In one flight, in a dogshit Mig-23M, our guy dunks an F-14 through a cloud, evades at least 8 missiles, gets a reversal on a kfir into scissors for a GUN KILL, takes out a F-4 trying to bounce his teammate, and sticks a clean landing. Hot damn.
You know, I had better matches with it while preparing this review, but that one match in particular really demonstrated most of the Mig-23's pros and cons in one sortie so it ended up being perfect to include. I ended up getting a 4th kill after flying back out in that match, but it dragged on forever.
The MTI "update" really annoy me a lot. The common excuse for it was "it's really how the radar operate", which is technically true, except that I'm pretty sure the real one doesn't erase all tracked target off the scope the moment the radar switch between two mode, unlike how it work in WT. This result in the scope reset itself every time the radar pointed at or away from the ground, which is way more annoying than it sound. Basically, the way WT radar system operate turn one of the QoL feature of MiG-23 into a handicap.
Yeah, it really wasn an absolutely monstrous nerf. The Mig-23MLD used to be one of my favorite jets - but now, since the radar got chopped .... not so much ....
The "funny" thing is that, it's not even realistic, the MiG-23s IRL, this means 23M/ML/MLA/MLD, can switch between SRC and SRC MTI, but not as you think, there are four modes of MTI the MiG-23 uses, BMV, and BS1-2-3, BMV and BS-1 are the most filtered modes of radar search and use limited Doppler filtering and provide full filtration of passive noise and ground reflection, these modes on the MLA and MLD are so filtered they might as well be PD modes of tracking (not search, that stays with MTI), and they are used under 1.5km, with around 30 km max for tracking. BS2-3 are less filtered and can be used at moderate altitudes for ground mapping. There is another mode that isn't really MTI and that is BSV, this mode is a Pulse mode and has little filtering, this is the mode that is used over 1.5km and has around 60km tracking and 90km for searching. All of these modes can be selected by the pilot through the radar control panel in the cockpit, so the "update" the MiG-23s got is pure bullshit and should 100% be reversed.
@@Kijby I would, the problem is that the manual for this info isn't readily available, I know these things because we have just a few pages of information, not the full source, this manual would include the Sapfir-23ML/MLA/MLA-2 and MLAE, for the 23ML/MLA/MLD, and MLAE. Problem is that the only manual I know that exists for these radars is on a Russian version of eBay and the price is 300€ so probably not gonna have it ever. Without the main source I can't really provide a good report that Gaijin would actually read and pass on to the devs.
This guy was my first top tier, I was so excited to fly it and before it had it's R-60m's I was very disappointed. Thanks for covering off-meta stuff like this!
I haven't seen anyone really mention it, but Tim. I miss, I MISS the intro music. I do not know why but I loved it so much hearing it before your review started. Even if just once, please put it in again. Another banger vid, thanks Tim!
People mention it, but unfortunately the old-style intro cuts viewer retention by a significant margin, and .. unfortunately .. that ends up mattering *a lot* for youtube's algorithms and stuff. :-\
I’m newish to the Mig23MLA. Spaded it around 2 weeks ago. I already get very good matches in it, and I realized I’ve been sleeping on it as a US main… Until now. Really wished I could’ve used it back in its prime before the nerfs😮💨
You should have seen it in the MLD vs f-4j says haha. The r-24 was borderline op. The only thing that came even remotely close was the j-7e but that was when the pl-5b had way to much acceleration so it still was not as good as it is now
The original review was the first video of yours I watched. It was honestly kinda strange to find a warthunder channel with a chill and "sane" sorta vibe to it. I remember bingeing the hell out of this stuff while recovering from various late 2020/early 2021 insanity.
The MiG-23M is even more fascinating when one considers how much work the Soviets put into trying to improve it from the M model onwards. Issues with spin recovery, weight gain, hydrogen embrittlement of the stainless steel used in the fuel tank bulkheads and structures for the swing wing boxes and so on; took a lot of effort to resolve and remedy. The M model really never satisfied and one gets the impression the MiG-23ML is really what they were hoping for from the outset. Still compared to the MiG-21's beggars can't be choosers, provided new tactical capabilities the VVS lacked compared to NATO and the F-4.
