The gentleman is smart. I grew up poor. Worked my ass off to have the house, nice cars etc. Then I realized I wasn't happy. You never knew who your real friends were. The more money you have the more problems you have. All those years of working my ass off just to realize it wasn't what I needed to be happy. I enjoy the simple life now.
Great guest, great interviewer, just great, great, great, I so wish there would be more people out there like Bill and his guests! Thanks a lot guys, you are really targeting my mind frequency, and entire mind set up, we are the same, thanks! All the best to you. Hermitus
+SIMKINETICS What i find interesting is that they try to disprove him by saying "nature isn't that good, so we can't be better". We have consciousness, we can be better than instinct based predatorial behaviour.
onpsxmember We have speech, an opposed thumb and advanced creative capacity; but, I'm not convinced that our consciousness is unique or that we don't also have many instincts like other animals.
Vs Capitalistic authoritarianism which is many sheep and 1 wolf, and the wolf either owns the sheep or owns whatever the sheep use, and if the sheep want to 'live' they need to agree to be eaten.
Pat Doyle they cooperate without a general order's.. They only hunt 1 bison at a time and sharing to the pack..Each wolf has a Functioning Brain anyone can challenge a Weak Alpha pair, in order to exist... if you think that bill is the leader, He's just a speaker that having its own opinions and he can accept a round 1 defeat of an endless round 16 LOL because maybe 16 thats your age or maybe older but you have a sweet 16 age in my Remote viewing, an intellect thing you need to reach age 33 to have you own opinion its my own thinking..bill has a mercy too, bcoz he are not selfish.., we give also to your "parallel world" a chance, We like you to reach round 16 Argument maybe more till we reach a point.. thats how a human brain works .. its just a bit more complex than a wolf or maybe we dont know.... A Wolf likes to lick its own dick, wolves maybe happier than humans they can lick their own pricks! like a self blowjob and no shame, it doesn't apply to them. Maybe some humans can do this and we dont need to know our own secrets.(im not gay)pussy is the perfect machine it ON with one Finger.... We are humans are the children of this planet that requires plastic because its the only child that likes plastic.... that's the wonder of nature.. but its up to you we don't convince anyone like what you think, some people may like the way of ideawe have, we don't list a member because its only applies to an individual who understands the basic things.. we are not intelligent its just common sense.. deep understanding... my english sucks, american english tought us... here in asia called Anglo-Saxon i dont get but it does help.. hope we communicate by d wayent our government suck too much worse than yours and We just about our problems here.. The character of a crazy not stupid we are not dumb..some are just floating around they dont know that they are dumb (the public).. you can bite me in Face and replace Mike Tyson Most embarrassing moment the public will judge you not us..
Some animals are naturally social, others are solitary. You can't simply lump together millions of unique species into one group and say they belong to a political system that humans invented.
Basically what he is saying is that when others all around you are thriving, you thrive also and that there is a inter-dependency among all living things on this planet. Hoarding resources from others in your tribe (nation) causes an unhealthy imbalance and causes everyone to suffer ultimately. Humans are the worst hoarders and wasters of resources while our fellow humans starve and suffer. It brings us all down.
Carlos Paz Despierta Lol you called a lot communist stupid then. Because many communist also think North korea is communist. And the top Marxist youtuber Jason Unrhue like North Korea and calls it communist! You sir are just a denying stupid little ass.
@Robert Barnhill How can he be the voice of reason--he doesn't understand about how herds work and the fact we have to stop going for each other's throats if we, as a species, are to survive.... Teachers need to start stressing that fact to their students; unfortunately there are hundreds of thousands of adults in the U.S. that don't get it.... There is no *us* vs *them* if we want to have a future.
I never expected Bill Maher to be like that.. In fact, I noticed that. This is one thing that is not just a limitation of "stupid people" or whatever. That amazes me sometimes really. I understand the argument that it's not the most useful thing in many cases, but as a means of conveying a point/idea it's perfectly fine. It's as if people are being intentionally dense, stubborn, and/or arrogant. It's easy to purposely not understand what somebody is saying or otherwise fail to for as simple a reason as you mention. It's really fucking irritating...
"I am not giving away my money, not to Obama, not this time." Bill... You're not giving it away to Obama. You're giving it to the United States of America!
This guy does make a lot of sense, I don't know if there's some kind of diminishing return in happiness in relation to wealth but you certainly don't need a lot of money to obtain optimal happiness. Other animals do cooperate greatly within the same species. There are cross-species cooperations if they have mutual interests but that's actually quite hard to develop. However, they don't do this cuz they're "good friendly people" or anything like that. They're not driven by "good and evil," they're driven by 2 primary forces: the will to survive and the will to breed. Some "higher animals" do have some sort of morality but that focuses on the well-being of their group and themselves, the same way humans are, and the root of this morality is still survival and the passing of their genes. The reason why predators don't eat and kill more than they need is because hunting is difficult, dangerous, and consume a lot of time and energy. They have the luxury to kill for fun or for petty reasons like humans do so it makes no sense for kill more then they need to survive.
I've been blue collar all my life, so try and convince me, Tom Shadyac, how more money won't improve life options that money provides. Guys like Shadyac lived large before deciding the energy, maintenance, and politics weren't worth the hassle and downsized. I question his desire to continue to live in L.A. after his personal transformation, he's still a writer, so living there is about the money. Hard to get published if you don't live in NY or L.A. In addition, a big reason people who go bankrupt shortly after winning a lotto don't have a plan of action before they buy their tickets.
I am as liberal as it gets. I'm a big Bernie Sanders, Michael Moore, John Oliver kind of guy, but hearing Tom Shadyac speak, it's a bit like when Bill Maher was on Family Guy and Brian was talking about Wish it Want it Do it. The sun doesn't charge us?! What is he talking about?
That guy thinks that the sun is altruistic, as opposed to being just what happens when a lot of hydrogen comes together in one place. He is far, FAR less intelligent than he imagines himself to be, and ridicule is an entirely appropriate response.
Phil Johnson He was referring to the sun as a system of rules, NOT as a conscious being. He did the same with the human body. Why is it so difficult for everybody to understand such a low degree of abstract thought?
