2017 GSX-R1000 S2B: Episode 5 (Part 1) - Dyno Tuning for Maximum Performance
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 22 ก.ค. 2024
- A true motorcycle performance enthusiast’s dream come true! In this episode of ‘Stock to Brock’, Brock’s Performance owner, Brock Davidson, dives deep into the theory behind tuning our 2017 GSX-R1000 project bike for maximum performance using a BrockFLASH™ ECU and Dynojet PCV. Brock addresses many questions you have… and many you didn’t know to ask, yet.
As usual, Brock does his best to try and tackle this very complicated subject, while making it as fun and enjoyable as possible for all experience levels.
2017 GSX-R1K S2B: Episode 1 - Parts Introduction & Overview: • 2017 GSX-R1000 S2B: Ep...
2017 GSX-R1K S2B: Episode 2 - Initial Dyno Break-In with Chart: • 2017 GSX-R1000 S2B: Ep...
2017 GSX-R1K S2B: Episode 3 - Throttle Blade Derestriction: • 2017 GSX-R1000 S2B: Ep...
2017 GSX-R1K S2B - SPECIAL EDITION (Q&A) from Episode 3: • 2017 GSX-R1000 S2B: SP...
2017 GSX-R1K S2B: Episode 4 - Exhaust Installation and Theory (Part 1): • 2017 GSX-R1000 S2B: Ep...
2017 GSX-R1K S2B: Episode 4 - Exhaust Installation and Theory (Part 2): • 2017 GSX-R1000 S2B: Ep...
2017 GSX-R1K S2B: Episode 4 - Exhaust Installation and Theory (Part 3): • 2017 GSX-R1000 S2B: Ep...
The details :
Brock’s Performance 2017 GSX-R1000L7 Standard model (not the ‘R’ version)
Exhaust: Brock’s Performance Predator™ full titanium exhaust system
Traction control: Motion Track Traction Control Standard (TC=OFF during testing)
Suzuki Drive Mode Selector (S-DMS): Power Mode=A (max power selected during testing)
Fuel used during test: Shell 89 Octane (choices available at our local Shell are 87, 89, 93 octane - we selected mid-grade for our tests)
Rear tire: Stock Bridgestone Battlax RS10 190/55/ZR17 - 35 PSI Nitrogen
Motor oil: As delivered (unknown)
Air filter: OEM
PAIR: Blocked
Power Commander: PCV with Brock’s Performance Pump Track Map 1
ECU: Stock or modified, per video requirements
5th gear pulls
Dynojet Model 250I dyno using DynoWare RT, Power Core C3 and WinPep 8 dyno control - displaying the SAE scale (unless noted otherwise in video)
0:00 Video introduction
2:50 So EASY!
3:50 Merriam-Webster defines a RACE as: a :a contest of speed…
4:10 Acceleration wins races!
4:35 Torque is the force that accelerates the vehicle, horsepower keeps it going
9:25 Demonstration of drivability and acceleration - in stock form, and how to remove the OEM connectors from the ECU
11:30 Stock O2 sensor “Self Mapping” on the new Gixxer
12:35 Go for a ride with the Stock ECU and OEM air-fuel sensor installed
17:20 Not smooth going
19:00 How to obtain a map for your Brock’s Performance exhaust
20:00 Installing a PCV Map via e-mail
22:30 Go for a ride with the flashed ECU and PCV with map
24:50 Dyno run with pump fuel (191 RWHP, SAE scale)
26:25 What did we learn about acceleration?
29:00 What’s next?
29:30 Until next time
2017 GSX-R 1000 Information Page: www.brocksperformance.com/bro...
Visit www.BrocksPerformance.com for additional information, installation instructions, information forums, and FAQ sections. - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
Brock, on behalf of the sport bike community I️ want to thank you for taking the time to make these videos. You don’t have to do these videos that take time and probably money to create. You do it completely for free and to educate the motorcycle community. People pay good money to learn the things you are telling us for free. You have a subscription and alert notifications turned on from me. Again THANK You!
Steven Watson Thanks! We typically have 50 man hours into a 20 min video. Not only do we pay staff, but it takes me away from running Brock's Performance. So yes, it's extremely expensive. We LOVE making them, but it takes a while longer since business comes first.
Steven Watson You could not have said it better my friend...Thanks so much Brock for taking the time to share and make these videos. Such a learning tool to study over and over whenever needed.
Brock Davidson I'm glad I discovered you guys right after buying my 1000R.
So many levels ahead of the competition. I'll be getting some goodies from you guys when the smoke clears.
I can't thank you enough for these development videos.
Excellent series and learning so much, bought a 2921 GSXR1000R new on the 10th of this month, thank you so much for all this info Brock, take care from Australian
The BEST series EVER MADE!
Congrats, Brock.
