How to Tie a Crab Claw Via Ferrata Lanyard - ITS Knot of the Week HD
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 11 เม.ย. 2018
- A via ferrata is a protected climbing route and usually involves fixed anchor points and steel cable. On this Knot of the Week, Bryan demonstrates how to create a Crab Claw Via Ferrata Lanyard to keep yourself safely clipped into the steel cabling as you traverse a route.
The supplies needed to tie this Knot of the Week are listed below, be sure that you’re utilizing double-locking style carabiners to ensure safety and ease of use.
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THIS SETUP IS PROVEN TO FAIL in a Via Ferrata fall! Please do not use such improvised safety equipment, but rather buy a new modern via ferrata set with a shock absorber!
Instead, you can also buy a kong kisa shock absorber plate to use with the dynamic ropes.
@@arnoldmeulen nope, absorber plates have been pulled out by most major producers due to safety issues
@@shoqed due to human error.
There is a real safety issue if you forget to tie a stopper knot.
Nevertheless, every device which absorbs shocks is better than no shock absorber at all.
Well...That system needs a Shock Absorber. Like this one. th-cam.com/video/USWyKFADvs8/w-d-xo.html
PLEASE DO NOT USE THIS SETUP! YOU WILL BE RISKING YOUR LIFE! There are other setups you can do at home, but must include the energy absorber!
Somebody is going to get hurt using this video as a guide. Thumbs down.
Deadly advise... so easy to die on via-ferrata when using lanyard like this, without shock absorber
Looks great and I admit to using a setup just like that on occasion, that type of setup without a shock absorption is a good way to break your back on even a small fall. Super dangerous without a shock absorber.
That's the purpose of the dynamic rope. Same principle as sport climbing
Dynamic rope are useless when you reach the fall factor you may encounter in vertical section of a Via Ferrata.
In sport climbing fall factor can't go over 2. In via ferrata 4 or 5 are easily possible.
If you value your life don't do via ferrata without shock absorbing device.
Depends on how far you can fall, if yours is set up so you fall less than a foot, you should be good, now if you have it set up wrong or too long, then yes very dangerous
It would be a rarity to fall less than a foot. I live in via Ferrata country and it’s not uncommon to have a 15-20 foot spacing between anchor points drilled into the rock. On a difficult route, I would never go without a shock absorber.
while climbing you fall into way more rope and the belay is flexible as well
the set up shown here will break your back
This is an incredibly irresponsible video and people should not follow this advice. Spend the $100 to get a proper via ferrata lanyard as if you follow this advice and take a fall you'll either be seriously injured or killed
@its tactical
this will break your back in case of a fall
there is a reason all the via ferrata set have suspension build in.
with this set up you have a so calle factor 2 fall which basically guarantees injuries
don't risk it and get proper equipment
ThePemsl finally someone who says it. Was just about to say it.
True! This is a disaster waiting to happen! :/
If your wear your harness high on your waist and not at normal belt height, you won't injure your back. Harnesses are intended to be worn high as possible, and the length of cord used is short and not to be used on a parallel cable but on the actual iron ladder steps. So if you did fall it wouldn't be more than 2 or 3 feet.
In sportclimbing the max fall factor is 2, in Via Feratta it is 5. It is best to use a proper Via feratta kit or you will break something in case of a fall... We sometimes use something like in this video, but never think you're safe, you would definetlly not like to fall on it. ;)
You're not above the anchor so how could you have a fall factor?
People keep saying you will break your back if you use this... but I've taken higher falls while rock climbing on a dynamic rope... why would via feratta fall characteristics be different? Genuinely curious... we don't use suspension or shock absorbers while rock climbing why not?
**EDIT**:
What others have said is that when climbing you are falling into way more rope so their is going to be much more stretch/extension along the full length of the rope to stop your fall. In this case you only have the stretch factor * the short length of the rope, so there is less absorption from this short stretch of rope than a full belay.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fall_factor
in rock climbing you rarely get to a fall factor of 2. When you climb a via ferrata fixed points are usually up tp 5mt apart, with 1mt of rope out of your harness, you can get to fall fators of 5. This is the reason you need a sewed shock absorber (Via ferrata kit) or at least some kind of rope dissipation system (which where in use some decades ago).
