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Hmm, funny how you said (churches would struggle without women) as I have come to the same conclusion a few years ago, I have always said that ( men make the "culture/society" but women preserve them), although I do also say ( men don't know how to blend the modern and traditional, but women can blend them easily without trying), if there is a way to blend contradictory ideas (secularism and religious sexism), women do it everyday, men would be saying it's impossible
Can I ask you what made you feel the need to make a video on this topic? Some significant event that was going on during that time, personal relationships, inspiration from another TH-camr's video? What was it?
I think it's, among many things, a result of a sunken cost fallacy. While men do suffer the effects of purity culture and religious guilt, women are subjected to more severe trauma and limitations. Many christian women see their unhappy marriages, wasted youths, and truncated careers as "spiritual investments". So they find the thought of having sacrificed so much for nothing -unbearable-.
This sentiment does seem true to me regarding women with children who seem to have a problem with women who choose not to have children. It’s as if the decision others make not to breed diminishes something in their own decisions.
@@religiologEngI had a thought in support of the original comment. I spent years studying in yeshiva specifically because I felt the need to understand my "true" religion. It was such a huge loss to conclude it wasn't true. If I had not been dedicated to logic and evidence, I doubt I would have overcome my biases. In other words, maybe clergy have huge sunk costs, but they are also in the very business of finding truth in their religion. Women - often excluded from religious leadership - might be less exposed to the sort of religious analysis which leads to overcoming the psychological defenses against loss.
I'm a white male. But I am disabled, autistic, have no family support, and have always struggled financially. I do not possess high social or.economic status. So why am I an atheist? I think autistic people, due social deficits and isolation, are more likely to be less religious because we don't participate in social structures.
great question. Thank you so much for sharing this. I'll check if there are any studies in that regard, but your hypothesis sounds legit. Here I found some studies but haven't read them yet - escholarship.org/content/qt6zh3j3pr/qt6zh3j3pr.pdf; brill.com/view/journals/arp/40/1/article-p1_1.xml; www.mdpi.com/2227-9067/10/8/1417
I don't think it has to do with social deficits and isolation and much more with the way autistic people process information, there is more rigid analytical thinking.
I have met a large number of atheist and agnostic women. I am one myself. I believe part of it may be an identification issue. Atheism can sometimes be seen as “harsh” and many people see themselves as “neutral”. I would argue that the number is skewed when polls are taken for % atheists men and women. Of course, I’m not saying it’s equal, but we exist!
Atheism vs agnosticism, atheism vs pantheism ("mystical atheism"?), hard atheism vs soft atheism... Anyway, as I said in a separate comment, in my country, where disbelief rose like a tsunami after the death of Christo-fascist dictator Franco, women are definitely as likely to be atheist (or similar: agnostic, etc.) as men. Most people are nonbelievers anyhow (same in France and Catalonia and growingly across all Western Europe).
Very true about the "harsh" part. Atheism should just be a lack of a belief in a god, but some seem to use it as hatred of the concept of a god too. That's why I think some people prefer the term "Agnostic" by itself even though it's supposed to be used alongside "atheist, theist, deist" etc. to more accurately describe the belief system.
“The fanatical atheists are like slaves who are still feeling the weight of their chains which they have thrown off after hard struggle. They are creatures who - in their grudge against traditional religion as the ‘opium of the masses’ - cannot hear the music of the spheres.” -Albert Einstein.
I am a woman. My mother and I are atheists. So are most of my (girl) friends. However, I think that a lot of women are living a life of oppression and that believing in a better afterlife will help make the nasty present bearable.
So I'm a woman and I would probably describe myself as "Heisenburg's belief system" or basically agnostic, if I'm simplifying. My mom was atheist because she was raised Calvinist in the 70s. In the midst of race riots it's hard to sit in church and hear that God loves "all" the little children when all the ones you see are white. She became atheist somewhere between 8 and 11 yo and never told her mom bc it would just make her worry for no good reason. She still finds prophecy and comparative religion an interesting topic, and found the Baha'i Faith because of various religious prophecies that seemed to fit. My dad was a very lapsed Catholic and converted after just reading the Baha'i books around the house. I have no serious qualms with the Faith, and don't regret being raised with religion at all, but I simply find it doesn't suit my life. Both of us kiddos (now grown) have decided to kinda go our own way and our parents are supportive and suitably inquisitive and informative.
@@maclectic 1) I live in Europe and AC is not the norm. We do not need it, and it is terrible for the environment, so no reason to get it. 2) Things have moved very quickly, and there are vast swathes of the world where being a woman=being oppressed until quite recently (living memory, so mentalities are still limping behind) and other big swathes where women's life still is.
@@Justin.Martyrtry turning on Closed captions. They seem 100% accurate to what he is saying. And no worries, unfamiliar accents are hard for everyone! Maybe listening to this channel will give you a new skill better understanding Ukrainian English accents.
Also recall having to hide my atheism during my teenage years in order to not offend my working class mother, and other member of the small town I grew up in back in the 1980’s when everyone attended their local church.
I remember when I was a kid in the late 70's my mom was buying a car. She was an RN, single mom, owned a house, etc. the sales manager asked if her husband knew she was buying a car. My dad called and he told them she was her own woman and she can do whatever she wants.
My mother would have walked away, bought another brand and gone back to the first place and told them they were losers whose attitude had cost them the sale.
I'm a working class, small town, women with little formal education, but I've been an avid reader all my life. I'm handicapped by trauma, PTSD. I'm also about 60 years old and live in the USA. I've been completely atheist since the noughties, and left my childhood religion in my teens. More men are apt to announce their atheism, while women just leave religion and the idea of god behind. Are you sure you are counting correctly? because it seems women have more reason to leave these thoughts behind.
Excellent points...and you are proving what I always say: you do not have to study to stimulate your brain. Learning comes in many guises. Anyway, when I went to the US, I said I was atheist. I was 18. The lovely people I was with were shocked (especially as I am culturally Jewish). They asked a few questions, and decided that I was agnostic. I thought about it when I went to bed that night, and decided to gp along with this. Not because it was true, but because age 18, in a foreign country, surrounded by Jews who, unlike my family, did believe, it was just more diplomatic. I think Auschwitz etc, and how my grand dad was treated when the Russians "liberated" his camp killed the idea of god for us. Once I was back in Europe, I was free to be honest, and I have never pretended again, but it gave me some insights into social pressure.
I agree. We leave our respective faiths within any fanfare. When I was 12, all I said to a few close friends was that I 'd given up Catholicism for Lent.
I think this question comes up in regard to a lot of statistics involving the differences between men and women - whether it's just the nature of our culture making women more likely to stay under the radar on certain matters. Kind of by definition it's hard to tell if-or-how-much it's the case, but it's always worth keeping the possibility in mind.
@@Dabordi Well, when I was younger I kept my ideas etc. to myself and am much more outspoken now that I am older. Society seems to favor the "quiet" women and also reward the outspoken men. Has a study been done on women only? That would be interesting IMO.
As an atheist woman, I just realize there’s no religion on the planet that treat women equally and fairly and it seems like all religious oppress women
@@toniq30 the pagan religions tend to be more equal, but not all of them. new age tends to be more equal, but one needs be careful to vet them before joining. toxic patriarchy is everywhere.
@@toniq30 If you're interested in a more feminist-leaning version of Christianity, look up Gnoticism or the Gospel of Mary. In Gnosticism, Mary Magdeline is viewed as one of Jesus's only true disciples compared to apostles like Paul and John who did their own thing. Also, the story of Adam and Eve gets flipped in Gnosticism, as eating from the Tree of Knowledge was actually a GOOD thing for the spiritual enlightenment of humanity, and Eve was unfairly punished for her curiosity by the spiteful and evil demiurge Yaldabeoth/"Jehovah". In Gnosticism, Jesus literally came to rescue humanity from the damage Yaldabeoth wreaked on humanity. That includes tearing down worldly systems like misogyny, greed, and other such earthly attachments in pursuit of spiritual awakening and ascension. Personally, there's a bit of weird mythological hooey involved with that religion, but it's philosophically similar to Hermeticism and Buddhism. I'd say Gnosticism is the version of Christianity most aligned with Jesus's teachings.
I believe a lot of women who leave organized religion typically end up following some other spiritual practice, like Wicca or paganism. It's very common on the female-dominated part of TH-cam.
religious belief and belief in astrology or tarot cards or the like gives women a sense of power they don't feel in a patriarchal world. even a sense of power is better than feeling powerless.
@@idk-ill-figure-smn-outmostly because it's the opposite of the patriarchal religion they been part of before, most women who go into wicca or paganism tend to focus their belief into empowering and empowered woman, like Hecate, Demeter, the divine feminine, I don't think it's just belief playing a part, it's also community, I don't believe in anything and I still go visit rituals from non abrahamic religions, specially the African diasporic ones that exist in my country, because they are much more inclusive people.
New Atheisim in the form of the 'skeptic' community deciding to declare war on Feminism back in the day certainly didn't help. I've been an atheist my entire life but those online spaces are only relatively recently becoming welcoming spaces for women and LGTB+ people. Many thanks to channels like ConcernedApe and Genetically Modified Skeptic for being way more welcoming and actually rational about social issues (as in, recognising that they actually exist instead of dismissing them).
That is one of the important factors about Atheism. is that it's not a religion with the requirements of a religion. and anyone is welcome to join the Atheist community. and there's no obligation to stay an Atheist. although the Atheist community would hate to see someone leave. they wouldn't force anyone to stay or ostrosize a person for leaving. it's on of the most appealing concepts of Atheism.
Weird considering that one of Christopher Hitchens' most popular debates had him defending homosexuality alongside Stephen Fry, even more weird knowing he himself was most likely bisexual, he did write that bonkers "Why Women Aren't Funny" article though so...
I'm an African American woman. As a child, I was a devout conservative Christian. In my late teens / early 20s, I went through a period of rebellion against the church. Blaming this for my poor start in adulthood, I returned, but continued to struggle in the job market. Then I inadvertently joined a cult, putting my life in danger. I escaped those circumstances and moved to a city I fell in love with, and joined a wonderful church where the pastor saved my life twice. But my economic struggles continued, to the point where I had to be rescued by my brother, leaving that church and city behind. The ultimate insult was being forced to sit helpless while his daughter dropped out of high school to join a cult. I am now a Buddhist / atheist. I have no respect for an all-powerful ever-present deity that lacks the wisdom of a developmentally disabled adult. I believe women' are more religious because of learned helplessness. The same goes for African Americans, and other disenfranchised groups. The more control you gain over your life, the less you need to rely on magical incantations and amulets.
African American women are not disenfranchised because of religion but because of LACK of religion. African American women are less likely to live in a stable long term marriage, they are more likely to become single mothers and their children being raised in fatherless homes. Which brings more poverty, crime, lack of education and opportunities. Don't confuse the cause for the consequences. Whilst Christianity is declining in black communities in the US, it is growing significantly in Africa. 👍
@jirislavicek9954 - you have a point. However, the real issue isn't lack of religion; it's the way the religion is practiced. Oftentimes, Christians think they can do whatever mess they want, and escape the consequences by asking God's forgiveness. If you criticize their behavior, they call you judgmental. Very few actually read the Bible, and I've met many who can't even recite the Ten Commandments. There's also a tendency to make excuses for irresponsible, even criminal, behavior, and to revel in martyrdom and self-righteousness. That explains the state of the African American community today. Buddhism, on the other hand, is based on the Laws of Cause and Effect, so it has zero tolerance for such foolishness. Many Asians are Buddhist; take a good look at their communities.
@@hiz24airness They are not denied any rights or opportunities or powers. They usually choose not to have them or not to fight for them. It's not really about religiosity, but about following Christian morality. If you fall for liberal propaganda, you you are very unlikely to succeed in life. That applies to white women and men as well.
I liked this video. The emphasis on social position and on social security, makes me thing it is important as an atheist not to demonize those who follow a religion as this could easily lead to discrimination against more vulnerable people with essential good hearts.
Often they where sheltered from harm, not oppressed, I know it can often seems like that or a limitation on them, untill you dig a bit deeper, if they really was seen as that, all the Men on Titanic would have survived and all the women would have played music as they was going down etc and we would force the women to go to war and make them get up at 4am to collect garbages and make them do concrete work, people often take the time we live in and use it to look at the past and some are just looking blindly with a bias for anything to support the idea that one gender was more oppressed at some point in time, we are oppressed differently, we can never reach a fair world, to the degree it is possible, if we start at a point where we belive that the two genders are the same and should be treated so, only by force, like in the past, etc the majority in the USSR was equaly poor or dead.
@@Uriel-Septim.you got it. Women can be seen as oppressed only if we see the world in the "Western", capitalistic way where money and work is all that matters. But if you change the perspective, I wouldn't call a citizen "second class" if it's sheltered from risky activities because of its biological importance in keeping a population alive.
It wasn’t about women’s existence as much as men’s shattered egos..men measured value based on their own standards to make the mere existence of a masculine being an advantage…there’s no creature women or not that was seen by men as higher in class than they are….feminism’s biggest achievement was revealing the equation isn’t logical at all even if you did twice his work with twice the quality… He will still measure your value less no explanations provided….simply very simply cause it’s easier for his brain..and he’s ego…
Religious groups are social /power groups. Females sometimes attend 2-3 churches in rural communities . This is a communication network and another social support system. Another reason that helps women live longer on average.
I am an atheist woman...there are so many culturally Christian which is most people not really thinking about their beliefs. Women typically do more charity work, rescue work, etc. it makes sense most women would not identify as atheist.
I am a woman and though I was raised Christian i now considered myself an atheist. Its true that most of my peers are spiritual wether through organization trad religion or new age religion. I find that im often alone in my lack of belief in anything supernatural.
@@Justin.Martyr You poor martyr, have you spent your own life listening to one sort of accent only? If this is the case, then stick at it: understanding accents come easy if you exercise it, and it can be a very useful skill. Alternatively, click on the caption button, right side of the screen, 3rd from right.
Here's a question: did women face more severe social consequences for religious dissent, or are women in general more afraid of social consequences? Since these would go hand in hand and reinforce each other, untangling this would not be easy. Do any of the studies you quote address this? I'm asking because I come from an atheist family, we were living in a Catholic social environment when I was younger, but my sister and I (male) reacted very differently to the pressure coming off our social environment. We were a well-educated family with very little economic pressure at the time, both of our parents had an academic education and were working in according jobs, and still, I basically did not care about the (rather mild, compared to what US atheists often face) adversity while my sister was almost traumatized by it.
Women have a lot more trauma to go through in general, and society has taught us to be afraid of being any more of a "less than" than we are. I suppose it's kind of a chicken-egg, downward spiral scenario, really.
I would say yes, AND. In many religions women are punished more harshly for similar crimes, and often if they make accusation it goes unheard, but a mans accusation against them is automatically written in stone. However, its much more that s womans existance in religion is harsher overall, and it beats them down. Ive had male friends who leave religion and list all the horrible things said and done to them, yet when i tell my story, they sit in slack jawed horror and revulsion. At my church, the boys were told to follow the ten commandments. The girls were told the same AND to follow their husbands. The boys were told not to sleep around. The girls were told that THINKING about $3x was a sin, if you so much as had urges you were deviant, and if you EVER did it outside marriage not only was God unable to fulfil his full purpose in your life, you were forever unworthy of love and companionship, and any man who took you was doing you a massive favor you were not worthy of. See the difference? Boys were taught to explore their dreams, get a good job to support a family. Lots of options there. Girls were told they only needed to worry about which option of husband to pick. If you pick wrong and he cheats, hits, is poor or distant, ALL of that is your fault for picking poorly. I. Could. Go. On. Think of muslims. Men have a long list of restrictive rules, sure. That list is longer for the women. Less speaking, less right, more coverings, less mobility, AND a dozen kids on top of it. I know reginal chinese religions had a few tipping scales, but throughout history, their religions and laws punished women more harshly for crimes like cheating for longer stretches of time. Its a common theme everywhere you look. Same rules, unequal outcome, choices taken from women. And since you are stuck at home with the babies, YOU ARE STUCK. No job. No experience. No skills. No private time. And once husband comes home, you take care of him fully too. And both sets of parents. Even upper class wonen had to travel to take care of even obscure sick relatives. When is there TIME to think? On top of indoctrination and shame, you are left without the skills and means to help yourself AND as many dependants as your body could survive making. Notice educated women have little to no children as well.
