 13 going on 14 at the beginning of the books. Much of the characters in this show are aged up. For example the adults like Ned and Cat and so on are in their early 30s. One can reconcile this by acknowledging that years may be longer in the ASOIAF universe. But that's just a theory.
Robert remembers his first kill so vividly down to minor details but cant even recall the woman he “loved”s face. He was a bloodhungry warrior not a lover.
'What harm could Lyanna Stark's ghost do to either of us?' It's called Jon Snow.
@★ Froggie Animation ★ what he meant was that Jon Snow was the rightful heir to the throne
Even in the grave, scenes like this are the living proof of the absolute misery Lyanna and Rhaegar's behaviour and selfishness endowed to so many other lives. They messed with nearly everyone. Robert, Elia and her family, Lyanna got her own father and brother killed, and the sacrifices she forced Ned to live with.
@@heyheyheyheyheyhey76 Would you say Robb Stark and Talisa were selfish or would you say the Freys were absolute dipshits who broke guest-right and oaths to their overlords because the Lannisters paid more? Because Robb and Lyanna essentially did the same thing, broke a betrothal for which the medieval custom was to make financial reparation to the injured side.
Lyanna was an idea for Robert. She didn't love him because he was already whoring around.
I don't think Robert knew Lyanna that well. She was an idea for him- pretty, his bestfriend's sister. In his head he thinks about Cersei's sharpness and thinks he would have been happier with Lyanna, but she wouldn't have been a pliant submissive wife either. Remember Ned compares Arya to her aunt. Lyanna Stark was no lady, she was the Knight of the Laughing Tree & she was disillusioned with Robert's playboy ways. Yes, even before Lyanna dies, Robert was whoring around. When Catelyn goes to the Vale, she meets one of his bastards there.
The war happened because Aerys was mad. If he was sane, he would have made reparations to the Baratheon house for a broken betrothal- there are precedents of this in Targaryen history when the children of Jaeherys broke the engagements he made for them - Baratheon was one of the houses- and the king paid them to make up for the insult. So Lyanna & Rhaegar might have Robb Stark level impulsive, but I don't see anyone call Robb selfish the way they call Lyanna selfish.
The war happened because Aerys burned Torrhen and Brandon and asked for the heads of Robert & Ned from Jon Arryn who was fostering them in the vale. Yes, Robert was sitting in the Vale after Lyanna was 'taken' and rebelled only after Aerys asked for his head.
Stop blaming war on them.
@@RuchiraRambles Would you say Robb Stark and Talisa were selfish?? Yes, completelly, he was an ashole too, if i was one of his soldiers and i had to watch my whole family die only because the man i followed broke his promise, i would be very angry... He could have married to that girls and then going through divorce ONCE EVERYTHING HAD HAPPENED... he could even keep fucking Talisa in secret, but he did the only thing he didn´t had to do, breaking that promise...
We don´t know how Robert would have been if he had married with Lyanna, maybe he would have stopped whoring, maybe not, maybe he wouldn´t be a drunk fat ass, maybe he would have been anyway, but we don´t know that...
And tecnically, yes, the war started because of king Aerys and because he didn´t handled things right, but if Lyanna and Rhaegar hadn´t escaped, the war wouldn´t started... So tecnically, they are in a way responsable for the war (even though anyone would have reblled to Aerys later, that was a matter of time)...
Too bad he dun whun ih
Someone took her away from me, and seven kingdoms couldn't fill the hole she left behind.
Man that gave me tears.
I lost the most important woman in my life, when it gets too much I watch this scene everytime. I feel Roberts pain one hundred percent!
Robert was betrothed to her, but she preferred Rhaegar, while Rhaegar, betrothed to Elia Martell, preferred Lyanna. Bitterness drove an outlandish lie that he kidnapped and raped her, and thus a rebellion that unseated the Targaryens and replaced a madman with a drunk and tyrant (Tywin) on his shoulder.
If Rhaegar had lived and taken the throne from his father (as was likely planned), Westeros wouldn't have gone down the shitter.
She definitely hated him LONG before this, but this is definitely the moment that Cersei wasn't having it anymore with Robert. Hearing his lament for a woman that's been dead for years made her snap. Even in her grave, Lyanna Stark's lies and selfishness messed with the lives of so many other characters. The misery she inflicted onto Ned's life, Elia's family, Robert, you can go on and on.
“How much of our earth has been wet by blood because of jealousy! And at the end of life, what does it all matter? We grow old and the young look at us and can never see that once we made a kingdom ring for love.” -Bernard Cornwell, The Winter King
@TheNorth Remembers Well, im not really sure, but she was betrothed to him, to the man that almost every girl in the seven kingdoms wanted, and i understand that she didnt love him, so she, aware of her duty, choosed to ignore it, and because of that, her father and her brother died, Elia Martel and her whole family went through horrible things, thousands died after, and Ned had to live with sacrifice because of it.
Robert admitting he can’t even remember what Lyanna Stark looks like is the second saddest part of this entire series. The saddest part is she didn’t even love him.
The fact that he didn't remember what she looked like meant that he never loved her AT ALL.
@@angelikacalangi5820 That's not true, his abuse of alcohol and depression could've been what made his mind foggy enough to forget her face.
Robert "wanted" her. He idealised her. He also wanted her because it'd bring him closer to Ned, a brother he never had. She'd tie Ned to him. Robert wasn't a fan of his own brothers. He tried to join his house to Ned's again when in the crypts he suggested they should marry their children and join their families.
Robert never really knew Lyanna, so it's safe to say he didn't actually love her. Just the idea of her. It was more about the wants.
That being said, sometimes I see people saying Robert wasn't a good guy and Lyanna deserved someone better like "Rhaegar." And that Lyanna told Ned at some point that Robert would never stop whoring and be unfaithful to her. Yes, Robert was very flawed but the guy she chose over him was the embodiment of scum. Left his children and wife for another woman so what Lyanna told Ned is pretty hypocritical and backfires.
