For those that keep saying how ChimeraOS now has HDR and ray-tracing, I know. This video is nearly 3 months old (and I built this PC about 4 months ago), so there's been many updates to ChimeraOS since I post this. I'm glad to see how our homemade Steam Machines get even better!
Question: If you already had a perfectly functional PC at home, why wouldn't you just setup remoteplay? Like a 5 year old laptop can do that, and run 4k60 just fine.
@@BaneWilliams Even with a WiFi 6 router that's only a few feet away from the Steam Deck, I still suffer from massive input lag and pixelation. It's too much of a hassle to set up half the time, so I still think a proper machine is the best way to go
@@BaneWilliams Some people also react a lot more to the added latency than others. I tried to stream from my main desktop to another desktop a while back, both on a wired connection, people used to playing on standard TVs probably wouldn't even notice the added latency but it felt completely unplayable for me.
Im in the same boat . The main draw for me was the idea for they where going make sure games worked and for chance play games that never, where going be switch like civ beyond earth and deus ex hr.
This. I dread booting up my gaming rig with Windows 10; it's such a clunky mess and impossible to get it to perform the way I want due to Microsoft's intrusive updates and kernel-affecting drivers. The SteamOS is -- bar none -- the best OS I have ever used in my life (eve better than Windows 3.11). I love it so much; just wish it had Nvidia support and then I would put on my gaming rig.
There's still a lot of issues they need to resolve for an official desktop OS (especially since the majority of gamers are still using Nvidia cards). I doubt we'd see one for at least a year or two.
@@420247paul except steamos is MORE than just arch OS. Two important differences: 1. Vanilla Arch is a nightmare to install for anyone not familiar with linux (i.e. over 98% of gamers), even a nightmare for many people who ARE familiar with linux. 2. SteamOS comes with a lot of very specific and important things preloaded and preconfigured, most importantly Gamescope.
Steam is literally the only gaming company I can get behind. The steam controler looks was such a hybrid of a mouse and thumbstico and even years later its features are seen new in the market. Steam machine as a concept sounds absolutely beautiful. Thousands of people using the same machine on similar settings. It also resolves the issue of generating shadercaches which can cause lag even in the beefiest cards right now. Also they may be cheaper than the sum of thier parts. Which cant be said for pre built pcs, the closest thing to the steam machine.
This comment is old, but going to also say this is true, I don't play very intense games on my HTPC, so with these settings, it's basically running idle and unnoticeably quiet
Awesome build! I went with 5600x/6700xt combo with my Chimera OS build. It was my first time building a PC from scratch so I went with a mid size tower. It's amazing and my whole family is enjoying using it. One thing I added was a cheap USB wireless adapter for my Xbox controllers instead of relying on Bluetooth. Now my controllers can wake the PC on sleep. It compliments my steam deck perfectly.
It's cool that you can turn on your PC with the Xbox adapter, but it's a little glitchy for me. Whenever I turn the computer on with a controller, none of the buttons on the controller work. Have you found any way around this?
I remember my family got me and my siblings a steam machine for christmas which I think was from alien ware. The steam machine was definitely cool and the controller was one of the best PC controllers imo, wish valve still supported making steam machines alongside the steam deck. Great video!
I recently built my first ITX steam machine, but with mostly used parts. It runs a Ryzen 2600 + 1060 6GB. Got away with moderately undervolting the GPU, now the system is super quiet and came out at about 400$. Sure, i'm limited to graphically more easy to run games, but it's a nice start for me and i didn't have any issues yet. :)
@@brosplit Do you? He literally said it was mid range. Yes, he also said he could have saved some money by getting older and used parts. But it's still a mid range PC. With how delicate PC parts can be, not everyone wants to build a PC with old used parts.
@@tubguinace yes, used to. Did you forget how GPU cost in the last 4 years?Nowadays, Budget gaming PC costs between 600-800$, Midrange costs about 850-1200$, high end can up to 5000$.
Steam deck is my first gaming pc. I haven't looked back. I love being able to play playstation games, xbox games, indie games, 3rd party games and pc games all on one platform. I hope valve makes a better steam deck in the near future.
If you want a steam machine on the cheap just buy a refurbished 64gb steam deck and keep it hooked up to your TV. Cant get a better deal than this. It's substantially more powerful than the switch.
I know the steam controller pushed people away for being wierd, but it legitimately is one of the best controllers ever made. It was horrendously missunderstood at launch. I want a V2.
What happened with the RAM is that ryzen can only handle DDR5 6000-6200 so 6400 is just too high. You could have applied the 6400 profile then set the speed to 6000 for best results.
memory overclocking isn't exactly a casual crowd topic, especially once you start talking about manually setting speeds and timings. Understandable since the gains to be had can be quite situational to non-existent depending on the platform
@@Phynellius a lot of pc manufacturers set the speeds around 3000-5000MHz so a lot of the time you’d have to download ryzen master for ryzen based systems to force a higher memory speed so say your memory is 6000MHz you’d then have to force your computer utilize the entire memory speed and not be capped although I only recommend that if you know wtf you’re doing cause if you don’t shit can go sideways and glitchy pretty quickly!
This is a awesome sign that gamers (especially Japanese gamers) gotta start making/manufacturing their own pc gaming machine so that the small tech companies can beat the shit out of the big tech companies.
I wonder if Valve is even contemplating making an at home console? Having a hardware target for high end gaming might make SteamOS and Linux by extension more widespread. I just built a SFFPC myself(i3-12100F and RX 6800 in a Velka 7), it's for shuffling around the house and occasionally to LAN parties.
@@Planet-Anime Steam Machines don't really exist in the modern day, and the Deck is more Switch-esque. I was envisioning something more akin to a Series X/PS5 as a hardware target, but really at that point , one would be asking Valve to make a standardized PC for gaming.
@@TNTITAN The point would be that it would be an easy way for someone to get into PC gaming without having to have the technological savoir of building a PC.
Excellent content, Well-scripted, well-paced, well-editing, No stupid music. No asking for subs, comment and likes. 15~18min long is long enough but not too long that makes me lose interest. Man, You got yourself a new subscriber. Great job
If they could make tiered RDNA2/3 based steam machines (like the deck), with some that can push frames to their index decently- it would be so awesome!
