I own a 2011 rav4 and my wife has a 2013 rav4 for our every day drivers. Never had any issue going anywhere in the snow. If it gets too bad I get in the Tacoma.
I have 10 years of technical off road experience in all Toyota SUV's. We recently bought a 2016 Rav4 for my wife. It's 2WD with the electronic LSD. This video does no justice for the general capabilities of the Rav4 which did extremely well its first year in the 2wd Rally National Championship. Anyone with common sense knows a high psi road tire on an incline with slick surface is going to break traction and slide around. With no momentum to carry you over this demo might as well be "16 year old girl gets stuck driving on a wet surface incline." This is a cross over not a body on frame 4runner locked with ATRAC. I've climbed steeper hills going to Road Atlanta in ours on wet surfaces with zero issues. Take into account that this drive-train is bullet proof and what it designed to do is get you home in most driving conditions within reason. You have to know how the vehicle operates to bring out its strengths. Momentum is your friend
The people are sad because most of the folks like the RAV4 - it's just a liittle bit more offroad capabilities would make this a dream car. I would be pretty happy if there was an offroad button which enhances its capabilities - e.g. apply brake on the spinning wheel so that it simulates the missing locking of the front or rear differential. In my honest opinion toyota is missing a small suv with bigger offroad capabilities like the suzuki jimny or the vitara, lada niva etc. I understand that they are not meant to be offroad vehicles, but at least they could improve their 4x4 performance.
I just bought a 2015 RAV4 AWD. My gravel driveway is steeper than the hill shown giving this RAV4 such a difficult time...yet I drive it daily with no issues. Go figure.
I have a 14' It's all about the tires! I had problems with mine climbing the basic hills with stock tires, but after a new set of tires it goes everywhere and I truly mean everywhere! The best part of owning a Rav4 is I don't belong to the smugeru club!
I really love how you are doing reviews on "practical" vehicles - meaning cars that the majority or persons would buy. keep up the good work. very informative btw
I own a 2015 one(pretty much the same aside from looks), it performs wonderfully in the snow up here in the tri state area, and is pretty good all around. It never disappointed me.
Agree, I have drove my 2014 through mountain passes, knee deep snow and icy roads. Up and down fire roads with steeper inclines, you will catch some spinning at times, but when I replaced my tires with better M&S tires, that dramatically made a difference. Crossovers aren't made for off roading, I know a lot of Subaru owners like to pretend they go off roading in their forester, but I use an older Chevy 4WD pick up for mud, rocks and actual off road work, for camping and hiking trips. I have yet to see any Subaru's in these areas ever, from the lower desert of Ca. to up here in the PNW. I generally see most of them parked next to my daily driver, the Rav 4 at Trader Joes and Whole Paycheck or up in the parking lot at the ski resorts. To each and their own, I like the Rav, it runs like a clock, low maintenance and has yet to not get through snowy passes.
basically you've done all the car explanations. i dont even know what EE haven't explained yet! and now you're only uploading car reviews but thats okay for me :)
guys I didn't see how nobody caught on to the traction control comment. you can completely disable all traction control by pressing and holding the traction button for about 10 seconds while parked. I love this feature especially in the winter. note that abs cannot be disabled while traction control can be disabled.
I have almost the same exact car (2016 AWD LE) and I’ve been taking it off-roading for years. On much more nasty hills than this. Maybe it’s the rain that made it too slick but it was surprising to see this Rav not be able to handle. Mine is extremely capable.
Good review! In all fairness these "off road" scenarios are actually what hikers experience going to trail heads and finding camp sites especially in the north west where it rains and snows even when it's not winter. The lack of ground clearance is my concern yet I still think with better tires this could be improved for a camping rig. The Tacoma could be a better choice but it's harder to park in the city and gets less mpg.... All things to consider if you live in the north west or for any city dweller in a mountain state. IMO
Hrm. For getting around in the snow on public roads, the RAV does just fine. Choose between a Toyota or a Subaru ? OMG, the Toyota any day ! I will take world renowned reliability over a car that is known for it's engine rumble.
My Rav 4 is incredible for winter. We had about 30 cm of snow in Canada. And I was able to riflle through the snow. Not bad for what it is. Nothing like a 4 runner or FJ, but pretty decent. This is not an offroader.
I love these review videos! They tend to be in line with other online/magazine reviews I read for the same vehicles, and having the narrated visuals really adds to the information. My folks are tentatively looking for a new SUV, and since your test areas resemble an area they visit often, these have been great to pass along. :)
Very good review, good job. Better than many magazines. I own a SUV and I have seen lot of videos before I buy it ... and it is not easy to get a good 4WD system in a midium size SUV. That hill should not be an obstacle.
great video, sad results though. I was thinking about recommending this car actually for my mom. I was already going to have to argue the interior but not anymore. thanks for the info!
+FrederickGFX no but she won't drive anything without 4 wheel drive, just how she is. I wanted her to drive something smaller since she's starting to not drive well and she's in a larger 4runner
That middle seat belt storage is neat, there's the same kind in my 2007 fit, really practical. My friends got their RAV4 In hybrid. They like it, they have a good commute so it's good on the fuel. It was expensive, but they only needed one car they sold their Honda fit and Matrix for it. They bought it in the right colour! a really nice blue.
I'm torn between the Rav4, Forester, and CX-5, any suggestions? I like the idea of being off road capable but I live in Orange County and would be doing city driving 99% of the time.
Which car would you suggest in the same price range but with better off-road capabilities. Ground clearance is an important factor for me, as well as storage. Thanks!
My mother recently bought a 2015 fully loaded Rav4 and I personally don't care for them. It's a nice well built cross over. For the same money you can buy a Subaru Forrester which would be more practical.
+MavHunter20XX Well my mom uses her Rav4 for physical therapy home visits. So she drives about 40,000 miles a year all over the rural area we live in. So far it has been excellent in the snow and on gravel/dirt roads. Some of the gravel roads are washed out so the slightly higher clearance it has compared to a car is a plus. As long as decent tires are on it, the Rav4 should have excellent performance for a cross over.
My wife and I have 2010 rav4 with the v6 awd. I really like it. The v6 puts out 270 hp. But we use it as it was intended. My wife doesn't offroad, it sees very snow and icey roads. It drives like a car, comfortable and quiet.