"abstract" is a technical term referring to discussing something in a theoretical sense rather than the physical or concrete sense. It's the precise term for a mode of hypothetical discussion which only works when technical language is employed in as correct a manner as possible: it isn't to be confused with the pseudoscientific gibberish this prat was spouting. You're quite right about there being a "low degree of thought" here.
Phil Johnson It works pretty well when the point is as simple as the one made in the video - i.e. the energy processing mechanism of the sun allows for free access, unlike many aspects of our social structure. It is a simple analogy, really (albeit not perfect), and nowhere did it ascribe altruism to the sun, as you seem to be suggesting. Also, don't misquote me; I meant "low degree of abstract thought" as in easy to understand even by the simplest of minds, as long they are willing to do so.
Im lovin u more n more with every video Wild Bill.....REAL TIME.......for me, thats the only time i ve got left.....And when you can call out the phonies to their faces.....and they laugh with you....Your a Master!.....We know that the hypnotized never lie.....do ya??...the Wizards that came up with the money thing....made a Hit!!....unless you ve got a better way........(Money) is it..........Keepin the Machine movin for the Humans.....It is only a tool though..a beautiful tool if used properly.....I ve never really had enough of the stuff to really matter either way....Thank you for bringing this topic to your show......Money fucks alotta folks up....on a multitude of levels...Keepin it Real....wit Wild Bill!!
I think the big point Thomas is trying to make is that nature, while occasionally cruel, never takes more than it actually needs. Also, everything in nature is interdependent on each other. Take one thing away and the whole suffers somewhat.
4 years later...just for posterity's sake: That is like saying Hannibal Lecter is only content with one victim and never takes another in any given month.
The reason its not always competition is the same reason that corporations cooperate with (sign deals) with other corporations. Its all about individual selfish interests and game theory. Sometimes cooperation helps, sometimes competition.
"I've never seen animals cooperate", Bill has obviously never heard of ants. "Animals are cruel and heartless", I'm pretty sure human beings fit that description, I don't see turtles creating concentration camps, I don't see ostriches constantly at war with each other, I don't see wolves killing deer out of desire, I don't see lions killing gazelles for sports, I don't see any animals other than human beings killing because they want to, they do it because they have to.. Oh and yes Bill we are animals too, aside from technology (which is destroying forests, animals, nature and the ozone layer) we are exactly the same as non human animals). Bill is wrong about so many things, but he assumes he is right because he is so ego driven, if you're wrong about all these things, I wonder what else you're wrong about...
lobelia2 I'm allergic to sunlight. I avoid it as much as physically possible already, and have done so for at least 20 years so far. I'm fairly healthy, actually. I just take a few more vitamin supplements than your average person.
Ardavan Farahvash You obviously have no idea what you're talking about: [ www.sparkpeople.com/resource/health_a-z_detail.asp?AZ=448 ] After my family's last vacation to Hawaii (when solar UV was at 110% normal levels) I got a severe, painful and extremely itchy rash on the backs of my hands and tops of my feet that left visible scars lasting 4 months afterward. My hands looked like this, but more severe: [ yourlifetube.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/polymorphic.jpg ] This happens less severely in the Summer just from having a short sleeve shirt on while driving my car and getting too much direct sun on my arm through the window. Yeah, but I guess I'm just trolling...
Ardavan Farahvash - According to info from an MD, humans allergic to almost anything is possible including sunlight, with the sole exception being moonlight.
Ardavan Farahvash Nobody even implied that it was the _light_ that I was allergic to. Obviously not... These semantics are tiresome. [ www.drugs.com/health-guide/sun-allergy-photosensitivity.html ] Will you please just admit you were wrong and end this (now ancient) exchange already?
I can't believe how naive they are about the animal kingdom. Animals work together and protect their own all the time, especially among kin. Getting some of your genes to the next generation is paramount.
Richard Briggs Exactly. It's unfortunate, because of the many people who listen to Maher's ideas, and are in completely the same bubble as he. A big problem that I see is that they have this absurd notion that science is the dominant factor in human understanding, and leave no room for spirituality. I used to be the same way, so I get it, but it's quite unfortunate that their eyes do not see with truth and humility.
Umm... some animals will sacrifice the old to predictors so that the herd can proceed. For example zebra will forcibly push the old (unwilling) ones into the crocodile pit so the rest can cross while the crocodile tends to the geriatric. Source: Robert Sapolski
i feel nothing but pity for people who expect to find happiness from such superficial things as one's lifestyle. obviously money won't make you happy but it will sustain most of your temporary wishes. happiness cannot be achieved anyway
your level of happiness does not increase infinitesimally as you get more and more money, after you have slightly more than your peers it levels out. It was proven in the usa in the boom yrs
that's such bullshit about the animals not taking everything they can. anyone that owns chickens and has weasels in their region knows of the excesses of predators
Pat Doyle That's such a silly notion. He doesn't "get it," because he has a nice home? What does that phrase mean to you? All that matters is the understanding that these things are impermanent, and to seek internal growth. Being a millionaire wouldn't hinder enlightenment if you don't let it. The notion that your wealth will bring you all you need is the hindrance.
Marlon Taylor I didn't say he was completely wrong. But when he talks about only taking what you need, and he lives in Malibu, there is some cognitive dissonance going on. That is a very expensive luxury. I applaud what he is trying to do, but (probably because he has experienced much greater wealth than he now has) he doesn't see the contradiction there. In fact, if he were really thinking about this carefully, he'd leave southern California altogether, because the population there is unsustainable. Every time he showers in Malibu, he's taking more than that environment can afford to give.
Pat Doyle You're right. I wasn't taking into consideration his belief of only taking what you need. I would hopefully assume that he is aware of this, as we can only reasonably do so much. But he is certainly on the right track with his ideas.
To apply or give human emotions to the rest of the natural world is illogical. To call a lion cruel for killing an antelope is not a act of cruelty it is an act of survival. I this episode Bill used the term cruel to a scenario of a dog with 8 nipples and 9 puppies. Yes one dies, the weakest, this ensures that that pack stays its strongest. In nature it is imperative that the pack stays it strongest so it can protect and feed its self.
Needless cruelty is a perverse symptom of the one quality that sets us apart from all other species, intelligence. We are the first species on earth to possess high intelligence, and it adds a very interesting dynamic to the evolution of our species. For example, we could potentially use our intelligence for genetic engineering of our species in a most un-Darwinian way. We could deliberately engineer adaptations. But we still act like a disparate herd. We're not the Borg just yet ...
