The thing about hobby groups is that they are a place for people to bond, share and discuss similar interests. This only works if you get joy out of experiencing/sharing special interests with other people, but not if you just like to be completely absorbed in it by yourself. Also, whenever you join a new club/group (unless it's relatively new) you will be ignored largely at first because you're the new person and WILL need to go out of your way to socialise and make an effort to get to know others in the initial stages to eventually be fully accepted into the group. Nobody, not even NT's like being the new person for this very reason.
This is so real. Other people always think it's weird that I don't want to talk about my interests that I spend everyday of my life thinking about/working on
My roommate and I went to a silent book club because we like to read and thought it would be interesting. It was supposed to be an hour of reading and then everyone could either leave after an hour or spend some time talking to the other people around about the books we were reading. Anyway what it ended up being was about 200 people filling a local gastropub, holding books (not reading) and talking loudly amongst their table groups, ordering and consuming food and drinks. To me, the event was a failure and not what it was described as, but everyone else seemed to have a great social time, and I can't really reconcile that except to just opt out of doing it again. As an autistic person I find things like this really confusing and the reason I keep my hobbies to myself most of the time.
I've had the same experience with "study groups" at college - turning up with my study materials, hoping to discuss the studies, only to have people chitchatting about random smalltalk, and it feeling like a waste of time and energy. I don't know whether I trust clubs to be what they say they are any more (also autistic). There's a tiny part of me that still wonders whether I might enjoy studying with other people if that's what we actually did, but as experience has taught me otherwise, I prefer studying by myself. I also have issues with anxiety and working memory so, like Dana said, sometimes I just struggle to talk about my special interests because I don't remember stuff about them at the time I'm supposed to, or my memory is more emotions/experience based than facts based. It is frustrating. I can definitely see the appeal of something like a Silent Book Club (if that's actually what it was).
I'm sorry that happened, I would also hate that. I would be so excited to go, thinking it's some kind of parallel play situation and then would be so disappointed.
Ya I've been playing dnd since I was about 13, almost ten years now. When I was in high school, I taught DOZENS of people to play, invited them over, went to their places, engaged with them as people all to play with them. When I got to Uni, people were farther away, emotionally, I didn't know anyone that well anymore. I only pulled together a couple of groups and even then the groups petered out almost immediately. After all these years, there are five people I've met that actually want to play, and we try and play once a week every week. I call these five my friends, and sure in high school we hung out a lot and did stuff together, but these days we just video call to play and then hang up and go about our lives. On one hand, the average rpg group only lasts two or three of sessions, but on the other hand, you'd think after teaching nearly a hundred people to play I would have made a few more friends. I'll keep trying when I build up the confidence to build more ttrpg groups, but it's always gonna be tough, and basically impossible with strangers. The worst part is always the NT instinct to say 'wow that's so cool, we should play sometime' and then never follow up lol. Also, I definitely relate to the sentiment of just not liking many people. My psych said I'd probably be a lot happier with just 2 or 3 ND friends, and I explained to them how I only really like maybe one in a hundred people, and maybe only one in a hundred people like me, so the odds say that I'll make a friend roughly every ten thousand people I meet, assuming we actually talk and aren't too nervous to actually try. To be honest, I'm probably beating the odds, having made 2 new friends in the past 4 years, I just wish I had friends that lived in the same town and actively invited me to stuff, you know? I want the kind of friend who could show up announced and I would find the surprise enjoyable instead of stressful. Well, here's to the perpetual struggle.
NOOO YOU'RE SO RIGHT! My special interest is Lilo and Stitch and I feel so like selfish over it, especially my favorite character. "You don't love them the way I do, so I don't want to talk about it to you."
I wish I had a magic solution... The thing that helped me recently was a group organised by my city's social work, intended for young people (18-35 or smth) who were currently at home due to depression, burnout, anxiety, etc. We very quickly managed to create a very safe space and were able to talk about our respective issues, including difficulties with socialising. The thing that really helped me was that it was a guided activity; it was 6 of us and 2 social workers. So for me that meant people who could help me participate if I didn't know how to speak up or do the whole social thing. I was in the group for about 4 months, and since then I've actually met up with two of the other participants who I really liked.
Socializing is immensely stressful to me too. I breakdown every single time I have to leave my house to socialize, no matter who will be there. I also like to do my hobbies alone because I want to zone in and not be distracted by having to communicate.
This is super relatable, I've never seen someone express this feeling before but I totally get the struggle of not fitting in anywhere and not getting along with anyone even if they're perfectly nice people and I like them in theory, actually interacting with them is a totally different story and I've now come to accept it (most of the time, sometimes it's still a hard pill to swallow). The thing about being 27 too, I'm only 21 but I've had the same experience of people always telling me to try harder or to 'not use autism as an excuse' even though I've tried very hard to build social skills and I only 'use autism as an excuse' because it is truly the only thing that explains it at this point. Normal people don't get it and I always notice a big shift in how they interact with me when they first meet me vs after a while of knowing me and learning that I don't know how to interact with them like a normal person. Whenever I start something new (ie new school, uni, new job, new acquaintance) I tell myself "I'm going to try harder this time and I'll be a normal person from now on" and I do the smalltalk thing and I make eye contact and whatever but in the end, it never lasts more than a few weeks because I'm just inherently different to these people and the mask always slips and I revert to being that weird awkward person who no one really likes. My social skills never improve and nothing really changes.