I remember trying to use this thing when I unlocked it a few months back. Thought I could use it to grind out most of the higher Soviet Jets without having to use the foldered MIG-23MLD. Boy was I wrong, the lack of R-24s and the very limited chaff was kinda irritating, and before I even spaded it I decided to just buy the MLD and redo the stock grind over again lol.
My favorite plane when I had my Xbox last summer. I’d practice so much in the test range. Awesome game. Cant wait to get my Xbox back and start shredding the enemy.
I have been playing a lot of MiG23 MF recently as i got a talisman on it From my experience it do be extremely fast and outrun stuff like MiG21 F5C and almost everything else tho it can be slower to accelerate sometime so you will need sometime to make them overshoot as they might catch out to you before you build enough speed to outrun them Also for the R23R in rear aspect, shoot only at around 2km-1,2km, as 3km the missile might not reach the start even if the lock is maintained and under 1km it might not track as the missile as a 2s delay before starting to track (sure it's not great but i do prefer carrying tho over 23T or other AAM as it do be a nice trick, most people either don't expect a MiG23M/MF to carry radar missiles and/or don't have chaff, allowing me to get kills that i would otherwise failed to get with IR missiles) Finally for countermesure, bringing chaff is not recommended, perhaps if you try high alt radar missile against stuff like F8 maybe but the plane isnt made for that and more advanced radar missiles Wont care about your couple of chaff so better only carry flares. Usually i rarely run out of flares as most missiles can be defeated with just one and with your speed you can get out of range easely enough, just be very careful about A10A/C and su25bm/39 as AIM9L (and especially M) as well as R73 can just ignore your 12 flares, to deal against those threat i adive to go head on and either use guns or if you can use R23R That's pretty much all i have to say, personnally i love playing it, really fun plane to play and at 11.0 you're safe from horrible stuff like F14s or planes that completly shit on you like F16s which is why i love the 11.0-11.3 br
Also to be noted: IT BREAKS WINGS. Way more than MLD. Don't try any funny -G maneuvers. It will break at even -2, and sometimes if you pull while rolling.
You know the flight performance nerf could be dealt with but the MTI nerf hurt all 23's severely. At least with versions carrying the 24R you can still maybe get something with them since their decent performance while also having a CW seeker, but I'm more likely to take the T's now instead just because of how finnicky the radar is to use now. One of those changes that you're left wondering why it wasn't the way it supposedly should've been all this time just for them to finally do so years later and claim "oh it's actually supposed to be this way :D" Thanks Snail.
Hey Tim, do you think you would do a basic review of the Yak-9UT? I think it would be interesting to breakdown all three tactics for its cannon options especially with the 45mm APHE ammo addition.
man this thing was so awful when it first dropped, on an update themed around itself no less (literally the icon for the update) you can fly the F-4C and still dunk on it if you dodge the R-60M. i was one of the few people that stuck with her until the next major update that actually gives 23M a usable flight model. it was hell but it was fun
This video is showing up as members first. Is that something you changed or did TH-cam do something? Either way, this is another great video. Thanks Tim!
@@TimsVariety Yeah, my comment was more about the members first badge, as it didn't appear on the Ho-229 review which I originally commented about. Again, thanks for the review!
@@Soccera0 I think it only shows that for the first few days. I was comparing notes with a couple other youtubers and our general conclusion is that YT is .... aggressive .... in trying to push channel memberships, whether we want them to be or not.
In a perfect world, Russians would design planes, while Americans did the rest of the aircraft. Because goddamn, those Eastern boys make some of the best looking planes to ever reach the skies of our planet.
