Chapter 14: Cornelius Fudge | Chamber of Secrets
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 มิ.ย. 2024
- Join J and Ben as they dive into Chapter 14 of the Chamber of Secrets and discuss Hogwarts monsters, 3rd year classes, Ginny stealing the Diary, McGonagall canceling quidditch, visiting Hagrid’s hut, Dumbledore’s animagus is a phoenix, and cryptic messages.
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Chapters:
00:00 - Intro and Chapter Art
09:55 - Chapter Breakdown
57:16 - Closing Thoughts and Review
Edited by :: Ethan Edghill
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My favorite bit from this chapter isn’t even in the book, in the movie the golden trio is discussing what Harry learned in the diary and Ron rather sarcastically goes “Hello Hagrid, let anything mad and hairy loose in the castle lately.” Then As it turns out Hagrid is right behind them, “Mad and hairy? Now you wouldn’t be talking about me now would ye?” and the idea that a man who’s roughly the size and shape of a phone box can sneak up on anybody amuses me to no end.
One of the few scenes that are better in the movie.
sneak 100 skyrim tactic lol
While I love that scene, if it is not in the book can it be in the chapter? The movie doesn't have chapters like the book I'd say :p
@@6666Imperator movies kinda have chapters. There's a bunch of scenes per each chapter. From what I know, the HP movies are divided into chapters that try to correlate to their book counterparts
@jshooa4840 yup very true. People don't have dvds anymore. 😂
Fudge is so well written character - he really seems like a bureaucrat and career politician you would meet in the real world. He shows from so early on that he cares more about having his job than doing his job.
I hear that a lot about Fudge, and I'm just like 'Well, you kind of need to have the job to do the job...'
Well yes, but I think the point being made was that he didn't even investigate to see if it was a copy cat. Just went who can I blame to make myself look good. Although know Uk politicians this would be something they'd do😮💨
@@eveairey7048 In the interest of fairness, I will admit I may be biased towards Fudge, out of a general sense that I had, as far as I can tell, since I first read the end of 'Goblet of Fire', that he's portrayed as way worse than he actually is, presumably due to Harry's own biased perspective (in-universe).
As to the matter at hand: my personal interpretation of 'Got to be seen to be doing something' is Fudge acknowledging that if Hagrid did open the Chamber of Secrets, Dumbledore would have figured that out by now, and he'd really rather stay away from the matter and let Dumbledore handle it, but he politically can't afford to not intervene even though he knows perfectly well it's not going to do any good.
Only emboldening my presumption is what happens right after: Lucius gets Dumbledore removed and Fudge basically panicks. He knows he hasn't actually solved the crisis, and he wants Dumbledore to take care of it - Dumbledore is the greater wizard, and actually on the ground as Headmaster. Why would he be upset if he thinks everything's taken care of anyway?
I never found it strange that Ginny waited so long to get the diary back. It was probably hard to find the opportune moment to get up there. A time when all the other boys from Harry's year were gone. When there would be a small chance of other boys from nearby dorms turning up. Trying to get away from teachers and her own friends without seeming suspicious. Trying to get away from Percy who, from earlier plot points, I assumed would be self-righteously watching her like a mother hen. No, I think she was always trying and always getting blocked somehow.
My take on Percy’s secrecy about his relationship - I think Penelope is the one who wants him to keep it quiet. He’s not very likable, and I tend to think she was like “tell no one” because she’d get teased for it, and Percy is just a simp so he’d be all “omg Penelope, you like me! I will take the secret of our love to the grave” 😂
It's the opposite imho. Percy has 6 siblings and he has no privacy for most of the time either at home or at school. He just wants to enjoy his relationship without the Twins picking on him.
@@edoardoprevelato6577 see, as an only child, that would never have occurred to me! Thank you- I definitely think your read on it makes more sense.
Fudge, knows its not Hagrid. He believes Dumbledore. That's why he says it like that. The public wants to see action So I must take him
Precisely. Fudge is selfish and self serving, but he isn't stupid.
I like how you can see the future theory videos manifest in real time
In Ron's defense about the DADA situation, while I think he would be aware of the pattern, they have had two incompetent teachers in a row and have learned basically nothing so an assumption that year three would be the same and thus a waste of time isn't totally unreasonable
Fudge’s stated reason for taking Hagrid, “gotta be seen doing something” is why harry gets so hung up on Stan Shunpike later on, the Ministry is, again, punishing an innocent person for appearances only
But if Snape was part of the plan to leave Harry the potions book, why does he seem surprised when he catches Harry doing the sectumsempra? And why does he ask him to go get his book to check it?
Agree. They like to make things "Dumbledores big plan" a little too easily. For excample the duel with Draco, I don't believe for a second that Dumbledore would want to out Harry as a parseltongue publicly, in front of everyone and their cats. Serves no purpose.
Also who gets the book really is a coin flip.
What I can believe is that he moved Snape to DADA teacher so Harry could still study potions.