I thought you put yourself down in this vid. I keep coming back to your vids and I don't think you're boring. You have over 11,000 subscribers, so these videos must be good. I wouldn't have the confidence to put myself on TH-cam, and I am 58. The fact that you have this channel and put out the content you do shows you are worthwhile spending time with. I like how honest you are about stuff, no point in hanging out with people you don't like. I have friends, but I feel like I could do with some who are unusual like me in my way as I am on the spectrum. One friend likes to do things alone, it recharges their batteries, that is how they are and that is what they need, shame because that friend is great to be around. The town where I live seems to have places where you get to know others and perhaps strike up friendships. I met people in the park nearly 20 years ago, we don't go there now, but I still see some of them from time to time. I also became friends with the friends of a person I met, more than them, it's odd how you meet people.
Dana's ok . She has a lot going on in her life. It's not all easy and she keeps dealing with it. It's nice to hear hints of other plans, too. As you point out, she's managing and growing this channel pretty well. I mean, asking us what we think - if that's not professionalism, I don't know what is :) I don't have friends at all and find all relationships complicated. Don't get me wrong, I'm not unhappy - getting away from people has been a relief, but I would say that not having that social connection affects you in ways you wouldn't expect, even without worrying about he dementia risk. I can write, but I can't write anything anyone wants to read, because I don't have those connections. Obviously, 'Don't be around people you don't like, or don't trust, or who just bring the chaos', but a lack of rizz is not a crime. It is not even necessarily to do with the person - some days every interaction is like that. Dana seems quite creative, and I think it is true that creative people can use more input for their art, so I wouldn't encourage her to pull away from people. As far as meeting people generally is concerned, I think it has always been hard. I wouldn't want to use an app like they do today - that seems like more nightmare fuel. I used to go to drawing classes and they were always in the most depressing part of winter. I really was trying to meet people, but I never did. I was always focussed on making accurate line drawings, so the art teachers hated everything I did, I barely spoke to anyone (I still don't) and would rush away as soon as I could. In retrospect, you can see why it didn't work out.
@@kr1221E Thank you for your concern, (though ...erm.. I think you might want to rephrase that slightly..) and I only ever thought it was a encouraging post towards Dana (we aren't connected), I just have a slightly different perspective on account of my social difficulties. My sister takes the same view as you about a similar sort of thing. She feels my mother was wrong to encourage her to give people a chance romantically, but I don't see it that way. I am sorry, also, if I am a bit verbose or say the wrong things. I have a very prosaic way of expressing myself. I don't mean harm. I am only trying to engage with this content. I am just a few years younger than you, and this is all quite new to me and even though (like everybody else) I identify quite strongly with some of the autistic content creators on TH-cam, including Dana. It is kind of hard to believe I could spend so much of my life without knowing such an important thing about myself as I have done and it needs a lot of processing.
I feel the same about hobby groups. I'm part of a drumming group, but I think I like it because it's very stimmy to drum in a group & we don't chat much during practice 🤣
I'm sorry Dana that sucks! I feel that way about music. What I feel and hear when it's in my headphones vs in a car with someone might as well be two completely different songs. I feel like hobby groups can be a bit shallow and it sounds like you are looking for a deeper friendship not a knitting 'buddy.'
I feel the same... I'm 37 and still struggle to meet people and socialise. All my interest are very much solo but if like to share my interests with someone and enjoy them together. In the past I've used things like meetup and Facebook social groups to find new people however have the same issue with meeting people and maybe not getting on or nothing happening. Everyone's advice is just keep trying. But there's only so much trying we can do really. So one recently said to me go and do something you are interested in or to see somoenthing you like and take a book and brew and sit and enjoy your own company. Someone may come and say hi. I really want to try archery so I'm. Going to find a group and do that. It's something that I can do on my own and if I take a book and read when waiting or after someone may see and start a conversation
No one that I encounter ever talks about their love of visiting filming locations, and I find it so great that it's a fellow autistic person who mentions it. I visited Toronto, and spent most of the time there visiting locations where "Scott Pilgrim vs The World" was filmed, and it was one of my happiest trips. I have no friends, so I have no advice to give. All of my hobbies are also "alone" hobbies, and I can't sew/craft and talk to people at the same time, anyway.
Thank you so much for talking about not wanting to share your special interest with other fans!!! I have felt this way about some of my special interests too, and I didn't know that was something other people experienced as well. I only got diagnosed autistic 3 years ago (at age 37) and I realized that I forced myself to socialize too much in the past. I'm naturally extroverted, but I would push myself over my limits to try and make/keep friends. I was highly masking and compensating, and it definitely took a huge toll on me. Now, I'm severely chronically ill and haven't been able to work, study or have a social life in ~10 years. While I don't think the masking and compensating caused it, it DEFINITELY contributed to my decline. I miss having friends, but I just don't have the spoons anymore... :/
I don’t think I have ever heard a description of this particular situation better articulated. Thank you for making it word, so I can better explain it to people who want me to do people things 😊 Much like yourself, and I imagine many of us, I became proficient in doing my own thing, in my own wee world from a very early age. I was consistently reported as “not integrating within peer group”. I’m late diagnosed at thirty-several, and I’m sure many of us shared this sentiment in concluding that we were inherently weird, or fundamentally unlikable. It doesn’t help that a vast majority of us are put through absolute purgatory in school - pretty much consolidating the sense of otherness into an entirely self sufficient unit. We cannot develop crucial social skills because we are actively excluded from doing so. It’s like a lesson we can never attend: we’re in the corridor while everyone else is in class. I think solitary and specific interests are sanctuary for many of us. The concept of opening up my sanctuary and attempting to make it a social thing seems kind of absurd to me. I get that we’re supposed to find kinship in “likeminded” people who share our interests, but it’s rarely like that. In order for you to make connections with people, you have to interact with them - but it’s exhausting, bewildering, uncomfortable (perhaps for them, as much as for you?) and ultimately makes you want to engage with people even less.
