3 Ways to Measure Headspace
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Headspace is an important consideration for both firearms inspection and for reloading. In this video, we'll look at three ways to measure headspace for bottleneck rifle cartridge systems.
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Gavin, the way you explain things, makes it easier for us old guys, thanks, love your channel 😊👍
I check my head space according to how much drama is going on.🥴🥴🥴
Dedicated tools are best. However, I have successfully used a socket before. Tried a few different sizes until I found one that sat about right on the shoulder. Primitive but effective.
Gavin, just wanted to say THANKS !!! I had a serious injury 3 months ago. I was in the bed six weeks, and felt like I was losing my mind. I've worked outside for 38 years. If it had not been for my reloading and your videos to focus on, I feel like I would have lost my mind . I'm still recovering, but I know I have something I can still do to help keep me focused. Thanks Gavin !!! Keep the videos coming. You need to get some 4XL shirts in !!😁
Thanks, hoping you have a speedy recovery!!!
Can you please do a video on how to check chamber Pressure Using plastigage And any other techniques
Another free option for 308/7.62 is a piece of sized 40s&w/10mm brass. The datum line is .400
That's a good idea
Bolt Action Reloading channel has a very brief and informative video on the headspace comparators.
i like the micrometre one as a concept, if you have custom cartridges, you can just get a fit finished "chamber" and just put the micrometre on the back.
Great video!! Always detailed and filled with useful information! Thank you!
I have done the plastic washer technique before. But recently got a lathe so i am gonna spin some chips and make something a bit more robust.
Rad! How can anyone run a household without a lathe????????
I use the SAC but will also confirm with the Wilson. I always measure new cases, case growth and shoulder setback relative to my JGS go gauges.
You did not mention the Sinclair headspace bushings. I use these and the Hornady kit to get two measurements each for my fired and sized cartridges. I like the Sinclair a bit better since the also have a matching shoulder angle in the bushing per cartridge.
Nice to see a good comparison of different costing methods, I use the LE Wilson tool, I measure my fired case before and then after sizing so I can adjustment my die to give me 1thou bump, works for me. I've looked at the SAC tool, looks nice, but not sure I need it.
You sir are psychic. I have been researching this all week
Check out Erik Cortina. Way better videos and he shows you how to do this properly. There is actually only one way if you are handloading for accuracy and this guy never even covers it. Hint, you size the beass for the actual chamber, not using the Go / NoGo guages…
@@ez7977 I just found it interesting that a video was posted on a subject i am reserching at the time i am researching it.
I have watched all of Cortina's videos in regards to the subject. Cortina is a bench shooter and single loads rounds. There is quite a bit of info from him that is also not covered in regards to saami specs and magazine lengths.
He also usually does not deal with factory barrels and chambers
If you have a die set doesn't it eliminate the need for this? It should size it the same every time right?
How nice to watch you measure head space guages. I did not see you measure head space in a rifle.
I have used the Hornady headspace tool. The LE Wilson may be in my future now. Like you said, you’ll probably end up with more than one tool. I think I’m there. 😊
I have been using both for several years. I find that it's a bit easier for me to use the LE Wilson gage for the reason that it has less parts to juggle. The only thing you have to be careful of is to make sure that when you screw the mic down you don't use any more pressure than is necessary to make contact. Takes a few tries to get a good feel for it. Very accurate kit.
To parrot some of the earlier posters, the Redding Instant Indicator, is simple, quick and easy to use, using a dial indicator.
Nice description of how to measure CBTD (Case Base To Datum), but not ‘Head Space’.
Because HS (Head Space) is the distance between the case base and the breach face. It is in all cases of any design the distance the case head is permitted to expand into during pressure.
Being an ‘inside measurement’ HS typically is found to be within range by go-nogo technique.
Using the tools shown will only confirm your ammunition is within the SAAMI dimension allowance.
