Sir Gideon Ofnir Is The Villain
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ก.ย. 2024
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The only people who can claim any true ownership over Elden Ring's story are Miyazaki and George R.R. Martin. Everyone else in the fan community should just celebrate this game's amazing world and help one another understand their creation.
Couldn’t haven been said better @BlankPicketSign
@@undeadsky923 I agree.👍
Imagine goint after someone who just want to be credited off a theory with wich some TH-camr gets money and credit for. How dare he right?
@@Frank-kq4te are that upset for someone else? I see you commenting on all the other comments that have anything to do with the Reddit guy drama. I don't see why you need to be that upset unless YOU ARE the person who made the theory and wanted credit.
@@Krakain if you see more closely, I'm going after people claiming idiotic points. Like "ownership over the story" argument in this comment.
I'd be embarassed if I got caught gatekeeping my own lore theories from the larger community under the guise of 'being the victim of plagiarization' the stories of these games have always been a community wide discussion, a soup of everyone's ideas - no one remembers who originates an idea, they remember the idea itself, and I think that's a good thing.
Yeah, a year from now, it will be just one of thousands and many other will have the same or similar theories on their own.
“Plagiarization” not even a word lmao
@@themostdiabolicalhater5986 hate to break it to you, but it indeed is a word.
yeah seriously what the fuck was that about? what a weird thing to act as if you "own" and can be stolen. its like if someone tried to say youre plagiarizing for telling a joke you read on reddit
@@musslosbruder5464 google disagrees with you. “Plagiarism” is the word that you’re thinking of
It could be possible that Gideon Ofnir believes he is aiding the Queens plans but does not realize that Radagon and Marika are one in the same. So while he believes that the Queen wishes for us to struggle for eternity on behalf of the Erdtree and Greater Will, he is actually and unintentionally assisting Radagon. He tells us that he is on a quest to become all knowing, he never says that he knows all. What if his entire belief of the Queen's "plan" was simply mixed up and misinterpreted because Gideon couldn't find the last piece of his puzzle, and assumed it to be complete?
This was exactly what I thought as well. I really love this idea, and my only hesitation with fully believing this theory is that the Law of Regression incantation required to reveal that Radagon and Marika are the same entity requires INT and FTH, both of which Sir Gideon has in spades. I think it's a bit of a leap in logic to think that someone like Gideon who seeks knowledge endlessly and makes use of as many spells as possible wouldn't know about the law of regression and have the ability to uncover the truth about Marika, especially since he was in close proximity to the capital where the statue in question resides. I'm not saying it's impossible that he'd be unaware of this revelation, but it's hard to totally dismiss.
@@DakJD Knowing the Law of Regression and knowing where to use it to reveal the truth are two separate things though.
By time Gideon moves from the Roundtable to the Capital, the Capital had been covered in the ash of the Erdtree, covering one of the only ways (we know of) to reveal the truth of Marika.
It is of course still possible that Gideon entirely knows of some grand plan that we are unaware of, but the idea of Gideon mistaking Radagon's intentions for Marika's makes the most sense in my mind.
@@forFeiix I agree with you. It makes the most sense to me as well.
I think it he had Marika and radagon backwards, I think Marika wanted a new Elden Lord to take over radagon, one that would hopefully obey her will or aid it in some way. Radagon is the one who wanted to stop us because of the uncertainty of our will. I believe that Gideon knew about Marika/Radagon and either sided with radagon or was manipulated by one of them
keep in mind the elden beast is also inside the same body so the struggle forever might be about radagon and marika inside the tree and thus keeping it safe
It might just be me but I think Gideon has one of the best voices in the entire game.
Which is good considering he is the exposition dump. It would have been a bad call to have a boring voice do the most talking
I referred to him as "budget Liam Neeson" my whole playthrough
FIND THE ALBINAURIC WOMAN
@@idlemindedmage6925 i called him "slightly less geezer ray winstone" 😂😂😂
@@antonironstag5085 heard that too many times while trying to get new dialogue from him 😂
Plagiarism doesn't exist in Fromsoft lore. No one owns these ideas, but kudos to you for citing your source.
Fucking thank you, I was waiting for someone to point this out.
I bet that guy figure out ofnir lore and think it's one precious thing he ever made and accused people who used it, a bit possessive
From the original Reddit post, it wasn’t the ideas that were claimed to be plagiarized, but the script being used verbatim from a comment.
That in combination with the Redditors comments being deleted on YT, blocked on Twitter, and others being met with the same response.
I think that, having read the original post, the point is that the lore community wants theories and ideas to gain ground, but they do deserve respect for the work that goes into it. Therefore, always cite sources!
@@melz410 Citing sources is one thing, but the multiple screen shots of blocked/ deleted comments is kind of damning, especially because it paints the picture of, not a honest mistake, but an active awareness and attempt at damage control.
I think when Gideon’s armour says he ‘glimpsed into the will of Marika’ that you are correct in your theory of keeping the struggle to feed the Erdtree, but I think it was actually Radagon he glimpsed into unknowingly; it’s fairly well known now amongst lore enthusiasts that Marika defied the Greater Will, so her plans being to serve it doesn’t add up. furthermore, not even the Gold Mask knew that Marika is Radagon, so who’s to say that Gideon didnt know this either.
this would explain why Radagon fights the tarnished, to prevent the mending of the Elden Ring and to keep the struggle in the Lands Between
I think marika plan comes way before the shatering, she gave ranni the comand of the black knives, she provaly knew that ranni was going against the greater will and when the caos of godwin death came she destroy the ring to cut the absolute control of the greater will
Obviously you’re sincere about it being a mistake and you did everything you can to rectify it. It’s more than most people would do. Anybody who can’t accept that isn’t worth the headache. Love your vids, keep up the great work!
He didn't even need to make an apology, no owns lore theories and the idea that people do own them or should get credit for them is pure cancer... They didn't make the game.
@@whitingpie5146 I agree but the lore of this game is complicated so people who do undercover something should get credit. But if someone doesn’t give credit for your theory you shouldn’t send them hate because that just makes you look like a 9 year old fortnite squeaker.