I feel ya. My social interactions are limited to 1 to 2 people at work while working and comment sections on TH-cam. Just because you have similar interests as someone it definitely doesn't make it easier or likely that you can get on with them. Socializing is a nightmare.
Dana you are one of the most relatable people in the autistic community for me. I also hate talking about special interests as I internalise it mostly and I don't know how to communicate it well other than I'm passionate about them. I maybe am a little harsh on myself but my social skills are fairly lacking as I have few friends and wish I had more but it simply hard to find ANYTHING worth saying to most people that isn't mega cringe.
I love His Dark Materials, and I did the Philip Pullman tour of Oxford. I saw the filing locations of the Golden Compass film and His Dark Materials TV series.
Well /I/ am personally interested in your lyrics. Not sure if they’re a thing you’d want to share without the support of a band, but I’m here for it. I’ve been looking for a therapist for almost a year now. Weekly appointments, without insurance, and still I don’t have one that works for me in a basic way. It’s really frustrating that I struggle so badly to connect with people, and with therapy/psychology as a special interest… I try not to be picky, but I don’t want to know more about the theory of therapy than my fucking therapist does….
Like how much to we really need to build social skills? We already speak english ... can we just hang around people with whom we can set boundaries and feel safe and be in no rush to learn more? I'm pushed into social settings by people who I am supposed to be able to trust and know how much it sucks for me. They don't seem to care, they refuse to accept me and need me to change to be like them and it really sucks. The truth is that dealing with strangers we don't trust is painful. We shouldn't have to repeatedly traumatize ourselves so our pain management gets better if we can easily avoid it, right?
I can relate, I've been just doing my own thing and enjoying things alone for hobbies mostly, and realised I'm a bit too isolated now, so I'm wanting to reach out to others again but don't know the best way to find like minded people, and I'm out of practice.
I find it hard to find people that like the same interest while being open enough to accept my specific type or level of interest in that thing to exist and still be cool with me. And then I want friends that have more than just that specific interest in common with me (we don't need everything to be in common but at least a few), so that when my focus isn't on that particular interest, I still have a friend. And then there's the fact that I hate small talk but also don't trust people enough to have more than surface level communication because I don't want to be seen as weird. 😩
Do you have experience with autism or Less Wrong meetups in the UK? (Almost everyone at Less Wrong meetups is autistic, so the second is sort of a subset of the first.) Or effective altruism meetups? (Also high rate of autistic people.) I was at the Less Wrong Community Weekend a few days ago, and it was amazing! I constantly ran into new people and within minutes we had established that we're both autistic, and then started discussing our traumas, special interests, kinks, exploitative exes/parents/bosses/et al., so delightfully inappropriate topics for the first ten minutes of meeting someone! They even had stickers to indicate preferences around touch (hugs) and conversation norms. Admittedly, I can seem extroverted from the perspective of people who are even more introverted than me, and I've overcome a lot of my social anxieties, which makes all of that easier, but I figured I put it out there just in case it's helpful after all.
I get it. I have gotten involved in certain online groups for some music groups I'm interested in. And online its great but as soon as I go to a concert or something in person with people liking the group, I just can't engage past just enjoying the concert. I am still trying to figure out social aspects too. Great video!
Mate, if you want to make music and you know how it should sound but you can't play instruments or anything like that, get something like ableton or logic where you can produce music instead. You can get packs like bbc symphony orchestra and LABS that give you instruments to play with, you can either use your computer or laptop keyboard or you can see the notes in front of you and edit them. There are tablet workstations if you don't have a computer, and I know there are some music apps for phones. They can cost a bit but you can get cheaper ones. I love making music but I can't play instruments and I know exactly what I want to do, I can have total control over what I make. The music I make is really weird and I don't really care what anyone thinks. I couldnt ever get in a band due to my social skills and always wanted to, but this is great and i prefer it now. I also use my phone to record and then put the recording in the workstation. Anyway hope that's helpful.
With my financial position I’ve had a go at using GarageBand a few times and…well, it sounds like someone that doesn’t really know what they were doing had a go on GarageBand, and I kept doing it for a long while thinking I’d get better, so it’d start sounding better, and just didn’t improve. Do you know if that’s more likely to be a me issue, or if it is a GarageBand thing and I’d likely have better luck investing in something like logic or ableton?
@@DanaAndersen Many creative apps like that specialize in a specific workflow & user interface and differentiate themselves with that. The problem is that as a beginner it's difficult to figure out what fits, and it always takes practice to become kinda decent. At least in my case that always leads me down a rabbit hole for days before I even decided if I like it at all. I'm afraid I don't have a clear solution either, but that kind of reminds me of Michael Jackson who supposedly never learned to write sheet music and composed everything by singing & beatboxing into a voice recorder whenever he got an idea.
Dana, if you want to do something with music, I’d recommend maybe learning guitar or piano. Maybe you won’t be able to do it in a band, but you can probably do solo work. Maybe you can get a friend (if you have a musician friend) to help. Personally, I’m in a similar situation. I want to start a metal band, but finding people who have the same drive and passion as me is f*cking difficult. Partially because I don’t leave my house (I can’t drive) and because my parents are weird about me using social media (they’re really controlling, even though I’m 20). I plan on starting my band after I move out, and trying to post my guitar stuff on TH-cam, TikTok and Instagram.