To actually measure Head Space directly requires measuring the actual distance between the breach face and the datum line of the chamber and then comparing it with the loaded ammunition case base to datum measurement to arrive at the number (which in all cases is below 0.010” as I recall). Things like extractors, ejectors and bullets seated long tend to put the case base in contact with the breach face at firing, which causes the actual expansion to be forward to the datum line, or some combination of both.
One way to approximate the breach face to datum measurement of a given chamber is to measure the CBTD of a statistically significant number of fired cases. The cases should be as nearly identical as practical, same lot, etc.
The fired bottle neck case will have ‘sprung back’ from its maximum CBTO by an amount that can be up to 0.002”, so use that as your error band, eg: the measured Average Fired Case CBTD +0.002” is near the absolute BFTD.
Bottle neck cases that will be fired in the same chamber for the rest of their lives will live longer if they have their shoulders moved back the least amount necessary, plus they center bullets much better than loose ammo.
Experiment with ‘shoulder bump’ and/or document the Head Space.
Https://SnellsNotebook.us for much, much more info.
Thank you for posting this. Nothing against Gavin but it's people like him that put out data that is not fully accurate that causes confusion among those trying to learn.
Years ago i bought a digital head space gauge from larry wills, I use that in conjunction with a redding body die to set up and check head space. and I'm still doing that way today.
But i just ordered a click ajustable FL bushing die from whitten that may replace the redding comp bushing die and body dies.
I've been using Sinclair and Hornaday and Wilson. Sometimes, when I'm look through Sears catalog for reloading tooling, I can't help myself, and if it looks like it's going to help build a better bullet, I'm trying it, and if it doesn't well I have a gift for my competitors. Sinclair's used to be close to me, and I always enjoyed the wisdom of Fred.
In my Encore you need a depth mic with adapter and a feeler gages as frame flex can allow case length growth even starting at zero headspace in cartridges like 22-250
I have the Stony Point kit. The Sinclair Headspace gauges, and the L.E. Wilson gauges and mike.
You can also use incremental chamber gauges..Very expensive but the best and most accurate way to measure a chamber..
Hornady but read the following;
TIP: for the Hornady bullet comparator; I just measured 3 different 223 bullets of different weights and manufacturers and found a total of CBTO variance of some .030. All bullets must have identical O'Gives.
Then I removed the plastic plunger and filed down the rounded end into a more pointed end and remeasured a 3 bullets again @ 8 each and found the new total variance of the same bullets to be .010. In two of the bullets the CBTO variance was less than 5%. Very accurate now.
My conclusion is the bullet bases are not 100% perpendicular to the concentricity of the bullet and the plastic plunger end is too large to get an accurate reading on a small point from the base of the bullets.
This was all done in a brand-new JC Custom barrel just purchased and not installed.
I wish Hornady would install a smaller metal pointed end on their plunger for a little extra money.
I use the Turbo Encabulator, the 5 hydrocoptic Marzzle veins are accurate to with in .00001
The Hornady bullet camparator kit (for relative measurements) works well too, just use an insert a few calibers larger than the cartridge being loaded.
are there not specific #s printed on the side of the gauge to tell you which one to use ?
ie: A330 can be used for 223 cartridges correct ?
I was wondering if anyone would bring this up. I use the Hornady bullet comparator kit also. I went to the SAMMI site to find the correct datum diameter, choose the comparator with the closest diameter, check cthe distance on a quality factory round before firing (write this measurement down in your reloading log) and after. This gives me a relative distance comparison. Then when I set up my reloading die I can better set my shoulder bump distance. I have gone to the trouble of loading what I call a "test dummy" round. This is inert (has no primer or powder) but is sized and has a bullet seated at my chosen depth. I will make 2 of these, load them into the rifle and manually cycle the action to make sure they will work correctly.
This may be going overboard but it reassures me that I should not have any cycling/feeding issues on the range due to ammunition... hopefully.
