I still remember "Jenny's" abusive boyfriend in Forrest Gump wearing a WW2 German coat and calling Forrest a "Baby Killer". It's just weird what people hold on to and let go.
that was fiction though, in reality the whole "spitting on soldiers in airports" or calling them baby killers didn't really happen, it's sjuts something that everybody thinks is true. Research it, the truth is that vietnam vets and the anti-war movement were very sympathetic towards one another.
@@Toxodos I've watched tons of Vietnam Veteran interviews and they all say that the public either treated them terribly or were completely indifferent. It also kinda depended on where you were from too. If a soldier arrived at an airport in a leftist state like California, then they'd probably get called baby killers, but if they landed in Texas then they'd get treated like returning heroes.
@@Dushmann_ there's 0 evidence for this. Look it up. "Myth of the spat-on Vietnam veteran", wikipedia has a whole well-sourced article on this, check the sources. I'm sure you even had people who think they remember it that way just because of how persistent that myth was. Not hard to find those for documentaries. I'm telling you ALL of these stories came YEARS after the war. You can't find anyone from that time or shortly after who says they were spat on. Returning flights from vietnam didn't even land at commercial airports, they landed at military bases, it makes almost all of these stories instantly unbelievable. I know, it's WILD how people just think this is true to the point it's just "common sense" but that happens all the time.
@@Dushmann_ There have been numerous studies of returning Vietnam veterans, a number of which have attempted to pinpoint the origins of the perception that the anti-Vietnam War movement was anti-troop or spat on veterans. Notably in this context, the earliest studies and polls related to Vietnam veterans don't even have this issue on their radar. The 1971 Harris Poll mentioned above, which found that only 1 percent of veterans perceived an unfriendly reception from friends and family, also interviewed a cross section of households and employers and summarized their findings saying, "The public and prospective employers clearly feel that veterans are deserving of the same respect and the warm reception accorded to returning veterans of previous wars."[9] In 1974 the Committee on Veterans Affairs of the U.S. Senate gathered together almost 1,000 pages of "Source Material on the Vietnam Era Veteran." Not one source in this large volume mentions antiwar forces spitting on veterans.[17] A 1975 academic study of Vietnam veteran "Adjustment Patterns and Attitudes" asked no questions about treatment by antiwar forces or being spat on. What this study did reveal, however, was that participation in the war significantly changed the men's attitudes-whereas 67% of them were for the war prior to entering the military, 75% came back against it.[18] So, not only has no evidence been uncovered by scholars of "I was spit on" stories, during the war period, or shortly after, but "there is no evidence that anyone at the time thought they were occurring", or felt it needed to be investigated.[4]: p.75
@@Dushmann_ from that wiki: "There have been numerous studies of returning Vietnam veterans, a number of which have attempted to pinpoint the origins of the perception that the anti-Vietnam War movement was anti-troop or spat on veterans. Notably in this context, the earliest studies and polls related to Vietnam veterans don't even have this issue on their radar. The 1971 Harris Poll mentioned above, which found that only 1 percent of veterans perceived an unfriendly reception from friends and family, also interviewed a cross section of households and employers and summarized their findings saying, "The public and prospective employers clearly feel that veterans are deserving of the same respect and the warm reception accorded to returning veterans of previous wars.""
@genaro5766 it's the sun rune, and it was used because its name sounded similar to "seig". The nazis called it the victory rune because, like all the symbols they stole, they wanted to make it theirs. You fell for nazi propaganda there champ.
David Hackworth said the US military was obsessed with German equipment and their tactics in the 1950's and 60's. To this day, armor units around the world study the tactics of Rommel and respect how good their military was for a short time.
It's reported that even Spielberg modeled the Empire in the Star Wars franchise after the nazi's. If the nazi's did anything right, is that they were they played the quintessential fanatical, brainwashed, super-soldier very well.
In a good world the military but yeah hear we are. Also a platoon commander is different from the "GOVERNMENT" not to mention the individual soldier, and a squad and a squads mentality. Think my man think a bit more then in 1. 1 I said it 1 uno single 1 direction
One of my Uncle's served in Vietnam, he mentioned he saw this as well, he at first thought the soldier was a Vet from WWII parading a souvenir he got from that war.
I think the meaning is very simple: 1. Dale Dye is correct, this was meant to be used as shock value. 2. Number 1 overlaps with this but, the Nazis were the only other faction to fight the Soviets. When the Cold War started, many Western pro-capitalist nations asked the former Nazi commanders about the Soviets. Figured maybe there were ways to beat them. Totally ignoring the biases that these Nazi commanders. But from what i got of the Nazi flag in this movie is that when you fight Communists, you end up looking up to another certain faction that also fought Communists. And lost.
It would be very stupid since in Vietnam nazi symbols weren't as charged as in Europe and US. They knew about nazis, they likely knew nazis weren't good guys but that's it. Now, could US soldiers think otherwise? Yeah, common GI Joe wasn't exactly a philosopher But I'm more inclined to believe that these guys were soft nazi sympathizers. You know, these "well actually Wehrmacht was ok" (they weren't better than SS, really) ones. Or "genocide was kinda bad but they did smoke some commies am I right?" guys.
This is the stupidest explanation ever 😂. “When you fight communism you also look up to another certain faction that also fought communists. And lost” 😂 Fukkking brilliant really 😂
I know of one. He was a Finn whose Anglicized name was Larry Thorne. I’m not aware of any others. They would’ve been getting a little old for jungle warfare.
@@jacobflores7621I think the point the OP was making had to do with the American military power and saying we defeated this powerful foe in the Nazi's and they would do the same to the Vietcong.
@@2CanSam1000 then why not fly the “rising sun” too since we defeated mighty Japan? It had to do with communism and communist. It was a big middle finger to NVA and Vietcong.
I’ll give you the answer, Erwin Rommel. Armor, as well mechanized, units learn their history and the employment of their unit systems from Erwin Rommel. He was an armored employment genius. An Iraqi general saw Rommel’s photo in a US Bradly vehicle, after his surrender and asked why his picture would be posted. It’s because Rommel was a God damn genius.
It’s not about intimidation it’s about IFF. Identify friend or foe. Which is ironic but it’s hard to miss or misidentify a Nazi flag or battle flag if it’s being flown by a unit in the field. A lot of blue on blue incidents are from not having proper IFF. I can think of several cases of it throughout the Gulf War and Iraq War.
@@loganbaileysfunwithtrains606 that might be true yet it is hard to believe that only the few wear such flags and take pictures with them outside of combat zone. It’s points to their ideological belief more than protection from friendly fire.
@@jeffGordon852 you can’t fly any nations flag under a false banner that is a war crime, using a flag or banner of a nation or army that no longer exists is fine, which is why again they are used for unit IFF
This happened during the Battle for 73 Easting during the Gulf War. When a captured Iraqi major asked why their was a picture of (WW2 German)Field Marshall Erwin Rommel taped to the inside of door of a command vehicle the major was being transported in, one of the crew members schooled him by saying, "If you had studied Rommel you might not be sitting in the back of this vehicle". There is an amazing amount of respect for Rommel's courage and tactics from all modern militaries, most of all from the tanker community.
Idk why any American service member would admire the Nazis military tactics when the US military outclassed the Nazis in every aspect of the war proving the US military was the most superior fighting force in the world. Not the Nazis. Shit makes 0 sense.
The flag was on a tank for a reason and that’s because many U.S. tank battalions study and learn from the famous german general Erwin Rommel. In desert storm some tankers had a portrait of him inside the tank.