Also, in a ferrata you are tied to a completely static anchor. When you sport climb with a belayer it is basically like two loads hanging by a pulley, it is a completely different scenario
Climbing: 20 m of rope stretch to cushion your 4 m fall. Ferrata: 1 m of rope tries to cushion your 2 m fall. The deceleration is too much for the body. Climbing ropes only work because you usually have more than 2 x the length out that a potential fall could be long.
You have really put a lot thought into this! Its time to get tactical on the mountain -and let evolution do its job. Enjoy✌🏾
YES i saw once some clmber doing 8b+ onsight with one of those army helmets and going fully cammo
Use this setup and win the Darwin Award. In case of a fall you will certainly remove yourself from the gene pool.
Good idea!
lol you're having wayyyy to much fun crab clawin'
It's probably been said before, but you really need to leave more tail for those overhand knots. I'd also recommending loading them and getting them nice and snug while you're still safe on the ground in case the knot rolls on it's self and the 1" tail isn't enough... Whenever we tie a backup knot/double/triple overhand knot the fire/tech rescue world, the general rule of thumb on all of our safety knots is having a tail at least as long as your hand is wide. It might be a little on the excessive side, but it virtually eliminates the possibility of the knot rolling and coming undone.
How to break your back 101.
This video should be taken down. The setup depicted is dangerous because there is no energy absorber. Do not use the setup shown here. Instead, purchase a Petzl Scorpio or Black Diamond Easy Rider which include an energy absorber and are designed for Via Ferrata. For reference, please visit the Wikipedia page entitled Via Ferrata.
Yep. bad example. no shock absorbers. delete this video, dude
If you are going to do this set up install a energy absorber example: Petzl’s absorcia energy absorber which is sold with or with out a connection rope.
To add to the chorus : this would be very dangerous on a Via Ferrata.
They are steel cables between bolts and falling in a vertical situation you will be in freefall until you hit the next bolt, hard. Even if there is only 1 metre between where you are clipped in and the bolt, 1 metre of rope will do virtually nothing to absorb the shock. Injury is very likely.
Dynamic rope is very stretchy, say 30% extension, but to bounce safely you need some length.
Rope soloing, you have the rope between the climber and the nearest protection plus the rope between there and the anchor. More commonly you also have a belayer to dynamically absorb impact.
A safe Via Ferrata lanyard can be made for a fraction of the cost of the commercial ones, either using a one-shot shock absorber ('screamer') or a reusable dissipator like the Kong Kisa (read the instructions carefully and test your setup).
Two other minor quibbles with the video : the tail on the knot seems inadequate, a palms width is usually a safe minimum. Also it mentions always being clipped in on one line, that gives the wrong impression. The idea is to be clipped in on both except when crossing bolts, when you briefly have to go down to one.
This is the upper part dude! never forget to use a shock absorber tightening in the belay loop of the harness!!!!
Well, there is a difference between fall restraint vs fall arrest systems. If this was to arrest you then I could see some injury depending on the slack of the cable you're clipped on like a fall factor 1. A F-1 someone can experience fall trama even at a 1/2 or 1 meter drop; If there is a F-2, you and the park are asking for trouble. If this was to be used as a fall restraint however, it would be fine as it is to prevent you from falling in the first place( no way of falling, no shock so a fall factor 0).
In a via ferrata, you're looking at FF 4 or more. This setup will kill you
Sir , With respect , You should attend some ROCO industrial classes .
Now that youtube took the dislikes away, no one viewing this will know this is deadly advice, yet youtube leaves this video up, while taking other, nondeadly, videos down.
Need to show some of the dbiScala stuff I’ve got.
Ottimo
How to become a paraplegic. Or worse... Seriously, you can get a decent certified VF set WITH SHOCK ABSORBER for about $60. Also, Imagine tying yourself into a harness with virtually NO free rope at your knot. scary stuff..
GEEZ! You shoud have the length of 10 times the diameter of the rope sticking out fo any knot! + no shock absorber in this setup. Please remove this vijeyo!
I love you knot videos. I have a question though - might the an alpine butterfly knot also be good instead of the figure 8?
what make is the black hook @ 1:46?
better this than nothing.