Haven't we dispelled the myth of dinosaurs eating their own young? Are they still such "terrible lizards" to people? When will people catch on to the latest advances in palaeontology?
I don't know if he knows it or not, but this idea is not new. Back in the 19th century, the Russian Anarchist and naturalist Kropotkin wrote a book called "mutual aid." In it, he refutes some of Darwins' ideas about constant competition by pointing out that animals very often do cooperate within the same species. In short, nature is an "Anarcho-Communist," a Socialist with no centralized government. But only within each species. With other species, the laws of competition generally apply, though there are exeptions (symbiosis.)
have you seen the D-Day-esque scenes out on the beaches where sea turtles are decimated by predators? only the fittest makes it off the beach and into the ocean
All the time through history, no matter what the "system" was, there has always been a strive for personal gain. The egyptians with the pharaon, the medieval times with all the smaller and bigger lords, kings etc. and the poorest and smallest people (= 99% of the actual population) just had to accept it. Then, with the introduction of universal human rights, the people had a voice too. The selfishness of humans is not something you can prove, but that's what I most often witness.
I get where this guy is going. Sadly, it took him to become a MILLIONAIRE to get to this revelation but I dig it. Oh, and BTW, when you're done...pass the dutchie 'pon the left hand side.
Human gut bacteria would be a good example to use. Some fish were recently discovered to give body motion signals to different species to help find prey. Some ants raise and milk aphids just like we do with cows. Or all those little birds that pick off insects off rhinos backs.
Goldfish is actually not fit to survive other than in an aquarium or a human maintained pond. Goldfish came about as a mutation from when people cultivated and bred Asian carps as food. Due to their color they become domesticated as pet fish for viewing purposes, goldfish are almost entirely human bred and raised. Goldfish stands absolutely no chance in the wild, because they are not fit. Their tendency to eat till they die is also one of those reasons.
Wow. I can't believe people would find fault with this. The guy gave millions to charity,gave up his luxury home, is trying to tell people what life should be about. But you're questioning his motives for writing a book?.... Sad.
Fast Checkers perhaps I was being hyperbolic when I said they had no intention of eating any of it, but the point still stands that many animals will kill many more prey than they need. For example, grizzly bears will kill dozens of salmon and eat only the heads and eggs, neglecting the flesh, which is scavenged by wolves and birds. There is also a case of a clan of hyenas killing nearly 100 gazelles and eating fewer than 20. Predators do this because evolution is imperfect. The instinct is to kill prey when they are near and when there are several predators in a pack or similar group, they may kill as many as they can lay their teeth on, eating only some or the specific parts of others.
How much, thats the same as saying when I throw a mattress out on the street because its old, dirty and I don't want it, when a homeless man takes it we are cooperating. No we are not, and neither do animals. One man's trash is another man's treasure is not a testament of cooperation.
Pretty sure that's not the point. Animals don't cooperate. They depend on each other but don't help each other. They virtually never help other species or even members of the same species except for close kin.
Too hippy for me, but has a point, particularly within the species'. When not directly threataned as an induvidual then most of the higher intelligence animals don't just cooperate, but need to cooperate in order to live and survive. Even inter-species, where there isn't conflict there will often be cooperation, which all depends on the starting conditions and circumstance. As social animals we evolved completing with our enviroment, but cooperate with eachother to beat it... however eventually our species became the enviroment that we end up fighting. We need less of that, and more cooperation... somehow...
Wow I absolutely love this guy, he spoke almost the exact same message I've been trying to tell other people. While absolute communism is impractical, the obvious advantage of co-operation and utilizing the best traits of humanity would seem to be the only logical course for humanity in the long run. As we further evolve and populate this world, further fighting over the limited resources and who has what technology, or who has what wealth and medicine, etc. The end result would have to be either total domination, where one group of people have all the power, and hold that through fear and violence... Or.. People eventually figure out that there can actually be two sides to an issue, where you can disagree yet still get along. You can build a bridge together, you don't always have to see it the same way. Now here is where we test ourselves, we find ourselves approaching the peak of the hill, ready to go over the other side. We approach the climax of population that Earth can sustain (12 or so billion), we face almost unimaginable changes in our very landscape and climate. All the while the most powerful nation on Earth that wants to remain as such, is crumbling at every corner and no one seems to care. So what becomes of us? Do we not get the bigger picture? Do we ignore our intuition and mothers, and fight for our survival? Or do we listen to their woes, and see how we can seek compromise? How many more wars must we fight without knowing why we truly fight, or why THEY truly fight?
Re sun charging you - not that strange in this era when one has to pay for drinking water and soon perhaps breathing too what with pollution - and at that there are the tanning equipment and salons that charge you for what sun does for free, without the benefits of health or vitamin D.
Vultures do share food equally among a flock; even if one dies, its food remains untouched by the others. Sorry about your 'eight nipples' theory, Bill :P
I understand what he is saying, but $ is a resource to get all other resources. More $ gives you more options. Keeping it doesn't mean you will necessarily live extravagantly . But if you are secure enough to unload it, and offer it where it will do more good then by all means. He is a better man than me. I like to think I'd keep a good ammount, have some working for me, and dedicate my lived life, AND some of it to the causes I care about
Actually, many animals do operate by consensus. Take herd animals, on the range there will be many watering holes, how do you think the group decides on which one to go to? They each begin to look towards its preference, only when a critical mass is met in the query does the herd move towards it. This is consensus decision making in animals, yooglebing it for yourself.
Actually all species are social, just some more than others. Micro-organisms are actually very social, just not in the way we understand it. Micro-organisms have demonstrated both selfish and generous behavior in their own way. Most predators hunt in packs or in teams, even the lone hunter brings food back to their community, anti-social predators are actually rarer and more prone to extinction. Not all cats hunt, but it is in their instinct. Animals don't understand cruelty, human concept.