Thanks! Tell your friends to subscribe :)
Very good work, Mr. Brock, thanks for the free knowledge. Please keep making these videos.
Thanks so much for sharing this info. I am new to the bike community and this was extremely helpful to be able to understand what’s actually going on when you make these changes.
Absolute outstanding video Brock.Thanks
See description for detailed information and video time tags.
Great video Brock! Can't wait until the next!
Great video, that power torque figure is unreal! The standard bike is a missile can't imagine how quick this must feel!!
Awesome vid Brock on a very interesting topic, as per all the previous - thank you! I really appreciate your 'teaching' style on the technical concepts of maximizing performance in a very calm and clear manner...Professor Brock is an appropriate title for you! Looking forward to the next installment.
Awesomely informative as usual. Keep up the good work!
finally it was a long wait, BROCK'S THANK U SIR
Thanks brocks, love the video. Please keep it up. Love from Sydney Australia
I've being so waiting for this latest video
Another great video we have all been waiting for I feel like your heading in the right direction with the build just make a badass drag bike out of it
I'm anxious to see the mr12 map play out that's the map I run on my 08 busa and it put it in the high 8 second range in the quarter
Hope to see you guys at the manufactures cup next month
Aesome video Brock! Thank you for all you do..
mate, i was so fascinated and paid attention to your GSXR episodes, that i forgot to hit LIKE button, damn it.
Thank you for these great vids mr. Brock
Like, subscribe....tap the little bell if you like what we do.
@@BrockDavidson did it already, i know the game damn well :D
you re doing a great job
Amazing work Brock keep it up
Awesome vid and thanks for sharing all this great info.
Hey sir thanks from INDIA
was searching such things from quite few days..👍👍
This stuff is great Brock!!! 5 stars
absolutely great video
Awesome information.. Thank you. 😉👍
Awesome work.....What a clever guy! Suzuki should have you helping with the race teams.
great video Brock! well done. keep up the good work :-)
BTW everybody, word is Texan Ben Spies, former AMA Superbike Champion, WSBK Champion, MotoGP Assen race winner is returning to race in 2018. Absolutely huge news, considering is one of the best riders to ever throw a leg over a motorcycle. The question which manufacturer will he ride for? Ducati has already offered him a ride if the money thing can be worked out. I'd love to see him back racing with Suzuki.
This is a class I enjoy attending. Thnx for posting this info
Glad you are enjoying the series.
saw you on 65ib live stream, great job Brock.
Thanks! We always have a great time working with Ib
Just ordered a sprint air filter from you and got some sweet Brock performance stickers that are going on the l2 gsxr1k!!! Thanks Brock!
Awesome thank you!
Damn, you have me wanting to go buy a bike. I’ve been out of the riding scene for about 6 years now. My buddies and I have used your stuff in the past and it works. Thanks for all the time you put into R&D instead of just selling a pipe.
Brock should have his own tv show brilliant could watch him all day👏👏👏👏
Holy shit man! You did an incredible job!
@Brock - 7:14 "It is most definitely not smooth ...", this is exactly what every EFI, throttle by wire sportbike rider
experiences at low RPMs, a near complete failure on ridability. Heck I just experienced that today, out doing
wheelies, and let me tell you how challenging it is, trying to keep balance point when the rideability is exactly what you said, "this bike is stumbling all over the place." 191-193 rwhp and 86 lb-ft of torque, wow very impressive!! I would have lost that bet at 197, but dang if this bike isn't the Hamamatsu missile. BTW, Factory Suzuki Japan and Suzuki America will be quietly visiting just a handful of RR owners to participate in a product improvement endeavor. Give you one guess who's on that list? I promised not to say too much about it, so I can't tell anyone the where and when, but yeah very cool!
Been waitin 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥luv these vids
As Brock says, stupid fast. Great video.
Hey Brock! First off I'd like to thank you for taking the time to post these extremely informative vids. I'm an old school drag racer (cars, not bikes. Plz don't hate me...Lol!) and my idea of tuning has always been changing jets and squirters in Holley 4bbl carbs. I've been trying to wrap my head around ECU flashing and power commanders as I just recently purchased a 17' Aprilia RSV4 RF. I purchased a Yoshi Ti titanium can for it (Sorry, I just really like the look of the carbon and titanium) and since the exhaust valve and cat are part of the stock can it all comes off in one piece. Therefore the dealership says I have to also purchase the Aprilia race ECU. The Yoshi can is on back order so I haven't purchased the ECU yet as it costs over $850. Was just going to buy it when the can arrives. In your opinion would I be better off to just have the factory ECU flashed and dyno tuned with a power commander or do you think the race ECU would work fine? I live in Ohio also about 3 hrs or so from Dayton. Is this something you would be willing or able to do if you think the Power commander would be the best bet? Thx again for the vids and plz keep em coming.
luvs2race370 I'm not sure who might be able to flash the stock RSV4 ECU? We don't do them currently. Once that is done, a pcv would do a job handling the fueling tasks, and give you the flexibility to adjust your self... just like swapping jets.