As others have said, DO NOT use this setup. You are very likely to risk serious injury or death using this setup even with only a very short fall (say half a metre or so). First, the triple fisherman's (this actually looks like a triple overhand) is not proven safe to hold the fall factors involved and given the short tails they are tied with here is likely to slip. Dynamic rope will stretch and compact when loaded so it's necessary to have a longer tail to avoid slipping under load, which could easily result in a fatal fall here. Second, the amount of available rope is so short that the impact force even from a factor 1 fall could seriously injure you. This means even if the knots hold, if you have any slack in the system when falling you risk injury. The rope itself is not rated for fall factors above 2 (UIAA testing involves repeated factor 1.7 falls). On VF you will often have factor 1.5 to factor 2 while traversing, and higher factors up to 4 or 5 when ascending/descending on a parallel line with bolts every few meters. This will kill you either through rope failure or the impact force. (And no, most VF ascent scenarios do not involve ladders, so always being able to clip to a point above is not a valid excuse to use such a system. Even going up a 45deg slope with exposure to one side could lead to a factor 3 or higher.). So, please do not use this. Get yourself a proper shock absorbing VF system tested and approved for these scenarios; your life is surely worth 5 to 10 bucks extra. The channel should really delete this video.
amazing info!
Have you ever climbed a tree as a kid?
I don't think so.
@@msz1950 have you ever been on a via ferrata? because he clearly has, but I'm nt sure about you
I’m not a climber but why not use figure eights on the ends? Seems like a more secure knot. At least coming from someone who learned about climbing and rappelling through the fire service
the knot is perfectly secure advante of this one is that it is a very small and tight knot which makes handling the biners more easily
that being said don't use this set up because it will seriously injure you in case of a fall
no shock absorber?
most slovenian ppl are going to agree with you on this
I'm not happy with only 1 inch of tail or so coming out of that fisherman's knot, that risks coming undone
I would love to see you leave extra space on the running end of the triple fisherman's to be able to tie a safety in it. It's a good practice to get into!
Chad Boden safety isnt needed in the fisherman's, the knot will hold..its the strongest knot, followed by the 8 series...
What knot would you tie as a safety?
dickyince none it doesn't need one. 8's don't either,
In the rescue setting it gives people a feel good to tie one....if your fisherman's or 8 are tied correctly they will never slip.
Even your prusiks for rescue work dont have safeties tied in them.
The in-line 8 will slip if loaded backwards,i get around that by tying an alpine butterfly, its bidirectional kmot, no safety needed for that one either😁
It may not be needed, but it's good practice to get into for every knot you tie
Chad Boden i disagree, use them where they are needed, not where they arent...know your knots, and the capabilities of them, that way you wont waste time or energy.
Those are quadruple fishermen's knots.
I bought 4 of those black Fusionclimb claw carabiners on Amazon Canada for $11@. Next day they went up to $21. Two days after $31 and now they are selling at $41@ supposedly on sale from $56.
Methinks someone made a price error and I saved a nice bit of cash. I'm gonna change the knots from figure 8's to your knots, thanks for the good video as usual.
i gennuinely hope you are still alive and well if you followed his tutorial and did not include a fall dissipator
@@alexambro4998 I didn't buy them for climbing I use them for something else.
This is not a triple fisherman's knot, it is a quadruple. Tie a single, take a pic, then tie a double, take a pic. The next will be a triple, which will have 3x wraps on one side and 2x wraps plus an X on the opposite side. This example has 4x wraps...
As mentioned, do not use this for via ferrata! a fall can easily exceed a factor 4 which is double the possible maximum when roped climbing, so a shock absorber lanyard is essential. The only time this may be acceptable is on horizontal traverses with high safety lines or gently ascending/descending routes where the fall factor can be maintained below 0.5, and even then any fall factor could hurt. Fall factor is calculated by dividing the potential fall distance into the length of rope, so with a 1m static lanyard a fall of 0.5m would be FF0.5. If clipped into a fixed point at waist level the fall factor could be 1.0, because you could fall 1.0m onto a 1.0m lanyard, however if clipped to a foot level anchor you can fall 2m onto a 1m lanyard = FF2.0. On a via ferrata the safety line runs vertically in places, so going 3m above the last anchor could mean a 5m fall onto a 1m lanyard! FF=5+!!! Broken back or broken gear either way it could be fatal... For $75/£60 just buy the safe, rated and approved gear.
Ovo je opasno po život!
Why not use a figure 8? It's got higher breaking point. Also, I've read about people taking about shock
absorption, that's why he's using a
Dynamic rope which has elongation.
You can use a 5 meter dynamic rope and tie 4 figure eight knots, two for two locking Carabiner's to attach to the steel cable and the other two to attach to two other locking Carabiners to tie to the harness so you have two points of failure.