No, the saddest part is that Robert was so in love with the idea of a woman he barely knew that he couldn't even entertain the idea of loving the woman he took as his wife.
@@eingrica3270 Why should he have fallen in love with a woman he never wanted to marry in the first place? It was political, nothing more.
How are the writers no longer capable of writing dialogue like this? This wasn't even in the books and it's amazing.
They were always good at small scenes and characters. Arya and Tywin are a good example of that. They're bad at plotting and pulling things together and conclusions.
george rr martin probably wrote it. i refuse to believe these two guys can come up a good line.
What ? Yeah you’re one of those Game of Thrones apologists that defend the men who destroyed an almost decade long series in a matter of a few hours of episodes. The men who denied more episodes/seasons because they got bored of it. Look up what they said at the Austin film festival. You can’t defend this shit.
@Abdulla Madjoub No I'd say they're good showrunners and good at small character driven scenes. Writing a season long plot is beyond them when they don't have source material to draw from (although they did also shoot themselves in the foot with the some of the material they did have)
Because it was George R. R. Martin's writing they were utilizing.
They are incapable of doing anything on their own.
Although I do hate Cersei (and everyone knows she deserves a lot of hatred) I can't help but feel the tiniest pang of empathy for her here. She never even had a chance for a happy marriage because her husband was still in love with a ghost.
while she was in love with her brother jaime? she never gave king robert any children (on purpose) he may have slept with other women openly but she was secretly having sex with her brother even after she married the king you think if he had been faithful and not continue to love lyanna cersei wouldve been a good wife to him? i think not...
SuperGiantRobot Rocket Well when Cersei had that conversation with Ned about "playing the game of thrones", Cersei said at some point about Robert that "Every girl in the Seven Kingdoms dreamed of him, but he was mine by oath.And when I finally saw him on our wedding day in the Sept of Baelor, lean and fierce and black-bearded, it was the happiest moment of my life." So I guess maybe at some point she would have gave up on Jamie, she even says in this scene that she once loved Robert/had feelings for him. So maybe, but just maybe, if they would have had a healthy relationship Jamie would have disappeared from the picture for her.
Drisina7 She slept with Jaime on the wedding night...
thesuntrider Yes, but I am saying that maybe afterwards she would have been capable of giving up on Jamie... not in the instant they got married, but afterwards, if they would have had a healthy relationship.
This love story is very interesting, actually.
Cersei loved Rhaegar. Robert loved Lyanna. But Rhaegar wanted Lyanna, and Cersei had to marry with the one who killed Rhaegar. Goddam GRRM...
The saddest thing about Robert is that he didn't *really* love Lyanna. He was in love with the idea of Lyanna. Robert barely even knew her. Canonically, he met her once before they were betrothed and even that one time he barely spent any time getting to know her. For him, she was just a construct of everything he idealized in a wife, and a way to make his best friend and the only man he ever truly cared about (Ned) his brother by marriage. He kept telling himself he loved her until he believed it, because it was an easy way for him to explain away his own vices and faults. He's a drunk because he lost the love of his life. He's unfaithful because Cersei can never live up to Lyanna. He skirts his duty as king because becoming king meant nothing when he lost Lyanna.
For Robert, subconsciously, his attachment to Lyanna Stark was a red herring to explain away all his deeply rooted problems and skirt his own failings as a king, a husband, and a person. He's really just a sad, miserable man who misses his best friend and stumbled into a kingship he never really wanted. Blaming it all on love lost is just a comfortable lie that he's spent so long telling others that he's begun to believe it himself.
Are you a psychologist or just a good observador?
@@xzukax3882 just a really true, deep fan
Oooh that is GOOD. Write a book!
Yes please write a book!
Really wish I could see more comments like this under GOT videos instead of the 1 million “Season 8 bad” comments I usually find.
these scenes are like therapy for me after the shitshow we got with season 8.
Yeah when George r r Martin was helping with the writing and dialogue before he left the series, these were some amazing scenes
In ways Robert Baratheon reminds me of Gaston from Beauty and the Beast... Loud, a temper, obsessed with looks, a hedonistic lifestyle and were so obsessed with woman that they only wanted for their beauty, didn't see the personality underneath and their obsession ultimately led to their own downfall.
Right? Back when the dialogue was powerful and not full of dick jokes. Fuck season 8.
@@smileandnodd For real. Anyone who doesn't admit the shit show that was season 7-8, isn't an actual enthusiast of the universe. It was some of the worst television I've ever watched, and it was so painful how they butchered the master piece that could've been. I'll never forget or forgive how the piece of shit show writers ditched this show and rushed the ending so they could run off and write for Star Wars
@@G5Nvm even season 5 and 6 are downgraded compared to the first 4 seasons. S7 and 8 are like a parody of the show
When Robert asks her, "Does that make you feel better or worse?" I think that Cersei's real answer inside her soul is "Better. I won't feel so bad about killing you now."
HelotOnWheels I think she meant what she said about feeling nothing. So she felt no remorse when she killed him, she wasn't relieved or guilty but out lioness feels nothing
I always thought she was lying about not feeling anything, maybe even to herself, going straight to the wine.
I assume a situation like this would have prompted conflicting feelings. On one side, she probably felt better/relieved because she knew she never stood a chance and he’d just given her the reason to not feel guilty about killing him. On the other, I can’t imagine it would be pleasant to find out what Lyanna was to him. Being neglected by your husband because he’s still in love with a dead girl is sad enough, but finding out she wasn’t even important enough for him to remember what she looked like must make you feel even more worthless and insulted.