@@IdaSanttiyeah. I believe the theory that Dumbledore has a scheme going throughout the series, but I feel it is more interesting if you think of him as playing a chess game with Voldemort.
He has a plan, but he isn't omnipresent. There are things happening that even he doesn't know about and he is reacting to these revelations also.
@@IdaSanttiI think that’s because of too many lucky coincidences in the book. They’re trying to explain them off. But they’re just coincidences :)
I feel that the ineffectiveness of the Basilisk is more a testimate to Ginny's strength of will, than plot convenience. Tom was able to kill someone woth the basilisk when it was just him. However when he was controlling Ginny he suddenly can't kill anyone? Seems like she was resisting him and using her new parseltongue to keep the basilisk from killing anyone, but wasn't strong enough to prevent the attacks entirely.
thats a interesting take, im adding this to my personal head cannon
I've personally always thought that Dumbledore simply read Hagrid's mind. And since Hagrid knows where Harry and Ron are hiding, then Dumbledore also knows (and his eyes quickly darting to that corner is the point where he learns this).
That's fair too. But also we see him feeling magic
In book 6 I thought he felt it.
Yeah. Dumbledore can “see” people under the cloak.
The author confirmed that Dumbledore always knew Harry was using the cloak because he would silently cast the Homenum Revelio spell when he suspected Harry was around under the cloak.
@@ScareCrow90 ... that seems ... like a cheat code. You'd think that wouldn't work on the cloak... odd
@@brookchristy8311 Dumbledore had the cloak for over a decade. He had plenty of time to study it and knows it's weaknesses. We know it's not infallible because Moody's eye sees through it. Personally, I like to suspect the cloak is only nearly infallible when it comes to protecting from actual threats of death. Which is why it's not one hundred percent protecting Harry from Dumbledore, Moody/Crouch, or even Malfoy on the Express in the 6th book. None of them were wanting to kill Harry so it wasn't a perfect protection. Similarly, Harry gets caught or almost gets caught almost every time he uses the cloak to sneak out in school. The brothers mentioned it in an earlier episode during book one. I suspect during normal circumstances it behaves like a typical cloak. However, in moments of dire threat, such as the night in Hogsmeade the Death Eaters attempt to summon it, the cloak exhibits extraordinary magic to protect it's owner. Similar to the Elder Wand which acts like a normal wand except for very specific circumstances.
I think the read on Lucius is that he flourishes when acting independently, but is very bad when working for Voldemort, or at least the 14 years with Voldemort out of commission made him gain an independent streak, and he had trouble adjusting when Voldy returned,
Agreed. He’s much better at giving orders than taking them.
Referring to the Voldemort with Voldy is both awesome and weird at the same time.
@@thatkingdomheartsguy9615 Canonically, so does Peeves, and I believe that JK included that as an acknowledgement of the fact that A LOT of fans did call Voldemort "Voldy" while the books were coming out. I just never stopped.
To be exact, after the Battle of Hogwarts, Peeves sings a victory song, where he jokingly calls the outcome of Harry ending Voldemort as "Voldy gone Moldy".
Ginny waiting 6 weeks to get diary - she’s the one who threw it away, at that time she doesnt want it anymore at all. There was a time that she almost talked to Percy about it. She knows all the writing disappears. Maybe, initially, she figured it didnt matter whether Harry had it or not, that it’ll put an end to all her misery and guilt by bringing out everything into the open. At that moment she was willing to face whatever happened; but as the days and weeks went on of anxiously awaiting to be caught, she finally had enough and went to get the diary herself. It has been a sufficient amount of time that maybe she figured that she could handle using it if necessary and maybe she had a better idea about how to get rid of it
18:30 We need a Ron in our lives. He would NEVER SNITCH on his friends. Hes a ride or die.
The Ministries initial inaction reminds me so much of true crime documentaries, where you hear of small City or small town police departments for the most part utterly ignoring missing persons cases, assuming that it's just wise leaving husbands or children running away, when in fact they have a serial killer loose. Sometimes even when they know something is wrong they continue to not act because it will just look bad on them. The way fudge has been acting reminds me so much of that mentality.
43:30 This just reminds me of in Lord of the Rings when Sauron just has gigantic armies at the gates of Mordor and then he has no guards at the heart of Mt. Doom, the only place where the Ring can be destroyed.
In fairness, while that's fun to point out, Sauron was not, in fact, being an idiot. No one in Middle-Earth, not even Sauron himself, could bring themselves to deliberately destroy the Ring. To get to Mount Doom, you need to get into Mordor - either traveling through miles of land controlled by Sauron or through well-guarded passages. Then there's the plains of Gorgoroth, where normally his vast armies are camped. And Sauron himself lives basically next door. And finally, most people, in the time it'd take to bring the Ring that far, would have already decided to use the Ring rather than destroy it, openly confronting Sauron. While that thought scared him, it didn't exactly incentivize guarding the Mountain of Fire itself.
Kind of similar to the Mirror of Erised. All the safeguards are superficial at most because you will fail when you reach the end. With the mirror it is because Harry is the only one who can ever retrieve it. Frodo destroys it through a scuffle and divine intervention but in the end only he could have gotten to that point.