I'll go through this process when setting up for each (new to me) firearm I load for. I use the Lee Precision Classic Turret press. Then I can set up a turret head for each caliber, check my different distances with load standards I've created for my firearms and go from there.
I use the RCBS Precision Mic. I think it is the most overlooked tool a reloader can have.
Can I add 1 more method to the list? The Redding Instant Indicator! (I recommend a .0005 dial instead of a .001 just for ultimate accuracy reading). For a comparator tool it is fast, accurate and consistent. It won't give OAL but for setting up dies and general differential measurements it's the best there is imho.
Very informative.
Using cut off's from barrels. I've been making my own gauges using the same finishing reamer. I also slot it like the Sheridan gauge to reference max coal to jam and see how the throat erodes
Right on Kenny, love your approaches here!
@Eagle Eye Shooting I've thought about this, I like the cut-away gauges as well. Are you able to acquire cut-offs from barrel manufactures relatively easily or are you using your own from blanks?
My family and I actually manufacturer rifles. Desert Precision Gunworks, over 440 rifles this year so far excluding rebarreling. I usually order a few inches over desired finish length which gives me the option to make a Full length die matched to the chamber or other tools as mentioned above
Great , very informative 👍🏻👍🏻
I think it's a pretty big stretch to say the hornady comparator gives an absolute measurement... The Wilson micrometer agreed with the hornady only because the hornady was zeroed on the go gauge. The wilson didn't need a reference.
I use the SAC kit and it is the best I've found. With this tool, I can set my headspace very precisely, where my handloads are right at the perfect threshold. I can also virtually do the same with the Hornady tool but SAC is a little more reassuring. I will warn folks that read this that most of the items sold by SAC have a real good sticker shock. Nothing they do is cheap.
I use the whidden gunworks bump gauges
Excellent
A bit confusing here in regards to what you mention, four dimensions overall. A go gauge, no go, and Saami chamber and then ammunition dimensions. You mentioned the saami specifications at chamber length at 1.6486 and the ammunition at 1.6517. So how can ammunition at 1.6517 fit into a chamber at 1.6486? In addition the Saami specs dimensions exceed what your go (1.641) and no go gauge (1.647) are at ? Can you clarify this?
I check my shoulder with a piece of barrel that was cut off and cut with the Remer that cut my chamber
I use the Hornady Head space tool to measure shoulder bump and then I use the LEWilson gauges w/o the micrometer to verify the fit and overall length using the step gauge on the top. Works well for me but I’m not a bench rest competitor.
I do pretty much the same. For a bolt action rifle it’s easy - just bump that shoulder back a few thousandths and you are GTG in that rifle. Absolute numbers don’t matter. For a semiauto where the case may start ejecting before all chamber pressure is gone, a fired case may not fit in the chamber without resizing. I don’t entirely trust the “absolute number” with the Hornady comparator - those aluminum bushings are somewhat soft and I’ve seen some drift over time in the measurements I get. That’s when the Wilson gauge verifies that my re-sized case fits within proper headspace.
Sooo…. The best way to set the headspace dim of your cartridge for your gun is to take fire formed brass, dismantle the bolt assembly of your rifle, remove the firing pin and springs/ejector, start bumping back the shoulder until the bolt just barely drops without resistance. Setting your headspace with a 0.002” shoulder bump. This will typically be 4-10 thousandths longer than SAMI spec, but regardless it will be set to the actual headspace for your gun. This will improve accuracy and most important extend the life of your brass.. also, no ‘Go’ or ‘No-Go’ guage necessary..
I suggest you watch Eric Cortina he talks about this. He says .002 of shoulder bump. Being an f class shooter I'll believe him.
@@orangerider2827 - haha…. Ive watched them all. Ive learned alot from Eric’s videos. Thanks!!
and whats about the Redding instant indicator?
I’ve got the hornady comparator kit and find it effective. Do you know when any there will be another show for reloading equipment?