HelotOnWheels I think that’s why she had this conversation, she was just confirming / validating her actions
Elizabeth Grace I think he forgets what she looked like because it was so long ago and he’s been through so much. But you’re right, she was absolutely hurt by what he said. That’s the brilliance of Lena. Cersei is cold and brutal but her facial expressions and body language Lena uses is what shows how Cersei really feels and how vulnerable she really is.
Billie Dahling I’m sure that played a huge part, as did the alcohol. That said, I believe it was stated somewhere (maybe in the books) that Robert was betrothed to Lyanna, but knew her very little and had met her just a few times. That would imply that he was more in love with an idea of her than the actual person.
I totally agree about Lena. It’s incredible what she did with Cersei, and some of her most poignant scenes really just rely on her expressiveness. Pretty sure that’s what gave Cersei much of her complexity, because there are so many things Lena’s able to convey through facial expressions that Cersei would never say out loud, and would therefore get completely lost.
"Was it ever possible for us? Was there ever a time, ever a moment?"
"No."
The feels. The acting between the two is powerful.
Robert looks genuinely sad about giving that answer. Not sorry, but sad that it's true.
@@EyebrowsGaming In a rather forced marriage between two people who'd rather not have it at all, it probably sucks knowing it makes the other person's life as miserable as yours.
Isn't this scene such proof that even in her grave, the shit and misery Lyanna Stark has caused to so many other lives because of her own reckless selfish behaviour is real. The lies Lyanna told took a brunt on the lives of Ned and Catelyn, both Cersei and Robert as well as Elia and her family.
It sucks also at the end when Robert refills his cup to drown out whatever pain.
@@heyheyheyheyheyhey76 Like Helen in Troy
One of my favorite scenes of the entire series. Gives you just the faintest idea that if circumstances had been different, these two could have made a decent couple. I also like that Robert doesn't come across as a blithering idiot. I simply think that once Lyanna was gone, he lost all purpose in life, stopped giving a single damn about anything, and just let himself go.
So glad someone else sees this as one of the best scenes. Most people I talk to don't even remember it.
+Veggie Gamer I agree, this is one of my favorite scenes. It shows how Cersei became the way she is, dejected and somewhat aloof. And it's one of King Robert's most serious scenes - as the other commenter said, he doesn't come across as a drunk and a flippant leader. Definitely an under rated scene.
I must have missed this scene and it really gives a new light to their relationship. I used to think she just killed their baby because she always hated Robert but it turns out she was really sad about it. She wouldn't give up the baby's body. Giant strong young Robert had to hold her while another 3 men pried it from her. Really heartbreaking. I can see why she is so protective over Joffrey and Tommen now.
Robert was a soldier. He was strong, tactical, and had enormous character, but he was definitely not cut out for leading an entire country.
she was hopeful when she married Robert though she had expected that her crush Rhaegar was the king she would marry but young Robert was handsome, strong, manly and women loved him..and when they married she admitted it was the happiest moment of her life.. and she did feel for him once and the death of their son was a blow to her heart
I love the way, that in this scene. When Robert explains about the hole lyanna left behind and cersei looks at him. It looks like she is feeling actual empathy and emotion for him
Well, she was kind of in love with Robert, at least according to the tv show's storyline, so maybe she was actually moved by his words because she loved someone herself but could not truly have him (same thing if we consider her in love only with Jaime, as it is in the books). Anyway she made sure this was the one and only time she ever felt empathy for anybody, since she has been a gigantic bitch ever after...
She is very much capable of empathy. She wouldnt be cunning without it. Empathy and sympathy are different. She felt what Catelyn Stark felt about Bran and empathised. As a mother. That is the real tragedy of humanity. We know sometimes full well what we are doing and yet we do it anyway
it's even more interesting how she can feel down for a few seconds and then go back being the biggest son of a bitch she actually is.
By way, amazing pic bro, have you ever read him?
@@rodrigomolano2151 The pic is Karl Marx and you'd do wise to stay clear of anything he's spewn out.
@@mcastel wasn't she in love with Robert for a time in the books as well? Until he shattered her
I got my older brother hooked on Game of Thrones by showing him this scene alone. But the flip side was, he immediately felt sorry for Cersei and thought the audience was meant to root for her. I promptly showed him the first two episodes.
He changed his mind about her really quickly.
Ahah, unbelievable! :D
+Syryu Cersei is definitely a lot more sympathetic in the show than she ever was in the books, until last season at least.
+Bryan G I too used this scene to get a friend into the show. And Cersei is fairly sympathetic in the show. I haven't watched season 6 yet so don't spoil anything for me, but I can tell after what happened to her in the season 5 finale she'll unleash her wrath against the religious fanatics, and especially with Jaime coming back and the Mountain at her command and stronger than ever. I can't wait to see what goes down in season 6.
i rooted for cersei until season 7 finale
I don’t want her to die
this is maybe the most human scene in this entire series. No white walkers, no giants, no dragons, no faceless men... Just two people with a marriage that was broken from the start, very clearly feeling empathy and understanding for each other for the first time, but because of their understanding they know that their empathy doesn't change a thing. Understanding each other, feeling each other's pain, doesn't necessarily mean that you can agree or get along.
So true
This was the only scene over the entire shows run to bring a tear to my eye. I'd read the first book so this additional scene was a brilliant suprise. Honestly season 1 in general I'd say is my favourite season for having the most scenes like this one
Gotta give credit where credit is due.
This scene is 100% the creation of the showrunners, it isnt in the books at all and it is maybe one of the best GoT scenes ever
They were pretty good at creating little side stories and characters to give the world more flavour while the main plot was guided by Martin. As soon as they took hold of the main plot as the show outran the books, things started going downhill, culminating in the disaster that is Season 8.
Interesting. I never would have guessed. Great work
I actually preferred the absolute lack of respect they had for each other in the books where it felt like they wouldn’t even bare being in the same room together. It made Cersei seem so bitter and unwanted which humiliated her over and over again. But I agree that for the sake of television, it was important to somehow manifest a connection between them...