I would say yes, AND. In many religions women are punished more harshly for similar crimes, and often if they make accusation it goes unheard, but a mans accusation against them is automatically written in stone. However, its much more that s womans existance in religion is harsher overall, and it beats them down. Ive had male friends who leave religion and list all the horrible things said and done to them, yet when i tell my story, they sit in slack jawed horror and revulsion. At my church, the boys were told to follow the ten commandments. The girls were told the same AND to follow their husbands. The boys were told not to sleep around. The girls were told that THINKING about $3x was a sin, if you so much as had urges you were deviant, and if you EVER did it outside marriage not only was God unable to fulfil his full purpose in your life, you were forever unworthy of love and companionship, and any man who took you was doing you a massive favor you were not worthy of. See the difference? Boys were taught to explore their dreams, get a good job to support a family. Lots of options there. Girls were told they only needed to worry about which option of husband to pick. If you pick wrong and he cheats, hits, is poor or distant, ALL of that is your fault for picking poorly. I. Could. Go. On. Think of muslims. Men have a long list of restrictive rules, sure. That list is longer for the women. Less speaking, less right, more coverings, less mobility, AND a dozen kids on top of it. I know reginal chinese religions had a few tipping scales, but throughout history, their religions and laws punished women more harshly for crimes like cheating for longer stretches of time. Its a common theme everywhere you look. Same rules, unequal outcome, choices taken from women. And since you are stuck at home with the babies, YOU ARE STUCK. No job. No experience. No skills. No private time. And once husband comes home, you take care of him fully too. And both sets of parents. Even upper class wonen had to travel to take care of even obscure sick relatives. When is there TIME to think? On top of indoctrination and shame, you are left without the skills and means to help yourself AND as many dependants as your body could survive making. Notice educated women have little to no children as well.
Bank account story from my great-granny Maximina Madariaga: she went to open a bank account (early 20th century, not sure the year, maybe the 30s) and she was turned back and asked to bring someone to sign for her. The next week she returned and declared that she would sign for herself... and (somehow) she got her bank account. That's at least what my historian sister has recolected.
@@letsomethingshine - We had peculiar laws (Basque charters) but unsure how they may have applied. The question is that she was stubborn and got what she wanted.
I’m an atheist woman who became atheist again after years in woo or pagan beliefs after years of Christian belief that started at age 15. I wonder about estrogen and belief, because I started believing around the time I would be getting the hormone rush and stopped around menopause. This didn’t occur to me until just now lol.
@@you_jay well I was vocally atheist from the time I read my dad’s comparative religion textbook in 2nd grade until 15 (when I got double whammied by the love bombing and coerced spiritual experience). It’s an interesting question.
@@riseofdarkleela It seems like your dad really contributed to the way you see the world around. I wonder the name of that text book based on comparative religion.
Until they're not young anymore. I witnessed previous atheists becoming religious with age. Sadly, but understandable. Loss, despair and fear of inevitable are backed up with religion. It's natural
No all this proves is that humanity is imperfect. Big surprise. But i dont think you can come along and deny what all of human history clearly points to. Every culture has some type of religion and some type of god they believe in. That in and of itself points to an inner need because why would humans so constantly seek something that they did not need? If we didnt need food we would never seek food. So why do we seek God through religion? Reducing everything to a social construct and denying whats clearly basic human nature is a product of a Godless and arrogant modern world with no sense of hope or direction. There has never been an atheist society, at least not one thats lasted for very long and thats because atheism is unnatural and leads to despair. A society with no hope is suicidal. And you can see that clear as day today with suicide rates going higher every year
the belivers know it doesn't work. because if they really beleived, they'd be hanging around hospital wards trying to cure people. it's a con, and they know it
@@elenamariatudela56are you muslim? What you are referring as an example of taking care of your life before puting your trust in god is from an islamic hadith.
How about praying when your friends are in a war zone? If my friends don't want my prayers then too bad for them. My prayers are for me. They know I'm praying for them. They are not so cruel as to take away my source of comfort from their situations. Ukraine 2022
I find this fascinating as someone whom came from a poorer immigrant family whose parents were religious, and yet became an atheist by the age of fifteen.
My mother is turkish my father is german. I was raised both, muslim and christianity. and i decided with 10 that there is no good and i have to help myself.
I think that women and men are equally likely to be atheistic/agnostic in my country (Basque Country) and that applies also to its entourage such as France, Catalonia, etc., which are the most atheist areas of Europe. Global statistics may be biased because there's a lot of people still emerging from the Dark Ages (rural "medievalist" background, which is also patriarchal almost invariably).
@@religiologEng - It's probably also different in Iran, where rumor is that atheism is growing massive among the younger generations. There's nothing like religious tyranny to make everyone atheist... What do you know of atheism figures in "Muslim" Albania? They had a cultural revolution, much like China's which left a deep mark, you know. The question is which is your part of the world and what do the thumbnail's statistics say. You seem to be talking about the whole world but were sloppy about sources and data.
@@annepoitrineau5650 - I understand things have been changing a lot since I did exactly that (as exchange student) in 1985-86... to the astonishment of some and the cheers of many. Things are improving fast even in the Americas.
@@LuisAldamiz Yes...I was an excchange student in 1973/1974... remarkable that it seems you had the same experience in 85/86 (AFS?? exchange?). I hope things are changing indeed!!
As an atheist woman... No there aren't few of us. A great majority of women are atheists in Spain, where I'm from. Same in Scotland where I'm currently living. It's just the US that is so overwhelmingly religious (if we're talking the western world) 😂
It's actually not true for the US either, if you look at the statistics, is pretty equal among genders and places like Latam are much more religious, the most common correlation we see with atheism is income.
I do expect a certain contingent of women in the US T say they're religious rather than be the center of a scandal. Southern Baptist women might ask a coworker which church they go to, and if it's the one across the street, they go all "steel magnolia." Or say to your face you'll burn in hell. Because it's my specific pastor or hell, apparently... *facepalm*
Atheist woman from the United States here. While I do concede your point, the US is not the only overwhelmingly religious country on the planet. Look in to the rates and practices of Islam in modern day Islamic Theocracies and what's going on in Africa.
Growing up in France, I came from a non-religious family. We weren’t even familiar with the concept of atheism. My French mother also came from a non-religious background, going back several generations, I believe. It wasn’t until much later that I learned my Dutch father was religious-Lutheran, according to my mother, who mentioned it once! Strangely enough, both my Dutch grandparents were also non-religious. As far as I can remember, the environment in France where I grew up was largely secular. When we moved to the Netherlands in 1970, I was surprised to find that most people there were either Catholic or Protestant. However, nowadays, most of the people I know who were once religious no longer are. What I find interesting is that many people who grew up with religious beliefs, even if they no longer practice, still hold onto certain superstitions. Having been raised without any form of mysticism, my mind remains free of such influences.
My guess is 90%++ of all french have a long 200++ yr history of atheism, nihilism, paganisms, etc, REligion does not go well w the french, THey ae hard core super NON RELIGIOUS. which explains why CG Jung's idea are non existent in france. 90%++ of french have not even heard the name CG Jung = pathetic,,, you see CG did not speak to hard core atheists.. Only those seeking. Poor france, doomed with her atheisms.
I ended up joining the community of Apostate Aladdin 2ish months ago, who I actually found out about because he commented on one of your previous videos, and found it fascinating that his private server (almost all ex-muslim atheists) had a lot of women, possibly even more than half. I directly asked him about this and he takes pride in it and says it reflects in his general viewership as well, having significantly more (although still a minority) general female viewership than his peers. He's also about as un-angry as atheists get and I've loved his content precisely because he's fantastic at helping me as a lifelong non-religious person understand how it feels, both good and bad. There's a lot of reasons I could discuss for why so many women are there - and I've asked a number of the women themselves what their opinion is on it - but I found it quite interesting either way since I think it spoke a lot both to the idiosyncrasies of that specific religion (VERY patriarchal), the fact that all of them could speak English (implying some baseline level of education and affluence), and the approach of the channel itself, that I think has more of a "stereotypical feminine appeal", focusing a lot on people's experiences and morality and less on the standard white Western atheist talking points of "logic dictates X so you should believe it, end of story." Not to say that those people don't have good points, just that I think it is fair to acknowledge that not everybody likes the same stuff, and a combination of being raised to be submissive and a lack of testosterone means they wouldn't be nearly as attracted to the more standoffish modern atheist communities, as you noted well in the video itself. Also, love that you go into this topic and look forward to you exploring it more. I think this is a really under-explored question. Atheism is still a touchy subject, and many minorities are the most religious since they are the poorest, least educated, and most badly in need of community. On the same note, treating women as equals in all social contexts is still a contentious issue getting its edges hammered out. Atheism tends to be a needless complication in any of these causes, but the end result is that even atheists who support women and minorities aren't likely to feel it's a good idea to try to do both of those issues at the same time. Comes back to why I immediately got hooked on Apostate Aladdin so much. As a non-white guy born in the non-West with a lot of female participation, I think he speaks to the massive silent majority whose religion is utterly intertwined with dealing with adversity they were born into... and perpetuating it.
Thank you, Dabor! I think I feel why AA gets many female views. It is not typical for ex-Christian-atheist channels, if I may call it this way. I am sure GMS et al. have much more male views. On my Russian channel its approximately 80% to 20% in favor of male views. On this channel 92% males and only 8% females. But AA appeals to those suppressed under "very patriarchal", as you put it, framework. So, its understandable. Thanks for the comment.
@@Mujisu5102 I can guess what sort of channels YOU watch. He literally just flew home from Oslo where he was invited to speak at a huge ex-Muslim conference a few days ago. Citation Needed. (Also I've literally had private conversations with him on the topic, and with many members of the community he has grown. And I'm Ashkenazi at that. Either you think he's the single stealthiest Hamas supporter ever, making cartoons of Mohammed just to throw us off his trail, or you're watching too much AP or Hassan Radwan (edit: I'm a dummy, meant to type Harris Sultan) with too much gullibility and not enough fact checking.)
@@Christoph399Women having more feeling and empathy is probably why we commit fewer crimes. No, if you listened to the video: women are less educated=they end up basing their opinions on hunches, feelings, and that's what religions capitalise on. As women's education catches up, the number of women who are atheists does too.
Yeah. Because women are more sensitive to social judgement, they prefer to pretend a believer. This is it. The author simply want to blame white males entire video.😅
It's amazing that women are more religious than man. when churches are dominated by men and where women can be no more than nuns. however men can go up though the ranks to be priests. especially in this day and age women strive to much higher places in status. such as in employment, health professionals, and politics, and judges, and many other places of status. yet churches are hesitant to do this.
A study of history suggests religious leadership bodies are the most politically conservative organizations on the planet. These groups always resist societal changes the most, are the last to adapt to said changes, and they typically credit positive structural changes to the influence of their religion.
I'm an older working class woman with an average education. Like 3 of my female friends, I'm an an atheist but it's something we don't really discuss or find important. Living in Britain (3 of us are English, 1 Polish) it's not really an issue, you don't announce you are an atheist, you just get on with your life!
I might discuss it but with people I know. That said, if asked in an interview I don't mind saying the absolute truth. If I lived in a more religious area, I think I would be far less likely to "rock the boat" and more likely to say "I'm with all these other people " just to keep them out of my business. Ah, appeasement... Doesn't it just... Suck.
@@andyf4292 Same in France, Belgium, Germany, Switzerland, Italy, Spain, Scandinavia. Things are more comolicaetd in Russia. Putin's Russia hates atheists.
I live in a country with a strong tradition of people getting along peacefully regardless of their attitude to existence so I have no idea about the gender distribution among Danish atheists, and I couldn't care less.
Interesting! I cared little about it when I was young, studying and working in a (mostly male) scientific community where most people were atheist or at least agnostic. But when it came to dating and finding a partner, that was when I discovered the hard way that atheist women were few and far between in the UK.
@@anotherfreediver3639 I have a vague feeling that in the general population there has for generations been a likeness between Danes and the British nations in our attitudes to life. It would mean, that both genders tend to have an undramatic and undogmatic attitude, but with women leaning more towards spirituality.
All right, I see that I have to explain. The secular women that seem to be missing largely identify as new age, neo-pagan or wiccan. In those communities there's a gender gap in the other direction. Women tend to have suffered from misogynic discrimination and violence from an early age, leave their religion and look elsewhere. Spiritual-but-not-religious communities are generally a place to heal emotionally, and many look forward when they recover. So they look at atheist and secular activist groups. And are met by men talking among themselves about how they are inherently more intelligent, more rational, and how those pesky women keeps wanting to talk about social justice. Instead of just being an elitist group scoffing at religion while ignoring the real harm it does. Men are less likely to suffer harm from patriarchal religion (still happens, definitely), and are more likely to deconvert for academic reasons. Women see the harm first, and is more concrete than the priest's rationalizations for doing said harm.
I'm sure this is your experience, and likely many others. I'm not sure we're all quite so reactionary, though. Like many things, I find it's a spectrum. (then again, I was raised religious but not oppressively and not Christian, that likely makes a huge difference)
Atheist men definitely have their own brand of toxic misogynists among them (obligatory “not all”), but they tend to fall more along the lines of biological essentialist thinking rather than “Eve doomed mankind”.
It definitely has nothing to do with women in religions being denied birth control, education, jobs, and other rights that make it beyond difficult to be a woman and support yourself. Talk to a woman who survived being raised Mormon and you'll know all you need to know about why it is harder for women to leave religion.
@@religiologEng the fact I can't get my tunes tied and I'm not even religious. Mercy Clinics in Missouri denied me my tubal because the people who own the clinics are catholic and think I should pop out as many kids as I can. Fun fact, my body doesnt want more babies either, I've had four miscarriages in the past year and a half and I'm almost 30 with a child. The ONLY reason they don't help me is because of THEIR religion. Freedom of Religion has been overstepping for years with overreaching policies that are borderline Christian. And this is not a Christian nation no matter how much yall pray and hope for it because it never was Christian and it'll never be Christian. Theocracy is beyond inhumane and is basically another form of a dictatorship. As someone who had to deconstruct from this religion themselves, growing up a young girl in church, I seen and heard it all. It was never about love or acceptance, it's all about control. God, then Husband, then wife, then children. The famous umbrella rule of Christianity literally outlines a hierarchy, in which women are not equal to men and children are even less so. Wake up and actually look at what you support, it's disgusting and overall does more harm than good.
Its okay, I'm a woman I don't need right apparently. Deciding if I want to end my baby making days should be my decision alone, but thank to catholics in my state a doctor is unable to give me a tubal despite having health issues and already having a kid. Friendly reminder I'm not religious so idgaf what anyone's "god" thinks, it's my body and as an adult woman in her late 20s I'm not going to just quit having sex so I don't get pregnant. My partner of 5 years would probably hate that just as much as me, but apparently that doesn't matter
@@religiologEng It is much more difficult and risky for a woman to leave a religious community or family than for a man to leave. A woman is more likely than a man to be forced into marriage at a young age. It is then harder to leave because she has children and getting custody and supporting them will be difficult if she was never allowed to work or get an education. It is also risky for women to make it obvious they are leaving, physically stronger male relatives will attempt to restrain her. In many cultures the men don’t even have to use violence. Just the threat of being forced out of the house and the “protection” of the male members of the family is enough is societies where violence against women is prevalent.