Great review of the Rav 4 AWD. Your test specifically targeted the lack of traction that could occur in certain "real world" scenarios like driving over snow drifts or when the snow plows do a half-ass job in your neighborhood. The viewers need to watch the LEFT-REAR tire spin along with the RIGHT-FRONT tire. Not too many reviewers test the AWD capability thoroughly which leaves many buyers to base their purchase on style, the marketing hype and adventurous background scenes the vehicles are set up for the photo shoot. If the RAV 4 AWD cannot drive over that small gravel hump in the road I can picture plenty of frustrated or embarassed owners.
a. ggrex - and how many times do you plan to pull up on a steep hill, stop, then try pulling out? I have a traction video with a twisted suspension test in a 2013 RAV4 that has good tires suited for the conditions that does well with what I do in the 2 videos. how many times will you stop in a snow drift just to see if you get stuck or not? ability, "common sense," and the right tires are the 3 main keys. I have never been pulled out of any situation, but I have pulled other vehicles out of the snow. ✌
Getting stuck in traffic on a snowy soft bank or hill or having a pedestrian busy texting walk across are a few ways way anyone could be forced to stop midway up a snowy hill. The RAV4 AWD capability s clearly limited as demonstrated on your video. Again good video and technique but no RAV4me.
a. ggrex limited and demonstrated? please explain. all it did was spin until the ECU learned what to do. my video also clearly proved that the right tires makes a huge difference as well. if the AWD system was that bad, I would never have made it across that "twist" ditch. I stopped, then I proceeded to pull out. when the ECU took over, as demonstrated in my video, the spinning stopped and I was able to pull out. my aunt's 2012 Legacy never made it up a small embankment in my driveway, but both of my RAV4's made it.
a. ggrex all the scenarios you mentioned, I've been there. what are you wanting to do, run summer tires in the snow? I live in the mountains, I know hills and steep streets. I also know snow drifts. I've never been stuck in any situation in either of my 2 RAV4'S. If you don't buy a RAV4, I respect that, that's totally your opinion and your right, but unless you own one and buy good tires suited for the conditions, don't knock it based off of this video. the ECU has to learn, and staying steady on the gas as I demonstrated in my video, is exactly what you have to do. A Subaru is the same way..they spin for a bit before realizing what's needed..
This is never meant to go off road like this. The awd is for wet/snowy roads and maybe towing a caravan on/off a muddy field. If you want a small off roader the Jimny is your guy. Still stuck in the 80s, but a mountain goat non the less. Also a panda 4x4 is a good Billy goat.
The little gravel mound is good test. We ran into similar situation at a ski area parking lot, bumper to bumper backup, wet icy unpaved road needing to get over a small icy mound. Our little Rav4 failed to get over it. We had to ask the guy behind to give some space to build up speed.
Hey Jason! Very nice video again! But can i (Audio Engineer) a little adive? You should do a little Low-Cut Filter on the audio track :) My subwoofer is killing me hehe
It really irritates me how the Rav4 and CR-V are considered SUVs to any degree. They're nothing more than slightly elevated hatchbacks with AWD. There are other crossovers that are actually capable of off-roading.
+Peter Schmidt Well, consider this. The I gen RAV4 pretty much was the very first SUV: small unibody 4x4, using engine from regular car with pretty surprising offroad capabilities. I don't really like what these cars have become either, but there we go, that's the kind of cars people are willing to buy nowadays.
People take SUV's off-road? Wranglers and older Cherokees and maybe an FJ cruiser/4runner, sure....every other SUV driver doesn't do anything more hard core than an unpaved road. When you actually go offroad, you see almost entirely pickup trucks.
Nice seats, but not sure why anyone would select this over the Subaru Forester. I get 32mpg hwy with 250hp and 258 torque. Eyesight system and 8.7 inches of ground clearance. For approximately the same price as a well equipped Rav
50/50 split is not the same as 50% of the torque to the rear axle. 50/50 is total axle biasing (locked) which allows 100% of torque to go to either axle, where 50% means no more than 50% will go to the rear axle. The current RAV4 does not allow for 100% rear axle torque even though it has a "center diff lock" button that simply energizes the center clutch to its slip limit (50%)
If the "centre" diff locks up, the torque distrubution could be 100%-0% or 0%-100% depending on the coeficient of friction in each axel. Only an open diff can distribute 50%-50%. As per your first videos.
@@starsky8351 I was talking about actually having a transfer case and actual 4wd system and not the chassis, which suv has a ladder frame, besides the jimny?
honestly, loose gravel and stock touring tires that come on this are not good for anything but road driving. I have a 2014 XLE, my drive way in CA. was hard packed dirt and slick, 3 times the length of this hill and a bit steeper. I never once had an issue driving up or backing up it and out into the street. Even our Golf TSI went up and down it with sport tires and though it would spin , you just gave a bit of gas and up you went. The Rav system triggers the opposite corner wheel when one spins, not as strong imo as Subaru's system but I can say I have drove this Rav up these types of fire roads, open BLM territory , on the beach and in snow and ice in the mountains. Recently here in the PNW in recent snow/sleet storms and it works just fine. I have yet to get it stuck but I am also not out rock crawling or trying to go off roading in a crossover.
Forester: better AWD system, better ground clearance, better MPG, larger rear window, larger quarter windows, better overall visibility. I'm not sure if the CVT makes that much of a difference, but how can the Forester rate better MPG with a more aggressive AWD system and higher ground clearance? I think Toyota builds great cars, but I think they've dropped the ball a bit with the Rav4. I would argue that the Rav4 is a better looking CUV than the Forester, but the Forester is a much more practical vehicle. What the Forester is giving up with "style," it is gaining in best-in-class outward visibility. Also, every winter condition test I've seen, such as Consumer Report's snowy Rav4/CRV/Forester comparison, the Forester handles better in low traction situations.
Armando Gonzalez, Subaru used to manufacture their blocks open deck, which contributed to the head gasket problem. They now use semi-closed deck, which will alleviate the problem. As for oil consumption, that is a result of using a boxer engine. There are benefits to a boxer engine, and there are drawbacks; oil consumption is a potential drawback. I think the RAV4 is a great car, as is the CX5 and CRV. Lot's of great CUV's out there, but, for me, I'd chose the vehicle with best in-class AWD, ground clearance, safety, and outward visibility; albeit even if I have to occasionally add oil. For the record, with 140,000 miles on my clock, I haven't added a drop of oil to my 2015 Forester. Knock on wood.