Yeah, Cersei’s hatred for Robert runs far deeper in the books. Which makes sense because in the books Robert would repeatedly rape her in the early years of their marriage, and when she confronted him about it, he blamed it on him drinking to much wine.
She loathed him so much, the one time she got pregnant with his child she had an abortion and then after his death, ordered the murder of his bastards. So a scene like this happening in the books wouldn’t make sense, but it makes for good TV.
@@cwc5085 oh cersei murdered the bastards? Wow. See some early show changes I don't mind. To me these changes are equally as good as the book counterparts. But the most important thing about the change...is that its executed well. Equally meaningful and interesting. Some in Season 5 and 6 and pretty much everything that happens in 7 and 8 are hot garbage. Season 7 has a few good likes and some good scenes (despite how we got their being dumb). Season 8 only has a few action scenes that aren't dumb and then a few brief lines of simple yet decent dialogue sprinkled in the beginning.
Weird thing about this scene. This is one of, if not the only, time we see Cersei actually relaxed. No veil, no image, no airs or graces. Not even menace. Even her hair and garb seem at ease - maybe exhausted.
Lena Headey is an incredible actress. This was a complex role to play, especially in the first season when subtlety was still a thing. A careful reminder that Cersei was a person once, and might have not degenerated into the monster she became.
Gods the dialogue was strong back then.
Nice reference to Robet's conversation with Ned in your last sentence. :)
I look at Cersei and Lena as 2 completely different entities. They look the same physically but at the same don't because the acting is that good if you get what I mean?
Agreed. I think, despite saying she didn't love Robert anymore and it was torture being married to him, I think she loved him deep down - not the way she loved Jaime, but in the way one might have a crush on the popular kid who had rejected you before, and can't get over them. He made her vulnerable, which never really suited her. But he was the one who haf the ability to do it. I think Robert was the only one who held power over her.
Doesnt matter if she loved him or not anymore, they were married for 18 years. He wasnt a complicated man, or a cruel man, simply uninterested with anything. It makes sense why Cercei would feel relaxed around her in a world where everyone is up to something. He is geniunely the only man that wouldnt use her words aganist him, nor she has anything to gain from trying to manipulate him.
Who wrote season 8, some halfwit with a stutter?
Back when Game of Thrones had well-written scenes instead of fan service retcons.
it's fucked up
Couldn't express my feelings better!
How can it be fan service now whenever half the fans are criticising GoT for not getting what they wanted? That D&D are doing the opposite of giving the audience what they expected? That's the antithesis of fan service. Maybe I could understand that argument in S7, but not S8.
@@MullanMedia96 Dude look at arya's plot armor
NoobSkillz Gaming If people want to argue that’s there’s fan service then I can try to see it, but not if at the same time the writers are getting slated for ruining the shower and not catering to fan’s expectations. The two criticisms contradict each other is all, one of them is probably truer than the other just trying to work out which 👍
"Someone took her away from me, and seven kingdoms couldn't fill the hole she left behind..."
That always gets me...
"You want to know the horrible truth... I can't even remember what she looked like" hit me hard because alcohol makes you forget things like that. I know from experience.
He was in love of the idea of been in love. He doesnt even really know her... He saw her once or twice only.
that wasn't in the book. that was D&D. they are great writers who just got sick of the show and wanted to wrap it up so they could move on to other project.
@@neonfox3 And trauma - dissociation becomes your best friend
The way Mark Addy delivered the line was incredible
This is the most perfect example of characters who are human. They've both done terrible things and yet they've got their hearts, weaknesses and such, and even admit them here with Robert addressing how he helped make Cersei so miserable, and later Cersei crying with Tyrion when she admits what a monster Joffrey is. It's such excellent writing.
peachjedi What terrible thing did robert do exactly?
Seriously it pisses me off when people say DND can't write worth shit without the books and this proves that they can write great scenes because this is not in the books.
Redwolf 19k raped her, cheated on her, beaten her, etc
@@cinemacola6398yes, but this is written based on the books. There is a main storyline, about war, fights, decisions. And all of it is written by Martin. And DND write side stories, scenes and characters, based on that main storyline. And they are good at it. But when they don't have basis, everything falls apart
Wasn't to sure about Mark Addy at first, but then he did this scene and BAM..... excellent work
I was doubtful as well, he didn't strike me as the strong warrior Robert was, but, as you said, he's done a great work!
Michele Castelluzzo is this scene there in books?
Nope, there isn't any scene of Robert and Cersei alone, as neither of them is a POV character in the first book.
Probebly happend tho at some point
Mark Addy/Robert still is one of my favourite characters on the series.
The acting by Mark Addy here is amazing, "Seven Kingdoms couldn't fill the hole she left behind." Gets me everytime.
Robert to Cersei: “I can’t even remember what she looked like. I only know she
was the one thing I ever wanted”. (S01-E05)
Maester Aemon to Sam: “I was in love once. […] I was very young. […] I could tell you
everything about her, who she was, how we met, the color of her eyes and the shape of her nose. I can see her right in front of me; she’s more real than you are.” (S04-E09)
G. Sings.P well to be fair, Maester Aemon did go blind.
One could imagine you might remember more if you were to never see something again.
Whereas Robert has probably seen hundreds of women after.
Gudwell Aemon became blind because of his old age..he wasn't always blind...pretty sure he's seen fair amount of women..
Aemon probably didn't get drunk as fuck every single day.
Inevitable Yeah, getting lost in barrels and barrels of wine can probably addle the memory.
Yeah you see how good your memory is after drinking yourself into an early coma every night.
This scene actually made me feel sympathy for Cersei. She was in love with a man who never wanted her, a man who preferred a dead woman instead of her, a man who never respected her during their marriage. No wonder why she became so bitter and cruel.
