We Found Something Strange Inside DeWALT's New Tool @ 10,000FPS
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 มิ.ย. 2024
- Lifetime Weekly Updated Rankings: torquetestchannel.etsy.com/li...
Today we take apart the all new DeWALT DCF860 impact driver to look at how it works and why it sometimes doesn't as well. Filming in high speed to get those sweet sweet slow mo shots, and maybe laern something along the way. - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
![Fc ครับ ขอแนะนำให้รู้จักกับ "น้องเปียโน" l [Nickynachat]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/HQU6Q_IYTLo/mqdefault.jpg)
The spring would need to be *wound* the other direction for it to be flipped and see a difference from a spring direction change if any. Rotating it on its head 180 degrees wouldnt do it.
What's unique about the spring isn't that its so strong, a heavier spring would not allow for the assembly to bounce all the way back. It's the whole strategy they used that is fascinating.
Please test all the cordless 7/16 hex drive Lineman Impacts.
I 2nd this vote
Retired Engineer here, you guys are ready for Motion Amplification software. It should work at any fps. This will give greater insight into what is going on inside. Look at RDI.
RDI?
FYI dewalt wants it driver back😮😮😮😮
DeWalt: What if TTC gets hold of this? Better paint the spring yellow.
Dewalt: Patent yellow spring 🤣
@@rafaya1729chinesuim
@@rafaya1729It is a rubber-ceramic polymer coating which increases the IPM further, hence why they could patent it.
_(just in case, yes, I'm being sarcastic lol)_
What is TTC? 😅
@@mirceaalex8313Are you lost? Do you know where you are? Can you tell me your name? 😅
Jokes aside: TTC = Torque Test Channel...
AKA where you are *_right now._* lol
Perfect timing. My wife was just asking for a new one.
She sounds like a keeper!
Happy wife, happy life.
😂
A new torque test channel video? Lady's got good taste!
😂
DeWalt should reverse that spring and internal helical and call it the DCF861 Driver, while this one becomes the DCF860 Reverser.
Yah I was thinking the same thing.
Yeah!! great idea!
Driver vs Revird
What if it had 2 springs that were opposite?
One being inside the internal diameter of the other. 🤔
The spring is most likely painted as a code. Where ever it is manufactured, there are probably others that look similar; but, have a different compression value.
I agree. That's the way springs are identified in firearms spring kits if they have multiple choices for hammer and trigger springs.
@@workingguy6666yea, that’s the most logical explanation. I know I have several multi colored recoil springs
@@workingguy6666 Yes. I am more familiar with that, than is probably good. 😎
I always get a kick out of seeing one tool brand disassemble another brand. It’s silly, but I like to imagine they are sparring against each other.
It's not silly, they are. These companies have been doing this type of testing (and much more) for a long time.
Yeah it's really kinky
Me too.
Hahaha i do too!
It feels a little disrespectful, doesn't it? Haha!
This channel is the best thing to happen to the internet
This and "Project Farm".
@@corin164 they should do a collab video
I'm beginning to think DeWalt has some dark magicians working at their R&D labs.
The tool wizards
I need to get my hands on that and fit a 3/8" anvil on it!
No more broken adapters 😂
That’s what I did to the 850 as soon as it was released. I’ve been hammering on it every single day in the shop and it’s been an absolute machine.
@@markm0000 Did you go for the 3/8 or 1/2 anvil?
@@ianbaker4295 I do love an impact driver in to an impact wrench conversion 😂
@@BrokeLifeEU the 3/8 anvil. It’s a very easy swap if you buy small retaining ring pliers. There’s videos showing how it’s done.
Crazy what you can find out when you actually break the tool down instead of just driving lag bolts to compare stuff. Thanks for your time and passion for tools.
That needs to be tested with an anvil instead of the bit chuck
Would be a wicked mod
But it’s an impact driver not an impact wrench. Whoever buys this is going to use the 1/4” hex with an adapter. This is more of a real world test which is what I want to see personally
DCF921?
@@jasonliblick9879 yes you’re right, but with it favouring reverse and being compact, would make a great compact impact
The painted spring reminds me of primary clutch springs for snowmobiles and atvs, where different colors mean different compression rates
Same inside AT tranny's
Was thinking the same thing!
Hey y'all. Just wanted to say how much I love this channel and that it has genuinely HEAVILY influenced my tool buying tendencies. I've got most of the heavy hitters (career mechanic that also does a fair amount of work on the side) including the Astro Thor 1984 1/2" and the DCF961. Don't think I'd ever have bought either if not for the hard-earned real world numbers from your channel. Every time a coworker is considering a new tool, I always tell them about this channel first. Keep doing what you're doing, I absolutely love it.