What we need is steam os. Valve is working on it. They have said it’s coming out to desktop and other devices. We just don’t know when. Steam deck is proof it works. We just need Valve to work on it so it’s works with both AMD and Nvidia GTX + or newer. While back. Like maybe 2 yrs ago. I tried haloISO. It was unofficial version of steam deck steam os. But it was buggy as hell for my GTX 1080ti. The start menu pop up for “shut down” often didn’t work at least in game mode. Booting to desktop worked flawlessly. Valve is working on it. We just don’t know if/when it ever come to desktop PCs. That what I am waiting. I hate windows 10, but atm I am dual booting Win10/Win7 atm. Can’t stand o many things in windows 10, hate control panel, and using start menu for proper winxp/Win7 menu task art/start menu for Win10. Win11 is even worst. I know there other Linux distros. But everyone ive tired been junk, or had issue or couldn’t even install steam. Tried ubuntu and few others. But was years ago. I also play a lot ATS, and never figure out how get force feed back work with my g29 wheel or get my SKRS shifter to work either on my TH8A shifter. So I am waiting for official steam os. And or I hope the launch new steam box or steam console. Something that at least has same performance of ps5 or better and have at least 16 GB GDDR6 or better. That’s around 10 to 12+Tflops or better. Which should be more then enough for most pc games atm. If Valve made steam Box with zen 3 or zen 4 with RDNA3 or newer and proper dedicate GGDR6 or better. It will sell like crazy. As long steam os is stable. Thanks vulkan.api which is proof dx12/windows are bloatware.
MAN, as another new channel, I saw this video and honestly thought “no way this guy has less than 100K subscribers with that production quality.” Subbed, this was fantastic! Btw: hearing someone else say communication doesn’t come naturally to them yet is a nice refresher as it always felt like everyone else just got it right away, hence my first lackluster video 😅
rather than cutting those tabs off from the pcie brackets on the back of the pc. I normaly just bend them out with a flat head screw driver and they are less of a hassle. use it like a pry bar.
Why doesn’t Steam release an official SteamOS? I don’t think they realise how many PC gamers like myself now want a console like experience but don’t want to leave their steam libraries. They could be a massive competitor to Xbox and PlayStation.
I had a similar issue. I wanted to play my PC games with a controller from the comfort of my couch, not sat at my PC. I also had the issue that I work from home, so by the time I've done an eight-hour work day, I don't want to be in the office where my PC is. Thankfully, my living room TV has a Steam Link app and I can pair an Xbox Series controller directly to the TV. Games run surprisingly well over the local network and, while there probably is some lag / latency / delay, I certainly can't feel any.
I just recently bought a Beelink SER6 mini PC on sale for the price of a refurbished Steam Deck and loaded it with ChimeraOS. It's small enough to bolt onto the back of a monitor and fit all the power cords for both (plus speakers) into a cheap cable management box. The goal is to make it a portable, multi-purpose setup for fighting game tournaments that's easy for any player to walk up and use. I'll be doing the first field test this week, but it's worked great in my at-home tests! I can go from packed to playing a game in a couple minutes and it only takes up one outlet, so it's friendly for other setups. I'd say between the PC, the monitor, and all accessories I've spent about $425 on this project
SteamOS could work on a home PC, but I feel Valve would need to release a fixed platform hardware like they did with the Steam Deck, but with more powerful hardware. The big advantage of the Steam Deck is that the hardware isn't constantly changing, that allows Valve and developed to target a specific PC platforms, whiles at the same time, making it far easier for users when it comes to automating bios, drivers and OS updates, it's all taken care of its self. The only major thing I think that is missing is set profiles for the games, if you have a fixed set hardware for a few years, it's much easier for Valve, the community or the developers of the game to have a preset for the game that automatically sets the resolution, frame rate, visuals settings, controls and so on, so it runs more like a console in that you don't need to do anything, unless you want to change some of the advanced settings. This would make it far mire appealing for console gamers wanting to jump into PC gaming, and all it needs is what Valve is doing with the Steam Deck but for a home based PC console. As for the presets, there are 3 ways that could be done, ideally, the developers of the game will do it, like some are already doing on the Steam Deck, but realistically, Valve or the community would be a better fit, at least until this concept really gains popularity that developers do it on their own, it would be a simple thing that as you instal a game from Steam, it replaces the default config file of the game with one that works better for the Steam Deck, or a home based PC console, and all it needs for that to happen is for stability and not constantly changing hardware so developers know what to target, so something like the Steam Deck, with 2 or 3 upgrade cycles through a normal console cycle, depending on how much hardware progress is being made. Valve have the core foundations in place already apart from a preset for all the games, which would be a game changer in their favour and would make the Steam Deck or home based PC console as easy to use as a console. As for what he did in the video, it kinda defeats the purpose of what Valve is aiming for, which is the low price, ease of use, whiles being open, so like a hybrid PC/console but the user doing have to constantly maintain the system with updates and other fixes along the way, basically, what Valve did with the Steam Deck but for the home market is what we need, with limited upgrade options so there's a platform around it that developers can change, that would still be far better than what consoles offer, it's a lot more open, a full-blown computer and far more games at lower prices, and as long as Valve release 2 or 3 of them per console cycle, that will cover most bases in keeping up with hardware changes.
Steam Machines are now awesome... except for... hardware/case configuration hardware compatibility hardware failure cooling performance fan noise controller pairing/compatibility software compatibility misc software integration software configuration game settings configuration hardware pricing etc Video basically listed every shortcoming of building one of these with the only payoff being "it works therefore it's awesome".
Best thing about steam deck is that every single steam deck out there has the same specification as any other steam deck(except for storage). This gives developers something to aim for. I home next steam machine will do the same.
Great video! I did a similar project recently with a 5700G/Radeon VII. There are some drawbacks (mainly bluetooth controllers not working) but it was still fun to build and I'm really looking forward to the official SteamOS release!
I thought the idea of a steam machine even as a PC user was weird because every time I build a new PC, the old PC goes into the living room. I'll play games with a controller like usual, and it makes a great watching experience vs sitting in my office since it's plugged into the speakers.
1) because proton compatibility was in its infancy and not many windows games worked 2) the pricing structure of the hardware wasn’t fixed. So a few companies were selling the same exact hardware for different prices. 3) it was significantly more expensive than a console for not much more performance and a quarter of the games.
@@WeencieRantsSome of the prices were bloody wild; I recall some companies charging £1000+ for low end laptop parts in an admittedly nice looking chassis.