I've been waiting
I bought a pcv for my slow old cbr1000rr and everyone was telling me I wasted my money when I could of just flashed it instead. Alot of confusion when it comes to this subject. This video seems like my saving grace. Thanks brock!
@Bill - you can go to www.powercommander.com and download a large selection of maps to try at no charge for your cbr. Just pick the one that closest matches your set-up, or try them all and use the one that makes you happiest.
@@BrockDavidson nice thanks for your quick reply! Would there be any benefit to flashing my ecu and running a pcv like your gsxr has? If so does your company do some type of mail in flash of my ecu? I live 6.5 hrs away and after spending 1k on the full exhaust I probably cant afford dyno time at this point.
@Bill ECU flash improvements will depend on the year of your cbr, the older it is , the less restrictive the ECU will be. There are many 3rd party flashing companies these days , so a bit of research on your end will help you decide. We would also suggest contacting Guhl Motors.
I️ can’t wait to get my ecu flashed and mapping for my gsxr 1000r from you Brock
appreciate the knowledge but can't wait to see it go down the drag strip
@Lewis - us also! All of the required parts will be available soon.
thank you Brock!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Brock you are the man
Thanks for the info
I can give too you sir one big respect! Love when people talking about details with full form of meaning and explanation! I spent five hours watching the videos and I have to admit it's better than sex!!!
@Maki - glad you like.... but better than sex?!
VERY interesting.
Brock my name is Jonathan and I wanna say thanks for great video's I have been watching you for a while on this bike a few hrs now and i know its from 2017 but i must say you have taught me a lot through your videos and I do plan to reach out to you soon if possible about my 2018 R model before i start ordering stuff from you guys to see what i need. What all is on this bike at the time of the video bolt on wise? I hear you say the exhaust with a tuned Power Commander and a Flashed ECU just clearing that up on my end.
Hello Jonathan, glad you like our vids. Here is a link to our GSX-R 1000 information page: bit.ly/3rceWwS it should answer your questions.
27:30 '....your bike doesn't know where its wheels are rolling' That's a bit cheeky, Brock!
peak power is how fast you hit the wall while torque is how far you move that wall. an old one. and i like it.
@brock Hi Brock, love your videos man, its the technical details that makes them that much more interesting. I got one question though, you keep mentioning ETV closes down, and I see lots of talking about how they close at 12000rpm to 64%. Now Ive been playing with my bike (EU version) so I can say in my example they don’t close but they really stay open. Can it be due to different market EU vs US, or perhaps there might be a soft limiter of some sort before the first 1000km service? If you need I can send you stock binary file pulled from ecu via woolich sw.
@Josip - correct. The Euro model does not close down the ETV early. We covered this in Episode 3: th-cam.com/video/e0T0p7TsV3s/w-d-xo.html
Fantastic
Thanks Boosted! (Props from a fast guy (: )
Ooops.... The stock O2 sensor was already disconnected... at 23:30 look at the O2 sensor wire plug just a little higher up at the engine🤷 Just saying... Thanks for the amazing video Brock
Nice Eye! We address in one of the comments.
Brock I have a question. I understand that you would map the fueling at 100% throttle to be around lambda 0.9(rich a/f ratio), because this is usually the a/f region that maximum power occurs. What is the strategy with partial throttle? Do you still want to make maximum power at each throttle position or do you consider it a bit less important for example on your street maps and therefore use stoichiometric mixture? This might improve the fuel consumption a bit when the rider is not asking for maximum power.
@Freek Jacobs - great question. It depends upon the use of the machine. We are racers, so we are not really concerned with fuel mileage and will give it up for maximum performance. But, some people want better mileage (you can't have max performance AND optimum mileage) so, we provide our Street Maps.
But in general, awesome information. So many people don't get this (in the bike community, car community, etc.)... When you change intake and exhaust, especially on bikes or turbocharged cars, you gotta remap the fueling... Otherwise at best you're in for poor drive ability, and at worst you've just junked your engine.
@Brock - Did the smoothing out of A/F ratio dyno pulls include your Sprint Filter installed or were these pulls without a filter? Just trying to put all my ducks in a row; Pair valve block off, filter, full exhaust with ridability map, etc. Thanks Jerry
@Getis - All results to date are with the OEM filter. Our past results have shown the need to remap due to the installation of a Sprint Filter is not required on 90% of bikes. If it is required for the 2017 GSX-R1k, we will incorporate the changes through updates in our Map Support System.
@Brock - Thank you sir!