I noticed the Nazi flag back in early 90's when I recorded the movie on VHS. After buying the DVD I could pause the video and clearly see it. I thought it was to intimidate the enemy because the Nazi's were against communism. It is funny to see a black American soldier sitting below it.
@@edgardovilla199I mean, the symbol and it's meaning are meant to be intimidating, I don't know if it makes the crew white supremacists though. Have fun Twittoid
That proves your white and have neither scratch or grasp of the word of minorities. That blood sitting in the APC was either rescued or wounded, and if he wasn't on top of that vehicle he'd be left behind and certainly killed by the NVA/Vietcong or the Jungle. In Vietnam, even GI's were prohibited from venturing into secured towns alone. Remember this, aside for from that one PoW rescue by Navy Seal rescue, or the Prisoners from the Hanoi Hilton, or that dude from Rescue Dawn, there were no PoWs who survived captivity during the Vietnam war; colored or Caucasian. This is literally portrayed in the film when Manny disappeared and was found hung and mutilated from a tree with a Vietcong card. Yeah, those guys like SGT Barns and the APC crew reviled Colored people, but they abhorred the enemy even more; that's what made their alliance between opposing Americans possible. It's not an exception or even a miracle: Necessity.
When America beat Germany in ww2 alot of nazis soldiers became American also so to think of a former nazi flying a nazi flag could be possible in Vietnam
@@Ominous-Shadows could be. Many former SS manner ended up in the French Foreign Legion. So much so that there were South Vietnamese officers that could speak fluent German.
This is so true. Ukraine-Russo war, infantry sewn random patches on the gear. Things like meme patches. Who knows somewhere in the future someone gonna fly Pikachu flag on their vehicles.
It’s there because it worked as an aesthetic choice. importantly it summed up the Americans’ attitude towards their enemies. Total war, total annihilation and an acceptance of war crimes, this can be summed up in one aesthetic choice. No symbol reflects this more accurately than a Nazi Swastika
Theoretically yes but that couldn't be further from the situation in Vietnam. It was a war fought with major restrictions and public opinion weighing in. Essentially fighting with one hand tied between your back.
During the Korean War the Communist Chinese complained to the UN that UN forces were using former Waffen SS soldiers against them. Turns out the US Army was training S. Korean scouts to do commando raids on the Yalu River and the only spare uniforms they had to give them were captured Waffen SS pea dot uniforms.
Stone was interviewed about this and he said the armoured guys in Vietnam had a thing for Nazi memorabilia as they were driving ‘panzers’ too. It was the same in the Australian Army in the 90s. Some of the Armoured Corps guys wore the peaked panzer caps with Deaths Heads on them in their Leopards and had Heinz Guderian PT shirts etc.. not a political statement as much as a bit of make believe that was a bit naughty. The Leopard was a modern German panzer after all. You wouldn’t get away with it now.
So what about the Australian blokes flying the German flag on their jeeps? Were they big fans of the Kubelwagen or should you and your ilk follow your leader?
During Desert Storm many US armored units both Abrams and Bradley crews had pictures of Rommel in their vehicles, and when asked about it by a captured Iraqi tank commander. The reply was “well if you read up on Rommel’s tactics you wouldn’t be a prisoner right now”
@@loganbaileysfunwithtrains606 Hitler lost. The Germans are barreling towards their own destruction at the hands of the people they tried to exploit. Turkey is outsourcing 155mm shell manufacture to the U.S. Look in the mirror, you're Guatamalan now. ☺️
Wtf I remember that being a Confederate flag. I'm certain of it because platoon was my favorite movie growing up and I watched it more time's than I can count. I'm either losing my mind or the Mandela Effect is real.
In WW II, US forces flew the square Confederate Army's battle flag and Navy's battle ensign. I read somewhere that Germany's and Japan's intelligence agencies spent a lot of time and effort trying to find out who else had declared war on them. They wanted to declare war in return. No luck.
The Nazi flag was flown as a symbol of impending death. It was primarily used to frighten enemy personnel, so it was a means of psychological warfare. Prior to U.S. involvement in Vietnam, the French employed “mercenaries” to protect their interests. Among these hired men were former wermacht and SS troops, many of whom were respected as well disciplined and professional soldiers.
@@arttoegemann Absolutely not there were tons of Germans that went to the French no questions asked give a new identities That was the whole thing with the French Foreign Legion a new beginning And they took everybody literally
@user-zh6sh8qv9k Correct. The French foreign legion was rammed full of wermacht soldiers so much so that there is a French foreign legion marching song not French but in German! Kameraden.
@@arttoegemannnope, read “on the Devils tail" by Paul Martelli. He was a Waffen SS Soldier who did just that and wrote a book about it really cray cray stuff.
The Germans, especially Prussians were famous for military discipline, toughness and efficiency. Even though they lost to the French 3 times out of 5, their army was tough and ruthless.
Could be paying homage to the Blitzkrieg or the Desert Fox. I’ve known tankers with totenkopf tattoos/patches out of respect for German tank commanders and their units history of fighting them.
@@DeltaDannerEither you're being wilfully misleading or you're terribly naive. They wore it for the same reason the Australians did in Afghanistan, because they're Nazis.
I always thought it was part of the lower ranks humor, like wearing dead enemies clothing or how in the movie " Full Metal Jacket" there's a scene where one of the squad props up a dead Vietnamese soldier to make fun of him.
Yep. Part of lower ranks' humor/satire. Remember the scene when Joker explains to his officer why on his helmet there is "peace" sign pin while at the same time there is inscription of "BORN TO KILL"? it is poking fun at the concept of "duality of man"..
They used Not-see symbols because they were Not-sees. The Vietnamese peasants they were fighting wouldn't have known what that flag looked like. Village folk from developing countries weren't familiar with symbols from European wars occurring 20 years earlier. You could say that maybe the American soldiers wouldn't have known that but in reality we have seen Nazi symbols used by American soldiers in modern day. They're also used by militant anti-Russian assemblies like Azov and C19 receiving American training, financing, and arms in Ukraine. Many in America saw (and continue to see) common cause with the Not-sees in that they also believe/d in White racial supremacy, anti-communism, and violent subjugation of those they see as lesser to them. Germany may have lost WWII but fascism won. It survived as the United States global empire.
When I first saw the movie, I interpreted the prescence of the flag as simply a symbol of anarchy. - Having read some of the comments, and thinking about it some more, it may be a reference to that company's previous record in WW2. Perhaps their predecessors had captured an enemy flag after a particular engagement?
It started with the French who had an entire foreign legion battalion of former German soldiers. They spoke German, and were ruthless, which scared the Vietnamese to no end.
By the way: It’s the official war flag of 3rd German Reich and actually it’s a war crime to use flags of other, not involved, nations in a war, even though that country uses other symbols then. 🇩🇪
Reminds me of finishing our time at fort Polk for training and one of our Strykers drives by the foxhole we had near a road with a Black NCO sticking out of the commander hatch doing the Nazi salute saying "it's over!"
Surfer culture from that era also had kids of WW2 vets playing with the souvenirs that the parents brought home. It was adaptation of these symbols fighting back at what they saw the govt was representing. There’s a whole academic research community on this.
It could be any number of things (unit history, shock value, etc.) but it also could just be a tank full of actual Neo-Nazis flying their colors or using the symbol to identify themselves from a distance.
The Germans were the fathers of mechanized warfare. The 7th Panzer Division and their tactics was the basis of all future US mechanized divisions starting in Korea and taught and utilized still to this day. The Nazi symbolism is an ode to the traditions passed on to our future warfighters using that doctrine.