Adding onto what others said, the steam machine was really only an alternative to what gaming PCs already could do (and it did less). Sure, pc handhelds existed before the steam deck, but none with the polish, comfort, performance (which was unheard of on a handheld at the time) and most importantly, price.
Yeah this incredibly tedious process is why a lot of people just want a console. It’s like you had to work for several days to get a slightly nicer than console experience… maybe.
I love ChimeraOS because it just works, with no fuss. I paid for Win11 and still can't play SF6 on it. But guess what plays perfectly fine on my little Steam Machine! True PC gaming for all!
I'm also a steam hoarder with about 3400 games. The best decision I ever made was to buy a 75ft fiber HDMI cable and run it from my office PC to living room TV. I use a program called Monitor Profile Switcher and some hotkeys to switch between my 2 setups. I have a wireless keyboard, mouse and headphones that have enough range to work in my living room. Now I don't need to worry about buying another 4090 and can play all games at 4k with at least 100fps and not worry about linux compatibility.
I know this video is a year old, but FYI the AMD 7000X series CPUs are designed to hit 95C under load. This happens even with large liquid coolers. So, seeing that number is expected behavior.
9:43 That's not the CPU baking in your PC. The 7000 series always goes up to 95C immediately. Also, to avoid RAM issues in the future, always get ones from your motherboards QVL to ensure compatibility.
I love that he comments early on about choosing the 7600X to avoid high temperatures without knowing that Zen 4 by design boosts to the thermal limit to sustain the highest possible clock speed. Also his comparison to the 5600 which has a 30W lower PPT and would thus put out less heat in every given scenario regardless of operating temp/boost state (albeit at lower performance). Overall just weird justifications for buying the new shiny chip.
Hey just a quick note, what you experienced is 100% the result of trying to run your RAM above the motherboard's rated speed. In the past motherboards didn't bother certifying higher speeds on the spec page, but higher speeds would often work, leading to this misconception still being around. These days every motherboard has a fairly accurate reporting of compatible memory specs Gskill and Corsair (and all the other major consumer facing memory brands) all repackage the memory from the same 3 manufacturers--Samsung, SK-Hynix, and Micron. They all have nearly identical reliability, and memory issues that are the result of the actual dimms themselves are exceedingly rare when running in spec. And one more thing: You can always run your ram at a different speed that is within spec! There are usually multiple slower profiles as options in the bios for this reason
Precisation about the Steam Deck: the Deck is a portable, fully flexged x64-86 PC, and has a power comparable (if not slightly more powerful) than a Xbox One S. The Nintendo Swich has a lobotomized ARM chipset with 4 threads, and is more comparable to a portable Xbox360. A Deck is is a middle ground between a Switch and a PS5.
The Steam deck made me fall in love with PC gaming. I built a budget gaming PC years ago but it didn't stick. So right now I'm on the fence whether to build my own Steam machine for my living room or wait til Valve releases one themselves!
i also have the same case, using a 120mm aio cooler (you can use a cheaper atx psu if you want) at the front instead, you wont have to worry about low profile coolers, psu being so close and the cables blocking airflow.
Went for a similar build but much cheaper with used parts and a SSD+PS4 controller I already had. Got away with a 350€ machine that can run many titles in 1080p in 30fps or 60fps. I built around a Ryzen 3600+RX580 8Go+16Go RAM. Installed Linux Nobara on it and I'm super happy. The Silverstone SG13 is really an underestimated case when you're really size constrained. I use CoreCtrl to undervolt the GPU and went with a 12cm case fan with undervolting cables. PC is super quiet. The budget killers were the motherboard (not mentioned in your build?) and the PSU. Both these two ended up accounting for 50% of the total price. PC part builders are clearly inflating prices on SFX/ITX parts and that cascades into the used part marked unfortunately. My next move will be upgrading the video card for a RX6600 (maybe XT) and snatching a steam controller for some CPRG play (inflated prices on that part too). I strongly advise to anyone considering such a move to give it a go. If you're in doubt, go with a Windows+Big picture build. Then, you really get the best current gaming platform. So many games to play!!!
Just took my core i5 12400 plex server that I built for $400 a year ago, and added a 3070 for $200 and 64GB of DDR 4 ram for $60 and now I have a living room computer that works pretty well for less than $800. Thank goodness for Microcenter. I love the Av1 support that my intel iGPU gives me.
As a Linux user for over a decade of dual booting. I have to say, knowing how to operate in terminal is fine and second nature at this point, but, even as a mid level user of it, it is nice to have a GUI installer and to be able to plug-in play as an option. Being lazy cannot be over emphasized when you just want things to work. Nice channel by the way, well scripted glad I got here to sub at less than 1.5k subs.
always were i love my little R1 alienware alpha from 2015. it can't play newer games worth shit obviously, but i still love it. absolutely fantastic to have a box in the living room or to take with me places instead of having to lug around my PC. just upgraded it too!
It still amaze me that "console" that were supposed to be affordable now ask for 59$ (or more) annual online plan, 500-600$ console price + 60$ controller.I'm not even speaking about elite controller, "digital games" that cost the same as physical and all the random accessories. Steam on PC is way more affordable and Steam Deck with EmuDeck unlock endless possibilities !
For such a small channel, this is really high quality stuff! Thoroughly enjoyed this video, would love to build a steam machine if i had the scratch for an AMD card rn. Still on my trusty old 1660 ti.
I love that PC gamers can have a serious expression on their faces while comparing a 500 DLLs 4k gaming console, against a 1,500 DLLs PC and that's without including mouse and keyboard
The Steam Deck was a genius move that re-paved the way for SteamOS. They got it right this time. I can't wait to see SteamOS realized as a gaming platform as viable and supported as Windows. Fingers crossed!
I’m trying out Chimera on an 11400/RX 480 on my living room TV. It runs amazingly well, and has fewer issues than I have on Linux proper (example: Borderlands GOTY Enhanced would lock to 24Hz at 1080p no matter what refresh rate I chose until dropping to 900p, not the case on Chimera). I am extremely impressed.
Noctua sells a foam duct kit for some of their heat sinks. I used one for the Ryzen 7 3700X that I built this summer and it dropped my temps by about 10°.
Steam Machines weren't just small PCs. They had various tricks like heat and air insulation layers to keep GPU and CPU heat separate and improve airflow.
I fantacise of a steam deck form factor with a dock containing an external gpu and an extra cooling solution for the cpu, really giving you the best of both world (for gaming, even the best of all worlds if you consider it as a pocket productivity laptop) Maybe one day… Volvo ?