Im of the opinion that ( headspace ) is the distance measured between the face of the bolt, and the base of the cartridge, when the round is fully chambered.
You are correct.
L.E. Wilson case gauge and depth micrometer
Whidden headspace gauges work so easy. What do you think?
I've been loading pistol for decades, but am new to rifle reloading. Wouldn't having cases sized with various amount of shoulder bump and testing them in your chamber *similar to what you'd do for COAL/seating depth) be the most accurate way *for your chamber* without the need for all the expensive tools?
Great i can measure headspace, but im a newby and dont even know what headspace really is and how it relates to reloading my AR. I was hoping for more info using the barrel cutaway, and what it is im trying to accomplish. Thanks
th-cam.com/video/fj8Ef-BxkVU/w-d-xo.html
@@rollandklontz Thank you sir, great video to get me on my way to understanding headspace. Appreciate it.
JP here. i use the RCBS precision mic, and the hornady comparator for ogive and for the datum line. .223,and .308 win
I see on your website for written content for this video you reference the Foster Datum Dial which you have also featured in a video. Why didn't you show that product in this video as well?
Great video . What is go no go ? When I resize I try the empty case in my rifle after resizeing . I adjust my die until the bolt has just a little resistance when I close it. Then I reload them from there and write the measurement. My loads have worked well doing it that way. What do you think ? Great videos !
Assuming you will be using your reloads in the same weapon that fired them originally, your technique, in which your are essentially only "neck sizing", provides the most accurate reloads, since headspace is kept to a minimum and is consistent across your entire lot. Since the case is "fire formed" to match the specific dimensions of your weapon's chamber, the reloaded cartridge is an almost perfect fit. The added benefit is that your cases will last much longer since there is less metal stretching into the neck that ultimately has to be length trimmed.
If it fits, it ships!
Just one question, wouldn't the head space gauge sufficient to check headspace?
I love this video, although I have no clue what you just did in relation to cartridge seating in the chamber to the barrel and bolt. Does what I just wrote make sense? Signed,
Confused so much I don’t know what I’m actually asking😀. Then I think about your relative values vs real or finite values. It seems to me they came out the same.
Finally, how does this affect resizing the case?
Can use different sized Tool Sockets as well 😉 if need be lol
Gavin , Do you have the I.D. of a 6.5 Creedmoor ogive Hornady 5-26 insert, need to make a new one on my lathe, old one took a trip and didn't come back. Thx
Been reloading for 30 years never gave a shit about head space and it never gave a shit about me!😃😃😃😃
Same here except for the 303 British, that one I barely bump the shoulder.
Never seen someone use so many words and sound more like he's not speaking English, then summerize like he just gave a masterclass in reloading. What a worthless tutorial... Try speaking English, use 1/4 as many words, and stop over complicating shit. You're talking to shooters, not engineers. 👆
hi Gavin ,whats corect 308 cal 175 gr sierra hpbt amunition lenght to OGIVE ?
I have been removing ejector and extractor from my bolt,then seating a round in the chamber,after that I just push the carrier forward to see if it seats fully into battery. So far this has been working for me. Please let me know if this is a safe way of doing this?
I use the Hornady system for HS and bullet seating... I have seen folks use straight wall pistol cases to measure head space... u can use anything really as long as you always use it... I also thing the Hornady is a little better because it's measuring more off a point on the bevel, rather then a surface like on you last gauge...
Pistol case, (.45 acp for my 308 Winchester) and measure brass fired in the rifle measuring. Adjust die a little at a time to set shoulder back 2 thousands and lock the die.
@@kentuckywindage222 Great idea, I'm going to give this a try.
@@redrock425
It will work. Use the same 45 acp brass. 22 rimfire or 22 mag brass works for bullet, for ogive to base. Using a chamfer tool helps on the brass helps it work smoother in my opinion.
I used these on my 308 Winchester loadings starting out and at times still do. Its actually pretty darn accurate.