She was always bitter and cruel. They tell storesi about how horrid she was even as a child.
She was with Jamie all along
The one thing the show has over the books is how better Robert is in the show. We get incredible scenes and moments like this where they aren't in the first book. And Mark Addys performance is amazing
book readers can masturbate on their damn books and let viewers enjoy theirs.
Bring me the Breastplate stretcher!
It's the same thing with Viserys in House of the Dragon. There's more depth to the character thanks to the actor portraying him.
Even if Cersei had actually married Rhaegar, she would always be second to Lyanna Stark.
Damn that is true
Exactly, Robert didn't love her and Rhaegar would have never loved her the way he loved Lyanna. She only ever really had Jaime because he understood her the most and was always there as they are siblings. Cercei never believed anyone could love her the way her brother did, so no wonder they had an incest relationship.
@@IBeMelissa pretty sure Rhaegar did not love Lyanna. That was just something added in the show.
@@Khushi-Shah hurrr… rhaegar fled with llyana of course he loved her. They got married in secret nd jon snow is their son.
@@dysplasiaanaplasia4128 Lyanna was a breeding mule to Rheagar.
Robert was a drunken fool and Cersei was bitter, this scene effortless revealed their humane sides and I thought this was so brilliant.
Robert wasn’t a fool, he just didn’t care.
The way he said "I know", after she told him she had felt something for him at the beginning, he genuinely felt ashamed about what he had done to her.
You want to know the horrible truth.
I can't even remember a time when Game of Thrones had promise.
I only knew that i wanted the final season to be the best one ever.
Someone stole the white walkers, Jaime's redemption , Cerseis death and Daenerys away from me.
And even Avengers Endgame couldn't fill the hole Game of Thrones Season 8 left behind.
💯💯💯
😭
Lol avengers🤐
I personally think daenerys going mad was a brilliant conclusion just poorly fucking executed
But yeah the other stuff 100% agree
you are very much correct
“It doesn’t make me feel anything.” Of all the lies Cersei has told, that one breaks my heart. She wanted love, never got it. All she had was lust and duty. Now she has nothing.
But she died in the arms of the only man she ever loved. Her death should have been worse
Dude Jamie loved her.
@@md5820 Jamie was the lid she used to cover the hole in her heart.
@@junesmind7325 Never said she loved him. I said Jamie loved her.
I don’t think that was a lie. After 17 years, she truly is at the point where she just doesn’t care anymore. She has given up. She has tried to love him then tried to hurt him, but none of it worked. Eventually, it just stopped mattering to her. She’s only asking now to sate her curiosity.
I love Mark Addy's acting here. The second Cersei asks about Lyanna you can see the change in expression and body language. He's immediately uncomfortable because this is the first time that Cersei openly mentions this ghost causing a rift in their marriage for 17 years. By asking about Lyanna, Cersei is indirectly questioning him about his failures as a King, as a husband, as a person.
What's interesting here is that this scene makes it clear that Cersei and Robert's strained relationship is entirely his fault. Cersei is usually presented as the villain but she was the victim in this situation - made to marry a man she didn't know at a young age and while she did give a chance to love him, he never did the same for her.
Well it's not like he could choose to love her. Sure, the state of their marriage was lile 90% his fault, and he was a very, _very_ flawed man, but unlike her he wasn't cruel. Spiteful, yes, but not sadistic.
@@ysgramornorris2452 The problem was NOT his feelings, but his actions. Of course Robert couldn’t make himself love Cersei, but he could’ve chosen to at least treat her well and with some dignity. Instead, he was physically and mentally abusive to Cersei throughout the whole marriage; in this scene alone it is made very clear Robert drank and whored his sorrows away from the very beginning, all the while knowing damn well Cersei cared for him and was hurting. The books also states Robert raped Cersei repeatedly in the early years of the marriage, but put the blame on the alcohol when confronted by her.
Pain is not an excuse to be a dick. Ned and Catelyn weren’t in love when they were wed. As a matter of fact, Catelyn was still in love with Brandon and mourning him, whereas Ned had lost his entire family in one swoop. To further complicate things, there was already a “bastard” between them. But unlike Robert, Ned actually tried to make an effort to be a good, respectful husband, and, in turn, Catelyn opened up to him. Their marriage survived because they WORKED on it. Robert already had the advantage of Cersei being into him from the get go, and instead of trying to be a good husband, he did everything in his power to push her away. Sure, maybe he would never be in LOVE with her, and maybe Cersei would eventually go back to being obsessed with her brother, but a civil relationship sure as hell would have been a better situation for both (and the entire realm) than the fuckery that actually took place.
@@ysgramornorris2452 He could have chosen to give up his fantasy of Lyanna and tried to move on, considering he never even knew the woman.
@@ysgramornorris2452 At least he could not be drunk while laying in bed with her and don’t insult her laying with many women while her own brother was guarding.
Cersei slept with Jaime on her wedding day lmao and she always refused robert to go with hunts with him
Always preferred Robert in the show as he had no point of view chapters in the book. Mark Addy was a perfect cast and scenes like this and the war stories gave Robert so much more depth.
GODS! THE SHOW WAS RIGHT PROPER BACK THEN!
GOOD WRITING, NED, ON AN OPEN FIELD
@@basedelon WE CALLED IT MAKING THE 8 SEASONS
*right proper*
Bran. “Who has a better story than Bran?” Gods, what a stupid line. Who wrote season 8, some halfwit with a stutter?
robert= the viewers
cersei= the directors
lyanna= the source material lol
still the best scene
The Best Scene in... the entire Show? Or the Best Scene in the First Season? Maybe... both?
@@konstantinlenz1057 best scene in the show
@@dominicdecoco7950 Youre Right.
"7 Kingdoms couldn’t fill the whole she left behind."