I think you can do that with some of the other handheld PCs out there that support Thunderbolt. If they add a Thunderbolt port in the next revision they'd be in business.
You set 80°C limit for a CPU that's meant to run at 95°, every guide tells you it's meant to run at 95°, every tester read it to you from their AMD notes during reviews, people discussed it in the forums...
I don't see why the hype in comment section. Windows machine in Steam large picture mode has by far widest compatibility, fewer driver or performance issues, is much more user friendly for most of us, can use regular PC mods, reshades, ENB for games, remote play (if you also have a powerful Geforce based PC and want bigger screen) etc. Additional advantages over actual consoles is functionalities like NAS or Plex. Mouse and keyboard are not needed after initial setup. And you can use remote desktop or wireless keyboard if needed
A Steam Machine fine tuned like Steam Deck would be great! Chimera OS is incredible too but messing around with PC parts and hook ups is a pain in the ass
As someone who replaced the windows desktop shell with steam for similar experience without sacrificing compatibility, you do still need the mouse for some things. Genshin Impact always opens with a confirmation prompt because of its ring zero anti-cheat. These prompts are impossible to use with the controller, even an Xbox controller. Then you still need to use a mouse to get into the game even if you have a controller plugged in, because the developers are incompetent.
I just built something similar to this with a upcycled old office PC. upgraded some specs inside it and put in a RX 6400 low profile. granted im running windows but once I set up launchbox for bigbox mode its just one click and im using the pc with just a controller pretty easy. perfect for most 1080p games@60fps which is what I was aiming for.
You could just have gone into bios and set ram frequency to 5000 and everything would have been fine😅. You most likely threw away a perfectly good pair of ram sticks..😊 Edit:(If you do not want to set ram timings manually, just buy something on rhe qvl ram list for the mobo you have.)
I built my own Steam machine using Windows 10 as the base and configuring the OS to boot into Big Picture Mode. It's basically a full blown console experience, no muss no fuss (beyond initial setup). It's just unfortunate that the 'ITX Tax' exists to make USFF builds unreasonably expensive.
Hey man, watched your video and noticed the part where you meantioned high thermals. I have this case as well and an alternative low profile air cooler. What i did was flip the psu over so that the fan faced the cpu. Then i flipped the cpu fan so that it would push air into the psu, and the psu would act as a heat exhaust. I understand that its a lot of heat being pushed through the psu, but so far thermals have been significantly improved without having to tinker with the cpu bios settings.
Yeah as someone who's built pcs, any of the "newer" cpus basically require some type of liquid cooling. I've been wanting to upgrade my personal PC but I'm not looking forward to having to basically rebuild it from scratch.
Ok, so what I do, is have my office and living room combined. My PC is in a corner and then a HDMI cable connects my Oled to my battlestation, Big Picture is set to pop up on my 2nd screen so I pick up my DS5, hit my PS button, and I get a snazzier start up than either of the consoles AND the power of a 4090... until it melts anyway. My guy, check your QVL (qualified vendor list)
I'm convinced that if Valve made a Steam Machine today, but made it more powerful than the XSX (and likely priced it higher too) they could make it work this time. It'd be more powerful than the Deck too, so the whole "just connect the Deck to the TV" argument falls away. And if they made it user upgradable that would be 10x better, though that might be wishful thinking on my part.
That’s cool and all, but I’m still sticking with getting a steam deck. I’m a portable guy. Very enjoyable video, I’ll watch some more to see if I like ya.
For those that keep saying how ChimeraOS now has HDR and ray-tracing, I know. This video is nearly 3 months old (and I built this PC about 4 months ago), so there's been many updates to ChimeraOS since I post this. I'm glad to see how our homemade Steam Machines get even better!
Question: If you already had a perfectly functional PC at home, why wouldn't you just setup remoteplay? Like a 5 year old laptop can do that, and run 4k60 just fine.
@@BaneWilliams Even with a WiFi 6 router that's only a few feet away from the Steam Deck, I still suffer from massive input lag and pixelation. It's too much of a hassle to set up half the time, so I still think a proper machine is the best way to go
@@TomJeva Thanks for explaining! remoteplay definitely only works on ethernet, so I understand completely.
@@BaneWilliams Some people also react a lot more to the added latency than others. I tried to stream from my main desktop to another desktop a while back, both on a wired connection, people used to playing on standard TVs probably wouldn't even notice the added latency but it felt completely unplayable for me.
Have you tried the beta steam build on just windows 10 or 11? Big picture mode looks just like the steam deck.
I would love to see an official SteamOS release. I got the Deck because I 'thought it'd be neat', little did I know I'd be absolutely floored by it.
Im in the same boat . The main draw for me was the idea for they where going make sure games worked and for chance play games that never, where going be switch like civ beyond earth and deus ex hr.
pssst its arch linux
This. I dread booting up my gaming rig with Windows 10; it's such a clunky mess and impossible to get it to perform the way I want due to Microsoft's intrusive updates and kernel-affecting drivers. The SteamOS is -- bar none -- the best OS I have ever used in my life (eve better than Windows 3.11). I love it so much; just wish it had Nvidia support and then I would put on my gaming rig.
There's still a lot of issues they need to resolve for an official desktop OS (especially since the majority of gamers are still using Nvidia cards). I doubt we'd see one for at least a year or two.
@@420247paul except steamos is MORE than just arch OS.
Two important differences:
1. Vanilla Arch is a nightmare to install for anyone not familiar with linux (i.e. over 98% of gamers), even a nightmare for many people who ARE familiar with linux.
2. SteamOS comes with a lot of very specific and important things preloaded and preconfigured, most importantly Gamescope.
Steam is literally the only gaming company I can get behind. The steam controler looks was such a hybrid of a mouse and thumbstico and even years later its features are seen new in the market.
Steam machine as a concept sounds absolutely beautiful. Thousands of people using the same machine on similar settings. It also resolves the issue of generating shadercaches which can cause lag even in the beefiest cards right now. Also they may be cheaper than the sum of thier parts. Which cant be said for pre built pcs, the closest thing to the steam machine.
Enable 60W CPU mode in the bios and cap fps to 60. Runs very quiet
Great tip!