Low-resolution answers like communism and socialism to high-resolution EXTREMLY complex problems like 'the answer to EVERYTHING' socially and culturally (including economics) are NOT ENOUGH. Positive psychology is bullshit. See a certain professor of psychology at University of Toronto named Jordan. Carl Jung has more relevance than ever, and always will as he recognizes how studying myth, and acknowledging the shadow self, the part of ourselves we can't stand and often embracing the negative rather than trying to thwart it with simple answers, is in fact an answer in and of itself. Forget this "ism" nonsense, these totalitarianism and nihilistic (two opposites) based ideologies are nothing special anymore. The massive social experiments of the 20th century should have been enough to show, communism doesn't bring itself about naturally (it's not even communism when it doesn't), when it's forced by states it ceases to be anything good. Anyone deciding what other people 'need' is futile and leads to violence. These are low-resolution answers to 'the system', which is not low-resolution.
Frater Tenc I agree. What needs to be done is to understand this unity of all things, and to seek enlightenment on an individual basis. Then the system will change itself.
whatever behaviors one could perhaps correctly label "communistic" in animals is A. remember no animal actually grasps abstract concepts like variations in possible societal wealth distribution philosophies. so B. whatever "generous" and "only taking what they need" behaviors are only done out of laziness, a lack of forsight, and the line evolution draws out of minimal but optimal (relative to species/individuals that dont survive) computational skills necessary to survive and thrive, and so C. is carved purely by evolutionary forces, it makes sense animals with practices that are more beneficial towards the species survival and thrival as a whole would come about, but there's no thought processes going on in the mind of animals that make them understand the concept of "ownership" or "sharing" or "strength in numbers" or any of that shit. They operate purely on mindless reflexes for the most part. It's kind of sad, but true.
Exactly. Besides, what about lions, the males of which kill each others' cubs, or chimpanzees, which kill each other all the time. There has yet to be an example of any species that has formed a large, peaceful, pleasant communist society with millions of individuals, with the exception of eusocial insects, which have evolved to want to behave that way. Even in their case, they're all one enormous family and thus have an interest in helping each other out to pass on their genes. Similarly, there can be communist tribal societies or small settlements but soon diversity is introduced, the system breaks down.
I don't agree with this at all. he started out really bad. he said that animals take what they need unlike humans. NNNNOOO....for example a lion catches one gazelle because that's all it could catch because catching gazelles is FUCKING hard. this guy has too much of a romanticized version of nature.
+aperez12374 Absolutely. Could not agree more with that. Let us not even get to much in to the lion - gazelle thing. But there are plenty of creatures on this earth which simply don't follow this approach of "they take only what they need". To really follow that concept you have to be extremely selctive about everything that is in nature. I mean what about insects? fungy? Bacteria? Viruses? There are also certain rodents and mamals that continue to spread as much as they can, if they can, and not care about what ever if they need it or not. There are some exremly agressive creatures out there. There is no doubt that nature has developed countless of different strategies, from coorporation, to sharing, to herding, swarming. But there is no reason to declare one strategy as some kind of guideline. Doesn't mean we can not learn a lot from nature though.
***** He can talk about what ever he want, but it doesn't mean that this is a common principle or rule in nature because there are countless creatures and living beeings that do not act like he describes it. Most insects for example, , amabea, bacteria/viruses, and even some mammals. Nature isn't always about a perfect balance. 99% of all the species in earths history are extinct. And even today there are countless species that die out even without the help of humans. If nature would be really like he describes it than no species would have to actually disapear, because all the creatures would only take what they need keeping a sort of balance. Which obviously not all creatures do. And thus sometimes a species disapears while others triumph.
The gentleman is smart. I grew up poor. Worked my ass off to have the house, nice cars etc. Then I realized I wasn't happy. You never knew who your real friends were. The more money you have the more problems you have. All those years of working my ass off just to realize it wasn't what I needed to be happy. I enjoy the simple life now.
Great guest, great interviewer, just great, great, great, I so wish there would be more people out there like Bill and his guests!
Thanks a lot guys, you are really targeting my mind frequency, and entire mind set up, we are the same, thanks!
All the best to you.
Hermitus
Nature can also be democratic. Like two wolves & a sheep voting on what's for dinner!
One of the wolves?
+SIMKINETICS
What i find interesting is that they try to disprove him by saying
"nature isn't that good, so we can't be better". We have consciousness,
we can be better than instinct based predatorial behaviour.
onpsxmember We have speech, an opposed thumb and advanced creative capacity; but, I'm not convinced that our consciousness is unique or that we don't also have many instincts like other animals.
***** If I'm understanding your comment correctly, that sounds rather funny! ; ]
Vs Capitalistic authoritarianism which is many sheep and 1 wolf, and the wolf either owns the sheep or owns whatever the sheep use, and if the sheep want to 'live' they need to agree to be eaten.
Bill, have you ever seen a pack of wolves? They cooperate.
I saw footage of a pack taking down a bison. The opening attack was one of them biting it in the face. Big balls.
Pat Doyle they cooperate without a general order's.. They only hunt 1 bison at a time and sharing to the pack..Each wolf has a Functioning Brain anyone can challenge a Weak Alpha pair, in order to exist... if you think that bill is the leader, He's just a speaker that having its own opinions and he can accept a round 1 defeat of an endless round 16 LOL because maybe 16 thats your age or maybe older but you have a sweet 16 age in my Remote viewing, an intellect thing you need to reach age 33 to have you own opinion its my own thinking..bill has a mercy too, bcoz he are not selfish.., we give also to your "parallel world" a chance, We like you to reach round 16 Argument maybe more till we reach a point.. thats how a human brain works .. its just a bit more complex than a wolf or maybe we dont know.... A Wolf likes to lick its own dick, wolves maybe happier than humans they can lick their own pricks! like a self blowjob and no shame, it doesn't apply to them. Maybe some humans can do this and we dont need to know our own secrets.(im not gay)pussy is the perfect machine it ON with one Finger.... We are humans are the children of this planet that requires plastic because its the only child that likes plastic.... that's the wonder of nature.. but its up to you we don't convince anyone like what you think, some people may like the way of ideawe have, we don't list a member because its only applies to an individual who understands the basic things.. we are not intelligent its just common sense.. deep understanding... my english sucks, american english tought us... here in asia called Anglo-Saxon i dont get but it does help.. hope we communicate by d wayent our government suck too much worse than yours and We just about our problems here.. The character of a crazy not stupid we are not dumb..some are just floating around they dont know that they are dumb (the public).. you can bite me in Face and replace Mike Tyson Most embarrassing moment
the public will judge you not us..