+Joe Zhang The Hybrid has less power to the rear wheels (67hp max), vs 87hp for the gas model. Mind you the Hybrid does have more HP overall, so that might make a difference in situations where the front wheels have grip. The Hybrid is also heavier, due to the batteries, which may or may not be helpful depending on the situation.
Going in reverse over that little hill and not locking the center diff might have improved the RAV4's capability. Even more if there was a lock-out to prevent sending power to the rear wheels.
Most people have no idea how TRAC works (traction control) which is Toyota's fault. In order for the TRAC to work you must not brake and you have to give it gas and leave it there (turning the wheels helps). You can see the TRAC trying to work by breaking the spinning tires (the ft rt and lt rr). Disabling TRAC is the WRONG thing to do as you can see the spinning tires do not brake at all. However, what appears wrong is that in a traditional 4WD system, braking the opposite tire should deliver power to the opposite tire and we don't see that (the rr tire). I don't know if giving the TRAC more time to work would have helped.
This is the second review of a car labelled AWD that is really two wheel drive (one in the front and one in the back). Not sure manufacturers should be stamping vehicles with open diffs as AWD.
+Mikey C Mikey, you're addressing a commercial naming convention that has been bad for nearly TWENTY YEARS now. Unfortunately, it is commonly accept that AWD implicitly identifies any vehicle that *can* supply power to all [four] wheels. The convention you mean is rather referred to as 4WD, to distinguish it. It sucks. But AWD, as it is used, means exactly what this video shows and the vehicles that claim it. Locking AWD is another subject, and we really should have made some sort of legislation *years ago* to enforce identifying the difference, for consumers.
+Engineering Explained Question for ya! There is no denying this is AWD but it does seem a rather poor execution of one. Any idea why we just saw the front wheels spinning and the rears do nothing when you tried to go up that hill despite it being center locked?
+Kamil Bernatowicz I'll answer for EE - for starters "locked 50:50" configuration means is that 50% is sent front and 50% is sent rear. What you need to understand is that even though front and rear are seeing the same amount of torque, they are not experiencing the same terrain, and more importantly external forces and traction scenario. This means that when accelerating or ascending the front wheels will have less grip than the rears, under deceleration and descending the rears will have less grip. Further issues affecting this vehicle is that the Rav4 has open differentials front and rear, which means that even though there is a 50:50 front:rear the further limiting factor is the open differentials; meaning between one and three wheels can spin without the vehicle making any progress due to a lack of ability to put power down. The only way for that Rav4 to crawl up that hill on stock tires would be for a 50:50 locked center diff AND locked front & rear diffs - with that configuration if one wheel has traction (and the axle holds out) the vehicle will crawl. If my explanation did not satify, or was not clear enough, I believe EE has previously done an AWD system explanation video which admittedly does a better job than I have. Anecdotal, I have a 2006 WRX which is full time locked 50:50 F:R with a LSD in the rear and open diff in the front - under dry conditions with heavy acceleration I routinely experience front wheel spin, in wet/snow I can force the car to rotate where the rear tires will spin and the fronts will not. bonus fact, my WRX came from the factory with 6.3" of ground clearance; way to use the "crossover" designation to help your CAFE rating Toyota.
I wish reviewers would just say it like it is, this car can not go "off-road". Like he said most people interested in this car would not be interested in leaving the city so why beat around the bush and say that it's an ok off-road vehicle but there are better ones. He was driving on a very nice dirt road by the way and the hill wasn't very steep.
+tonytypes right, and with 2 open diff front and back and seemingly very crappy traction management... It sucks. I'm not saying it should have torsens front and back but at least brake ediff....
If you haven't, you should have tried to turn off rear axel lock for the reverse hill ascent. In theory it should have sent 100% power to the front, and you wouldn't have had rear wheel slip.
To disable any toyota traction control, if you dont see it, car off, hand brake up start car depress brake 2 times brake brake (hold 2nd brake while doing next step) handbrake down, up, down, up release brake and depress brake 2 more times
Thanks for the review. Can you or anyone else please explain to me why and how come the rear wheels doesn't spin or move when the front wheel does, considering it is all-wheel-drive? This doesn't seem any better than regular front-wheel-drive, or am I missing some vital facts here?
+Christoffer Lundgren Probably doesn't direct as much power to the rear wheels as it should in those conditions. Also, the front and rear differentials don't have any limited slip, so if the wheel on one side starts slipping it will just spin that wheel.
+Engineering Explained Thanks, now I noticed. If there would have been a locking differential, both wheels would have turned, right? Would that have made it possible to pass in low speed as well?
Have you had a chance to actually engage the abs? If so, did you find it to be rather rough as in like the front end was going to jump off the vehicle? Well maybe not that severe but rougher than any other vehicle that you driven?
Subaru already got that covered with all models running symmetrical AWD. Toyota is too commercial to offer awd in every model. They will lose money and not be able to charge it as a premium upgrade.
it's the tires. if the spinning tires have no tread for the conditions, then how can they hook up? I own a 2010 and 2013, both AWD, and I have not been stuck yet. we have had several snows well over 16" to 24" and believe me, they went.
2010V6RAV4 No. It's the AWD system. If all 4 wheels are spinning, and the car is still not moving, then it's the tires, but if the front wheels slip and the rear wheels fail to engage appropriately, then it's obviously a poor AWD system at fault.
no. it's the tires. they have no grip. if the tires that were spinning were fit for the conditions, which they are not, and this guy had a bit more momentum to go along with it, the car would go. it's like wearing dance shoes on a slippery slope..the best dancer couldn't perform to their potential without the right shoes.. even a basic 4wd wouldn't go any better than this if the tires were no good. the tires are touching the ground, not the AWD system. I have 2 RAV4's and haven't been stuck yet.
2010V6RAV4 There are many conditions where no tire will gain traction, such as ice, oil, sand, etc, especially in an incline. During those times, a competent AWD system will then begin to engage all wheels in order to hunt for traction. An AWD system that just allows the front wheels to spin without soon sending at least 50% of power to the rear wheels is a crappy "slip and grip" system. Toyota, Honda, GM, Ford, Chrysler, and many others have such crappy systems. Others such as Subaru, Audi, Acura (SH-AWD) have far superior systems.