Shooting to 1000 yards regularly very accurately. 1200 at times. I used it on my 6.5 creed and 243 Winchester also.
@@kentuckywindage222 Thanks. I currently have a couple of 308s and have a Hornady tool but always good to have a back up.
@@redrock425
Yep. I've been shooting 175 grain SMK over 45.5gr CFE223, Lapua brass and CCI primers. It's a hot load and temperature sensitive but after chronographing in 88, 75, 60, 50, 40, 32 and loading it in to my app I'm confident to 1000 for target.
We shoot clay pigeon's from 800 to 1000. Most wouldn't believe but it's on video. I'm working up a 168gr Berger hybrid load. Testing now. If it is what Strelok says it will I will be thoroughly impressed. My buddy shoots the 212gr in 300 WM and it is very accurate and deadly. He took two deer last year at 700 yards.
I've been impressed with the new to me 6.5 CM. Very accurate and basically no recoil. It is a shooter.
is the "Benchrest Game" you mention comparable to hunting?
For amateur I use the Hornady.
Any views on Sinclair head bump?
I’m still a little confused about how the go/no-go gauges are needed here, since it appears you’re just measuring them. Many other videos use the gauges as part of the process in the way that you do, so what am I missing here?
I’m also trying to figure out if they are (yet even) more things I need to buy.
Ive used a .357 mag case for measuring 308 win.. Seems to work for me.
Sinclair has been making shoulder angle gages for years, That's what I use. They are made of stainless steel, their bullet comparator's have ogive angles in them giving you a more accurate reading.
I just use the hornady headspace kit. Frankly I don't see the point in the other 2 kits or a case gauge for that matter. That's money I could use for other better/more important reloading tools in my opinion.
What is the ideal starting headspace in a semiauto for reliability?
Bump the shoulder back around 0.003" for a semi-auto.
I have had issues using the Wilson gauge as compared to the Hornady and SAC, the Hornady and SAC delta head space reads -2 , the Wilson reads -7, I am pretty sure the Wilson gauge is incorrect, if I bump -2 using the Wilson gauge, the bolt is difficult to close and that brass reads a delta of 0 to +2 on the SAC and Hornady
I have the same problem whit Sinclair and Wilson, 6.5 and 308
Use Wilson case gauge
What are your thoughts on the RCBS case mic?
I've used the RCBS Precision Mic for years. It works great for measuring headspace as well as bullet seating depth. For whatever reason, it seems to get no respect.
@@doctormdds I can agree with using the shoulder mic, but that bullet tool is a flat out joke. There are ALOT of differences in bullet companies ogives that don't even come close to matching the adjustable steel dummy bullet in the kit. That`s why it doesn't get much love these days when there are far better tools to check things with today.
@@D70340 I absolutely agree with you on the steel dummy bullet. It's pretty much useless and I've never used it. However, once I establish what my bullet seating depth will be, I use the Precision Mic to measure cartridge base to ogive. I record this value and reference it in the future as needed. As I'm sure you are aware, this measurement is much more valuable than cartridge overall length.
Chinese junk. They are supposed to be calibrated to saami min. The one I got zeroed on a field gauge. It was 6 thousandths off. I've heard of them being up to 15 thou off. They need to just call those things comparators, but a lot of the new chinese rcbs stuff is junk. Good design, poor manufacturing.
@@doctormdds Because the "bullet" found in the RCBS is an arbitrary shaped ogive rather than the actual used. No way it can produce a reliable result. Same goes for the Head space.
What i don't get is how i ever loaded accurate, safe ammo using Lee hand tools. For multiple guns.
