@@JohnSargent-r4l driving isn’t about how fast. It’s about the feeling! The sounds, the feeling, the experience. Having grown up in the 60’s speed wasn’t the only thing. How it looked and sounded were equally important!
. Wrong EV's are more Toxic than any and All V8's, ever made combined. One (1) EV are more Toxic than all V8's ever made combined. The Petrol ⛽️ Vehicle's Engines are easily reforged, to make new Engines, or other stuff building frames, tools, machines. Lithium-Ion Battery Packs 🔋 are made of multiple elements, and the Minerals are Granulated Materials. The Lithium-Ion Batteries 🔋 Packs are Granulated so fine that it was spread to water sources. To Creeks, Rivers, and Lakes. Killing fish 🐟, and Polluting Well and Faucet Tap Water. How my V8 lasts 30+ year's. I have Mustang V8 with 113,000 miles no leaks. EV's clean air when they work, and not burn. Toxic to the Environment when they burn, or sit in UNPAVED JUNKYARDS. They drip Corrosive Acidic Brownish, Orange, Gel or Glaze. Which eventually penetrates into the Ground Water 💧 sources. This link shows proof th-cam.com/video/2Bas81OsV9Y/w-d-xo.htmlsi=4G9bhHlH0mF1J-_A
Demonology really trying hard to fight for the EV, but the rest of the boys ain't having it; sorry Demonology, you are not cooking haws, you are just not cooking. To me, a muscle-car is a big, beefy, oversized, boxy af, simple drivetrain with a simple gearbox car with heaping amounts of raw torque and HP that does one thing and one thing only.....propels that big beast down the track really fast. It's not meant for corners or any other terrain but the strip. It is affordable, generally reliable, easy to work on and find parts for, easy to upgrade with little resources and widely available parts, loud and obnoxious, has striking lines and features, and is unapologetically passionate about what it is. It is not a supercar, it is not a sports-car, it is a muscle car.....it is not the nerd, the geek, the teachers pet, or the smartest kid in class.....IT IS THE JOCK that is big, tough, powerful, and scares the pants off of everyone else and looks good while doing it.
He’s being paid by dodge that’s why he’s trying to defend it. He’s so biased that it’s insane for him to justify this. I understand he’s keeping his options open but you have to call it for what it is
I agree with everything except your point of “not meant for corners” because well the Trans-Am Racing Series, the Australian V8 Supercar Series, and even NASCAR would like to beg to differ on that front.
If thats the case, all this Charger needs is a Hemi and an affordable price and BOOM, Muscle car! maybe have a manual transmission option. Its already, big, beefy, oversized and boxy.
How are people going to steal the new dodge EV if everything is electronic????? Dodge Chargers we’re fly off the lot lol 😂 from all the stolen ones lol 😂
Original definition use to be a mid sized 2 door coupe with a engine size larger than 6 liters. The car designated at the time being the first muscle car was the 64 Pontiac GTO. The GTO aka the GOAT, it had a 6.5 liter engine.
To me a muscle car is a midsize car with a 2 door where you could also get the car in a 4 door with more bare options with a large engine that produces more than 350 horsepower. Now a days you should get at least 400 to 450 horsepower. The last ones are long gone and not sure what we may get in the future but I would love to see another GTO or Monte Carlo with the 6.6 litre L8T gas engine.
There's nothing "wrong" with the Charger EV in and of itself, but... #1 Stellantis tried to get rid of a POPULAR Charger and POPULAR Challenger - replacing them both with this one size fits all job. #2 It's 2025 and this "2024" is nowhere to be seen. There weren't even video reviews on it till the end of 2024. The car is LATE. #3 Not only is the car LATE to the party...the technology is old. Where's the self-driving technology? Where's the fast-charging technology? #4 TESLA is currently selling Model S (and Cybertruck) with FREE SUPERCHARGING. The Model S/Plaid is far superior to virtually all other EV on the market and actually cheaper than the Daytona EV. They are attempting to REPLACE more desirable products with a less desirable product in a market where enthusiasts reign. Not gonna work.
Dodge needs to listen to their consumers. The EV platforms that are out now are here aren’t going away. It is what it is. But… from this point forward they should learn and improve on areas the consumer wants to see. Plus continue the Hemis as well while the EV platforms are improving over the next few years
This is a sit down that the brotherhood of muscle needed to have. Glad you pulled it off. Great podcast. Do it again…the conversation needs to continue.
Great conversations and thank you for this video. For what it’s worth here is my 2 cents. As a lifelong Mopar guy, Stellantis and Carlos completely dropped the ball on this EV charger . Stellantis made the stupid decision to shut down the awesome ICE challengers and chargers and gave us Mopar guys the middle finger and said, no more hemi’s, you will take this EV charger and nothing else. What did they end up with, a 2024 EV at a high price with so many problems it still is not ready for saleNot one of us Mopar guys that I know was interested in an EV Mopar. As far the opinion that we had no choice to go all EV, total bullcrap. Look at Ford, look at GM, they continue to offer ICE ass kick V8 muscle cars . You can put lipstick on a pig but it’s still a pig
Great collaboration Big ups to setting this up On you and Rich’s discussion with the engineers about the wide body possibility showed me they may have made it too wide. I was looking forward to a separate fender widebody add on in the future. Oh well
Love the improvements you all wanted to make, then coming up with the words for them, you all started laughing because it's funny to upgrade an EV. Thanks for getting together and having some fun at the same time. Your muscle car definitions were great!
Personally, the world isn't ready for EV's. They are not sustainable, are too expensive, and too dangerous for the average buyer. They also have no soul which cannot be fixed.
@B0obJunior i never said that all cars have soul. This is in reference to muscle cars and sports cars. You completely ignored the main point of my statement.
@hellomeatrobots the emotion it causes when you drive it. The excitement you feel when you hear the engine rumble to life. The adrenaline rush when you shift or press the pedal. That, in my opinion, is what gives a car soul.
@@MewVSMewtwo94 Sounds like it's the driver who gives the car its soul, and that doesn't really preclude any car from having one. It's just a matter of appreciating it.