I just uploaded 2 videos of proof what better tires can do. I rest my case with you because I proved my point ;-) Toyota has an excellent traction management system and they also have 20% controlling interest in Subaru, so why wouldn't Toyota use some of their technology? and my videos are proof. my car starts spinning, the TRAC control kicks in, the ECU took over, and I was able to get out due to aggressive tires...these tires on this car in this video will barely pull out on wet grass, let alone a slick loose wet gravel hill where the tires are simply spinning. I know what I'm talking about and again have videos to prove it.
when it comes at off roading the difference between a crossover and a hardcore off roader are huge i believe my stock jeep that has a rear LSD would go up that hill even in 2wd ,before some months i went for some off roading with my jeep and my friend came also with his bmw x3 i was surprised how easily the bmw got stuck i could literally drive over obstacles in 2wd because of the lsd and solid axles easily and he couldn't make it without having momentum in 4wd
"Car Enthusiasts" cry and howl for supercars such as the GT-R to have a manual transmission; but I'm for one calling for the return of manuals on vehicles such as the RAV-4's. Now that's where the fun is.
Not impressed with Rav4's performance off-road compared to what I've seen with Subaru Forester as far as transferring power to the wheels that actually need it most. That being said, for 99% of day to day driving, Rav4 is a very attractive option. Put me in a real snowstorm with drifts and I'm not certain that Rav4's drive train configuring is up to snuff.
Any chance you'll try the Lexus NX and/or RX? I like how in depth you talk about the AWD system and would like to know how if lexus and toyota differentiate with the system.
Your videos are awesome! Could you please explain the differences between FSI, TSI and TFSI engines? It buggs me out, and I can't find a clear answer online. Thanks! :)
+Engineering Explained Is it bc you increased your speed which allowed the RAV4 to get over the hump or was it the increase in momentum? Maybe i'm overthinking it...
I'm disappointed in that 4wd system. If it can send all power to the front, then why is it that the rear wheels lose traction in reverse? Or... When they lose traction, why not send more power to the front axle instead of taking away power?
I don't think backing up the hill makes much, if any, difference. After all the wheels that are higher are not being pushed to the ground, causing more slip/less grip. When you consider these cars have most of their weight pushing the front of the car, it makes it even worse.
What is the point of paying the costs (up front AND fuel economy) of AWD and you end up getting stuck? FWD based AWD vehicles are a waste of money. This is a great plug for the Subaru Forrester.
So if you turn off traction control and you locked the center diff. for a 50/50 torque split, why when you go up that hill, the front tires are the only ones spinning but the back ones don't? It looks like the rear tires are not doing anything.
I own a 2011 rav4 and my wife has a 2013 rav4 for our every day drivers. Never had any issue going anywhere in the snow. If it gets too bad I get in the Tacoma.
John Fox are your rav4s awd?
I have 10 years of technical off road experience in all Toyota SUV's. We recently bought a 2016 Rav4 for my wife. It's 2WD with the electronic LSD. This video does no justice for the general capabilities of the Rav4 which did extremely well its first year in the 2wd Rally National Championship. Anyone with common sense knows a high psi road tire on an incline with slick surface is going to break traction and slide around. With no momentum to carry you over this demo might as well be "16 year old girl gets stuck driving on a wet surface incline." This is a cross over not a body on frame 4runner locked with ATRAC. I've climbed steeper hills going to Road Atlanta in ours on wet surfaces with zero issues. Take into account that this drive-train is bullet proof and what it designed to do is get you home in most driving conditions within reason. You have to know how the vehicle operates to bring out its strengths. Momentum is your friend
" this drive-train is bullet proof and what it designed to do is get you home in most driving conditions within reason" EXACTLY !!!
The people are sad because most of the folks like the RAV4 - it's just a liittle bit more offroad capabilities would make this a dream car. I would be pretty happy if there was an offroad button which enhances its capabilities - e.g. apply brake on the spinning wheel so that it simulates the missing locking of the front or rear differential. In my honest opinion toyota is missing a small suv with bigger offroad capabilities like the suzuki jimny or the vitara, lada niva etc. I understand that they are not meant to be offroad vehicles, but at least they could improve their 4x4 performance.
I just bought a 2015 RAV4 AWD. My gravel driveway is steeper than the hill shown giving this RAV4 such a difficult time...yet I drive it daily with no issues. Go figure.
The back wheels do not get traction. This is not about tires
I have a 14' It's all about the tires! I had problems with mine climbing the basic hills with stock tires, but after a new set of tires it goes everywhere and I truly mean everywhere! The best part of owning a Rav4 is I don't belong to the smugeru club!
Do you still own the car? Any issues?
I really love how you are doing reviews on "practical" vehicles - meaning cars that the majority or persons would buy. keep up the good work. very informative btw
+Rommel Beckford An estate is much more practical than an SUV,
We have a 2018 xle. On the highway running 62-63 mph I can get 35+ mpg. That is actual mileage, not the computer. Great vehicle
I own a 2015 one(pretty much the same aside from looks), it performs wonderfully in the snow up here in the tri state area, and is pretty good all around. It never disappointed me.
Agree, I have drove my 2014 through mountain passes, knee deep snow and icy roads. Up and down fire roads with steeper inclines, you will catch some spinning at times, but when I replaced my tires with better M&S tires, that dramatically made a difference. Crossovers aren't made for off roading, I know a lot of Subaru owners like to pretend they go off roading in their forester, but I use an older Chevy 4WD pick up for mud, rocks and actual off road work, for camping and hiking trips. I have yet to see any Subaru's in these areas ever, from the lower desert of Ca. to up here in the PNW. I generally see most of them parked next to my daily driver, the Rav 4 at Trader Joes and Whole Paycheck or up in the parking lot at the ski resorts. To each and their own, I like the Rav, it runs like a clock, low maintenance and has yet to not get through snowy passes.
do you still own it? Any flaws?
Interior looks really good imo
yeah it does
The interior on this new rav-4 is the best in its class. They gave it a substantial update
It looks good but the interior has a lot of cheap plastic. I own one
basically you've done all the car explanations. i dont even know what EE haven't explained yet!
and now you're only uploading car reviews but thats okay for me :)
New explanation every Wednesday!
+Engineering Explained Could you do a review on the Toyota Rav 4 2016 hybrid as well, please? That would be awesome.
guys I didn't see how nobody caught on to the traction control comment. you can completely disable all traction control by pressing and holding the traction button for about 10 seconds while parked. I love this feature especially in the winter. note that abs cannot be disabled while traction control can be disabled.
