It was less of a war, and more of an all out brawl. Everytime 2 clones came within 5 miles of each other they became aware of each other and would want to do nothing but kill each other. And that happened a lot, because they all went looking for the same stashes of loot. It's kinda like the start of the Hunger Games. The whole thing lasted about 80 days, and officially there were 40+ clones. Also, I think some sources mention that some just decided to Plane Shift and start over somewhere else, so it's entirely possible that somewhere in the Great Wheel there's a Manshoon that is unaccounted for.
I will never forget when I pushed my wizard into dating Manshoon, because I'm not very well versed in Forgotten Realms lore yet. The poor kid was so lovestruck he didn't think his Manshoon would spy on him. And he described Manshoon's liar in great detail after the date to the rest of the party. Rest in literal pieces, Y'boi the Drow. You will forever be missed.
It's funny, because the head canon i came up with for the Zhentarim and Manshoon is that the black network has effecively grown sick of megalomaniacs like manshoon and Fzoul since all of their actions were motivated entirely by their own agenda's and which ultimately squandered power and resources for the network as a whole. No, the new Zhentarim is a different beast from what was around 150 years ago; this one is motivated entirely towards a slow aquisition of power by building the brand, setting up buisnesses and seeking out relics without engaging in assinine quests to ascend their leaders to godhood or kill elminster that ultimately waste time. Thus a clone of manshoon would have potentially much more to fear from his former minions then he would his more conventional enemies.
So this is probably a different one then the vampire manshoon who has been showing his face in Cormyr in a few of the latest Greenwood novels . . . Or is it - Deathmasks was the last Greenwood novel and it took place outside of Cormyr in Waterdeep it's possible that clone followed Elminster there when he went to visit Lady Laeral during the novel
Maybe i missed it but i dont think they mentioned that he is an vampire as well. The guy has some seriously impressive feats behind him as well, such as defeating chosen of mystra in battle ( though with ALOT of prep )
Man every time Chris Perkins or Mike Mearls is on one of these I feel like I could listen to them talk about D&D lore for hours. Can we do that? Just have like an official D&D lore podcast or something? Also can I run it? Cause I wanna talk to Chris Perkins and Mike Mearls and whoever else is on the D&D lore team about wars and ancient evils and corrupted gods. I want to talk about the great good ones that are now the darkest of evils, the hopes dashed when heroes fell, the greatness that rose from the shadows of dark places. The lights in dark places that burn brighter for the pressure of the darkness surrounding them. The times when evil won and good was stricken low by doubt and loss. The terror that must manifest in the hearts of even the most heroic of adventurers when they see a beholder or a demon or the Elder things beyond the veil, That Which Wishes To Tear The World Asunder And Drown All Things In The Seas Of Chaos. I love D&D stuff and now I have more ideas for my homebrew.
I think I would really enjoy running this adventure I have a question would it be possible to use all 4 of the bad guys at the same time who would be in competition with each other as well as the pc party
Dont think they have offical rules for doing something like that lol but you can do what you want but could be really complicated because each villain probably has a tone of recources and organizations also each is very very powerful. Like each one is meant to last a entire adventure.
Colt Carlton And yet Manshoon isn't a standard Archmage, similar to how Vecna and Acererak aren't standard Liches or how Strahd isn't a standard Vampire Lord.
Sure John, but that's because Manshoon is just particularly powerful himself, nothing to do with him specifically being an "Archmage" anymore. Archmage is just a title. In 5e Manshoon is a wizard.
No, it never did that. Just summons an inert, mindless "backup" body. Story doesn't make sense unless some third party interfered with the inert clones.
brainiac642 ARCHMAGES have access to better spells than Wizards, no one can say that he didn't use a version of the clone spell native to a different plane? With it's own Trade offs and benefits. The Man's clones waged a world war, don't compare him to any thing you've played or DMed before. He's not a country bumpkin villian your used too. this is the Apex of Civilization were taking about, his game is stepped up 15 spaces than anyone's we've seen. who isn't a god
So you're working one day, and your boss shows up and says, "Hey, I need you to do -----." An hour later you see another group of your coworkers doing something completely contrary to what your boss told you to do, except hes out there with them leading them in the effort. You go up to ask him about it and his castigates you for doing the very thing he told you to do. Then, at that moment, your boss steps up behind you while your boss is yelling at you, and they stare at other, eyes narrowing with animosity. I imagine it went a bit like that, except over a landscape roughly the size of Europe, at various different locales. Suddenly, everyone in the group finds themselves at odds. Surely, the one they are following is the true one, he must be. They act the same, smell the same, talk the same, even magic tells you you are working with the genuine article.