To whomever would like to respond:
Is there a reason why my Sinclair bump gauge insert for .243 WIN doesn’t seem to reflect the the headspace line of the SAMMI spec when measuring my new stock ammo? I see the headspace is measured out on the taper at a very specific dia of the shoulder of .400”. My Sinclair bump guage insert seems to measure my stock Norma, Federal and Winchester cartridge factory new loaded brass at 1.613” , 1.628 and 1.602 respectively. The data in a reference book I have shows the headspace line at 1.634 +/- .007 at .400 dia point. With exception of the Federal at 1.628, why are my other two brands at 1.613 and 1.602 showing so much shorter than the SAMMI spec? If 1.634 +/- .007” is the SAMMI Spec of the .243 Win headspace at .400” dia point of shoulder, why are 2 of my new stock ammo examples shorter than SAMMI spec? Is it my bump comparator insert that is machined incorrectly and not reading at the .400” dia point or something else? I’m somewhat confused, is the case head to datum line the same as the headspace measurement that is referenced. In my common reload manuals it shows a measurement from case head to the very start of the taper, rather than at the .400” dia point of the taper which is called the headspace measurement “as far as I know.” So what point is the datum line then, is it the start of the taper or is it the headspace measurement at .400” dia of shoulder as in the .243” ? Any insight guys as to what point my Sinclair bump gauge insert is actually designed to measure, is it designed to measure the head “or end of case” to datum line, or head space, or just an arbitrary measurement somewhere along the shoulder for measuring case stretch?
I think I figured out my answer. The reload manual does not give a headspace measurement. The manual will show the start of the shoulder taper and also the length to end of case. The datum line is used to refer to a very specific point along the taper of the shoulder to the very end of the case end. It is this measurement that is called the headspace, it is taken from the end of case head to the datum line along the taper at a specific dia point of the shoulder taper where the cartridge is stopped in the chamber. It’s this measurement that is defined as the headspace by SAAMI. Speaking of the .243 Win, at .400 dia point of case shoulder back to case end of head , it should measure min 1.627 to 1.634 max length to be within SAAMI Spec. My Sinclair bump gauge insert does not measure at the precise .400 dia point of the case shoulder. Therefore this bump gauge type insert is for a comparative measurement only, “not to measure actual true headspace.” This tool is just to allow you to see how much you are bumping back your shoulder with FL resizing dia. So by measuring with this tool after firing the new cartridge’s brass in your chamber, you can then measure length with this bump comparator bushing, then bump the shoulder back with the resizing die, then measure “compare” this with the previous measurement. It is this difference that shows how much you sized the shoulder back or shorter. Many people will say for a bolt action rifle, a bump back of shoulder “using this bump gauge comparator method” .002 is sufficient. For autoloaders, pumps or lever guns more of a bump greater than .002” is suggested to allow the action to close fully and with enough clearance to allow proper feeding/extraction.
However the bump back the shoulder of a fire-formed case of only say .002” is only going to make that cartridge fit the specific rifle it was shot from only. But the advantage of just bumping back say .002” is prolonged brass life and perhaps more accurate cartridges for that specific rife. If one wants to size their brass to fit other rifles as well, then sizing back to SAAMI min headspace is suggested. However this sizing all the way back to SAAMI min will cause your brass life to be shortened because the brass is being worked more each time “work hardened” if it is sized back to SAAMI Min each time. If I’m in error in anything I said, please correct me, for this is only what I’ve read. I welcome learning.
Experiment solely at your own risk!
Very concise answer and correct to how I understand the goal of resizing during the reloading process.
To date, after about 4 years of reloading, the only cases I've had that failed are range pickups in .223. I don't load them to max pressure but to best load for accuracy in my rifle. I'm generally running about 200-300fps below factory loads in my rifle as read by my chronograph.
The case failures in question are usually neck splitting after firing and could be mitigated with annealing.
With .223, I use the same load for my bolt action as well as my MSR. They go from about a 1.5" group in my MSR to a bug hole in my bolt action. I developed the load for the MSR, and got lucky with how well it works in the bolt action.
Once I shoot it in my gun won't the cartridge conform to my barrel? So why check it? What problem is this solving?
