Seriously, At the end of every video when he signs off, how is it possible not to have a smile on your face. It's just such a warm and caring sign off. Makes me want to get recording even if i was watching this on the loo or in bed or anywhere.
I feel the same way. He's so positive that even though I don't own or plan on owning these mics, compared to my Audio Technica, I just love to hear/see him talk. he's a positive light out there :D
I honestly love how you do your mic shootouts. They're always loaded with information, and the way you switch between mics is the best way I've seen to actually allow me to compare the two sounds (at least for your voice, haha). I wish more people would do their comparisons in a similar fashion.
You can tell that the neumann tlm 103 has a bit more bass response when talking at normal distance, I can hear the difference in the 2 mics. When getting closer to the Warm audio wq87 it sounds almost the same as the Neumann from the farther distance.
I was wearing headphones. ^^; idk, i tend to find listening to shoot outs without looking at the video to be the best way to ensure bias doesn't get in the way. You'd be surprised at the difference it can make.
Me either. I couldnt tell at all when they switched. A client is never going to notice if we couldn't notice and we knew in advance it was 2 different mics.
Listening on Klipsch earbuds: The Neumann's low end is quite extended and sounds much bigger than reality. I guess this is why it pops so easily. The mics sounded otherwise identical on the earbuds. Listening on Sennheiser HD600 headphones: There's a difference in the upper mids. The WA-87 slightly reveals unflattering mouth noises in the upper mids and in some cases sounded like it was popping electrically (could be mouth noises). The Neumann sounded smoother, but that could be because the extended low end is masking noises in the upper mids. I wonder how the captured audio fares when EQ'd. I have noticed that some mics generate sound that holds up well to EQ and other mics do not (the sound can become brittle). That seems more important ultimately since it drastically improves versatility to be able to EQ a sound. I noticed this when I tested Sweetwater Sound's mic shootout.
I have both of these mics including an original U87. The WA87 does a good job at getting that 3D sound synonymous with Neumann and has great clarity but can sound a little dull or scooped at times. The TLM 103 is great for preserving mid-highs as it is brighter than the others and has a huge bottom end but can cause sibilance. The U87 is much better than either of these but it sometimes has too much low end. Point is, you need multiple mics for multiple applications. And your gear is going to affect the sound. But if you want a workhorse under $1k then get the WA87. It records more versatile sources with less eq or processing.
To me, the TLM103 seems thick and present in the low end complimenting the timbers in your voice while the WA87 is more bright. BEST or BETTER is subjective, I agree on that 100%. What I would say is that depending on the project you're working on, each mic will do you well, RESPECTIVELY. :)
Yeah, this. I'd really like to hear the gent's voice live before deciding. :) In general I thought the TLM103 came across as thick in the midrange and mid-lows, very warm coloring overall; and the WA87 possibly more transparent. But it's *VERY* hard to judge what effect the mic is having without hearing the reference sound directly!
The Warm is an interesting mix of low/mid/high. The 103 definitely has a lower, smoother timbre to it. However, I would say you can't fully judge the Warm by this video, since Mike would be able to effectively work proximity/placement by using just the Warm alone, rather than speaking in the middle of the two mics, and that could make the Warm sound more appealing (not that it sounds bad here.)
Most of the video you're facing the TLM 103 so it's easy to get the idea that the TLM is much better. You get a better idea around 7:03 of what the mics are capable of.
I think they both sound great. The WA87 actually sounds a bit more like I remember the U87 sounding, it has the duller vintage vibe to it while the TLM103 is cleaner and a bit hyped. I'd say the 103 fits your voice better out of the box, but with some tiny EQ adjustments I'd like the WA87 just as much I believe.
The 103 sounds great on it's own. It probably would be great for narration and sparse mixes. I can't help but think the Warm 87 will probably sit better in a full mix.
The Warm sounds a bit brighter, more mid range slightly harsh on your voice. The TLM103 sounds smoother on your voice and better overall from what I can hear.
Thank you, Mike, for posting this very helpful video. There is an obvious difference between the two mics. This video has reaffirmed my respect for the TLM 103. (OFF-TOPIC: Still interested in a video featuring a test of the Saramonic SR-VRM1's preamp noise, especially as it compares to the Zoom H5.)
For years I've used U87 in studios so this week I rented one to try out at home, and... It without EQ it sounded terrible! On the other hand my TLM103 sounds fantastic out of the box with no EQ. In fact, the only processing I do on the TLM103 is to use very slight compression and a limiter. And that in a nutshell is why (like my MKH416) the price is worth ever penny.
@@dereklanevo just get the wa87r2 u wont be disappointed. I went ahead and got it. Their isn't enough reviews yet. I definitely like it better then my Tlm 103, and Even my NEUMANN u87 AI.. Weird outcome
Hello Mike! They both sound great, but the Warm sounds like the mids are a little stronger. Not bad, just different. Like it would give a hint of broadcast-processed sound without having to do a thing. (I hope that makes sense) That being said, the TLM just sounded transparent with no coloration by comparison. Like many mics, they have a unique character. I think either mic would serve someone well, but if someone had both, I could see different uses for each.