They have a simple 2.5 lift kit for these along with a thousand other things to make them great offroad for what they are.
@@Tsalinger Any suggestions on website for this?
really like the exterior of this car. much much better then previous gen rav4s.
+Den Moumoiazei Naah the 2009 that i has nicer exterior imo, but the interior is awesome.
The traction control button is located on the right hand side of the clock
Thanks for this video. It has dissuaded me from purchasing this as my next vehicle. I need better offroad performance.
But that 2020 adventure model tho
I'm very happy with the 2016 Rav4 Hybrid. It has more horsepower, 7 inches of ground clearance, and AWD-i electronic AWD.
I have almost the same exact car (2016 AWD LE) and I’ve been taking it off-roading for years. On much more nasty hills than this. Maybe it’s the rain that made it too slick but it was surprising to see this Rav not be able to handle. Mine is extremely capable.
Многое от прокладки между рулём и сиденьем зависит 😉
Good review! In all fairness these "off road" scenarios are actually what hikers experience going to trail heads and finding camp sites especially in the north west where it rains and snows even when it's not winter. The lack of ground clearance is my concern yet I still think with better tires this could be improved for a camping rig. The Tacoma could be a better choice but it's harder to park in the city and gets less mpg.... All things to consider if you live in the north west or for any city dweller in a mountain state. IMO
This is what I call "a city SUV"
it's a crossover
+RickTrajan it is a jacked up station wagon
For when you wanna climb over sidewalks and curbs to get to the other parking lot.
+nano3711 It's what I call a "not even lifted wagon"
If my Forester ever got stuck on a 'hill' like that, I would sell it. That is just sad.
true that
SilverJig I bet your Subaru burns oil lol
Armando Gonzalez Nope.
SilverJig remember he was at slow speed and the vehicle is a city SUV not an off-road SUV
Hrm. For getting around in the snow on public roads, the RAV does just fine. Choose between a Toyota or a Subaru ? OMG, the Toyota any day ! I will take world renowned reliability over a car that is known for it's engine rumble.
My Rav 4 is incredible for winter. We had about 30 cm of snow in Canada. And I was able to riflle through the snow. Not bad for what it is. Nothing like a 4 runner or FJ, but pretty decent. This is not an offroader.
I really like the AWD reviews. Very detailed and something that I think was missing on youtube.
I love these review videos! They tend to be in line with other online/magazine reviews I read for the same vehicles, and having the narrated visuals really adds to the information. My folks are tentatively looking for a new SUV, and since your test areas resemble an area they visit often, these have been great to pass along. :)
SUCH A ADORABLE WARM SMALL SUV WITH A POWERFUL TAILPIPE PUMPS OUT SO MUCH WARMTH SO COZY
I really enjoy these car reviews, even the everyday sort of cars. They work well alongside the explanations, keep up this great content!
I just bought one of these. And Im happy! Always when you need traction, you have to speed up the engine to get the 4 wheel funktion.
he gives the best car reviews tbh.
Very good review, good job. Better than many magazines.
I own a SUV and I have seen lot of videos before I buy it ... and it is not easy to get a good 4WD system in a midium size SUV.
That hill should not be an obstacle.
my fj cruiser would murder that hill
+carbonunit Poor hill :(
+Justin Hickey I owned a 2003 AWD Rav 4 sport . very dependable SUV. great in the snow.
no way 2016 rav4 better faster . you drive fj with off road tire .. kia sportag with off tire will distroy fj loooool
as a 97 Toyota rav4 owner. I have to say that Toyota killed the off road label on the rav4
The hill doesnt even look that steep
They never seem to on videos.
great video, sad results though. I was thinking about recommending this car actually for my mom. I was already going to have to argue the interior but not anymore. thanks for the info!
+Steven Kitchin Does your mom go mudding?
+FrederickGFX no but she won't drive anything without 4 wheel drive, just how she is. I wanted her to drive something smaller since she's starting to not drive well and she's in a larger 4runner
Looks way better than the previous year with little tweaks.
That middle seat belt storage is neat, there's the same kind in my 2007 fit, really practical. My friends got their RAV4 In hybrid. They like it, they have a good commute so it's good on the fuel. It was expensive, but they only needed one car they sold their Honda fit and Matrix for it. They bought it in the right colour! a really nice blue.
I'm torn between the Rav4, Forester, and CX-5, any suggestions? I like the idea of being off road capable but I live in Orange County and would be doing city driving 99% of the time.
I love the rav 4
Which car would you suggest in the same price range but with better off-road capabilities. Ground clearance is an important factor for me, as well as storage. Thanks!
My mother recently bought a 2015 fully loaded Rav4 and I personally don't care for them. It's a nice well built cross over. For the same money you can buy a Subaru Forrester which would be more practical.
+Bobby0345 just better in general. I'm very disappointed by its performance in EE's demonstration.
+MavHunter20XX Well my mom uses her Rav4 for physical therapy home visits. So she drives about 40,000 miles a year all over the rural area we live in. So far it has been excellent in the snow and on gravel/dirt roads. Some of the gravel roads are washed out so the slightly higher clearance it has compared to a car is a plus. As long as decent tires are on it, the Rav4 should have excellent performance for a cross over.
the thing is rav4 gets better fuel economy because it's not full-time awd.
My wife and I have 2010 rav4 with the v6 awd. I really like it. The v6 puts out 270 hp. But we use it as it was intended. My wife doesn't offroad, it sees very snow and icey roads. It drives like a car, comfortable and quiet.
+Tracey Allen I wish they still made them with the V6. Toyotas V6 can fly lol.