I recently bought my dream muscle car. A 2020 Dodge Challenger 1320 (1970 modernized replica) with 7k miles for 35k. How they going to beat that? Why even try? Man come up with another concept like the real dodge dart. Bring that back make it small boxy and a lot of power. They can 100% put that inline in there keep it light and fast.
A muscle car is supposed to be all engine with everything else stripped down for speed. Bare bones with emphasis on speed. It’s not supposed to be a personal luxury car. And it’s supposed to be authentic, not have fake noises and gimmicks.
It’s funny because if you look at the brochure for the 1969 dodge charger, it’s emphasized as being a luxury coupe. With the big engine option for towing RVs. i.postimg.cc/9FbgPPHh/IMG-0292.jpg
Great Podcast Brotha I definitely agree that Dodge could've did better with the All New Charger Daytona Scatpack and I hope Tim influences Dodge to go back to its roots
I rarely watch long videos. This was great. I feel like I could sit and discuss cars with any of you guys. This car is DOA. Too much money for a nice/quick commuter. I use my RT (w/exhaust) as my daily, but I spent $20K for it and occasionally I take it road trips. The only people that would want this are city dwellers and they don't want a super wide/long car; too hard to park. Additionally, no one will rent a car (for more than a day) that they can't recharge.
I drove the Model 3 performance. For the money, it's a fantastic value. The Model Y Performance refresh will definitely be a game changer when it debuts soon. BUT THE TESLA MODEL S PLAID IS THE FASTEST THING I'VE EVER DRIVEN IN MY LIFE. And that thing is absolutely terrifying to drive. For them to be selling those things for under $100,000 - and capable of beating Lamborghinis and Ferraris in the quarter mile is absolutely amazing. Eventually, Tesla will have the performance of the Lucid Sapphire. Bugatti KILLER for under $150,000 is ridiculous.
This was overall a great conversation. No matter your view. Herman wasn’t advocating for the Daytona. He was just pointing out some good things. He agrees about the soul of the car
Now that Carlos Tavares has been fired, it’s easy to blame him for all of CDJR’s problems, but many of these issues predate his leadership. Tavares wasn’t there when Dodge abandoned affordable models like the Dart and 200, or when the Grand Caravan’s design grew stale and the Dodge Journey was canceled without a replacement for affordable SUVs. The company also faces long-standing quality issues, including EcoDiesel engine failures and underwhelming fuel efficiency. Even the Hemi V8 showed its age with problems like the “Hemi tick.” Meanwhile, dealerships alienated customers with excessive markups. On top of that, CDJR’s lack of investment in EVs has cost them globally, particularly in China, where they’ve seen significant profit losses. Without early investment, they now face steep challenges in scaling EV production to reduce costs and compete with brands like Tesla and BYD. Tavares’ firing may be a leadership shift, but CDJR’s struggles are deep-rooted. Overcoming these challenges will require major changes to their product strategy and production processes to remain competitive.
Taycan turbo gt is a dual motor and is faster then a plaid and better then them all around track. If u choose to do 2motors it better be alot better at handling. Dodge didn't even do that.
Great conversation you guys. You should think about doing these once a quarter. Cause there are going to be some real changes coming. Esp when the HEMI comes back.
Always good to see the Car Guru (no trademark) comment on an EV with his extensive EV history. Of course the best EV I've seen is that Tesla ICE-T. On the "software" upgrade, that's no difference with the Audi RS e Tron GT.
This would have been a very nice thing to do I've always wanted to review cars for companies and give them the real man's review of it. But one problem is one person on this panel actually may be sponsored by Dodge we love this man so he's not really being that harsh as he could be. I love riches review and the other Fellas on here one person on here might be being a little biased
I really appreciate everyone taking the time to put this together, and your candid, honest feedback. To be honest, this wasn't as bad as I was expecting it to be. I said this on the owner's forum, and I'll repeat it for those that don't agree with this crew or their opinions: "We have to be careful not to completely dismiss everything these guys say, and risk missing some of the valid points they make. It I were Dodge, as hard as pill it would be to swallow, I'd be taking notes and preparing updates that would address those concerns and shut them down." I work in the tech space, and one of the most important methods of product improvement isn't internal or partner testing; it's the real world feedback from customers (especially the unhappy ones). They are literally telling you, "If only it did THIS, or didn't do THAT." They are giving you the recipe for success, because they care about the brand and they want products that excite and interest them. Butter said it best at the kick-off of the call, "I just hope that we go back to being fun." You'd think that would be a pretty simply wish to grant. Cheers Everyone! Appreciate the video.
Leave it to the guys who didn't drive the car have the most opinions on the car, I trust demonology opinion on the car since he actually races and has EVs and knows what to expect , and if he is impressed on what it can do and not do but is willing to give it a chance that maybe future updates can fix alot of those issues.
I run my Tesla and my i4 bmw as well as the scat pack and STS V. Sorry I don’t think you’re going to find many sticking up for that bum EV charger. Period
It's funny how life repaeats itself. Life before the internt. In 69, the Chager Daytona was so hated that they sat on lots for years, causing some dealers to convert them to regular chargers. Decades passed before they were considered cool. I believe this Charger Daytona may be the same..
OC Motivator, I object to your characterization of the Neon as a POS. LOL. The first gen Neon was actually developed as a driver's car. What held it back was the 3-speed automatic and the roll-up rear windows. The 5-speed manual variants (especially the R/T) were brilliant. That being said, your idea of bringing back the Neon bodies is a great idea. They are relatively lightweight. Even the 2nd gen (SRT-4) is 2900 lbs.