Dynamic rope can't hold the fall factor 4+ falls via ferrata sees
Rope access technician/rock climber/generally speaking just a dirtbag alpinist here.
1 you don't need a triple fisherman a dubble holds just as much
2 you should have used a figure 8 or a bowline becaouse rope always brakes in the knot and a fisherman knot will break easier (with that said I have used a lanyard for work with a fisherman on an 11mm rope)
3 the "slack" on the fishermans is waaaay too short
4 that's not enough rope in the system it won't act like a dynamic rope, it might be fine when traversing on a ferrata but if it goes up or down you will die in case of a factor 3 fall
5 the webbing does absolutely nothing here because the rope will brake in the knot not where the carabiner is
6 the figure 8 you put there is completely useless because firstly it reduces the rope length making the rope even less dynamic secondly because you can just leave out that carabiner and hitch it through your harness directly
7 just use an energy absorber because even if somehow nothing in this system brakes on a vertical cable fall (factor 3 or above) your organs and bones will for sure
this setup is ment to be used as Longe maybe. Absolutely not to use in via ferrata
But with more slack at least...
in 2018? realy?, more stupid advises pls.
This video is time travelling into the past to 1970.
I am a mountaineer and EMS, DO NOT USE IMPROVISED VIA FERRATA KIT, PHYSICS WILL ALWAYS TAKE ITS TOLL.
If you fall in a via ferrata the shock will not be absorbed by any of your cables, so it will distribute to your body, thus probably causing spinal and neck injuries depending on the fall.
DO NOT USE IMPROVISED KITS, a via ferrata kit has a shock absorber which will prevent such injuries (shock absorbers are usually not used in mountaineering since in mountaineering you will have someone ensuring the safety of the line, immediately blocking the fall and distributing the shock), a via ferrata kit usually cost around 60 bucks, your life is worth more than 60 bucks.
That figure 8 was messy homie.
Watched in sheer horror. terrible advice. via ferrata could put more force on your body In a fall than any other type of climbing (except free soloing obviously). 8.4mm is super skinny rope and I would be doubtful if it's a single rope or if in fact it was out of twin/half rope.
tying in - barrel, stopper knots always require 10x diameter of the rope. there was barely a cm or two.
finally the most deadly part of the advice is to make this with no fall arrest lanyard. a fall arrest lanyard is designed to bring the stopping force to around 6kn. a 12kn fall onto rope with no fall arrest is proven to kill 100% of the time. a 6 kn fall you "should" survive. I say "should" as even with the arrest lanyard there is likely to be internal damage at 6 kn.
insert this deathtrap onto a via ferrata and take a fall from ladders at the top before changing to a higher cable. you are likely to fall 3-5 m to the previous cable, you have at best 1 m of skinny dynamic rope to "protect" the fall. the fall factor of 3-5 is insane. if by some miracle the rope didn't snap, your relying on a tiny bit of stretch to stop the fall. organs will be squashed against each other. THIS IS A FATAL SETUP.
SAVE SOMEONE'S LIFE TAKE THIS DOWN. and to the community, ignore the "advice" buy a proper kit. at least you're likely to survive. or free solo at least if you fall it would be a quicker and less painful death 🙄
i wish this was highr up, it deserves way more likes. crazy how this video is still available after all this years
this is useful untill you fall.
🇹🇭❤️👍
Use a shock absorber or you're gonna break your spine.
PLEASE BUY A CERTIFIED LANYARD, IT COSTS THE SAME AS THE TWO CARABINERS
Why is this video still online? So many people mentioning how wrong and dangerous this would be to be used for via ferrata. It's a bit irresponsible to keep the video public in my opinion. But hey.. It makes views, it brings in money, right? Let each decide how safe or unsafe the advices are... I guess...
Hi. Nice video bro)
How much rope will it take to make this. And how thick
PLEASE PLEASE TAKE THIS DOWN.
A very close friend of mine had to be rescued by helicopter after falling on a via ferrata with the exact same setup (except he used double figure 8 knots for the biners). you are not considering that a dynamic rope needs to be way longer in order to stretch enough to absorb the energy of a fall. If you were to take a factor 3-4 fall on this it would most likely just make it easier for rescuers to retrieve your corpse.
it is atrocious to see that after so many comments explaining why this is not the proper way and why it could lead to injury you still keep up this video
subscribing because of rooster teeth
firefighters do this on ladders and astronauts do it on spacewalks! cool
Good video. OBVIOUSLY not appropriate for steep via ferrata. This setup would be idiotic on a steep route. All of the comments about safety are assuming a use case on steep via ferrata.