Great review of the Rav 4 AWD. Your test specifically targeted the lack of traction that could occur in certain "real world" scenarios like driving over snow drifts or when the snow plows do a half-ass job in your neighborhood. The viewers need to watch the LEFT-REAR tire spin along with the RIGHT-FRONT tire. Not too many reviewers test the AWD capability thoroughly which leaves many buyers to base their purchase on style, the marketing hype and adventurous background scenes the vehicles are set up for the photo shoot. If the RAV 4 AWD cannot drive over that small gravel hump in the road I can picture plenty of frustrated or embarassed owners.
a. ggrex - and how many times do you plan to pull up on a steep hill, stop, then try pulling out? I have a traction video with a twisted suspension test in a 2013 RAV4 that has good tires suited for the conditions that does well with what I do in the 2 videos. how many times will you stop in a snow drift just to see if you get stuck or not? ability, "common sense," and the right tires are the 3 main keys. I have never been pulled out of any situation, but I have pulled other vehicles out of the snow. ✌
Getting stuck in traffic on a snowy soft bank or hill or having a pedestrian busy texting walk across are a few ways way anyone could be forced to stop midway up a snowy hill. The RAV4 AWD capability s clearly limited as demonstrated on your video. Again good video and technique but no RAV4me.
a. ggrex limited and demonstrated? please explain. all it did was spin until the ECU learned what to do. my video also clearly proved that the right tires makes a huge difference as well. if the AWD system was that bad, I would never have made it across that "twist" ditch. I stopped, then I proceeded to pull out. when the ECU took over, as demonstrated in my video, the spinning stopped and I was able to pull out. my aunt's 2012 Legacy never made it up a small embankment in my driveway, but both of my RAV4's made it.
a. ggrex all the scenarios you mentioned, I've been there. what are you wanting to do, run summer tires in the snow? I live in the mountains, I know hills and steep streets. I also know snow drifts. I've never been stuck in any situation in either of my 2 RAV4'S. If you don't buy a RAV4, I respect that, that's totally your opinion and your right, but unless you own one and buy good tires suited for the conditions, don't knock it based off of this video. the ECU has to learn, and staying steady on the gas as I demonstrated in my video, is exactly what you have to do. A Subaru is the same way..they spin for a bit before realizing what's needed..
Next time change it with Mitsubishi Outlander for great traction doing forward & reverse on steep road or hills
Woo we are getting dozens of these at our rental car company!
i wish they offered a V6 like they used to
This is never meant to go off road like this. The awd is for wet/snowy roads and maybe towing a caravan on/off a muddy field.
If you want a small off roader the Jimny is your guy. Still stuck in the 80s, but a mountain goat non the less. Also a panda 4x4 is a good Billy goat.
Which one would last longer and be less expensive on the long run : A hybrid rav4 or a regular rav4?
press and hold the traction control button to completely shut it down
The little gravel mound is good test. We ran into similar situation at a ski area parking lot, bumper to bumper backup, wet icy unpaved road needing to get over a small icy mound. Our little Rav4 failed to get over it. We had to ask the guy behind to give some space to build up speed.
All terrain tires on that rav4 make all the difference in the world.
Hi EE,
Would love to see a review of the new Focus RS when it is out :D
Hey Jason! Very nice video again! But can i (Audio Engineer) a little adive? You should do a little Low-Cut Filter on the audio track :) My subwoofer is killing me hehe
It really irritates me how the Rav4 and CR-V are considered SUVs to any degree. They're nothing more than slightly elevated hatchbacks with AWD. There are other crossovers that are actually capable of off-roading.
+Peter Schmidt
Well, consider this. The I gen RAV4 pretty much was the very first SUV: small unibody 4x4, using engine from regular car with pretty surprising offroad capabilities. I don't really like what these cars have become either, but there we go, that's the kind of cars people are willing to buy nowadays.
The rav-4 started life like a SUV actually
***** Agreed, but back then it was a legit SUV. It really was capable of being sporty. Today, it's just a big car that self-identifies as a SUV.
this is why I just sold my rav4; too small to do anything worthwhile and too big to be nimble and get reasonable gas mileage
People take SUV's off-road?
Wranglers and older Cherokees and maybe an FJ cruiser/4runner, sure....every other SUV driver doesn't do anything more hard core than an unpaved road.
When you actually go offroad, you see almost entirely pickup trucks.
The TC button is in the center dash. If you have turned it off you wouldn't even need to use the AWD lock.
Can you do this same test with your STi?
great review.. could you do a better buy comparison between this and the crv?
I have the RAV4. I'd honestly get a Subaru instead
Nice seats, but not sure why anyone would select this over the Subaru Forester. I get 32mpg hwy with 250hp and 258 torque. Eyesight system and 8.7 inches of ground clearance. For approximately the same price as a well equipped Rav
50/50 split is not the same as 50% of the torque to the rear axle. 50/50 is total axle biasing (locked) which allows 100% of torque to go to either axle, where 50% means no more than 50% will go to the rear axle. The current RAV4 does not allow for 100% rear axle torque even though it has a "center diff lock" button that simply energizes the center clutch to its slip limit (50%)
If the "centre" diff locks up, the torque distrubution could be 100%-0% or 0%-100% depending on the coeficient of friction in each axel. Only an open diff can distribute 50%-50%. As per your first videos.
I drive 50/50 highway city, do you recommend the hybrid? How did you find the suspension on the SE? And finally, the sound system?
These newer small "suv's" are nancy cars. The older models could actually work offroad, like the older vitara.
That's because the only offroading these new ones do, are the speedbumps at the mall parking lot
Shaiyan Hossain
True that.
The Vitara is the same old and new. Doesnt have a seperate chassis for a start. Wtf a try hard noob comment lol
Old ones where practically the same way but less features maby an inch more clearance and less power and less tech wich can be good for longevity
@@starsky8351 I was talking about actually having a transfer case and actual 4wd system and not the chassis, which suv has a ladder frame, besides the jimny?
I am surprised this doesn't make it over the hill.
honestly, loose gravel and stock touring tires that come on this are not good for anything but road driving. I have a 2014 XLE, my drive way in CA. was hard packed dirt and slick, 3 times the length of this hill and a bit steeper. I never once had an issue driving up or backing up it and out into the street. Even our Golf TSI went up and down it with sport tires and though it would spin , you just gave a bit of gas and up you went. The Rav system triggers the opposite corner wheel when one spins, not as strong imo as Subaru's system but I can say I have drove this Rav up these types of fire roads, open BLM territory , on the beach and in snow and ice in the mountains. Recently here in the PNW in recent snow/sleet storms and it works just fine. I have yet to get it stuck but I am also not out rock crawling or trying to go off roading in a crossover.
Superb video!
Forester: better AWD system, better ground clearance, better MPG, larger rear window, larger quarter windows, better overall visibility. I'm not sure if the CVT makes that much of a difference, but how can the Forester rate better MPG with a more aggressive AWD system and higher ground clearance?
