Well... that was an unexpected improvement...
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 มิ.ย. 2024
- This is my final attempt at fixing the i500 cooling issues. Can a low profile air cooler do the trick?
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We will all remember the 14900K as that insanely hot chip that forced every brand to up their cooling game. Interesting video as always!
13900k did that to me. That chip is hot. Had to get a contact frame, 420 rad, and 3 3000rpm fans to keep it less than 80c under load
@@justzac8467 stock yeah. but anyone with even basic experience with overclocking/undervolting could tame in 5 minutes.
@@bigpoppa1234*tips fedora. That’s the vibes you give off.
@@bigpoppa1234 I don't believe products being unstable out the box is a good thing. For anyone that doesn't know how to adjust the voltage in the bios the 13900k seems like a shitty CPU.
The AMD Thunderbird was like that in the 90s
Puts a 14900k with a 120mm AIO. "yeah, it's fine just ship it." I'm sure there have been 0 Customer Service emails about the temperatures. Surely, right?
Clueless
Don’t call us Shirley!
Most people (PC users) have no idea what means and why they should care. It works? It works.
Well, if no one bought it, then no emails
@@cszolee7979 Yeah, but when you're paying a premium for this type of system, you would hope it would run in-spec and not have underlying issues that are preventable. I wouldn't want to buy a car that runs fine under 60mph but the minute it goes over the Engine overheats and starts dropping RPM. I don't know how it works in a car, but I also know it shouldn't slow down like that.
Corsair: We need to improve our best SFF case.
Design Team: We increased the case from 12L to 21.7L, added more fans, & made the cooling so bad it will thermal throttle.
Corsair: Perfect! How soon can we start shipping?
Corsair sell the original case, and let users select their components. We can all show you how to fit a 14900k and an RTX4090 into an SFF case that doesn't thermal throttle.
That fan noise is just Phil going “OHHHHHHHHHHHHHH” into a mic, you can’t fool me!!
I can't believe a company like Corsair that lives to sell 360mm AIOs put a 14900K in a case to small to put a sufficient cooling system for the thing.
So nice of Jay to work on Phils house
It's amazing to see how much air cooling improved in the last 2 decades, not joking.
GPU cooling makes more sense to be water cooled. i'll always use air cooling on my CPU, though.
oldschool matterhorn pure
what CPU's not cool with that . . . it's not cool overall
You know what I like Jay? He just tells it like he sees it. No agenda.
Everyone has an agenda, it's just that Jay's agenda is giving good info not selling product.
@@mrfawkes9110 no
@@MaddJakd maybe
@ICCUWANSIUT honestly not even sure what that "no" was in response to.
"Selling" a product, eh. Not his own for sure. What he uses, and stuff like it, yes. Not in a bad way though, and definitely not like most folk have the machines lying around to craft some homemade waterblocks and such.
What I do know is, internet babies love to cast broad nets lol. You het one odd thing wrong in one vid amongst thousands "no more cred." You worked with "company X at all = bad and shill"
Jay got the watercooling game down, and definitely knows how to do more with a PC than most watching will figure out in their lifetime.
Fixing Corsair’s engineering, episode 2
Actually been kicking myself for missing out on a deal on a used Corsair One (w/ a 9900k and 2080ti) that crashes on Facebook marketplace, so this content is very enjoyable
All of this could have just been solved with an AMD 7800x3D, because a 120 AIO could handle that, and it's a cheaper cpu, and performs faster for less wattage.
Unfortunately there are too many people that blindly believe Intel is the best.
@@justevil100 Its crazy how often 14900k is used. Such a heater, stability issues etc.
Eh I feel like this PC is meant for productivity and not gaming, where the 14900k is better. Probably could've went with a 7950x though, although not sure if it's equivalent to 14900k in productivity
@@userblame632 This PC was meant for being showcased in a living room, akin to a home theater entertainment system. Even Jay said as much given its unique style and look. It was meant for gaming, VR and movie entertainment.
@@luminatrixfanfiction ah ok, yea a 14900k is a terrible decision then
Next time just put an 7800x3d in it
Have it..and its sucks.. oced 12600kf way more stable
@@koky179 bullshit
@@koky179 Tell me you're shillin' & lyin' without telling me
@@koky179 press x to doubt
@@tlv8555 @riccardo3092 still have both systems and still seeing in..intel system runs just fine. Amd random game crashes, windows too.. so only bs here is coming from your moutha
The biggest take-away? Noctua coolers are solid gold.