@@ethanedwards422 Wait up smooth brain, Exactly what vast post WWI British tank program did the English have that the Germans used to learn Blitzkrieg and mechanized infantry tactics? Is that why every single British led tank operation from 1939 to 1945 ended in disaster? Because they were so good at it? If that were the case, American tank crews would be flying the Union Jack and not Swastikas and Death Heads.
It's the psychological effect to scare the enemy. In foreign countries the Nazi is still a life threatening scare. In the US we didn't have occupation as there was in foreign countries, so we see it in a different aspect.
When France was fighting in Vietnam they used German SS & other German troops. They were crushing the Vietnamese UNTIL a reporter saw it, did research about France using former German SS. After his reporting hit France that program was stopped. France soldiers came in and was getting crushed.
They were Foriegn Legionnaires,the only way foreigners could serve in the French military. The Netherlands also used former collaborators, SS,Luftwaffe,Wehrmacht,in Indonesia & Korea. Their citizenship had been revoked & this was a path to reinstatement......& was not a universally popular move
Yeah, there’s a really good book about it called “The Devil’s Guard.” It’s a former Waffen SS officer’s recounting of the end of the war, going into the Legion, and then his time in Indochina. One of my favorite books of all time. Highly recommend
@AP-1138 i read the book. It was an incredible story. It became very popular in the military, that's where i read it. But since then it had come out that although Germans did serve in IndoChina under the French, the book is actually made up.
There is actually a clear answer as to why it’s there, it’s just another little detail added by Stone and Dye. Americans in Vietnam did use various intimidating flags and symbols on their APCs, the troops decorated them themselves, it’s not meant to be some deep symbolism to be analysed lmao, you barely even see it in the movie.
I've easily seen over 10,000 photos of the Vietnam War, I grew up during that conflict, and it's always fascinated me. Not once have I ever seen a Nazi flag on anything American. Confederate, yes, Nazi, no. So it's a bit odd to hear that Dale Dye and Oliver Stone added this for "realism".
@AfraimAttathe support the USSR got from the West was largely supporting equipment. Mostly trucks, 13,000 aircraft and some 9,000 tanks, 8,000 tractors, 15 million army boots and a metric shit ton of fuel.
No the answer is mich simpler: Most white Americans were racist at the time. Yes they fought against Nazi Germany but the flag became "White Power" symbol later on. Although US is not a completely racist country but was happy to look the other way, racists are good warriors needed.
The French Foreign Legion fought against the Viet Minh(precursor to the Viet Cong) in the early 1950's. Back then the majority of Legionaires were former German soldiers from WW-2 and more than half were former SS members. In fact the Legion adopted the same style of many SS marching songs but used French and non Nazi themes as their basis. The SS used their very highly motivated mindset and style in fighting for the Legion. The dogs of war mentality was set loose upon the Viet Minh and other enemies of the Legion wherever they fought. Psychological warfare is an essential part of war, the Nazi flag in the Vietnam War was a reminder of the harsh enemy that the VC & NVA fought more than 15yrs earlier and what the American armed forces were willing to meet out on their enemies in a more updated but similar war as was waged before in French Indo China/Vietnam.
I served 13 months as a rifle squad leader. I never saw any thing that would even look Black. It belonged to the nazis the Marines that I serve with would be offended and in my opinion tear any such symbol down.
Wasnt even that Erwin Rommel wasnt evil at all. Dude even defied orders to kill POW’s and treated them well better then others. Not to mention he was a master tank commander and a general
I watched the movie and didn’t notice this, i take it as: represents how similar German atrocities in Poland were to American ones in Vietnam, and also, a captured flag during WW2 used during the Vietnam war.
One of the Sheridan tanks my dad was on in Vietnam had a German gross painted on it, the type that was on the bottom of their planes wings in wwii, I think it was like an homage to wwii German tankers since they were the best
@@edscmidt5193 A shame that the krauts could not fathom that picking fights with every nation in europe would end in defeat. And you need to keep in mind that all the ace tankers and pilots really only had good kill tallies against poor quality soviet armour. Once they got transferred to the west, these supposed legendary aces barely lasted a month e.g. michael wittman. Oh and german ratios for tanks lost and enemy armour destroyed is wildly exaggerated because krauts did not count their armour lost even when tanks were smoking immobilized wrecks, whist soviet and american troops would count mobility killed tanks as losses too. So yeah kraut aces are only really regarded as aces because of facing inferior quality of enemy vehicles, masking their own losses and cold war romanticism
To give context to this, when the Vietnamese were fighting the French most of these were Nazi SS hiding from the law in the Foreign Legion. These units were brutal and still wore Nazi emblems on uniforms vehicles and such. The U.S. troops learned this and did use it for fear.
The French sent many wehrmacht veterans (and some SS) who were homeless, on the run, etc. From a tactical perspective, the Nazis never really fought in Jungle terrain during WW2 and they never encountered enemies weapons such as the ak-47. Although the Germans had the similar stg 44, they never went up against troops with weapons as such. They also never experienced combat with an enemy that dug networks of tunnels. I believe this was sometime in the late 40’s or 50’s when France still had colonial rule over vietnam. Once the wehrmacht and SS left overs were slaughtered, that was really the shock to the military world.
@@malcomx1924 that's fucking hilarious coming from someone using malcomx as their name. Educate yourself on some of the basics before you make dumb comments.
"He has no soul, and preys to no god, dont be stubborn buddy" thats some supremely metal shit to say to some as spiritual as an Afgan, man. Sent my sides in to orbit.
In all likelihood, that unit captured they Nazi flag 30 years earlier and it was passed down to the new trips in the unit as a souvenir from an old vanquished enemy. They wanted to put a North Vietnamese flag up next to it I'm sure.
It was a little while before America decided to make a move on Hitlers Germany. Fact was a lot of Americans didn’t want to be involved and didn’t see an issue as it wasn’t their fight and like in others places, some percentage of Americans sympathised with Germanys stance on Blacks, Gays, Jews and Gypsies. Fighting that war didn’t change everyone’s opinion on those groups so in some instances didn’t see the Nazi symbolism as something to fear but something to be proud of. There was definitely elements of white supremacy in that film anyway. The crazy guy with the scar hated everyone and everything. His “friends” were like minded. I only watched it for the first time a month ago and enjoyed it. Some brilliant actors in it.
It's not a matter of how the viewer of the movie determines its real meaning. It is a matter of how the soldiers determine the meaning of the flag that they chose to use at that time and place. Their interpretation is the one that counts.
I had the privilege of knowing alot of Vietnam vets growing up. My Godfather was a vet and so was a lot of his friends. I aaked them once about what was the most realistic movie about Vietnam. They all had different answers but what was hilarious is they all unanimously agreed that Platoon was the most unrealistic by far.
Before it was Vietnam, it was the indo-China war. At that time the French were fighting and the French foreign legion still had a good number of Hitler child soldiers in it. Maybe a tie to that
It served two purposes. First, as a showoff, "look this is the flag of an enemy we've beaten". Second, its meant to shock enemies. Weather they think you are the nazie, or you've beaten them therefore you're stroger, doesn't matter. Value of shock is in the fact that the enemy isn't in their rigjt state of mind. And if it boosts your troops morale at the same time, even better. Simmilar tactics were used during Yugoslav wars. Due to being severely underarmed Croatian troops would use WWII ustasha insignia and wear black uniforms, for the sole purpose of instilling fear into serbian troops. And it worked like a charm.
when the US went to the middle east many of the elders in isolated tribes thought the germans had came back. So some very small groups of soldiers would use that to scare them to not fight back.