Yeah it is, for TV play @@BonusCrook
@@BonusCrook Capping the FPS does actually lower the temperatures by a lot
@@decliningship4208 true, and better frametimes
This comment is old, but going to also say this is true, I don't play very intense games on my HTPC, so with these settings, it's basically running idle and unnoticeably quiet
Awesome build! I went with 5600x/6700xt combo with my Chimera OS build. It was my first time building a PC from scratch so I went with a mid size tower. It's amazing and my whole family is enjoying using it. One thing I added was a cheap USB wireless adapter for my Xbox controllers instead of relying on Bluetooth. Now my controllers can wake the PC on sleep. It compliments my steam deck perfectly.
It's cool that you can turn on your PC with the Xbox adapter, but it's a little glitchy for me. Whenever I turn the computer on with a controller, none of the buttons on the controller work. Have you found any way around this?
@@TomJeva dang sorry to hear that, it's been working flawless for me. Wish I could be more help.
That's awesome. What wireless adapter are you using? I'd love to have a setup similar to that.
Thanks.
I remember my family got me and my siblings a steam machine for christmas which I think was from alien ware. The steam machine was definitely cool and the controller was one of the best PC controllers imo, wish valve still supported making steam machines alongside the steam deck. Great video!
I recently built my first ITX steam machine, but with mostly used parts. It runs a Ryzen 2600 + 1060 6GB. Got away with moderately undervolting the GPU, now the system is super quiet and came out at about 400$. Sure, i'm limited to graphically more easy to run games, but it's a nice start for me and i didn't have any issues yet. :)
How do you run an nvidia card on chimeraos it says amd is required
@@ragestacker windows but with steam big picture mode probably
much like cars, it doesn't matter what you drive. if you built it and love it; its your baby.
@@ragestackerThere are open source fan made Nvidia drivers that work with some issues.
Are we really at a point when a 1500 dollar PC is considered mid range? That's pretty crazy
Do you have listening comprehension problem?
@@brosplit Do you? He literally said it was mid range. Yes, he also said he could have saved some money by getting older and used parts. But it's still a mid range PC. With how delicate PC parts can be, not everyone wants to build a PC with old used parts.
@@tubguinace duh, in sum the video stated: i know this is abit high for midrange gaming PC but I am happy with it.
@@brosplit mid range gaming PC's used to be a third of this price, that's more than just a bit
@@tubguinace yes, used to. Did you forget how GPU cost in the last 4 years?Nowadays, Budget gaming PC costs between 600-800$, Midrange costs about 850-1200$, high end can up to 5000$.
Steam deck is my first gaming pc. I haven't looked back. I love being able to play playstation games, xbox games, indie games, 3rd party games and pc games all on one platform. I hope valve makes a better steam deck in the near future.
If you want a steam machine on the cheap just buy a refurbished 64gb steam deck and keep it hooked up to your TV. Cant get a better deal than this.
It's substantially more powerful than the switch.
I know the steam controller pushed people away for being wierd, but it legitimately is one of the best controllers ever made. It was horrendously missunderstood at launch. I want a V2.
If they created a controller with the Steam Deck's layout, they'd have a winner on their hands.
@@TomJeva I could honestly go without the second stick still, but I agree.
1:19 Man that was too real
The best feeling is when you have a modern issue with a 20 year old solution a Redditor had before me on a older version of software
What happened with the RAM is that ryzen can only handle DDR5 6000-6200 so 6400 is just too high. You could have applied the 6400 profile then set the speed to 6000 for best results.
memory overclocking isn't exactly a casual crowd topic, especially once you start talking about manually setting speeds and timings. Understandable since the gains to be had can be quite situational to non-existent depending on the platform
@@Phynellius a lot of pc manufacturers set the speeds around 3000-5000MHz so a lot of the time you’d have to download ryzen master for ryzen based systems to force a higher memory speed so say your memory is 6000MHz you’d then have to force your computer utilize the entire memory speed and not be capped although I only recommend that if you know wtf you’re doing cause if you don’t shit can go sideways and glitchy pretty quickly!
Built one with R5 5600x and an RX6600xt. I use HoloISO instead of ChimeraOS. 2 months in and still works great! Bluetooth devices working well too!
5/10 , does not emit steam, doesnt even have a fog machine to create ‘steam’ either
Pour water into the cpu cooler
This is a awesome sign that gamers (especially Japanese gamers) gotta start making/manufacturing their own pc gaming machine so that the small tech companies can beat the shit out of the big tech companies.
I wonder if Valve is even contemplating making an at home console? Having a hardware target for high end gaming might make SteamOS and Linux by extension more widespread.
I just built a SFFPC myself(i3-12100F and RX 6800 in a Velka 7), it's for shuffling around the house and occasionally to LAN parties.
They have a home console it's the steam deck and steam machines
@@Planet-Anime Steam Machines don't really exist in the modern day, and the Deck is more Switch-esque. I was envisioning something more akin to a Series X/PS5 as a hardware target, but really at that point , one would be asking Valve to make a standardized PC for gaming.
There really isn’t a point. Just connect you PC with a HDMI cable.
@@TNTITAN The point would be that it would be an easy way for someone to get into PC gaming without having to have the technological savoir of building a PC.
@@Sonic6293 I bet most just type “gaming pc” on Google and went what looks best + affordability.
Excellent content, Well-scripted, well-paced, well-editing, No stupid music. No asking for subs, comment and likes. 15~18min long is long enough but not too long that makes me lose interest. Man, You got yourself a new subscriber. Great job
If they could make tiered RDNA2/3 based steam machines (like the deck), with some that can push frames to their index decently- it would be so awesome!
What we need is steam os. Valve is working on it. They have said it’s coming out to desktop and other devices. We just don’t know when. Steam deck is proof it works. We just need Valve to work on it so it’s works with both AMD and Nvidia GTX + or newer.
While back. Like maybe 2 yrs ago. I tried haloISO. It was unofficial version of steam deck steam os. But it was buggy as hell for my GTX 1080ti. The start menu pop up for “shut down” often didn’t work at least in game mode. Booting to desktop worked flawlessly.
Valve is working on it. We just don’t know if/when it ever come to desktop PCs. That what I am waiting. I hate windows 10, but atm I am dual booting Win10/Win7 atm. Can’t stand o many things in windows 10, hate control panel, and using start menu for proper winxp/Win7 menu task art/start menu for Win10. Win11 is even worst.
I know there other Linux distros. But everyone ive tired been junk, or had issue or couldn’t even install steam. Tried ubuntu and few others. But was years ago. I also play a lot ATS, and never figure out how get force feed back work with my g29 wheel or get my SKRS shifter to work either on my TH8A shifter.