There’s definitely some more detail in the high end and a richer bass response on the TLM103. For the price, the Warm Audio is great. But I definitely like how that Neumann is sounding
I personally don't like the sound of the WA87 very much, and I noticed this last video also. To me it just sounds.. muddy. Vague in comparison to the all-mighty muscular TLM 103. I found them rather different, mainly due to the low end response. The TLM 103 sounds so smooth, so.. tender.
The WA has slightly harsher upper mids. I prefer the voice of TLM103 for this case use. The other thing that’s often neglected in reviews is specification tolerance and build quality. Neumann mics are extremely well made and are known to last 30, 40, 50 years.
For your voice - I much prefer the TLM103. It's a nice, rich warm sound whereas the the WA87 is uhm, less warm and a bit brittle at normal distance in comparison.
Both of these are designed to resemble the U87. The Neumann has more going on down low at 6" distance and I love it. It is also richer on the top end. The Neumann's low-mids do not change much with closer proximity, you hear it more in the bass. The Warm is a darker mic with a tighter bottom end, which increases heavily in the low-mids with closer proximity, which makes sense because it is modeled after a *VINTAGE* U87. The TLM103 is going to be more akin to the modern U87ai. Both of these mics represent their counterparts well, as the U87ai and Vintage U87 are very different microphones, both still excellent in their own respect. Great comparison!
Until this shootout I had the Warm Audio WA87 on my wish list, but it doesn't compete with the smooth sounds of the Neumann TLM 103 (also on my wish list)...price wise the difference narrows when you get these two down under.
with headphones i'm completely sold on the tlm103. in every video it's just nicer sounding than what it's compared with imo. my ears are sensitive to sharp sounds and the smooth warm sound it has is just right for me. i recently got my first mic after saying fuck it lets do this music thing and based on budget a couple months back I went with the at2020 to afford the rest of the stuff and while i'm fairly happy with it, it's just not what i'm looking for. since investing in some good headphones i can hear such a clear difference in all these videos. i kept wondering why no matter what i did with my vocals i just couldn't find that same smoothness and warmth in them if they were loud enough which now I understand a lot of the reason why lol. that mic sounds absolutely incredible no matter who uses it and regardless of the style of music etc they do. i wasn't ready to spend over a grand on just the mic but i'm returning the at2020 now and ordering a neumann here soon. i really want high potential in my recordings to sound equivalent to professional musicians. can't wait to get one of these
I just wanted to say this really quick about the Neuman effect. The Neuman effect is when some one think a mic sounds better based on price. Saying that the 103 sounds better than the WA87, means that you are not sure what each mic is trying to achieve. The WA87 is used for a warm sound (Hence the name). The 103 is built to have a really high, high end and a really low, low end. It is meant to give a really sharp sound, which is why it can pop like crazy. The WA87 is meant to have a very bass heavy warm sound, which is why it is used for broadcast. Over all Both are Fantastic. There is very little difference, between them other than the price. Even then I think plenty of people will agree that the TLM is horribly overpriced when compared to, say, a Shure sm7b, which comes in at a lower price than both and still sounds just as good, and serves more functionality than either of the Mics shown.
Their both very nice microphones. The WA87 is an excellent copy of the U87 style mic with a Transformer. The 103 is cleaner being transformerless so that’s why it’s known for sibilance at times. Mike can make any microphone sound great.. 👍
Interesting. I'm listening through an Apollo with my headphones and I can tell a noticeable difference in the bottom end. The 103 definitely has that Neumann sound as they tend to have.
The TLM 103 sounds more transparent to my ears. It may just be the point where the boost is, but it comes off as a little brighter but not in an annoying way, but in a way that's more present and less mid range focused compared to the WA87
I'm going to be watching more of these shoot-out videos because I always think they're interesting, but not this one. I'm a VO guy who owns the TLM 103 and I love it. My booking percentage has risen since I've gotten it, including a Corona campaign in the fall.
TLM has more bass, which in some parts sounded somewhat unpleasant imo, it's almost like an "octaver" effect, where bass is playing same note as guitar, I think it can get fatiguing over time. Warm otoh sounded a little thin from the low end in some parts, but most of the video it sounded fine. I think the TLM handles the proximity effect better/cleaner, where as I can hear some subtle distortion going in WA87 during proximity effect, maybe some resonance going there.