The best that I think of is where the unit served during WW2, if it served in Europe they might have fought the Germans. Since it is a mechanized unit I would assume so.
That flag isn't actully banned but in Germany. Just not welcomed in most places. And in 68 it was still made on request by the same companies that made American flags for the government.
I agree witth the interpretation in the video. I would not interpret that American soldiers were Nazis based on a film. Only history and facts would do that because if the film did mean that, it would need factual evidence to base it on.
I had assumed it was there as a southern FU to the black Americans. Just the confederate flag was. Don’t how it would have any real physiological impact on the Vietnamese except for two hikers there were no Third Reich operating in Asia.
I still remember "Jenny's" abusive boyfriend in Forrest Gump wearing a WW2 German coat and calling Forrest a "Baby Killer". It's just weird what people hold on to and let go.
that was fiction though, in reality the whole "spitting on soldiers in airports" or calling them baby killers didn't really happen, it's sjuts something that everybody thinks is true. Research it, the truth is that vietnam vets and the anti-war movement were very sympathetic towards one another.
@@Toxodos
I've watched tons of Vietnam Veteran interviews and they all say that the public either treated them terribly or were completely indifferent.
It also kinda depended on where you were from too. If a soldier arrived at an airport in a leftist state like California, then they'd probably get called baby killers, but if they landed in Texas then they'd get treated like returning heroes.
@@Dushmann_ there's 0 evidence for this. Look it up. "Myth of the spat-on Vietnam veteran", wikipedia has a whole well-sourced article on this, check the sources.
I'm sure you even had people who think they remember it that way just because of how persistent that myth was. Not hard to find those for documentaries.
I'm telling you ALL of these stories came YEARS after the war. You can't find anyone from that time or shortly after who says they were spat on.
Returning flights from vietnam didn't even land at commercial airports, they landed at military bases, it makes almost all of these stories instantly unbelievable.
I know, it's WILD how people just think this is true to the point it's just "common sense" but that happens all the time.
@@Dushmann_ There have been numerous studies of returning Vietnam veterans, a number of which have attempted to pinpoint the origins of the perception that the anti-Vietnam War movement was anti-troop or spat on veterans. Notably in this context, the earliest studies and polls related to Vietnam veterans don't even have this issue on their radar. The 1971 Harris Poll mentioned above, which found that only 1 percent of veterans perceived an unfriendly reception from friends and family, also interviewed a cross section of households and employers and summarized their findings saying, "The public and prospective employers clearly feel that veterans are deserving of the same respect and the warm reception accorded to returning veterans of previous wars."[9] In 1974 the Committee on Veterans Affairs of the U.S. Senate gathered together almost 1,000 pages of "Source Material on the Vietnam Era Veteran." Not one source in this large volume mentions antiwar forces spitting on veterans.[17] A 1975 academic study of Vietnam veteran "Adjustment Patterns and Attitudes" asked no questions about treatment by antiwar forces or being spat on. What this study did reveal, however, was that participation in the war significantly changed the men's attitudes-whereas 67% of them were for the war prior to entering the military, 75% came back against it.[18] So, not only has no evidence been uncovered by scholars of "I was spit on" stories, during the war period, or shortly after, but "there is no evidence that anyone at the time thought they were occurring", or felt it needed to be investigated.[4]: p.75
@@Dushmann_ from that wiki: "There have been numerous studies of returning Vietnam veterans, a number of which have attempted to pinpoint the origins of the perception that the anti-Vietnam War movement was anti-troop or spat on veterans. Notably in this context, the earliest studies and polls related to Vietnam veterans don't even have this issue on their radar. The 1971 Harris Poll mentioned above, which found that only 1 percent of veterans perceived an unfriendly reception from friends and family, also interviewed a cross section of households and employers and summarized their findings saying, "The public and prospective employers clearly feel that veterans are deserving of the same respect and the warm reception accorded to returning veterans of previous wars.""
Fun fact: vietnam war had some ww2 axis veterans.
Yes, but that was the french part of the war. Most of the fallen soldiers at Dien Bien Phu were germans.
No. They were in US army
@@boshwaggleboskolsson7905 thats what im saying. probably the most known one is Larry Thorne.
@@Alexandros.Mograine Yes, "Bad Larry" Thorne fought with the Finnish Waffen SS. WIKING DIV.
Yeah, Törni being just one example
The usmc scout snipers used the SS thunder bolts as a symbol. Not surprising to say the least
They're runes not thunder bolts. The rune symbol for Victory... "SIEG" rune .
@@genaro5766well said Bröther. ^^"
@genaro5766 finally, someone else who does research
@genaro5766 it's the sun rune, and it was used because its name sounded similar to "seig". The nazis called it the victory rune because, like all the symbols they stole, they wanted to make it theirs. You fell for nazi propaganda there champ.
@@genaro5766thank God someone corrected him I hate that people talk without any understanding about something.
Because the soldiers found the flag amusing.
That's literally the full explanation.
nah dude it requires an essay on ideology and human psychology to explain.
There's a photo of an MP in Vietnam using an SS marked stalhelm, and another photo of a tanker in country using a stalhelm
Not a tank- that is a M113 APC.
@@josephlipnickas8148He didn't talk about the scene.
Unfun fact: men of the SS didnt disappear after WW2 , some of them signed up as colonial troops/foreign legion for France
@@ivanmonahhov2314 and they got sent to Vietnam, where they used a wild mix of weapons and equipment
Nick Brokhausen was known to wear a stalhelm as well. He was MACV SOG
David Hackworth said the US military was obsessed with German equipment and their tactics in the 1950's and 60's. To this day, armor units around the world study the tactics of Rommel and respect how good their military was for a short time.
Yes, even the M-60 pig machine gun was modelled on the mg-42.
It's reported that even Spielberg modeled the Empire in the Star Wars franchise after the nazi's. If the nazi's did anything right, is that they were they played the quintessential fanatical, brainwashed, super-soldier very well.
My father was a fighter/bomber pilot in Egypt fighting the Desert Fox
I can’t remember the title, but an author in a book I read stated that the US Army had what many derisively called “Wehrmacht penis envy” post-WWII.
@@cassidy109 I would like you to remember the book
"It's a military statement, not a political one"
Bro, who runs the military?
The Grunts do
The hire ups who where not in Vietnam but back in the US and where totally disillusioned and oblivious to the situation in Vietnam.
In a good world the military but yeah hear we are. Also a platoon commander is different from the "GOVERNMENT" not to mention the individual soldier, and a squad and a squads mentality. Think my man think a bit more then in 1. 1 I said it 1 uno single 1 direction
Generals
And tresoned politicians and also tresoned generals
One of my Uncle's served in Vietnam, he mentioned he saw this as well, he at first thought the soldier was a Vet from WWII parading a souvenir he got from that war.
Was it a souvenir?
@@crabby648 Yes, from his services in WWII Elemein.
I think the meaning is very simple:
1. Dale Dye is correct, this was meant to be used as shock value.
2. Number 1 overlaps with this but, the Nazis were the only other faction to fight the Soviets. When the Cold War started, many Western pro-capitalist nations asked the former Nazi commanders about the Soviets. Figured maybe there were ways to beat them. Totally ignoring the biases that these Nazi commanders. But from what i got of the Nazi flag in this movie is that when you fight Communists, you end up looking up to another certain faction that also fought Communists. And lost.
Yes Sir I learn something new all the time on UTUBE thank you.
Yeah that's a good point.Nazisim is the far opposite of communism and wanting to show how opposite we stood to the Soviet back Viet Cong makes sense
It would be very stupid since in Vietnam nazi symbols weren't as charged as in Europe and US. They knew about nazis, they likely knew nazis weren't good guys but that's it.