@@whitingpie5146plagiarism is plagiarism, accidental or not
@@harrylane4 You're so annoying
Something interesting I found while fighting Rykard- During the second phase, he destroyed a pillar that happened to have loot in it. Thinking that was odd, I grabbed it to find that it was armor with Gideons crest on it (or something like that), suggesting that a soldier of Gideons attempted to fight Rykard.
There's a NPC invader who wears that very same armour piece and his name just so happens to be _Recusant_ Henricus.
I just noticed this as well on my ng+ playthrough. It's the whole reason im here now 🤣
I believe that guy was an agent of Gideon’s, sent to infiltrate the volcano manor to gain information
Is that the eye surcoat?
I always found how Gideon says Ensha got "rather ahead of himself" Almost implying that the plan IS to eventually kill you for some reason, but Ensha went for it too early. Love it.
The thing I never got about Gideon's first words to us, about earning our keep, is that no one ever tells us what they did to earn their keep. Sure Gideon seems to be the leader, but of what? There doesn't seem to be any kind of army or even organization beyond a loose scattering of tarnished. Most tarnished we meet don't ally or answer whatsoever to Gideon and are trying to kill us, doing their own thing, or are in direct competition with us. Do these other tarnished have Great Runes that they never mention? Because that was how we earned his respect, what did the others do, It's always bugged me.
Bro yes, my thoughts exactly. Trying to punk us right from the get go lol.
Well the guy who hunts death root it might be that why they earn his keep as he is trying to restore order. Fia and dungeater would be because they are the tarnished mentioned before I can't remember what they did.
I see it us our character is just sort of a random tarnished who has no previous affiliations or great feats. And besides gideons claims are sort of weak to being a leader as like you can attend the roundtable even with him refusing to speak to you, he most likely says that to make the player believe that like state din the video he wants you to hunt down the great runes
@@danielshore1457 the intro does say that we are a tarnished of no renown i.e. a nobody, whereas the others are notable in some way.
I just assumed Ofnir was being a hardass skeptic like “we haven’t had a new Tarnished added to our club in awhile, don’t think that means we’ll let you slack anyway. Touched by Grace or not you have to prove to me you’re a candidate.”
Ofnir is just an old man employer who is starved for employees but also drives them away unless they get past that hard ass of his.
He’s the leader after all, and the title ‘Sir’ Gideon Ofnir implies he was dubbed this spot by Marika or someone else. Thus he feels honorbound to make sure every Tarnished in the Roundtable are actual candidates for Elden Lord. To succeed Queen Marika
Ehhh he's probably tired of chumps showing up to the Roundtable so he wants to see someone impressive.
During the opening cinematic, it states clearly the Lands Between were abandoned by the Greater Will during the wars of the Shattering. The description of Lord's Divine Fortification tells us that the Two Fingers tells Ofnir that "all had been broken long ago; that the trembling fingers, bent with age, and the Erdtree itself, were no exception."
The Greater Will has fled. The Elden Beast was a vassal of the Greater Will. The Elden Beast IS the Erdtree and the Elden Ring, not the Greater Will. The Elden Beast is likely on the side of maintaining things as they are, because it's being fed the dead.
The Fingers are likely trying to hide the true state of what has happened. They too have been forsaken by the Greater Will. That's why they're aging. But they don't want to give up their power. We can only guess when the Two Fingers told Ofnir about the true state of things. I don't trust him. He may have known since before we arrived in the Lands Between or at some point when he's not available to speak to us.
For some reason when I first saw the godskin apostles and nobles I then looked at Gideon's armor and something about it looks like draping skin especially the legs and belly area
maybe but enya says that the greater will has not abandoned life and both enya and the fingers are shocked when the erdtree denies the tarnished entry meaning things didn't go as planned, now the long wait for the fingers to consult with the greater will is odd, it could mean the greater will is struggling or gone which would sinc with the fingers tell gideon that all is broken though there are some interpretations as to what they mean by that. Radagon's elden rune is present at the seal in the erdtree though, maybe the greater will didn't expect further resistance since marika seems to rendered mostly helpless which explains the fingers' reaction.
Yeah because all these ED lore videos are shitposts by people trying to catch some attention from the trending topic. 70 minute video on Mogh? Kill me.
@@DrFrogglePhD Nah. The lore is my favorite part of From Soft games. The attention seekers who whine about lore videos in the comments and replies of lore videos are cringe af. They're as bad as the people who harass speed runners for "not respecting the game."
The Elden Beast is most decidedly NOT the Elden Ring. More yet, The Greater Will didn't create it, but stole it.
For one, the Ring existed already in Farum Azula long before the GW decided to become our problem. You can see how it looked like in Maliketh's arena.
Second, you kill the Beast, and with it forever destroy the Ri- whoops, nevermind, the Ring is still just fine, nestled up in Marika's titty crack.
Sir Gideon Is The Perfect Embodiment Of "Live Long Enough To See Yourself Become The Villain"
I want to know more about Marika because there are at least two characters who seem to be terrified of her. Gideon's armor mentions him seeming to be startled by Marika's will and Master Hewg mentioned the sheer terror of her.
Don't forget also, roderika tells you to go kill Marika, because Marika "imprisoned" all the tarnished as well as hewg.
First the mission given to the Tarnished was to slay the Elden Beast, it's the secret reason she created the Tarnished as confirmed by Hewg and Roderika's dialogue. It's why she tasks Hewg with forging a weapon that can kill a god. It's also why she gives her daughter Melina the mission to burn the Erdtree and guide someone to Maliketh's location to free Destined Death also known as Rune of Death. (Game files name Melina as "maricaofdaughter" and she speaks of the task given to her by her mother inside the Erdtree)
Now there were other Demigods in the past aside from just the ones at Leyndell. A bunch were killed on the night of black knives. And presumably some weren't killed as well and survived longer. You can find them in the walking Mausoleums, Miquella was experimenting with one of them to see if he can resurrect it outside Castle Sol. Presumably there are other runes in the Round Table Hold's possession already since Gideon had access to the Two Fingers and he speaks of needing one to meet them. The Finger Reader mentions other people that have had 2 before as well. Since this is in part a competition of sorts and we know you can assemble different runes to complete the Ring then it stands to reason he and possibly others like Godfrey already have runes they can use to complete the ring but something or someone else is possibly stalling them.