@@jabargalaroza7979 Got Cliff Notes?
Some animals are naturally social, others are solitary. You can't simply lump together millions of unique species into one group and say they belong to a political system that humans invented.
@@jamesdettmann94
Who said THAT? But humans did not invent cooperation within social species.
Basically what he is saying is that when others all around you are thriving, you thrive also and that there is a inter-dependency among all living things on this planet. Hoarding resources from others in your tribe (nation) causes an unhealthy imbalance and causes everyone to suffer ultimately. Humans are the worst hoarders and wasters of resources while our fellow humans starve and suffer. It brings us all down.
Tom: You ever seen a herd?
Bill: No. I’ve never “herd” of that before....
A lot of AFRAID people in the comments. Yeap, cooperation, socialism and communism is the boogey man for a lot of americans.
Yeah maybe stop believing in a utopia!
The utopia of our times is called the free market. That belief has caused a lot of human rights violations.
Carlos Paz Despierta O
"North Korea is communist"
Only stupid people think that. I guess you are one of them.
Carlos Paz Despierta Lol you called a lot communist stupid then. Because many communist also think North korea is communist.
And the top Marxist youtuber Jason Unrhue like North Korea and calls it communist!
You sir are just a denying stupid little ass.
This guy made a movie called "I Am", its on netflix. And thats my community service for today
Animal Cooperation. Small aquatic life which live cleaning the Blue Whale.
He's right. This guy really walks the walk.
what an intelligent man!!
Four legs good, two legs bad!
he right..... greed will eventually kill us .....front row seat to the freak show .....
Success is all about what things will look like in the future. Bernie Sanders 2016!!!!!
Bill Maher is one of the few voices of reason in our increasingly polarized and divided America.Im a conservative(mostly) by the way
@Robert Barnhill How can he be the voice of reason--he doesn't understand about how herds work and the fact we have to stop going for each other's throats if we, as a species, are to survive.... Teachers need to start stressing that fact to their students; unfortunately there are hundreds of thousands of adults in the U.S. that don't get it.... There is no *us* vs *them* if we want to have a future.
Did the same as Tom.....Bike to work and all. I ride my bike not to ad days to my life but to ad life to my days !
an example of human being.
+toubapatouba never seen such a short but sweet comment such as this
^agreed. i enjoyed this comment :)
nature is in vicious competition with no empathy where only the strong survive
more money may not make me any happier, but less money certainly wont
50,000$ a year makes you happy... unless you have cancer or a student loan to pay back.
My father had a German Shepard named "Lenin" back in the 1950's. He disappeared during the McCarthy witch-hunt.......
thank you ... and also i feel sad and happy for you at the same time.....
Animals are anarchists
I love how ppl here gets totally confused by abstract thought.
I never expected Bill Maher to be like that.. In fact, I noticed that. This is one thing that is not just a limitation of "stupid people" or whatever. That amazes me sometimes really. I understand the argument that it's not the most useful thing in many cases, but as a means of conveying a point/idea it's perfectly fine. It's as if people are being intentionally dense, stubborn, and/or arrogant. It's easy to purposely not understand what somebody is saying or otherwise fail to for as simple a reason as you mention. It's really fucking irritating...
Maslow’s Hierarchy of Needs.
That is what he is talking about.
"I am not giving away my money, not to Obama, not this time."
Bill... You're not giving it away to Obama. You're giving it to the United States of America!
He said (jokingly) that he IS going to give all his money away but not to Obama this time because he contributed $1,000,000 to Obama's campaign.
This guy does make a lot of sense, I don't know if there's some kind of diminishing return in happiness in relation to wealth but you certainly don't need a lot of money to obtain optimal happiness.
Other animals do cooperate greatly within the same species. There are cross-species cooperations if they have mutual interests but that's actually quite hard to develop. However, they don't do this cuz they're "good friendly people" or anything like that. They're not driven by "good and evil," they're driven by 2 primary forces: the will to survive and the will to breed. Some "higher animals" do have some sort of morality but that focuses on the well-being of their group and themselves, the same way humans are, and the root of this morality is still survival and the passing of their genes.
The reason why predators don't eat and kill more than they need is because hunting is difficult, dangerous, and consume a lot of time and energy. They have the luxury to kill for fun or for petty reasons like humans do so it makes no sense for kill more then they need to survive.
I've been blue collar all my life, so try and convince me, Tom Shadyac, how more money won't improve life options that money provides. Guys like Shadyac lived large before deciding the energy, maintenance, and politics weren't worth the hassle and downsized. I question his desire to continue to live in L.A. after his personal transformation, he's still a writer, so living there is about the money. Hard to get published if you don't live in NY or L.A.
In addition, a big reason people who go bankrupt shortly after winning a lotto don't have a plan of action before they buy their tickets.
I am as liberal as it gets. I'm a big Bernie Sanders, Michael Moore, John Oliver kind of guy, but hearing Tom Shadyac speak, it's a bit like when Bill Maher was on Family Guy and Brian was talking about Wish it Want it Do it. The sun doesn't charge us?! What is he talking about?
I'll suggest George Carlin. He's dead though.
The first time I had heard of Tom Shadyac was when I saw Patch Adams.
It was Herbert Spencer who first used the phrase in his "Principles of Biology" (1864)
Bill Maher can't handle somebody who is more intelligent than he is. He feels threatened so he uses ridicule. Tom Shadyac, I'm glad I found you.
yeah can't be because he's a comedian as well as political commentator who often does that to his guests, speakers etc.
That guy thinks that the sun is altruistic, as opposed to being just what happens when a lot of hydrogen comes together in one place. He is far, FAR less intelligent than he imagines himself to be, and ridicule is an entirely appropriate response.
Phil Johnson He was referring to the sun as a system of rules, NOT as a conscious being. He did the same with the human body. Why is it so difficult for everybody to understand such a low degree of abstract thought?
"abstract" is a technical term referring to discussing something in a theoretical sense rather than the physical or concrete sense. It's the precise term for a mode of hypothetical discussion which only works when technical language is employed in as correct a manner as possible: it isn't to be confused with the pseudoscientific gibberish this prat was spouting.