Good video here. TK Santa down there had some cringey racial comments a couple times. I will say though that Dodge needs to do 2 things pre-launch: 1) Offer a DAY 1 upgrade to both RT/Scat. SCAT needs to be right under 700HP and the RT needs mid 5’s. 2) Offer 1 year free charging and or follow ford with the home charger ev charger installs. Next Gen, go HYBRID! Scrap full ev r&d for now and come back in couple years while the charging network is built out across the country
49:47 The 1969 Dodge Charger is in the history books as one of the great automotive designs. With that as a backdrop, I think the designers did the best they could with what they had. It appears as a modern interpretation of a 1969 Dodge Charger, given US bumper and light regulation. If it had the 3.6L Pentastar and a 5.7L Hemi for $40,000 they couldn't make enough of them. They would have limit production ordering. To do an EV muscle car it should be 75% of the size it is, HAS to use Tesla's network, and partner with Harmon Kardon to build the sophisticated "Fratzonic" exhaust system ever conceived, that is easily customizable and could be loud and obnoxious enough to warrant a noise ordinance citation in any county in America.
People overlook that Dodge/FIAT hasn't had a decent economy car in 20yrs. Its the reason ford and gm are able to still make v8s is because of the malibus and fusions they sell regardless of what we think about them.
Definition of a Muscle Car is as Follows: Requirements 1. Needs to be a Rear Wheel Drive only. 2. Needs to have V8 variant. 3. Needs to 2 + 2 seating 4. Needs to be 2 Doors Mustang was knocked out of Hierarchy in Muscle Car World. With the Muscle Car. The Dodge Charger was knocked out with the 4 doors... it doesn't matter if it has 500 hp, or 1,000 + hp. The New EV Charger Look on the Daytona with the 6 Cylinder or EV's. Is not a Muscle Car. It isn't the Automotive Heritage of the Muscle Car. The only existing Muscle Car standing are the Challengers, if Pontiac Firebird or GTO still existed they would still be Muscle Cars. Now all pony cars are Sports Cars competing with European GT... One (1) EV are more Toxic than all V8's ever made combined. The Petrol ⛽️ Vehicle's Engines are easily reforged, to make new Engines, or other stuff building frames, tools, machines. Lithium-Ion Battery Packs 🔋 are made of multiple elements, and the Minerals are Granulated Materials. The Lithium-Ion Batteries 🔋 Packs are Granulated so fine that it was spread to water sources. To Creeks, Rivers, and Lakes. Killing fish 🐟, and Polluting Well and Faucet Tap Water. How my V8 lasts 30+ year's. I have Mustang V8 with 113,000 miles no leaks. EV's clean air when they work, and not burn. Toxic to the Environment when they burn, or sit in UNPAVED JUNKYARDS. They drip Corrosive Acidic Brownish, Orange, Gel or Glaze. Which eventually penetrates into the Ground Water 💧 sources. This link shows proof th-cam.com/video/2Bas81OsV9Y/w-d-xo.htmlsi=4G9bhHlH0mF1J-_A
I wished most all the 1980s - 2000 FWD car & van would have had an electric motor RWD hybrid. What about that 2 mode hybrid Chevrolet & Chrysler used. Sure it was just a 4sp. But with electric motor in place of a torque converter, maybe lower gears are not necessary. It had a switch to be EV only. Once and awhile, I still see one. Saturn Vue hybrid was the only 2 mode hybrid FWD. As for the argument of 8sp trans vs 10. I think 5sp is good enough. If 70mph is under 2800 RPM. I'm happy. I'd love to get a 4sp automatic for my B or RB engine.
I can understand (as much as i hate the idea) making the CHARGER electric. It makes sense in a tongue-in-cheek way. But they should have never got rid of the Challenger. That was the actual muscle car
@ You are the last person to be talking with all that clickbait you post dry lying on dodge. Like I said yall be crying like fans boys. This is the future. Nobody imagines the far future with ice engines lol. At some point the definition would have to change. And let’s not forget to mention that the crap you guys drive is already a big hunk of electrical crap. Today’s cars can barely be called muscle when compared to yesterday’s… Electric is the way. N these companies make moves decades ahead. How about you except that you are a dinosaur and no longer dodges core customers. They aren’t making cars for you. They’re making them for us lol. Demonology was the only one not being a girl about it.
Saying , "My wife would like this car" is not a proper endorsement for a muscle car. This car offends no one except those who don't care about offending.
The world has been changing since the wheel. Either embrace or be an angry old man in skipped over. OC is always mad,unhappy, not laughter, Mr curmudgeon. Mine he lives in OC.
Herman.... That car is not fast...... I can't wait to see the quarter mile times..... Also, it is WAY overpriced, and you can't modify the car at all other than some boring cosmetic crap. Regardless it's fat, heavy and not enough power to compensate for it. AND making the EV louder won't make it better! It just makes it funnier and goofier at a louder frequency. It's corny
It ran mid 11s at ~120 consistently at the event while spinning the front tires every pass. A good set of tires, full charge, and a cooler day and you should get low 11s no problem. Keep in mind that is the mid level car which starts at $70k.
Hellcat engine weighs over 1,000 lbs with the supercharger. The new Charger online 6 twin turbos engine weighs 430 lbs WHATTTT!! That car is going to be phenomenal. Modded turbos, downpipes, exhaust , tuned . Dodge knows that car is the one. Watch the markup!!
Only way those $75-80k Dodge EVs will sell is if they beat a plaid. Be cheaper and faster than the competition and there will be backorders. Otherwise the mass population won't buy them. They need to be in everyone's hand at $35-40k. Average transaction is $44k for a new car today.
If people are criticizing the new Dodge Daytona EV as “not being a real muscle car,” it’s worth pointing out that the FWD Dodge Daytona of the ’80s and ’90s wasn’t exactly traditional muscle car material either. That car traded rear-wheel drive and V8s for a smaller, turbocharged four-cylinder engine and a front-wheel-drive platform. Yet, despite the departure from muscle car norms, it found its place as a sporty, performance-focused car for its time. The new Daytona EV is similar in that it’s redefining what a muscle car can be for a new era. Sure, it doesn’t have a roaring V8 or rear-wheel drive, but neither did the FWD Daytona-and it still carved out a fanbase. Muscle cars have always been about delivering performance and pushing boundaries, and while the EV version is a radical departure, so was the shift to FWD in the ’80s. Maybe it’s not what we’re used to, but dismissing it outright ignores Dodge’s history of evolving its products to meet the demands of the moment.