@@christianjacinto7042 Not to take credit away from Frodo (it's amazing he got as far as he did), but also, Sauron may well have been the only being this might have happened to. He has long-standing beef with literal God. In that sense, even Sauron's end is pretty badass. Imagine only losing because you pissed off the Big Guy Himself.
That's also not to say, of course, his moral failures aren't at the heart of his loss (if he had so much as considered someone might decide to try and destroy the Ring, he certainly would've prepared for that scenario), and, in that sense, especially with the Mirror, Voldemort is exactly the same. His moral failures make it impossible for him to win.
@@JustFlemishMe 'Oft evil will shall evil mar'
The canon explanation is that Sauron was so arrogant that he never thought anyone would have any desire to destroy the Ring. He thought if anybody had it, it would just drive them nuts like it did with Isildur and Gollum.
Re Dippet not mentioning Myrtle by name. We know that memories can be tampered with. (Slughorn in HBP). What if in “real life” (as in the actual timeline) he does refer to Myrtle by name, but Voldy alters his memory in the diary to hide that information.
Thoughts?
It's possible. But I also think it isn't that weird they didn't mention her name. In real life we often talk in terms that would seem vague if we were being watched by someone reading our life like a book.
we NEED a supercut of J yawning at this point lmao
I think there are two main reasons it took Ginny so long to get the diary back. One, she was genuinely terrified of it, so the thought of having to take back something that you are so scared of in order to protect someone else you care about requires a lot of courage and given how courageous she is she would have done it sooner but the diary had been draining her energy and her life force, so she had to be well enough to take it back. Getting the distance from the diary allowed her to heal and once she had enough strength, she took it back.
I agree with you. Those are both reasons I thought of when they were talking about this. With the addition that perhaps it was the first time all the boys were out of the dormitory at the same time and Ginny wasn't in class since Harry got the diary.
😊😊😊
Fun theory, the basilisk is what drove Tom riddle mad. He was listening to it want to kill and maim for his whole time at Hogwarts. Maybe Tom thought it was his own thoughts since no one else could hear it. Or maybe all snakes are killers and he has been hearing muderous voices his whole life
Nagini wasn’t always murderous. So I doubt all snakes are murderous. The lesson that the series teaches is the importance of a mother’s love which Tom did not have. His mother abandoned him in an orphanage and didn’t have the will to even live for him because his father didn’t love her.
My theory is that not all basilisks care about muggleborns/witches/wizard. The Basilik that was in Hogwarts was hatched by Salazar Slytherin himself and trained to rid the school of muggleborns because they were a threat to wizard kind at the time. During his lifetime muggles were trying to kill witches/wizards so he didn’t trust muggleborns. Not because he was just rascist. It eventually turned to racism by wizards/witches who glorified him. Let’s not forget that Slytherin and Gryffindor were best friends.
@@rebeccaq7291I personally I think there was also a little racism in Slazars motives.
I can get on board with that. "Hearing voices isn't a good thing, even in the Wizarding world."
He was predisposed to cruelty due to his upbringing, was born of a love potion and thus was unable to love, could understand snakes his whole life which have always been associated with evil, and hearing the murderous basilisk at Hogwarts just helped seal his fate.
@@kiranicole2096Snakes were originally associated with life and rebirth due to the shedding of their skin, it wasn't until the conception of Abrahamic Religions that serpents were associated with evil
If Fudge had ANY sense, he would have waited until there were seven attacks. Seven is the most powerfully magic number like duh 🙄
I have heard somewhere that Rowling has commented that Dumbledore uses a spell to discover that Harry and Ron are in the cabin. the same spell that is used by the death eater in book 7 when they are at Luna's house to detect that there are people in the house, and by Hermione in book 7 when they travel to Sirius's house after the wedding.
always fun to listen to the podcast👍
Here's a theory about why it took Fudge so long to take action. Look at the victims: A Squib's Cat, A Muggleborn, a Ghost, A Muggleborn and then finally Penelope Clearwater who is of formal wizarding decent we don't know if her family is full or half blood but to placate those that think of blood as important Fudge Finally Took Action.
A slight variation on this: at least one of Penelope's parents was likely part of the Wizarding community. Until then, Dumbledore and/or Fudge could keep it secret, but they knew word would get out and there would be political fallout, forcing Fudge to do _something_ even if he knew his meddling would only get in Dumbledore's way.
Fudge doesn't need to care about what Hermione's Muggle parents think. But the Clearwaters? Now it's his constituents.
Hermione uses Penelope Clearwater's name in Deathly Hollows when they are caught by the snatchers and she states that she is a half-blood, so I'm guessing that it is safe to assume that Penelope is half-blood.
@@awesome_artemis6710that’s what I was thinking as well. I mean I know that’s not iron clad reasoning but it’s usually safe to assume Hermione knows what she is talking avout
@occheermommy Or Hermione was lying because she can't just tell Death Eater sympathizers that she and the person she's impersonating are Muggle-born, especially when they automatically assume Harry is one by saying "There ain't a lot of Mudblood Slytherins" after he describes the common room.