I love scenes like this b/c they weren't in the books, since they weren't POV characters
I must agree. Every line said holds such immense weight; this is where I fell in love with the show.
Wow, Cersei actually being a human.
Her conversation with Robert was amazing, cause it shows that under all that anger and hatred, she can feel genuine love for someone.
And it was that situation she was in that turned her into the angry woman she became.
“The 7 kingdoms couldn’t fill the hole she left”
Fuck I felt that. Anyone who’s ever lost a beloved partner feels that deeply
Also, when he says he can't remember what she looks like - I felt that. I lost my mom back in 2013 and I don't remember what she looks like anymore.
Just some top notch dialogue and two fantastic actors. Addy's subtle shame when she tells him she felt something for him once, that quiet little "I know" is brief, but says a world about the deep seeded regret Robert has about how he's treated his wife, and choices he's made.
Screw red wedding, this is the best scene in the series.
The purple wedding was the best
Gerard Foran robert is the goat 🐐
Honestly, one could make the argument THIS was the most incredible scene in GOTs. There was just something so earnest about their talk. Both crushingly sad and liberating.
I’m reading the books now for the first time, and I genuinely feel that this is the only addition to the show that I wished was in the book. It just does such a fantastic job of characterizing the relationship between Robert and Cersei. That said, their relationship in the books and the TV show, is quite different, so I doubt it would have worked. I actually like their dynamic in the show (and Robert’s character generally) far better in the show, personally.
And the sad thing is Robert would've never been happy with Lyanna either, he was never in love with Lyanna herself so much as he was in love with the memory of her, of what could have been. Robert was a player, always had been, the fire and passion that made him such a great warrior was the same thing that made him a terrible King and Husband. He might have tried for awhile to be faithful but in the end he would've cheated on her too
well we wouldn't know for sure. although from what the show is suggesting and by what is shown, it appears Robert would hold true to his vows.
So true. And Lyanna herself knew this when she was alive.
In the first book in Neds point of view, he said Lyanna didn't want to be with Robert because she knew how he was and she knew he already had a Bastard daughter and that even if he did truly love her that love doesn't change a man's nature. So I agree he would've eventually cheated on her too.
Plus Lyanna wasn't in love with him nor did she want him. Cersei at least wanted Robert but was disappointed and disillusioned after years of lovelessness. There was never going to be a happy ending for Robert regardless.
@@luvfreedom1470 Cersei grew tired of the lovelessness, the whoring and also, in the books, Robert was deliberately cruel to her in bed.
Robert is actually very grounded when he isn't belligerently drunk
A lot of people, both the characters in the show itself and the people who watch it, say Robert is a fool for acting the way he did with all the drinking and debauchery.
He wasn’t a fool, he just didn’t care.
“And seven kingdoms couldn’t fill the hole she left behind.” After all these years that line still makes me tear up
"She was the one thing I ever wanted"
How relate-able
Powerful scene. You can hear deep sadness in his voice when he told her about the horrible truth. It's a great line, delivered in great acting on Mark Addy's part.
"Doesn't make me feel anything."
But if you pay attention to her eyes, you notice that she lies, trying hard to pretend, she really doesn't care, so Robert doesn't catch her weakness.
Such strong acting in this scene, from both actors! One of the best scenes in the entire series to me.
"What harm could Lyanna Stark's ghost do to either of us, that we haven't done to each other a hundred times over?"
Oh, I don't know, maybe secretly married Rhaegar Targaryen and had a child with him, who would have a better claim to the throne than any of your children combined.
Shove that "secret marriage"-bullshit back up your ass from whence it came
+Mark P I disagree with you, but I'll admit I laughed my butt off reading your comment.
They were at that damn tower for over a year, and you don't think they got hitched?
lol a year later and this guy was right
Mark P lol
"Someone took her away from me and 7 Kingdoms couldn't fill the void " I keep coming to watch this clip for this dialog
my favorite scene in the entire show. To date.
"I felt something for you once, you know... Even after we lost our first boy... it took quite awhile actually."
Music Kicks in.
You feel a lot of empathy for Cersei even though you hate her. That's great writing.
Cinema Cola Didn't she kill her firstborn?
TAZY In the books Cersei would drink moon tea whenever the time of conception would have seen the baby to have been Robert's child, so she could only have Jaime's, though, it was never specified she had this child in the novels. This scene was filmed after the first season was in post-production, because they didn't something to fill time, so the David & Dan with the help of George wrote this. I think this might of been one of the many things he said he wanted to include in the books but had to cut because of how long the original manuscript was. However, in the television series, it's believed she did actively seek means of not getting pregnant with Robert's child, but there was a slip up with whom's she thought it was. Many fans theorize that it was Jaime whom had the babe killed, but Cersei grew to love him before his death despite his parentage.
Their first born was Gendry (so he isn't a bastard, just like Jon isn't) That's gonna be the next big twist I reckon so he will have more right to sit on the Iron Throne than anyone alive 😉
Except in the books Cercei was in love with Rhaegar, didn't like Robert, and abort their first child out of spite because he had called her Lyana's name
@@montelvontaviouspore Uhm Cercei was not mother of Gendry lol.
I love this scene so much, it has to be one of my favourites in the entire show and that’s hard to pick - The lines “I can’t even remember what she looked like” and “And seven kingdoms couldn’t fill the hole she left behind” - I’ve had quite a few loved ones die in my life and I’m only 25, I lost most of them to cancer over 10 years ago and that line really hits home - those lines are probably the most accurate descriptions of grief and loss you’ll ever hear. - it’s been so long since they died and so long since I last saw them I have trouble remembering their faces
Those of you reading this and if you haven’t experienced it - You’ll understand one day
This is why people loved game of thrones.. The interactions between characters, powerful Dilougs, amazing depth to backstories, the grey area of human nature.... Not the bloody dragons or expensive battles hell the first three seasons had only one major battle scene and still they were the best... Sure dragons and huge battles are amazing but these scenes were the stuff which attracted such vast audience
even though lyanna probably was not in love with him I feel for Robert. loving someone beyond reason ... is never healthy ... it makes you very vulnerable. The never ending pain of not being able to be with that person slowly destroys you ... no wonder he failed at ruling ...