While I've had friends over the years, I realised only recently that the reason I struggle with maintaining them and being consistent is because I'm more introverted than I realised. I might want to do something multiple times in a month, then have several months where I just don't want to meet anyone and I focus on my own solo hobbies. And I also have never found anyone I perfectly click with. University societies were probably the easiest place I found to meet people, because most of them were like clubs which we vaguely had a shared interest but we weren't going there just to talk about that interest, like you say that would just be boring and there's not much to say on it. Most people were there just to meet others rather than focus on the shared interest, and even if you only liked 1/20 of the people there it at least gave you more exposure to people so you can find that one person you are more similar to. Since graduating though, I've never found clubs that feel similar for adults rather than students, and it's just so much hard work now to meet people. I kind of wish there were clubs based on personality types rather than a hobbies. I've found that it's fine having friends that share no interests with each other, as long as we are similar in terms of personality and we are both fine talking/hearing about the other person's interests even if we don't share them. I think there's an expectation that people need friends, but I'm starting to question how important it is, and I guess that's going to be individual to everyone. There's lots of different kind of friendships and I think it's easier to find the right kind of person if you know what you want to give and get out of the friendship, whether that's just someone to go places with, or tell about something cool you've discovered etc. wow this has been a ramble and a half, sorry about that 😂
Having to take a year and half rest before trying again is so relatable 🙃 In typical ADHD fashion I could give you a million hobby's mainly because I'm bouncing between several hobbies at any one time 😂
Why are people so hard to connect with? I like people. People are cool. When I watch them go about their business or when they talk about their interests, dreams and goals with enthusiasm, when they let their 'weird' out. I really like that. But whenever I meet actual people in actual life, It's dry like the Sahara desert. Or it's plain confusing and I feel like I'm missing context for everything and no one is bothering to catch me up. And I've gotten better at conversation, at expressing myself, at asking questions to motivate people to speak... But it's still so hard to build connection. No matter how many times we meet it still feels like tip-toeing around each other. It makes me wonder if they are fine with it being this way and if it's fulfilling for them or they also don't know how to connect better.
Hi Dana, with regards to your first thoughts about developing social skills, have you tried mirroring someone that is already good at it? The idea is to find someone who is good at social interaction already, who you can be close to in person, and then they interact and you pay attention to what they are doing and repeat those things in your mind. Don't try to logically analyze it, just notice and repeat. The idea here is that you're developing connections between things that are appropriate to say, with visual and other sensory information of the kinds of situations they are being said in. It is then training the subconscious brain, such that when you are exposed to the same situation again, those things get triggered subconsciously and you know how to act. Much like learning a musical instrument, this kind of thing needs to be practiced regularly, and won't be remembered if it isn't due to the forgetting curve. I suspect that a lot of the social difficulty experienced by autistic people is actually not that heavily related to the autistic neurotype directly, but is rather: - Many autistic people have reduced herd instinct, they are driven by what they personally want to do, and won't engage with things if they don't see value in it. So if they don't see value in interacting with other people at a young age, they may not choose to mirror those behaviors. - Many autistic people's parents also have trouble with social skills, emotional regulation and other things, and are thus unable to effectively model these to a child because it is 'missing information' for them. This is probably the case for you due to what you've discussed about your parents before. - You are trying to develop social skills as an adult in an environment surrounded by 'experts' and thus the communications that are happening are at expert level complexity, while someone learning as a child and teenager 'normally', is exposed to gradually more complex things slowly over a period of time.
As regards making new friends I speak theoretically as I have no success in that area but probably the best way to make new friends is to already have friends who can make introductions, etc. That though is little use for the person who doesn't already have many friends. For autists there's an added problem because even with introductions it's difficult to know what to do next. it's a little like getting into a car and then not knowing how to drive it. In the past I did meet more people at work and got on okay and sometimes well with them but rarely did it move into friendship. I didn't really know how to move things forward. Many people make connections with others because they talk a lot about their partners, children, families and other social things but I didn't have those so I wasn't bringing much to the table. I didn't like talking about my personal life and maybe that made me seem too difficult to know. I think this may be true for many with autism as we don't have all those personal relationships to draw upon.
My interests are really too "niche" and obscure to connect with other people. I'm also interested in TV programmes but mostly ones from decades ago so it's not even possible to connect with fans of current TV. I don't discuss my interests with the few people I meet because it would be pointless as they're things most people either haven't heard of or are not interested in. It is usually possible to find people with those interests online and we might discuss aspects of a show, etc, but it doesn't go any further than that, at least not for me. To be frank I'd feel a bit apprehensive if anyone then suggested discussing anything else or getting onto personal matters. For me friendships - especially new ones - just bring new anxieties so for me it seems easier to be alone. Some interests can be done with others - indeed many enjoy that - but like you I prefer to follow my interests alone. For example if I'm watching a show or listening to music I'd find it distracting to have someone making comments or expecting me to respond. i might do that afterwards but not during.
Dude seriously...in my twenties - after realizing I'm factually gay - I got immensely hyped about joining the "LGBT community" and going to club meetings. It soon turned out just having the same kinda sexual interest was not gonna help me feel connected. Gay clubbing was the absolute worst...sweaty loud people getting completely wasted and trying to pick one-night stands while dancing to Shakira ('twas way back then) 😆
Have you tried using one of those music making apps to try get music to your lyrics? Interacting with one person is hard, add another person and I stress over how Im supposed to split my attention equally between them.
tell me am i thee only who is discriminated at the bus, i mean, the public transport in general, i sit still quiet in my seat and somebody comes and sits at my side, i'm looking at the landscape and the person at my side keeps ataring me, like thinking that i am crazy, affff, can i not be leave in peace even in the bus?????? well, i don't know why.
The thing about hobby groups is that they are a place for people to bond, share and discuss similar interests. This only works if you get joy out of experiencing/sharing special interests with other people, but not if you just like to be completely absorbed in it by yourself. Also, whenever you join a new club/group (unless it's relatively new) you will be ignored largely at first because you're the new person and WILL need to go out of your way to socialise and make an effort to get to know others in the initial stages to eventually be fully accepted into the group. Nobody, not even NT's like being the new person for this very reason.