Thank you so much for this video - I appreciate that you provided so many interesting resources. I feel very inspired to do more research on this subject ✨ This is a deeply personal topic for me, as the 1st in my family to openly reject religion and given how my religion demonized education particularly for young women such as myself. Without proper education (which I was mostly prevented from having in childhood), I might have remained religious. The thought terrifies me.
I think the issue isn't in that religion contradicts basic freedoms. If one looks at the Scnadinavian model, one can observe that religion in those countries has been adjusted to the current values of the society; for example in Sweden women can not only preach, but take high ranking positions, and homosexuality is accepted as a normal part of life to a point that we can find a lesbian bishop who is married and has an adopted kid (Gerd Eva Cecilia Brunne). I think this demonstrates that religion is what we make of it, and if in some other countries people discriminate others under the guise of church, it's a question of the people in charge of the church in that particular country and the government, who not only do nothing to change that situation, but endorse it.
I'd love an atheist to help me out with a question I have! To start with, I'm agnostic, but I'm agnostic specifically because I can't prove one way or another. Most atheists I've met say that their atheist because you can't prove that there's a God, but we can't prove that there's not. I love science and The idea of having a finite decision when it comes to something we can't prove one way or another doesn't seem scientific to me. This is all in good spirit, I'm just trying to understand different points of view. Thank you guys!
thanks for your questions. Many people use 'atheist' label for various reasons and various meanings. But the most common, i know of is that atheism is simply a lack of faith in a deity.
I've seen the defenitions people use for themselves vary a lot. I see atheism as "belief there is no god" and agnosticism "uncertain about or uncaring about whether there is one or not" I think many people specifically believe there is no god and aren't "militant atheists" that might insist everyone who has a belief in anything they can't see is idiotic. I find this particular approach not only annoying (as it often prostletyzes) but also fairly ironic, because these are the same people who believe in science for everything - science, which by definition, seeks to explain the unexplained. Human limitations also suggest it will never accomplish this mission, meaning some things will forever be unexplainable to humans, but making a hypothesis about something we know we can't prove... Is dumb? Mmm, no.
In my case it is weak atheism: absence of belief in any god. You are referring to strong atheism: denying the existence of any god. Agnosticism: says that has no knowledge about the existence or nonexistence of god. It is also divided: Weak agnosticism: does not know if knowledge about the existence or nonexistence of God can be achieved. Strong agnosticism: believes that that knowledge is unattainable. The weak variants do not require or should prove anything. Keep in mind that both agnosticisms are compatible with weak atheism. That is, people can be both: atheists (weak) and agnostics (weak) There are also labels for those who do not know the concept of a god. They are also included in weak atheism, but not in agnosticism. Since agnosticism is the intellectual position regarding the subject.
Agnostic is the more scientific position. There is currently no way to prove or disprove the existence of any deity, and therefore the lot of them are in the "dunno" box. Until someone does come up with a scientific test that would prove the existence or non-existence of one or more of the thousands of deities humans around the world have posited, we can safely ignore the lot, or believe in whatever we find useful to us, while knowing this belief has no basis in evidence.
This comment section is wild and it helps show why women don't identify as atheist, why would we? Atheists are here talking about how inferior and less intelligent we are, how emotional we are, how we are a lesser human, why would anyone want to associate with that? Because of the atheist channels I watch nowadays, I have forgotten how anti-woman atheism spaces online often were and apparently still are. I don't believe in any gods but I will stick to agnostic as a label.
thank you for sharing your pain here. It is really important for others to hear such perspective, and it is one of the reasons I decided to produce this video.
Just to be fair, I haven't watched the video yet. So basically, I wanted to ask where did you hear such horrendous things? As an atheist male, living in poland, I have never personally heard such claims on yt or anywhere else and I'm really curious why would anyone say such a thing? In my experience, atheism is all about logic and knowledge, which clearly state that, and this might be wild for some people, women and men are both humans (and are equal, just to clarify)
@@abdoolkareem_I believe OP is talking about the new atheist community. Those people are the worst. They don’t just hate women, they think science proves that they are genetically and intellectually superior to everyone. I think it’s a cultural thing more relevant in the US and the UK.
@@barbo866Just scroll the comment section, I have read all comments before I posted this one, as you go down it becomes super common (at least at the time I wrote the first comment) , there were multiple comments about this even though I'm paraphrasing so it may not seem as harsh as what I wrote, and as someone who is 32 and been on the Internet since I was 12, it's not a new phenomenon, even though nowadays is much better, being an atheist in real life isn't great either, I live in a 90% christian country, people don't feel confortable with non belief, they barely feel confortable with believe in other religions.
Here my take: I'm a western european woman and, as most people here, I'm atheist. But also here, women are easier attracted to spirtual stuff (astrology, soul-mate, life after death, etc.) than men. When I tell women I believe in nothing spiritual, they often look at me as if I was an alien. Men are more like: "yeah... of course?" Are there studies about it?
My girlfriend somewhat recently started believing in God, praying, etc. She doesn't call herself a Christian but believes Jesus was resurrected. She's a leftist politically, raised Catholic, but spent most of her life as an atheist. She showed me a sermon from a TH-cam channel called Elevation Church that offered nothing more than a basic protestant perspective, but she had never heard these ideas as she was raised at a Roman Catholic. In contrast I spent most of my teenage years willingly going to a protestant church and hearing all the same ideas that changed her mind, only having my atheism cemented further. I am glad that she finds some level of comfort and community in believing, but it genuinely bothers me that she believes in unproven omnipotent beings, resurrection, and the efficacy of intercessory prayer. I also feel like believing in heaven, though I'm sure comforting, is illogical. I believe that the eternal glory distorts a person's worldview, and influences people's decisions by taking the urgency out of your real life. Giving people fantastic ideas of what happens after death with no evidence is manipulative, just because it quells your fear of death and gives you the warm and fuzzies doesn't mean you should believe it. This is a college educated leftist who went to art school, so I never really expected to have to deal with this. Any thoughts/advice from people who've been through something like this with their partner? Preferably something more substantial than "dump her"! If anyone took the time to read this, thank you.
I may have not gone through something like this, but I think that if this girl is supposed to be your life partner and best friend, then you have to be able to express your concerns about this to her. If you haven't talked in depth about your atheist journey to her, then do that. I apologize if this doesn't seem helpful.
FFS, don't fight about it, as it may create a backfire effect. Go to that church and suss it out. If she is intelligent, she will recognise the BS. Refrain from finding faults, even though they are apparent. Spend spare moments speaking to the more beautiful girls, and on the way home, be excited about going back. When they ask for money during the offering, suggest that you and she give your entire weekly income, including the rent. Get rid of the TV and other evil influences. Instead of going out and wasting money on a coffee or a birthday gift, give an equal amount to the church, stay home, and read a wholesome book together. If you must have coffee, get the cheapest crap, like the sweepings from the factory floor, or look in the neighbour's trash. After all, the saviour will come at an unknown hour and take the goodies to heaven. If you behave like a nutcase, you will not fit in with the crowd of hypocrites at that church. If your true love is already a bit cracked, it might be time for you to become an apiarist - buzz off. *. . . only having my atheism cemented further. . . .
I'm an atheist woman. Every person's story is different and their journey to atheism different as well. Idk if my story is uusal or not. But I've been atheist for most of my life as a young adult.
I never understood the appeal of religion. Even as a kid actively trying to believe in what was being preached, I still thought it was nothing more than a fairy tale. Aesop's fables. Stories with a moral you have to guess at because we don't live in those times and can't possibly gauge the morals of that time. I also never understood the subjugation of women and their willingness to believe in something that kept them subjugated in society.
I always argued that this is why so many depended on doing hellfire and brimstone sermons to kids. Those kids are that much easier to manipulate with mind tricks.
@@skylinefever I believe there's an age thing with that. Something like 5-10 is the age they like to get kids so they can be brainwashed. I don't recall the exact numbers.
Im a male who was raised in an atheist household. My parents chose not to baptise me so I could find god in my own time. I never understood my peers in school in regards to their faith and neither did they at such a young age. I gained an interest in questioning religion very early on and concluded that I would remain an atheist. Your reasons don’t really apply to Ireland. Religion and politics aren’t such taboo conversation topics. I was never told not to discuss religion. The difference that I’ve noticed between men and women is that men are more interested in discussing their religion and women aren’t as often. Young men are becoming more conservative so this may shift.
@@torturetuesday5191 um no it did not. Religion has killed hundreds of millions over the centuries while capitalism also tens of millions. See, you live in a first world nation where you benefit from capitalism (while being exploited) but have never lived in places where capitalism has ruined like the middle east, south and Central America, India, Philippines, native American lands.
I suspect that the correlation between high social status and lack of religion is largely caused by the way that being more educated tends to be associated with both being of a higher privileged background and being less religious rather than the high social status itself causing people to be more likely to not be religious. I think if education was to be accounted for then the correlation between high social status and being unreligious would at least drastically decrease if not go away. In general Medieval Kings had a much higher social status than Modern High School Students, yet it’s Modern Highschool Students who are less likely to be religious, because despite tending to be of a lower social status than Medieval Kings Modern High School Students tend to have more of an understanding of how the world works than a Medieval King. I know people in The Middle Ages knew more about how the world works than we often give them credit for, but their understanding was still a lot less than the understanding of most people living today. I think if anything the patriarchal teachings of the Bible and the Koran would all else being equal make women more likely to leave the Jewish Religion, Christianity, and Islam, but I think being less educated tends to more than cancel out the effects of the patriarchal teachings on women being religious. Some religions and branches of a religion are very strict and teach a fire and brimstone message, and so if anything might just add more stress to the lives of people already stressed out by the struggles of being a marginalized group, but the effects of being less educated might cancel out the effects of the teachings of the religion on marginalized groups being religious.
I'm not sure it's quite that simple. Kings, much like rulers today, may believe what they want privately and we would probably never know, because religion was another avenue to power. Denying it would probably get you killed at the very least. It's more acceptable to be less religious in general, and it's expected that high school students are trying to find their own way, or "be angsty" as some might say who lack perspective. Besides, they have no power (and often no hope and no truth in school) to lose. Nobody cares what happens to teenagers, even though humans likely need the most guidance at that age. A king on the other hand can't maintain power without maintaining the appearance of religion basically always.
Science is also incredibly misogynistic. A lot of times reason/logic/science will be used as an antidote to religion, but when these are misogynistic, religion seems just as valid of an option.
@@misslayer999yes, but religions have a bunch options, lots of women leave the patriarchal religions and go into more inclusive or matriarchal religions, there is a reason there are so many women going into paganism and new age, you can actually customise it.
Modern science is at best very biased. Almost all medical studies are done on young white men in their 20s or 30s. Where I grew up, autism help disappears as soon as you turn 13. (nevermind nobody was talking about it in my teens) and autism is one of many issues that have been noticed in men and dismissed in women. Black people often show as having too little vitamin D in blood tests because the metric for the available kind was set based on... White people. My husband's BMI is insane, but mountain people tend to be short and stocky, so not acceptable in Western beauty standards. He's all ribcage and tree trunk muscle legs. Yeah science is biased by money and all kinds of things... But it's not usually doctrine that women are the cause of all our suffering. Also I watched a Netflix thing a while back about Adam and eve. Interesting story: not about the origins of humanity. At all. They were a king and queen of a city-state that was polytheistic and they wanted to stay that way so they could stay in power. The serpent crawling on the ground is not some devil, but a representation of angelic/ancestor-type spirits (represented by winged snakes) no longer being considered acceptable worship. This is a relic of when Jews became monotheistic, as well as some angry guys with women problems and all the pens.
@@bluester7177 right that's why I said most religions. Also I'm a neuroscience student, and I have yet to encounter any misogyny. Hell all of my professors are women and there's a growing trend of more and more women getting science degrees. Just because men have been more prevalent in the field in the past doesn't mean it has to stay that way forever. You can make the misogyny argument about a lot of things, but I don't think avoiding certain careers, interests or ways of life is the way to change that. Personally I love science and nobody is going to stop me from following my passion. People(both women and men) become atheists and go with science over religion because religion isnt real and they're sick of being fed bullshit mythology. Once you realize the truth, it's not something you can just unsee and ignore anymore
Anyone who listens to iq stuff is likely both atheist and closet racists. It's a thing. If humans are not divine they don't matter. Which is funny, they'll deny free will but not believe in a higher power. Greatest cognitive dissonance possible.
I was born in a relatively poor family in Ukraine, both my father and mother had pretty successful carriers, however my father eventually became more religious, specially after my sister was born, while my mom became more open about her atheism
In India, where I live, I am a part of a club for atheists. Initially we didn't get many women. When we stopped filming our seminars and made that known the number of women just kept growing. Many women said openly that they will never tell their parents, partners or in-laws cz they won't be accepted and be seen as a "bad influence" or an "immoral woman". There are many religious people still cz religion has become intertwined with nationalism so it is now somehow more complicated but I think in my country at least there are many atheist women but it's been hard to get them out of their closets.
I have had many atheist, they also shared the same reasons but once they came out no one in their family really cared. And I have seen this in a lot of Hindu families.
I'm a woman who was raised Catholic but when I look back.. never actually believed any of the religion part. Though I've never been able to shake my deistic god belief. I think it's less of a 'belief' in a god but more of a 'hope' that something started all this & is watching. So I consider myself an Agnostic Deist. Atheist, to me, suggests someone actively does not want a god to exist.
thanks for sharing this observations. But what makes you believe that atheist "suggests someone actively does not want a god to exist." but someone who simply lacks belief in god?
@@religiologEng It doesn't always. I didn't mean to imply _all_ atheists share that mindset. It's just that a lot of very vocal atheists seem to & look down on theists, deists & pantheists.
@@elenamariatudela56 Yeah. I think it kind of contradicts the idea of skepticism that most atheists proudly proclaim. Some practically declare there isn't any kind of god, which is absurd & kinda arrogant given how vague & varied the idea of a god could be.
Why are atheists so obsessed with trying to prove something they believe doesn't exist like God? Why does it bother Ya'll so much on what people choose to believe
This French-based history is significant in the origin of anti-French sentiment & fundamentalist Christianity in early 1900’s American social history. Great video!
@@christopherhamilton3621 weird, I’ve never heard of the anti-French sentiment in 1900-1930s. Anti-Italian and anti-Asian, and anti-German, yes but not anti-French.
12:57 SO DAMN TRUE. I've met many atheist men that out loudly state their atheism and no one gives a sheet, but I say I'm atheist too and now the same people that didn't bat an eye at the man at my side that said the same, now question my morals, my inteligence, how can I ever be a good person, etc.
Fascinating video, but I'd like to challenge this idea that all societies in the past relied on strict forms of patriarchy to ensure stability and continuity. This is far from the case. Even in Europe, women's access to rights like divorce, inheritance, and property varied widely from country to country, and in different time periods (including the 1,000 years that comprise the Middle Ages.) You expand beyond Europe, and the diversity is even greater. This claim of the past as men always being in complete control of women is another form of oppression and erasure.
As an atheist man of 50, I'll just add that true atheism isn't a choice a person makes. It's the only worldview that makes sense to a critically thinking person. One can hide one's worldview by pretending to believe in the divine and supernatural, as I'm sure many past men and women did out of fear for their safety. Neat upload, cheers!
I think this is because in many societies because of patriarchy woman are socialized to not study hard science but instead study subjects related to humanities or soft science. Thats why they are unlikely to question superstitions of religious books. Its simply due to lack of education opportunity for woman.