Wonderful series, Question (1) What are the effects of Dynojet’s and Bazzaz’s Air/Fuel Ratio Auto Tune options? Would they assist your maps in any way for a end user? (2) Do you offer similar combinations for 2009 and newer BMW, Yamaha, Kawi and Suzuki bikes? Particularly R1s since they usually are lowest on the hp totem pole. (3) Do you have any plans on work on other brands such as the KTM Super Duke 1290 and Aprilia Tuono 1100? Keep it Up!
@Monty Great questions! 1. We generally find that auto tuners ruin our otherwise perfect maps. 2. Generally, they seem to continually suggest to add more fuel - so, no... and Yes - see our Model Specific links here: goo.gl/JLUXoB 3. Not at the moment.
the pipe sounds really good
Thanks! That's our new CT Megaphone- Carbon Tipped Full Titanium Exhaust: brocksperformance.com/ct-megaphone-full-system-w-17-muffler-gsx-r1000-17-18/
Brock I have a 20 r1 just had the ecu flashed, I purchased a pc5, was planning on doing some street tuning. I have a AFR guage wired up. Should I get the auto tune to add to my setup ? Is the auto tune what you were using earlier in this video series to setup target AFR’s?
I'm not a big fan of autotune's if you have access to a competent tuner with a model 250 dyno that is an approved dynojet tuning center. Find a tuning center on powercommander.com or use our dealer locator to find a Brock's Performance dealer with a dyno near you: blog.brocksperformance.com/dealer-locator/
@@BrockDavidson awesome! I found two places near me on your dyno finder. I’ll get ahold of them thanks man.
@Brock - Question: For the 2017 Gixxer, I'm liking the idea of your street map for drivability, but may I ask what is the track map octane requirement? Thanks
Our track maps are designed specifically for VP's MR12 oxygenated fuel. Octane level does not greatly affect fuel mapping, but percentage of Oxygen content does. Here is more info. on Octane: h
www.brocksperformance.com/absolutefm/?f=392 Make sure you read 'The Gas Factor' by Don Smith attached to the FAQ.
@Brock - Good article, I know Chip at KWS, good guy, used to own one of their AMA Superbikes a few years ago. Looking back now, I would have foregone the high compression route, it just too much of a hassle to deal with. Even if you drain the fuel system after every race, still get some gum remaining somewhere. Without a good tech support team, very difficult to keep it running smooth for every race. An engine with a little compression boost to take advantage of 93 pump gas is the way to go for me now days. But this time around, I think I'll keep the 2017 GSX-R1000R engine just the way it is, and make use of your full exhaust and the ridability map. I'm really liking the idea of smoother throttle throughout the RPM range, very important for wheelies and track days. 191+ hp will do just fine!!
Some questions. How pair valves affect your af readings? do you remove pair valves?
here you go: th-cam.com/video/_xMykbzJWiQ/w-d-xo.html
@Brock: I absolutely love your videos and you're most definately one hell of a tuner. You sell the pc5 with a "custom" map, but I've seen content on YT and forums that showed that even on an exact same bike/parts combo, a downloaded map just didnt cope well. Cause of tolerances between engines??? Do you recommend buyers to still do a dyno adjustment after installing the received flash and pc5?
Thanks lillnemo1 - this should answer your question: blog.brocksperformance.com/faq/how-can-brocks-get-mapping-so-close/
Brock please i need some advice,,i bought a gen1 hayabusa made 05,, the red efi light doesnt turn on and the dude i bought it from claims that they changed the exhaust and that is the reason. i have driven 06 zx10 and that felt way faster and more responsive then this gen1 busa.. what can i do to get it right,,should i buy a pc5 with auto tune or should i send in the ecu,where i have the bike there isnt any professional tuners.. heck they dont even have turbo bikes if calculated per capita... would presciate some advice.
Please give us a call. We guide you in the correct direction. 937-912-0054 ext.106 - Steve can help.
🤤 need next video haha
Can't wait I'm falling for this bike. When is the next one coming?
MUCH sooner than this one (:
Quick question when you flash the ECU can you program the Dyno jet map into the ECU and avoid the Power Commander
STEVE ORTEZ we can import this map into the ECU, e will cover that in an upcoming episode.
Hi brock, thank's again for your video
Can you tell me why are you still using Powercommander to ajust AFR? Whereas you can do it directly in the ecu?
olivier Mercher future vid will demonstrate both techniques, so you can make the decision that's best for your application.
Brock Davidson, right! Thanks for reply
I have 2012 yamaha r1, two brothers 2/3 exhaust :de cat. K&N filter, and juice box. What's the next step to gain/unlock it's full power? Pc5,and a flash? How power power gain?