Over priced compared to it's competitors; Under performs compared to it's competitors; Software & touch screen have issues & is slow; Fit & finish are sub par; Flawed design elements. This vehicle is the epitome of a vehicle that no one at Dodge wanted to make & from the design, to the manufacturing to the sales/dealerships it shows. I'm basing these comments off of everything I have read & seen from people that have driven these cars. Even the petrol version is not looking like it will be better than the ancient, outgoing chassis/vehicles. Car is heavier & bigger than the outgoing model which is the opposite of what everyone was hoping for back in 2017/18 (when we were teased with rumors that Dodge would take the Alfa Guilia chassis & make a smaller, lighter 700+hp AWD version of the Challenger). Carlos absolutely RUINED this brand, then got ran out of town AFTER the damage was done. Such a shame. Unless they make stage kits for the Hurricane that can put out Hellcat (or better) numbers AND have the Hurricane hold up as well as the HC motors, long term, then this whole generation of Chargers is a complete & utter failure. Such a shame...
A muscle car is just a personal luxury car without the luxury, hence the cheap price and wide availability. Because of the cheap price of muscle cars, they could be had by ANYONE and anyone, could race a rich guy in a pricey fast car and win. Cheap, fast, fun.
I honestly think people have forgotten where "muscle cars" came from. They were originally small to mid-size "economy" cars (yes, cars that came with inline and slant 6 engines) that were altered from their original intent to have more performance (power, handling and "braking" [as much as 4-wheel drums could give]) and typically had altered aesthetics to set them apart from the more mundane versions. That's IT! THAT is a "muscle car". There is NO "requirement" for it to be V8 or RWD. Having said that, due to the faults of this new car that Stelantis has thrust upon the world I can't in good conscience call it a "muscle car". I defended that thing all the way up until here recently and the faults found by the reviewers (some in this chat) squashed my support. I like the body style, but that's really it. The execution of everything else is utter garbage. I don't blame the engineers...they worked with what they had, but unfortunately that wasn't a lot and it shows. This is what happens when marketing and management design a car....you get this trash.
I shouldn’t have to press a button to show a lane patrolling Karen that I’m pissed for slowing me down in the passing lane. Maybe good for sneaking up on a cheating wife but not for dumb-dumbs in traffic who think their mirrors should be pointed at themselves.
I would definitely get a Tesla model 3 performance over the charger scat pack EV. I would get the Tesla model 3 Rear Wheel drive over the RT. I’m kind of digging the new model 3 looks since it’s been refreshed. It kind of reminds me of a Toyota GR86, in the front at least.
For me, if it's 13 second or less 1/4 mile. It's a muscle car. 11 second 1/4 mile is a race car. 383 4bbl was just 330-350hp. Electric motor gives instant power response. As for 2025 2dr charger, interior reminds me of 1966-67 Charger. 4dr to me should be another body.
I'm sure the 2025 charger is a nice parking lot rallye racer. Might be too wide. I wonder how it would do at Portland race track. Or other road racing track.
In the words of Homer Simpson…
“When I step on the gas, I want people to think the world is coming to an end!”
When Rich explained the symphony of moving parts....... he nailed it. That's why we love gasoline engines.
@@JohnSargent-r4l driving isn’t about how fast. It’s about the feeling! The sounds, the feeling, the experience. Having grown up in the 60’s speed wasn’t the only thing. How it looked and sounded were equally important!
@charlesjames9783 yes sir! While going fast😁😄
Let’s goooo! Great spending time with you guys!
At this point I think we should just deal with this ev crap I think eventually dodge going to make cars better then hellcats
. Wrong EV's are more Toxic than any and All V8's, ever made combined.
One (1) EV are more Toxic than all V8's ever made combined.
The Petrol ⛽️ Vehicle's Engines are easily reforged, to make new Engines, or other stuff building frames, tools, machines.
Lithium-Ion Battery Packs 🔋 are made of multiple elements, and the Minerals are Granulated Materials. The Lithium-Ion Batteries 🔋 Packs are Granulated so fine that it was spread to water sources. To Creeks, Rivers, and Lakes. Killing fish 🐟, and Polluting Well and Faucet Tap Water.
How my V8 lasts 30+ year's. I have Mustang V8 with 113,000 miles no leaks.
EV's clean air when they work, and not burn. Toxic to the Environment when they burn, or sit in UNPAVED JUNKYARDS. They drip Corrosive Acidic Brownish, Orange, Gel or Glaze. Which eventually penetrates into the Ground Water 💧 sources. This link shows proof
th-cam.com/video/2Bas81OsV9Y/w-d-xo.htmlsi=4G9bhHlH0mF1J-_A
Demonology really trying hard to fight for the EV, but the rest of the boys ain't having it; sorry Demonology, you are not cooking haws, you are just not cooking. To me, a muscle-car is a big, beefy, oversized, boxy af, simple drivetrain with a simple gearbox car with heaping amounts of raw torque and HP that does one thing and one thing only.....propels that big beast down the track really fast. It's not meant for corners or any other terrain but the strip. It is affordable, generally reliable, easy to work on and find parts for, easy to upgrade with little resources and widely available parts, loud and obnoxious, has striking lines and features, and is unapologetically passionate about what it is. It is not a supercar, it is not a sports-car, it is a muscle car.....it is not the nerd, the geek, the teachers pet, or the smartest kid in class.....IT IS THE JOCK that is big, tough, powerful, and scares the pants off of everyone else and looks good while doing it.
He’s being paid by dodge that’s why he’s trying to defend it. He’s so biased that it’s insane for him to justify this. I understand he’s keeping his options open but you have to call it for what it is
I agree with everything except your point of “not meant for corners” because well the Trans-Am Racing Series, the Australian V8 Supercar Series, and even NASCAR would like to beg to differ on that front.
If thats the case, all this Charger needs is a Hemi and an affordable price and BOOM, Muscle car! maybe have a manual transmission option. Its already, big, beefy, oversized and boxy.