So I am waiting for official steam os. And or I hope the launch new steam box or steam console. Something that at least has same performance of ps5 or better and have at least 16 GB GDDR6 or better. That’s around 10 to 12+Tflops or better. Which should be more then enough for most pc games atm. If Valve made steam Box with zen 3 or zen 4 with RDNA3 or newer and proper dedicate GGDR6 or better. It will sell like crazy. As long steam os is stable. Thanks vulkan.api which is proof dx12/windows are bloatware.
MAN, as another new channel, I saw this video and honestly thought “no way this guy has less than 100K subscribers with that production quality.” Subbed, this was fantastic!
Btw: hearing someone else say communication doesn’t come naturally to them yet is a nice refresher as it always felt like everyone else just got it right away, hence my first lackluster video 😅
Great video! Surprised your channel only has 500 subs. Looking forward to seeing where your channel goes!
rather than cutting those tabs off from the pcie brackets on the back of the pc. I normaly just bend them out with a flat head screw driver and they are less of a hassle. use it like a pry bar.
Why doesn’t Steam release an official SteamOS? I don’t think they realise how many PC gamers like myself now want a console like experience but don’t want to leave their steam libraries. They could be a massive competitor to Xbox and PlayStation.
I had a similar issue. I wanted to play my PC games with a controller from the comfort of my couch, not sat at my PC. I also had the issue that I work from home, so by the time I've done an eight-hour work day, I don't want to be in the office where my PC is. Thankfully, my living room TV has a Steam Link app and I can pair an Xbox Series controller directly to the TV. Games run surprisingly well over the local network and, while there probably is some lag / latency / delay, I certainly can't feel any.
this is a sick build. 10/10 enjoyed!
I just recently bought a Beelink SER6 mini PC on sale for the price of a refurbished Steam Deck and loaded it with ChimeraOS. It's small enough to bolt onto the back of a monitor and fit all the power cords for both (plus speakers) into a cheap cable management box.
The goal is to make it a portable, multi-purpose setup for fighting game tournaments that's easy for any player to walk up and use. I'll be doing the first field test this week, but it's worked great in my at-home tests! I can go from packed to playing a game in a couple minutes and it only takes up one outlet, so it's friendly for other setups. I'd say between the PC, the monitor, and all accessories I've spent about $425 on this project
SteamOS could work on a home PC, but I feel Valve would need to release a fixed platform hardware like they did with the Steam Deck, but with more powerful hardware.
The big advantage of the Steam Deck is that the hardware isn't constantly changing, that allows Valve and developed to target a specific PC platforms, whiles at the same time, making it far easier for users when it comes to automating bios, drivers and OS updates, it's all taken care of its self.
The only major thing I think that is missing is set profiles for the games, if you have a fixed set hardware for a few years, it's much easier for Valve, the community or the developers of the game to have a preset for the game that automatically sets the resolution, frame rate, visuals settings, controls and so on, so it runs more like a console in that you don't need to do anything, unless you want to change some of the advanced settings.
This would make it far mire appealing for console gamers wanting to jump into PC gaming, and all it needs is what Valve is doing with the Steam Deck but for a home based PC console.
As for the presets, there are 3 ways that could be done, ideally, the developers of the game will do it, like some are already doing on the Steam Deck, but realistically, Valve or the community would be a better fit, at least until this concept really gains popularity that developers do it on their own, it would be a simple thing that as you instal a game from Steam, it replaces the default config file of the game with one that works better for the Steam Deck, or a home based PC console, and all it needs for that to happen is for stability and not constantly changing hardware so developers know what to target, so something like the Steam Deck, with 2 or 3 upgrade cycles through a normal console cycle, depending on how much hardware progress is being made.
Valve have the core foundations in place already apart from a preset for all the games, which would be a game changer in their favour and would make the Steam Deck or home based PC console as easy to use as a console.
As for what he did in the video, it kinda defeats the purpose of what Valve is aiming for, which is the low price, ease of use, whiles being open, so like a hybrid PC/console but the user doing have to constantly maintain the system with updates and other fixes along the way, basically, what Valve did with the Steam Deck but for the home market is what we need, with limited upgrade options so there's a platform around it that developers can change, that would still be far better than what consoles offer, it's a lot more open, a full-blown computer and far more games at lower prices, and as long as Valve release 2 or 3 of them per console cycle, that will cover most bases in keeping up with hardware changes.
Just saw this in my recommened. Great video and surprised with the low number of subscribers for such terrific and informative vidoes
Steam Machines are now awesome... except for...
hardware/case configuration
hardware compatibility
hardware failure
cooling performance
fan noise
controller pairing/compatibility
software compatibility
misc software integration
software configuration
game settings configuration
hardware pricing
etc
Video basically listed every shortcoming of building one of these with the only payoff being "it works therefore it's awesome".
Best thing about steam deck is that every single steam deck out there has the same specification as any other steam deck(except for storage). This gives developers something to aim for. I home next steam machine will do the same.
Great video! I did a similar project recently with a 5700G/Radeon VII. There are some drawbacks (mainly bluetooth controllers not working) but it was still fun to build and I'm really looking forward to the official SteamOS release!
I thought the idea of a steam machine even as a PC user was weird because every time I build a new PC, the old PC goes into the living room.
I'll play games with a controller like usual, and it makes a great watching experience vs sitting in my office since it's plugged into the speakers.
Wonder if you could do a deep dive into why Steam Machines failed and how the Steam Deck avoided those pitfalls.
1) because proton compatibility was in its infancy and not many windows games worked
2) the pricing structure of the hardware wasn’t fixed. So a few companies were selling the same exact hardware for different prices.
3) it was significantly more expensive than a console for not much more performance and a quarter of the games.
@@WeencieRantsSome of the prices were bloody wild; I recall some companies charging £1000+ for low end laptop parts in an admittedly nice looking chassis.
Adding onto what others said, the steam machine was really only an alternative to what gaming PCs already could do (and it did less).
Sure, pc handhelds existed before the steam deck, but none with the polish, comfort, performance (which was unheard of on a handheld at the time) and most importantly, price.
I would love another shot at the steam controller. Basically the steam deck controls but just a controller.
Yeah this incredibly tedious process is why a lot of people just want a console. It’s like you had to work for several days to get a slightly nicer than console experience… maybe.