Yeah but you can't control your affection for someone.
Agreed! Well said Patrick. That's the truth.
17 years of peace and stability. A long summer before the long winter.
Thank you King Robert
What a tremendous scene between Lena Headey and Mark Addy. Wonderful talent. I feel his heartache every time I see this. I wish we would have seen more of the complex and deep character Robert Baratheon was (fingers crossed for some origin prequels). And Lena does an outstanding job in this performance showing the loving and perhaps, dare I say, innocent side she once had. It feels so genuine and so painful. I loved the exchanges like this between these actors. They never disappoint.
Great acting
The interesting thing about it is, that this scene isn't even in the books, but it's one of the best written scenes of this season. They WERE able to write brilliantly and empathically... Wonder what actually happened.......
I have heard that the show runners wants to get the show over and done as soon as possible by that point in order to have a chance at one of the Star Wars movies. They ended up not being chosen, so their decision backfired.
One of the best scenes in the series. Heartbreaking.
One of my favorite scenes in the franchise - books and show.
Not sure this is actually in the books given that neither Cersei or Robert are POV characters at this point
Miles Curtis Watson It wasn't
EvanSol919 The scene was not from the books. Robert from the show seems more sane for some reason.
Hearing that Cersei loved Robert at some point is really sad, if he had just let go of that grief he could’ve actually been happy with her and raised his own kids
Another point given that context: I think this is the reason Cersei does show something of a soft spot for Sansa. She sees herself in her. A young woman betrothed to a would-be king, who doesn't realize the monster within their object of affection.
I thought this scene made Robert seem delusional. It's clear that he was only ever in love with the idea of a woman who had zero interest in him. Lol. It's like hearing someone cry about an unrequited crush from high school 20 years ago. Super unrealistic.
I still say that Season 1 was the best.
season 1 was easily the best in terms of writing and character development. anyone says otherwise is easily impressed by ez shock moments
@@orochimaru527, i mean, S2-S4 also have equally strong writing and character development. I’d say S1’s strongest attribute compared to those seasons is the pacing and the way the story slowly unfolds. Plus the smaller scale of S1 allowed each plotline to get an equally strong amount of needed screentime
In the books it is even sadder, as Cersei genuinely liked Robert in the beginning but felt betrayed when on their first wedding night together Robert mentioned Lyanna's name.
I've watched this a million times, and I've had a million goosebumps after Robert said that line
The way Cersei gulps down her pain with wine when Robert said "No". The way she keeps a straight face & leaves!!
This show is one off the best for all time for a reason.❤❤
Such powerful performances!
this is in my opinion the greatest piece of dialogue in all of tv history.. the acting, writing, emotion, lighting, impact, heartbreaking realness.. it all ties into a masterpiece that i haven't seen anywhere else.. everything is perfect in every aspect
Throughout the whole series this scene is one of the most honest conversation these characters had
Perhaps one of the finest examples of a masterfully crafted scene, the writing, the dialogue, the lighting, the delivery, the direction and how much it contributes insight to the two characters who are hopelessly imperfect in their lives. I guess one of the points the scene tries to make is that even in an imagined and fantastical world like Westeros characters are only humans whose actions are the result of their struggle driven past and failures, regrets, anger, spite are all the basest human emotions which define our lives. A brilliant and profound piece of storytelling.
its often the richest and most powerful ones who live the most deprived lives.
I'd Rather live such a miserable rich and poweful life with a hot wife rather than a mediocre and poor life with an ugly wife :D
Natalie Stark Then clearly you've never suffered from depression.
I am currently suffering from it
TheUndyingCrystal The constant stress of financial woes is enough for someone suffering from depression to end it all, it's often the catalyst in fact.
Well can concur
But nothing’s gonna change really
I’ve grown used to this
The depth and nuance Mark Addy gave to Robert is why Bobby B is so popular among the fandom.
Gods the dialogue was good
Someone's said it here before, but compare this to what Maester Aemon says in a later scene. Aemon can picture his beloved clearly, even after so many years, because he genuinely loved her. Robert cannot remember Lyanna's face because it was mere infatuation
Season 1 has some of the best acting I’ve ever had the pleasure of watching
One of my favourite show-only additions. Such a shame that the writers were unable of recreating the magic in the later seasons. In just a few short minutes, we're given more insight into Robert and Cersei's complex, naunced relationship than we ever did in the books, elevated of course by Lena and Mark's incredible acting.
Imagine being in a competition with a ghost anf losing
This scene is such perfection and it’s just two people sitting across a table from each other. Just great acting and great writing
The subtle foreshadowing here about Robert’s death is done masterfully. “17 years is quite a long time.” I think Cersei already started planning his death. Hence why she wanted to talk about Lyanna. She wouldn’t have gotten another chance.
While I think she's always had the idea in the back of her mind, as a contingency plan if nothing else, it's more likely she acted on it once Ned started snooping around and eventually discovered the truth about her and Jaime. By then, it was do or die.
@@enderman_666 Exactly, she had no choice if she wanted to live, in the show at least. In the book it is suggested she had tried to get him put in situations were the possibility of him being killed. When he was going to participate in a jousting for Ned's tournament. Cersei forbade him from participating thus causing him to against her "wishes", which is what she wanted. He was out of shape so he would likely lose. Ned had to talk him out of participating. However, from her perspective she REALLY had to actively end his life after Ned informed her of his knowledge. Apparently she had to kill him sooner than what she would have preferred, bit the idea was always there. In the show this particular scene inadvertently made her choice to kill him a lot more easier as she had no qualms about doing. But I am not sure if Robert telling her that he did feel for her would have changed anything.