Wow, I was on the point of buying a b-stock "wa87" at a good price, but the tlm103 in your shootout made it sound like it was behind a 10 inch high density rockwool panel. Tlm103 could definitely be better as it lacks some midrange compared to a real u87, but it is a high quality microphone, with great bass and smooth modern top end, clearly on another league than that wa87 which should be gone and forgotten like most other clones, pelusos and other chinese manufactured knock-offs which are mainly backed by marketing on forums like gearslutz and groupdiy. Yes, I know that warm audio, unlike peluso and others, use mostly quality components and only assembling is made in China - that's why I was on the point of buying one, but that's not enough for a good mic. One thing I noticed about these clones: they always get the bass wrong:)
Great video - THX 👍🏼 I work with both mics. The question however is which recordings they are used for. Undoubtedly the TLM103 has better results ♡. For singing classical music, ballads or playing acoustic guitar... the TLM is excellent and worth its price. When it comes to singing for pop and all modern and electronic music, the WA87 is great, thanks to the (U87) options it's even more efficient (and it is less expensive!). I think with the right equipment (e.g. Neve RND, Focusrite...) and professional post-production nobody will really be able to hear which of the two mics was used. Both are excellent and well worth the price.
Late. Late viewer. I was just set to buy the Warm 87. I already own and use daily the TLM103. Why would I want to add another mic? My thoughts were based upon the patterns of the two mics. But, this video was incredibly timely for me as in the voice over world, the pattern issue is rather moot. Working very close to the mic is the big reason I bought the Neumann to begin with. You can work 1/4" from the mic without too many issues. I found an incredible $10 pop filter that fits like a sock over the Neumann. Caught it on Amazon which I searched for the best pop filters for specific mics. A GREAT $10 purchase and I can see over the screen. Great video comparison and it proves that Google SEO works like a charm.
The Neumann definitely has a smoother bottom end, with deeper lows. The Warm Audio has a brighter top end, atleast the way they are EQ'd here, if your not running them flat. If you are running them flat, then I'm convinced that the 2 Mics could be EQ'd too be so similar that you wouldn't hear the difference. I'm sitting hear listening to the recording with a McIntosh set-up. McIntosh speaks for itself. I've watched many of your videos, and I'm not sure what EQ'ing your using if any. Great videos by the way, Mike, your videos have helped me make a couple of selections, in regards to Mics. The Shure KSM 32 was one such purchase after you compared it with the TLM 103.
Something about the WA87 feels like its rattling around in my skull. The frequencies sound garbled and chewed up in the high mids and highs. The TLM103 has an air boost that makes your voice sound "sweeter", while the rest of the frequencies sound flat to me. I prefer the TLM 103.
Wow, just in the opening there is a significant difference. Iike the Neumann much more. It's sounds bigger, full er and richer, where the Warm Audio sounds flat
He is saying that there are purposewise differencies. Yes there are but its also about how much Information a Mic transports, the more it does the finer it is. In this Example to me the tlm 103 is more fine so there is more information in my DAW.
TLM has more proximity effect but not in a good way. There seems to be a little bit more top end on the 103. The 87 sounds fantastic though. Your voice sounds great on both. If I had to pick one for you, I'd have to say the 103. There's a WA87-R2 out now and it looks like they've discontinued the first generation.
I like them both. For him he needs to climb up on the Warm a little bit more but it brings out the upper mids a little better. The lip sounds might get a bit too much so you might need to pull a bit of top end out of it which is what the Neuman is not so good at.
The Proximity Effect seems to be very different on both mics. With the TLM having much stronger Proximity Effect. So at the same distance it has more low end etc
The WA87 sounds less sibilant to me with more low mids. I think your choice really depends on the voice type and the sound you're going for. They're both very close in quality.
I sing male rock vocals into an AT4033. Q: Since voice, mike placement, and EQ make such a big difference, what difference would 'better' mike (eg the WA87 or TLM103) realistically make?
Definitely the TLM has a more rounded and complete perception of the your voice. It serves great all frequencies all over the spectrum. Especially comparing WA87 to TLM it looks like the WARM microphone obviously lacks bass and sounds more mid-ranged. NOT BAD but as you mentioned different. Depending on the talent's voice and taste it can be a "go to" mic for voice over or vocals. Anyway the comparison was helpful in deed. Thanks!!!
Great Video as always, Mike! The WA87 and the TLM 103 are going to sound different, as the WA87 uses a transformer, which gives it a "softer fidelity" and saturated lows, much like a real u87. The TLM (Transformer Less Microphone) will have a tighter sound, because it does not have a transformer in the signal path. If a voice has more sibilant qualities, the WA87 will smooth that out. The price of the Warm mic, includes a very nice shock mount, so on average, you get more for less with the Warm. With your great voice, both microphones work for me! The TLM 103 has more cut, good for commercial work going above a music bed, the WA87 may be great for narration or audio books, but either or could easily be equalized to taste. For those looking for Neumann u87ai to WA87 shootouts, even for voice over, there are a few already on You Tube look at the Dale Pro Audio video for example. A microphone overlooked is the Neumann TLM 102. Again there are shootouts galore, but I prefer it to the TLM 103, for my voice. I did take the internal foam out of the 102, because I had an old u87 that was destroyed, because, Neumann used to put a foam dampener below the capsule, and when that deteriorated it stuck to the capsule and innards. The foam will eventually do the same thing in the 102, and I am not going to chance it! Keep up the great work! Oh, I would lend you my 102, but I use it everyday!