I love ChimeraOS because it just works, with no fuss. I paid for Win11 and still can't play SF6 on it. But guess what plays perfectly fine on my little Steam Machine! True PC gaming for all!
Why is valve not reaching into the console market? Fuck I’d buy a steam console to play all my games on.
They are! That what steam deck is for
The PS5 has exclusive games unavailable on the PC
The XBOX doesn't
PS5 + Steam deck is the best duo for me
I'm also a steam hoarder with about 3400 games. The best decision I ever made was to buy a 75ft fiber HDMI cable and run it from my office PC to living room TV. I use a program called Monitor Profile Switcher and some hotkeys to switch between my 2 setups. I have a wireless keyboard, mouse and headphones that have enough range to work in my living room. Now I don't need to worry about buying another 4090 and can play all games at 4k with at least 100fps and not worry about linux compatibility.
I know this video is a year old, but FYI the AMD 7000X series CPUs are designed to hit 95C under load. This happens even with large liquid coolers. So, seeing that number is expected behavior.
9:43 That's not the CPU baking in your PC. The 7000 series always goes up to 95C immediately. Also, to avoid RAM issues in the future, always get ones from your motherboards QVL to ensure compatibility.
I love that he comments early on about choosing the 7600X to avoid high temperatures without knowing that Zen 4 by design boosts to the thermal limit to sustain the highest possible clock speed. Also his comparison to the 5600 which has a 30W lower PPT and would thus put out less heat in every given scenario regardless of operating temp/boost state (albeit at lower performance). Overall just weird justifications for buying the new shiny chip.
Tom! This was both entertaining and informative! Great Job!
Hey just a quick note, what you experienced is 100% the result of trying to run your RAM above the motherboard's rated speed. In the past motherboards didn't bother certifying higher speeds on the spec page, but higher speeds would often work, leading to this misconception still being around. These days every motherboard has a fairly accurate reporting of compatible memory specs
Gskill and Corsair (and all the other major consumer facing memory brands) all repackage the memory from the same 3 manufacturers--Samsung, SK-Hynix, and Micron. They all have nearly identical reliability, and memory issues that are the result of the actual dimms themselves are exceedingly rare when running in spec.
And one more thing: You can always run your ram at a different speed that is within spec! There are usually multiple slower profiles as options in the bios for this reason
Woah how ur sub count so low, quality vid. Thank you for the newly learned information
Precisation about the Steam Deck: the Deck is a portable, fully flexged x64-86 PC, and has a power comparable (if not slightly more powerful) than a Xbox One S. The Nintendo Swich has a lobotomized ARM chipset with 4 threads, and is more comparable to a portable Xbox360.
A Deck is is a middle ground between a Switch and a PS5.
The Steam deck made me fall in love with PC gaming. I built a budget gaming PC years ago but it didn't stick. So right now I'm on the fence whether to build my own Steam machine for my living room or wait til Valve releases one themselves!
“Why don’t you just make a Steam machine?!” is a laughable question to ask with a price of $1500.
i also have the same case, using a 120mm aio cooler (you can use a cheaper atx psu if you want) at the front instead, you wont have to worry about low profile coolers, psu being so close and the cables blocking airflow.
Well in short i would just say great video!! Covered all aspects of from building a steam machine to the Industry's future.
Went for a similar build but much cheaper with used parts and a SSD+PS4 controller I already had. Got away with a 350€ machine that can run many titles in 1080p in 30fps or 60fps. I built around a Ryzen 3600+RX580 8Go+16Go RAM. Installed Linux Nobara on it and I'm super happy. The Silverstone SG13 is really an underestimated case when you're really size constrained.
I use CoreCtrl to undervolt the GPU and went with a 12cm case fan with undervolting cables. PC is super quiet.
The budget killers were the motherboard (not mentioned in your build?) and the PSU. Both these two ended up accounting for 50% of the total price. PC part builders are clearly inflating prices on SFX/ITX parts and that cascades into the used part marked unfortunately.
My next move will be upgrading the video card for a RX6600 (maybe XT) and snatching a steam controller for some CPRG play (inflated prices on that part too).
I strongly advise to anyone considering such a move to give it a go. If you're in doubt, go with a Windows+Big picture build. Then, you really get the best current gaming platform. So many games to play!!!
Just took my core i5 12400 plex server that I built for $400 a year ago, and added a 3070 for $200 and 64GB of DDR 4 ram for $60 and now I have a living room computer that works pretty well for less than $800. Thank goodness for Microcenter. I love the Av1 support that my intel iGPU gives me.
As a Linux user for over a decade of dual booting. I have to say, knowing how to operate in terminal is fine and second nature at this point, but, even as a mid level user of it, it is nice to have a GUI installer and to be able to plug-in play as an option. Being lazy cannot be over emphasized when you just want things to work. Nice channel by the way, well scripted glad I got here to sub at less than 1.5k subs.
“If you want high-quality first party exclusives, or if you want Game Pass” had me rolling 😂
Tom showing Forza while saying that third-party stuff are available, and Peppino's when he speaks about AAAs and first-party stuff is funny to me.
always were
i love my little R1 alienware alpha from 2015. it can't play newer games worth shit obviously, but i still love it. absolutely fantastic to have a box in the living room or to take with me places instead of having to lug around my PC. just upgraded it too!
i wish, my was complete trash and would always overheat during gameplay
It still amaze me that "console" that were supposed to be affordable now ask for 59$ (or more) annual online plan, 500-600$ console price + 60$ controller.I'm not even speaking about elite controller, "digital games" that cost the same as physical and all the random accessories.
Steam on PC is way more affordable and Steam Deck with EmuDeck unlock endless possibilities !
For such a small channel, this is really high quality stuff! Thoroughly enjoyed this video, would love to build a steam machine if i had the scratch for an AMD card rn. Still on my trusty old 1660 ti.
I love that PC gamers can have a serious expression on their faces while comparing a 500 DLLs 4k gaming console, against a 1,500 DLLs PC and that's without including mouse and keyboard
Then you got to count the price of a monitor for the PC which of the price for good one
I was so happy to see the steamdeck. I knew it was going to pave the way to a stream console that competes with Xbox and PlayStation.
Subscriber no. 817 👍 keep up the work. Very high quality
The Steam Deck was a genius move that re-paved the way for SteamOS. They got it right this time. I can't wait to see SteamOS realized as a gaming platform as viable and supported as Windows. Fingers crossed!