@@occheermommyOr Hermione was lying because she can't just tell Death Eater sympathizers that she and the person she's impersonating are Muggle-born.
Fudge is a passable fair weather politician at best
Basically like many Career politicians good enough to pass when things are going well but terrible during a Crisis
In fairness, that was kind of the deal. Fudge wasn't even supposed to be Minister; he was second or third choice, depending, and after Voldemort's downfall, everyone expected things to be fine. He was perfectly adequate, but he knew as well as anyone that, unlike Crouch, he wasn't up to containing Voldemort and his Death Eathers.
I've recently started watching TH-cam videos at 1.25x speed, but this is one of the videos that I just don't want to get done with quickly. I absolutely love this podcast, and can't wait until a few years down the line when I'll have hours to listen to while driving or doing things around the house
Same! Just yesterday I listened to all COS chapters to get caught up for today it was a fun 12 hours 😂😂😂
I watch all videos on 2x and sometimes 3x
@@tednockowitz7749I watched Dumbeldore a big plan to get warmed up for this ❤
WOW! 3x? Depending on content, I will usually listen at 1.25 up to a max of 2x, but I can’t even imagine 3x. Talking head stuff is usually 1.5 or higher…except Ben Shapiro: my ears bleed if I try to listen to him any faster than 1.25. Want some fun? Listen to him at .75: what you get is a really funny, very careful drunk Ben.
No way. I can’t listen to anything other 1x.
I had also wondered why Snape would leave his potions book behind. Settled on the fact that he knew potions so well, it was no longer needed.
Review question: Hey brothers, so a question I’ve always had was in prisoner of Azkaban when dementors approach Harry and he hears Lily’s scream, was is it actually the part of voldemorts soul living its worst/painful memory (i.e. death) instead of Harry’s worst memory, it would explain why Harry only begins to remember fragments of that scene in Godrics hollow (through voldemorts mind) and it would explain why Harry doesn’t see thestrals until book 5. I’ve been a huge fan since your first Pixar theory video and love all the content you create, especially the vast in depth discussion on through the griffin door, keep up the great work, love from Ireland.
If you want to understand Fudge, watch Yes Minister and Yes Prime Minister. It will be an excellent education on the mechanics of how politicians and the civil service work.
"We need to do something. This is something, let's do that."
Ooooo, the Love-occlumency thing could apply for Narcissa too in terms of her love for Draco. When she checks on Harry, it's the one thing she asks prior to lying to Voldemort.
The bit about all crime in the Wizarding World leading to Azkaban.
Considering Harry thought he was going to be carted off to Azkaban for blowing up Aunt Marge I think that’s an accurate assessment.
Especially when you get to Harry’s trial in book five. I think if Dumbledore hadn’t called Fudge out on holding a full on criminal trial for a bit of underage magic, and there weren’t any reasonable people on the Wizengamont who realized how illogical that was, Harry might have ended up in Azkaban.
To be fair to Harry, he had no way of knowing if the wizarding world even has regular jail. The only prison system he had heard of at that point is Azkaban. As for the trial, I think of it as another part of Fudge's own crusade to just continue ignoring the situation with Voldy. He would be absolutely willing to throw a child in Azkaban just to cover his own ass.
@@TheKabuto90 ye
I've always thought it was nuts that the answer was straight to we're going to hold you in Azkaban for a suspicion and not hey here's a holding cell in the minystry ect. They also say that most people loose there minds there in like a week so like ... before a trial could happen you'd be so gone you couldn't fight for yourself.
Also I believe Sirius never got a trail either so ... they're kind of willy nilly
@@brookchristy8311 yeah and wasn’t there a little kid in HBP who got sent to Azkaban for trying to kill his grandparents? I think he was nine and under the imperius curse. Or maybe he was taken to St Mungo’s. I forget
@@Boundwithflame23 whoa don't remember that one. Hope it Mungos.
I love how lately your SCB videos come from ideas that came out of this deep dive on the books and fans comments
I have evidence against filch being a poltergeist. A main theory is that the chains and dungeons and punishments that filch threatens don't make much sense for the school. However, Molly mentions in Goblet of Fire that Arthur still has the marks from being caught out of bed by a professor. Which means physical punishment wasn't only used, it was used recently. I think it's possible that Hogwarts was a much darker place even before Tom started going.
It is not just a professor, it was the caretaker of the time (and it wasn’t Filtch).
@@mikebrown1881 aware it wasn't filch, pretty sure it's dippet but I could be wrong, I just read it this morning. What I'm saying is that the shackles and torture implements Filch has maybe have actually been used.
@@calemroberts2941 This is the quote « Your father and I had been for a night-time stroll. He got caught by Apollyon Pringle - he was the caretaker in those days - your father's still got the marks. »
The fact that there were another caretaker before Filtch is a more convincing proof that Filtch isn’t a poltergeist.