Funnily enough, the only model of MiG-23 I've flown outside of the BN. And I actually liked it. Maybe it's bad, maybe it's one of the worse MiG-23s. But hey, I've only had experience with the one interceptor model.
@@TimsVariety Agreed! I've spaded both a long while ago; on some level a bit of a pity looking how the MiG-23 has progressed over time but yet it still performs faithfully I find.
G'day Tim, Hmm question is it the mic or is your voice different than usual (sickness maybe or a dry mouth) or is it just my end? Anyway ahh the MiG-23M, an aircraft I want to enjoy but the aircraft around make it annoying to use (imo), at least the chezh colour scheme looks glorious on it.
Are you using the manual sweep in the video there for demonstration purposes? Cuz using that sweep at 100% is gonna be killing your performance at those subsonic speeds, might aswell just use auto and put it on 0% manual when dogfighting
Yes, but in most of the situations where I keep the wings back its because I'm not intending to do any real maneuvering. When I slow down to turn, the wings go forward, I thought that was fairly obvious.
@ all of em, there’s pilot reports saying it couldn’t turn. It’s easy to see that too, look at how little lift the body and wings provide It’s kinda like the F-4 in a sense except the F-4 could turn and go fast as hell. But yeah the 23 was a brick with wings. A very fast brick.
@@Elaina_The_Ashen Well, I'm not taking that at face value and that is simply not true, there were engagements of MiG-23MLs and MLDs being able to dogfight F-14s and come out on top. Plus when you look at the flight manual you can clearly see that the MiG-23 is not a brick, the only bricks are the MiG-23MS and to an extent the 23M which could do 3.5G and 5G respectively, while the ML/MLA could do 8G and the MLD could do around 8.5G, comparing these numbers to like an F-16 of F-14, they are quite close, and the MLD especially if the pilot is experienced enough, it could do 9G. I would very much like to hear those pilot reports lmao.
In one flight, in a dogshit Mig-23M, our guy dunks an F-14 through a cloud, evades at least 8 missiles, gets a reversal on a kfir into scissors for a GUN KILL, takes out a F-4 trying to bounce his teammate, and sticks a clean landing. Hot damn.
You know, I had better matches with it while preparing this review, but that one match in particular really demonstrated most of the Mig-23's pros and cons in one sortie so it ended up being perfect to include. I ended up getting a 4th kill after flying back out in that match, but it dragged on forever.
My favorite part was when the MiG-23 said “It’s Floggin’ time” and flogged the enemy team
So how about the MiG-15 ?
@ I also enjoyed when the MiG-15 said “Its…uh…umm, Its fagging time?” And kissed boys?
I liked it when the mig 25 said "It's boxbattin' time" and than foxbatted all over the battlefield. Truly one of the plane moments of all times
Reminds me of donuts video with the mld part
@@CoolLink-Zelda 🫵😳 spelling error
I remember absolutely clowning on F-14As in my 23MF back in the day when everyone was rushing to grind it, good times
I miss the floggers before they nerfed the mti
That really was an enormous crit from the nerfbat.
they nerfed all the soviet jet flight models bc god forbid soviet planes can dog fight which is what they are known for
The MTI "update" really annoy me a lot.
The common excuse for it was "it's really how the radar operate", which is technically true, except that I'm pretty sure the real one doesn't erase all tracked target off the scope the moment the radar switch between two mode, unlike how it work in WT. This result in the scope reset itself every time the radar pointed at or away from the ground, which is way more annoying than it sound. Basically, the way WT radar system operate turn one of the QoL feature of MiG-23 into a handicap.
Yeah, it really wasn an absolutely monstrous nerf. The Mig-23MLD used to be one of my favorite jets - but now, since the radar got chopped .... not so much ....
The "funny" thing is that, it's not even realistic, the MiG-23s IRL, this means 23M/ML/MLA/MLD, can switch between SRC and SRC MTI, but not as you think, there are four modes of MTI the MiG-23 uses, BMV, and BS1-2-3, BMV and BS-1 are the most filtered modes of radar search and use limited Doppler filtering and provide full filtration of passive noise and ground reflection, these modes on the MLA and MLD are so filtered they might as well be PD modes of tracking (not search, that stays with MTI), and they are used under 1.5km, with around 30 km max for tracking.