And cost accordingly
This has been a fun series. I really enjoy these videos.
That computer costs 4 723 USD here in Norway. I think for that price it has to have a solid cooling solution.
And I would think for the price Sony charges for their Bravia OLED TV's it would last more than 2yrs, but here I am stuck with a nonrepairable high end TV made to be disposable. 😢
Sadly, companies make products to be bought, not to be used or to satisfy their customers these days.
Bust out the dremel! Time to put a 240 AIO on that CPU!
I have the big brother of that Noctua. It's been on 2 Ryzen CPUs and there's no stress test I can do to make the temps get high enough to throttle in any way. It works great.
which is crazy since AMD throttles at a lower temp then Intel. If your AMD CPU ever gets anywhere in the 90s then you know you're doing something wrong. Whereas with Intel it seems like 90s is normal operating temp.
If you not considering acoustic comfort, than yeah, of course
@@NonLegitNation2 7900x boosts to 95c before it drops power.. intel hitting 100 is crazy, these chips have no lifespan
@@SergeiSugaroverdoseShuykov A full load it's a slight hum.
@@NonLegitNation2 my undervolted 5800x3d hits 85-90c r23 cine with a nh d15
7:36 - 7:39 - haha- nice editing Phil - I see what happened
Your face on the thumbnail mocking the usual TH-camr shock face is way too funny!!!😂 Only thing missing is your hands on the side of your face 😂
He makes these shock face thumbnails all the time and usualy changes them after 1-2 hours.
in fairness..
with great power, comes even greater heat.
~ Intel
i dont know if they ever said something similar.. but the 14900 chip makes it a fitting slogan.
You could try the Thermalright SI-100 air cooler - thicker with 6 heatpipes.
Thats only 0-3 celcius difference compared to Noctua L12S 77 in favor of Thermalright cooler.
@@jarnom85 3 C can make all the difference. Especially when you consider how much cheaper the Thermalright one is.
Oh my God what was Corsair thinking when they made this? Corsair you need to get your act together because you are one of the top 10 brands!
Ummm....they are probably the number one brand for marketing, and about the number 50 brand for quality and value.
"The heat coming out the back is cold" - Jay is awesome!!! 😂
the NH-l12s is good but you have the space try a NH-C14S it has almost 40w higher load rating. a 3rd option is pull that side bracket out and use a full size NH-U12S.
I used a NH-U12S in a Silverstone case that's very similar and had temps on my 5700X drop by 8 to 11 degrees!
Hey Jay! hope youre having an awesome day and feeling better
Those fan clips on the Noctua cooler will actually just work fine for 25mm thick fans as they have two steps. So you could just have mounted the thicker fan without zip ties.
Or you could have used the original fan (rotated so it pulls air and doesn't fire against the case fans) and then the thick intake fan above it. Would have worked probably just as fine.
I'm a car guy and last November built my first gaming PC in over 20 years, getting back into it, and you just made me realize why I loved building my PC so much I want to just build more for fun with your radiator comment.
Jayz got some passion back with mini pcs -- I've been doing same thing, lots fun messing around all small cases including some new mATX. Thermalright air coolers rock pretty well too in mini pcs.
I'm an air cooling guy so maybe it's weird I watch this channel a lot but it's great fun and I've learnt tonnes about water cooling. That made this video stand out strangely! Still good fun but it was a relatively predictable outcome given the parts you had to work with. I'd probably try the Noctua Nh-C14 in there. I reckon it would fit with just the lower fan and you'd get even better performance.
Corsair needs to sell just the case.
This! I'd love getting my hands on this case
This tells you to get a proper size case for the components you're planning on installing. Cheers!
Or just avoid stupid Corsair cases...
@@malphadour Agreed this case is horrible, but not all Corsair cases are bad.
@@123Suffering456 You are right, not all of them are bad, just most of them.
Just put an noctua U9S with two fans and will be fine LOL! It fits perfectly this case because its under 130mm and allows you to still use the side bracket with additional fans attached.
Buy me a beer now :)))
Or a Noctua industrial 3000 RPM fan
Jay in thumbnails: inappropriate amounts of smiling.
Jay in videos: Holding on to his last thread of sanity.