How are people going to steal the new dodge EV if everything is electronic????? Dodge Chargers we’re fly off the lot lol 😂 from all the stolen ones lol 😂
Kickbacks lol
Man I enjoyed seeing all of the Mopar family together kicking it.
MUSCLE CAR DEFINITION: A muscle car is an American-made two-door sports coupe with a powerful engine, generally designed for high-performance driving.
Its funny how almost everyone couldn't give a good description on what a muscle car is to them 😅
Original definition use to be a mid sized 2 door coupe with a engine size larger than 6 liters. The car designated at the time being the first muscle car was the 64 Pontiac GTO. The GTO aka the GOAT, it had a 6.5 liter engine.
To me a muscle car is a midsize car with a 2 door where you could also get the car in a 4 door with more bare options with a large engine that produces more than 350 horsepower. Now a days you should get at least 400 to 450 horsepower. The last ones are long gone and not sure what we may get in the future but I would love to see another GTO or Monte Carlo with the 6.6 litre L8T gas engine.
@@MichaelBangart yup it essentially changed a little over time. Like the “Pony” car. Pony car now is a combination of a GT and Sports car.
@@MaddNomad1015 that's ALWAYS been what a pony car is.
This was an awesome video and enjoyed learning about this car. Rich keeps it 100 as usual
@@TKsGarage TK I've got a nice used Yugo I'll let you have at steal.
Where racer X at why he scared of the adversity 😂
@@Newjeffcity x wants first bid on that Banshee
TK's not using his "business voice..." "Hey, TK, tell us you're from Boston without telling us you're from Boston." 😆
My bad lol 😂
There's nothing "wrong" with the Charger EV in and of itself, but...
#1 Stellantis tried to get rid of a POPULAR Charger and POPULAR Challenger - replacing them both with this one size fits all job.
#2 It's 2025 and this "2024" is nowhere to be seen. There weren't even video reviews on it till the end of 2024. The car is LATE.
#3 Not only is the car LATE to the party...the technology is old. Where's the self-driving technology? Where's the fast-charging technology?
#4 TESLA is currently selling Model S (and Cybertruck) with FREE SUPERCHARGING. The Model S/Plaid is far superior to virtually all other EV on the market and actually cheaper than the Daytona EV.
They are attempting to REPLACE more desirable products with a less desirable product in a market where enthusiasts reign. Not gonna work.
This needs to be pinned
Dodge needs to listen to their consumers. The EV platforms that are out now are here aren’t going away. It is what it is. But… from this point forward they should learn and improve on areas the consumer wants to see. Plus continue the Hemis as well while the EV platforms are improving over the next few years
This is a sit down that the brotherhood of muscle needed to have. Glad you pulled it off. Great podcast. Do it again…the conversation needs to continue.
All of my favorite Auto Industry TH-cam Dudes 👍🏾
OC was spot on!! Outstanding perspective and point of view. Well explained
This was an awesome collaboration. Please do this more often.
Great conversations and thank you for this video. For what it’s worth here is my 2 cents. As a lifelong Mopar guy, Stellantis and Carlos completely dropped the ball on this EV charger . Stellantis made the stupid decision to shut down the awesome ICE challengers and chargers and gave us Mopar guys the middle finger and said, no more hemi’s, you will take this EV charger and nothing else. What did they end up with, a 2024 EV at a high price with so many problems it still is not ready for saleNot one of us Mopar guys that I know was interested in an EV Mopar. As far the opinion that we had no choice to go all EV, total bullcrap. Look at Ford, look at GM, they continue to offer ICE ass kick V8 muscle cars . You can put lipstick on a pig but it’s still a pig
When Rich filmed Herman asleep during the presentation, that was all I needed to know. Sad.
I wasn't asleep 😅🤣😂
@@Demonology looked like you were close, though lol
@Demonology you might not have been asleep. I know one thing for sure, you were NOT impressed.
The Banshee might be interesting coming out, but even more interesting would be a 2026 Hemi Cuda
Let’s play a game, who seems biased or dare I say compromised 😂😂😂
😂😂😂
Great collaboration
Big ups to setting this up
On you and Rich’s discussion with the engineers about the wide body possibility showed me they may have made it too wide.
I was looking forward to a separate fender widebody add on in the future.
Oh well
Love the improvements you all wanted to make, then coming up with the words for them, you all started laughing because it's funny to upgrade an EV. Thanks for getting together and having some fun at the same time. Your muscle car definitions were great!
I don't really like EV cars, but if someone wants a Charger EV, that's on them.not going to hate them.
Personally, the world isn't ready for EV's. They are not sustainable, are too expensive, and too dangerous for the average buyer. They also have no soul which cannot be fixed.
A corolla has a soul? A rav4 has a soul? Come on now, most car make the worst sound known to man with a trash CVT.
@B0obJunior i never said that all cars have soul. This is in reference to muscle cars and sports cars. You completely ignored the main point of my statement.
How can I tell if a car has a soul?
@hellomeatrobots the emotion it causes when you drive it. The excitement you feel when you hear the engine rumble to life. The adrenaline rush when you shift or press the pedal. That, in my opinion, is what gives a car soul.
@@MewVSMewtwo94 Sounds like it's the driver who gives the car its soul, and that doesn't really preclude any car from having one. It's just a matter of appreciating it.
Great Discussion, Really fun to watch. Thank you!
Phenomenal episode Herman
Respect to Rich for keeping it 💯
Great points. This dudes make more sense then all the car manufacturers CEOs combine.
I recently bought my dream muscle car. A 2020 Dodge Challenger 1320 (1970 modernized replica) with 7k miles for 35k. How they going to beat that? Why even try? Man come up with another concept like the real dodge dart. Bring that back make it small boxy and a lot of power. They can 100% put that inline in there keep it light and fast.
🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 video a few of my favorite Mopar creators collabing 🙏🏾
Love you bro but I'm here for uncle rich who keeps it 1 thousand 👏🏽💪🏾
A muscle car is supposed to be all engine with everything else stripped down for speed. Bare bones with emphasis on speed. It’s not supposed to be a personal luxury car. And it’s supposed to be authentic, not have fake noises and gimmicks.