This is so real. Other people always think it's weird that I don't want to talk about my interests that I spend everyday of my life thinking about/working on
My roommate and I went to a silent book club because we like to read and thought it would be interesting. It was supposed to be an hour of reading and then everyone could either leave after an hour or spend some time talking to the other people around about the books we were reading. Anyway what it ended up being was about 200 people filling a local gastropub, holding books (not reading) and talking loudly amongst their table groups, ordering and consuming food and drinks. To me, the event was a failure and not what it was described as, but everyone else seemed to have a great social time, and I can't really reconcile that except to just opt out of doing it again. As an autistic person I find things like this really confusing and the reason I keep my hobbies to myself most of the time.
Sounds like a case where most people simply don't mind that it's not as advertised, being unaware that some people don't like surprises.
I've had the same experience with "study groups" at college - turning up with my study materials, hoping to discuss the studies, only to have people chitchatting about random smalltalk, and it feeling like a waste of time and energy. I don't know whether I trust clubs to be what they say they are any more (also autistic).
There's a tiny part of me that still wonders whether I might enjoy studying with other people if that's what we actually did, but as experience has taught me otherwise, I prefer studying by myself.
I also have issues with anxiety and working memory so, like Dana said, sometimes I just struggle to talk about my special interests because I don't remember stuff about them at the time I'm supposed to, or my memory is more emotions/experience based than facts based. It is frustrating. I can definitely see the appeal of something like a Silent Book Club (if that's actually what it was).
I'm sorry that happened, I would also hate that. I would be so excited to go, thinking it's some kind of parallel play situation and then would be so disappointed.
Ya I've been playing dnd since I was about 13, almost ten years now. When I was in high school, I taught DOZENS of people to play, invited them over, went to their places, engaged with them as people all to play with them. When I got to Uni, people were farther away, emotionally, I didn't know anyone that well anymore. I only pulled together a couple of groups and even then the groups petered out almost immediately. After all these years, there are five people I've met that actually want to play, and we try and play once a week every week. I call these five my friends, and sure in high school we hung out a lot and did stuff together, but these days we just video call to play and then hang up and go about our lives.
On one hand, the average rpg group only lasts two or three of sessions, but on the other hand, you'd think after teaching nearly a hundred people to play I would have made a few more friends. I'll keep trying when I build up the confidence to build more ttrpg groups, but it's always gonna be tough, and basically impossible with strangers. The worst part is always the NT instinct to say 'wow that's so cool, we should play sometime' and then never follow up lol.
Also, I definitely relate to the sentiment of just not liking many people. My psych said I'd probably be a lot happier with just 2 or 3 ND friends, and I explained to them how I only really like maybe one in a hundred people, and maybe only one in a hundred people like me, so the odds say that I'll make a friend roughly every ten thousand people I meet, assuming we actually talk and aren't too nervous to actually try. To be honest, I'm probably beating the odds, having made 2 new friends in the past 4 years, I just wish I had friends that lived in the same town and actively invited me to stuff, you know? I want the kind of friend who could show up announced and I would find the surprise enjoyable instead of stressful. Well, here's to the perpetual struggle.
NOOO YOU'RE SO RIGHT! My special interest is Lilo and Stitch and I feel so like selfish over it, especially my favorite character. "You don't love them the way I do, so I don't want to talk about it to you."
I wish I had a magic solution... The thing that helped me recently was a group organised by my city's social work, intended for young people (18-35 or smth) who were currently at home due to depression, burnout, anxiety, etc. We very quickly managed to create a very safe space and were able to talk about our respective issues, including difficulties with socialising. The thing that really helped me was that it was a guided activity; it was 6 of us and 2 social workers. So for me that meant people who could help me participate if I didn't know how to speak up or do the whole social thing. I was in the group for about 4 months, and since then I've actually met up with two of the other participants who I really liked.
Socializing is immensely stressful to me too. I breakdown every single time I have to leave my house to socialize, no matter who will be there. I also like to do my hobbies alone because I want to zone in and not be distracted by having to communicate.
This is super relatable, I've never seen someone express this feeling before but I totally get the struggle of not fitting in anywhere and not getting along with anyone even if they're perfectly nice people and I like them in theory, actually interacting with them is a totally different story and I've now come to accept it (most of the time, sometimes it's still a hard pill to swallow).
The thing about being 27 too, I'm only 21 but I've had the same experience of people always telling me to try harder or to 'not use autism as an excuse' even though I've tried very hard to build social skills and I only 'use autism as an excuse' because it is truly the only thing that explains it at this point. Normal people don't get it and I always notice a big shift in how they interact with me when they first meet me vs after a while of knowing me and learning that I don't know how to interact with them like a normal person. Whenever I start something new (ie new school, uni, new job, new acquaintance) I tell myself "I'm going to try harder this time and I'll be a normal person from now on" and I do the smalltalk thing and I make eye contact and whatever but in the end, it never lasts more than a few weeks because I'm just inherently different to these people and the mask always slips and I revert to being that weird awkward person who no one really likes. My social skills never improve and nothing really changes.
I thought you put yourself down in this vid. I keep coming back to your vids and I don't think you're boring. You have over 11,000 subscribers, so these videos must be good. I wouldn't have the confidence to put myself on TH-cam, and I am 58. The fact that you have this channel and put out the content you do shows you are worthwhile spending time with. I like how honest you are about stuff, no point in hanging out with people you don't like. I have friends, but I feel like I could do with some who are unusual like me in my way as I am on the spectrum. One friend likes to do things alone, it recharges their batteries, that is how they are and that is what they need, shame because that friend is great to be around. The town where I live seems to have places where you get to know others and perhaps strike up friendships. I met people in the park nearly 20 years ago, we don't go there now, but I still see some of them from time to time. I also became friends with the friends of a person I met, more than them, it's odd how you meet people.