The warm audio u87 was made to be like the old Neumann u87, not the AI version , that’s why the tlm 103 is brighter because it’s basically the same as a u87 AI just without a transformer
Ok I'm going to differ from the majority and say I preferred the sound of the WA. The Neumann was good too, but I've noticed it has this, what I think of as "electronic" sound to it. Which probably makes no sense to anyone reading this, but I know what I mean ;) Its perhaps as if your voice is coming out of it in 3D. Hard to describe, and no doubt some will prefer that quality but I found the WA easier to listen to, more natural. Just slightly though.
I could hear a difference on my iPhone speakers! Both sound great but the WA87 just sounds “sharper”. The TLM103 (ironically) feels warmer, smoother. Sounds like absolute butter. Great video as always!
A lot of people using the word “sharper” online these days. Not something I’ve heard in the U.K. What does it mean, clearer, crisper or more treble perhaps? Cheers
it sounds more like the u87 its claiming to be inspired by. tlm103 is just a beautiful smooth flat pattern with a slight high frequency bump like all LDCs by design
You should do a mic review on Studio Projects c1 it’s considered nicknamed the Neumann killer sounds amazing and I just purchased Neumann tlm102 and almost identical
"Is there a huge difference between them?" YES! I don't like the TLM103 (in fact: not _any_ microphone in the TLM range...) but it sounds way better than the WA-87. It seems the WA-87 is lacking low frequency content, or it rolls-off too early... Also the WA-87 sound more "midrangy"
No, it doesn't "roll off" too early. It just doesn't accentuate the lows as much as the 103. Frankly for voice-over work, the 103 probably the preferred choice here, but not by much. For recording vocal tracks in music, the bottom end of the 103 would inevitably be shelved down or just rolled off anyway...the 87 a much better choice for that job.
The proximity effect of the TLM 103 is to die for, it really sounds amazing
The Neumann sounds a bit more solid and smoother, but then again, your whisper room really makes most mics sound really good.
Seriously, At the end of every video when he signs off, how is it possible not to have a smile on your face. It's just such a warm and caring sign off. Makes me want to get recording even if i was watching this on the loo or in bed or anywhere.
I feel the same way. He's so positive that even though I don't own or plan on owning these mics, compared to my Audio Technica, I just love to hear/see him talk. he's a positive light out there :D
I honestly love how you do your mic shootouts. They're always loaded with information, and the way you switch between mics is the best way I've seen to actually allow me to compare the two sounds (at least for your voice, haha). I wish more people would do their comparisons in a similar fashion.
I'd have to go with the tlm103 on this one. I feel it has more thickness while having a similar high end as the WA87
Totally agree
You can tell that the neumann tlm 103 has a bit more bass response when talking at normal distance, I can hear the difference in the 2 mics. When getting closer to the Warm audio wq87 it sounds almost the same as the Neumann from the farther distance.
I put this video on in the background as I was working and honestly, I couldn't pick out AT ALL when they switched. They both sound fantastic
Devon Black maybe listen to the Video with headphones, one sounds thinner.
I won't say wich, because i don't want to influence youtube.
I was wearing headphones. ^^;
idk, i tend to find listening to shoot outs without looking at the video to be the best way to ensure bias doesn't get in the way. You'd be surprised at the difference it can make.
Me either. I couldnt tell at all when they switched. A client is never going to notice if we couldn't notice and we knew in advance it was 2 different mics.
The best video I’ve seen comparing these mics. Thanks for taking the time! 🙏🏼
On my studio speakers, the Neumann sounds slightly warmer and smoother but, for the price, that WA87 is hard to beat.
Listening on Klipsch earbuds: The Neumann's low end is quite extended and sounds much bigger than reality. I guess this is why it pops so easily. The mics sounded otherwise identical on the earbuds. Listening on Sennheiser HD600 headphones: There's a difference in the upper mids. The WA-87 slightly reveals unflattering mouth noises in the upper mids and in some cases sounded like it was popping electrically (could be mouth noises). The Neumann sounded smoother, but that could be because the extended low end is masking noises in the upper mids. I wonder how the captured audio fares when EQ'd. I have noticed that some mics generate sound that holds up well to EQ and other mics do not (the sound can become brittle). That seems more important ultimately since it drastically improves versatility to be able to EQ a sound. I noticed this when I tested Sweetwater Sound's mic shootout.
I have both of these mics including an original U87. The WA87 does a good job at getting that 3D sound synonymous with Neumann and has great clarity but can sound a little dull or scooped at times. The TLM 103 is great for preserving mid-highs as it is brighter than the others and has a huge bottom end but can cause sibilance. The U87 is much better than either of these but it sometimes has too much low end. Point is, you need multiple mics for multiple applications. And your gear is going to affect the sound. But if you want a workhorse under $1k then get the WA87. It records more versatile sources with less eq or processing.