I also think that woman are socialized to accept authority more and men are more encouraged to be rebellious, encouraging men to question authority like religions
I have never "researched" it, but I have often discussed theological ideas on a casual level (it's not about discovering the truth but about knowing what others think) Being many atheists in my circle I think it is a topic with almost no risk of hurting sensibilities. I think there are many axes or dimensions to consider in the effects that adopting the beliefs of typical religions implies: 1. Distribution of resources, responsibilities, blame, benefits, status, etc. In total or net terms: The woman is the beneficiary and the man is the contributor. That is, Christianity is calibrated to protect women. It tries to equalize the advantages or comforts of men in terms of superior strength and low reproductive investment. (I'm not saying that it's a bad thing, just that it's quite one-sided) 2. The predominant religions are intensely collectivist. This is closer to the social behavior of women. 3. The predisposition of women towards emotional and sentimental experiences; It is more compatible with religious rites in general. The analytical predisposition of men is not. 4. Women are more socialized in almost any culture. That is, they are raised with greater emotional and group experiences. Expectations of strength and the corresponding experiences are placed on men. 5. Churches are quite crude in terms of: blaming men and pampering women. 6. Victimhood is a key part of MANY ideologies. Female physical weakness gives them the profile compatible with victimhood. Then, women tend more to choose codes of conduct or values that favor them. (I am not saying that they are false victims. Whether or not they are, the system is compatible and beneficial to them) ---- Keep in mind that these items are not exclusive to theism. In general, they are the characteristics of a code created by or for the taste of the weak. And I repeat, it is not that everything is bad, but that it is inclined to help the weak at the expense of the strong; And the main problem of the strong with this matter is that they generally have no debt towards the beneficiary.
7. For women, the price of rejecting groups in their environment is much higher. Men can get by without belonging to a group as much. But women have fewer options outside groups. Keep in mind, religious groups are quite hostile and women are more vulnerable. 8. Women are very good at weighing benefits and costs. But not on a conscious level. That is, they tend to choose good options. But still, they are dissatisfied and believe themselves to be victims.
9. Women really like supernatural ideas. If we were to measure beliefs in supernatural things beyond binary options (believe or don't believe) we would find that women are much more intense about their respective religions or superstitions.
10. Religions are designed for those who suffer and find no material solution. Men have more material solutions. It is easy to believe in future rewards for the sufferings that are forced on them today. So much so that many forget that they are not choosing the suffering but that it was their only path. There is no virtue in those supposed sacrifices because they were not voluntary. This is not just about true victimhood, as in previous points. But it is the next level: false self-sacrifice.
Because many women can of course use logics, but prefer not to do it. Emotions, feelings,are more important for them. Having said that, there are plenty of women with a successfull career in stem. Furthermore, many women are still oppressed especuslly in some poor countries, and religion help them in bearing a difficult life.
Nice video, well thought through. Since I'm a man and I don't recall witnessing it, I'm curious about the specific forms that stigma against women takes when they leave the religious fold or defy other cultural norms. Perhaps the upcoming video you mentioned will satisfy me on that count.
@@Ringcaat As a two-gender female, I nearly got disowned by my family for coming out as both queer and atheist. Only recently have I been allowed back into the fold due to my "rediscovering" of spirituality (i.e. a lakeshore trip gave me ego death and spiritual awakening shenanigans). Only... that spirituality isn't what my family THINKS it is lol. I'm more of a spiritual hermeticist with gnostic leanings. I doubt they know what Hermeticism even is, but Gnosticism is SACRILEDGE for Christians lol.
On first glance, gnosticism makes more sense than modern Christian representation of dualism with Satan being somehow equal to a god who doesn't seem to care about that particular problem. Then again many modern Christians have no idea what they are talking about, sooo
Also aggressive men willing to subjugate women and others will be attracted to religion to maintain structures of oppression, even if they don't really believe in the spiritual or supernatural.
Chiming in as an agnostic woman: seeing as religious systems have failed my gender the world over, and that many of their care functions have been subsumed by different organizations and experiences (e.g. food banks, nursing homes, hospitals, the awe from nature), it's been difficult for me to see religion as true or faith as beneficial to my life. Does it help if it's the same people over and over? Maybe. Might it be because I'm neurodivergent and can't really imagine a sentient being playing with us like poker chips? Maybe. But if the poker chips are Also, a combination of psychotherapy and learning about stochastic processes has helped me come to terms with bad things happening and how to make the best of them. Witnessing our own human processes have godlike power (as a collective) and awe fulfills the endorphin generating niche as well. Regarding social consequences - OH BOY. I can't exactly tell my fellow South Asian diaspora friends that I'm atheist. In fact, the stereotype of India being particularly spiritual checks out because of the marked lack of people who identify as agnostic or atheist because they grew up with particular faith traditions and those are reinforced in public or school holidays (especially Hindu). I'm the kind of atheist that's the patriarchy's worst nightmare: overeducated, overthinking, overweening atheist cat lady.
Even here in muslims majority countries more ex muslims men than women ,more athiests men than women (not based on actual statistics because that s forbidden in muslims countries but what i noticed from my social life/ lives (and believe me when i say i watch many ))
It's probably pretty true anywhere that women are less likely to be open about it, or even open to questioning religion, for fear that they may be ostracized. Basically anywhere patriarchy can be found, which is almost everywhere.
@@elenamariatudela56 one factor for sure 👍 But on the internet they can hide their ids and they can watch same shows as men in fact they have even bigger motivation (this is why i don't believe it s the only factor also it s bad where i m from for both ☠️ but more for females no doubts )
@@elenamariatudela56 May be in a sense of how they were raised vs how men were raised which is still patriarchy (if this what u meant it s huge factor)(quran says :" they r deficient in intelligence and religion " imagine society that believes in this how can they raise both to be equally smart and responsible?
@@elenamariatudela56 If u mean in a sense of how they were raised to be expected to be less than men then u r correct it s huge factor. I wrote another huge comment but TH-cam deleted it , even though i quoted what coran says and they believe in coran not me !
I'm very confused about the opening bit about the Olympics. Women couldn't participate until the Paris Olympic games in the 20th century... so the second modern Olympics.
So What I'm hearing as around 6:45-7:00 on, it sounds like a lot of the freethinking women have been ignored in part because Atheism has been a male-centered belief system.
Probably also true. There are women in philosophy too, and some of them really freaking important. And I can't remember their names. Not a one. But you can't help but find white male philosophers, only partly because there are more of them.
Granted, culture and politics still play a large role in this. E.g. my mother's side of the family grew up in East Germany, before, during, and after the Cold War. My grandparents left the church, and my mother, uncle, and me have been atheist all our life and continue to do so after re-unification. While the wide-spread employment of East German women started out of necessity, it informed how these people thought of themselves, making atheism or "being non-denominational" the standard for East German women to this very day.
religion is more of a social/emotional thing. women are more attuned to environmental cues. they can see when another woman is giving them a dirty look but this also means they read things into nature that aren't really there. plus people like the idea that that have a sky daddy that loves and is looking after them - nobody wants to admit they're all alone and their life means absolutely nothing. western women are abandoning religion but they're adopting things like 'manifesting' which is still magical thinking but without the nasty bronze age gods.
Manifesting sounds so much like both BS corporate motivational slogans, and the stuff megachurch holy men talk about. I hate the corporate motivational industry with a passion.
The Olympic Games were only revived at the very end of the 19th century. Alleging women weren't allowed to compete until the 20th century is misleading. True, the original Olympic games of ancient Greece were unisex. But I believe women had their own games.
The data on this video would benefit from cross-examination with data about how young men/women are currently doing. Considering trends in educational and economic performance, the numbers shown at 16:50 make a lot of sense.
Can I ask you what made you feel the need to make a video on this topic? Some significant event that was going on during that time, personal relationships, inspiration from another TH-camr's video? What was it?
@@religiologEng That's cool. I wanted to know what made you choose this topic at this time. You could have chosen any. What lead you to choose this one?
I guess you would say I am a agnostic woman. I don't think I found enough evidence to prove for or against God, but I question most religions and find humans to be odd, so I study them both.
Systems of control don’t work unless they are directed at the people who need to be controlled. I have a strong feeling that this is why so many Black Americans are so religious. That said, religion is also great for organizing a community and keeping it cohesive against adversity. Women would benefit from a tight social network as much as former slaves would. Edit: I am saying all this as a Black atheist. I can’t speak for women, I have never been one, but I do have some insight into the Black community
In my experience, women generally aren’t deeply concerned with religious or atheistic ideologies. Instead, they tend to follow societal norms and expectations. They are pragmatic by nature, prioritizing what works best for them in a given context.
i'm atheist woman and ex-Muslim, yeah is not surprising to a women leave this religion but It was different for me. The reasons for leaving this religion were different from what is commonly believed, which is also what allowed me to take the position of atheism specifically. Just the atheist arguments of an arrogant white man and its comprehension were enough. I was accepting of the social status that the beliefs of this religion presented for me , religion in a way, protected the lower classes of society, including women, so there was no need to reject it as long as it provided organization and security for us .
I think what made me hate god and become an atheistic girl in the future was the fact that my mom forced me to pray whenever I did anything wrong, and also because she would always scold me for going straight to my tablet, cellphone or computer after church cause that meant I was disrespecting god. So yeah, I was able to overcome these statistics through My Little Pony and Papa's Pizzeria
Also, I kept watching, and your distinction between existential and social risk is flawed, since humans are weak and can’t survive on their own, so in the past being excluded from your community e.g. tribe meant certain death, so it would be more correct to say that social risk is a subcategory of existential risk, which validates the male/female risk relation you were going against
(To clarify, I’m not saying there’s existential consequences to being rejected from a group nowadays, just that it’s been this way for most of history, so that’s how the brain perceives it)
Those women are not exactly favored these days. O'Hair begrudged feminism and denied the extent of decimation of Jewish people during WWII, and it's now cool to hate Ayn Rand because she was against government sponsored altruism in the form of socialism and communism.
I was just talking about this with my mother the other day. Not in terms of atheism. Majority of my friends have always been Hindu and it's common for Hindus to stop eating meat when its a festival or during the month of Shravan. We as Buddhists observe that too during our festivals but not as strictly as others. There are days assigned to specific gods and according to their belief they will not eat meat on that day, I never observed that. But I always noticed how the boys in my group didn't really care about it all. If they feel like eating meat, they will, if not then not. They never justified them not eating meat due to religious reasons but the girls always did. I ate whatever my friends ate but it was always in the back of my mind how women are so much more strict about following certain things due to religious reasons than men.
I think the opening argument is anachronistic. Most women in the developed world today never experienced issues with passports or bank accounts, these are abstract stories from their grandmothers. Moreover most college graduates are women and have been now for decades. I think it's infantilizing to insist that women are religious out of ignorance, fear, or social pressure. The religious women I have known in my life have been nothing like that. Why is it when men are religious it's genuine agency but when women are religious it's some product of society? To me it seems like in trying not to be sexist you're just being sexist in a different way. Maybe the best way to not be sexist is simply *believe women* when they tell you they find value in religion and stop projecting on them.
Unless you conduct a critical analysis of the research papers you cite, believing that they made considerations for such studies doesn't leave much confidence in people who truly do care about the scientific method.
The amazing thing is people who think they are smarter than people of faith out of some imagined mental superiority. The creator of this video need not worry that his vast intelligence has held him back.
People simply assume I'm religious because they see it as part of my inherited identity. Not one person asked me what I thought while I was growing up. Even my parents would each still say I belong to their religions, which are not the same, because they never listened to me. There are probably far more non-religious girls and women than people will ever know.
![ILLSLICK - KILLSHOT REMIX [FULL VERSION]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/RIK8RrqIAzE/mqdefault.jpg)
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Dear, what is the name of the place where the brains of the "society of mutual autopsy" are held on display in France?
Hmm, funny how you said (churches would struggle without women) as I have come to the same conclusion a few years ago,
I have always said that ( men make the "culture/society" but women preserve them),
although I do also say ( men don't know how to blend the modern and traditional, but women can blend them easily without trying),
if there is a way to blend contradictory ideas (secularism and religious sexism), women do it everyday, men would be saying it's impossible
Can I ask you what made you feel the need to make a video on this topic? Some significant event that was going on during that time, personal relationships, inspiration from another TH-camr's video? What was it?
Same reason women are more successful in school.
@@aaad3552 That doesn't answer my question at all.
I think it's, among many things, a result of a sunken cost fallacy. While men do suffer the effects of purity culture and religious guilt, women are subjected to more severe trauma and limitations. Many christian women see their unhappy marriages, wasted youths, and truncated careers as "spiritual investments". So they find the thought of having sacrificed so much for nothing -unbearable-.
in my research I focus on ex-clergy most of whom are male and they share similar thoughts but I see what you mean.
This sentiment does seem true to me regarding women with children who seem to have a problem with women who choose not to have children. It’s as if the decision others make not to breed diminishes something in their own decisions.
There's also the literal costs of not having as much financial security as a man.
@@religiologEngI had a thought in support of the original comment. I spent years studying in yeshiva specifically because I felt the need to understand my "true" religion. It was such a huge loss to conclude it wasn't true. If I had not been dedicated to logic and evidence, I doubt I would have overcome my biases. In other words, maybe clergy have huge sunk costs, but they are also in the very business of finding truth in their religion. Women - often excluded from religious leadership - might be less exposed to the sort of religious analysis which leads to overcoming the psychological defenses against loss.
@@benjaminplotke4716 I know someone (a former pastor) for whom this was very true.
I'm a white male. But I am disabled, autistic, have no family support, and have always struggled financially. I do not possess high social or.economic status. So why am I an atheist? I think autistic people, due social deficits and isolation, are more likely to be less religious because we don't participate in social structures.
great question. Thank you so much for sharing this. I'll check if there are any studies in that regard, but your hypothesis sounds legit. Here I found some studies but haven't read them yet - escholarship.org/content/qt6zh3j3pr/qt6zh3j3pr.pdf; brill.com/view/journals/arp/40/1/article-p1_1.xml; www.mdpi.com/2227-9067/10/8/1417
@@religiologEng
*ALthough I gave him an UP VOTE, I CouLd OnLy Understand 1/2 of his words!!!*
*I had to QUIT Watching at 1/2 way Point!!!!*
@@Justin.Martyr Just why are you spamming this dumb comment?
I don't think it has to do with social deficits and isolation and much more with the way autistic people process information, there is more rigid analytical thinking.
Could it also be that you tend to analyse things, and frankly...most religions do not stand up to scrutiny.
I have met a large number of atheist and agnostic women. I am one myself. I believe part of it may be an identification issue. Atheism can sometimes be seen as “harsh” and many people see themselves as “neutral”. I would argue that the number is skewed when polls are taken for % atheists men and women.
Of course, I’m not saying it’s equal, but we exist!
thank you for sharing this
Atheism vs agnosticism, atheism vs pantheism ("mystical atheism"?), hard atheism vs soft atheism...
Anyway, as I said in a separate comment, in my country, where disbelief rose like a tsunami after the death of Christo-fascist dictator Franco, women are definitely as likely to be atheist (or similar: agnostic, etc.) as men. Most people are nonbelievers anyhow (same in France and Catalonia and growingly across all Western Europe).
Very true about the "harsh" part. Atheism should just be a lack of a belief in a god, but some seem to use it as hatred of the concept of a god too. That's why I think some people prefer the term "Agnostic" by itself even though it's supposed to be used alongside "atheist, theist, deist" etc. to more accurately describe the belief system.
*WHO IS the DUDE in your AvaTar???*
@@Justin.MartyrSOSEKI NATSUME FROM GREAT ACE ATTORNEY!
I didn’t shake off the shackles of religion until I was 29 y/o. It is rare being black and atheist. I haven’t met another one.
I hope you will find many. One of my next videos will be on Black Atheists. I recommend checking Sikivu Hutchinson and Daniel Swann.
There are plenty of black atheists, many are not out, like myself 😊
I'm a Mexican atheist, if that makes you feel less lonely. POC atheist gang rise up ✊️
I’m black and an atheist. But I’m also a man, so there’s that!