For me, the highlight of this video is the roller bearing in the nose. Finally! Combined with the longer, beefier anvil, this should be the low runout, durable impact I’ve been waiting for since the DCF895.
Problem is, the DCF887 already had that… and failed quite regularly under heavy use. The needle bearing was also a weak point on Makita’s XDT14. The 2 sealed ball bearing design on Makita’s newest models is holding up much better. And Milwaukee’s just have a bushing, which likes to seize up or go floppy.
@@josephfox3901 the 887 doesn’t have a bearing in the nose.
Love the analysis, and the camerawork is outstanding.
This is incredibly interesting! Thanks for this breakdown, guys 🙏🏽
Cool slow mo footage! That thing hits fast!
DeWalt seems to have dialed the tool in (the spring) so that you're hitting the natural frequency of the hammer assembly, with the rebound timed in just the right way to get more IPMs out of the assembly. Pretty gnarly vibrations as a result but I'm wondering if they're gonna push this on their future tools.
I was thinking the same thing. Looks and sounds like when valve springs just start to float and the valvetrain makes that buzz sound
add to that the models that seem like they have V-Tech like performance programmed in - seems like Dewalt has been studying high rpm engines and adapting the developments made there
@@nickdecker2350honestly it is kinda reminiscent of an A-10 CAS run: Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrt... All it needs is impact smoke rising up from wherever you point it.
That would be fantastic in the rec room pointed at the TV: Lume female B.O. commercial comes on? Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrt
Another pharma commercial comes on? Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrt
I’ve always wanted to see a brand by brand socket strength and slipping comparison. Huge fan of your videos!
Great a two episode week on the torque test channel
Thank you for this video, you make great content.
Wow! That is one cool impact! That camera you have is vrey cool. Thank you have a good day!
Quality content unbiased content. This is so much better than Tools with Sol.
This looks like so much fun!
You always say "the tool companies know more than we do" but I very seriously doubt Dewalt did this completely on purpose. I'd bet my paycheck they watched this video and will try to emulate your test methods.
This could be a legit consulting gig for you. This is super super valuable info. If you could keep your journalistic integrity for the fans, you ought to be getting seriously paid for this
Two videos in a week! 💪🏼
Great video
Hopefully mine comes in soon have a lot of TESTING to do
I've seen videos of the DCF860 driving screws slightly faster than the latest M18 fuel, repeatedly. I wonder if that "dance" has a rhythm in forward that is better timed in a fastener in wood scenario vs the dyno. Otherwise it seems like it would perform worse with all that missing, even considering the slightly higher speed and listed IPM.
We also show it driving faster here. Even with the uneven hits all of its faster than an m18. Up to 4750 ipm in fwd at times
That rebound effect could help hammer the drill bit into the screw so it doesn’t strip.
Just used mine first time on a job yesterday, it’s quick for sure
This channel is awesome.
You appear to have put more work into analyzing this tool than the manufacturer.
💯💯💯💯💯
I doubt that. Those drills and impact drivers are awesome tools. From my experience, they last forever and don’t really need much or any maintenance. Im sure that’s a result of tons of r&d. Unless you’re a Chinese company
Great video thank you!
Thanks for the amazing vid
That fwd rebounding reminds me of the triple hammer Hikoki you guys tested, it's definitely a powerhouse
Thanks for the video
Have you tried having some shims made to preload that hammer spring a bit more to see how that would effect the performance of the tools?
*affect
Fascinating for sure! I have seen industrial equipment have painted or coded springs for various strengths, lengths etc. but I have never seen this in a tool either. Makes you wonder if some of the first releases have initial beta springs during testing. "That yellow spring tested the best go ahead and start sending them out with that one..."😂
Love to see a dual spring version of this with beefier hammer and motor. Might not fit in the same class but the idea shows promise
it might be better - or might be worse - i'm just you're average village idiot, but to me it looks like spring chatter (or spring surge or spring knock - i have no idea) - i thought maybe just a spring with a more progressive curve would resolve - i hope... no i pray lol that TTC starts swapping internals just to see what's theoretically possible. more beasts! more beasts! more beasts! 🤣🤣🤣
Wow. Real testing! ❤
Wow, TCC and Project Farm videos for Sunday. (No surprises from Todd).
You should do a second channel where you talk like David Attenborough over super slow motion shots of impact mechanisms working. Watching this was like watching Planet Earth but for tools.