12:59 The best part of this video!! “Record something amazing!” Yessir! I will!!
To me, the TLM103 seems thick and present in the low end complimenting the timbers in your voice while the WA87 is more bright. BEST or BETTER is subjective, I agree on that 100%. What I would say is that depending on the project you're working on, each mic will do you well, RESPECTIVELY. :)
He has wood in his voice? :O
Yeah, this. I'd really like to hear the gent's voice live before deciding. :) In general I thought the TLM103 came across as thick in the midrange and mid-lows, very warm coloring overall; and the WA87 possibly more transparent. But it's *VERY* hard to judge what effect the mic is having without hearing the reference sound directly!
The TLM103 sounds smoother than the WA87, and there IS a notable difference, specially in the low end.
They both sound really good. The WA 87 has a really nice broadcast quality to it. It's surprisingly pretty sounding for its price point.
You might like the bass rolloff feature on the U87. It lets you get close to the mic, but takes out the close-proximity boominess.
Or you could just eq in post
For me as a singer, i feel that i would need less Eq work with the warm Wa87 love is nice top end. and for the price is a no brainer. good job !
Wa87 has multiple pollar patterns and bass roll off which the TLM does not have. I will buy the TLM 103 next. I just got the wa87
the TLM sounds $400 better than the Warm
fatmanfalling lol
more like 700 better wa87 does not sound natural and realistic like at all.
bro i read this comment as he said it
lol, basically
I'd say even the 600 euro TLM102 is worth it more than the WA87 unless you are just going for looks.
Not liking the sound of it at all.
I would like to see a video comparison of united studio twin87 to the u87.
From what I can tell the Neumann definitely has a richer sound, but the Warm still sounds great.
And your microphone review shootout method is the best. Really let's people get a grip on the mic.
The Warm is an interesting mix of low/mid/high. The 103 definitely has a lower, smoother timbre to it. However, I would say you can't fully judge the Warm by this video, since Mike would be able to effectively work proximity/placement by using just the Warm alone, rather than speaking in the middle of the two mics, and that could make the Warm sound more appealing (not that it sounds bad here.)
Most of the video you're facing the TLM 103 so it's easy to get the idea that the TLM is much better. You get a better idea around 7:03 of what the mics are capable of.
I think they both sound great. The WA87 actually sounds a bit more like I remember the U87 sounding, it has the duller vintage vibe to it while the TLM103 is cleaner and a bit hyped. I'd say the 103 fits your voice better out of the box, but with some tiny EQ adjustments I'd like the WA87 just as much I believe.
The 103 sounds great on it's own. It probably would be great for narration and sparse mixes. I can't help but think the Warm 87 will probably sit better in a full mix.
The Warm sounds a bit brighter, more mid range slightly harsh on your voice. The TLM103 sounds smoother on your voice and better overall from what I can hear.
Thank you, Mike, for posting this very helpful video. There is an obvious difference between the two mics. This video has reaffirmed my respect for the TLM 103.
(OFF-TOPIC: Still interested in a video featuring a test of the Saramonic SR-VRM1's preamp noise, especially as it compares to the Zoom H5.)
For years I've used U87 in studios so this week I rented one to try out at home, and... It without EQ it sounded terrible! On the other hand my TLM103 sounds fantastic out of the box with no EQ. In fact, the only processing I do on the TLM103 is to use very slight compression and a limiter. And that in a nutshell is why (like my MKH416) the price is worth ever penny.
great video! can you please redo this with the Tlm 103 and warm audio WA-87R2? I have a lot of people telling me its a better version of the Tlm 103
Agreed! I'm searching for those comparisons right now.
@@dereklanevo just get the wa87r2 u wont be disappointed. I went ahead and got it. Their isn't enough reviews yet. I definitely like it better then my Tlm 103, and Even my NEUMANN u87 AI.. Weird outcome
Hello Mike! They both sound great, but the Warm sounds like the mids are a little stronger. Not bad, just different. Like it would give a hint of broadcast-processed sound without having to do a thing. (I hope that makes sense)
That being said, the TLM just sounded transparent with no coloration by comparison. Like many mics, they have a unique character. I think either mic would serve someone well, but if someone had both, I could see different uses for each.
I'm just impressed you actually didn't pop the Neumann. Nice job.
Lost Compositions what do you mean pop it?
@@michaelbevel8539 I think he meant "popping his p's" into it.
The warm was definitely quite brighter but it definitely sounded great. It would depend on who the user is.
There’s definitely some more detail in the high end and a richer bass response on the TLM103. For the price, the Warm Audio is great. But I definitely like how that Neumann is sounding
I personally don't like the sound of the WA87 very much, and I noticed this last video also. To me it just sounds.. muddy. Vague in comparison to the all-mighty muscular TLM 103. I found them rather different, mainly due to the low end response. The TLM 103 sounds so smooth, so.. tender.