I think Toyota builds great cars, but I think they've dropped the ball a bit with the Rav4. I would argue that the Rav4 is a better looking CUV than the Forester, but the Forester is a much more practical vehicle. What the Forester is giving up with "style," it is gaining in best-in-class outward visibility. Also, every winter condition test I've seen, such as Consumer Report's snowy Rav4/CRV/Forester comparison, the Forester handles better in low traction situations.
FlRiAfCeTLE yeah Subaru is also good at making cars that blow head gaskets and burn excessive oil.
Armando Gonzalez, Subaru used to manufacture their blocks open deck, which contributed to the head gasket problem. They now use semi-closed deck, which will alleviate the problem.
As for oil consumption, that is a result of using a boxer engine. There are benefits to a boxer engine, and there are drawbacks; oil consumption is a potential drawback.
I think the RAV4 is a great car, as is the CX5 and CRV. Lot's of great CUV's out there, but, for me, I'd chose the vehicle with best in-class AWD, ground clearance, safety, and outward visibility; albeit even if I have to occasionally add oil. For the record, with 140,000 miles on my clock, I haven't added a drop of oil to my 2015 Forester. Knock on wood.
I want to know the AWD hybrid performance on off-road, please
+Joe Zhang The Hybrid has less power to the rear wheels (67hp max), vs 87hp for the gas model. Mind you the Hybrid does have more HP overall, so that might make a difference in situations where the front wheels have grip. The Hybrid is also heavier, due to the batteries, which may or may not be helpful depending on the situation.
You are right. It will be interesting to see how much different a Hybrid AWD than a normal Rav4 2WD
Going in reverse over that little hill and not locking the center diff might have improved the RAV4's capability. Even more if there was a lock-out to prevent sending power to the rear wheels.
Most people have no idea how TRAC works (traction control) which is Toyota's fault. In order for the TRAC to work you must not brake and you have to give it gas and leave it there (turning the wheels helps). You can see the TRAC trying to work by breaking the spinning tires (the ft rt and lt rr). Disabling TRAC is the WRONG thing to do as you can see the spinning tires do not brake at all. However, what appears wrong is that in a traditional 4WD system, braking the opposite tire should deliver power to the opposite tire and we don't see that (the rr tire). I don't know if giving the TRAC more time to work would have helped.
This is the second review of a car labelled AWD that is really two wheel drive (one in the front and one in the back). Not sure manufacturers should be stamping vehicles with open diffs as AWD.
Every wheel gets 25% torque when the center locks, I'd call that AWD, regardless if it can ascend a steep l, slippery grade or not.
+Mikey C
Mikey, you're addressing a commercial naming convention that has been bad for nearly TWENTY YEARS now. Unfortunately, it is commonly accept that AWD implicitly identifies any vehicle that *can* supply power to all [four] wheels. The convention you mean is rather referred to as 4WD, to distinguish it.
It sucks. But AWD, as it is used, means exactly what this video shows and the vehicles that claim it. Locking AWD is another subject, and we really should have made some sort of legislation *years ago* to enforce identifying the difference, for consumers.
+Engineering Explained
Question for ya!
There is no denying this is AWD but it does seem a rather poor execution of one. Any idea why we just saw the front wheels spinning and the rears do nothing when you tried to go up that hill despite it being center locked?
+Kamil Bernatowicz I'll answer for EE - for starters "locked 50:50" configuration means is that 50% is sent front and 50% is sent rear. What you need to understand is that even though front and rear are seeing the same amount of torque, they are not experiencing the same terrain, and more importantly external forces and traction scenario. This means that when accelerating or ascending the front wheels will have less grip than the rears, under deceleration and descending the rears will have less grip. Further issues affecting this vehicle is that the Rav4 has open differentials front and rear, which means that even though there is a 50:50 front:rear the further limiting factor is the open differentials; meaning between one and three wheels can spin without the vehicle making any progress due to a lack of ability to put power down. The only way for that Rav4 to crawl up that hill on stock tires would be for a 50:50 locked center diff AND locked front & rear diffs - with that configuration if one wheel has traction (and the axle holds out) the vehicle will crawl. If my explanation did not satify, or was not clear enough, I believe EE has previously done an AWD system explanation video which admittedly does a better job than I have. Anecdotal, I have a 2006 WRX which is full time locked 50:50 F:R with a LSD in the rear and open diff in the front - under dry conditions with heavy acceleration I routinely experience front wheel spin, in wet/snow I can force the car to rotate where the rear tires will spin and the fronts will not. bonus fact, my WRX came from the factory with 6.3" of ground clearance; way to use the "crossover" designation to help your CAFE rating Toyota.
haha just like the jeeps in ww2
I wish reviewers would just say it like it is, this car can not go "off-road". Like he said most people interested in this car would not be interested in leaving the city so why beat around the bush and say that it's an ok off-road vehicle but there are better ones. He was driving on a very nice dirt road by the way and the hill wasn't very steep.
That open diff awd is an absolute disaster. You've been way too nice about it in your review!! I really thought the lock would actually lock it...
the lock is only a center diff lock to send 50/50 power to the rear. if the rear axle slips on one wheel that 50/50 power is useless
+tonytypes right, and with 2 open diff front and back and seemingly very crappy traction management... It sucks. I'm not saying it should have torsens front and back but at least brake ediff....
The traction off button is in the clock display section
If you haven't, you should have tried to turn off rear axel lock for the reverse hill ascent. In theory it should have sent 100% power to the front, and you wouldn't have had rear wheel slip.
To disable any toyota traction control, if you dont see it, car off, hand brake up
start car
depress brake 2 times brake brake (hold 2nd brake while doing next step)
handbrake down, up, down, up
release brake and depress brake 2 more times
+Rafa : Is this a traction control or a chat code to a Konami game? Jesus!
Toyota lol
Thanks for the review. Can you or anyone else please explain to me why and how come the rear wheels doesn't spin or move when the front wheel does, considering it is all-wheel-drive? This doesn't seem any better than regular front-wheel-drive, or am I missing some vital facts here?
Rear left is spinning as well.
+Christoffer Lundgren Probably doesn't direct as much power to the rear wheels as it should in those conditions. Also, the front and rear differentials don't have any limited slip, so if the wheel on one side starts slipping it will just spin that wheel.