He's American, it's genetically impossible for him to speak like Attenborough.
Any chance you could do a video on Rivnuts (nut-serts) and how strong they are? Maybe testing torque loads and force required to pull out? That'd be super cool, especially since it doesn't seem like there's any content on youtube covering this. Appreciate the content by the way!
I find all these new tool advancements amazing especially as a mechanic. This year I swapped out all my 1/4" style stuff out for 12v from the 20v because of weight and if I really need the power I'm just going to step up to a 3/8" or larger 20v anyway which thanks to the last few years of crazy competition between the brands has pretty much made these tools monsters compared to when I first started out 10 years ago (anyone remember Dewalt 18v haha). Air power is still king but man I can't remember the last time I had to resort to mine. I actually forgot I had an air powered ratchet (probably because electric ones don't try to break my hand). Innovation is a heck of a thing.
I still have my 18v DeWalt. With those NIMH batteries. Mine still works but the batteries have all gone to shit. If I remember right it was rated at a wrapping 350 inch lbs.
My replacement was back in 2005 when makita came out with their first lithium batteries. Still running mine and batteries still work nearly 20 years later. I was lucky to get a few years out of those NIMH ones
The impact head reminds me of the spicy soda can, with the long travel and super thick spring
Interesting, I thought it was down to programming as well so just as surprised to see an engineered solution. SBD wizards seemed to have tweaked their magic again! Thanks as always TTC!
I wonder if there isn't a slight variation between the angles on the contact faces? Say forward being square and reverse being slightly angled to add just enough thrust energy to the hammer to bounce it every second strike? To wind the spring to get the exact change in strength for the direction change would be extremely difficult. The precision required in all aspects of it's manufacture is signifigant and wouldn't come cheap.
I think ave talked about this in one episode awhile back how to get way more out of the tool with it ballanced like this.
That painted spring reminds me of a NASCAR spring when they painted them yellow or white so when they wrecked and it went flying off it was easy to see on the track so drivers wouldn’t hit it.
Now this is a great tool
Yes very enjoyable. Another great reveal on the insides of these tools. Do you know if Dewalt's engineers film their tools like this ? 🤔 Or any of the other tool brands for that matter.
I guess you could say its been an impactful month of videos :)
if you torque a coil in each direction and it will either expand or contract along both axis (longer/shorter and wider/skinnier). seems like the friction on the spring allows the slightest amount of that torque to 'tighten' the coil when in reverse. where when in forward that torque makes the spring expand in both directions, making it longer, thus harder to compress.
Now this is my kind of science boys 😎 job well done!
Could you take a look at 26650,26700, 26800, 32700 cells for battery packs. There's some very interesting combinations.
It would also be cool to see the new 4680 cells in a pack, you can get 25AH and 250A though the BMS on the market would probably support up to 120A before the wires in the tool start melting and would be a 1.75kg behemoth for just the weight of the cells alone.
I have a chart of all cells usable in 3.7v and 3.2v
I just saw something similar to this on Steve Morris TH-cam channel. It’s all about spring harmonics.
Great video thx
I figured the Dewalt had something different going on inside. Very cool
PLEASE test all the cordless 7/16 hex drive Lineman Impacts.
Good match. if the spring were tougher or thicker it wouldn't hit as strongly.
You know the big brands watch the channel. Will be interesting to see if they get a spring wound in the other direction and truly make it a driver.
It always amazes me that the whole mechanism in these tools can handle all that violence for years and years. I have never had any impact driver fail because of an issue with the hammer/anvil/spring breaking. Its always been either the plastic casing fails or at least back in the brushed days was the motor
Steel is an amazing material
Metallurgy is an Art and Science
I thought the same thing about, flipping the spring. How awesome that would be to have a 6k IPM impact. Makes me wonder if you got one with the spring put in backwards.
Toolkovsky's Boltcracker Ballet
Also that's just a suuuuper heavy duty brake drum return spring... 😅
This is actually great. Wonder if resonant frequency is relevant. They should honestly just drill drive forward and impact on reverse. You don’t need an impact gun for anything tightening other than like wood lag bolts
It's worth inspecting the ramps. I suspect they have a different pitch in fwd vs rev.
The spring offer less resistance when the rotation goes in the direction of its coil,and more when you go the opposite direction of its coil : the friction increases or desreases at its extremities.
Have you ever tried to push while twisting a coil spring ? it's the same effect and it's nothing special.
Neat and clean version of AvE
No one can replace AvE though.