Its fun to bring a set of Go and No gauges to look at a used rifle that's for sale. If the rifle is out of tolerance, I would get the price lowered about 150 bucks or so. It's fun to see them cringe.
I still don't know why you check headspace. Is it to see if a chamber is worn out?
From my understanding it’s to adjust seating depth on rounds
No it’s so you bump the shoulder back far enough to allow you to chamber the round and close the bond. It allows proper cycling. If you bump too much you can overwork the brass and eventually cause case head separation. It’s an important topic.
After FL resizing .30-06 brass to create .25-06 brass, the rounds were difficult to chamber. The OAL was consistently 2.501-2.508. Because i'm kinda OCD on this stuff, I'm going to get Whidden micrometer case gage to ensure headspace is correct before I trim 200 pieces of brass.
I'd love to see you do a head to head 6.5 PRC/300 wm test....
As always, great video! I've only used the Hornady comparator kit for a year, and its 0.400" datum piece chamfer depth has increased 0.0015", meaning that my prior headspace measurements now seem too short...I might add that by having a go gauge with actual length printed on the side, this can always refer one back to absolute measurements to compare with actual SAAMI specs (which lets you know what the chamfer depths are on comparators)
Help me understand. The Hornady tool gives BOTH absolute and relative measurements. Why is the SAC set better (i.e. the Cadillac)? Love the look/fit/finish of the machined parts, but if Hornady is accurate (as demonstrated) I don't understand why it's down on the list just above a random plastic bushing....
I agree. Not sure why I would pay more for an expensive set to get the same info as Hornady. I rather spend the extra money on ammo to practice. Am I missing something? I wonder if this video was sponsored by SAC.
The SAC combines the headspace and bullet comparator tools.
The SAC kit mimics the exact lead angle and dimensions as the actual chamber in your gun. For the headspace gauges, the shoulder angle is the exact same as the chamber. For the bullet comparator inserts, the lead angle mimics the actual throat in your chamber and touches the bullet at the exact same spot on the ogive as it would in your chamber. It's to make it so it's the most accurate way to measure relative to the actual chamber of your gun.
@@xxshiftlockxx This video proves otherwise. Get the idea in principle, but in practice this does not hold water. First, every chamber varies in dimensions so SAC cannot possibly match my actual chamber. Second, and more importantly, if the end result is a relative measurement vs. absolute, and if the Hornady produced an accurate result, then SAC isn't better. I'm not promoting Hornady, I'm just trying to justify buying the SAC. With a good reason I probably would.
@@schmidtwoodworks533 You are correct in this observation and assessment. Who says the shoulder angle will be the same in the SAC gauge as found in your chamber? or in your unfired, or fired case for that matter? There well could be (and will be) variations in these angles all the time. The spec given by SAMMI is a datum circle....not a shoulder angle. Actual and hypothetical results will vary. I rest my case. Grin.
I imagine, if you already know how to measure headspace, this makes sense.
You don’t need to measure headspace to make accurate ammo!
You dont need to use toilet paper after you go number 2 either.
@@williamkillingsworth2619holy smokes!!! Almost fell out of my recliner!!!!😂
Lol
I've asked this question on about 10 videos and not one person has been courteous enough to answer me:
What is this gentleman's FULL name please for the 11th time? (I cannot understand what he is saying when he says "hey Gavin _____ here")
Is his last name actually Toobe or is that a play on "TH-cam"?
Thank you.
So basically anything is better that a plastic ring, copy that!
Wish you had used actual brass cases rather than guages would make more sense
No captions - please turn on captions. I am deaf.
I will take a look, I wish they were automatically added!
Rich- it looks like the CC is working on my videos automatically, but it takes a while for them to be automatically generated. Please try a bit later. Thanks!
@@Ultimatereloader GOOD MAN for following up on that for him Gavin.
Scotch tape lol
Whidden Gunworks
Wilson all the way, screw horandy
I was gonna get the Hornady kit. Not anymore. Get woke go broke
Read/watch other reviews about Hornady set. It works well. Not sure why he is comparing it to a plastic bushing.