Perhaps use our R1 project bike as a guide: blog.brocksperformance.com/stock-to-brock-200hp-yamaha-r1-15-16-new-products-available/
when ecu Flashing a customer's bike or even a personal vehicle, is it always necessary to purchase a new separate ecu? or could the stock one be modified and labeled as a "race ecu" of course with all of the necessary disclosures)?
No. More info: blog.brocksperformance.com/faq/does-a-brockflash-lock-the-ecu/
I just wanted to know why you use both an ECU Flash and the power commander? Why not one or the other? Thanks
Because we don't have the ability to create an ECU only tune that matches the performance of our ECU flash with PCV map combination. We are working on it.
Hello Brock, Awesome series, Many thanks.
I would like to reverse a question previously asked:
If you have a PCV with a Brock map, why do you need to flash the ECU?
Wouldn't the PCV with map override the ECU's stock map?
The flash derestricts the throttle blades, removes the top speed limiter, prevents FI codes after removing the EXUP Valve + a large host of other items. The PCV precisely controls the fueling, allows for easy tuning adjustments and allows the operator to run a dual map setup. Here is more info: www.brocksperformance.com/BrockFLASH-ECU-Stage-1+I924162+C297.aspx
it's finally here great !...2 questions for the next part
you wont get the same amount of air on a dyno and on the street so how do you know you wont be lean on the road where the volume of air increase with the speed of the bike?
and what do you think of those auto tune that map your bike on the road ?
@sural89. Great questions, we will explain in an upcoming episode.
ok thx
Great info as always. Now you can make a video on how the 02 sensor works and effects the mapping. OEM and PC5. I see the PC5 uses a 02 optimizer. Really would like to know how this works, does the 02 sensor work against the PC5? I have a Bazzaz unit on my DL650 and the 02 bypass unit keeps throwing the code that there is a 02 sensor problem. Bazazz isn't helping either :( Also how does the code effect the mapping once it's thrown? Limp modes? Also do you make or recommend using 02 optimizers or bypass units?
@David - That would be a very long/confusing video that I'm not sure I could even explain properly. O2 sensors on most Japanese motorcycles (euros with Bosch ECU's work differently) are present for emissions purposes ONLY, for cleaner air at cruising speeds - so yes, they will fight the PCV or Bazzaz if installed. Most won't throw codes, but some will (especially newer bikes). If the O2 sensors are left in place, the ECU will continue to lean the bike down, even if you have a good map in the PCV... offsetting your drivability gains. If you can still ride your bike like normal, it's not in limp mode, even if you have a dash light on. The 02 optimizers are not required with a proper flash, and we can eliminate codes. Unfortunately, we don't offer a flash for your bike.
Thanks for the reply. It costs a lot of money for this equipment and so is your time. Nice to see someone giving some real answers instead of no answers at all.
Im a ft ecu flash tuner. just wondering, why not change fueling through the ecu flash software. Is the reason for the powercommander only for ease of use? Love the vid, and compliment you on your tuning excellence and for sharing your knowledge. keep up the awesome work.
Justin K that will be answered in an upcoming vid ;)
Brock Davidson ok. Haha leave us in suspense. Im guessing its cause the different cylinders in the flash software adds different amounts of fuel from stock and the pc adds equal % to each cylinder. Its more accurate than changing each fueling map per cylinder in the flash software.
At the 23:39 mark when you disconnect the 02 sensor. It looks like the other end of the black 02 sensor wire there is a white connector that looks to NOT be connected to anything. Right near the 3 yellow wires. Can you explain why? Or am I wrong?
Rob Lamendola we were using the O2 sensor extension cord we supply with the predator exhaust. It is not used with our flash.
@Rob Lamendola - excellent eye for detail!
We shot that sequence more than once, and I forgot to plug the extension harness into the main harness after the previous take... OOPS!
My point was that the O2 sensor was not doing anything... it obviously wasn't if it wasn't plugged into the harness.
Look at 11:22 - the extension harness is plainly plugged into the main harness before we shoot the scene where the sensor is functioning with the OEM ECU.
Oh well, we are human.
My apologies for any confusion and I hope this clears things up.
Brock
Brock Davidson i seen this and it had me wondering. I'm glad you cleared that up
So what is the idea AFR for power? I've been told by car guys that for complete combustion 14-1 is money but that doesn't seem to be correct here...
@Hick on a Honda - this explains why there is no perfect XX.X AFR for any single application -blog.brocksperformance.com/faq/how-can-brocks-get-mapping-so-close/
@Brock Davidson. Hey Brock. I have a 2017 gsxr1000r with full Ti Predator exhaust, P08 F185 sprint filter and PCV with your street map on it. Runs great, even without derestricted ecu yet. Wondering what the performance differences are between 89 octane vs 93? Also i have access to 90 octane ethanol free gas in my area. Which fuel would be best for performance?