Also: "There are six Great Runes in Elden Ring, each of them held by a mighty demigod. Players only need to obtain two of them to enter Leyndell, Royal Capital, and pass through to the end of the game."
So I put forth it's the lack of a weapon or in part Hewg that stalls them. Their mission given to them by Marika is to slay the Elden Beast. So even if you have the runes you shouldn't be able to just go in there if you can't complete the mission given by Marika. So then what do you do? I believe that's where Gideon/the Round Table was in part stalled. For story purposes the game assumes you will have a +10 or +25 weapon using the Ancient Dragon Stones that say specifically they can slay a God. Perhaps those are meant to be exclusively available in Farum Azula story wise instead of spread out in the game world as they are and Gideon has found no path there.
And of course Gideon's own beliefs seem to stall him once he thinks he's figured out Marika's true will, that they suffer in chaos essentially and struggle. As he says while dying "A man cannot kill a god..." Which I believe is the only reason why he says Marika wants them to struggle, he simply thinks you can't kill a god.
In the end he knew nothing.
As for Marika's will, she began to plot against the Greater Will after she started to research and investigate the Greater Will. It's from when she says that blind faith isn't enough and you can see her chamber filled with her research. So what did she uncover that makes her betray the Greater Will and begin her plotting? That's really just open to a lot of debate and speculation. However I present the simple notion that the Greater Will is clearly meant to be the gnostic Yaldabaoth the Demiurge. Great and terrible golden god of order and control. Sound familiar already? If you look him up you can see how they derived the Erdtree design from his popular interpretations. (There is even one picture of him as a golden tree with a woman inside it...) The god desires to feed on the life he creates, so I suspect the fact he's taking everyone's souls into the Erdtree is ultimately a bad thing you've been manipulated and deceived into thinking is a good thing for you. Marika discovers this and begins to plot. It's why she "punishes" the Tarnished by severing them from grace, so that when they die their souls won't be claimed by the Erdtree. She then continues scheming and various plots which ultimately culminate in her feeling she has no choice but to shatter the ring.
What pressures her? Was she part of the plot of the black knives? Was she trying to free her demigod children from flesh the same way Ranni and Melina are? (Do you think it's a coincidence that Ranni and Melina seem to be friends due to Melina trusting her with the bell? Melina says she's "Burned and bodiless" and Ranni's body is found burnt and we know the black knives weapons emit red/black flames.) Did the plot go horribly wrong? Or did the black knive betray them as they clearly aren't working with Ranni anymore as they try to kill her...we still have a lot of questions.
Regardless of why, the idea what the end goal of Marika is to kill a god (with the points you bring up being convincing enough for me) hasn't ever occured to me, but it makes sense to me now.
Nice summary. When you encounter other tarnished, they seem relatively normal with the ability to talk and reason, but most of the other creatures and "humans" in the lands between are twisted and mostly incapable of free thought.
Maybe severing the connection to the erdtree, for the tarnished prevents them from becoming this way. The greater will feeds on those who get "recycled" by the erdtree, leaving them as husks. This seems especially pronounced in the golden order nobles, who are feeble, dessicated husks.
A lot is open to interpretation, but some theories are stronger than others, which is why I like the subtle hints dropped in this game
Well. I always thought Miyazaki was deeply into the Gnostics... but I didn't know just how deep.
And, now that I think about it, this whole "Guidance of Grace" thing strikes me as very similar to the "Fruit of Knowledge," found in pretty much every interpretation of the Paradise/Eden story there is out there. It was controlled by the Demiurge/Erdtree, only given to those that IT deemed worthy of it, until someone - Sophia/Marika - gave it to the rest of us.
In fact, the game makes it very clear what made Marika break the Elden Ring, in the first cutscene it says that after the demigods received their great runes, the power tempted them, so they started looking for more. This caused Queen Marika to break the ring.
This is because The Greater Will wanted the demigods to go crazy and go to war with Marika and themselves for the Elden Ring, since as they are gods, Erdtree would feed on eternal death and conflict. It was through greather will Radagon came to existence but it was Marika's that sent him to Liurnia in the war against the Carian royal family and the Academy of Raya Lucaria, coincidentally making him fall in love with Renalla and having three more demigods who would later be tempted by the powers of the two fingers and the great rune. But no, it happened that the greater will chooses Ranni to become the next goddess and representative of the golden order. But in the end she never wanted to follow the greater will, and Marika "knowing" this, helped her take part of the Death rune and burn her own empirial flesh to never be used again by her two fingers. Marika forced Radagon to return and marry her, knowing that this would fuel Renalla's hatred against her and the greater order, and that this would extend to her children. The giant turtle in Liurnia itself says that Renalla was heartbroken after losing her husband.
She sealed the death rune on Malekith's sword knowing that no one at that moment would be strong enough to go head to head with the greater will, she entrusted Malekith with the mission of guarding the death rune without tellin him the reasons... but the reason why she entrusted Malekith was that bcs he was a shadow to her (like Blaidd was to Ranni) so if he found out about her plan to break the ring, he would try to stop it. Before he left for Farum Azulla she stole a part of the death rune for Ranni and during the Night of the Black Knives he even sacrificed her own son Godwyn so that Ranni's ritual could work.
Queen Marika always wanted to defy the greater will, but she needed elements that also defied the greater will.