You also have to remember that in the 1970 they were still using the cane in English schools. So why wouldn't they at Hogwarts
@@mikebrown1881you're absolutely right haha, my bad
I love this podcast, I look forward to it every Sunday, it's become part of my weekend routine. Here's a question- would Harry have been able to summon Kreacher while they were camping without the risk of Yaxley or another Death Eater tagging along? I know they don't because they're worried about the same thing happening that made them bring Yaxley along to Grimmauld Place in the first place, but Kreacher himself says "the house elf's highest law is his master's bidding", so if Harry summoned Kreacher with the intent of summoning _only_ Kreacher, would that have worked?
a theory for how Dumbledore knew Harry and Ron were there; nonverbal revelio
and what you said about Ron, only in the movie does Mcgonagal send Ron with Harry. in the book, he asks to have the same roster of classes Harry has
If Ron wasn't in the class, then Harry had a 50/50 chance of getting Snape's book or the other old book from the cabinet.
The funniest thing to me is that when I first read this book, I don't think I ever suspected Percy. Granted this was back when I was in middle school, but even in rereads, I never picked up on the hints that Percy might be the one behind the attacks. I think Percy always seemed to be a rule follower without exception, so the thought of him doing something against the rules that I could never consider him.
I had totally forgotten Woods reaction to Mcgonagall telling him quidditch is cancelled was a movie scene and wasnt in the books and was waiting for it all episode. Always found that scene hilarious
It so goes with his personality though
Harry gasped when he saw Lucius in the doorway when Dumbledore was already in the room. He heard that they were there.
If the theory that no one has realized that it was the Chamber of Secrets opened previously, then there would be little reason to suspect Hagrid this time because the messaging is so overtly claiming that it is caused by the opening of the chamber.
I really like the “being motivated by love creates a mind vault Voldemort cannot penetrate” theory because it explains Narcissa’s straight up lie to Voldemort about Harry being dead. 1:00:27
Another amazing video. The question I have is with your theory of the chamber being under a Fidelius Charm to hide it after Slytherin left the school, what if other charms were used as well, such as the Confucius or a Memory charm to confuse or straight up make them forget when trying to figure out what the monster is?
Also Percy letting people know he is dating would also let them know he was misusing his time turner, another SCB theory. Since he wouldn’t have a lot of time to date, take all those classes, perfect duties, and sleeping.
1:03:17 it would make sense that Dumbledore expected Hermione to do the best in Slughorns class to win the potion, so it was guaranteed that a member of the Golden Trio was going to have the potion for use down the line
But surely dumbeldore can't be the only one who knows that tom riddle became Voldemort and therefore his word from 50 years ago that hagrid did it should be like voided 😂
Jonathan yawning in every episode cracks me up 😂. I love listening/watching you guys. Keep up the great work!
You guys are the best. I have been dealing with a lot of depression and anxiety lately, but every Sunday, after work, I can watch this, and finally get out of my head for a bit. And I just wanted to say, thank you so much. You are all i have to look forward to. But i have a question. How did they revive nearly hedless Nick? He can't eat or drink anything, and we know that the mandrakes have to be cut up and stewed for the potion..... So..... How?
We know that they used a large fan to move him, so it seems as though ghosts can be affected by moving air. And liquid, for that matter- Myrtle's made mention of having been forced down into the lake by somebody flushing her toilet, after all. Maybe they had to, like, fan the vapor coming off the potion into Nick, or splash a goblet of the stuff onto him?
Oh, offscreen!
Also... I'm sorry for your trouble. I hope things will turn for the better soon!
@IAmMissingnoMaster yes, but there was no abortion. If everything, except for air and water, just passes through you, then its effects can not take root. But yes, you are right.
@@JustFlemishMe thank you so much.. . Just after watching these, I always feel better. Still just on the precipice of just crying, but way better
Also, note that this is the first time I've ever gotten a comment response on here.... So thank you both for that.
Mandrakes are also used to cure victims of transfiguration, not only petrification.
"who does Hagrid think is coming for him that he has a crossbow"
Voldemort...
Hey brother !
This podcast is so interesting, I stumbled across your main channel a while ago and started following you because of how thorough you are in your researches, it is so amazing.
While listening to this episode I had a What if...? question, and it is "What if Harry realised that the diadem was a Horcrux when he went to hide his copy of Advances Potion Making in the Room of Requirements in Half Blood Prince ?"
Indeed Harry is a Horcrux himself so what if he realised it was also a Horcrux, as we know at that point in time he already knows about them ?
Also I wanted to add that as a trans person I am grateful that you never tell the name of the author of the book, because this is the reason why I've stopped watching many videos concerning Harry Potter, but still enjoy watching yours
Ok, guys, you did it. I never watched TH-cam videos like that. Actually waiting for it to appear on a certain day at a certain time.
This chapter seems “fluffier” after several re-reads and rewatches, but the first time finding out that Hermione had been petrified… I was shook as a preteen! Lol😅
The best understanding of Trelawney's divination class, is Harry and Ron in the common room writing their term papers and helping each other makeup things to predict.