It’s funny because if you look at the brochure for the 1969 dodge charger, it’s emphasized as being a luxury coupe. With the big engine option for towing RVs.
i.postimg.cc/9FbgPPHh/IMG-0292.jpg
This was an awesome idea 💡 👏 😮letssss goooo
Collaboration show, very nice 👍
Great Podcast Brotha I definitely agree that Dodge could've did better with the All New Charger Daytona Scatpack and I hope Tim influences Dodge to go back to its roots
This was fun to listen to! Thank you guys!
Very cool video. Really nice to see the Mopar nation of TH-cam enthusiasts get together. Good content
I rarely watch long videos. This was great. I feel like I could sit and discuss cars with any of you guys. This car is DOA. Too much money for a nice/quick commuter. I use my RT (w/exhaust) as my daily, but I spent $20K for it and occasionally I take it road trips. The only people that would want this are city dwellers and they don't want a super wide/long car; too hard to park. Additionally, no one will rent a car (for more than a day) that they can't recharge.
I can't see how an EV would be interesting to an enthusiast. I mean , all you do is drive it. Seems boring to spectators who enjoy the sounds as well.
This was dope to see! I wish Racer X was apart of this conversation too
I drove the Model 3 performance. For the money, it's a fantastic value. The Model Y Performance refresh will definitely be a game changer when it debuts soon.
BUT THE TESLA MODEL S PLAID IS THE FASTEST THING I'VE EVER DRIVEN IN MY LIFE.
And that thing is absolutely terrifying to drive.
For them to be selling those things for under $100,000 - and capable of beating Lamborghinis and Ferraris in the quarter mile is absolutely amazing.
Eventually, Tesla will have the performance of the Lucid Sapphire.
Bugatti KILLER for under $150,000 is ridiculous.
This was overall a great conversation. No matter your view. Herman wasn’t advocating for the Daytona. He was just pointing out some good things. He agrees about the soul of the car
Now that Carlos Tavares has been fired, it’s easy to blame him for all of CDJR’s problems, but many of these issues predate his leadership. Tavares wasn’t there when Dodge abandoned affordable models like the Dart and 200, or when the Grand Caravan’s design grew stale and the Dodge Journey was canceled without a replacement for affordable SUVs.
The company also faces long-standing quality issues, including EcoDiesel engine failures and underwhelming fuel efficiency. Even the Hemi V8 showed its age with problems like the “Hemi tick.” Meanwhile, dealerships alienated customers with excessive markups.
On top of that, CDJR’s lack of investment in EVs has cost them globally, particularly in China, where they’ve seen significant profit losses. Without early investment, they now face steep challenges in scaling EV production to reduce costs and compete with brands like Tesla and BYD.
Tavares’ firing may be a leadership shift, but CDJR’s struggles are deep-rooted. Overcoming these challenges will require major changes to their product strategy and production processes to remain competitive.
This was just absolutely awesome. Rich and OC were spot on!
great video. all great input.
I think it's important to remember that the Tesla Model S Plaid is a TRI MOTOR. Same for the Lucid Sapphire.
@@PassportBrosBusinessClass doesn’t matter look at the pricing that’s what they’re also comparing it too just not performance
Bitcoin to the moonnnn uncle big truck lol
Taycan turbo gt is a dual motor and is faster then a plaid and better then them all around track. If u choose to do 2motors it better be alot better at handling. Dodge didn't even do that.
@@G82Wattsno it isn’t
@@PassportBrosBusinessClass it isn't what? Daniel abt, edmunds u drag... also did a 7:07 around nuruburing
Dodge ain't inviting y'all back again 😭😂😂😂😂
💀
Probably won’t exist anyway
🤣🤣
Digging it, you boys are preaching much truth.
Great discussion!
Great conversation you guys. You should think about doing these once a quarter. Cause there are going to be some real changes coming. Esp when the HEMI comes back.
This committee needs B. Mason for technical insight. The man is talented in explaining performance and the market.
I appreciate the kind words!
Thanks so much for making this vid.:)
The only one missing is Racer X.
I like him but he won't bash Dodge like this. He's even said so, its not what his brand is about.
Always good to see the Car Guru (no trademark) comment on an EV with his extensive EV history. Of course the best EV I've seen is that Tesla ICE-T. On the "software" upgrade, that's no difference with the Audi RS e Tron GT.
That EV car sucks. It was an embarrassment.
OC decertation of a muscle car was a highlight. This is a great calab. Rich Ive not known had so much character.
This would have been a very nice thing to do I've always wanted to review cars for companies and give them the real man's review of it. But one problem is one person on this panel actually may be sponsored by Dodge we love this man so he's not really being that harsh as he could be. I love riches review and the other Fellas on here one person on here might be being a little biased
Cool video guys
I really appreciate everyone taking the time to put this together, and your candid, honest feedback. To be honest, this wasn't as bad as I was expecting it to be.
I said this on the owner's forum, and I'll repeat it for those that don't agree with this crew or their opinions: "We have to be careful not to completely dismiss everything these guys say, and risk missing some of the valid points they make. It I were Dodge, as hard as pill it would be to swallow, I'd be taking notes and preparing updates that would address those concerns and shut them down."
I work in the tech space, and one of the most important methods of product improvement isn't internal or partner testing; it's the real world feedback from customers (especially the unhappy ones). They are literally telling you, "If only it did THIS, or didn't do THAT." They are giving you the recipe for success, because they care about the brand and they want products that excite and interest them.
Butter said it best at the kick-off of the call, "I just hope that we go back to being fun." You'd think that would be a pretty simply wish to grant.
Cheers Everyone! Appreciate the video.
Leave it to the guys who didn't drive the car have the most opinions on the car, I trust demonology opinion on the car since he actually races and has EVs and knows what to expect , and if he is impressed on what it can do and not do but is willing to give it a chance that maybe future updates can fix alot of those issues.