If you look at the armor of the Black Knives it also clearly says that they had close ties with Queen Marika, it also says that all the assassins of the Black Knives night were women and Numen, which coincidentally in the rune of the Numens, it says, that it is a race outside the lands in between and are of the same race as Queen Marika herself. Rogier also says that the Numens are born in Nokron, the eternal city. Even if they are rare to born they and the offspring lives a extend periods of time. So to the great will they in war would be the culmination of struggle and suffer that feeds Erdtree... She withdrew the Guidance of Grace of Godfrey and his armada to send them away, the excuse was to fight and die but precisely it was as not to be prevented from breaking the Elden Ring, as Godfrey and his tarnished would oppose Queen Marika.
Given all the circumstances going in favor of Queen Marika's plan, she broke the ring. Knowing that this would generate conflict, knowing that the greater will would be challenged, knowing that this would mark the return of the "tarnished", in this case the player to the lands in between. She conceived her own daughter's purpose and destiny to burn down Erdtree. But ultimately she knew that we would have a choice, that we would suffer, we would be manipulated by several characters, but in the end we would become the elden lord, that we would have freedom to choose any ending we thought fit, not the ending that everyone else "chosen" by the golden order would follow.
@@hrawwr You got most of that wrong, so much I didn't bother to read the whole thing.
Marika broke the ring because she figured out something was up with the Greater Will. Go listen to all her Grace Site dialogues from Melina. And this is because we know GW is based on Yaldabaoth from Gnosticism. All his imprisonment of souls being taught to be a good thing when it's not is from Gnosticism. They also based designs in the game on famous Gnostic art.
Marika broke the ring to stop the evil, it's why she's crucified like Christ. And the Shattering war didn't didn't occur until AFTER the ring was broken, meaning the demigods didn't have their runes until AFTER the ring was shattered.
Marika figured out the Greater Will was evil just like in Gnosticism. She experimented with removing Grace from people like with her children. Then she most likely was responsible for the Black Knives actions, she was most likely further experimenting with severing people's souls from their bodies to try and save them. She had to do it all in secret, and she concocted a plan in the end that resulted in shattering the ring once everything else had failed.
If you look up all of Hewg's lines since you can miss some of them he was tasked by her to create something to kill a God, and the only real thing that makes her a God is the Elden Beast, she did all this to eliminate it.
And remember, this was all based on Lord of the Rings as said by Martin as well, the thing that makes the Ring evil is the Elden Beast. So you "cleanse" it essentially in the end.
Does Gideon know that we're in a game struggling to beat it? Marika is too meta here!
The element of dying a lot in the video game that holds the narrative is acknowledged in almost all souls games.
It’s why there’s always a Crestfallen person near the start, they represent players who gave up on beating the game.
@@CitizenLenny They just knew huh? Gonna call all the haters crestfallen from now on lol.
@@justinlindfors8512 You could also just call them Hollows, as that's also gameplay and lorewise correct with previous games. The undead that gave up became the random hollows you have to slaughter yourself through. Players that gave up due to not being able to beat the game would be the definition of em.
Dude who striked it was a total scrub to begin with. Hope the comment helps it's a neat theory at the least
He probably knows something we don't, he is the all knowing after all.
i mean it wouldnt be the first time that the all knowing doesnt know something.
I love that Skyrim is such a widely popular game, that its ambience music is used for videos on other games
ALL of the outer gods in this game require "something" that sustains them. Whether it be a cycle of life, struggle, then returning to the erdtree to be born anew, suffering and death, or... well more suffering and death, it seems the gods simply feed on the mortality of lesser beings albeit slightly differently.
I don't think any of the outer gods really 'need' anything to sustain themselves, but are rather just having a Great Game à la Warhammer 40k because they think they're clever little fucks like that.
A flaws I can note about this theory:
He says Unto instead of Onto, which in most circumstances can mean similar things, although not always. When taking into account Melina's dialogues about marika, we can conclude she actually DID want the tarnished and demigods alike to struggle in eternal conflict until one of them became strong enough to take the throne. Unto in certain definitions can mean until, perhaps Ofnir is calling this struggle meaningless or impossible? This tracks with him saying none can take the throne; not because he wants to prevent it, but rather he views it as outright impossible.
We know many things about Gideon; infact, most of his story is explained EXCEPT for his interaction with queen marika. Rather than a simple villain, id argue Ofnir plays a far less common roll, that of the Anti-Villain. Anti-Villains are characters with good motives, but who go to evil means to achieve them. First, let me lay the ground works for what we know of Ofnir (Assuming he isnt lying to us):
He is a fellow tarnished, like us, who seeks to gain knowledge in order to become elden lord -His dialogue
He is one of, if not the oldest tarnished at the table; He was likely present within the first iteration of the roundtable, the roundtable in the capital, where we can find items related to many of the characters who are currently/once were part of the table (For instance, Fia and Hewg). -Yet again his dialogue, although this is questionable and related to something we have little lore about
We know for a fact that either he or Vyke have two great runes -Enia dialogue, specifically "Only once before have I seen two Great Runes together... The Fingers expect... As much from you as they do young Gideon."
He has communed directly with the two fingers; and he apparently knows the origins of the world -Lord's Divine Fortification
He also once had a friend in Dolores, known as the sleeping arrow who is known for her St Trina arrows -Dolores the Sleeping Arrow Puppet
Furthermore, one of the four rites known only to him is the crafting recipe of a "Bewitching branch", using a St Trina cookbook, and which is one of miquella's major items -His rewards
Infact, much of his dialogue revolves around Miquella and attempting to find him; and we know that (originally) Miquella WAS St Trina in cut content.
He adopted Nepheli, likely when she was an adult woman, and taught her that he intended to fix the world and prevent the weak from being trod on.
And finally, he personally met with queen marika, and he was fearful of what she told him.