AvE is washed up. I also got shadow banned in his comments and paid him for an answer to get unbanned. He just responded that he’s never done that to anyone. Forget him.
It looks like the forward rotation may tighten the coil of the spring reducing it's length. Just the opposite will occur in reverse.
Thank you so much, I never knew of course.... now I do(sort of)
That mechanism would make a great impact wrench with it's emphasis on removal torque.
Now replace it with a stacked wave spring and see if the fwd/rev are equal. I bet it'd be a shorter assembly too.
Great Idea!
Imagine being the engineer on this tool and watching a video say you broke physics. Proud dad moment. The needle bearing is an unexpected nicety too. DeWalt has been stepping up its game the last several years with all the Milwaukee perceived dominance. If they could make the collet and the tool overall just a bit shorter, I think it would get even more adoration from the people. That 5900ipm high speed internal shot was crazy. The external use shots were even more wild. Awesome! Thanks for going in depth.
P.S. I sent you a message on Insta a while ago about some tools you might want to check out. Went to your filtered requests.
TTC, do you think Dewalt did this sort of thing with the camera on their product during design? Or did it all thru simulations and testing with fully assembled units and never a camera and cutaway?
Seems like the spring winds up and releases in forward causing the inconsistency
Hello , is something different between friction ring and detent pin , with the same matterial ? And the friction ring with the hole and without the hold is anything different . Thank you
I would say that's kind of future proofing for their next generations they can just increase that spring and that's gonna give them the higher outputs without changing the rest of the tool.
Mind that they opened the hammer/spring chamber. So there is no air cushion/absorber. Also oil or grease will seal off a air chamber.
The spiral spring itself needs to be wounded up or down this effects the spring tension for forward or reverse hammering force.
That paint on the spring might be a type of wear indicator. Similar to what is used on the springs of the drum brakes on cars.
🤔
Put a roller bearing on the bottom of the spring like the early colts have on the bottom of the hammer. Probably stop the harmonics of it scooting forward and let it max out every time like in reverse.
Hey. Let me suggest this. How about a stronger spring? Could you do that?
awesome as always, keep up the fantastic analysis. is a internal swap an option? love to see these internals in its competition, you know for science 😊
So if you wound the spring the other way, would you be able to switch the performance and have it work better in forward than reverse? You guys should totally get a custom spring made and try it.
that is very impressive...
Do you reckon the axial hammering has any effect on loosening, say, rusted out fasteners? Or is the energy too small for that?
Lighter double helix coil spring would be interesting.
Now imagine if the hammer had more mass by going past the spring! That would likely add some real beans to the tool! I’m generally not a dewalt guy (I just have makita batteries) but this is an exciting design!
Could this be driven by bench power? Could try to tune the volts and see if it would improve with future battery tech
Reverse looks like it approaches resonance between the spring and hammer hence more power.
Fascinating. It might be a winner as undoing some things is way harder than doing them up ( timber bugles for example ) but I'm already concerned for reliability in such a bonkers tool. Like to see you test it, ok, another one, to see if it breaks. And that collet.... Nope, no thanks, rethink needed, or is it a deliberate thing to get you to buy a different shank Yellow set of tools?
That spring straight up from H&R coilovers 🤣
I wonder if it might be spring wrap. I wonder if the center of the hammer where the spring rides was turned down a little bit then forward would be more similar to reverse.
A-10 go: 8:38
What if you ground down or otherwise removed part of the end of that taper on the hammer. Would it still bottom out? Is it due to stacking tolerances of the spring rate and design of hammer taper? Or is it there on purpose to limit the travel so it bounces back faster?
Where did you get your deep impact bits from
that case is gonna crack with those 90 corners.
I know this might be way left of your normal testing, but could you test axle shafts, torque obtained before failure. You could test all the dana axles vs RCV thanks if you read my comment
Maybe you can turn the spring around and make it go faster forward?
How does it get pulled back and under spring compression?
Cool review. So the other channel I saw, that kept having this impact jump out of the screw head wasn't faking it. That back and forth doesn't seem good or right. Seems like a flat out pain to deal with. Having the housing move all over doesn't bode for longevity either. With how lowish powered it is in forward and how stout it is in reverse doesn't seem like a usable, good or balanced tool to me. With all that combined with the highest price out there, this sure seems like a no go. Maybe a bunch of DeWalt fan boys will pick one up but don't think with all the above problems and quarks, it's not really going to get anyone to switch to team yellow and black.
when will they start selling in canada?