...stay strong there Jay 🫂
I was seeing the CAMM2 concept motherboards in Computex coveerage and was thinking that if that became a standard you could do a really wide heatsink for a case like this and cool that 14900K much easier. Ideally, Corsair would have made it like a half to an inch deeper so you could fit a 240mm radiator but imagining a world where camm2 is a thing and you have a downfire dual tower low-profile CPU cooler for SFF makes me excited. Though knowing companies and tooling and status quo that won't happen, but it's nice to dream.
The Jiushark JF13K cooler should fit the case & cool a 14900k J. It's on Amazon $55 though the install is going to be fun.
Jay , could you put two (2x) 120mm rads in series in the hinge/door ? Cpu>rad1>rad2>Cpu
Since the two 120mm rads would have the end-tanks on top and the fittings on bottom, they could fit; rather than a 240mm with the tank on one side and the fittings on the other. 👍
way too much of a pain tbh. Youd have to cannibalize 2 AIOS or do a custom loop
@@Shadow0fd3ath24 I don't think so. You (Jay) have the Stock one already. You only need 1 similar rad and a short patch tube to go in between the 2 rads. And 2-3 straight fittings.
Rad 1 is the stock 120 rad.
Cpu block (stock tube) >rad1 in > rad1 out (patch tube) > rad2 in > rad2 out (stock tube out)> Cpu. +1 extra fan for the new rad ofc.
No need to make it more complicated than that.
*swap one of the straight fittings with a T/Y as a fill port.
@@IcecalGamerAIO radiators are aluminium so they wouldn't work with open loop radiators (which are usually copper). Also they're not really made to be serviced, so the tubes are crimped on, and you can't easily refill the loop once you've cut open the tubes. It's really a non-starter especially considering the target market for these pre-built machines (people who often just want it to work without having to tinker with it)
@@DuyLeNguyen This tower/pc is defective out of the box anyway < Talking about target market. If a cooling solution out of the box throttles your components at 100% load, EVEN in 20C air conditioned huge room, how it gonna fair in (lets say) Texas non AC man-cave/shed? Ok? Aaalright.
Now that we've established that this experiment is just for gliggles, does it matter that we mix metals? In a 2-3 hours experiment / proof-of-concept? Neah. Long term, Jay already knows that mixing metals in car engines works as long as you Maintain your coolant and additives. Could do that, if you Really want to go long term use. But again, it's not the case since the point of it was "Could it work? Could it work better than zip-ties on a 65$ Noctua cooler (before tax)? Should it have came like that from the factory, with 2x120mm in series?"
Filling issue -> read my previous comment. +Jay could vacuum-fill it
I'm impressed with what a tiny cooler can do!
I love that Fan Control program, used it ever since you showed it off the first time!
I have a older version of that Noctua air cooler. 4 heat pipes with 2 fans. The bottom fan is just a little smaller. So my question is would adding a small fan under the heat fins help thermals.
True, 1 more inch wouldn't have significantly lengthened the case to cause any large issues as far as floor or desktop space is concerned but barring that, Corsair could just orient the case 90 degrees from what it is to then allow enough room for a 240! Either that or rotate the swinging bracket and hardware 90 degrees and then hinge them on the bottom of the current config to make said brackets long enough for a 240 without altering the case dimensions. Sheesh.
Alienware: I make the worse PC Designs.
Corsair: Hold my AIO.
you take your time on it jay
I love the fan control software after you recommended it on your pc essential software video, Im using the fractal ridge case and managed to squeeze the artic liquid freezer cooler 280mm version inside my gpu encloseure, took the fans and shroud off of my rtx 2070 and fit 2x 140mm fans inbetween the radiator and gpu and use the fan control software to set the fan speed depending of both the cpu and gpu temps. Its so dense in that top enclosure there is almost no gap between the fans and both the gpu heatsink and the cpu rad. And the crown jewls is its quiet and keeps everything below 60 when im gaming
"Back for twice try to cool the thing" is the content I'm here for.
Don't stop :D continue until you are satisified with it, I am commenting at the beginning!
What the ....... , is the best part. Noice cutout
Thermalright has some nice downdraft coolers at different heights. I'm using one in my htpc.
I am using same noctua to cool a 5800x in a low profile case. I bought an extra slim fan to put on other side of fin stack. It definitely helped.