My theory is as follows:
Gideon does legitimately believe in the ideals he states to nepheli. He searches for knowledge in order to become powerful enough to become lord, likely holding two great runes already from times past. He works towards this goal under an "Any means necessary" Mentality, which I will explore further momentarily. In order to further this goal, he seeks out Miquella (a child progeny and empyrean capable of replacing queen Marika on the throne) potentially in order to become his consort? Or perhaps just to gain more strength in order to usher in his new era. Regardless, he seeks the medallions to reach the haligtree regardless of the extents he needs to go to (Likely sending ensha to obtain them for him, in cut content Latenna says the same "All-hearing Brute" line, but adds on "I told that bastard in the bone armor", also explaining why ensha attacks us for it). Once we obtain one, he encourages us to find the other half and open the snowfields, further urging us towards the haligtree in search of miquella, and finally concluding his search once he finds out that miquella is no longer in "Working order" Shall we say. He then moves to the ashen capital, speaking directly with marika/radagon/potentially the elden beast, and realizes that in order to become Elden lord, he would have to slay the Elden Beast, a task he is incapable of doing (Note Hewg's obsession with forging us a weapon specifically to kill a god, perhaps implying even with death unbound only certain people/weapons can kill a god?). He sees the end that should not be; that of the eternal and meaningless struggle of the tarnished, for, if he, a person who devoted his whole life to the pursuit of knowledge and power, cannot defeat a god, who can? He directly states that "A man cannot kill a god", and that he believes no other tarnished capable of taking the throne. I'd even go so far as saying that he likely ends up coming to the realization that the ends, in his case, did not justify the means, and all of what he did was for naught.
Im honestly just making shit up at this rate I dont know man, why did you read all of this? I definitely dont think he is working for marika though, especially with his odd ties to miquella.
What if his confrontation with us is a last ditch attempt to become lord himself? He is the smartest, most suited to rule, but even he can't slay a god. So when he learns you're going to slay a god he decides to try his hand against you, because he believes himself the best candidate. But when he falls, the all knowing who doesn't know how to slay a god, then surely you have no way either and no tarnished will ever become lord, because he just died. His final words being a reflection on his hubris, his belief that only he could become lord, and not a "it was rigged from the start" sorta thing like everyone interprets it.
What I took from him saying it, he became fearful, because he knew that Marika wanted a Tarnished to Slay the Elden Beast, Ofnir thinks that it’d be literally impossible, and that’s why he thinks Marika wants them to struggle for eternity.
I believe this. It explains why he just drops his ambition to become Elden Lord, and links up well with what he says and his armor’s description. The only thing that gives me a little doubt is: why fight the tarnished if he thought it impossible? He was waiting for us, that’s clear, but the rest isn’t.
Yeah, he couldn't comprehend the idea that a human could kill a god, so he thinks that Marika signed them up to an impossible task. Which is why he tries to stop us from getting to the Elden Ring, because genuinely thinks that we can't do it.
@@Theendman42 Iunno, maybe he figured it was a way for us to try and see his reasoning, but we are already dead set on becoming elden lord
@@MetalCaffeine56 He might just be trying to tell you what he learned, to save you from an impossible task, but when you don’t show any sign of backing down, he attacks
It's the remembrances! I knew something was up when you fight him and he uses all the incantations you get from remembrances including malenia rot flower incantation
Not them trying to gatekeep a fucking fan theory lmfaoooo
This doesn't make sense that Marika wishes for us to struggle endlessly. She shattered the Elden Ring to set the game's events in motion. She's a martyr.
I've heard, the more you talk to Gideon about what you have discovered the more powerful he will be in the fight against him. Does anybody made that experience?
Every time Gideon is given information on one of the demi-gods he didn't know much about, he seems to gain a part of their moveset. It seems like the intended implication is that once we tell him where to look, he follows up and gathers more information.
Pretty sure I have seen that he gains powers related to the shardbearers you have killed so the more you kill the stronger he gets
@@spenny2henny197 very interesting feature.
In my first and second playthrough I didnt kill Malenia until just before Radagon. In my third I killed her before fighting Gideon and he used her scarlet rot move agaisnt me.
@@andresfajardo6838 yes, this sucker uses you to find out the skills of the others. Actually I'm playing without talking to him
bro just made the best apology in all of TH-cam within a minute.
Gideon is siding with Morgott, who sides with Radagon, who sides with the Greater Will . Each one wants to prevent all tarnished to reach the Erdtree with some Great Runes. Their explanation is everytime, that Marika wanted to see them struggle endless in the Shattering.
So seeing all the Tarnished failing before you in the Story it seems Gideon was sabotaging the Roundtablehold all the time. Like an Sectret agent of Morgott.
Another strange thing is Vyke, the strongest Tarnished before yourself who achieved to wield two great Runes but met his "end" at the three fingers. Without the consent of Morgott he could never have entered this chamber, someone (Gideon maybe) gave Vyke fake infos and lead him there. Which resulted in shattering Vykes ambitions for the good.
And would show the partnership of Morgott and Gideon.
Another part is his Position to Miquella. It´s not full clear, but his task to find the Entrance to the Haligtree and collecting informations about Miquellas Fate shows his concerns of the possibility for another rising God in the Lands Between which would result in the End of the Shattering.
I think his reason is, as long nothing changes, his Position as the best knowledable Person in the World is safe. Like an Archivar of the Ruined World, where all is writen down and nothing changes.
Oh damn, that’s a super interesting idea as to how Vyke took on the Frenzied Flame
@Relyks Netoow the good thing about crazy people is you can manipulate them.
@Relyks Netoow Those are interesting questions for sure, and I think in order to figure that out we'd have to find out which Great Runes he managed to collect, and from whom he took them. (Unless that's already common knowledge and I just didn't know)
@Relyks Netoow Where does it say Vyke got 2 runes? (Genuine question because I've heard other people say he never got any of the great runes)
There is something else that is different from all the other ruin bearers and the two at the halegtree, the two at the tree are empearyians, not just Demi gods, maybe he want to personally destroy them because as empearyians they can be selected as a vessel for the elden ring replacing queen marika
The only actually good TH-cam apology, I respect you even more now man
"Getting ahead of yourself" means to act impulsively, recklessly or without thinking.
I find the fact that the 3 and 2 fingers used to be the same entity really interesting once you consider that the frenzied flame seems to have an (insane) intelligent entity/manifestation, while the other doesn't. The Elden Ring was shattered and apparently the fingers reacted in the same way, but the larger half of the Hand now embodies the Frenzied Flame. Coincidentally after this happens the Greater Will just up and dissapears, while Shabriri appears from nowhere and literally CULTivates some followers for the Frenzied Flame.