Now, could US soldiers think otherwise? Yeah, common GI Joe wasn't exactly a philosopher
But I'm more inclined to believe that these guys were soft nazi sympathizers. You know, these "well actually Wehrmacht was ok" (they weren't better than SS, really) ones. Or "genocide was kinda bad but they did smoke some commies am I right?" guys.
This is the stupidest explanation ever 😂.
“When you fight communism you also look up to another certain faction that also fought communists. And lost”
😂
Fukkking brilliant really 😂
Isn’t it more about incorporating symbols from former foes, such as how the Americans name equipment “Tomahawk” or “Apache?”
A lot of ex waffen SS troops joined the French foreign legion after ww2 & saw action in Vietnam fighting the communists in the 50s.
About 5000 German soldiers joined LE after war 2... Officially none were SS. (cough) Not to put you down, just a tidbit. ✌
@@dougs4944right "offically" right
I was gonna comment the same thing, kudos to you.
Yes they hated communism so much they sought it out when ever they could.
There's alot of former SS and Wehrmacht members in the US army during in Vietnam war.
I know of one. He was a Finn whose Anglicized name was Larry Thorne. I’m not aware of any others. They would’ve been getting a little old for jungle warfare.
@@ericoberlies7537 Läuri Törni that's was his Finnish named.
Wrong Vietnam War .. you are thinking of the French Foreign Legion before Dien Binh Phu...
@@ralphalvarez5465 he was a green beret in the us army
@ralphalvarez5465 there were quite a few in US service. They were usually older.
I think that the meaning behind the flag is that the amaricans defeated us german in ww2 and wanted to say „we will defeat you too“
Not really. Who really hated Communism and communists? The Nazis 👍🏽
@@jacobflores7621I think the point the OP was making had to do with the American military power and saying we defeated this powerful foe in the Nazi's and they would do the same to the Vietcong.
@@2CanSam1000 then why not fly the “rising sun” too since we defeated mighty Japan? It had to do with communism and communist. It was a big middle finger to NVA and Vietcong.
@@jacobflores7621 I didn't say i agreed with him i was just clarifying his original comment
I’ll give you the answer, Erwin Rommel. Armor, as well mechanized, units learn their history and the employment of their unit systems from Erwin Rommel. He was an armored employment genius.
An Iraqi general saw Rommel’s photo in a US Bradly vehicle, after his surrender and asked why his picture would be posted. It’s because Rommel was a God damn genius.
Same reason you used to see some bikers wore lightning bolts or swastikas - shock value.
Punks in the 70's did it too. There's Sex Pistols pics of the band wearing swastika t-shirts.
skaters and surfers still use the iron cross
Or they're actually Nazis
They're not lightning bolts.. They are runes.
@@OldManJenkins23the German government still uses the iron cross, it predates Naziism.
Some US soldiers were photographed in Iraq and Afgan with Nazi and confederate battle flag. I doubt it was to “intimidate” the enemy.
It’s not about intimidation it’s about IFF. Identify friend or foe. Which is ironic but it’s hard to miss or misidentify a Nazi flag or battle flag if it’s being flown by a unit in the field. A lot of blue on blue incidents are from not having proper IFF. I can think of several cases of it throughout the Gulf War and Iraq War.
@@loganbaileysfunwithtrains606 that might be true yet it is hard to believe that only the few wear such flags and take pictures with them outside of combat zone. It’s points to their ideological belief more than protection from friendly fire.
I'll take my Barbarism over your Progressivism any day of the week.
@@loganbaileysfunwithtrains606 lot of flag could’ve been used, but they CHOSE this one. Guess they will never learn
@@jeffGordon852 you can’t fly any nations flag under a false banner that is a war crime, using a flag or banner of a nation or army that no longer exists is fine, which is why again they are used for unit IFF
This happened during the Battle for 73 Easting during the Gulf War.
When a captured Iraqi major asked why their was a picture of (WW2 German)Field Marshall Erwin Rommel taped to the inside of door of a command vehicle the major was being transported in, one of the crew members schooled him by saying, "If you had studied Rommel you might not be sitting in the back of this vehicle".
There is an amazing amount of respect for Rommel's courage and tactics from all modern militaries, most of all from the tanker community.
It's popular to think of Rommel as a military genius but General Heinz Guderian was the innovator of Blitzkrieg and modern tank warfare.
@@ralphalvarez5465 I'll check it out
@@ralphalvarez5465Thank god somebody sed this
Idk why any American service member would admire the Nazis military tactics when the US military outclassed the Nazis in every aspect of the war proving the US military was the most superior fighting force in the world. Not the Nazis. Shit makes 0 sense.
Studying Rommels tactics and flying that flag are two very different things.
The flag was on a tank for a reason and that’s because many U.S. tank battalions study and learn from the famous german general Erwin Rommel. In desert storm some tankers had a portrait of him inside the tank.
Ive seen a picture from inside, bought a copy of Rommel the Desert Fox from an armored recce guy.
Bradley crews had pictures of Rommel during desert storm.
If they wanted to honor Rommel, wouldn’t it be accurate to use DAK emblem instead?
“ROMMEL YOU MAGNIFICENT BASTARD…I READ YOUR BOOK!” - George Patton (from Patton the movie)
Never forget, as Stone got older, he says he Barnes was the hero
both of them were heros ying and yang of the war
Stone has said some bullshit too before so I wouldn't praise him for anything but his movies.
I noticed the Nazi flag back in early 90's when I recorded the movie on VHS. After buying the DVD I could pause the video and clearly see it. I thought it was to intimidate the enemy because the Nazi's were against communism. It is funny to see a black American soldier sitting below it.
I highly doubt he agrees with it, more like the other little wh1te supremacist other apc crew members put it there.
@@edgardovilla199I mean, the symbol and it's meaning are meant to be intimidating, I don't know if it makes the crew white supremacists though. Have fun Twittoid
That proves your white and have neither scratch or grasp of the word of minorities. That blood sitting in the APC was either rescued or wounded, and if he wasn't on top of that vehicle he'd be left behind and certainly killed by the NVA/Vietcong or the Jungle. In Vietnam, even GI's were prohibited from venturing into secured towns alone.
Remember this, aside for from that one PoW rescue by Navy Seal rescue, or the Prisoners from the Hanoi Hilton, or that dude from Rescue Dawn, there were no PoWs who survived captivity during the Vietnam war; colored or Caucasian. This is literally portrayed in the film when Manny disappeared and was found hung and mutilated from a tree with a Vietcong card.
Yeah, those guys like SGT Barns and the APC crew reviled Colored people, but they abhorred the enemy even more; that's what made their alliance between opposing Americans possible. It's not an exception or even a miracle: Necessity.
black und Nani
@@edgardovilla199 don’t have to be white to be smart ;)
The Americans had a NAZI flag and the Vietnamese had NAZI weapons. Who got the better deal?
What Nazi weapons did the Vietnamese use?
@@josephahner3031Kar-98k, MP-40, MG-34, StG-44, Luger pistol. Some were captured from the French while others were provided by the Soviet Union.
When America beat Germany in ww2 alot of nazis soldiers became American also so to think of a former nazi flying a nazi flag could be possible in Vietnam
@@Ominous-Shadows could be. Many former SS manner ended up in the French Foreign Legion. So much so that there were South Vietnamese officers that could speak fluent German.