@Nick Skiver - glad you like your set-up. You will be amazed at how much faster your bike will be when you are properly flashed. This should answer all of your questions about Octane: blog.brocksperformance.com/throttle-nation-magazine-the-gas-factor-fuel-options-for-max-hp/
@Brock Davidson. Thank you, helped a lot. Sending ecu out in a week or so.
23:41 you disconnect the stock O2 sensor that is already disconnect =DD
I realize this video series is several years old now but I have a related question. In a previous video you said the factory internal tuning using the O2 sensor pertained to emissions moreso than power. Here you likened it to placebo effect. I buy that, they need to stay in regulations etc, no big, EPA isn't something to play with.
Where my question comes in is where / how does your static tune compensate for elevation? You guys are at like 200' elevation and I'm at 6200' elevation. On a typical ride I can go from 5k to nearly 11k elevation. Roadtrips from 6k to sea level. How will the tune hold up in ranges like that?
In theory placebo land, the stock bike is making adjustments like a closed loop system in a car..but according to your research that's actually not an ideal state of tune.
I ride thousands of miles a year. How does a guy keep his bike in ideal or near-ideal state of tune, regardless of elevation?
@Shinn Family - This should help answer your question: blog.brocksperformance.com/faq/how-can-brocks-get-mapping-so-close/
Question. I've heard of tuners use the ecu to deregulate the bike and then tune the ecu. And i see u use the ecu to deregulate and then use a power commander for the tune. When i got my ecu flashed at two wheel dynoworks i was told no need for a PC because my ecu wad tuned. I guess my question is why do u use a pc ibstead of just tuning the ecu?
We do both. We prefer the pcv due to ease of adjustment, especially at the race track. The ecu tunes are good for set and forget tunes.
@@BrockDavidson thanks fot the prompt reply. Makes sense.
Mr. Brock is it true that your full exhaust systems r just for the track? And if that is true, will you be building any street exhaust systems ever?
GigaHertz62 we do not make "50 State" approved full systems... And probably won't. We don't know of any available on the market.
Hi Brock, quick question, I have a k5 Gsxr 1000. I'm getting my ecu flash and dyno tune done in the next week or two. A guy near me is selling a power commander 3 for pretty cheap. Should I buy it as well? Or is the ecu flash all I need . Thanks, really love your vids
That would depend on your use and your tuners skills - you should discuss your situation with your tuner and devise a plan that meets your needs.
Brock Davidson I'm not racing, just road use. I would love for you to flash my ecu and tune my bike. But I'm from South Africa lol . Keep up the awesome work . Thanks for the reply
If you have no need to tune for performance, a proper ECU flash with fuel mapping should do the job for your street use. We can flash your ECU if you sent it to us, but if you have a good tuner in your area, they should be able to handle it for you.
Brock Davidson thanks Brock
Does a power commander have the ability to to add fuel at 10% throttle and bellow?
EVERY DAY I RACE - yes 0%,2%,5%,10%, 15%, 20-40-60-70-80-100 and we can add additional columns - up to 30 total columns. The level of precision is excellent.
I love the videos Brock! So, when you're tuning for cruise conditions, or as you call it just riding around, you are targeting lower than the standard 14.7:1 AFR? I know cars are different animals, but even "track" cars with emissions equipment removed are tuned for 14.7:1 at low loads. Actually, I think a lot of cars actually have that hard coded into the ECU, and most tuners still run closed loop fueling with emissions devices removed (i.e., a lot of cars you can't target anything other than 14.7:1 while cruising unless you force full time open loop). Another question, do you essentially tune "track" bikes with the unrestricted pipes to run open loop 100% of the time? I am guessing so, as older bikes don't even have O2 sensors, and most bikes have them removed with the addition of new pipes.
@ilarson007 Bikes (Japanese) are not as sophisticated as cars. Only the BMW's and Ducati's, using Bosch ECU's, are self-tuning for anything except emissions. 14.7 is great for fuel economy, but performance will suffer. We will tune 13.5 for rideability, and 12.9-13.2 for power. It depends on the bike/fuel/etc.
Brock Davidson 12.9-13.2 at WOT?
yes.
Hey Brock was wondering if you could do a fellow sailor a favor. I’m picking up a 2017 myself, and was wondering what the process of getting you to flash my exhaust. Sadly I’m not going with your exhaust, but I am going Yoshimura. A full exhaust to be exact. I would love for you do it. If you could provide an email for such a thing. Thank you in advanced.