You're quite right about there being a "low degree of thought" here.
Phil Johnson It works pretty well when the point is as simple as the one made in the video - i.e. the energy processing mechanism of the sun allows for free access, unlike many aspects of our social structure. It is a simple analogy, really (albeit not perfect), and nowhere did it ascribe altruism to the sun, as you seem to be suggesting. Also, don't misquote me; I meant "low degree of abstract thought" as in easy to understand even by the simplest of minds, as long they are willing to do so.
I was just surprised that he didn't understand the answers.
people seem to forget humans are animals too.
wow this guy is all class
Im lovin u more n more with every video Wild Bill.....REAL TIME.......for me, thats the only time i ve got left.....And when you can call out the phonies to their faces.....and they laugh with you....Your a Master!.....We know that the hypnotized never lie.....do ya??...the Wizards that came up with the money thing....made a Hit!!....unless you ve got a better way........(Money) is it..........Keepin the Machine movin for the Humans.....It is only a tool though..a beautiful tool if used properly.....I ve never really had enough of the stuff to really matter either way....Thank you for bringing this topic to your show......Money fucks alotta folks up....on a multitude of levels...Keepin it Real....wit Wild Bill!!
I think the big point Thomas is trying to make is that nature, while occasionally cruel, never takes more than it actually needs. Also, everything in nature is interdependent on each other. Take one thing away and the whole suffers somewhat.
4 years later...just for posterity's sake: That is like saying Hannibal Lecter is only content with one victim and never takes another in any given month.
The reason its not always competition is the same reason that corporations cooperate with (sign deals) with other corporations. Its all about individual selfish interests and game theory. Sometimes cooperation helps, sometimes competition.
Best example of first world problems ever!
I had all this money and yet still was not satisfied.
at first I thought this was weird al
yeah , ;me too;..
Live and let live, at least his loving and living his life the way he wants to, but more importantly it doesn't affect anyone else.
Everything is Awesome!
Thank you for pointing that ou!
"I've never seen animals cooperate", Bill has obviously never heard of ants. "Animals are cruel and heartless", I'm pretty sure human beings fit that description, I don't see turtles creating concentration camps, I don't see ostriches constantly at war with each other, I don't see wolves killing deer out of desire, I don't see lions killing gazelles for sports, I don't see any animals other than human beings killing because they want to, they do it because they have to.. Oh and yes Bill we are animals too, aside from technology (which is destroying forests, animals, nature and the ozone layer) we are exactly the same as non human animals). Bill is wrong about so many things, but he assumes he is right because he is so ego driven, if you're wrong about all these things, I wonder what else you're wrong about...
He's talking about interspecies cooperation, but he's still wrong.
"How much has the sun charged you"
I dunno. I'll let you know in 20 years when I'm all wrinkly and possibly have skin cancer.
why don't you live in a bunker for 20 years with no sunlight and see how healthy you are
lobelia2
I'm allergic to sunlight. I avoid it as much as physically possible already, and have done so for at least 20 years so far. I'm fairly healthy, actually.
I just take a few more vitamin supplements than your average person.
Ardavan Farahvash
You obviously have no idea what you're talking about:
[ www.sparkpeople.com/resource/health_a-z_detail.asp?AZ=448 ]
After my family's last vacation to Hawaii (when solar UV was at 110% normal levels) I got a severe, painful and extremely itchy rash on the backs of my hands and tops of my feet that left visible scars lasting 4 months afterward.
My hands looked like this, but more severe:
[ yourlifetube.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/polymorphic.jpg ]
This happens less severely in the Summer just from having a short sleeve shirt on while driving my car and getting too much direct sun on my arm through the window.
Yeah, but I guess I'm just trolling...
Ardavan Farahvash - According to info from an MD, humans allergic to almost anything is possible including sunlight, with the sole exception being moonlight.
Ardavan Farahvash
Nobody even implied that it was the _light_ that I was allergic to. Obviously not... These semantics are tiresome.
[ www.drugs.com/health-guide/sun-allergy-photosensitivity.html ]
Will you please just admit you were wrong and end this (now ancient) exchange already?
Well, from a biologist standpoint its kind of a huge over simplification, but i get where he's coming from.
I can't believe how naive they are about the animal kingdom. Animals work together and protect their own all the time, especially among kin. Getting some of your genes to the next generation is paramount.
Let's FALC ourselves!
It's kinda funny how much this guy "gets it" but Bill can't understand.
Richard Briggs Exactly. It's unfortunate, because of the many people who listen to Maher's ideas, and are in completely the same bubble as he. A big problem that I see is that they have this absurd notion that science is the dominant factor in human understanding, and leave no room for spirituality. I used to be the same way, so I get it, but it's quite unfortunate that their eyes do not see with truth and humility.
Umm... some animals will sacrifice the old to predictors so that the herd can proceed. For example zebra will forcibly push the old (unwilling) ones into the crocodile pit so the rest can cross while the crocodile tends to the geriatric. Source: Robert Sapolski
even in the stone age people lived in tribes. there were hunters and nesters. it's not like barbarians who would just murder anyone they saw in sight
Love your point mmarieden, hahaha
He wrote the book to spread what he's learned.
i feel nothing but pity for people who expect to find happiness from such superficial things as one's lifestyle. obviously money won't make you happy but it will sustain most of your temporary wishes. happiness cannot be achieved anyway
your level of happiness does not increase infinitesimally as you get more and more money, after you have slightly more than your peers it levels out. It was proven in the usa in the boom yrs
very important to live the life you want. however, always realize the consequences of ones actions.
Actually "fit" does not mean how well a species adapts to its environment. Fit means how well a species is able to successfully reproduce.
that's such bullshit about the animals not taking everything they can. anyone that owns chickens and has weasels in their region knows of the excesses of predators
He has a home in Malibu - he still doesn't quite get it.
Pat Doyle That's such a silly notion. He doesn't "get it," because he has a nice home? What does that phrase mean to you?
All that matters is the understanding that these things are impermanent, and to seek internal growth. Being a millionaire wouldn't hinder enlightenment if you don't let it. The notion that your wealth will bring you all you need is the hindrance.