Imagine some American WW2 vets going to Vietnam and getting PTSD from MG42 ripping thru the Jungle
Some people just took random shit to Vietnam
i think i remember seeing a image of black soldier with the Confederate flag,i may be a bafoon if im wrong
@@sven9900I think I saw something similar from Iraq. I'm starting to think people didn't really take it as seriously back then
This is so true. Ukraine-Russo war, infantry sewn random patches on the gear. Things like meme patches.
Who knows somewhere in the future someone gonna fly Pikachu flag on their vehicles.
@@nimay13 someone will sneak in an anime patch
@@sven9900 lmao based
It’s there because it worked as an aesthetic choice. importantly it summed up the Americans’ attitude towards their enemies. Total war, total annihilation and an acceptance of war crimes, this can be summed up in one aesthetic choice. No symbol reflects this more accurately than a Nazi Swastika
NAH NAH Its cuz they were high
@@Hitlersoneball i doubt it even happened. Just a prop.
@goodnightvienna8511 You gave a fitting explanation. I totally agree with you.
Theoretically yes but that couldn't be further from the situation in Vietnam. It was a war fought with major restrictions and public opinion weighing in. Essentially fighting with one hand tied between your back.
@@ericolsen5592 Of course absolutly no massacred families and burned villages in vietnam 🤦♂️
During the Korean War the Communist Chinese complained to the UN that UN forces were using former Waffen SS soldiers against them. Turns out the US Army was training S. Korean scouts to do commando raids on the Yalu River and the only spare uniforms they had to give them were captured Waffen SS pea dot uniforms.
Cool
Stone was interviewed about this and he said the armoured guys in Vietnam had a thing for Nazi memorabilia as they were driving ‘panzers’ too.
It was the same in the Australian Army in the 90s. Some of the Armoured Corps guys wore the peaked panzer caps with Deaths Heads on them in their Leopards and had Heinz Guderian PT shirts etc.. not a political statement as much as a bit of make believe that was a bit naughty. The Leopard was a modern German panzer after all. You wouldn’t get away with it now.
So what about the Australian blokes flying the German flag on their jeeps? Were they big fans of the Kubelwagen or should you and your ilk follow your leader?
During Desert Storm many US armored units both Abrams and Bradley crews had pictures of Rommel in their vehicles, and when asked about it by a captured Iraqi tank commander. The reply was “well if you read up on Rommel’s tactics you wouldn’t be a prisoner right now”
@@loganbaileysfunwithtrains606 Which relative of yours was sent home in a garbage bag, apologist?
@@Jimpiedepimpie from your triggered comment I’d ask which of your relatives were sent home in a trash bag
@@loganbaileysfunwithtrains606 Hitler lost. The Germans are barreling towards their own destruction at the hands of the people they tried to exploit.
Turkey is outsourcing 155mm shell manufacture to the U.S. Look in the mirror, you're Guatamalan now. ☺️
Wtf I remember that being a Confederate flag. I'm certain of it because platoon was my favorite movie growing up and I watched it more time's than I can count. I'm either losing my mind or the Mandela Effect is real.
In WW II, US forces flew the square Confederate Army's battle flag and Navy's battle ensign. I read somewhere that Germany's and Japan's intelligence agencies spent a lot of time and effort trying to find out who else had declared war on them. They wanted to declare war in return. No luck.
@@leondillon8723 that's a good one, I'm sure they spent a lot of time and effort with no results 😂
YES I swear it was a confederate flag.!
The Confederate flag was on the bunk of one of Sgt Barnes friends.
@@Hex___666I think it was Rodriguezs bunk
The Nazi flag was flown as a symbol of impending death. It was primarily used to frighten enemy personnel, so it was a means of psychological warfare. Prior to U.S. involvement in Vietnam, the French employed “mercenaries” to protect their interests. Among these hired men were former wermacht and SS troops, many of whom were respected as well disciplined and professional soldiers.
I have heard those "mercenaries" were prisoners of war, from WWII, the French held on to.
@@arttoegemann Absolutely not there were tons of Germans that went to the French no questions asked give a new identities That was the whole thing with the French Foreign Legion a new beginning And they took everybody literally
@user-zh6sh8qv9k Correct. The French foreign legion was rammed full of wermacht soldiers so much so that there is a French foreign legion marching song not French but in German! Kameraden.
@@arttoegemannnope, read “on the Devils tail" by Paul Martelli. He was a Waffen SS Soldier who did just that and wrote a book about it really cray cray stuff.
@@loslobos786 My source is H. Bruce Franklin.
The Germans, especially Prussians were famous for military discipline, toughness and efficiency. Even though they lost to the French 3 times out of 5, their army was tough and ruthless.
Could be paying homage to the Blitzkrieg or the Desert Fox. I’ve known tankers with totenkopf tattoos/patches out of respect for German tank commanders and their units history of fighting them.
@@DeltaDannerMy thoughts exactly.
@@DeltaDannerEither you're being wilfully misleading or you're terribly naive.
They wore it for the same reason the Australians did in Afghanistan, because they're Nazis.
I always thought it was part of the lower ranks humor, like wearing dead enemies clothing or how in the movie " Full Metal Jacket" there's a scene where one of the squad props up a dead Vietnamese soldier to make fun of him.
This is correct.
Yep. Part of lower ranks' humor/satire. Remember the scene when Joker explains to his officer why on his helmet there is "peace" sign pin while at the same time there is inscription of "BORN TO KILL"? it is poking fun at the concept of "duality of man"..
Soldiers start losing their shit after awhile. I didn't see anything sadistic, but definitely weird.
This is it. Humor was super dark in the infantry when I was in. Especially in an actual war zone.
Like shouting "Get some!" While you murder women and children, you mean? People fly Nazi flags because they're Nazis.
They used Not-see symbols because they were Not-sees. The Vietnamese peasants they were fighting wouldn't have known what that flag looked like. Village folk from developing countries weren't familiar with symbols from European wars occurring 20 years earlier.
You could say that maybe the American soldiers wouldn't have known that but in reality we have seen Nazi symbols used by American soldiers in modern day. They're also used by militant anti-Russian assemblies like Azov and C19 receiving American training, financing, and arms in Ukraine. Many in America saw (and continue to see) common cause with the Not-sees in that they also believe/d in White racial supremacy, anti-communism, and violent subjugation of those they see as lesser to them.
Germany may have lost WWII but fascism won. It survived as the United States global empire.
Operation paperclip
I don't think you have to be afraid to say Nazi... NSDAP
I wore a metal swastika around my neck.
I had acquired it from a Vietnamese who was offering them for sale out of his sidewalk cart.
As a soldier?
In East Asia, the swastika is a religious symbol commonly found in Buddhism and Hinduism
@@mattm.4861 , lol. Most people know the symbol dates back to antiquity.
What does that have to do with today ?
Young and dumb or committed ?
Before WW2, there was a US infantry division that used it as their SSI...
When I first saw the movie, I interpreted the prescence of the flag as simply a symbol of anarchy. - Having read some of the comments, and thinking about it some more, it may be a reference to that company's previous record in WW2. Perhaps their predecessors had captured an enemy flag after a particular engagement?
I thought it was anti establishment symbology. A protest against being drafted.
Malding Americans desperately trying to cover up how much their grandpappies loved Hitler. 😂
Possible, but I said it was likely for IFF, identify friend or foe. Kinda hard to misidentify a M48 flying a Nazi battle flag.
It started with the French who had an entire foreign legion battalion of former German soldiers. They spoke German, and were ruthless, which scared the Vietnamese to no end.