BS2-3 are less filtered and can be used at moderate altitudes for ground mapping.
There is another mode that isn't really MTI and that is BSV, this mode is a Pulse mode and has little filtering, this is the mode that is used over 1.5km and has around 60km tracking and 90km for searching.
All of these modes can be selected by the pilot through the radar control panel in the cockpit, so the "update" the MiG-23s got is pure bullshit and should 100% be reversed.
@@sealboyy6584 Report it-although gaijin will probably ignore it.
@@Kijby I would, the problem is that the manual for this info isn't readily available, I know these things because we have just a few pages of information, not the full source, this manual would include the Sapfir-23ML/MLA/MLA-2 and MLAE, for the 23ML/MLA/MLD, and MLAE.
Problem is that the only manual I know that exists for these radars is on a Russian version of eBay and the price is 300€ so probably not gonna have it ever.
Without the main source I can't really provide a good report that Gaijin would actually read and pass on to the devs.
Another thing is realistically it could also use MTI at +6 degrees vertically not -1 degree vertical as it is right now
This guy was my first top tier, I was so excited to fly it and before it had it's R-60m's I was very disappointed. Thanks for covering off-meta stuff like this!
I haven't seen anyone really mention it, but Tim. I miss, I MISS the intro music. I do not know why but I loved it so much hearing it before your review started. Even if just once, please put it in again. Another banger vid, thanks Tim!
People mention it, but unfortunately the old-style intro cuts viewer retention by a significant margin, and .. unfortunately .. that ends up mattering *a lot* for youtube's algorithms and stuff. :-\
I’m newish to the Mig23MLA. Spaded it around 2 weeks ago.
I already get very good matches in it, and I realized I’ve been sleeping on it as a US main… Until now.
Really wished I could’ve used it back in its prime before the nerfs😮💨
I got the MLA literally 1 ray after it was nerfed
You should have seen it in the MLD vs f-4j says haha. The r-24 was borderline op. The only thing that came even remotely close was the j-7e but that was when the pl-5b had way to much acceleration so it still was not as good as it is now
The original review was the first video of yours I watched. It was honestly kinda strange to find a warthunder channel with a chill and "sane" sorta vibe to it. I remember bingeing the hell out of this stuff while recovering from various late 2020/early 2021 insanity.
The MiG-23M is even more fascinating when one considers how much work the Soviets put into trying to improve it from the M model onwards. Issues with spin recovery, weight gain, hydrogen embrittlement of the stainless steel used in the fuel tank bulkheads and structures for the swing wing boxes and so on; took a lot of effort to resolve and remedy. The M model really never satisfied and one gets the impression the MiG-23ML is really what they were hoping for from the outset.
Still compared to the MiG-21's beggars can't be choosers, provided new tactical capabilities the VVS lacked compared to NATO and the F-4.
Tim , God bless you 🎉🎉🎉🎉
its great to see newer versions of some of your older videos!
This cockpit just look awesome, this green tone illuminated with the red light just looks sick
Another cracking review!
Happy belated Halloween Tim! Keep up the great work. Hope. The rest of your holiday season is great as well.
Great work again Tim!
Attack the d point!
i miss pre radar nerf mig 23, i used to get 6 kill games in my ML all the time
I remember trying to use this thing when I unlocked it a few months back. Thought I could use it to grind out most of the higher Soviet Jets without having to use the foldered MIG-23MLD. Boy was I wrong, the lack of R-24s and the very limited chaff was kinda irritating, and before I even spaded it I decided to just buy the MLD and redo the stock grind over again lol.
Love your videos, keep up the good work. But my OCD is kicking in with the titel and MiG being written MIg
Good catch, thanks - fixed the typo.