You have under 1k subs? WHAAAT?
I mean, with this content quality you deserves much more
When I saw this recommended, I really hoped it would be about building a literal steam-operated machine.
I’m trying out Chimera on an 11400/RX 480 on my living room TV. It runs amazingly well, and has fewer issues than I have on Linux proper (example: Borderlands GOTY Enhanced would lock to 24Hz at 1080p no matter what refresh rate I chose until dropping to 900p, not the case on Chimera). I am extremely impressed.
Noctua sells a foam duct kit for some of their heat sinks. I used one for the Ryzen 7 3700X that I built this summer and it dropped my temps by about 10°.
Trust me, it's very possible to get a similarly performing PC for less than half the cost
My pc is a ryzen 5 5500 coupled with a rx6650xt, it never overheats and I can play any game easily.
Steam Machines weren't just small PCs. They had various tricks like heat and air insulation layers to keep GPU and CPU heat separate and improve airflow.
I fantacise of a steam deck form factor with a dock containing an external gpu and an extra cooling solution for the cpu, really giving you the best of both world (for gaming, even the best of all worlds if you consider it as a pocket productivity laptop)
Maybe one day… Volvo ?
I think you can do that with some of the other handheld PCs out there that support Thunderbolt. If they add a Thunderbolt port in the next revision they'd be in business.
I mean... you can kinda already do that with a Deck
Didn’t even clock you only had 200 subs
Incredible vid dude
Didn't realize I had 200 subs until yesterday! Thanks everyone for the support!
You set 80°C limit for a CPU that's meant to run at 95°, every guide tells you it's meant to run at 95°, every tester read it to you from their AMD notes during reviews, people discussed it in the forums...
I was SO hyped for Steam Machines. Kind of a bummer how it turned out, but it worked out in the end with Steam Deck
The NVK update a couple of days ago makes Nvidia builds much more interesting. They plan full Vulcan 1.3 comparability in March next year. :)
I don't see why the hype in comment section. Windows machine in Steam large picture mode has by far widest compatibility, fewer driver or performance issues, is much more user friendly for most of us, can use regular PC mods, reshades, ENB for games, remote play (if you also have a powerful Geforce based PC and want bigger screen) etc. Additional advantages over actual consoles is functionalities like NAS or Plex.
Mouse and keyboard are not needed after initial setup. And you can use remote desktop or wireless keyboard if needed
It would be a nice dual boot option for my secondary gaming pc. Looking forward to trying it out.
A Steam Machine fine tuned like Steam Deck would be great! Chimera OS is incredible too but messing around with PC parts and hook ups is a pain in the ass
Remove the shield for the back of the motherboard. This actually gives a significant increase in airflow for that particular case.
I’ve still got the Alienware alpha hooked up to my tv to watch streams on tv. It still works awesome got it in 2014.
Awesome! I use my PC like a games console (big picture and steam input) is awesome
As someone who replaced the windows desktop shell with steam for similar experience without sacrificing compatibility, you do still need the mouse for some things. Genshin Impact always opens with a confirmation prompt because of its ring zero anti-cheat. These prompts are impossible to use with the controller, even an Xbox controller. Then you still need to use a mouse to get into the game even if you have a controller plugged in, because the developers are incompetent.
I just built something similar to this with a upcycled old office PC. upgraded some specs inside it and put in a RX 6400 low profile. granted im running windows but once I set up launchbox for bigbox mode its just one click and im using the pc with just a controller pretty easy. perfect for most 1080p games@60fps which is what I was aiming for.
If only Steam Machines had disks/carts you could keep forever.
Not really a fan of disks but i like cartridges.
You could just have gone into bios and set ram frequency to 5000 and everything would have been fine😅. You most likely threw away a perfectly good pair of ram sticks..😊
Edit:(If you do not want to set ram timings manually, just buy something on rhe qvl ram list for the mobo you have.)
They weren't good. Memtest86 was failing on every test. Fortunately I got a refund on them so it's all good.
I built my own Steam machine using Windows 10 as the base and configuring the OS to boot into Big Picture Mode. It's basically a full blown console experience, no muss no fuss (beyond initial setup). It's just unfortunate that the 'ITX Tax' exists to make USFF builds unreasonably expensive.
Loved the video. Youre definitely getting a sub
Which game is that at 0:55? Awesome video 😊
Pizza Tower. It's a fun game if you like the Warioland series.
3rd feature on why I choose console is the on disc preservation.
Still mad that some companies choose to not get the full game on disc.
Hey man, watched your video and noticed the part where you meantioned high thermals. I have this case as well and an alternative low profile air cooler. What i did was flip the psu over so that the fan faced the cpu. Then i flipped the cpu fan so that it would push air into the psu, and the psu would act as a heat exhaust. I understand that its a lot of heat being pushed through the psu, but so far thermals have been significantly improved without having to tinker with the cpu bios settings.
its funny that i got recommended this video after I've watched videos of a leak saying there is new steam console being in the works
I'm happy how i saw TUNIC several times in this video, great game.
I like how the goal was to sell console players on PC, then spent the video showing them their own nightmares of why they don't go with PC.
Yeah as someone who's built pcs, any of the "newer" cpus basically require some type of liquid cooling. I've been wanting to upgrade my personal PC but I'm not looking forward to having to basically rebuild it from scratch.
Ok, so what I do, is have my office and living room combined. My PC is in a corner and then a HDMI cable connects my Oled to my battlestation, Big Picture is set to pop up on my 2nd screen so I pick up my DS5, hit my PS button, and I get a snazzier start up than either of the consoles AND the power of a 4090... until it melts anyway.
My guy, check your QVL (qualified vendor list)
I'm convinced that if Valve made a Steam Machine today, but made it more powerful than the XSX (and likely priced it higher too) they could make it work this time. It'd be more powerful than the Deck too, so the whole "just connect the Deck to the TV" argument falls away. And if they made it user upgradable that would be 10x better, though that might be wishful thinking on my part.
That’s cool and all, but I’m still sticking with getting a steam deck. I’m a portable guy. Very enjoyable video, I’ll watch some more to see if I like ya.
while I have an existing linux setup the fact that the 6700XT can run 4k60 is a very valuable piece of info.
When it comes to living room gaming, this video might as well be an advertisement for consoles.
man if I didn't so so much stuff that only works on windows, I'd make the switch in a heart beat
Super interesting subject, great job !