That makes more sense. Yes ex ss troopers went to the FFL and fought against the Vietnamese. A fear factor akin to flying the jolly rogers.
the vietnamese were clearly not impressed given that they dragged artillery trough the jungle to shell them in their positions
By the way: It’s the official war flag of 3rd German Reich and actually it’s a war crime to use flags of other, not involved, nations in a war, even though that country uses other symbols then. 🇩🇪
That's not true. It's illegal in a couple of countries. Not the entire world. And in Vietnam during the 60s, it wasn't. And It's still not there.
@@willthorson4543 Ever heard of the United Nations who define such rules for the whole world
@@silasmerzenichlmao
@@silasmerzenichthe UN can go to hell
Nazi Germany was defunct by then, so it was no longer a country.
Bros just showing his pride
Reminds me of finishing our time at fort Polk for training and one of our Strykers drives by the foxhole we had near a road with a Black NCO sticking out of the commander hatch doing the Nazi salute saying "it's over!"
😂
Classic, was it 2ID as well?
Surfer culture from that era also had kids of WW2 vets playing with the souvenirs that the parents brought home. It was adaptation of these symbols fighting back at what they saw the govt was representing. There’s a whole academic research community on this.
A buddy of mine told me when he deployed to Iraq. His tank platoon the SS thunderbolts on them. Pretty sure for the same reason.
Russian do same in chechnya war
Its proof both are same
We had a totenkopf skull stencil on some of our humvees in 04
I imagine part of the use of these symbols as shock value came from “yeah we kicked their ass and took their shit. Guess who’s next?”
Then only the Russians, Indian and British would be able to use it in that context
It's also a reminder that not all the "good guys" are good guys. Though I think that sentiment was already established
It could be any number of things (unit history, shock value, etc.) but it also could just be a tank full of actual Neo-Nazis flying their colors or using the symbol to identify themselves from a distance.
To be fair, if WW2 vets had a snapshot of the US today, I’m pretty sure they would have switched sides.
The Germans were the fathers of mechanized warfare. The 7th Panzer Division and their tactics was the basis of all future US mechanized divisions starting in Korea and taught and utilized still to this day. The Nazi symbolism is an ode to the traditions passed on to our future warfighters using that doctrine.
You are aware that Nazi WW2 tank doctrine came from British tankers post ww1 right?
@@ethanedwards422 Wait up smooth brain, Exactly what vast post WWI British tank program did the English have that the Germans used to learn Blitzkrieg and mechanized infantry tactics? Is that why every single British led tank operation from 1939 to 1945 ended in disaster? Because they were so good at it? If that were the case, American tank crews would be flying the Union Jack and not Swastikas and Death Heads.
It's the psychological effect to scare the enemy. In foreign countries the Nazi is still a life threatening scare. In the US we didn't have occupation as there was in foreign countries, so we see it in a different aspect.
Its more that were jsut racist
Nazis never went to the east dum dum, amerimuts are just f*kng racist
When France was fighting in Vietnam they used German SS & other German troops. They were crushing the Vietnamese UNTIL a reporter saw it, did research about France using former German SS. After his reporting hit France that program was stopped. France soldiers came in and was getting crushed.
They were Foriegn Legionnaires,the only way foreigners could serve in the French military. The Netherlands also used former collaborators, SS,Luftwaffe,Wehrmacht,in Indonesia & Korea. Their citizenship had been revoked & this was a path to reinstatement......& was not a universally popular move
Cool story bro...😂
Yeah, there’s a really good book about it called “The Devil’s Guard.” It’s a former Waffen SS officer’s recounting of the end of the war, going into the Legion, and then his time in Indochina. One of my favorite books of all time. Highly recommend
@AP-1138 and it's documented that it's complete BS.
@AP-1138 i read the book. It was an incredible story. It became very popular in the military, that's where i read it. But since then it had come out that although Germans did serve in IndoChina under the French, the book is actually made up.
Being that the flag is on a tank I would also guess it has some type of homage to Field Marshal Rommel as well.
There is actually a clear answer as to why it’s there, it’s just another little detail added by Stone and Dye. Americans in Vietnam did use various intimidating flags and symbols on their APCs, the troops decorated them themselves, it’s not meant to be some deep symbolism to be analysed lmao, you barely even see it in the movie.
A reference to the book _Devil's Guard._
Im actually rereading that book right now lol
The m113 isn't a tank, it's an armored personnel carrier.
Same exact thing
@@jho7659nope. The biggest reason is because it can’t kill a tank. But the armor is much poorer as well.
@@jho7659it was designed to be a “battlefield taxi”, a field ambulance, not a front line fighting vehicle.
I've easily seen over 10,000 photos of the Vietnam War, I grew up during that conflict, and it's always fascinated me. Not once have I ever seen a Nazi flag on anything American. Confederate, yes, Nazi, no. So it's a bit odd to hear that Dale Dye and Oliver Stone added this for "realism".
"Why did u put a naxi flag there?!"
"Dunno,because i wanted to?"
Is that like saying “we beat these guys and we’ll beat you to”
Or a ww2 relic from the TC's father who gave it to him as a symbol of "survive and bring this relic back home"
It was the USSR the one who defeated Germany lmao
The communists did the heavy lifting against nazi germany
@AfraimAttathe support the USSR got from the West was largely supporting equipment. Mostly trucks, 13,000 aircraft and some 9,000 tanks, 8,000 tractors, 15 million army boots and a metric shit ton of fuel.
Beat by 6 not by 1
No the answer is mich simpler: Most white Americans were racist at the time. Yes they fought against Nazi Germany but the flag became "White Power" symbol later on. Although US is not a completely racist country but was happy to look the other way, racists are good warriors needed.
Most races at the time were racist so your point?
The French Foreign Legion fought against the Viet Minh(precursor to the Viet Cong) in the early 1950's. Back then the majority of Legionaires were former German soldiers from WW-2 and more than half were former SS members. In fact the Legion adopted the same style of many SS marching songs but used French and non Nazi themes as their basis. The SS used their very highly motivated mindset and style in fighting for the Legion. The dogs of war mentality was set loose upon the Viet Minh and other enemies of the Legion wherever they fought. Psychological warfare is an essential part of war, the Nazi flag in the Vietnam War was a reminder of the harsh enemy that the VC & NVA fought more than 15yrs earlier and what the American armed forces were willing to meet out on their enemies in a more updated but similar war as was waged before in French Indo China/Vietnam.
I served 13 months as a rifle squad leader. I never saw any thing that would even look Black. It belonged to the nazis the Marines that I serve with would be offended and in my opinion tear any such symbol down.
I was in Vietnam 67-68 and never seen anything related to the Nazis! Movies don’t always reflect reality!
They sure don't! Hollywood is fantasy.
There were NAZI SS troops fighting with the foreign legion in indo China long before you got there.
There have been photographs. Maybe you didn't see it because it was EXTREMELY rare
Fking liar 😂💀
Stone said in the bts commentary about this, that the armored division that rolled in that day did have a fetish for using Nazi memorabilia.
American tank commanders to this day will proudly have pictures of the Desert Fox in their tanks.. as they should
Wasnt even that Erwin Rommel wasnt evil at all. Dude even defied orders to kill POW’s and treated them well better then others. Not to mention he was a master tank commander and a general
Rommel also was involved in the failed assassination attempt on Hitler.
Regardless of Rommel fighting for the wrong side, he was definitely a strategic pioneer. There was a lot to learn from the German military in WW2.
Rommel was a God damn genius. The true inventor of the Thunder Run.
@@ericolsen5592 your country is doomed for defeating the "wrong side"
I watched the movie and didn’t notice this, i take it as:
represents how similar German atrocities in Poland were to American ones in Vietnam, and also, a captured flag during WW2 used during the Vietnam war.