“The fanatical atheists are like slaves who are still feeling the weight of their chains which they have thrown off after hard struggle. They are creatures who - in their grudge against traditional religion as the ‘opium of the masses’ - cannot hear the music of the spheres.”
-Albert Einstein.
I am a woman. My mother and I are atheists. So are most of my (girl) friends.
However, I think that a lot of women are living a life of oppression and that believing in a better afterlife will help make the nasty present bearable.
good point
So I'm a woman and I would probably describe myself as "Heisenburg's belief system" or basically agnostic, if I'm simplifying. My mom was atheist because she was raised Calvinist in the 70s. In the midst of race riots it's hard to sit in church and hear that God loves "all" the little children when all the ones you see are white. She became atheist somewhere between 8 and 11 yo and never told her mom bc it would just make her worry for no good reason. She still finds prophecy and comparative religion an interesting topic, and found the Baha'i Faith because of various religious prophecies that seemed to fit. My dad was a very lapsed Catholic and converted after just reading the Baha'i books around the house. I have no serious qualms with the Faith, and don't regret being raised with religion at all, but I simply find it doesn't suit my life. Both of us kiddos (now grown) have decided to kinda go our own way and our parents are supportive and suitably inquisitive and informative.
There has never been a present that is more bearable. How long do you think climate controlled buildings, as an example, have existed?
@@maclectic 1) I live in Europe and AC is not the norm. We do not need it, and it is terrible for the environment, so no reason to get it. 2) Things have moved very quickly, and there are vast swathes of the world where being a woman=being oppressed until quite recently (living memory, so mentalities are still limping behind) and other big swathes where women's life still is.
@@elenamariatudela56 Thank you for sharing these interesting paths!
As an atheist woman I find this fascinating!
glad you liked it
@@religiologEng very dumb video, it's because women are Neurologically different than MEN, people are not blank slates.
*ALthough I gave him an UP VOTE, I CouLd OnLy Understand 1/2 of his words!!!*
*I had to QUIT Watching at 1/2 way Point!!!!*
All the women I know are atheist, but I met most of them at university in my science classes.
@@Justin.Martyrtry turning on Closed captions. They seem 100% accurate to what he is saying.
And no worries, unfamiliar accents are hard for everyone! Maybe listening to this channel will give you a new skill better understanding Ukrainian English accents.
Also recall having to hide my atheism during my teenage years in order to not offend my working class mother, and other member of the small town I grew up in back in the 1980’s when everyone attended their local church.
thank you for sharing your experience
I often wonder how many people throught history were secretly atheists. They only pretended not to be atheists to survive.
I remember when I was a kid in the late 70's my mom was buying a car. She was an RN, single mom, owned a house, etc. the sales manager asked if her husband knew she was buying a car. My dad called and he told them she was her own woman and she can do whatever she wants.
Your dad is a legend ❤
Based
Sounds like something a guy might get asked😂
My mother would have walked away, bought another brand and gone back to the first place and told them they were losers whose attitude had cost them the sale.
I'm a working class, small town, women with little formal education, but I've been an avid reader all my life. I'm handicapped by trauma, PTSD. I'm also about 60 years old and live in the USA. I've been completely atheist since the noughties, and left my childhood religion in my teens.
More men are apt to announce their atheism, while women just leave religion and the idea of god behind. Are you sure you are counting correctly? because it seems women have more reason to leave these thoughts behind.
good hypothesis , it could be
Excellent points...and you are proving what I always say: you do not have to study to stimulate your brain. Learning comes in many guises. Anyway, when I went to the US, I said I was atheist. I was 18. The lovely people I was with were shocked (especially as I am culturally Jewish). They asked a few questions, and decided that I was agnostic. I thought about it when I went to bed that night, and decided to gp along with this. Not because it was true, but because age 18, in a foreign country, surrounded by Jews who, unlike my family, did believe, it was just more diplomatic. I think Auschwitz etc, and how my grand dad was treated when the Russians "liberated" his camp killed the idea of god for us.
Once I was back in Europe, I was free to be honest, and I have never pretended again, but it gave me some insights into social pressure.
I agree. We leave our respective faiths within any fanfare. When I was 12, all I said to a few close friends was that I 'd given up Catholicism for Lent.
I think this question comes up in regard to a lot of statistics involving the differences between men and women - whether it's just the nature of our culture making women more likely to stay under the radar on certain matters. Kind of by definition it's hard to tell if-or-how-much it's the case, but it's always worth keeping the possibility in mind.
@@Dabordi Well, when I was younger I kept my ideas etc. to myself and am much more outspoken now that I am older. Society seems to favor the "quiet" women and also reward the outspoken men. Has a study been done on women only? That would be interesting IMO.
As an atheist woman, I just realize there’s no religion on the planet that treat women equally and fairly and it seems like all religious oppress women
maybe not all, but many do
@@religiologEng what religion treat women equally and fairly? Please let me know
@@toniq30 the pagan religions tend to be more equal, but not all of them. new age tends to be more equal, but one needs be careful to vet them before joining. toxic patriarchy is everywhere.
@@toniq30 If you're interested in a more feminist-leaning version of Christianity, look up Gnoticism or the Gospel of Mary. In Gnosticism, Mary Magdeline is viewed as one of Jesus's only true disciples compared to apostles like Paul and John who did their own thing. Also, the story of Adam and Eve gets flipped in Gnosticism, as eating from the Tree of Knowledge was actually a GOOD thing for the spiritual enlightenment of humanity, and Eve was unfairly punished for her curiosity by the spiteful and evil demiurge Yaldabeoth/"Jehovah". In Gnosticism, Jesus literally came to rescue humanity from the damage Yaldabeoth wreaked on humanity. That includes tearing down worldly systems like misogyny, greed, and other such earthly attachments in pursuit of spiritual awakening and ascension.
Personally, there's a bit of weird mythological hooey involved with that religion, but it's philosophically similar to Hermeticism and Buddhism. I'd say Gnosticism is the version of Christianity most aligned with Jesus's teachings.
@@toniq30 islam 😂😂
It makes the woman do nothing except serving her husband
I wonder if these same phenomenon are responsible for women more stereotypically believing in astrology
great question
I believe a lot of women who leave organized religion typically end up following some other spiritual practice, like Wicca or paganism. It's very common on the female-dominated part of TH-cam.
Women are spiritually superior. We maintain a connection with the spiritual, whether it's Christianity or Paganism.
religious belief and belief in astrology or tarot cards or the like gives women a sense of power they don't feel in a patriarchal world. even a sense of power is better than feeling powerless.
@@idk-ill-figure-smn-outmostly because it's the opposite of the patriarchal religion they been part of before, most women who go into wicca or paganism tend to focus their belief into empowering and empowered woman, like Hecate, Demeter, the divine feminine, I don't think it's just belief playing a part, it's also community, I don't believe in anything and I still go visit rituals from non abrahamic religions, specially the African diasporic ones that exist in my country, because they are much more inclusive people.
New Atheisim in the form of the 'skeptic' community deciding to declare war on Feminism back in the day certainly didn't help. I've been an atheist my entire life but those online spaces are only relatively recently becoming welcoming spaces for women and LGTB+ people.
Many thanks to channels like ConcernedApe and Genetically Modified Skeptic for being way more welcoming and actually rational about social issues (as in, recognising that they actually exist instead of dismissing them).
thanks for sharing it!
The New Atheists didn't declare war on feminists, feminists declared war on the New Atheists.
That is one of the important factors about Atheism. is that it's not a religion with the requirements of a religion. and anyone is welcome to join the Atheist community. and there's no obligation to stay an Atheist. although the Atheist community would hate to see someone leave. they wouldn't force anyone to stay or ostrosize a person for leaving. it's on of the most appealing concepts of Atheism.
Weird considering that one of Christopher Hitchens' most popular debates had him defending homosexuality alongside Stephen Fry, even more weird knowing he himself was most likely bisexual, he did write that bonkers "Why Women Aren't Funny" article though so...
Fat deal
I'm an African American woman. As a child, I was a devout conservative Christian. In my late teens / early 20s, I went through a period of rebellion against the church. Blaming this for my poor start in adulthood, I returned, but continued to struggle in the job market. Then I inadvertently joined a cult, putting my life in danger.
I escaped those circumstances and moved to a city I fell in love with, and joined a wonderful church where the pastor saved my life twice. But my economic struggles continued, to the point where I had to be rescued by my brother, leaving that church and city behind. The ultimate insult was being forced to sit helpless while his daughter dropped out of high school to join a cult.
I am now a Buddhist / atheist. I have no respect for an all-powerful ever-present deity that lacks the wisdom of a developmentally disabled adult.
I believe women' are more religious because of learned helplessness. The same goes for African Americans, and other disenfranchised groups. The more control you gain over your life, the less you need to rely on magical incantations and amulets.
thank you for sharing this. It is a very interesting testimony with deep insights. Wishing you the best!
Girl u cooked with that last sentence. 👏👏👏
African American women are not disenfranchised because of religion but because of LACK of religion.
African American women are less likely to live in a stable long term marriage, they are more likely to become single mothers and their children being raised in fatherless homes. Which brings more poverty, crime, lack of education and opportunities. Don't confuse the cause for the consequences.
Whilst Christianity is declining in black communities in the US, it is growing significantly in Africa. 👍
@jirislavicek9954 - you have a point. However, the real issue isn't lack of religion; it's the way the religion is practiced. Oftentimes, Christians think they can do whatever mess they want, and escape the consequences by asking God's forgiveness. If you criticize their behavior, they call you judgmental. Very few actually read the Bible, and I've met many who can't even recite the Ten Commandments.
There's also a tendency to make excuses for irresponsible, even criminal, behavior, and to revel in martyrdom and self-righteousness. That explains the state of the African American community today. Buddhism, on the other hand, is based on the Laws of Cause and Effect, so it has zero tolerance for such foolishness. Many Asians are Buddhist; take a good look at their communities.
@@hiz24airness They are not denied any rights or opportunities or powers. They usually choose not to have them or not to fight for them. It's not really about religiosity, but about following Christian morality. If you fall for liberal propaganda, you you are very unlikely to succeed in life. That applies to white women and men as well.
I liked this video. The emphasis on social position and on social security, makes me thing it is important as an atheist not to demonize those who follow a religion as this could easily lead to discrimination against more vulnerable people with essential good hearts.
good point!
Atheist woman here...I look forward to watching!
Thank you Becca! Please check out some of my previous videos too.
It's so absurd that women were viewed as second class humans for such a long time and still today in many parts of the world.
yes, its really sad
Often they where sheltered from harm, not oppressed, I know it can often seems like that or a limitation on them, untill you dig a bit deeper, if they really was seen as that, all the Men on Titanic would have survived and all the women would have played music as they was going down etc and we would force the women to go to war and make them get up at 4am to collect garbages and make them do concrete work, people often take the time we live in and use it to look at the past and some are just looking blindly with a bias for anything to support the idea that one gender was more oppressed at some point in time, we are oppressed differently, we can never reach a fair world, to the degree it is possible, if we start at a point where we belive that the two genders are the same and should be treated so, only by force, like in the past, etc the majority in the USSR was equaly poor or dead.
@@Uriel-Septim.you got it. Women can be seen as oppressed only if we see the world in the "Western", capitalistic way where money and work is all that matters. But if you change the perspective, I wouldn't call a citizen "second class" if it's sheltered from risky activities because of its biological importance in keeping a population alive.
@@TimonLepidusWestern woman are also priviliged so anything else is seen by them as oprresion
It wasn’t about women’s existence as much as men’s shattered egos..men measured value based on their own standards to make the mere existence of a masculine being an advantage…there’s no creature women or not that was seen by men as higher in class than they are….feminism’s biggest achievement was revealing the equation isn’t logical at all even if you did twice his work with twice the quality…
He will still measure your value less no explanations provided….simply very simply cause it’s easier for his brain..and he’s ego…
Religious groups are social /power groups. Females sometimes attend 2-3 churches in rural communities . This is a communication network and another social support system. Another reason that helps women live longer on average.
I am an atheist woman...there are so many culturally Christian which is most people not really thinking about their beliefs. Women typically do more charity work, rescue work, etc. it makes sense most women would not identify as atheist.
thank you, good points
I am a woman and though I was raised Christian i now considered myself an atheist. Its true that most of my peers are spiritual wether through organization trad religion or new age religion. I find that im often alone in my lack of belief in anything supernatural.
One superstition or another 👍
too sad and I completely feel your situation
*ALthough I gave him an UP VOTE, I CouLd OnLy Understand 1/2 of his words!!!*
*I had to QUIT Watching at 1/2 way Point!!!!*
@@Justin.Martyruse closed captions.
@@Justin.Martyr You poor martyr, have you spent your own life listening to one sort of accent only? If this is the case, then stick at it: understanding accents come easy if you exercise it, and it can be a very useful skill. Alternatively, click on the caption button, right side of the screen, 3rd from right.
Here's a question: did women face more severe social consequences for religious dissent, or are women in general more afraid of social consequences? Since these would go hand in hand and reinforce each other, untangling this would not be easy. Do any of the studies you quote address this? I'm asking because I come from an atheist family, we were living in a Catholic social environment when I was younger, but my sister and I (male) reacted very differently to the pressure coming off our social environment. We were a well-educated family with very little economic pressure at the time, both of our parents had an academic education and were working in according jobs, and still, I basically did not care about the (rather mild, compared to what US atheists often face) adversity while my sister was almost traumatized by it.
Women have a lot more trauma to go through in general, and society has taught us to be afraid of being any more of a "less than" than we are. I suppose it's kind of a chicken-egg, downward spiral scenario, really.
I would say yes, AND.
In many religions women are punished more harshly for similar crimes, and often if they make accusation it goes unheard, but a mans accusation against them is automatically written in stone.
However, its much more that s womans existance in religion is harsher overall, and it beats them down.
Ive had male friends who leave religion and list all the horrible things said and done to them, yet when i tell my story, they sit in slack jawed horror and revulsion.
At my church, the boys were told to follow the ten commandments. The girls were told the same AND to follow their husbands.
The boys were told not to sleep around. The girls were told that THINKING about $3x was a sin, if you so much as had urges you were deviant, and if you EVER did it outside marriage not only was God unable to fulfil his full purpose in your life, you were forever unworthy of love and companionship, and any man who took you was doing you a massive favor you were not worthy of.
See the difference?
Boys were taught to explore their dreams, get a good job to support a family. Lots of options there.
Girls were told they only needed to worry about which option of husband to pick. If you pick wrong and he cheats, hits, is poor or distant, ALL of that is your fault for picking poorly.
I. Could. Go. On.
Think of muslims. Men have a long list of restrictive rules, sure. That list is longer for the women. Less speaking, less right, more coverings, less mobility, AND a dozen kids on top of it.
I know reginal chinese religions had a few tipping scales, but throughout history, their religions and laws punished women more harshly for crimes like cheating for longer stretches of time.
Its a common theme everywhere you look. Same rules, unequal outcome, choices taken from women.
And since you are stuck at home with the babies, YOU ARE STUCK. No job. No experience. No skills. No private time. And once husband comes home, you take care of him fully too. And both sets of parents. Even upper class wonen had to travel to take care of even obscure sick relatives.
When is there TIME to think?
On top of indoctrination and shame, you are left without the skills and means to help yourself AND as many dependants as your body could survive making.
Notice educated women have little to no children as well.
I would say yes, AND.
In many religions women are punished more harshly for similar crimes, and often if they make accusation it goes unheard, but a mans accusation against them is automatically written in stone.
However, its much more that s womans existance in religion is harsher overall, and it beats them down.
Ive had male friends who leave religion and list all the horrible things said and done to them, yet when i tell my story, they sit in slack jawed horror and revulsion.
At my church, the boys were told to follow the ten commandments. The girls were told the same AND to follow their husbands.