I thought Hagrid had a crossbow to defend himself from The Creature.
Dumbledore not being able to figure out sooner that it's a Basilisk comes up a lot in this book. Could be an interesting video.
My theory is that the basilisk was not a very commonly known creature (since it is so rare and difficult to interact with, and there supposedly hadn't been any confirmed sightings for 1000 years)(I know it's mentioned in the Fantastic Beasts book, but I think that was more of a fun thing for fans than the actual in-universe textbook, since Hermione has to go to the library to look up about the basilisk instead of just checking her own textbook). So while Dumbledore almost certainly suspects it's a snake of some sort cuz Slytherin, he may not have enough information to narrow down on the Basilisk.
Plus while it's ability to kill with its gaze is known, the idea of its indirect gaze petrifying someone is entirely undocumented and guessed by Harry (and presumably Hermione). So while it seems obvious in retrospect, Dumbledore may not have been able to figure out from the petrifications that it was the indirect gaze of a basilisk, and it took Hermione (a very intelligent person herself) months of hearing about Harry hearing voices and being a parseltongue and all to make the connections.
I feel like asking Myrtle about her death and consulting Newt Scamander, plus Dumbledore's own knowledge, should probably have got the answer. But I think the above points prove that it wasn't necessarily obvious even to someone like Dumbledore
The “Weasley, you look too happy” is only in the movies. It just says something like “in the end, Harry was able to take the same classes as Ron”
*J.K. Rowling listening to the theories at the end*
".... yes. That's exactly what had in mind..... glad we're on the same page."
In the Slughorn hands each boy the advanced potion making book. Therefore Dumbledore could have advised Slughorn to give Harry the old, battered book, and Ron the nicer book. His logic to Slughorn could have been that Ron often gets second hand thing so he should get the less tattered book. I don’t know. I’m just trying to make it work with their theory. Lol
In the book though Ron and Harry pick their book themselves out of a cubbies... odd because normally they have to buy all there own
@@brookchristy8311 they are handed the books directly from Slughorn. “Slughorn strode over to a corner cupboard and, after a moment’s foraging, emerged with two very battered-looking copies of Ad- vanced Potion-Making by Libatius Borage, which he gave to Harry and Ron along with two sets of tarnished scales.” -HBP
The reason that they get the books directly from him and not a shop is that they were not planning to take potions so they did not buy the books in advance.
@@hufflepom ohhhh! Shoot I was mixing DaDa and potions ! Thanks for reminding me! That's my bad! They fight over the dingy Dada book. That's how Harry gets the used prince book.
I think Dumbledore was trying to have Fudge not come out as much as he could because of Hagrid. Possibly hoping he'd be able to catch the monster before the attacks got worse but couldn't by the 4th attack.
A possible reason why Fudge is acting now (instead of after Colin or Justin) is because Penelope is a half blood. (Per Hermione is DH). Therefore Penelope has at least one magical parent. There is a risk that her mum and dad could tell their magical friends about this (a risk that he didn’t have with Colin or Justin) and Fudge is now worried about his image.
Thoughts?
I do find it interesting though that Fudge only focused on the muggle borns specifically. He says “four attacks on muggle borns” but doesn’t include Penelope by saying something like “and now this attacker is going after half-bloods”
@@Boundwithflame23 it is four kids, a ghost, and a cat. Maybe at this point in her writing Rowling had Penelope as muggle born and later changed her mind? No idea. lol. But good point.
I’ve always thought it odd that Hermione said she was a half blood when pretending to be Penelope, but I think Penelope was muggle born, Hermione just said half blood to fool the snatchers because she knew they were after muggleborns.
@@loopylinguist7716 Nah I think Penelope is half blood. Just got attacked because she happened to be the one with Hermione at the time and I’m guessing Rowling had her be there instead of some other random unnamed student because of her connection to Percy
The luck potion being part of Dumbledores's plan makes me think that maybe Tom won the potion while he was at school and maybe that's how he got the Gray Lady to reveal where the diadem was.
my favourite thing about sundays is leaving the house and getting two steps out and going “through the griffin door!!” and listening to the latest episode on my walk to work
After re-listening to the podcast multiple times (So good!) I realized that it might not be the basilisk that Harry is hearing but Tom Riddle giving commands to the basilisk, and he can hear it through the connection of Voldemort's soul (Or it's echoing through the pipes from the chamber)
I always figured that Riddle was instructing the Basilisk NOT to kill the muggle borns, because it would almost guarantee a Hogwarts closure, which was never something that he wanted. The only death was Myrtle and a. he wanted to make the Horcrux, and b. he had the ace up his sleeve of being able to accuse Hagrid and make it seem like it was all over and thus safe again. The Basilisk doesn't say "I will kill this time", it's "Let me kill this time". Snakey boi wants to, but isn't allowed to kill. Riddle wanted to rid the school of Muggle Borns, but I think his plan was to make the school seem so unsafe for them that they just get banned from going for their own protection, and because there's no real point in them attending a school if the odds are that they'll spend most of their time as a statue in the hospital wing.