+Engineering Explained Thanks, now I noticed. If there would have been a locking differential, both wheels would have turned, right? Would that have made it possible to pass in low speed as well?
+Christoffer Lundgren It would benefit from a VTM system. So being able to shift torque from side to side. This is a kind of basic AWD system.
+Christoffer Lundgren This is why locking differentials are often better then "All-wheel-drive" with 2 or 3 open diffs for this type of scenario
Have you had a chance to actually engage the abs? If so, did you find it to be rather rough as in like the front end was going to jump off the vehicle? Well maybe not that severe but rougher than any other vehicle that you driven?
I hope every toyota cars will be available with AWD!!!!
Subaru already got that covered with all models running symmetrical AWD. Toyota is too commercial to offer awd in every model. They will lose money and not be able to charge it as a premium upgrade.
OK enjoy the Rav...feeling the passion you have. It's a good reliable small 4 dr utility vehicle. Luv the V6 for speed
Tires would only improve traction once all four wheels are spinning. Until then, it's the piss poor AWD system at fault, not tires.
it's the tires. if the spinning tires have no tread for the conditions, then how can they hook up? I own a 2010 and 2013, both AWD, and I have not been stuck yet. we have had several snows well over 16" to 24" and believe me, they went.
2010V6RAV4
No. It's the AWD system.
If all 4 wheels are spinning, and the car is still not moving, then it's the tires, but if the front wheels slip and the rear wheels fail to engage appropriately, then it's obviously a poor AWD system at fault.
no. it's the tires. they have no grip. if the tires that were spinning were fit for the conditions, which they are not, and this guy had a bit more momentum to go along with it, the car would go. it's like wearing dance shoes on a slippery slope..the best dancer couldn't perform to their potential without the right shoes.. even a basic 4wd wouldn't go any better than this if the tires were no good. the tires are touching the ground, not the AWD system. I have 2 RAV4's and haven't been stuck yet.
2010V6RAV4
There are many conditions where no tire will gain traction, such as ice, oil, sand, etc, especially in an incline.
During those times, a competent AWD system will then begin to engage all wheels in order to hunt for traction.
An AWD system that just allows the front wheels to spin without soon sending at least 50% of power to the rear wheels is a crappy "slip and grip" system. Toyota, Honda, GM, Ford, Chrysler, and many others have such crappy systems.
Others such as Subaru, Audi, Acura (SH-AWD) have far superior systems.
I just uploaded 2 videos of proof what better tires can do. I rest my case with you because I proved my point ;-)
Toyota has an excellent traction management system and they also have 20% controlling interest in Subaru, so why wouldn't Toyota use some of their technology? and my videos are proof. my car starts spinning, the TRAC control kicks in, the ECU took over, and I was able to get out due to aggressive tires...these tires on this car in this video will barely pull out on wet grass, let alone a slick loose wet gravel hill where the tires are simply spinning. I know what I'm talking about and again have videos to prove it.
when it comes at off roading the difference between a crossover and a hardcore off roader are huge i believe my stock jeep that has a rear LSD would go up that hill even in 2wd ,before some months i went for some off roading with my jeep and my friend came also with his bmw x3 i was surprised how easily the bmw got stuck i could literally drive over obstacles in 2wd because of the lsd and solid axles easily and he couldn't make it without having momentum in 4wd
"Car Enthusiasts" cry and howl for supercars such as the GT-R to have a manual transmission; but I'm for one calling for the return of manuals on vehicles such as the RAV-4's. Now that's where the fun is.
Which suv has more ground clearance and better fuel economy than rav4
I get 23 mpg in mixed driving.
Where do you offroad? Looks really nice.
Good illustration: Any similar traction test for CX-5?
Not impressed with Rav4's performance off-road compared to what I've seen with Subaru Forester as far as transferring power to the wheels that actually need it most. That being said, for 99% of day to day driving, Rav4 is a very attractive option. Put me in a real snowstorm with drifts and I'm not certain that Rav4's drive train configuring is up to snuff.
Traction control switch is at the center beside time display above the multimedia system
Any chance you'll try the Lexus NX and/or RX? I like how in depth you talk about the AWD system and would like to know how if lexus and toyota differentiate with the system.
up by the small screen above the stereo is the traction control button .. we have those things as work-cars.
Will you be testing out the hybrid model? I haven't seen to much discussion or real world tests with that awd set-up.
How do set up your GoPro's? What settings do you use? Thanks!
Your videos are awesome! Could you please explain the differences between FSI, TSI and TFSI engines? It buggs me out, and I can't find a clear answer online. Thanks! :)
+Engineering Explained Is it bc you increased your speed which allowed the RAV4 to get over the hump or was it the increase in momentum? Maybe i'm overthinking it...
car of my dreams
excellent review. ...thanks to you
I would love to see the base price model. Always show higher end vehicles.
Traction Controle button is in the middle on the right side of the clock.
Trac control is beside the seat belt warning lights
I'm disappointed in that 4wd system. If it can send all power to the front, then why is it that the rear wheels lose traction in reverse? Or... When they lose traction, why not send more power to the front axle instead of taking away power?
That is a good point. I bet once it enters "AWD Mode" it splits 50/50 and will no longer try for more than 50% to the front.
I'm glad they got rid of the third row seating. a family member has the 2012 and there is no chance a teenager can fit in there.
Hi Experts,
Which is the better buy, purely gasoline version with "lock" button OR Hybrid version without "Lock" button ?
Jozsef
Depends on how long you want to keep it and how much driving you do. It normally takes a long time to recoup the cost of a hybrid power train
please do an off road review of the 2015 Ford Escape 4WD
I don't think backing up the hill makes much, if any, difference. After all the wheels that are higher are not being pushed to the ground, causing more slip/less grip. When you consider these cars have most of their weight pushing the front of the car, it makes it even worse.
I'd love to see a review on the outgoing 2016 Ford Escape and the incoming 2017 Ford Escape.
Very informative!
What is the point of paying the costs (up front AND fuel economy) of AWD and you end up getting stuck? FWD based AWD vehicles are a waste of money. This is a great plug for the Subaru Forrester.
It's like the center diff unlocks when it is supposed to be locked, I don't see the rear wheels turning when the front are sleeping
So if you turn off traction control and you locked the center diff. for a 50/50 torque split, why when you go up that hill, the front tires are the only ones spinning but the back ones don't? It looks like the rear tires are not doing anything.