Marlon Taylor
I didn't say he was completely wrong. But when he talks about only taking what you need, and he lives in Malibu, there is some cognitive dissonance going on. That is a very expensive luxury. I applaud what he is trying to do, but (probably because he has experienced much greater wealth than he now has) he doesn't see the contradiction there.
In fact, if he were really thinking about this carefully, he'd leave southern California altogether, because the population there is unsustainable. Every time he showers in Malibu, he's taking more than that environment can afford to give.
Pat Doyle You're right. I wasn't taking into consideration his belief of only taking what you need. I would hopefully assume that he is aware of this, as we can only reasonably do so much. But he is certainly on the right track with his ideas.
Evolution involves a balance between cooperation and selfishness with most species, including humans,
good thing it was a philosophical point....
Bears take more salmon than they need. They eat the tasty bits and leave a half eaten carcass and continue fishing.
He's RIGHT
To apply or give human emotions to the rest of the natural world is illogical. To call a lion cruel for killing an antelope is not a act of cruelty it is an act of survival.
I this episode Bill used the term cruel to a scenario of a dog with 8 nipples and 9 puppies. Yes one dies, the weakest, this ensures that that pack stays its strongest. In nature it is imperative that the pack stays it strongest so it can protect and feed its self.
Needless cruelty is a perverse symptom of the one quality that sets us apart from all other species, intelligence. We are the first species on earth to possess high intelligence, and it adds a very interesting dynamic to the evolution of our species. For example, we could potentially use our intelligence for genetic engineering of our species in a most un-Darwinian way. We could deliberately engineer adaptations. But we still act like a disparate herd. We're not the Borg just yet ...
Haven't we dispelled the myth of dinosaurs eating their own young? Are they still such "terrible lizards" to people? When will people catch on to the latest advances in palaeontology?
Obama needs to appreciate Bill Maher more
Maher needs to read Kropotkin's Mutual Aid. There's FAR more working communally in nature than fighting and competition.
You do have a point there.
I don't know if he knows it or not, but this idea is not new. Back in the 19th century, the Russian Anarchist and naturalist Kropotkin wrote a book called "mutual aid." In it, he refutes some of Darwins' ideas about constant competition by pointing out that animals very often do cooperate within the same species.
In short, nature is an "Anarcho-Communist," a Socialist with no centralized government. But only within each species. With other species, the laws of competition generally apply, though there are exeptions (symbiosis.)
Animals don't have medicines and the newest gadgets
have you seen the D-Day-esque scenes out on the beaches where sea turtles are decimated by predators? only the fittest makes it off the beach and into the ocean
Oh, Bill gets it all right...but what he wanted was something light and funny, and this guy wasn't having any of that.
All the time through history, no matter what the "system" was, there has always been a strive for personal gain. The egyptians with the pharaon, the medieval times with all the smaller and bigger lords, kings etc. and the poorest and smallest people (= 99% of the actual population) just had to accept it. Then, with the introduction of universal human rights, the people had a voice too.
The selfishness of humans is not something you can prove, but that's what I most often witness.
I get where this guy is going. Sadly, it took him to become a MILLIONAIRE to get to this revelation but I dig it.
Oh, and BTW, when you're done...pass the dutchie 'pon the left hand side.
Human gut bacteria would be a good example to use. Some fish were recently discovered to give body motion signals to different species to help find prey. Some ants raise and milk aphids just like we do with cows. Or all those little birds that pick off insects off rhinos backs.
Goldfish is actually not fit to survive other than in an aquarium or a human maintained pond.
Goldfish came about as a mutation from when people cultivated and bred Asian carps as food. Due to their color they become domesticated as pet fish for viewing purposes, goldfish are almost entirely human bred and raised.
Goldfish stands absolutely no chance in the wild, because they are not fit. Their tendency to eat till they die is also one of those reasons.
Wow. I can't believe people would find fault with this. The guy gave millions to charity,gave up his luxury home, is trying to tell people what life should be about. But you're questioning his motives for writing a book?.... Sad.
Trust me . Animals corporate
There are plenty of examples of predators killing far more prey than they have to and not eating any of it.
+Unambiguously Vague
Well don't keep us all in suspense, provide some examples
Fast Checkers perhaps I was being hyperbolic when I said they had no intention of eating any of it, but the point still stands that many animals will kill many more prey than they need. For example, grizzly bears will kill dozens of salmon and eat only the heads and eggs, neglecting the flesh, which is scavenged by wolves and birds. There is also a case of a clan of hyenas killing nearly 100 gazelles and eating fewer than 20.
Predators do this because evolution is imperfect. The instinct is to kill prey when they are near and when there are several predators in a pack or similar group, they may kill as many as they can lay their teeth on, eating only some or the specific parts of others.
+Unambiguously Vague yeh that happens when I don´t eat my desert (sweet)
How much, thats the same as saying when I throw a mattress out on the street because its old, dirty and I don't want it, when a homeless man takes it we are cooperating. No we are not, and neither do animals. One man's trash is another man's treasure is not a testament of cooperation.
This guys mental
+Robeon Mew yeah its really mental to expect to be happy with nothing, yet very effective ....
Pretty sure that's not the point. Animals don't cooperate. They depend on each other but don't help each other. They virtually never help other species or even members of the same species except for close kin.
+shalom4301997 Shabbat Shalom
Too hippy for me, but has a point, particularly within the species'.
When not directly threataned as an induvidual then most of the higher intelligence animals don't just cooperate, but need to cooperate in order to live and survive.
Even inter-species, where there isn't conflict there will often be cooperation, which all depends on the starting conditions and circumstance.
As social animals we evolved completing with our enviroment, but cooperate with eachother to beat it... however eventually our species became the enviroment that we end up fighting.
We need less of that, and more cooperation... somehow...
Americans have such a distorted picture on nature. Bill, it is time to move out of LA ...
I am not surprised that his surname SHADYAC
Wow I absolutely love this guy, he spoke almost the exact same message I've been trying to tell other people. While absolute communism is impractical, the obvious advantage of co-operation and utilizing the best traits of humanity would seem to be the only logical course for humanity in the long run. As we further evolve and populate this world, further fighting over the limited resources and who has what technology, or who has what wealth and medicine, etc. The end result would have to be either total domination, where one group of people have all the power, and hold that through fear and violence... Or.. People eventually figure out that there can actually be two sides to an issue, where you can disagree yet still get along. You can build a bridge together, you don't always have to see it the same way.