The WA has slightly harsher upper mids. I prefer the voice of TLM103 for this case use. The other thing that’s often neglected in reviews is specification tolerance and build quality. Neumann mics are extremely well made and are known to last 30, 40, 50 years.
Don't rely on this video if you use mics for singing or instruments.
the TLM 103 is very nice with the Avalon 737
For your voice - I much prefer the TLM103. It's a nice, rich warm sound whereas the the WA87 is uhm, less warm and a bit brittle at normal distance in comparison.
Both of these are designed to resemble the U87. The Neumann has more going on down low at 6" distance and I love it. It is also richer on the top end. The Neumann's low-mids do not change much with closer proximity, you hear it more in the bass. The Warm is a darker mic with a tighter bottom end, which increases heavily in the low-mids with closer proximity, which makes sense because it is modeled after a *VINTAGE* U87. The TLM103 is going to be more akin to the modern U87ai. Both of these mics represent their counterparts well, as the U87ai and Vintage U87 are very different microphones, both still excellent in their own respect. Great comparison!
the best comparisons are where the exact recorded sound is run back and forth between the mics in 5 sec loops.
Until this shootout I had the Warm Audio WA87 on my wish list, but it doesn't compete with the smooth sounds of the Neumann TLM 103 (also on my wish list)...price wise the difference narrows when you get these two down under.
I listened to this whole video with my AirPods Pro and wasn’t watching it and I swear to God I couldn’t tell when you were switching mics!
Then you need to watch this time :)
with headphones i'm completely sold on the tlm103. in every video it's just nicer sounding than what it's compared with imo. my ears are sensitive to sharp sounds and the smooth warm sound it has is just right for me. i recently got my first mic after saying fuck it lets do this music thing and based on budget a couple months back I went with the at2020 to afford the rest of the stuff and while i'm fairly happy with it, it's just not what i'm looking for. since investing in some good headphones i can hear such a clear difference in all these videos. i kept wondering why no matter what i did with my vocals i just couldn't find that same smoothness and warmth in them if they were loud enough which now I understand a lot of the reason why lol. that mic sounds absolutely incredible no matter who uses it and regardless of the style of music etc they do. i wasn't ready to spend over a grand on just the mic but i'm returning the at2020 now and ordering a neumann here soon. i really want high potential in my recordings to sound equivalent to professional musicians. can't wait to get one of these
I just wanted to say this really quick about the Neuman effect. The Neuman effect is when some one think a mic sounds better based on price. Saying that the 103 sounds better than the WA87, means that you are not sure what each mic is trying to achieve. The WA87 is used for a warm sound (Hence the name). The 103 is built to have a really high, high end and a really low, low end. It is meant to give a really sharp sound, which is why it can pop like crazy. The WA87 is meant to have a very bass heavy warm sound, which is why it is used for broadcast.
Over all Both are Fantastic. There is very little difference, between them other than the price. Even then I think plenty of people will agree that the TLM is horribly overpriced when compared to, say, a Shure sm7b, which comes in at a lower price than both and still sounds just as good, and serves more functionality than either of the Mics shown.
Great reviews on both microphones. Thank You!
I am use tlm 103 mic in our studio. it is sweet & clean voal but not depth. i see your demo warm audio is depth vocal. good price
Their both very nice microphones. The WA87 is an excellent copy of the U87 style mic with a Transformer. The 103 is cleaner being transformerless so that’s why it’s known for sibilance at times. Mike can make any microphone sound great.. 👍
Interesting. I'm listening through an Apollo with my headphones and I can tell a noticeable difference in the bottom end. The 103 definitely has that Neumann sound as they tend to have.
The TLM 103 sounds more transparent to my ears. It may just be the point where the boost is, but it comes off as a little brighter but not in an annoying way, but in a way that's more present and less mid range focused compared to the WA87
The 103 sounds cleaner and smoother so I would go with that one because smoothness is what my main goal is
I'm going to be watching more of these shoot-out videos because I always think they're interesting, but not this one. I'm a VO guy who owns the TLM 103 and I love it. My booking percentage has risen since I've gotten it, including a Corona campaign in the fall.
TLM has more bass, which in some parts sounded somewhat unpleasant imo, it's almost like an "octaver" effect, where bass is playing same note as guitar, I think it can get fatiguing over time. Warm otoh sounded a little thin from the low end in some parts, but most of the video it sounded fine. I think the TLM handles the proximity effect better/cleaner, where as I can hear some subtle distortion going in WA87 during proximity effect, maybe some resonance going there.