Why do some people vehemently argue that PlayStation is better than Xbox and visa versa? Why do some people buy every Apple or Android device available and denounce the other? Why do some people love McDonald's but think Burger King is trash? People latch onto something or someone quickly and refuse everything else, denying any and all similarities. Takes a special kind of person, but those people exist.
He has statblocks from previous editions. He is a level 20 Wizard and 5 Archmage in 3E. So basically you aren't meant to actually attempt to fight him.
I love hearing Chris Perkins explain stuff he has written.
Most of the things he explained written in older editions actually.
Right, he draws from great source material.
He wrote ‘Waterdeep: Dragon Heist’, right?
@@braindeadgenius2 i believe so, yeah
Manshoon Returns: This Time He's Not Cloning Around...
Wilson Tortosa I laughed despite myself
Awesome! Nearly spit my drink out my nose!
He’s gonna wipe out half of Waterdeep, with just a snap of his fingers...
Manshoon: Misterworldwide
Dread it, Run from it, destiny still Arrives all the same.
I like the campaign idea of a giant world spanning war carried out entirely between a wizard and his clones
It was less of a war, and more of an all out brawl. Everytime 2 clones came within 5 miles of each other they became aware of each other and would want to do nothing but kill each other. And that happened a lot, because they all went looking for the same stashes of loot. It's kinda like the start of the Hunger Games. The whole thing lasted about 80 days, and officially there were 40+ clones. Also, I think some sources mention that some just decided to Plane Shift and start over somewhere else, so it's entirely possible that somewhere in the Great Wheel there's a Manshoon that is unaccounted for.
I will never forget when I pushed my wizard into dating Manshoon, because I'm not very well versed in Forgotten Realms lore yet. The poor kid was so lovestruck he didn't think his Manshoon would spy on him. And he described Manshoon's liar in great detail after the date to the rest of the party. Rest in literal pieces, Y'boi the Drow. You will forever be missed.
Thousands of an archmage.... fun
I cant wait for my players to experience "The Manshoonian Candidate" come September!
It's funny, because the head canon i came up with for the Zhentarim and Manshoon is that the black network has effecively grown sick of megalomaniacs like manshoon and Fzoul since all of their actions were motivated entirely by their own agenda's and which ultimately squandered power and resources for the network as a whole.
No, the new Zhentarim is a different beast from what was around 150 years ago; this one is motivated entirely towards a slow aquisition of power by building the brand, setting up buisnesses and seeking out relics without engaging in assinine quests to ascend their leaders to godhood or kill elminster that ultimately waste time.
Thus a clone of manshoon would have potentially much more to fear from his former minions then he would his more conventional enemies.
I smiled as soon as I heard Chris’s voice lol
So this is probably a different one then the vampire manshoon who has been showing his face in Cormyr in a few of the latest Greenwood novels . . . Or is it - Deathmasks was the last Greenwood novel and it took place outside of Cormyr in Waterdeep it's possible that clone followed Elminster there when he went to visit Lady Laeral during the novel
Favorite book already
Cool Manshoon is back, his description and stats in the Epic Level Handbook in 3.5e was awesome!!
Don't do clones, kids
Maybe i missed it but i dont think they mentioned that he is an vampire as well. The guy has some seriously impressive feats behind him as well, such as defeating chosen of mystra in battle ( though with ALOT of prep )
Thanos that you??
Man every time Chris Perkins or Mike Mearls is on one of these I feel like I could listen to them talk about D&D lore for hours. Can we do that? Just have like an official D&D lore podcast or something? Also can I run it? Cause I wanna talk to Chris Perkins and Mike Mearls and whoever else is on the D&D lore team about wars and ancient evils and corrupted gods. I want to talk about the great good ones that are now the darkest of evils, the hopes dashed when heroes fell, the greatness that rose from the shadows of dark places. The lights in dark places that burn brighter for the pressure of the darkness surrounding them. The times when evil won and good was stricken low by doubt and loss. The terror that must manifest in the hearts of even the most heroic of adventurers when they see a beholder or a demon or the Elder things beyond the veil, That Which Wishes To Tear The World Asunder And Drown All Things In The Seas Of Chaos. I love D&D stuff and now I have more ideas for my homebrew.