I always think of it as Dumbledore is actively reading minds to stay ahead of everyone to make sure Fudge and Malfoye don’t do something stupid and in that process he sees Harry and Ron’s thoughts
The movie quote, “soon we will all have to face the choice between what is right and what is easy” is at the end of Goblet of Fire when Dumbledore is talking to Harry which at that time wasn’t in relation to Fudge.
Absolutely love this podcast! I listen to it on my commutes to work, which is always a great way to start the day. Thank you guys for your joyous overanalysing of these books! Look forward to each episode :)
I recently started reading Philosopher’s Stone again (trying to catch you guys up so can read along with the podcast!), and noticed this line in The Potions Master chapter;
“They had to study the night skies every Wednesday at midnight”
This surprised me a bit as I don’t think we hear about this happening for the rest of the series. It would be interesting to see if we know any Wednesdays where the trio are out in the castle at night when they could have been caught by 1st years coming back from their midnight Astronomy class. Also, this would be terrible for messing up students sleep schedules - would NEWT Astronomy students basically be nocturnal?! And if students aren’t allowed to be out of bed, how do they even get up to the Astronomy tower for the lessons?
And if it was a Wednesday that Harry and Dumbledore went to the cave in Half-Blood Prince, would there have been a class of 1st years on the Astronomy tower looking through their telescopes when they got back to the school??
My headcanon is that Percy told Ron and Harry about Divination cause he knew how easy it could be for the duo to fake it and still get good grades. Like one of the few big brother acts he does for Ron
I think Snape left his Potions book simply because he wanted someone else to discover his genius, without being the one to say "look at this, see how smart I am?" It's like an aspiring author leaving their manuscript in a book store under a pseudonym and envisioning a scenario where someone finds it and thinks "Who is this amazing author? We must find them!" while at the same time not being confident enough to just submit it to a publisher under their own name.
The simplest answer to Ginny waiting is that she's a first year and hasn't become the confident amd brilliant witch we know she will be by the end of the story. In short, she had to work up the nerve to go into an area she's not technically allowed to be in. Remember that every time she's done that to this point, she's been possessed.
About Fudge in his first appearance: I might be overcompensating because I feel like I'm the only one who feels sympathy for the man, but I think a lot of what you bring up are really positives. Firstly, he wasn't around when Hagrid was kicked out, you pointed out yourselves there was no real evidence and Dumbledore seemed to trust him. I don't believe for a second he actually was sure it was Hagrid. Hence why he's so apologetic and reluctant. His relationship with Dumbledore is not yet adversarial, and he probably knows it's best for everyone if he doesn't meddle and just lets Dumbledore handle it. Dumbledore is the more capable wizard, and the authority figure on the ground. But the situation becomes too hard to ignore, so he has 'got to be seen to be doing something', even if he's perfectly aware it's not going to help, probably.
Why couldn’t any of the professors or Dumbledore even just order some mandrake leaves to make the potion the first time there was a petrification? We know there’s lots of shops in Diagon Alley and Hogsmeade, you’re telling me no one had mandrake leaves?
Also, if every year a second year students study mandrakes, shouldn't there be some from last year
I don’t get why Dumbledore doesn’t start an investigation after the 1-2 attacks. One would think the headmaster cared more about the students’ safety 😅 Clearly he doesn’t suspect Harry or Hagrid, so what is he doing or waiting for? The least he could do is interview the students, and maybe someone had noticed Ginny acting weird, or maybe after getting closer to Harry he would open up about the voices etc.
petrification is quite common as even in year 1 Hermione petrified Neville
That wasn't petrification; it was the Body-Bind Curse.
I'd say the most important thing Harry learns from the Halfblood Prince's book is the function of bezoars. Saves Ron's life.
Makes me think about how Dumbledore took "borrowed" the Invisibility cloak from James, so he could "examine it closer" (meaning, to confirm if it really was one of the Deadly Hallows).
When you think about it, Albus had 12 years to examine the cloak meticulously and know every aspect about it.
My guess would be that Albus learnt how to identify when someone was using it. Maybe he even placed a specific charm or spell to be able to trace it.
(Thus being able to identify Harry under it).
I’m disappointed that I never suspected Percy. Despite the clues, he always struck me as someone incapable of breaking rules.
This podcast is amazing to listen to while cleaning! Thanks guys 🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉
I’ve been listening to your podcast since the beginning of the year, but on another app… That’s why I never subscribed, but you know what? You’ve got me today, I’m doing it LOL. I’ll have to listen again to the ones I would like to point something out. It’s the most entertaining podcast I listen to.
Hey brother! I am loving this series so much. My question has always been why is everyone so quick to turn on Sirius Black when he turned his back on his family and was staying with James for the last few years of school and why doesn’t Dumbledore look into it?
I just realized how incredibly stealthy the Basilisk actually is. Like, no one reprted sights about a giant snake just slithering around the castle. And it surely had to come out of the sewers to attack people.