My favorite plane when I had my Xbox last summer. I’d practice so much in the test range. Awesome game. Cant wait to get my Xbox back and start shredding the enemy.
Good job Tim. U are best...
Finally i fans a video that is not 4 months or 1 year ago this time 40 minutes
I have been playing a lot of MiG23 MF recently as i got a talisman on it
From my experience it do be extremely fast and outrun stuff like MiG21 F5C and almost everything else tho it can be slower to accelerate sometime so you will need sometime to make them overshoot as they might catch out to you before you build enough speed to outrun them
Also for the R23R in rear aspect, shoot only at around 2km-1,2km, as 3km the missile might not reach the start even if the lock is maintained and under 1km it might not track as the missile as a 2s delay before starting to track (sure it's not great but i do prefer carrying tho over 23T or other AAM as it do be a nice trick, most people either don't expect a MiG23M/MF to carry radar missiles and/or don't have chaff, allowing me to get kills that i would otherwise failed to get with IR missiles)
Finally for countermesure, bringing chaff is not recommended, perhaps if you try high alt radar missile against stuff like F8 maybe but the plane isnt made for that and more advanced radar missiles Wont care about your couple of chaff so better only carry flares. Usually i rarely run out of flares as most missiles can be defeated with just one and with your speed you can get out of range easely enough, just be very careful about A10A/C and su25bm/39 as AIM9L (and especially M) as well as R73 can just ignore your 12 flares, to deal against those threat i adive to go head on and either use guns or if you can use R23R
That's pretty much all i have to say, personnally i love playing it, really fun plane to play and at 11.0 you're safe from horrible stuff like F14s or planes that completly shit on you like F16s which is why i love the 11.0-11.3 br
Also to be noted: IT BREAKS WINGS. Way more than MLD. Don't try any funny -G maneuvers. It will break at even -2, and sometimes if you pull while rolling.
9:27 The WHAT?
You know the flight performance nerf could be dealt with but the MTI nerf hurt all 23's severely. At least with versions carrying the 24R you can still maybe get something with them since their decent performance while also having a CW seeker, but I'm more likely to take the T's now instead just because of how finnicky the radar is to use now. One of those changes that you're left wondering why it wasn't the way it supposedly should've been all this time just for them to finally do so years later and claim "oh it's actually supposed to be this way :D"
Thanks Snail.
Sorry babe, can't make it, Tim uploaded a new video
These are just delicious to snack on in SB 11.0 days since the flogger flight model nerf.
Hey Tim, do you think you would do a basic review of the Yak-9UT? I think it would be interesting to breakdown all three tactics for its cannon options especially with the 45mm APHE ammo addition.
I'll get to it eventually. The Yak-3 will probably be the first prop yak I cover.
@ Sweet, looking forward to watching them!
idgaf about the turn rate nerf, but mti nerf? damn bro :(. anyways, well done and comprehensive as always tim!
man this thing was so awful when it first dropped, on an update themed around itself no less (literally the icon for the update) you can fly the F-4C and still dunk on it if you dodge the R-60M. i was one of the few people that stuck with her until the next major update that actually gives 23M a usable flight model. it was hell but it was fun
Hi there, What's the difference between SRC and SRC IR? 1:12
Also, How do i set RadarAltitude (RALT)? Thanks!
I covered that in my complete guide to radar - the SRC IR is using the Infrared Search and Track system instead of conventional radar.
@@TimsVariety Oh thanks, i'l take a look there one day!
This video is showing up as members first. Is that something you changed or did TH-cam do something?
Either way, this is another great video. Thanks Tim!
I think thats normal, channel members get early-access for a few days to new vids.
@@TimsVariety Yeah, my comment was more about the members first badge, as it didn't appear on the Ho-229 review which I originally commented about. Again, thanks for the review!
@@Soccera0 I think it only shows that for the first few days. I was comparing notes with a couple other youtubers and our general conclusion is that YT is .... aggressive .... in trying to push channel memberships, whether we want them to be or not.