The boys were told not to sleep around. The girls were told that THINKING about $3x was a sin, if you so much as had urges you were deviant, and if you EVER did it outside marriage not only was God unable to fulfil his full purpose in your life, you were forever unworthy of love and companionship, and any man who took you was doing you a massive favor you were not worthy of.
See the difference?
Boys were taught to explore their dreams, get a good job to support a family. Lots of options there.
Girls were told they only needed to worry about which option of husband to pick. If you pick wrong and he cheats, hits, is poor or distant, ALL of that is your fault for picking poorly.
I. Could. Go. On.
Think of muslims. Men have a long list of restrictive rules, sure. That list is longer for the women. Less speaking, less right, more coverings, less mobility, AND a dozen kids on top of it.
I know reginal chinese religions had a few tipping scales, but throughout history, their religions and laws punished women more harshly for crimes like cheating for longer stretches of time.
Its a common theme everywhere you look. Same rules, unequal outcome, choices taken from women.
And since you are stuck at home with the babies, YOU ARE STUCK. No job. No experience. No skills. No private time. And once husband comes home, you take care of him fully too. And both sets of parents. Even upper class wonen had to travel to take care of even obscure sick relatives.
When is there TIME to think?
On top of indoctrination and shame, you are left without the skills and means to help yourself AND as many dependants as your body could survive making.
Notice educated women have little to no children as well.
Men have their words challenged less, yes
Bank account story from my great-granny Maximina Madariaga: she went to open a bank account (early 20th century, not sure the year, maybe the 30s) and she was turned back and asked to bring someone to sign for her. The next week she returned and declared that she would sign for herself... and (somehow) she got her bank account. That's at least what my historian sister has recolected.
interesting, thanks for sharing this story.
Maybe it wasn’t “illegal” in that State, just it was not a “right” like it is now
@@letsomethingshine - We had peculiar laws (Basque charters) but unsure how they may have applied. The question is that she was stubborn and got what she wanted.
I’m an atheist woman who became atheist again after years in woo or pagan beliefs after years of Christian belief that started at age 15. I wonder about estrogen and belief, because I started believing around the time I would be getting the hormone rush and stopped around menopause. This didn’t occur to me until just now lol.
interesting
@rise do you think some neonatal infantile attachment mechanisms may be a contributing factor?
@@you_jay well I was vocally atheist from the time I read my dad’s comparative religion textbook in 2nd grade until 15 (when I got double whammied by the love bombing and coerced spiritual experience). It’s an interesting question.
@@riseofdarkleela very very interesting!!!
@@riseofdarkleela It seems like your dad really contributed to the way you see the world around. I wonder the name of that text book based on comparative religion.
This clearly proves that religion is a SOCIAL behavior, not an "inner need" of humanity like many apologists say.
Until they're not young anymore. I witnessed previous atheists becoming religious with age. Sadly, but understandable.
Loss, despair and fear of inevitable are backed up with religion. It's natural
@@faina_yevheniiaDeath is inalienable. What to do with the “self” after it is frightening to many.
That still isn't an inner need, but just an unhealthy coping mechanism.
No all this proves is that humanity is imperfect. Big surprise. But i dont think you can come along and deny what all of human history clearly points to. Every culture has some type of religion and some type of god they believe in. That in and of itself points to an inner need because why would humans so constantly seek something that they did not need? If we didnt need food we would never seek food. So why do we seek God through religion?
Reducing everything to a social construct and denying whats clearly basic human nature is a product of a Godless and arrogant modern world with no sense of hope or direction.
There has never been an atheist society, at least not one thats lasted for very long and thats because atheism is unnatural and leads to despair. A society with no hope is suicidal. And you can see that clear as day today with suicide rates going higher every year
Anything social is a consequence. There are different cultures because different people exist. Culture does not shape people, is shaped by people.
I'm not an atheist. But I always jump on online proselytizers who think prayer cures illness when it does not.
Only Clorox and uv rays cure illnesses.
Yes! Pray to God if you want, but tie up your camel!
the belivers know it doesn't work. because if they really beleived, they'd be hanging around hospital wards trying to cure people. it's a con, and they know it
@@elenamariatudela56are you muslim? What you are referring as an example of taking care of your life before puting your trust in god is from an islamic hadith.
How about praying when your friends are in a war zone? If my friends don't want my prayers then too bad for them. My prayers are for me. They know I'm praying for them. They are not so cruel as to take away my source of comfort from their situations. Ukraine 2022
I find this fascinating as someone whom came from a poorer immigrant family whose parents were religious, and yet became an atheist by the age of fifteen.
My mother is turkish my father is german. I was raised both, muslim and christianity. and i decided with 10 that there is no good and i have to help myself.
I think that women and men are equally likely to be atheistic/agnostic in my country (Basque Country) and that applies also to its entourage such as France, Catalonia, etc., which are the most atheist areas of Europe. Global statistics may be biased because there's a lot of people still emerging from the Dark Ages (rural "medievalist" background, which is also patriarchal almost invariably).
yes, in your part of the world things may be very different
@@religiologEng - It's probably also different in Iran, where rumor is that atheism is growing massive among the younger generations. There's nothing like religious tyranny to make everyone atheist...
What do you know of atheism figures in "Muslim" Albania? They had a cultural revolution, much like China's which left a deep mark, you know.
The question is which is your part of the world and what do the thumbnail's statistics say. You seem to be talking about the whole world but were sloppy about sources and data.
Also, I always find such videos have a slight American slant. As I posted above, it can be hard to declare yourself an atheist in the USA.
@@annepoitrineau5650 - I understand things have been changing a lot since I did exactly that (as exchange student) in 1985-86... to the astonishment of some and the cheers of many. Things are improving fast even in the Americas.
@@LuisAldamiz Yes...I was an excchange student in 1973/1974... remarkable that it seems you had the same experience in 85/86 (AFS?? exchange?). I hope things are changing indeed!!
As an atheist woman... No there aren't few of us. A great majority of women are atheists in Spain, where I'm from. Same in Scotland where I'm currently living. It's just the US that is so overwhelmingly religious (if we're talking the western world) 😂
thank you for sharing your experience
It's actually not true for the US either, if you look at the statistics, is pretty equal among genders and places like Latam are much more religious, the most common correlation we see with atheism is income.
I do expect a certain contingent of women in the US T say they're religious rather than be the center of a scandal. Southern Baptist women might ask a coworker which church they go to, and if it's the one across the street, they go all "steel magnolia." Or say to your face you'll burn in hell. Because it's my specific pastor or hell, apparently... *facepalm*
@@elenamariatudela56 gods that sounds awful
Atheist woman from the United States here. While I do concede your point, the US is not the only overwhelmingly religious country on the planet. Look in to the rates and practices of Islam in modern day Islamic Theocracies and what's going on in Africa.
Growing up in France, I came from a non-religious family. We weren’t even familiar with the concept of atheism. My French mother also came from a non-religious background, going back several generations, I believe. It wasn’t until much later that I learned my Dutch father was religious-Lutheran, according to my mother, who mentioned it once! Strangely enough, both my Dutch grandparents were also non-religious.
As far as I can remember, the environment in France where I grew up was largely secular. When we moved to the Netherlands in 1970, I was surprised to find that most people there were either Catholic or Protestant. However, nowadays, most of the people I know who were once religious no longer are.
What I find interesting is that many people who grew up with religious beliefs, even if they no longer practice, still hold onto certain superstitions. Having been raised without any form of mysticism, my mind remains free of such influences.
My guess is 90%++ of all french have a long 200++ yr history of atheism, nihilism, paganisms, etc, REligion does not go well w the french, THey ae hard core super NON RELIGIOUS. which explains why CG Jung's idea are non existent in france. 90%++ of french have not even heard the name CG Jung = pathetic,,, you see CG did not speak to hard core atheists.. Only those seeking. Poor france, doomed with her atheisms.
I ended up joining the community of Apostate Aladdin 2ish months ago, who I actually found out about because he commented on one of your previous videos, and found it fascinating that his private server (almost all ex-muslim atheists) had a lot of women, possibly even more than half. I directly asked him about this and he takes pride in it and says it reflects in his general viewership as well, having significantly more (although still a minority) general female viewership than his peers. He's also about as un-angry as atheists get and I've loved his content precisely because he's fantastic at helping me as a lifelong non-religious person understand how it feels, both good and bad.
There's a lot of reasons I could discuss for why so many women are there - and I've asked a number of the women themselves what their opinion is on it - but I found it quite interesting either way since I think it spoke a lot both to the idiosyncrasies of that specific religion (VERY patriarchal), the fact that all of them could speak English (implying some baseline level of education and affluence), and the approach of the channel itself, that I think has more of a "stereotypical feminine appeal", focusing a lot on people's experiences and morality and less on the standard white Western atheist talking points of "logic dictates X so you should believe it, end of story."
Not to say that those people don't have good points, just that I think it is fair to acknowledge that not everybody likes the same stuff, and a combination of being raised to be submissive and a lack of testosterone means they wouldn't be nearly as attracted to the more standoffish modern atheist communities, as you noted well in the video itself.
Also, love that you go into this topic and look forward to you exploring it more. I think this is a really under-explored question. Atheism is still a touchy subject, and many minorities are the most religious since they are the poorest, least educated, and most badly in need of community. On the same note, treating women as equals in all social contexts is still a contentious issue getting its edges hammered out. Atheism tends to be a needless complication in any of these causes, but the end result is that even atheists who support women and minorities aren't likely to feel it's a good idea to try to do both of those issues at the same time.
Comes back to why I immediately got hooked on Apostate Aladdin so much. As a non-white guy born in the non-West with a lot of female participation, I think he speaks to the massive silent majority whose religion is utterly intertwined with dealing with adversity they were born into... and perpetuating it.
Thank you, Dabor! I think I feel why AA gets many female views. It is not typical for ex-Christian-atheist channels, if I may call it this way. I am sure GMS et al. have much more male views. On my Russian channel its approximately 80% to 20% in favor of male views. On this channel 92% males and only 8% females. But AA appeals to those suppressed under "very patriarchal", as you put it, framework. So, its understandable. Thanks for the comment.
Aladdin support hamas what do you mean...he's against ex Muslims now...unfortunately
@@Mujisu5102 I can guess what sort of channels YOU watch. He literally just flew home from Oslo where he was invited to speak at a huge ex-Muslim conference a few days ago. Citation Needed.
(Also I've literally had private conversations with him on the topic, and with many members of the community he has grown. And I'm Ashkenazi at that. Either you think he's the single stealthiest Hamas supporter ever, making cartoons of Mohammed just to throw us off his trail, or you're watching too much AP or Hassan Radwan (edit: I'm a dummy, meant to type Harris Sultan) with too much gullibility and not enough fact checking.)
@@Mujisu5102 I am Jewish (culturally, else I am an atheist) and I disagree with you, based on what I know of Aladdin.
@@Christoph399Women having more feeling and empathy is probably why we commit fewer crimes. No, if you listened to the video: women are less educated=they end up basing their opinions on hunches, feelings, and that's what religions capitalise on.
As women's education catches up, the number of women who are atheists does too.
There are TONS of non believers.. they just don’t come out..
Yeah. Because women are more sensitive to social judgement, they prefer to pretend a believer. This is it. The author simply want to blame white males entire video.😅
REligion is dying fast,,, THe 2 newsest fastest growing cults are The New Paganisms, and the New Nihilisms.
It's amazing that women are more religious than man. when churches are dominated by men and where women can be no more than nuns. however men can go up though the ranks to be priests. especially in this day and age women strive to much higher places in status. such as in employment, health professionals, and politics, and judges, and many other places of status. yet churches are hesitant to do this.
A study of history suggests religious leadership bodies are the most politically conservative organizations on the planet. These groups always resist societal changes the most, are the last to adapt to said changes, and they typically credit positive structural changes to the influence of their religion.
I'm an older working class woman with an average education. Like 3 of my female friends, I'm an an atheist but it's something we don't really discuss or find important. Living in Britain (3 of us are English, 1 Polish) it's not really an issue, you don't announce you are an atheist, you just get on with your life!
yes, most nonreligious people are simply indifferent to religion and never discuss it.
@@religiologEng too true.
I might discuss it but with people I know. That said, if asked in an interview I don't mind saying the absolute truth. If I lived in a more religious area, I think I would be far less likely to "rock the boat" and more likely to say "I'm with all these other people " just to keep them out of my business. Ah, appeasement... Doesn't it just... Suck.
in UK nobody minds. what does annoy is when you get cultists knocking at the door...
@@andyf4292 Same in France, Belgium, Germany, Switzerland, Italy, Spain, Scandinavia. Things are more comolicaetd in Russia. Putin's Russia hates atheists.
I live in a country with a strong tradition of people getting along peacefully regardless of their attitude to existence so I have no idea about the gender distribution among Danish atheists, and I couldn't care less.
thanks for sharing. Peace to Denmark.
Interesting! I cared little about it when I was young, studying and working in a (mostly male) scientific community where most people were atheist or at least agnostic. But when it came to dating and finding a partner, that was when I discovered the hard way that atheist women were few and far between in the UK.
@@anotherfreediver3639 I have a vague feeling that in the general population there has for generations been a likeness between Danes and the British nations in our attitudes to life. It would mean, that both genders tend to have an undramatic and undogmatic attitude, but with women leaning more towards spirituality.
All right, I see that I have to explain.
The secular women that seem to be missing largely identify as new age, neo-pagan or wiccan. In those communities there's a gender gap in the other direction.
Women tend to have suffered from misogynic discrimination and violence from an early age, leave their religion and look elsewhere.
Spiritual-but-not-religious communities are generally a place to heal emotionally, and many look forward when they recover. So they look at atheist and secular activist groups.
And are met by men talking among themselves about how they are inherently more intelligent, more rational, and how those pesky women keeps wanting to talk about social justice. Instead of just being an elitist group scoffing at religion while ignoring the real harm it does.
Men are less likely to suffer harm from patriarchal religion (still happens, definitely), and are more likely to deconvert for academic reasons. Women see the harm first, and is more concrete than the priest's rationalizations for doing said harm.
thank you, makes sense
Thank you, this is exactly my thoughts.
Interesting. But I do not really know men like the ones you describe.
I'm sure this is your experience, and likely many others. I'm not sure we're all quite so reactionary, though. Like many things, I find it's a spectrum. (then again, I was raised religious but not oppressively and not Christian, that likely makes a huge difference)
Atheist men definitely have their own brand of toxic misogynists among them (obligatory “not all”), but they tend to fall more along the lines of biological essentialist thinking rather than “Eve doomed mankind”.
It definitely has nothing to do with women in religions being denied birth control, education, jobs, and other rights that make it beyond difficult to be a woman and support yourself. Talk to a woman who survived being raised Mormon and you'll know all you need to know about why it is harder for women to leave religion.
for example?
@@religiologEng the fact I can't get my tunes tied and I'm not even religious.
Mercy Clinics in Missouri denied me my tubal because the people who own the clinics are catholic and think I should pop out as many kids as I can. Fun fact, my body doesnt want more babies either, I've had four miscarriages in the past year and a half and I'm almost 30 with a child. The ONLY reason they don't help me is because of THEIR religion. Freedom of Religion has been overstepping for years with overreaching policies that are borderline Christian. And this is not a Christian nation no matter how much yall pray and hope for it because it never was Christian and it'll never be Christian. Theocracy is beyond inhumane and is basically another form of a dictatorship. As someone who had to deconstruct from this religion themselves, growing up a young girl in church, I seen and heard it all. It was never about love or acceptance, it's all about control. God, then Husband, then wife, then children. The famous umbrella rule of Christianity literally outlines a hierarchy, in which women are not equal to men and children are even less so. Wake up and actually look at what you support, it's disgusting and overall does more harm than good.