I think You sounded better on the 87. TLM didn’t seem to handle plosives as well but the bottom end on the TLM is pretty nice
Wow, I was on the point of buying a b-stock "wa87" at a good price, but the tlm103 in your shootout made it sound like it was behind a 10 inch high density rockwool panel. Tlm103 could definitely be better as it lacks some midrange compared to a real u87, but it is a high quality microphone, with great bass and smooth modern top end, clearly on another league than that wa87 which should be gone and forgotten like most other clones, pelusos and other chinese manufactured knock-offs which are mainly backed by marketing on forums like gearslutz and groupdiy. Yes, I know that warm audio, unlike peluso and others, use mostly quality components and only assembling is made in China - that's why I was on the point of buying one, but that's not enough for a good mic. One thing I noticed about these clones: they always get the bass wrong:)
Great video - THX 👍🏼
I work with both mics.
The question however is which recordings they are used for.
Undoubtedly the TLM103 has better results ♡. For singing classical music, ballads or playing acoustic guitar... the TLM is excellent and worth its price.
When it comes to singing for pop and all modern and electronic music, the WA87 is great, thanks to the (U87) options it's even more efficient (and it is less expensive!).
I think with the right equipment (e.g. Neve RND, Focusrite...) and professional post-production nobody will really be able to hear which of the two mics was used.
Both are excellent and well worth the price.
Late. Late viewer. I was just set to buy the Warm 87. I already own and use daily the TLM103. Why would I want to add another mic? My thoughts were based upon the patterns of the two mics. But, this video was incredibly timely for me as in the voice over world, the pattern issue is rather moot. Working very close to the mic is the big reason I bought the Neumann to begin with. You can work 1/4" from the mic without too many issues. I found an incredible $10 pop filter that fits like a sock over the Neumann. Caught it on Amazon which I searched for the best pop filters for specific mics. A GREAT $10 purchase and I can see over the screen. Great video comparison and it proves that Google SEO works like a charm.
The Neumann definitely has a smoother bottom end, with deeper lows. The Warm Audio has a brighter top end, atleast the way they are EQ'd here, if your not running them flat. If you are running them flat, then I'm convinced that the 2 Mics could be EQ'd too be so similar that you wouldn't hear the difference. I'm sitting hear listening to the recording with a McIntosh set-up. McIntosh speaks for itself. I've watched many of your videos, and I'm not sure what EQ'ing your using if any. Great videos by the way, Mike, your videos have helped me make a couple of selections, in regards to Mics. The Shure KSM 32 was one such purchase after you compared it with the TLM 103.
I'm sure you can make the warm wa87 cover the 40% gap with your mixer.
Can you do a part two video? Or like a longer video on the WA87 only?
The 103 gives off more fullness to the tone, because of the rich bass. But the Warm holds its own in terms of clarity and presence.
Do have an opinion on the differences between the TLM102 and TLM103? There seems to be a lot of debate on the internet about this.
After watching your other 87 videos I prefer the ECM-87 over the WA-87, and I would have liked to hear it against the TLM-103.
WA87 remained clear when you moved close up to it. The TLM 103 had a nicer top in general, but became muddier up close.
Something about the WA87 feels like its rattling around in my skull. The frequencies sound garbled and chewed up in the high mids and highs. The TLM103 has an air boost that makes your voice sound "sweeter", while the rest of the frequencies sound flat to me. I prefer the TLM 103.
Wow, just in the opening there is a significant difference. Iike the Neumann much more. It's sounds bigger, full er and richer, where the Warm Audio sounds flat
He is saying that there are purposewise differencies. Yes there are but its also about how much Information a Mic transports, the more it does the finer it is. In this Example to me the tlm 103 is more fine so there is more information in my DAW.
TLM has more proximity effect but not in a good way. There seems to be a little bit more top end on the 103. The 87 sounds fantastic though. Your voice sounds great on both. If I had to pick one for you, I'd have to say the 103. There's a WA87-R2 out now and it looks like they've discontinued the first generation.
The 103 is warmer, ironically. The WA87 is scooped in the bottom end. It's not a U87, or, as good as the WA87 for your voice, imho.
They're simply different. The TLM103 has more bass, while the WA87 has a flatter frequency response. They both sound great.
I like them both. For him he needs to climb up on the Warm a little bit more but it brings out the upper mids a little better. The lip sounds might get a bit too much so you might need to pull a bit of top end out of it which is what the Neuman is not so good at.
Wow. The difference is Night and Day. Your video justified the price of the Neumann.
The Proximity Effect seems to be very different on both mics. With the TLM having much stronger Proximity Effect. So at the same distance it has more low end etc
The WA87 sounds less sibilant to me with more low mids. I think your choice really depends on the voice type and the sound you're going for. They're both very close in quality.
Please let’s all make sure that when we hear the comparisons, we do not forget how we are listening.
Between both, there is not a significant difference that cannot be corrected in post prod with a bit of EQing
I sing male rock vocals into an AT4033. Q: Since voice, mike placement, and EQ make such a big difference, what difference would 'better' mike (eg the WA87 or TLM103) realistically make?
I am very interested in you comparing,TLM 103 or U87 with advanced audio cm87
A different lid for every jar. The TLM just has more low end. Fits your voice great. Is the WA87 revision 2?