Dana's ok .
She has a lot going on in her life. It's not all easy and she keeps dealing with it. It's nice to hear hints of other plans, too.
As you point out, she's managing and growing this channel pretty well. I mean, asking us what we think - if that's not professionalism, I don't know what is :)
I don't have friends at all and find all relationships complicated. Don't get me wrong, I'm not unhappy - getting away from people has been a relief, but I would say that not having that social connection affects you in ways you wouldn't expect, even without worrying about he dementia risk. I can write, but I can't write anything anyone wants to read, because I don't have those connections. Obviously, 'Don't be around people you don't like, or don't trust, or who just bring the chaos', but a lack of rizz is not a crime. It is not even necessarily to do with the person - some days every interaction is like that. Dana seems quite creative, and I think it is true that creative people can use more input for their art, so I wouldn't encourage her to pull away from people.
As far as meeting people generally is concerned, I think it has always been hard. I wouldn't want to use an app like they do today - that seems like more nightmare fuel. I used to go to drawing classes and they were always in the most depressing part of winter. I really was trying to meet people, but I never did. I was always focussed on making accurate line drawings, so the art teachers hated everything I did, I barely spoke to anyone (I still don't) and would rush away as soon as I could. In retrospect, you can see why it didn't work out.
@@Katielouise262 Thank you for sharing your story. I wish for you and Dana to be happy.
@@kr1221E Thank you for your concern, (though ...erm.. I think you might want to rephrase that slightly..) and I only ever thought it was a encouraging post towards Dana (we aren't connected), I just have a slightly different perspective on account of my social difficulties. My sister takes the same view as you about a similar sort of thing. She feels my mother was wrong to encourage her to give people a chance romantically, but I don't see it that way.
I am sorry, also, if I am a bit verbose or say the wrong things. I have a very prosaic way of expressing myself. I don't mean harm. I am only trying to engage with this content. I am just a few years younger than you, and this is all quite new to me and even though (like everybody else) I identify quite strongly with some of the autistic content creators on TH-cam, including Dana. It is kind of hard to believe I could spend so much of my life without knowing such an important thing about myself as I have done and it needs a lot of processing.
I feel the same about hobby groups. I'm part of a drumming group, but I think I like it because it's very stimmy to drum in a group & we don't chat much during practice 🤣
I'm sorry Dana that sucks! I feel that way about music. What I feel and hear when it's in my headphones vs in a car with someone might as well be two completely different songs. I feel like hobby groups can be a bit shallow and it sounds like you are looking for a deeper friendship not a knitting 'buddy.'
Hello Dana. Great video, great topic. I have the same issues. 👍
I feel the same... I'm 37 and still struggle to meet people and socialise.
All my interest are very much solo but if like to share my interests with someone and enjoy them together.
In the past I've used things like meetup and Facebook social groups to find new people however have the same issue with meeting people and maybe not getting on or nothing happening.
Everyone's advice is just keep trying. But there's only so much trying we can do really.
So one recently said to me go and do something you are interested in or to see somoenthing you like and take a book and brew and sit and enjoy your own company. Someone may come and say hi.
I really want to try archery so I'm. Going to find a group and do that. It's something that I can do on my own and if I take a book and read when waiting or after someone may see and start a conversation
love the new hair... your so cool Dana! normal ppl aren't even ready for genuine sweet ppl... they didn't know what to do with that tbh
No one that I encounter ever talks about their love of visiting filming locations, and I find it so great that it's a fellow autistic person who mentions it. I visited Toronto, and spent most of the time there visiting locations where "Scott Pilgrim vs The World" was filmed, and it was one of my happiest trips. I have no friends, so I have no advice to give. All of my hobbies are also "alone" hobbies, and I can't sew/craft and talk to people at the same time, anyway.
Thank you so much for talking about not wanting to share your special interest with other fans!!! I have felt this way about some of my special interests too, and I didn't know that was something other people experienced as well. I only got diagnosed autistic 3 years ago (at age 37) and I realized that I forced myself to socialize too much in the past. I'm naturally extroverted, but I would push myself over my limits to try and make/keep friends. I was highly masking and compensating, and it definitely took a huge toll on me. Now, I'm severely chronically ill and haven't been able to work, study or have a social life in ~10 years. While I don't think the masking and compensating caused it, it DEFINITELY contributed to my decline. I miss having friends, but I just don't have the spoons anymore... :/
I don’t think I have ever heard a description of this particular situation better articulated. Thank you for making it word, so I can better explain it to people who want me to do people things 😊
Much like yourself, and I imagine many of us, I became proficient in doing my own thing, in my own wee world from a very early age. I was consistently reported as “not integrating within peer group”. I’m late diagnosed at thirty-several, and I’m sure many of us shared this sentiment in concluding that we were inherently weird, or fundamentally unlikable. It doesn’t help that a vast majority of us are put through absolute purgatory in school - pretty much consolidating the sense of otherness into an entirely self sufficient unit. We cannot develop crucial social skills because we are actively excluded from doing so. It’s like a lesson we can never attend: we’re in the corridor while everyone else is in class.
I think solitary and specific interests are sanctuary for many of us. The concept of opening up my sanctuary and attempting to make it a social thing seems kind of absurd to me. I get that we’re supposed to find kinship in “likeminded” people who share our interests, but it’s rarely like that. In order for you to make connections with people, you have to interact with them - but it’s exhausting, bewildering, uncomfortable (perhaps for them, as much as for you?) and ultimately makes you want to engage with people even less.
I feel ya. My social interactions are limited to 1 to 2 people at work while working and comment sections on TH-cam. Just because you have similar interests as someone it definitely doesn't make it easier or likely that you can get on with them. Socializing is a nightmare.