If my assumption is correct then the Greater Will IS the Frenzied Flame, or what's left of it after it was shattered. The Outer God was literally driven insane post fracture, but the Elden Beast and the Erd Tree don't recognize them anymore and have been set up to renew/keep themselves in power hence the thorns. (Elden Beast/Erd Tree are likely afraid of the Frenzied Flame's influence and since Vyke suspect anyone from the lands between of harboring it.)
Yeah, 3+2=5. They used to be whole to me.
I'm glad I'm not the only one thinking the 2 broken hands could make a fist.
The Frenzied Flame most likely pre-dates the Shattering. It emerged onto the scene when the merchants were driven underground into the shunning grounds below the capitol, but it would have been impractical to gather up and imprison the merchants while the capitol was actively in danger of siege. The talisman the player gets that depicts the fingers (that seems to predate the shattering) also depicts them as two (or 4, if you count the legs, but in any case definitely not 5), and Ranni alludes to each Empyrean being selected by their own two fingers. If the three fingers and two fingers were unified, it happened somewhere earlier in the timeline.
May chaos take the world
Hyetta (Finger maiden) tells us that the Frenzied Flame and the Greater Will were one being called The Great (I think this is the name in english). I have the theory that is the sun because one has the power of light and the other the power of fire
2/10 TH-cam Apology.
- No deep sigh at the beginning
- No "I didn't want to have to make this video" phrase
- No Dog on your lap being pet
- Sounded genuine
- Admitted to fault
- No Interpretive dance nor Ukulele
- TH-cam Comments are still open and likes aren't hidden
Please try and do better with making TH-cam Apologies
Haha
Great job getting the video back, we can enjoy your theories in peace
One... slight problem. Marika was the one who shattered the elden ring. Her weapon mentions that explicitly. As such, if Gideon is tying his motivations specifically to her, then we cannot truly say that she is in favor of supporting this cycle of parasitic erdtree sucking on the suffering juice, at least not anymore. He could certainly be mistaken about one or more variables... but to me, it's not so simple as him wanting to protect the greater will's interests if he is smart enough to know what's truly going on.
Doesn't he mention that at 10:28? I also think that your "parasitic erdtree sucking on the suffering juice" is a bit too much paraphrasing.
The parasite theory is from vati right? And I think he changed his mind about it
The redditor that accuse you of plagiarism was on Reddit legaladvice, he is claiming that his comment is HIS intellectual property and submitting a copyright claim to TH-cam.
Great content and don't stress too much. You've corrected the record and that shows character! Keep up the great work
Honestly, Sir Gideon was obviously a villain. It wasn't even that subtle by the time we have to fight him.
Just realized "Ofnir" was one of the names for Odin, and also seems to be related to a serpent that gnaws on the world tree similar to Nidhoggr. Gideon had always given me Odin vibes when it comes to the "all knowing" aspect of his character, aswell as his lust for knowledge and power.
Imagine if the Cresfallen Warrior had somehow managed to become the boss of the Nexus or the Firelink Shrine. That's Gideon Ofnir.
Defeatism, nihilism, envy, cowardice, cynicism, all warped into his weird vision that "no Tarnish can ever become the Elden Lord so why even try when you can cower in your Rounbtable alternate reality chambers as the world continues to go tits up out there?"
Dude doesn't even care that his "guests" keep dying or turning against each other right under his nose haha.
Glad the video is back, really wanted to watch it.
I just wanna mention that Gideon has his back at that 90 degree angle over the table for the entire game...
I really like Gideon
I cosplay him with my second character :D
In Zullie The Witches video called "unmasking friendly npc's" you can see how Gideon looks under his helmet and with ALL the stats for his character creation
So I used that to make a Gideon myself
Fun fact: Sir Gideon Ofnir has the exact amount of space available for your name
I was planning to do the same, great to know you can have the full name (without the All-Knowing, of course)
Me: Listens to Elden Ring Lore.
Also me: Mentally trapped in Whiterun by the background music.
As a frequent Reddit user, I apologize on their behalf. Most of the community honestly isn’t that harsh. I’m sorry a select few got so loud. You’re doing great, man
No one is the “villain”.
They all just have their own motivations.
Gideon is like Little Finger.
So a villain then.
@@RedgraveGilver there's no good or evil in elden ring just everyone trying to enact their own will
@@MrNinja543 well, if my will is to murder baby seals, then I would be a villain. Everyone wants to enact their own will, it’s want that will is and how they do it that determines if they’re a villain.
Really dig that skyrim song playing in the background. It's like the best of 2 worlds colliding
No hate, but I saw the post on Reddit about this and i don't think the gripe was about the main lore theory, but a specific part of your video where it seems like you are saying the exact same thing AncalagonV said on reddit a month ago. Hope you don't get hate for this though, no one needs that.
But he deleted the vid and apologized for it, giving proper credit. These dudes are seriously overreacting. It's not that deep, especially now that he's given them credit for their work.
@@killaghostface1256 yeah understand what you are saying. The Reddit post was only talking about a small section in the video where it was almost the same thing they posted. So i can kinda see why they got upset. It would be like taking a passage from someone else's article and coping it into your own article.
Regardless it happened... It's good that there was an addendum to the video.
@@killaghostface1256 He is literally still using that exact stolen part at 8:26 to 9:38. He did not change it, he does not credit it and he acted as if he doesn't know what Ancalon V was talking about. The addendum just makes it worse, because it dodges the responsibility fopr what he actually did and shifts blame to the victim.
@@varden506 Look at Ancalon V's comment from the linked reddit thread and tell me I'm wrong. Tell me that intro of the video was sincere and not being dishonest to his own viewers.
@@varden506 but he didn't apologize to the guy, he just said he doesn't understand.