Great video sir. Very informative. Sadly i think your business is not here in india. If in future it is possible I would love to have your services here. We have a decent motorcycle community here in the country
We ship worldwide, please go here for details: blog.brocksperformance.com/terms-and-conditions/
Brock, I installed the Predator kit w/PCV on my 2018 GSXR1000. It's nuts! Good fitment, Great quality, and Excellent installation instruction, ....runs great. I have a hard time keeping the front end on the ground. My question is: Is the "Shell 89" fuel you tuned with Non-oxygenated, or an oxygenated mix? I have run both your Street map, and Track map but have only run oxygenated BP 89 octane. I experience a lean condition (cuts out) at slight throttle (5% or less) when opening throttle after a shift. Doesn't happen if I open it more then 5%. It's much improved with the Track map. I will switch over to non-oxygenated fuel from here on out which should richen it up a bit and fix that. What is your take on this? I'm at 900' altitude, and with sound restrictor removed cut-out is worse.
@B Lawrence Glad you like our performance, but you should feel just as happy about the drivability. FYI: we are at 860 ft. above sea level and try not to use 10% ethanol added whenever possible. The track map should be VERY rich on pump gas and cause the bike to 'burble' down low. If it's working better than the street map, that would indicate a possible issue with your TPS settings in the PCV. Send me an e-mail and I'll try to point you in the right direction: bmail@brocksperformance.com
Sorry I meant "Pump Track Map" not Track Map. Since your tune was on non-ethanol fuel, I'm fairly certain switching over will solve it. I have 91 octane non-ethanol abundantly available in my area. I see a significant difference in jetting on my 2 strokes switching between 10% ethanol added and non. I'll switch it over Tomorrow, and give it a shot. This is so minor most people wouldn't notice it, so don't stress over it. I'll let you know the results, but I'm certain this will make it perfect.
No stress my friend - we just aim for you to see the same results as us :)
Solved! .....No more lean Cut-out. Changing to Non-ethanol fuel has a much larger effect then I expected. Drivability and power improved everywhere. No more surging at Idle, and low speed operation. Cold start enrichment is now spot on. Roll on torque is up at all RPM's. Even Handlebar buzz is cut in half. Wow.... This is best running Bike I've ever experienced. Good Job.
hey brock. have a 2015 with power commander. do I have to send u the power commander?
Hello Mike. Brock's Performance supplies maps at no charge for our Brock's exhaust owners and we email the maps and install instructions so you do not need to send it in, click here for more info on Brock's map Support Program: blog.brocksperformance.com/category/map-support/ if you don't own a Brock's Performance exhaust, www.powercommander.com supplies them at no cost.
Do I need an ecu flash or just the power commander for my 2012 Hayabusa? I just installed your alien head exhaust.
@swatson0061 for drag use, the ECM is typically fine on the Gen 2 Busa. For land speed, we do a simple derestriction flash: blog.brocksperformance.com/faq/do-i-need-a-pcv-when-installing-a-brocks-performance-exhaust-system/
Here is more info on going fast with the stock ECM and our PCV mapping: blog.brocksperformance.com/hayabusa-chronicles-part-2/
So what if I already have a pc5 An purchase a ecu from yal , so I send yal my ecu? I don't have a 1k big boy bike I have a 2013 750 gsxr with a full exhaust system on a what seems to be shitty base map ,I'd love some power increase for the size of the motor with out haven to dig i to the internals at this moment so what would be my best course of action. ? As well as can or done recommend another tuner touching the ecu ? Let's say I wanted to do a dyno run pull more numbers out from some extra parts iv added ,will that throw off the tune u made for (purchaser ? Jus trying see what options to go to ,also im more of a Mexico racer,u know because street racing illegal ,so lot of us Texans head south of the boarder lol
@celis281 - Please send an e-mail with your needs to dynoroom@brocksperformance.com to see if we can help you out.
That's interesting... It's kinda like tuning a modified car with a standalone and a laptop. I found out that my 2.4L turbo engine likes to idle at 13.5:1 AFR instead of the 14.7:1 that the factory had. O2 sensors are reporting sensors, so with them disabled, there is no ECU correction. Is there a reason you didn't tune the overrun areas to engine brake and clear the cylinders out? I'm guessing it's for on\off throttle response? Good class💪
Unlike automobiles, most bikes (and this is rapidly changing in the mc world...) the ECU operates in an open loop configuration, with the exception of the "cruising area" that is closed loop to help more precisely control emissions. We don't tune for decel in most applications unless the bike requires it for smoother/ more consistent operation. We built this bike to go drag racing, but our flash is optimized for our street/track day customers.
@@BrockDavidson cool. When tuning on cars, we now set the closed loop for idle and cruising. Open loop naturally is for off-idle conditions. I like shutting the injectors off during overrun. It gives the engine cool sound in those high vacuum areas and from what i read once, it cleans out the cylinders of combustion gases.
Do you do ThunderMax for road glide???
We do not 😔
Do you have tunes/ecu flash Available for the 17' cbr 1000s ?