Dana you are one of the most relatable people in the autistic community for me. I also hate talking about special interests as I internalise it mostly and I don't know how to communicate it well other than I'm passionate about them. I maybe am a little harsh on myself but my social skills are fairly lacking as I have few friends and wish I had more but it simply hard to find ANYTHING worth saying to most people that isn't mega cringe.
I love His Dark Materials, and I did the Philip Pullman tour of Oxford. I saw the filing locations of the Golden Compass film and His Dark Materials TV series.
Well /I/ am personally interested in your lyrics. Not sure if they’re a thing you’d want to share without the support of a band, but I’m here for it.
I’ve been looking for a therapist for almost a year now. Weekly appointments, without insurance, and still I don’t have one that works for me in a basic way. It’s really frustrating that I struggle so badly to connect with people, and with therapy/psychology as a special interest… I try not to be picky, but I don’t want to know more about the theory of therapy than my fucking therapist does….
Like how much to we really need to build social skills? We already speak english ... can we just hang around people with whom we can set boundaries and feel safe and be in no rush to learn more? I'm pushed into social settings by people who I am supposed to be able to trust and know how much it sucks for me. They don't seem to care, they refuse to accept me and need me to change to be like them and it really sucks. The truth is that dealing with strangers we don't trust is painful. We shouldn't have to repeatedly traumatize ourselves so our pain management gets better if we can easily avoid it, right?
Thankyou for expressing this!!!! I absolutely completely relate and it's been so hard to put words to.
I can relate, I've been just doing my own thing and enjoying things alone for hobbies mostly, and realised I'm a bit too isolated now, so I'm wanting to reach out to others again but don't know the best way to find like minded people, and I'm out of practice.
I find it hard to find people that like the same interest while being open enough to accept my specific type or level of interest in that thing to exist and still be cool with me. And then I want friends that have more than just that specific interest in common with me (we don't need everything to be in common but at least a few), so that when my focus isn't on that particular interest, I still have a friend.
And then there's the fact that I hate small talk but also don't trust people enough to have more than surface level communication because I don't want to be seen as weird. 😩
Do you have experience with autism or Less Wrong meetups in the UK? (Almost everyone at Less Wrong meetups is autistic, so the second is sort of a subset of the first.) Or effective altruism meetups? (Also high rate of autistic people.) I was at the Less Wrong Community Weekend a few days ago, and it was amazing! I constantly ran into new people and within minutes we had established that we're both autistic, and then started discussing our traumas, special interests, kinks, exploitative exes/parents/bosses/et al., so delightfully inappropriate topics for the first ten minutes of meeting someone! They even had stickers to indicate preferences around touch (hugs) and conversation norms. Admittedly, I can seem extroverted from the perspective of people who are even more introverted than me, and I've overcome a lot of my social anxieties, which makes all of that easier, but I figured I put it out there just in case it's helpful after all.
I get it. I have gotten involved in certain online groups for some music groups I'm interested in. And online its great but as soon as I go to a concert or something in person with people liking the group, I just can't engage past just enjoying the concert. I am still trying to figure out social aspects too. Great video!
Mate, if you want to make music and you know how it should sound but you can't play instruments or anything like that, get something like ableton or logic where you can produce music instead. You can get packs like bbc symphony orchestra and LABS that give you instruments to play with, you can either use your computer or laptop keyboard or you can see the notes in front of you and edit them. There are tablet workstations if you don't have a computer, and I know there are some music apps for phones. They can cost a bit but you can get cheaper ones. I love making music but I can't play instruments and I know exactly what I want to do, I can have total control over what I make. The music I make is really weird and I don't really care what anyone thinks. I couldnt ever get in a band due to my social skills and always wanted to, but this is great and i prefer it now. I also use my phone to record and then put the recording in the workstation. Anyway hope that's helpful.
With my financial position I’ve had a go at using GarageBand a few times and…well, it sounds like someone that doesn’t really know what they were doing had a go on GarageBand, and I kept doing it for a long while thinking I’d get better, so it’d start sounding better, and just didn’t improve. Do you know if that’s more likely to be a me issue, or if it is a GarageBand thing and I’d likely have better luck investing in something like logic or ableton?
@@DanaAndersen Many creative apps like that specialize in a specific workflow & user interface and differentiate themselves with that. The problem is that as a beginner it's difficult to figure out what fits, and it always takes practice to become kinda decent. At least in my case that always leads me down a rabbit hole for days before I even decided if I like it at all. I'm afraid I don't have a clear solution either, but that kind of reminds me of Michael Jackson who supposedly never learned to write sheet music and composed everything by singing & beatboxing into a voice recorder whenever he got an idea.
Dana, if you want to do something with music, I’d recommend maybe learning guitar or piano. Maybe you won’t be able to do it in a band, but you can probably do solo work. Maybe you can get a friend (if you have a musician friend) to help.
Personally, I’m in a similar situation. I want to start a metal band, but finding people who have the same drive and passion as me is f*cking difficult. Partially because I don’t leave my house (I can’t drive) and because my parents are weird about me using social media (they’re really controlling, even though I’m 20). I plan on starting my band after I move out, and trying to post my guitar stuff on TH-cam, TikTok and Instagram.
While I've had friends over the years, I realised only recently that the reason I struggle with maintaining them and being consistent is because I'm more introverted than I realised. I might want to do something multiple times in a month, then have several months where I just don't want to meet anyone and I focus on my own solo hobbies. And I also have never found anyone I perfectly click with.