Definitely the TLM has a more rounded and complete perception of the your voice. It serves great all frequencies all over the spectrum. Especially comparing WA87 to TLM it looks like the WARM microphone obviously lacks bass and sounds more mid-ranged. NOT BAD but as you mentioned different. Depending on the talent's voice and taste it can be a "go to" mic for voice over or vocals.
Anyway the comparison was helpful in deed. Thanks!!!
is there another vid where you teach us this pencil trick? I could use some position consistency for myself
Great Video as always, Mike! The WA87 and the TLM 103 are going to sound different, as the WA87 uses a transformer, which gives it a "softer fidelity" and saturated lows, much like a real u87. The TLM (Transformer Less Microphone) will have a tighter sound, because it does not have a transformer in the signal path. If a voice has more sibilant qualities, the WA87 will smooth that out. The price of the Warm mic, includes a very nice shock mount, so on average, you get more for less with the Warm.
With your great voice, both microphones work for me! The TLM 103 has more cut, good for commercial work going above a music bed, the WA87 may be great for narration or audio books, but either or could easily be equalized to taste.
For those looking for Neumann u87ai to WA87 shootouts, even for voice over, there are a few already on You Tube look at the Dale Pro Audio video for example.
A microphone overlooked is the Neumann TLM 102. Again there are shootouts galore, but I prefer it to the TLM 103, for my voice. I did take the internal foam out of the 102, because I had an old u87 that was destroyed, because, Neumann used to put a foam dampener below the capsule, and when that deteriorated it stuck to the capsule and innards. The foam will eventually do the same thing in the 102, and I am not going to chance it!
Keep up the great work! Oh, I would lend you my 102, but I use it everyday!
Thank you so much for doing this video.
i prefer the tlm 103 in this video. has punch and smooth sound. the WA 87 i tested in sam ash in a shootout against a WA14. I chose the WA 14.
The warm audio u87 was made to be like the old Neumann u87, not the AI version , that’s why the tlm 103 is brighter because it’s basically the same as a u87 AI just without a transformer
I got a $20 CAD supercardioid dynamic that sounds AMAZING. I sold my TLM102
The WA87 is made for vocals, the TLM103 more for VoiceOver! I personally really like the Warm, just not in this use case!
Guitar3000LP .....
How about the Warm Audio WA-47 vs. Tlm 103?? Any thoughts, sir?
Ok I'm going to differ from the majority and say I preferred the sound of the WA. The Neumann was good too, but I've noticed it has this, what I think of as "electronic" sound to it. Which probably makes no sense to anyone reading this, but I know what I mean ;) Its perhaps as if your voice is coming out of it in 3D. Hard to describe, and no doubt some will prefer that quality but I found the WA easier to listen to, more natural. Just slightly though.
I like both in their own way .
Please if you were to buy one of them, which one would be more useful in all around purposes. Thx
I could hear a difference on my iPhone speakers! Both sound great but the WA87 just sounds “sharper”. The TLM103 (ironically) feels warmer, smoother. Sounds like absolute butter. Great video as always!
A lot of people using the word “sharper” online these days. Not something I’ve heard in the U.K. What does it mean, clearer, crisper or more treble perhaps? Cheers
@@markcooper6300 to me sharp is harsh in high end, opposed of smooth.
the wa 87 has accentuated high mid frequencies, i think it would be a good mic but im suspecting it needs some headbasket revisions.
it sounds more like the u87 its claiming to be inspired by. tlm103 is just a beautiful smooth flat pattern with a slight high frequency bump like all LDCs by design
What do you think about the Audio Technica AT2035 vs their slightly lower/higher cost options? AT2020/ AT2050/ AT4040. Primarily for Streaming/VO
You should do a mic review on Studio Projects c1 it’s considered nicknamed the Neumann killer sounds amazing and I just purchased Neumann tlm102 and almost identical
Please compare TLM 103 vs 102
Great channel BTW!
103 is better with plosive and high frequencies
Hey, what´s up?
Did you switch the Mic at min 1:18?
"Is there a huge difference between them?" YES!
I don't like the TLM103 (in fact: not _any_ microphone in the TLM range...) but it sounds way better than the WA-87.
It seems the WA-87 is lacking low frequency content, or it rolls-off too early...
Also the WA-87 sound more "midrangy"
No, it doesn't "roll off" too early. It just doesn't accentuate the lows as much as the 103. Frankly for voice-over work, the 103 probably the preferred choice here, but not by much. For recording vocal tracks in music, the bottom end of the 103 would inevitably be shelved down or just rolled off anyway...the 87 a much better choice for that job.
Mike, which microphone did you like more for your voice?
When you say it's incredably easy to pop this mic, you mean plosives? like just affecting the vocals? or do you mean pop as in harming the mic?
The TLM sounds fuller and smoother top end. Warm sounds a bit harsh.