Weird my long winded response got deleted
Its okay, I'm a woman I don't need right apparently. Deciding if I want to end my baby making days should be my decision alone, but thank to catholics in my state a doctor is unable to give me a tubal despite having health issues and already having a kid. Friendly reminder I'm not religious so idgaf what anyone's "god" thinks, it's my body and as an adult woman in her late 20s I'm not going to just quit having sex so I don't get pregnant. My partner of 5 years would probably hate that just as much as me, but apparently that doesn't matter
@@religiologEng It is much more difficult and risky for a woman to leave a religious community or family than for a man to leave. A woman is more likely than a man to be forced into marriage at a young age. It is then harder to leave because she has children and getting custody and supporting them will be difficult if she was never allowed to work or get an education. It is also risky for women to make it obvious they are leaving, physically stronger male relatives will attempt to restrain her. In many cultures the men don’t even have to use violence. Just the threat of being forced out of the house and the “protection” of the male members of the family is enough is societies where violence against women is prevalent.
Thank you so much for this video - I appreciate that you provided so many interesting resources. I feel very inspired to do more research on this subject ✨ This is a deeply personal topic for me, as the 1st in my family to openly reject religion and given how my religion demonized education particularly for young women such as myself. Without proper education (which I was mostly prevented from having in childhood), I might have remained religious. The thought terrifies me.
thank you for sharing your personal experience. glad you found the video inspirational.
Excellent. Another fantastic, informative video.
Glad you enjoyed it, Dr. Zuckerman!
I think the issue isn't in that religion contradicts basic freedoms. If one looks at the Scnadinavian model, one can observe that religion in those countries has been adjusted to the current values of the society; for example in Sweden women can not only preach, but take high ranking positions, and homosexuality is accepted as a normal part of life to a point that we can find a lesbian bishop who is married and has an adopted kid (Gerd Eva Cecilia Brunne). I think this demonstrates that religion is what we make of it, and if in some other countries people discriminate others under the guise of church, it's a question of the people in charge of the church in that particular country and the government, who not only do nothing to change that situation, but endorse it.
I mean, it took me a long time to finally become an atheist because of the shame and fear.
The first time I questioned God's existence I had a panic attack. It became easier with age.
I'd love an atheist to help me out with a question I have! To start with, I'm agnostic, but I'm agnostic specifically because I can't prove one way or another. Most atheists I've met say that their atheist because you can't prove that there's a God, but we can't prove that there's not. I love science and The idea of having a finite decision when it comes to something we can't prove one way or another doesn't seem scientific to me. This is all in good spirit, I'm just trying to understand different points of view. Thank you guys!
thanks for your questions. Many people use 'atheist' label for various reasons and various meanings. But the most common, i know of is that atheism is simply a lack of faith in a deity.
I've seen the defenitions people use for themselves vary a lot. I see atheism as "belief there is no god" and agnosticism "uncertain about or uncaring about whether there is one or not" I think many people specifically believe there is no god and aren't "militant atheists" that might insist everyone who has a belief in anything they can't see is idiotic. I find this particular approach not only annoying (as it often prostletyzes) but also fairly ironic, because these are the same people who believe in science for everything - science, which by definition, seeks to explain the unexplained. Human limitations also suggest it will never accomplish this mission, meaning some things will forever be unexplainable to humans, but making a hypothesis about something we know we can't prove... Is dumb? Mmm, no.
In my case it is weak atheism: absence of belief in any god.
You are referring to strong atheism: denying the existence of any god.
Agnosticism: says that has no knowledge about the existence or nonexistence of god.
It is also divided:
Weak agnosticism: does not know if knowledge about the existence or nonexistence of God can be achieved.
Strong agnosticism: believes that that knowledge is unattainable.
The weak variants do not require or should prove anything.
Keep in mind that both agnosticisms are compatible with weak atheism. That is, people can be both: atheists (weak) and agnostics (weak)
There are also labels for those who do not know the concept of a god. They are also included in weak atheism, but not in agnosticism. Since agnosticism is the intellectual position regarding the subject.
Agnostic is the more scientific position. There is currently no way to prove or disprove the existence of any deity, and therefore the lot of them are in the "dunno" box. Until someone does come up with a scientific test that would prove the existence or non-existence of one or more of the thousands of deities humans around the world have posited, we can safely ignore the lot, or believe in whatever we find useful to us, while knowing this belief has no basis in evidence.
This comment section is wild and it helps show why women don't identify as atheist, why would we? Atheists are here talking about how inferior and less intelligent we are, how emotional we are, how we are a lesser human, why would anyone want to associate with that?
Because of the atheist channels I watch nowadays, I have forgotten how anti-woman atheism spaces online often were and apparently still are.
I don't believe in any gods but I will stick to agnostic as a label.
thank you for sharing your pain here. It is really important for others to hear such perspective, and it is one of the reasons I decided to produce this video.
Just to be fair, I haven't watched the video yet. So basically, I wanted to ask where did you hear such horrendous things? As an atheist male, living in poland, I have never personally heard such claims on yt or anywhere else and I'm really curious why would anyone say such a thing? In my experience, atheism is all about logic and knowledge, which clearly state that, and this might be wild for some people, women and men are both humans (and are equal, just to clarify)
Honestly speaking here I haven't heard what you described here.
@@abdoolkareem_I believe OP is talking about the new atheist community. Those people are the worst. They don’t just hate women, they think science proves that they are genetically and intellectually superior to everyone. I think it’s a cultural thing more relevant in the US and the UK.
@@barbo866Just scroll the comment section, I have read all comments before I posted this one, as you go down it becomes super common (at least at the time I wrote the first comment) , there were multiple comments about this even though I'm paraphrasing so it may not seem as harsh as what I wrote, and as someone who is 32 and been on the Internet since I was 12, it's not a new phenomenon, even though nowadays is much better, being an atheist in real life isn't great either, I live in a 90% christian country, people don't feel confortable with non belief, they barely feel confortable with believe in other religions.
Here my take: I'm a western european woman and, as most people here, I'm atheist. But also here, women are easier attracted to spirtual stuff (astrology, soul-mate, life after death, etc.) than men.
When I tell women I believe in nothing spiritual, they often look at me as if I was an alien. Men are more like: "yeah... of course?"
Are there studies about it?
My girlfriend somewhat recently started believing in God, praying, etc. She doesn't call herself a Christian but believes Jesus was resurrected. She's a leftist politically, raised Catholic, but spent most of her life as an atheist. She showed me a sermon from a TH-cam channel called Elevation Church that offered nothing more than a basic protestant perspective, but she had never heard these ideas as she was raised at a Roman Catholic.
In contrast I spent most of my teenage years willingly going to a protestant church and hearing all the same ideas that changed her mind, only having my atheism cemented further.
I am glad that she finds some level of comfort and community in believing, but it genuinely bothers me that she believes in unproven omnipotent beings, resurrection, and the efficacy of intercessory prayer. I also feel like believing in heaven, though I'm sure comforting, is illogical. I believe that the eternal glory distorts a person's worldview, and influences people's decisions by taking the urgency out of your real life. Giving people fantastic ideas of what happens after death with no evidence is manipulative, just because it quells your fear of death and gives you the warm and fuzzies doesn't mean you should believe it.
This is a college educated leftist who went to art school, so I never really expected to have to deal with this. Any thoughts/advice from people who've been through something like this with their partner? Preferably something more substantial than "dump her"!
If anyone took the time to read this, thank you.
I may have not gone through something like this, but I think that if this girl is supposed to be your life partner and best friend, then you have to be able to express your concerns about this to her. If you haven't talked in depth about your atheist journey to her, then do that. I apologize if this doesn't seem helpful.
FFS, don't fight about it, as it may create a backfire effect. Go to that church and suss it out. If she is intelligent, she will recognise the BS.
Refrain from finding faults, even though they are apparent. Spend spare moments speaking to the more beautiful girls, and on the way home, be excited about going back.
When they ask for money during the offering, suggest that you and she give your entire weekly income, including the rent.
Get rid of the TV and other evil influences.
Instead of going out and wasting money on a coffee or a birthday gift, give an equal amount to the church, stay home, and read a wholesome book together.
If you must have coffee, get the cheapest crap, like the sweepings from the factory floor, or look in the neighbour's trash.
After all, the saviour will come at an unknown hour and take the goodies to heaven.
If you behave like a nutcase, you will not fit in with the crowd of hypocrites at that church.
If your true love is already a bit cracked, it might be time for you to become an apiarist - buzz off.
*. . . only having my atheism cemented further. . . .
I'm an atheist woman. Every person's story is different and their journey to atheism different as well. Idk if my story is uusal or not. But I've been atheist for most of my life as a young adult.
good to know. thanks
I'm from Africa and an atheist.... It's not easy over here identifying as one... But I chose to break the invisible chains as a young vibrant adult...
I never understood the appeal of religion. Even as a kid actively trying to believe in what was being preached, I still thought it was nothing more than a fairy tale. Aesop's fables. Stories with a moral you have to guess at because we don't live in those times and can't possibly gauge the morals of that time. I also never understood the subjugation of women and their willingness to believe in something that kept them subjugated in society.
I always argued that this is why so many depended on doing hellfire and brimstone sermons to kids. Those kids are that much easier to manipulate with mind tricks.
@@skylinefever
I believe there's an age thing with that. Something like 5-10 is the age they like to get kids so they can be brainwashed. I don't recall the exact numbers.
Im a male who was raised in an atheist household. My parents chose not to baptise me so I could find god in my own time. I never understood my peers in school in regards to their faith and neither did they at such a young age. I gained an interest in questioning religion very early on and concluded that I would remain an atheist.
Your reasons don’t really apply to Ireland. Religion and politics aren’t such taboo conversation topics. I was never told not to discuss religion. The difference that I’ve noticed between men and women is that men are more interested in discussing their religion and women aren’t as often.
Young men are becoming more conservative so this may shift.
Religion and Capitalism: the two worst fallacies oppressing humanity since their inception
💯
So is plan economy better?
We tried atheist/communism. It ended much much worse.
@@torturetuesday5191 um no it did not. Religion has killed hundreds of millions over the centuries while capitalism also tens of millions. See, you live in a first world nation where you benefit from capitalism (while being exploited) but have never lived in places where capitalism has ruined like the middle east, south and Central America, India, Philippines, native American lands.
@@torturetuesday5191 when? (Provide proof and sources)
As a Christian I like this data
thanks!
I suspect that the correlation between high social status and lack of religion is largely caused by the way that being more educated tends to be associated with both being of a higher privileged background and being less religious rather than the high social status itself causing people to be more likely to not be religious. I think if education was to be accounted for then the correlation between high social status and being unreligious would at least drastically decrease if not go away.
In general Medieval Kings had a much higher social status than Modern High School Students, yet it’s Modern Highschool Students who are less likely to be religious, because despite tending to be of a lower social status than Medieval Kings Modern High School Students tend to have more of an understanding of how the world works than a Medieval King. I know people in The Middle Ages knew more about how the world works than we often give them credit for, but their understanding was still a lot less than the understanding of most people living today.
I think if anything the patriarchal teachings of the Bible and the Koran would all else being equal make women more likely to leave the Jewish Religion, Christianity, and Islam, but I think being less educated tends to more than cancel out the effects of the patriarchal teachings on women being religious. Some religions and branches of a religion are very strict and teach a fire and brimstone message, and so if anything might just add more stress to the lives of people already stressed out by the struggles of being a marginalized group, but the effects of being less educated might cancel out the effects of the teachings of the religion on marginalized groups being religious.
I'm not sure it's quite that simple. Kings, much like rulers today, may believe what they want privately and we would probably never know, because religion was another avenue to power. Denying it would probably get you killed at the very least. It's more acceptable to be less religious in general, and it's expected that high school students are trying to find their own way, or "be angsty" as some might say who lack perspective. Besides, they have no power (and often no hope and no truth in school) to lose. Nobody cares what happens to teenagers, even though humans likely need the most guidance at that age. A king on the other hand can't maintain power without maintaining the appearance of religion basically always.
Science is also incredibly misogynistic. A lot of times reason/logic/science will be used as an antidote to religion, but when these are misogynistic, religion seems just as valid of an option.
I do get what you're saying in some sense, but have to point out that most religions are way more misogynistic than science could ever be
@@misslayer999yes, but religions have a bunch options, lots of women leave the patriarchal religions and go into more inclusive or matriarchal religions, there is a reason there are so many women going into paganism and new age, you can actually customise it.
Modern science is at best very biased. Almost all medical studies are done on young white men in their 20s or 30s. Where I grew up, autism help disappears as soon as you turn 13. (nevermind nobody was talking about it in my teens) and autism is one of many issues that have been noticed in men and dismissed in women. Black people often show as having too little vitamin D in blood tests because the metric for the available kind was set based on... White people. My husband's BMI is insane, but mountain people tend to be short and stocky, so not acceptable in Western beauty standards. He's all ribcage and tree trunk muscle legs. Yeah science is biased by money and all kinds of things... But it's not usually doctrine that women are the cause of all our suffering.
Also I watched a Netflix thing a while back about Adam and eve. Interesting story: not about the origins of humanity. At all. They were a king and queen of a city-state that was polytheistic and they wanted to stay that way so they could stay in power. The serpent crawling on the ground is not some devil, but a representation of angelic/ancestor-type spirits (represented by winged snakes) no longer being considered acceptable worship. This is a relic of when Jews became monotheistic, as well as some angry guys with women problems and all the pens.
@@bluester7177 right that's why I said most religions. Also I'm a neuroscience student, and I have yet to encounter any misogyny. Hell all of my professors are women and there's a growing trend of more and more women getting science degrees. Just because men have been more prevalent in the field in the past doesn't mean it has to stay that way forever. You can make the misogyny argument about a lot of things, but I don't think avoiding certain careers, interests or ways of life is the way to change that. Personally I love science and nobody is going to stop me from following my passion. People(both women and men) become atheists and go with science over religion because religion isnt real and they're sick of being fed bullshit mythology. Once you realize the truth, it's not something you can just unsee and ignore anymore
Anyone who listens to iq stuff is likely both atheist and closet racists. It's a thing. If humans are not divine they don't matter. Which is funny, they'll deny free will but not believe in a higher power. Greatest cognitive dissonance possible.
Wow, this was fascinating to watch, thank you
glad you enjoyed!
I was born in a relatively poor family in Ukraine, both my father and mother had pretty successful carriers, however my father eventually became more religious, specially after my sister was born, while my mom became more open about her atheism
thanks for sharing, I'm Ukrainian too
In India, where I live, I am a part of a club for atheists. Initially we didn't get many women. When we stopped filming our seminars and made that known the number of women just kept growing. Many women said openly that they will never tell their parents, partners or in-laws cz they won't be accepted and be seen as a "bad influence" or an "immoral woman". There are many religious people still cz religion has become intertwined with nationalism so it is now somehow more complicated but I think in my country at least there are many atheist women but it's been hard to get them out of their closets.
Very interesting! Thanks for sharing! Are they and overall people in the club mainly deconverting from Hinduism or from other religions?
I have had many atheist, they also shared the same reasons but once they came out no one in their family really cared. And I have seen this in a lot of Hindu families.
I'm a woman who was raised Catholic but when I look back.. never actually believed any of the religion part. Though I've never been able to shake my deistic god belief. I think it's less of a 'belief' in a god but more of a 'hope' that something started all this & is watching. So I consider myself an Agnostic Deist. Atheist, to me, suggests someone actively does not want a god to exist.
thanks for sharing this observations. But what makes you believe that atheist "suggests someone actively does not want a god to exist." but someone who simply lacks belief in god?
@@religiologEng It doesn't always. I didn't mean to imply _all_ atheists share that mindset. It's just that a lot of very vocal atheists seem to & look down on theists, deists & pantheists.
It's always the ones that shout the loudest, isn't it?