😂😂😂😂
I run my Tesla and my i4 bmw as well as the scat pack and STS V. Sorry I don’t think you’re going to find many sticking up for that bum EV charger. Period
Could of beat u but my exhaust drained my battery 😆😅🤣😂
It's funny how life repaeats itself. Life before the internt. In 69, the Chager Daytona was so hated that they sat on lots for years, causing some dealers to convert them to regular chargers. Decades passed before they were considered cool. I believe this Charger Daytona may be the same..
What is with TK's accent? I don't recall hearing that on his channel.
People gotta stop shyting on the car before it even hits the streets. They gotta give it a chance first.
The Hyundai Ionic 5 N’s fake engine sound is actually really good. You can choose different sounds too.
The Ionic series is the only EV I would personally consider.
I agree it’s a good looking car, just needs a v8 !
How many of you guys will be restoring a battery powered car in 30 years!!!??
Hell no!!!! Case closed!
Love the video family i feel like that car going to grow on use like all the rest of them do and turn out to be something cool
OC Motivator, I object to your characterization of the Neon as a POS. LOL. The first gen Neon was actually developed as a driver's car. What held it back was the 3-speed automatic and the roll-up rear windows. The 5-speed manual variants (especially the R/T) were brilliant. That being said, your idea of bringing back the Neon bodies is a great idea. They are relatively lightweight. Even the 2nd gen (SRT-4) is 2900 lbs.
“Uncomfortably thick black women” 🤣🤣🤣 I knew it was something I liked about TK!! LMAO
Timestamp? 😅
Good video here. TK Santa down there had some cringey racial comments a couple times.
I will say though that Dodge needs to do 2 things pre-launch:
1) Offer a DAY 1 upgrade to both RT/Scat. SCAT needs to be right under 700HP and the RT needs mid 5’s.
2) Offer 1 year free charging and or follow ford with the home charger ev charger installs.
Next Gen, go HYBRID! Scrap full ev r&d for now and come back in couple years while the charging network is built out across the country
Yeah I’m racist, with a black wife and 3 black daughters 😂😂😂😂😂😂 clearly don’t know me with this comment.
But I’ll be your huckleberry
Gotta love the comments when people do zero research and assume…. Here’s your sign 😂😂😂😂
The furious five.
A muscle car is loud v8 crazy horse power that u can keep upgrading
49:47 The 1969 Dodge Charger is in the history books as one of the great automotive designs. With that as a backdrop, I think the designers did the best they could with what they had. It appears as a modern interpretation of a 1969 Dodge Charger, given US bumper and light regulation. If it had the 3.6L Pentastar and a 5.7L Hemi for $40,000 they couldn't make enough of them. They would have limit production ordering. To do an EV muscle car it should be 75% of the size it is, HAS to use Tesla's network, and partner with Harmon Kardon to build the sophisticated "Fratzonic" exhaust system ever conceived, that is easily customizable and could be loud and obnoxious enough to warrant a noise ordinance citation in any county in America.
My first car Was also a 70 Charger
Wow they doing a podcast
People overlook that Dodge/FIAT hasn't had a decent economy car in 20yrs. Its the reason ford and gm are able to still make v8s is because of the malibus and fusions they sell regardless of what we think about them.
Definition of a Muscle Car is as Follows: Requirements
1. Needs to be a Rear Wheel Drive only.
2. Needs to have V8 variant.
3. Needs to 2 + 2 seating
4. Needs to be 2 Doors
Mustang was knocked out of Hierarchy in Muscle Car World. With the Muscle Car.
The Dodge Charger was knocked out with the 4 doors... it doesn't matter if it has 500 hp, or 1,000 + hp.
The New EV Charger Look on the Daytona with the 6 Cylinder or EV's. Is not a Muscle Car. It isn't the Automotive Heritage of the Muscle Car. The only existing Muscle Car standing are the Challengers, if Pontiac Firebird or GTO still existed they would still be Muscle Cars.
Now all pony cars are Sports Cars competing with European GT...
One (1) EV are more Toxic than all V8's ever made combined.
The Petrol ⛽️ Vehicle's Engines are easily reforged, to make new Engines, or other stuff building frames, tools, machines.
Lithium-Ion Battery Packs 🔋 are made of multiple elements, and the Minerals are Granulated Materials. The Lithium-Ion Batteries 🔋 Packs are Granulated so fine that it was spread to water sources. To Creeks, Rivers, and Lakes. Killing fish 🐟, and Polluting Well and Faucet Tap Water.
How my V8 lasts 30+ year's. I have Mustang V8 with 113,000 miles no leaks.
EV's clean air when they work, and not burn. Toxic to the Environment when they burn, or sit in UNPAVED JUNKYARDS. They drip Corrosive Acidic Brownish, Orange, Gel or Glaze. Which eventually penetrates into the Ground Water 💧 sources. This link shows proof
th-cam.com/video/2Bas81OsV9Y/w-d-xo.htmlsi=4G9bhHlH0mF1J-_A
It's a Great looking car in search of an identity. If and when a V8 is installed in the Daytona is the real question inquiry minds want to know.
I wished most all the 1980s - 2000 FWD car & van would have had an electric motor RWD hybrid. What about that 2 mode hybrid Chevrolet & Chrysler used. Sure it was just a 4sp. But with electric motor in place of a torque converter, maybe lower gears are not necessary. It had a switch to be EV only. Once and awhile, I still see one. Saturn Vue hybrid was the only 2 mode hybrid FWD. As for the argument of 8sp trans vs 10. I think 5sp is good enough. If 70mph is under 2800 RPM. I'm happy. I'd love to get a 4sp automatic for my B or RB engine.
I can understand (as much as i hate the idea) making the CHARGER electric. It makes sense in a tongue-in-cheek way. But they should have never got rid of the Challenger. That was the actual muscle car
Notice how they fail to define what makes a Muscle Car. Sounds like a lot of crying to me.