Cersei would have been way better had Robert been nice to her and loved her, or at least given their relationship a chance, although I despise Cersei, I can't imagine the pain she must have gone through with Robert, she was already being treated like a piece of meat by tywin, marrying her off to the highest lord to make an alliance ,I mean she's no saint but she did have a difficult life
Lol read the books. She was a psychopath. She murdered her best friend at the age of 9.
@@TTUploads Cersei in the books and Cersei in the show are very different. George Martin had been talking about this when filming for the first season was just about to begin. He wrote about it on his blog. They chose Lena Headey because she could show Cersei more human than she was in the books. This was the plan of Martin and the showrunners from the beginning. So Cersei didn't kill her friend on the show.
I absolutely love this scene. The emotions are so raw....so real. It really flushes out the characters, especially Robert. How on the surface he appears to have the world at his finger tips.. He was always a desirable person, strong, charismatic, good looking, aristocrat, good friends/allies etc. and now he's king, gets his choice of women, drinks and parties at his leisure. But you realize that he's a hedonist because he's trying to heal from something that won't go away: the pain left behind from the death of the women he loved. 7 kingdoms couldn't fill the void she left behind. Bravo! great acting and writing
It's a great scene. They make a very good job of it, and there's a certain tenderness to the honesty, even though they don't love each other, there's an openness that's quite wholesome in a strange way.
The best non-book scene of the entire series. It’s so stunningly good and insightful to both of these characters it’s one that I’ve taken as canonical book, despite not being in the books.
I like to come back to superbly written scenes like this from the first 4 seasons to remember why I used to love this show 😢
This was quite possibly my favorite scene in all of game of thrones. It was deep and powerful on multiple levels.
He was the greatest king we ever had . Someone took him away from us , and seven seasons couldn't fill the hole he left behind.
This was both the first and last one-on-one scene these two shared together, and yet so much history was shaded in. You feel like you watched their entire relationship in this one scene.
I honestly feel bad for them both. Cersei wanted Rhaegar more than anything while Robert wanted Lyanna more than anything
GODS the writing was strong then!
Robert didn't even know Lyanna, he was projecting a lot onto her. The "one thing he ever wanted" was someone he barely knew, and had idealized. And then he lost her and then "seven kingdoms couldn't fill the hole she left behind". Robert never had her, nor before her death, nor after. Robert was never whole. The king of Westeros was just a miserable man his entire life.
This is one of the best changes they made to Robert’s character. It helps give him a little more debt, and wipes away whatever thoughts Ned had of him and his sister. Throughout Ned’s chapters, he often wonders if Robert actually loved Lyanna for who she was, or simply because she was beautiful. Ned even wonders wonders if Robert’s whoring would have ended, or even begun had his sister lived to be his wife. I love how the show makes it abundantly clear how much Robert truly loved her. Every time she’s brought up, he transforms from the stubborn king he’s known to be, to a broken man still hopelessly in love with a woman he can never have.
Robert loves the idea of her. The idea of a him being a different man. He never loved her.
@@spanishflea634 I think this version of Robert deeply loved her. The book and the show are two completely different beasts. You can see how her her death still haunts him. In the book, Robert often said that he loved her, but we never really got any deep emotional scenes like this to really hammer that in. I kinda agree with Book Ned, that had she lived, Robert still would have been unfaithful to her.
@@VideoGameAutopsyI don't him being at a live he never got live is exactly proof of love.
GODS, the writing was good then!
(PS i know this comment is stolen)
Hey don't feel bad I just commented the same thing and did'nt admit the theft.
strong*
@@sirborkington1052 Then stop commenting the same thing if you already see the comment on the same video.
In my opinion, this is still the most humanizing moment for Cersei.
Cersei had many of those tiny bits of humanity moments..
Yeah bc even tho she was fucking Jamie half the time, this show she did love Robert at one point
Much like all people, Cersei was her best self when people told her "no...."
I love that pause between Cersei’s asking Robert if there was ever a chance for them to work things out and Robert’s “no”. Like…he knows the truth would crush Cersei and he doesn’t want to hurt her but is ultimately forced to say it because it’s the first time they’ve ever been honest with each other.
God damn, this scene is perfect. Complete honesty and acceptance from both of them. This scene should be nominated for awards tbh.
The way this scene makes you feel, the way it paints a picture of how incredibly rich this world was and currently is. I miss that feeling, the dialog was everything in this show.
This is one of my all time thrones scenes
The acting, the writing, the music....these early seasons were some of the best tv i ever watched ❤
I wonder if had said Yes instead of No if she would have still had him killed.
17 years....
That means Jon Snow is 17 years old in Season 1...
16. he was born at the end of the war
13 in the books If I’m not mistaken
I think he's 14, so is Robb Stark. Sansa is 11 and Arya 9, Bran 7 and Rickon 3 or 4. Why even Dany herself is only 13 going on 14 at the beginning of the books. Much of the characters in this show are aged up. For example the adults like Ned and Cat and so on are in their early 30s. One can reconcile this by acknowledging that years may be longer in the ASOIAF universe. But that's just a theory.
@@Kaboomboo The age of the actors was better for tv.
he was talking about 17 years of marriage , we're not sure if Lyanna gave Jon in the same year that Cersie and Robert got married
"I felt something for you once, you know." As someone whose wife hates him, this really hit hard for me.
Robert remembers his first kill so vividly down to minor details but cant even recall the woman he “loved”s face.
He was a bloodhungry warrior not a lover.
Exactly. Because he only loved the idea of Lyanna.
Based sigma Bobby B
Such marvellous acting...you can actually feel the sense of loss, the grief...the miserable truth of 2 people being in painful unrequited love..