Hornady pulled back on the wokeness. They sent an apology letter out today to their employees. So they no longer are forced to take the vaccine, nore lose their job.
@@D70340 thats great I heard that story today hopefully all the ammo makers will come out against Brandons policy.
@@D70340 yea because of the backlash and them worried about losing money. The fact that they even caved and sent out the first letter put a bad taste in my mouth. Fuck them
420 69 gavin.
Drop it off at Joe's cause he has all the tools and will do it for free if you take him a 12 pack of non anhiser bush when you pick it up. Note take him the 12 pack when you pick it up not when you drop it off.
Reloading is a waste of time and $ cheaper to buy ammo and I’ve put reload against quality shelf ammo see absolutely zero difference
And when the shelves are empty or have only non-quality ammo sitting on them, what to do then? Modern reloading isn’t about saving time or money. It’s about shooting what you want when you want regardless of market trends. Now, I would agree that it’s cheaper to buy factory ammo over empty brass. That way, you get to shoot the factory stuff then save the brass for reloading. Buy other components in bulk to make each round cheaper and to keep your stock up then shoot to your hearts content.
There’s also the fact that many of us have perfectly functional firearms that they don’t even make ammo for anymore and the only way to utilize those firearms is by reloading. There is literally no other way around it. I’m not sure who or what ever started the myth that reloading was cheaper than just buying factory ammo but that hasn’t been true for several decades now, if ever really.
@@ryanwilson5936 Gotcha gotcha buddy unfortunately for me I can’t afford to reload and even if I wanted to I can’t find stuff to reload and I have no clue absolutely no clue how to reload
@@ryanwilson5936 I find that if I have the brass and the tools, reloading is somewhat cheaper. However since covid powder and primers are quite expensive, but I'm well stocked.
With all due respect comparing reloads to factory off the shelf ammunition.
While it is true you can buy bulk ammo fairly cheaply, I don't get the same accuracy as I do from my reloads. Before COVID, I had calculated my .223 reloads were costing about $0.82 each. That's for a 62gn BTHP, running about 2800fps from a bolt action with a 24" barrel, making a 0.5" bug hole, 5 round group @ 100yrds. The closest factory ammo I could find is Hornady Black, 62gn BTFMJ, running about 3300fps from the same rifle making a 2" group @ 100yrds. The cost averaged out to over $1.10 per round.
Now, did I save money? No, not at all, but I did get to do more shooting for the money I spent.
The other cost to consider is initial outlay for equipment. Yes, this can get really expensive. I paid out about $520 initially. I later found I could have reduced that with better research on the subject.
Have I recouped my expense from ammo savings? I do have enough supplies that yes, I have broken even.
Now, with primer prices the way they are, I believe a person will have a very hard time reloading cheaper than buying off the shelf.
The one exception, if you are chasing the accuracy bug. I believe reloading is the best way to get there. That does depend on what a person considers acceptable accuracy. Should someone consider a 2" group @ 100yds acceptable then reloading is not for that person, IMO.
I enjoy going to the range and practicing. I've recently been out on a hunting trip which I greatly enjoyed and like the meat from it.
In conclusion, the benefits of reloading are more esoteric in nature than financial. One should really think about their goals before getting into reloading.
Let's admit at least one truth...rifles and the shooting sports are not cheap. The cost of entry has come down a great deal with modern manufacturing. With a lot of research a person can build a respectable rifle for a few hundred dollars versus the thousands it used to cost. Good ammo however, has always been not the easiest to get.
That's my ¢2, for what it's worth.
@@GB-zi6qr I feel ya just in my experience I haven’t seen enough diff in accuracy
I’m afraid your instruction is a bit too fast and too cursory for me. Lost me at the donut explanation.
This might be the dumbest video I've seen on headspace yet. You didn't even measure headspace, all you did was measure your go/no-go gauges.