"when you died to boss you feeding the eardtree" omg this piss me off imma burn it
The mere fact that Elden Ring has this much of a story on top of its incredible design and its unflinching difficulty is what makes Elden Ring live up to the old days of Arcade glory...and THEN some
i'd always thought it was more that gideon loyally served Merika's plan. to shatter the runes, bring them together and shatter again, to repeat this endlessly, the tarnished to struggle until eternity, for that was the only way the nature of such an order could be understood.
Bro don't even worry about it. People always gonna find a reason to hate
Gideon is the epitome of hubris. He doesn't believe that any tarnished can do what he cannot - slay a god. Even when you've retrieved the shards, burned the erdtree and marched on the capital, he still cannot believe it, because he can't fathom being surpassed by any other tarnished.
Nor does he, so I don't really see the connection
@@Z.O.M.G Nor does he what?
This is a year old but still remains a good example for how to own a mistake and apologize. TH-cam is full of bad examples. Usually with horrible people playing ukuleles.
Man, the line "He got a bit ahead of himself" always had me suspecting. I never knew that he was THAT bad though
8:15 that Skyrim Background Music made me cry 🥹
the fact that you used skyrim music out of no where was a banger because i always thought it fit sometime in elden ring. skyrim has the best soundtrack ever of original songs
Hey bro! Thanks for your videos! You didint really do anything wrong. Great job!
Bro just got the biggest fking props from me fr
People admitting to their own mistakes is a huge thing most people cant even do, sadly. Very nice mate.
AgtJake- it's okay. But here is something you think you can look at ? What are your thoughts on this actually being a future or past of dark souls ? I know even though it's stated this is not related, it's very interesting to see just the physical aspects of how it matches to how Dark Souls is. Let us know what you think
Genuine question I'm not trolling, and maybe I just misread this but are you implying elden ring takes place in darksouls?
Can everyone please let go of the idea that everything fromsoft does in merely a painted world inside dark souls? It's so tired at this point.
@@justhaku9240 yes and only DS games and not demons souls or bloodborne.
@@fjorgyn7438 I don't usually look at souls game that way..this is the first time and for some reason it's just dark souls and not demons souls or Bloodborne . Just DS. I know sounds very off but I feel just based on the layout, usage of certain things like the way the pillars are and many more to showcase it to be part of DS universe .. just my personal observation.
Admirable apology.
Good man.
I was shocked when I found Gideon and realized he was a fraud all along. He definitely fooled me but I wasted his ass anyway. Great video and lore so keep up the good work and glad you owned up to your mistake, it shows your a good guy.
man, Gideon Ofnir is my favorite elden ring character, he so cool and the way he looks under his helmet where he's just an old man with long white hair, just makes him cooler on how this 74 year old man killed an entire albenauric village
When I first met Gideon and got to the roundtable it felt very much like a hunger games scenario. He needs our help and we need his knowledge but (at least initially) acknowledges there is only one Elden lord so either I figured he would try to kill us or hope we die during our task.
The small details you take into account to come up with these theories is absolutely amazing! Great video man this truly changed the way I thought about this game lore wise
i loved that you played my favorite skyrim song of all time
When Ensha attacked me, I was weirded out because I assumed he worked for Gideon. I went to talk to Gideon and as soon as he said “ahh you…” the tone of his voice made me even more suspicious of him
The thing is trail and error also comes with completion and progress, so you are feeding the erdtree and going against it at the same time
I see this misconception being thrown around in practically every lore video. The greater will is NOT an outer god ad we learn from hyettas questline: "Thank... thank you... I have touched them. The words of the Three Fingers. As your maiden, allow me to divine them. All that there is came from the One Great. Then came fractures, and births, and souls. But the Greater Will made a mistake. Torment, despair, affliction... every sin, every curse. Every one, born of the mistake. And so, what was borrowed must be returned. Melt it all away, with the yellow chaos flame. Until all is One again."
If we make a lovecraft comparison, the greater will is azathot, the outer gods are the great ones. The greater will is creation and existence itself. The touter godss are what make up existence.
Hence why my favourite character is Gideon. I find him a complex and interesting character. Many hate him for the actions he did, but I appreciate him for what he adds to Elden Ring
Was a very good video at first. But we understand the situation. And your past videos show where your heart is. Thanks for the hard work to bring this world to life. Looking forward for more.
Bro, I hope you see this I like everything you have with this theory, I think Marika wants you to kill the elden beast, why would she give the blacksmith a special mission to make God slaying weapon, Even after everything that happens for the end he forgets everything except that he needs to make a God killing weapon for the tarnished.
With the way that I see the Lore after finishing everything Marika was finally fed up after the greater will when it did not save her first born Godwyn, she’s hoping that we tarnished come back and come back stronger TO kill the greater will because all she can do is hold them back. Which is why even at the end of the game we don’t fight her we fight Radagon
The funny thing is I killed the omen killer randomly and had no idea about this whole quest with it
Any lore if free to interpretation. The guy being mean to you for adding his theory into yours is just being mean because he wants the credit.
We are here to learn together.
4:17 Ensha is all hearing
So, " a tarnished of no renown" was awoken by grace, entered the lands between, got they're grace-clad ass handed to them by a grafted scion, and then proceeded to solo all the demigods, marika, radagon and the greater fucking will, all implied to be first try.
That is glow-up if I've ever seen one.
As a lore theorizer of other works, in one of a couple communities for it I appreciate you correcting your attribution. As a contributor and iterator of theory and speculation I however find I am mostly on your side regardless of the fact that you corrected the error.
I’ve deleted a half dozen accounts over as many years. Post hundreds and hundreds of comments on half as many theories. And one thing I know, is you cannot own a piece of speculation on lore from a media property. And the real ironclad clinch on that is that theories and speculation are iterative. Explained, reexplained, reorganized to fit a different set of theories better. When they are posted, and are rethought through, adding more or less like the first to say something like it, you fail to have anything like ownership of it.
Why?
Because your work itself is an iteration of the true owner you hypocrite! Because the very claim you make to the idea, is itself derivative. Directly.