Ideal fighter to Ace Combat 8. 55 years of MiG-23 "Flogger" in 2022.
In a perfect world, Russians would design planes, while Americans did the rest of the aircraft. Because goddamn, those Eastern boys make some of the best looking planes to ever reach the skies of our planet.
Imagine an mig-21 with the vulcan and the f-104 engine lol
Do not let Russians design planes, worst mistake of my life
MIG-23M (Tim's Version)
Funnily enough, the only model of MiG-23 I've flown outside of the BN. And I actually liked it.
Maybe it's bad, maybe it's one of the worse MiG-23s. But hey, I've only had experience with the one interceptor model.
I've got a review up on the BN, its a totally different playstyle with its own pros and cons.
@@TimsVariety Agreed! I've spaded both a long while ago; on some level a bit of a pity looking how the MiG-23 has progressed over time but yet it still performs faithfully I find.
G'day Tim, Hmm question is it the mic or is your voice different than usual (sickness maybe or a dry mouth) or is it just my end?
Anyway ahh the MiG-23M, an aircraft I want to enjoy but the aircraft around make it annoying to use (imo), at least the chezh colour scheme looks glorious on it.
It was a little raspy while recording, I had spent about six hours on the phone that day for my dayjob.
Can you make a review for the new British Tornado GR.4?
It'll be on the list once the update goes live.
Itchy for the F18
Could you review the new viggen on the dev server (premium for Sweden 13.0 apparently)
I don't have access to it, unfortunately. It'll get a full review at some point after the patch drops.
This plane has been suffering for so long.
Flew the mla first time in a while few days ago the mti change to the 23s is stupid af
Does any one know if it true that gaijin is gonna remove the fw190 d13 premium pack? I saw someone talking about it but they gave no extra details.
They made a news post on the website listing the premium packs they're phasing out.
nice
hey can we use IRST with R60m
Yes, you can.
The R-60M supports slaving, yes.
@@TimsVariety thanks
@@sealboyy6584 thanks
Are you using the manual sweep in the video there for demonstration purposes? Cuz using that sweep at 100% is gonna be killing your performance at those subsonic speeds, might aswell just use auto and put it on 0% manual when dogfighting
Yes, but in most of the situations where I keep the wings back its because I'm not intending to do any real maneuvering. When I slow down to turn, the wings go forward, I thought that was fairly obvious.
Well, i for one dogfight in this thing and it's not that bad
swiss hunter video?
Already have one up
I cant stand those rear view mirrors in those rus jets. Idk how many times iv lost my target because its in the way.
And now it costs 60 bucks on the market^^
Only the ML I think, this was the tech tree Mig-23M , but really the ML is pretty damned similar.
@@TimsVariety ML is the better premium. I was refering to the german event Mig-23M which is anexact copy of the TT version.
Gaijin needs to add its 1G per 100kts of pull it had irl (for those who dont know the 23 couldnt turn for shit irl)
Nah, it could turn pretty well, just depends on which variant you are talking about.
@ all of em, there’s pilot reports saying it couldn’t turn. It’s easy to see that too, look at how little lift the body and wings provide It’s kinda like the F-4 in a sense except the F-4 could turn and go fast as hell. But yeah the 23 was a brick with wings. A very fast brick.
@@Elaina_The_Ashen Well, I'm not taking that at face value and that is simply not true, there were engagements of MiG-23MLs and MLDs being able to dogfight F-14s and come out on top.
Plus when you look at the flight manual you can clearly see that the MiG-23 is not a brick, the only bricks are the MiG-23MS and to an extent the 23M which could do 3.5G and 5G respectively, while the ML/MLA could do 8G and the MLD could do around 8.5G, comparing these numbers to like an F-16 of F-14, they are quite close, and the MLD especially if the pilot is experienced enough, it could do 9G.
I would very much like to hear those pilot reports lmao.