Look up "lore you should know"
The Manshoon wars sounds badass!
Evil Genius gone mad , soo well
Ocean's Eleven but Thanos is the casino owner and the coins are from Skyrim.
I think I would really enjoy running this adventure I have a question would it be possible to use all 4 of the bad guys at the same time who would be in competition with each other as well as the pc party
Dont think they have offical rules for doing something like that lol but you can do what you want but could be really complicated because each villain probably has a tone of recources and organizations also each is very very powerful. Like each one is meant to last a entire adventure.
So... a superadventure? Sounds fun and dangerous...
Manshoon= Thanos
Clone Wars.... where have i heard that before??...
Oh, if the clones made clones and sparked another Manshoon war...(Can they do that? I'm not familiar with the spell)
Yes, they can
counterspell counterspell counterspell
*finger snap*
Doesn't the Clone spell just make an inert duplicate that your soul goes to when you die. Not new sentient beings that hate their creator
his clones were all made pre spellplague, magic worked differently then
The feel when poeple Compare Thier shitty Wizard Magic, to that of an ARCHMAGE
A level 20 wizard is more powerful than any standard Archmage.
Colt Carlton And yet Manshoon isn't a standard Archmage, similar to how Vecna and Acererak aren't standard Liches or how Strahd isn't a standard Vampire Lord.
Sure John, but that's because Manshoon is just particularly powerful himself, nothing to do with him specifically being an "Archmage" anymore. Archmage is just a title. In 5e Manshoon is a wizard.
What's his glove though?
He looks like if infinity war's Thanos fused with BlueDiamond from Steven Universe
Thats pretty accurate
Manshoon will appear in Infinity War 2
I think you can tell the clones by the faux-manshoon facial hair, not worn by the original Manshoon.
where does the clone spell say that your clones want to destroy you?
Any news from the guild adepts??
Doomfist
Sense when does the clone spell in 5th ed state that it wants to kill you lol. Is he quoting a past ed?
Michael Brown past edition
No, it never did that. Just summons an inert, mindless "backup" body. Story doesn't make sense unless some third party interfered with the inert clones.
It's an NPC they are not supposed to follow the rules
brainiac642 ARCHMAGES have access to better spells than Wizards, no one can say that he didn't use a version of the clone spell native to a different plane? With it's own Trade offs and benefits.
The Man's clones waged a world war, don't compare him to any thing you've played or DMed before. He's not a country bumpkin villian your used too. this is the Apex of Civilization were taking about, his game is stepped up 15 spaces than anyone's we've seen.
who isn't a god
You know there's no longer a difference between Archmage and Wizard other than title now, right john? Mordenkainen is a pure wizard in 5e for example.
1 Manshoon clone disliked.
Okay, but Xanathar where?
who would fallow the manshoons, why would one group fall one the manshoons but not the otheres.
So you're working one day, and your boss shows up and says, "Hey, I need you to do -----." An hour later you see another group of your coworkers doing something completely contrary to what your boss told you to do, except hes out there with them leading them in the effort. You go up to ask him about it and his castigates you for doing the very thing he told you to do. Then, at that moment, your boss steps up behind you while your boss is yelling at you, and they stare at other, eyes narrowing with animosity.
I imagine it went a bit like that, except over a landscape roughly the size of Europe, at various different locales. Suddenly, everyone in the group finds themselves at odds. Surely, the one they are following is the true one, he must be. They act the same, smell the same, talk the same, even magic tells you you are working with the genuine article.
Jeremy Griffin This explanation is so far above the question.
Why do some people vehemently argue that PlayStation is better than Xbox and visa versa? Why do some people buy every Apple or Android device available and denounce the other? Why do some people love McDonald's but think Burger King is trash?
People latch onto something or someone quickly and refuse everything else, denying any and all similarities. Takes a special kind of person, but those people exist.
Don’t like it when the cut Chris off.
archmage villain in an adventure that ends in level 5, yeah chris im sure he is really powerfull
Actually, yes. They've said themselves that actually fighting the villains of Dragon Heist is likely to not go very well for you.
He has statblocks from previous editions. He is a level 20 Wizard and 5 Archmage in 3E. So basically you aren't meant to actually attempt to fight him.