However look at his route starting at 0:45. On this and many non-tourist routes there are segments of primarily NOT steep ferrata where a slip does NOT result in significant load. Context matters!
Although personally I would tie a figure 8 on a bight and girth hitch that to your harness, versus a free girth like the demo shows..
You need shock absorber !
Hello from Czech republic and thank You for Yours videos. But! This Your set is very dangerous. Please, don't use it! Fall factor on via ferrata maybe too big and dymamic rope in Your set will not work. Sorry for my english. Use only original via ferrata set! Don't risk with Your life.
Pull this video down.
No shock absorber = dangerous.
Dynamic rope is no fall protection on Via Ferrata. That's idiotic. You need a shock absorber. Third carabiner is also superfluos, you can just tie in with a loop.
DO NOT USE THIS . YOU ARE RISKING YOU'RE LIFE
Do not do a via ferrata with this setup if you fall you will generate huge fall factors and will either break the rope or your back.
...whithout shock absorber?? 💀
You fool.
THIS WILL KILL YOU. There is a very high potential of the rope simply breaking.
Nope nope nope. This setup is so short it's basically non-dynamic and given that you can take FAR harder falls on a VF than regular climbing, this would a serious mistake. A setup like this would only be useful if the entire route was horizontal progression with the safety cable at chest height (i.e. almost no fall factor).
Seems like a lot of people don't understand that half the fun of climbing is cutting corners in safety
Why, oh why do you keep posting? It seems every time people point out the faults of your advice.
I hope you do not live in germany, austria, france or swizzerland. Because here this video could land you in jail for 15 years. Starting at 50€ there is proper sets, that you do not die with. Brands that currently offer those: LACD, Edelrid, Salewa, Skylotec, Petzl, AustriAlpin ... and many more
Bravo, you are showing People how to die
THIS SYSTEM WILL KILL YOU.
Only use systems with absorbers.
Just DON"T. The "hight" of fall on via ferrata is much longer than in climbing, and this setup will snap. Buy a normal, decent, tested set (for almost the same amount of money)
Stupid setup, don't use this! 😡☠☠☠
Very dangerous! Without a shok absorber, the rope will break or your backbone or both.
This is dangerous. If you respect your life then 100euro/100dollars for a proper absorber via ferrata kit is nothing comparing to the injuries or even death after a fall with this setup.
please don't do this
you need a brake in the setup, otherwise it's your back that's going to break
quick and good definition how to kill yourself - are you still alive?
Knot proven NOT to work. Please delete video!!
what is with your freaking hair dude? why did you do that? are you incognito?
do not do this
This is incredibly dangerous
This is extremely dangerous, you absolutely need a shock absorber in the system, the dynamic rope is nowhere sufficient. In Via Ferrata the fall factors can go way past 2 (which the ropes are tested for) at which point you're either going to break the rope, your spine and/or have your internals crushed by your harness. Proper Via Ferrata lanyard with an energy absorber costs like 60€, I hope you'd value your health more than that. I agree with most of the commenters that this video should be taken down.
Do Not, Do Not, Do not follow this advice it WILL get you killed. the guy does not have a clue what he is talking about. you are better to free climb that way you are well aware of the consequences of a slip.
Very bad idea
...that is Not a tripple fisherman knot.. as you have 4 wraps and not 3.. so its more of a "quad fisherman knot", and that don't exist..
deadly advises like this should be banned from youtube!!!
VERY VERY VERY BAD, DON'T DO THIS ANYWHERE ANYTIME
This is a deadly advise. Please take the video down.
what the hell!!! Remove this video! Danger danger! Dont do this!
This is very dangerous advice. I suggest you take this video down!
very good video!
why are all negative responses getting priority here?
what about that Hillary Norgay thing?
nobody falls off a via ferrata except people who should not be there in there first place
sorry people but if you need triple safety stay home and watch a documentary instead
Well if nobody was to fall off a via ferrata nobody would use a ferrata set. Accidents do happen and ferrata sets minimize the injuries in that case. The Lanyard shown here is lacking a vital part of any ferrata set - the shock absorber. Falling into this set is almost as bad as falling onto a rock back first.
THIS SETUP IS PROVEN TO FAIL in a Via Ferrata fall! Please do not use such improvised safety equipment, but rather buy a new modern via ferrata set with a shock absorber!