By Fudge saying, a girl instead of Myrtle died, it's distancing from the occurrence. Naming something is much more personal than making it an object.
I keep forgetting that new episodes drop on Sunday so every Sunday I squeak with excitement when I see it!
Is it ever mentioned anywhere how the bludgers and snitch know not to leave the Quidditch pitch or the bludgers know not to attack the people in the stands?
1:02:46
Okay so here's my theory on that...
Snape was using that copy of advanced potions making to teach from...when he left the classroom in year 6, Slughorn saw the textbook and put it with the other copies
With all the red herring stuff with Percy, and since I don't think we know what Iit actually is, I like to think his patronus is a herring - just makes me laugh
This was my review and Ben nailed it in terms of what I was going for. Further evidence that Voldemort can’t exist in a mind filled with love is when he tried to possess Harry at the ministry… It’s the same thing at work when he tries to read the truth Within mind. The truth is hidden within love something Voldemort cannot penetrate.
Love the podcast! I started listening just recently, having saved up episodes, but blasted through them and I have just now caught up with you. I love the insights and theories and the enthusiasm with which you discuss them.
Here's my question: regarding the timeturner, it's said that seeing your own self can drive you mad, which as you pointed out doesn't make sense. But what if it's not seeing your own self, but trying to alter history and finding out you actually can't alter it drives you mad? After all, it would confirm that you don't have free will.
I love this podcast and I love this channel ❤️ look forward to it every week! Fridays and Sundays !!
As it comes to the Half Blood Prince’s book it is mentioned that Harry does try to share it with Ron but that he’s not as good at reading the small tight writing as Harry is. He does the same to Hermione but she refuses to follow anything but the ‘official’ instructions despite constantly getting subpar results
This is also something that could be brought up as a thing with what if Fudge had come for Hagrid sooner, because if he had come for Hagrid and then the attacks still continued then he would have definitive proof that Hagrid had not been the one to open the chamber.
really love these soooo much! they are perfect for nap time listening, i watch every episode like 3 or 4 times cuz of me using it for nap time listening lol.
Hagrid, like Sirius, convicted without a trial. I think this chapter is trying to set up how the wizarding world doesn’t care about facts, they care about blame.
Fudge isn't nervous about what he has to do to Hagrid, he's nervous because he has upset Dumbledore.
My theory is that they couldn’t prove it was Hagrid 50 years ago, but he did admit to the spider. He was expelled for bringing Aragog into the school, and partially for being accused of the chamber of secrets. In the meantime Dumbledore managed to convince everyone that it most likely wasn’t Hagrid, which is why he was allowed to stay. It’s also why Hagrid doesn’t get a new wand after chamber and start learning again. He was actually guilty of bringing in a giant spider. That doubt of whether it really was Hagrid who opened the chamber, mixed with Dumbledore actively defending Hagrid to the ministry, is why it took them so long to act.
Hey brother! And hello from Germany! Absolutely love the podcast! My mum used to read the books to me and my younger brother before she past away from cancer. We just finished the deathly hallows 2 months before she past away. I have a question... How does the pensive work? You put a memory in but what happens then? Don't you remember that particular memory or just the action of putting away a memory? For example: if j putts all his memories of ben in the pencive does he still remember ben. Keep up the good work ❤❤❤
I find it interesting that Scorch Marks were mentioned in an earlier chapter because in the Lego Game, the Basilisk Boss Battle has laser eyes. This is probably to show the player where its gaze is, but it's neat that you guys have been joking about Laser vision.
I think it'd be really cool, after this podcast is over, to do a ranking video on the chapter art for each book. Which one is best in each one and which book has the best ones overall?
Love this podcast, it’s the highlight of my Sundays! You guys should do a sorting atla characters into hp houses
!!Petrified is the Rare Steak of Basalisk heat vision and old Barry the Basalisk likes it well done brothers!!
Hey Brother! I love your TH-cam channel, and have been excited every week to listen to y’all break down each chapter. I was wondering why you believe James didn’t have his wand on the infamous night. I believe you can see James using it as Voldy approaches the house, but when entering the house the wands gone. My head cannon has always been that James tried to turn into a stag. Good luck on the Griffen Tour!
@haydenbreck2999 you're right, in DH's chapter seventeen (Bathilda's Secret) James indeed makes coloured smoke come out of his wand to amuse baby Harry - but a few lines below that, it states "Now the father scooped up the son and handed him to the mother. He threw his wand down upon the sofa and stretched, yawning..." the last thing James did was to "sprint into the hall" when the front door burst open, presumably forgetting his wand because of the shock?
So there is an actual explanation in the books as to why James didn't have his wand
When I read this, and, even when I watched the movie, I never thought it was Percy. I always assumed it was Draco, until this moment, then I just didn’t have any idea who it was until Ginny and Riddle tell Harry that it was them.
New head cannon: "wimbley wombley" is a reference from the famous wizarding radio show "Medic Whom"