It is a courtesy if it has been found by you in a direct way, to attribute whom was the source you saw it in. And if you use their words directly, you should not pretend it is from you. But this is the domain of thought. And even if you quote it, you aren’t obligated to give anything like attribution. Because. And this is critically two parts, the media property is not any of ours, and the writings on such things are infinitely divisible into rewording, and specific iteration. Meaning it’s elements and constituent parts ARE BY NO MEANS the property of the theorizers, and are subject to literal infinities of subtle revision by each and every single on of the people who perceive the idea, and work out its application.
So thanks. For mentioning. Good of you. Thanks for correcting that. You should properly specific your quotes if you are quoting. Thanks too, for recalling the specific person whom you heard this from, and proceeded to speculate and analyze your understanding of the lore with. I think it’s honorable to feel like you are a part of a larger community, and so certain individuals deserve recognition for their contribution.
But. Don’t be to hard on yourself. This was more than enough for you. And dancing around another’s ego and entitlement to thought and conversation on another’s is not necessary, or helpful to anyone. Especially not the fragile bogart of thought for their own pride in petty derivation of narrative, which a million other men have actually done in a real and definable way. And so own the publishing rights to. You know. Authors of original works. And tellers of stories. Who if honest, are making amalgamations of the essences of a million other words, said by a million other men, and are boiled down and reused to tell their version of it. We oughta be a bit more humble if we at all realize what we are doing when writing and speaking. In relating narrative.
When he started out smacking me around with moves from other bosses I beat, I knew I fucked up giving him the knowledge.
Isn’t it messed up that people feel the need to apologize over such trivial things? This info is easy to to figure out by simply paying attention. I knew Gideon was evil as soon as I seen him. His shape language, his goal conflicting with yours right from the start, him being like Odin wanting to know everything in benefit of his own. Everyone knows by now that those traits just ooz villain. F that guy for trying to call you out.
Skyrim’s soundtrack so good it’s even being used in ER videos
I love how fluently the skyrim theme fits into this
its a theory! on a game! PLAGURISM!? the facts are there in the game they arent the only people to read item descriptions. brilliant video, keep it up
I think what Gideon heard was the greater will speaking through its prisoner Marika. This is its way of punishing everyone in the lands between for Rannis (even though i think marika was pulling the strings) rebellion. Because he thinks hes "all knowing" he assumes this is Marikas command and is too blind to question whats happening. That and he was too afraid to fight her as "no man can kill a god" even though thats clearly what Marika wanted.
The music you picked for this video sent me back to my childhood thank you
I think the safest theory here is that Ofnir is working for Morgott, Radagon and/or the Greater Will directly. Both he and Morgott promote the idea that no one can or should become Elden Lord. And it's clear that the Greater Will has abandoned the Lands Between to crumble and die, or at least so long as Marika's long-game plot stands any chance of succeeding. Like I've commented before on a previous lore video on Marika, the Greater Will is essentially the same as the Elder God from Legacy of Kain; it feeds on the endless cycle of war, suffering and death by commanding people to eternally wage war for its Golden Order.
Either Ofnir has always been Morgott/Radagon/TGW's mole or pawn within the Tarnished & Roundtable Hold, or he's somehow been contacted by the Greater Will after you or Melina burn the Erdtree and manipulated into believing this course of action. And, of course, Ofnir's personal benefit is that, in a rotting world bereft of Demigods and abandoned by Outer Gods, HE gets to play the leader. Killing Miquella and Malenia, and hiding/destroying the Haligtree, means he's eliminated every pocket of resistance and any possibility of better options for the people of the Lands Between. He can be the Stalin/Big Brother towards a broken nation, playing the part of All-Knowing Prophet for "Queen Marika" (really the Greater Will or just himself) with no one capable of or willing to challenging him on it, since Marika herself is a prisoner within her own throne room that only Gideo will have the authority and power to enter.
Alternatively, Marika manipulated Gideon to sabotage, manipulate and/or oppose you and any other Tarnished... so Godfrey would have the time to arrive, stomp Gideon into mush like the uppity puppy he is and complete their scheme.
The skyrim music in the background is a beautiful finishing touch on this video
Gideon is a hero for trying to stop us from being underwhelmed with the elden beast
Gideon: A man cannot kill a god.
Me: Watch me.
most professional apology💀
When you fight Gideon any boss you kill that has a great rune before had becomes is added to his moveset
I had a whole dialogue with him about how pissed he was about you going to forbiden places in the north.
Where are you getting this "Erdtree feeds on struggle" thing from? If it's just the corpses in the tombs, that's called Erdtree burial and it's only awarded to a chosen few. And if it feeds on suffering wouldn't it be stronger now that there's more of it and not dying?
Also the Erdtree isnt a manifestation of the Greater Will. It's not even a unique thing seeing as how Miquella, who is only a demigod, which basically means just a really strong being, managed to make one of his own.
If someone didn't want their "work" to be "plagiarized" they shouldn't have posted it anonymously onto a public forum.
I subscribed because you put your adorable dog pictures, it totally worked on me
Being a TH-camr will definitely toughen your skin. Just know that there are plenty of us who appreciate what you're doing. Looking forward to more content!
So like, everyone else is a houseguest, including him?
Oh well, thank you.
For your lack of citations, you have been found both Maidenless and a mere visitor of the Roundtable.
So, it is not just canonical for our character to respawn, but it is also canonical to be bad at the game and keep failing and dying, since that creates a lot of suffering and struggle for the Erdtree to nomnom on, motivating it to ressurect our character every time. The other Tarnished mostly just stand around and don't yolo every fight, so the Erdtree doesn't bother with ressurecting them (unless we ask for forgiveness at the Chuch of wows)
best youtube apologie in a elden ring video lol
The Erdtree’s pretty, Leyndell’s pretty, the Elden Ring looks cool, and I want that goddamned crown. My taking the throne, and the Golden Order, for myself is indeed the best ending.
Just noticed the weird little guys in Gideon's trailer image. One in the bottom left and one in the top right handing G his staff. They don't look like any enemies in game