While you cry in the comments. 😂🤦♂️
@ You are the last person to be talking with all that clickbait you post dry lying on dodge. Like I said yall be crying like fans boys. This is the future. Nobody imagines the far future with ice engines lol. At some point the definition would have to change. And let’s not forget to mention that the crap you guys drive is already a big hunk of electrical crap. Today’s cars can barely be called muscle when compared to yesterday’s…
Electric is the way. N these companies make moves decades ahead. How about you except that you are a dinosaur and no longer dodges core customers. They aren’t making cars for you. They’re making them for us lol. Demonology was the only one not being a girl about it.
Saying , "My wife would like this car" is not a proper endorsement for a muscle car. This car offends no one except those who don't care about offending.
If butter shows that red key one more time 😂
The world has been changing since the wheel. Either embrace or be an angry old man in skipped over. OC is always mad,unhappy, not laughter, Mr curmudgeon. Mine he lives in OC.
The best car TH-camrs in the same room !!!! Dope
Love it
I'm done with this ev, it's crate time.
Herman.... That car is not fast...... I can't wait to see the quarter mile times..... Also, it is WAY overpriced, and you can't modify the car at all other than some boring cosmetic crap. Regardless it's fat, heavy and not enough power to compensate for it. AND making the EV louder won't make it better! It just makes it funnier and goofier at a louder frequency. It's corny
It ran mid 11s at ~120 consistently at the event while spinning the front tires every pass. A good set of tires, full charge, and a cooler day and you should get low 11s no problem. Keep in mind that is the mid level car which starts at $70k.
🔥🔥🔥🔥
Hellcat engine weighs over
1,000 lbs with the supercharger. The new Charger online 6 twin turbos engine weighs 430 lbs WHATTTT!! That car is going to be phenomenal. Modded turbos, downpipes, exhaust , tuned . Dodge knows that car is the one. Watch the markup!!
at the end of the day the biggest problem with why it won't sell big is the economy and it cost too much for what you get simple
Only way those $75-80k Dodge EVs will sell is if they beat a plaid. Be cheaper and faster than the competition and there will be backorders. Otherwise the mass population won't buy them. They need to be in everyone's hand at $35-40k. Average transaction is $44k for a new car today.
Towards the end of this video is what hemi muscle says all the time fun & affordable
If people are criticizing the new Dodge Daytona EV as “not being a real muscle car,” it’s worth pointing out that the FWD Dodge Daytona of the ’80s and ’90s wasn’t exactly traditional muscle car material either. That car traded rear-wheel drive and V8s for a smaller, turbocharged four-cylinder engine and a front-wheel-drive platform. Yet, despite the departure from muscle car norms, it found its place as a sporty, performance-focused car for its time.
The new Daytona EV is similar in that it’s redefining what a muscle car can be for a new era. Sure, it doesn’t have a roaring V8 or rear-wheel drive, but neither did the FWD Daytona-and it still carved out a fanbase. Muscle cars have always been about delivering performance and pushing boundaries, and while the EV version is a radical departure, so was the shift to FWD in the ’80s. Maybe it’s not what we’re used to, but dismissing it outright ignores Dodge’s history of evolving its products to meet the demands of the moment.
I can see a lawsuit over the TRX coming back.
Over priced compared to it's competitors; Under performs compared to it's competitors; Software & touch screen have issues & is slow; Fit & finish are sub par; Flawed design elements. This vehicle is the epitome of a vehicle that no one at Dodge wanted to make & from the design, to the manufacturing to the sales/dealerships it shows. I'm basing these comments off of everything I have read & seen from people that have driven these cars. Even the petrol version is not looking like it will be better than the ancient, outgoing chassis/vehicles. Car is heavier & bigger than the outgoing model which is the opposite of what everyone was hoping for back in 2017/18 (when we were teased with rumors that Dodge would take the Alfa Guilia chassis & make a smaller, lighter 700+hp AWD version of the Challenger). Carlos absolutely RUINED this brand, then got ran out of town AFTER the damage was done. Such a shame. Unless they make stage kits for the Hurricane that can put out Hellcat (or better) numbers AND have the Hurricane hold up as well as the HC motors, long term, then this whole generation of Chargers is a complete & utter failure. Such a shame...
A muscle car is just a personal luxury car without the luxury, hence the cheap price and wide availability. Because of the cheap price of muscle cars, they could be had by ANYONE and anyone, could race a rich guy in a pricey fast car and win. Cheap, fast, fun.
I honestly think people have forgotten where "muscle cars" came from. They were originally small to mid-size "economy" cars (yes, cars that came with inline and slant 6 engines) that were altered from their original intent to have more performance (power, handling and "braking" [as much as 4-wheel drums could give]) and typically had altered aesthetics to set them apart from the more mundane versions. That's IT! THAT is a "muscle car". There is NO "requirement" for it to be V8 or RWD.
Having said that, due to the faults of this new car that Stelantis has thrust upon the world I can't in good conscience call it a "muscle car". I defended that thing all the way up until here recently and the faults found by the reviewers (some in this chat) squashed my support. I like the body style, but that's really it. The execution of everything else is utter garbage. I don't blame the engineers...they worked with what they had, but unfortunately that wasn't a lot and it shows. This is what happens when marketing and management design a car....you get this trash.
I shouldn’t have to press a button to show a lane patrolling Karen that I’m pissed for slowing me down in the passing lane. Maybe good for sneaking up on a cheating wife but not for dumb-dumbs in traffic who think their mirrors should be pointed at themselves.
I would definitely get a Tesla model 3 performance over the charger scat pack EV. I would get the Tesla model 3 Rear Wheel drive over the RT. I’m kind of digging the new model 3 looks since it’s been refreshed. It kind of reminds me of a Toyota GR86, in the front at least.
The model 3 performance is too small for me.
For me, if it's 13 second or less 1/4 mile. It's a muscle car. 11 second 1/4 mile is a race car. 383 4bbl was just 330-350hp. Electric motor gives instant power response. As for 2025 2dr charger, interior reminds me of 1966-67 Charger. 4dr to me should be another body.
I'm sure the 2025 charger is a nice parking lot rallye racer. Might be too wide. I wonder how it would do at Portland race track. Or other road racing track.