Probably a "If we defeated them, imagine what we could do to you!" type thing.
One of the Sheridan tanks my dad was on in Vietnam had a German gross painted on it, the type that was on the bottom of their planes wings in wwii, I think it was like an homage to wwii German tankers since they were the best
Kraut tankers were the best, pilots were the best, generals were the best, they had the best gear yadda yadda.
how come they lost then?
@@salar7902 cuz they fought the world and the pilots and tankers didn’t get to retire unless they were badly wounded or dead
@@edscmidt5193 A shame that the krauts could not fathom that picking fights with every nation in europe would end in defeat.
And you need to keep in mind that all the ace tankers and pilots really only had good kill tallies against poor quality soviet armour. Once they got transferred to the west, these supposed legendary aces barely lasted a month e.g. michael wittman.
Oh and german ratios for tanks lost and enemy armour destroyed is wildly exaggerated because krauts did not count their armour lost even when tanks were smoking immobilized wrecks, whist soviet and american troops would count mobility killed tanks as losses too.
So yeah kraut aces are only really regarded as aces because of facing inferior quality of enemy vehicles, masking their own losses and cold war romanticism
War trophy that belongs to whoever placed it there or someone could have died and it's a memorial of a fellow veteran , old days
To give context to this, when the Vietnamese were fighting the French most of these were Nazi SS hiding from the law in the Foreign Legion. These units were brutal and still wore Nazi emblems on uniforms vehicles and such. The U.S. troops learned this and did use it for fear.
The French sent many wehrmacht veterans (and some SS) who were homeless, on the run, etc.
From a tactical perspective, the Nazis never really fought in Jungle terrain during WW2 and they never encountered enemies weapons such as the ak-47. Although the Germans had the similar stg 44, they never went up against troops with weapons as such. They also never experienced combat with an enemy that dug networks of tunnels. I believe this was sometime in the late 40’s or 50’s when France still had colonial rule over vietnam.
Once the wehrmacht and SS left overs were slaughtered, that was really the shock to the military world.
I have two of those flags in my room and I am proud to have them..FJB
Why do you guys always pick the sides that lose? Just curious because God damn you guys can't win jack shit (even in Iraq you got your asses kicked)
Most badass flag ever created!!!
Fed
@@malcomx1924 that's fucking hilarious coming from someone using malcomx as their name. Educate yourself on some of the basics before you make dumb comments.
Proud? Lol. Flags of losers and murderers. Good choice to be Proud of. Lol
Shock value.
Absolutely right
"what did they mean by this?"
"Oi, dun this look fuckin cool?"
They flew the flag for the same reason they adopted the 'Fritz' helmet in the '80s- it's badass and makes an impression.
It can also make the enemy scared and think they are fighting way more people then thier actually is.
Oliver Stone? Propaganda.
How so?
Are you gainsaying actual Vietnam vets like Dale Dye and Oliver Stone and the vets who saw the movie and confirm the existence of those flags?
They are lucky they didn't met with the Spetsnaz Volunteers.
That would have been tragic for the americans.
Lucky Soviet Never Took Vietnam War seriously Since They already have Asian Representatives there..
"He has no soul, and preys to no god, dont be stubborn buddy" thats some supremely metal shit to say to some as spiritual as an Afgan, man. Sent my sides in to orbit.
I always understood this scene with the Nazi flag to represent "remembering a worthy opponent".
In all likelihood, that unit captured they Nazi flag 30 years earlier and it was passed down to the new trips in the unit as a souvenir from an old vanquished enemy.
They wanted to put a North Vietnamese flag up next to it I'm sure.
Makes sense, even in Afghanistan and Desert Storm some units carried Nazi and Confederate flags around.
It was a Ukrainian tank
They probably have it because it's just such a badass looking flag!!!
Yes
Former nazis joined the French Legionaires to escape punishment and were sent to Vietnam to reclaim the French colonies.
It was a little while before America decided to make a move on Hitlers Germany. Fact was a lot of Americans didn’t want to be involved and didn’t see an issue as it wasn’t their fight and like in others places, some percentage of Americans sympathised with Germanys stance on Blacks, Gays, Jews and Gypsies. Fighting that war didn’t change everyone’s opinion on those groups so in some instances didn’t see the Nazi symbolism as something to fear but something to be proud of.
There was definitely elements of white supremacy in that film anyway. The crazy guy with the scar hated everyone and everything. His “friends” were like minded.
I only watched it for the first time a month ago and enjoyed it. Some brilliant actors in it.
Thats the german national flag i thought i didn't see a swastika
It's in the center. It paused when he starts talking and you can see it.
Maybe they were Democrats!
I didn't see any Nazi flags in the Army, but I did see Nazi salutes.
I mean obviously they are calling the American troops Nazis.. this is one of the most anti American military movies ever produced
It's not a matter of how the viewer of the movie determines its real meaning. It is a matter of how the soldiers determine the meaning of the flag that they chose to use at that time and place. Their interpretation is the one that counts.
Confederate flags were also often seen , displayed by soldiers/Marines who were proud to be from the South
Yeah my grandfather had one too, from the war.
I had the privilege of knowing alot of Vietnam vets growing up. My Godfather was a vet and so was a lot of his friends. I aaked them once about what was the most realistic movie about Vietnam. They all had different answers but what was hilarious is they all unanimously agreed that Platoon was the most unrealistic by far.
Before it was Vietnam, it was the indo-China war. At that time the French were fighting and the French foreign legion still had a good number of Hitler child soldiers in it.
Maybe a tie to that
Supposition : A lot of french who have been in vietnam were Germans that served in french Foreign Legion.
Maybe they found one in Vietname camps.
The flag was there because americans were just like germans, aggressors.
It served two purposes. First, as a showoff, "look this is the flag of an enemy we've beaten". Second, its meant to shock enemies. Weather they think you are the nazie, or you've beaten them therefore you're stroger, doesn't matter. Value of shock is in the fact that the enemy isn't in their rigjt state of mind. And if it boosts your troops morale at the same time, even better.
Simmilar tactics were used during Yugoslav wars. Due to being severely underarmed Croatian troops would use WWII ustasha insignia and wear black uniforms, for the sole purpose of instilling fear into serbian troops. And it worked like a charm.
Even as a military statement, it's inappropriate. But, that speaks to the mentality of the combatants not stone's.
when the US went to the middle east many of the elders in isolated tribes thought the germans had came back. So some very small groups of soldiers would use that to scare them to not fight back.
The best that I think of is where the unit served during WW2, if it served in Europe they might have fought the Germans. Since it is a mechanized unit I would assume so.
That flag isn't actully banned but in Germany. Just not welcomed in most places. And in 68 it was still made on request by the same companies that made American flags for the government.
I agree witth the interpretation in the video. I would not interpret that American soldiers were Nazis based on a film. Only history and facts would do that because if the film did mean that, it would need factual evidence to base it on.
Used to intimidate the Vietnamese who probably never faced any nazis
I had assumed it was there as a southern FU to the black Americans. Just the confederate flag was.
Don’t how it would have any real physiological impact on the Vietnamese except for two hikers there were no Third Reich operating in Asia.
Time traveller: moves a stick
Gotta love when a film leaves something open ended for everyone to misinterpret and get wrong.
I always thought it was soldiers fuckimg around.
The Nazi symbolism in the US military doesnt have anything to do Nazi beliefs. It is more about fearlessness and having no quit.
The German Army for a long time was the most effective and experienced fighting force in the world.
I like Charlie’s helmet. The words describe how I feel all the time. Awesome video man.