We do - please contact dynoroom@brocksperformance.com for more details.
Man these videos are really making me reconsider the gsxr over the cbr. I feel like Honda has probably left a ton on the table aswell . Especially with the cbr throttle restricted to 84% open at all times .
This is really interesting! THank you Brock! I didnt realize you had such low octane fuel in America, so basicly, if I get an American exhaust system the finished map wont be optimal and I have to make a custom map anyways as we run 95 or 98 octane, correct? Or will the track map be good for that?
Nordsman Racing we can get you very close, but you will want to map your bike to your fuel inn your country.
America calculates their octane differently to many european contries, if I recall correctly our 98 octane should correspond to their 93 octane, it's a bit confusing but as a general rule it holds true.
What’s the actual difference between a street flash and track flash ?
Street flashes are more focused on smooth operation. Track flashes are more typically aggressive, to maximize acceleration. This might help also: bit.ly/2EJ1zAV
for me in the uk err hope my numbers come up and i am allowed to buy bmw s100rr
Brock if I was ever around you for the day I’d drive you crazy picking at that brain. I just love to learn these things. I’m not a gsxr fan and still watching. The R1 for me.
Jacob Hendrickson lol, thanks. These techniques apply to your R1 also: www.brocksperformance.com/brocknm/templates/bpp1.aspx?articleid=779&zoneid=22
Brock can I ask ( for my education more than anything) why the need for the power commander if you can map the ecu? Or is it just easier to map the power commander than the stock ecu?
altypeRR, the level of fuel tuning precision is far greater using the PCV, IMO. It also allows the consumer to quickly add our proven maps, as well as easily make tuning adjustments to their bike. ECU tunes are a great 'set and forget', and some people prefer it this way. We understand this and will be making this service available soon. The BMW's are a much different animal since they can self-tune for performance, so a PCV is not required. That said, the flexibility of the PCV is gone also. And yes - ecu tuning is far more difficult and time-consuming.
This is a really good question. Unless you want the ability to tweak on the mapping yourself with a power commander it seems pointless to spend the extra money on the PC5.
Steven Watson if "good enough" with limited or no ability to make adjustments yourself to enhance your performance is "pointless" to you, then you are correct. We will address this situation in upcoming vids.
Brock Davidson yes please address this on your upcoming vids because I️ was actually going to ask the same question. Can I️ still achieve the same horse power/ driveability/ and acceleration as your bike bike with just the ecu tune. What I️ really wanna know is With a full exhaust and Brocks ecu tune and no power commander can I️ still achieve the same dyno numbers.
disarmyou84 - it will be addressed in an upcoming episode
off the wall question...with folks like us, sitting up at 3100' elevation compared to your 700' approx, how do you handle tuning for that? or does it not matter enough? maybe it's a playing with the mind game, but it seems like when I take my bikes home (WI at 800'), the bikes seem to have more balls. Do I need to have a different tune for different altitudes.... street riding in South Dakota, but then do The Texas Mile or Colorado Mile speed runs...? just curious.... oh, and BTW, awesome vid. always wanted to know about tuning and what goes in it, even if it is a small portion of the big picture. wish I had a dyno to play with. I'd spend all my extra hours just messing around...
Sco zar it does have more balls at lower altitude, because the air is more dense with oxygen. Did YOU remap for this? Or does it run "good enough?"
currently, I haven't ran the ZX in WI, but every other bike (02 Busa, 04 GSXR750) ran fine. As far as the ZX, I would like it to run dang good to pass 200 in either Texas or Arkansas since Colorado would be even more down on power (compared to SD). I have not done ANY mapping since I don't have the capability, so all my bikes have been left to factory specs. which is the same for the ZX.
Sco zar, to best of our knowledge, Racheal Johnson still holds the record top speed for a ZX-14R using all bolt-on components. It was critical that we mapped her ECU fueling with a power commander: www.brocksperformance.com/brocknm/templates/bpp1.aspx?articleid=363&zoneid=10
good to hear so there is hope. Not really worrying about records. Just want to check one more thing off my bucket list... to go 200 on 2 wheels and be official. :)
Hey just asking for a friend who if anybody are you going to give that form to. 🤨
How long do PCVs last? You ever see them go bad?
PCV's last for as long as most people own their bikes. They can go bad, but it is rare.
Also, to test the PCV - disconnect it and go for a ride. the bike will run fine without it...but be smoother and more powerful with the PCV and a good map.
Does a kinked header ( nothing severe) affect
If you mean a dented header - we only measure a power loss if they are smashed down to at least 1/2 the diameter. Small to medium dents have no affect on power, as they tend to dent into a 'D' shape, which flows very well also.
Brock Davidson u are awesome thanks for the answer, blessings
Brock ive been waiting for ur video lije a crack head!!! i LOVVE this Stuff