@@elenamariatudela56 Yeah. I think it kind of contradicts the idea of skepticism that most atheists proudly proclaim. Some practically declare there isn't any kind of god, which is absurd & kinda arrogant given how vague & varied the idea of a god could be.
Why are atheists so obsessed with trying to prove something they believe doesn't exist like God? Why does it bother Ya'll so much on what people choose to believe
Your videos are fascinating. Keep up the great work.
Glad you like them!
This French-based history is significant in the origin of anti-French sentiment & fundamentalist Christianity in early 1900’s American social history. Great video!
thank you!
In that case, proud to be French!!
@@christopherhamilton3621 weird, I’ve never heard of the anti-French sentiment in 1900-1930s. Anti-Italian and anti-Asian, and anti-German, yes but not anti-French.
12:57 SO DAMN TRUE. I've met many atheist men that out loudly state their atheism and no one gives a sheet, but I say I'm atheist too and now the same people that didn't bat an eye at the man at my side that said the same, now question my morals, my inteligence, how can I ever be a good person, etc.
Thank you very much for an informative video. It was very interesting to me
Glad you enjoyed it!
Fascinating video, but I'd like to challenge this idea that all societies in the past relied on strict forms of patriarchy to ensure stability and continuity. This is far from the case. Even in Europe, women's access to rights like divorce, inheritance, and property varied widely from country to country, and in different time periods (including the 1,000 years that comprise the Middle Ages.) You expand beyond Europe, and the diversity is even greater. This claim of the past as men always being in complete control of women is another form of oppression and erasure.
as a religious person myself I am often lonely and find myself turning to the spirit world for company.
understandable
As an atheist man of 50, I'll just add that true atheism isn't a choice a person makes. It's the only worldview that makes sense to a critically thinking person. One can hide one's worldview by pretending to believe in the divine and supernatural, as I'm sure many past men and women did out of fear for their safety. Neat upload, cheers!
I think this is because in many societies because of patriarchy woman are socialized to not study hard science
but instead study subjects related to humanities or soft science. Thats why they are unlikely to question
superstitions of religious books. Its simply due to lack of education opportunity for woman.
I also think that woman are socialized to accept authority more and men are more encouraged to be rebellious, encouraging men to question authority like religions
I have never "researched" it, but I have often discussed theological ideas on a casual level (it's not about discovering the truth but about knowing what others think)
Being many atheists in my circle I think it is a topic with almost no risk of hurting sensibilities.
I think there are many axes or dimensions to consider in the effects that adopting the beliefs of typical religions implies:
1. Distribution of resources, responsibilities, blame, benefits, status, etc.
In total or net terms: The woman is the beneficiary and the man is the contributor.
That is, Christianity is calibrated to protect women. It tries to equalize the advantages or comforts of men in terms of superior strength and low reproductive investment.
(I'm not saying that it's a bad thing, just that it's quite one-sided)
2. The predominant religions are intensely collectivist. This is closer to the social behavior of women.
3. The predisposition of women towards emotional and sentimental experiences; It is more compatible with religious rites in general.
The analytical predisposition of men is not.
4. Women are more socialized in almost any culture. That is, they are raised with greater emotional and group experiences.
Expectations of strength and the corresponding experiences are placed on men.
5. Churches are quite crude in terms of: blaming men and pampering women.
6. Victimhood is a key part of MANY ideologies. Female physical weakness gives them the profile compatible with victimhood. Then, women tend more to choose codes of conduct or values that favor them.
(I am not saying that they are false victims. Whether or not they are, the system is compatible and beneficial to them)
----
Keep in mind that these items are not exclusive to theism. In general, they are the characteristics of a code created by or for the taste of the weak. And I repeat, it is not that everything is bad, but that it is inclined to help the weak at the expense of the strong; And the main problem of the strong with this matter is that they generally have no debt towards the beneficiary.
7. For women, the price of rejecting groups in their environment is much higher.
Men can get by without belonging to a group as much. But women have fewer options outside groups.
Keep in mind, religious groups are quite hostile and women are more vulnerable.
8. Women are very good at weighing benefits and costs. But not on a conscious level.
That is, they tend to choose good options. But still, they are dissatisfied and believe themselves to be victims.
9. Women really like supernatural ideas.
If we were to measure beliefs in supernatural things beyond binary options (believe or don't believe) we would find that women are much more intense about their respective religions or superstitions.
10. Religions are designed for those who suffer and find no material solution. Men have more material solutions.
It is easy to believe in future rewards for the sufferings that are forced on them today. So much so that many forget that they are not choosing the suffering but that it was their only path. There is no virtue in those supposed sacrifices because they were not voluntary.
This is not just about true victimhood, as in previous points. But it is the next level: false self-sacrifice.
looking forward to the video about the atheistic women etc. :)
Thank you! I hope you watched my previous videos
Before watching this video, my guess would be that it's probably cultural.
Now let's see...
I'll be glad to hear your feedback afterwards
Religion is a crux for those downtrodden.
Because many women can of course use logics, but prefer not to do it. Emotions, feelings,are more important for them. Having said that, there are plenty of women with a successfull career in stem. Furthermore, many women are still oppressed especuslly in some poor countries, and religion help them in bearing a difficult life.
The congregation’s are a social group and women get more involved in the group activities of their society. Simple, end of story.
Excellent video
Thanks, Drew!
Nice video, well thought through. Since I'm a man and I don't recall witnessing it, I'm curious about the specific forms that stigma against women takes when they leave the religious fold or defy other cultural norms. Perhaps the upcoming video you mentioned will satisfy me on that count.
thank you! I hope it will.
@@Ringcaat As a two-gender female, I nearly got disowned by my family for coming out as both queer and atheist. Only recently have I been allowed back into the fold due to my "rediscovering" of spirituality (i.e. a lakeshore trip gave me ego death and spiritual awakening shenanigans). Only... that spirituality isn't what my family THINKS it is lol. I'm more of a spiritual hermeticist with gnostic leanings. I doubt they know what Hermeticism even is, but Gnosticism is SACRILEDGE for Christians lol.
Being called a slut without morals and having men think you will sleep with them is one issue I have noticed.
@@idk-ill-figure-smn-out Interesting - thanks for sharing! I'm afraid I don't know what a two-gender female is.
On first glance, gnosticism makes more sense than modern Christian representation of dualism with Satan being somehow equal to a god who doesn't seem to care about that particular problem. Then again many modern Christians have no idea what they are talking about, sooo
Also aggressive men willing to subjugate women and others will be attracted to religion to maintain structures of oppression, even if they don't really believe in the spiritual or supernatural.
Chiming in as an agnostic woman: seeing as religious systems have failed my gender the world over, and that many of their care functions have been subsumed by different organizations and experiences (e.g. food banks, nursing homes, hospitals, the awe from nature), it's been difficult for me to see religion as true or faith as beneficial to my life. Does it help if it's the same people over and over? Maybe.
Might it be because I'm neurodivergent and can't really imagine a sentient being playing with us like poker chips? Maybe. But if the poker chips are
Also, a combination of psychotherapy and learning about stochastic processes has helped me come to terms with bad things happening and how to make the best of them. Witnessing our own human processes have godlike power (as a collective) and awe fulfills the endorphin generating niche as well.
Regarding social consequences - OH BOY. I can't exactly tell my fellow South Asian diaspora friends that I'm atheist. In fact, the stereotype of India being particularly spiritual checks out because of the marked lack of people who identify as agnostic or atheist because they grew up with particular faith traditions and those are reinforced in public or school holidays (especially Hindu).
I'm the kind of atheist that's the patriarchy's worst nightmare: overeducated, overthinking, overweening atheist cat lady.
Excellent topic.
thank you!
Even here in muslims majority countries more ex muslims men than women ,more athiests men than women (not based on actual statistics because that s forbidden in muslims countries but what i noticed from my social life/ lives (and believe me when i say i watch many ))
It's probably pretty true anywhere that women are less likely to be open about it, or even open to questioning religion, for fear that they may be ostracized. Basically anywhere patriarchy can be found, which is almost everywhere.
@@elenamariatudela56 one factor for sure 👍
But on the internet they can hide their ids and they can watch same shows as men in fact they have even bigger motivation (this is why i don't believe it s the only factor also it s bad where i m from for both ☠️ but more for females no doubts )
@@elenamariatudela56
May be in a sense of how they were raised vs how men were raised which is still patriarchy (if this what u meant it s huge factor)(quran says :" they r deficient in intelligence and religion " imagine society that believes in this how can they raise both to be equally smart and responsible?
@@elenamariatudela56
If u mean in a sense of how they were raised to be expected to be less than men then u r correct it s huge factor. I wrote another huge comment but TH-cam deleted it , even though i quoted what coran says and they believe in coran not me !
@@elenamariatudela56 men are more skeptical and irreverent.
I'm very confused about the opening bit about the Olympics. Women couldn't participate until the Paris Olympic games in the 20th century... so the second modern Olympics.
That's actually quite early if you understand the historical context.
"A spiritual women is the greatest threat
To the status quo
The fruits she will bear
The power she has access to" Jah9
what is Jah9?
@@religiologEng A musician. This is a quote from her song "Greatest Threat To The Status Quo".
*woman
Spiritual isn't real
excellent! This was very useful!
glad it helped
So What I'm hearing as around 6:45-7:00 on, it sounds like a lot of the freethinking women have been ignored in part because Atheism has been a male-centered belief system.
Probably also true. There are women in philosophy too, and some of them really freaking important. And I can't remember their names. Not a one. But you can't help but find white male philosophers, only partly because there are more of them.
Granted, culture and politics still play a large role in this. E.g. my mother's side of the family grew up in East Germany, before, during, and after the Cold War.
My grandparents left the church, and my mother, uncle, and me have been atheist all our life and continue to do so after re-unification.
While the wide-spread employment of East German women started out of necessity, it informed how these people thought of themselves, making atheism or "being non-denominational" the standard for East German women to this very day.
religion is more of a social/emotional thing. women are more attuned to environmental cues. they can see when another woman is giving them a dirty look but this also means they read things into nature that aren't really there. plus people like the idea that that have a sky daddy that loves and is looking after them - nobody wants to admit they're all alone and their life means absolutely nothing. western women are abandoning religion but they're adopting things like 'manifesting' which is still magical thinking but without the nasty bronze age gods.
Manifesting sounds so much like both BS corporate motivational slogans, and the stuff megachurch holy men talk about.
I hate the corporate motivational industry with a passion.
The Olympic Games were only revived at the very end of the 19th century. Alleging women weren't allowed to compete until the 20th century is misleading. True, the original Olympic games of ancient Greece were unisex. But I believe women had their own games.
Im a women and Im non religious
thank you for sharing!
The data on this video would benefit from cross-examination with data about how young men/women are currently doing.
Considering trends in educational and economic performance, the numbers shown at 16:50 make a lot of sense.
thank you for the suggestion
Can I ask you what made you feel the need to make a video on this topic? Some significant event that was going on during that time, personal relationships, inspiration from another TH-camr's video? What was it?
thanks for the question. I am a scholar with research focus on nonreligion and I teach History of Atheism in colleges.
@@religiologEng That's cool. I wanted to know what made you choose this topic at this time. You could have chosen any. What lead you to choose this one?
As an Atheist, I'm offended, I can't take communion.
I guess you would say I am a agnostic woman. I don't think I found enough evidence to prove for or against God, but I question most religions and find humans to be odd, so I study them both.
Systems of control don’t work unless they are directed at the people who need to be controlled. I have a strong feeling that this is why so many Black Americans are so religious. That said, religion is also great for organizing a community and keeping it cohesive against adversity. Women would benefit from a tight social network as much as former slaves would.
Edit: I am saying all this as a Black atheist. I can’t speak for women, I have never been one, but I do have some insight into the Black community
❤
I know many conservatives who would be triggered to find out these stats
yes, indeed
How? I'm atheist and a conservative. I'm anti islamic immigration.
Or just skeptical as whether the statistics were determined from scientific surveys instead of populism factories.
In my experience, women generally aren’t deeply concerned with religious or atheistic ideologies. Instead, they tend to follow societal norms and expectations. They are pragmatic by nature, prioritizing what works best for them in a given context.
i'm atheist woman and ex-Muslim, yeah is not surprising to a women leave this religion but It was different for me. The reasons for leaving this religion were different from what is commonly believed, which is also what allowed me to take the position of atheism specifically. Just the atheist arguments of an arrogant white man and its comprehension were enough. I was accepting of the social status that the beliefs of this religion presented for me , religion in a way, protected the lower classes of society, including women, so there was no need to reject it as long as it provided organization and security for us .
Thanks for sharing your unusual experience
Could you explain in more detail? I'd really love more context!
I think what made me hate god and become an atheistic girl in the future was the fact that my mom forced me to pray whenever I did anything wrong, and also because she would always scold me for going straight to my tablet, cellphone or computer after church cause that meant I was disrespecting god. So yeah, I was able to overcome these statistics through My Little Pony and Papa's Pizzeria
Religion does no favors to women.
Bro most college graduates are women, wdym
Also, I kept watching, and your distinction between existential and social risk is flawed, since humans are weak and can’t survive on their own, so in the past being excluded from your community e.g. tribe meant certain death, so it would be more correct to say that social risk is a subcategory of existential risk, which validates the male/female risk relation you were going against
(To clarify, I’m not saying there’s existential consequences to being rejected from a group nowadays, just that it’s been this way for most of history, so that’s how the brain perceives it)
Well, the two most prominent atheists in America (in the mid to late 20th centuries) -- Madelyn O'Hair and Ayn Rand -- were both women.
Ayn rand capitalism won't be palatable to liberals
Those women are not exactly favored these days. O'Hair begrudged feminism and denied the extent of decimation of Jewish people during WWII, and it's now cool to hate Ayn Rand because she was against government sponsored altruism in the form of socialism and communism.
I was just talking about this with my mother the other day. Not in terms of atheism.
Majority of my friends have always been Hindu and it's common for Hindus to stop eating meat when its a festival or during the month of Shravan. We as Buddhists observe that too during our festivals but not as strictly as others. There are days assigned to specific gods and according to their belief they will not eat meat on that day, I never observed that. But I always noticed how the boys in my group didn't really care about it all. If they feel like eating meat, they will, if not then not. They never justified them not eating meat due to religious reasons but the girls always did. I ate whatever my friends ate but it was always in the back of my mind how women are so much more strict about following certain things due to religious reasons than men.
Yeah cos women are more fearful in general.
For yourself, let me tell you, gods aren't real. Live your life
I think the opening argument is anachronistic. Most women in the developed world today never experienced issues with passports or bank accounts, these are abstract stories from their grandmothers. Moreover most college graduates are women and have been now for decades. I think it's infantilizing to insist that women are religious out of ignorance, fear, or social pressure. The religious women I have known in my life have been nothing like that. Why is it when men are religious it's genuine agency but when women are religious it's some product of society? To me it seems like in trying not to be sexist you're just being sexist in a different way. Maybe the best way to not be sexist is simply *believe women* when they tell you they find value in religion and stop projecting on them.
Thanks for bringing up these points. I believe that the researchers whose works I reference have considered these assumptions.
Interesting argument, but men invented religion as an arm of patriarchy, so perhaps this is why religious women are not seen as having agency.
Unless you conduct a critical analysis of the research papers you cite, believing that they made considerations for such studies doesn't leave much confidence in people who truly do care about the scientific method.
The amazing thing is people who think they are smarter than people of faith out of some imagined mental superiority. The creator of this video need not worry that his vast intelligence has held him back.
Wow, another argument that atheism is for midwits.
I hope it’s only older women.
People simply assume I'm religious because they see it as part of my inherited identity. Not one person asked me what I thought while I was growing up. Even my parents would each still say I belong to their religions, which are not the same, because they never listened to me. There are probably far more non-religious girls and women than people will ever know.