Now here is where we test ourselves, we find ourselves approaching the peak of the hill, ready to go over the other side. We approach the climax of population that Earth can sustain (12 or so billion), we face almost unimaginable changes in our very landscape and climate. All the while the most powerful nation on Earth that wants to remain as such, is crumbling at every corner and no one seems to care. So what becomes of us? Do we not get the bigger picture? Do we ignore our intuition and mothers, and fight for our survival? Or do we listen to their woes, and see how we can seek compromise? How many more wars must we fight without knowing why we truly fight, or why THEY truly fight?
just discovered a new fellow being !
Re sun charging you - not that strange in this era when one has to pay for drinking water and soon perhaps breathing too what with pollution - and at that there are the tanning equipment and salons that charge you for what sun does for free, without the benefits of health or vitamin D.
Vultures do share food equally among a flock; even if one dies, its food remains untouched by the others. Sorry about your 'eight nipples' theory, Bill :P
I understand what he is saying, but $ is a resource to get all other resources. More $ gives you more options. Keeping it doesn't mean you will necessarily live extravagantly . But if you are secure enough to unload it, and offer it where it will do more good then by all means. He is a better man than me. I like to think I'd keep a good ammount, have some working for me, and dedicate my lived life, AND some of it to the causes I care about
This man has some interesting ideas about anatomy.
Actually, many animals do operate by consensus. Take herd animals, on the range there will be many watering holes, how do you think the group decides on which one to go to? They each begin to look towards its preference, only when a critical mass is met in the query does the herd move towards it. This is consensus decision making in animals, yooglebing it for yourself.
bill maher can be such a sad view sometimes
Food for thought, he's a genius.
Actually all species are social, just some more than others.
Micro-organisms are actually very social, just not in the way we understand it. Micro-organisms have demonstrated both selfish and generous behavior in their own way.
Most predators hunt in packs or in teams, even the lone hunter brings food back to their community, anti-social predators are actually rarer and more prone to extinction.
Not all cats hunt, but it is in their instinct. Animals don't understand cruelty, human concept.
Holy shit i fucking love this guy.
needles120 sounds like Bernie Sanders..... on nature anyways
Low-resolution answers like communism and socialism to high-resolution EXTREMLY complex problems like 'the answer to EVERYTHING' socially and culturally (including economics) are NOT ENOUGH. Positive psychology is bullshit. See a certain professor of psychology at University of Toronto named Jordan. Carl Jung has more relevance than ever, and always will as he recognizes how studying myth, and acknowledging the shadow self, the part of ourselves we can't stand and often embracing the negative rather than trying to thwart it with simple answers, is in fact an answer in and of itself. Forget this "ism" nonsense, these totalitarianism and nihilistic (two opposites) based ideologies are nothing special anymore. The massive social experiments of the 20th century should have been enough to show, communism doesn't bring itself about naturally (it's not even communism when it doesn't), when it's forced by states it ceases to be anything good. Anyone deciding what other people 'need' is futile and leads to violence. These are low-resolution answers to 'the system', which is not low-resolution.
Frater Tenc I agree. What needs to be done is to understand this unity of all things, and to seek enlightenment on an individual basis. Then the system will change itself.
C'mon Bill, Humans are not heartless???
animals are capitalists unless they live in herds, etc.
whatever behaviors one could perhaps correctly label "communistic" in animals is A. remember no animal actually grasps abstract concepts like variations in possible societal wealth distribution philosophies. so B. whatever "generous" and "only taking what they need" behaviors are only done out of laziness, a lack of forsight, and the line evolution draws out of minimal but optimal (relative to species/individuals that dont survive) computational skills necessary to survive and thrive, and so C. is carved purely by evolutionary forces, it makes sense animals with practices that are more beneficial towards the species survival and thrival as a whole would come about, but there's no thought processes going on in the mind of animals that make them understand the concept of "ownership" or "sharing" or "strength in numbers" or any of that shit.
They operate purely on mindless reflexes for the most part. It's kind of sad, but true.
Exactly. Besides, what about lions, the males of which kill each others' cubs, or chimpanzees, which kill each other all the time. There has yet to be an example of any species that has formed a large, peaceful, pleasant communist society with millions of individuals, with the exception of eusocial insects, which have evolved to want to behave that way. Even in their case, they're all one enormous family and thus have an interest in helping each other out to pass on their genes. Similarly, there can be communist tribal societies or small settlements but soon diversity is introduced, the system breaks down.
Bill totally doesn't get it... He needs to take a big bong hit
I don't agree with this at all. he started out really bad. he said that animals take what they need unlike humans. NNNNOOO....for example a lion catches one gazelle because that's all it could catch because catching gazelles is FUCKING hard. this guy has too much of a romanticized version of nature.
+aperez12374 Absolutely. Could not agree more with that. Let us not even get to much in to the lion - gazelle thing. But there are plenty of creatures on this earth which simply don't follow this approach of "they take only what they need". To really follow that concept you have to be extremely selctive about everything that is in nature. I mean what about insects? fungy? Bacteria? Viruses? There are also certain rodents and mamals that continue to spread as much as they can, if they can, and not care about what ever if they need it or not. There are some exremly agressive creatures out there. There is no doubt that nature has developed countless of different strategies, from coorporation, to sharing, to herding, swarming. But there is no reason to declare one strategy as some kind of guideline. Doesn't mean we can not learn a lot from nature though.
We take stuff with us because we can imagine the future, If we don't continue to do that then our ancestors evolved for nothing.
But we evolved in groups, we need to look after those who cant. This argument sounds nice but its not reality.
*****
He can talk about what ever he want, but it doesn't mean that this is a common principle or rule in nature because there are countless creatures and living beeings that do not act like he describes it. Most insects for example, , amabea, bacteria/viruses, and even some mammals. Nature isn't always about a perfect balance. 99% of all the species in earths history are extinct. And even today there are countless species that die out even without the help of humans. If nature would be really like he describes it than no species would have to actually disapear, because all the creatures would only take what they need keeping a sort of balance. Which obviously not all creatures do. And thus sometimes a species disapears while others triumph.
*****
Germany, but my parents are from Serbia.