University societies were probably the easiest place I found to meet people, because most of them were like clubs which we vaguely had a shared interest but we weren't going there just to talk about that interest, like you say that would just be boring and there's not much to say on it. Most people were there just to meet others rather than focus on the shared interest, and even if you only liked 1/20 of the people there it at least gave you more exposure to people so you can find that one person you are more similar to. Since graduating though, I've never found clubs that feel similar for adults rather than students, and it's just so much hard work now to meet people. I kind of wish there were clubs based on personality types rather than a hobbies. I've found that it's fine having friends that share no interests with each other, as long as we are similar in terms of personality and we are both fine talking/hearing about the other person's interests even if we don't share them.
I think there's an expectation that people need friends, but I'm starting to question how important it is, and I guess that's going to be individual to everyone. There's lots of different kind of friendships and I think it's easier to find the right kind of person if you know what you want to give and get out of the friendship, whether that's just someone to go places with, or tell about something cool you've discovered etc. wow this has been a ramble and a half, sorry about that 😂
Having to take a year and half rest before trying again is so relatable 🙃 In typical ADHD fashion I could give you a million hobby's mainly because I'm bouncing between several hobbies at any one time 😂
Why are people so hard to connect with? I like people. People are cool. When I watch them go about their business or when they talk about their interests, dreams and goals with enthusiasm, when they let their 'weird' out. I really like that. But whenever I meet actual people in actual life, It's dry like the Sahara desert. Or it's plain confusing and I feel like I'm missing context for everything and no one is bothering to catch me up.
And I've gotten better at conversation, at expressing myself, at asking questions to motivate people to speak... But it's still so hard to build connection. No matter how many times we meet it still feels like tip-toeing around each other. It makes me wonder if they are fine with it being this way and if it's fulfilling for them or they also don't know how to connect better.
Hi Dana, with regards to your first thoughts about developing social skills, have you tried mirroring someone that is already good at it? The idea is to find someone who is good at social interaction already, who you can be close to in person, and then they interact and you pay attention to what they are doing and repeat those things in your mind. Don't try to logically analyze it, just notice and repeat.
The idea here is that you're developing connections between things that are appropriate to say, with visual and other sensory information of the kinds of situations they are being said in. It is then training the subconscious brain, such that when you are exposed to the same situation again, those things get triggered subconsciously and you know how to act.
Much like learning a musical instrument, this kind of thing needs to be practiced regularly, and won't be remembered if it isn't due to the forgetting curve.
I suspect that a lot of the social difficulty experienced by autistic people is actually not that heavily related to the autistic neurotype directly, but is rather:
- Many autistic people have reduced herd instinct, they are driven by what they personally want to do, and won't engage with things if they don't see value in it. So if they don't see value in interacting with other people at a young age, they may not choose to mirror those behaviors.
- Many autistic people's parents also have trouble with social skills, emotional regulation and other things, and are thus unable to effectively model these to a child because it is 'missing information' for them. This is probably the case for you due to what you've discussed about your parents before.
- You are trying to develop social skills as an adult in an environment surrounded by 'experts' and thus the communications that are happening are at expert level complexity, while someone learning as a child and teenager 'normally', is exposed to gradually more complex things slowly over a period of time.
While I know I could go up to people in an interest club and talk, I choose not to because it's unnecessary stress. I love Dr who 🎉
As regards making new friends I speak theoretically as I have no success in that area but probably the best way to make new friends is to already have friends who can make introductions, etc. That though is little use for the person who doesn't already have many friends. For autists there's an added problem because even with introductions it's difficult to know what to do next. it's a little like getting into a car and then not knowing how to drive it. In the past I did meet more people at work and got on okay and sometimes well with them but rarely did it move into friendship. I didn't really know how to move things forward. Many people make connections with others because they talk a lot about their partners, children, families and other social things but I didn't have those so I wasn't bringing much to the table. I didn't like talking about my personal life and maybe that made me seem too difficult to know. I think this may be true for many with autism as we don't have all those personal relationships to draw upon.
Great haircut :)
My interests are really too "niche" and obscure to connect with other people. I'm also interested in TV programmes but mostly ones from decades ago so it's not even possible to connect with fans of current TV. I don't discuss my interests with the few people I meet because it would be pointless as they're things most people either haven't heard of or are not interested in. It is usually possible to find people with those interests online and we might discuss aspects of a show, etc, but it doesn't go any further than that, at least not for me. To be frank I'd feel a bit apprehensive if anyone then suggested discussing anything else or getting onto personal matters. For me friendships - especially new ones - just bring new anxieties so for me it seems easier to be alone. Some interests can be done with others - indeed many enjoy that - but like you I prefer to follow my interests alone. For example if I'm watching a show or listening to music I'd find it distracting to have someone making comments or expecting me to respond. i might do that afterwards but not during.
Dude seriously...in my twenties - after realizing I'm factually gay - I got immensely hyped about joining the "LGBT community" and going to club meetings.
It soon turned out just having the same kinda sexual interest was not gonna help me feel connected. Gay clubbing was the absolute worst...sweaty loud people getting completely wasted and trying to pick one-night stands while dancing to Shakira ('twas way back then) 😆
Thanks Dana 💕
Have you tried using one of those music making apps to try get music to your lyrics? Interacting with one person is hard, add another person and I stress over how Im supposed to split my attention equally between them.
tell me am i thee only who is discriminated at the bus, i mean, the public transport in general, i sit still quiet in my seat and somebody comes and sits at my side, i'm looking at the landscape and the person at my side keeps ataring me, like thinking that i am crazy, affff, can i not be leave in peace even in the bus?????? well, i don't know why.
I used a little Garage Band and have some music theory. I'm not an expert but maybe I can help a little
It can be hard
I have Atusim ocd sosical anxiety a lot more I have no friends I’m 25 years old from Scotland if anyone over 18 wants to be friends lmk