Waiting patiently for the Asus BIOS update video before i install the new one they just released
it seems like they are definitely using a lot of your feedback in their updates, painstakingly at a snails pace, but im happy they are just doing it
What about turning that aio to a custom loop with a second 120 radiator in serial with the first?
Should fit with the radiator reservoir towards the bottom.
When you talked about an inch more space I remember when HP made a small form factor not like they are today though. Those would fry the motherboard because it did not have enough space for airflow.
Only thing I can think is that Corsair decided that because it was SFF, they were concerned about fan noise a little too much? You can really hear those fans ramping up now in your Cinebench test in the video. But personally would rather deal with some fan noise temporarily in extreme use vs throttlling.
I learned pretty early on in SFX builds, get really long needle nose pliers. No more busting my knuckle jamming my hang through everything.
Funny thing is, Corsair has already done an ITX case that has good air flow options, the Obsidian 250D. I've actually revisited that case over the past couple of days.
Have you tried the Arctic P12/14 Max fans? They're pretty wild
Whoever had the idea of putting a 120 AIO on a 14900k was on some serious fighter jet level altitudes.
I hope they throw some R&D money your way Jay, you are doing their work for them as you tinker for a better solution. I would like for you to do the dremel the edge and fit a 240 in there and test that vs your air cooler setup also, if that makes it fit that is.
bequiet seems to have a couple of those chunky low profile cooler that looks like it would fit (probably wont be able to mount the fan afterward though) , would love to see what one of those would do for the temp
Jay you could of probably fit a Noctua NH-C14S in this without the side fan, but the cooler fan would be close to the side panel anyway, much bigger cooler than the NH-L12S
Jay: Corsair make a custom cooler
Corsair: No buy it and love it like a good little fanboy and make plenty of videos so more people will buy it. We only care about profit now.
Jay: Ok but only 3 videos of me trying to fix this trash that I love.
I didn't know about the old version having a bespoke radiator, as you said, which means that they could have gone with a bespoke one again, as shown at Computex, where someone (I forgot which manufacturer) has made a radiator where the tubes is attached at the middle off the side, which means that it should be possible to make the whole 240 space into a rad with the tubes in the same place as the 120.
But of course they wouldn't do that because that would cut into their profit margins.
I would enjoy watching Jay try to Brute Force a 240 in there.
what is the cpu clearance if you take out the side fans? Could you fit something like the noctua U12A or U9?
If you're look at a whole bunch of videos comparng various coolers, and find the ones that include Noctua coolers, you can pretty much place any cooler somewhere on the Noctua scale.
What about cooling these components with a soft-tubing custom loop inside the old Corsair One case?
I wonder how a nice tower cooler like the noctua nh15 something and noctua fans would do in this case. Those are beasts and on par with water coolers
Hey Jay. You are talking about "saturation" of the liquid in terms of temperatures. This makes sense. And this is the reason why my fan curves are set up to adjust via the liquids' temperature, not the CPU/GPU temps. Because the logic behind it is, that if the liquid is cooler, it can decipade more heat from the actual components that are causing the heat.
No video of water cooling comparissions ever covers the temperature of the liquid. Sure, a bigger, wider, longer, thicker radiator makes a difference since there is more surface area.
But how much does it actually matter how high or low the liquid temperatures are? - Cooler liquid can take more heat out of the components, but to what point? Like what is a critical point where it doesn't "cool much" anymore? Does it matter if the liquid is just 30°C, or 36°C - does that make a big difference and if, how big? - Is it worth ramping up your fans just to keep the coolant as cool as possible, or can you easily have it take an extra 5 or 10K in delta and still get the components down to the same temperatures, or maybe just 1 or 2°C higher?
I don't know how to describe what I am looking for since english isn't my native language, but maybe you get what I mean and can make a video about that.
The "problem" of using water temp only for fan speed control is that it takes a longer time for the water temperature to raise than it takes for the CPU temperature. But when CPU temp raises you know water temp will in time raise. By using CPU temp monitoring the fans will speed up before the water get warm, giving the radiator more chance to keep water temp down. and cooling the CPU quicker than if you monitor the water temp.
Now I'm not saying that water temp isn't important, it most certainly is. But the time needed for water temp to raise significantly is longer. Both methods work but one tends to react slower than the other.
I'm on the same logic. On AIO, you are cooling the water with the fans. If you keep the water cool and not going over certain temps, it will not let the CPU also reach high temps. You also remove the constant ramp up of the fans.
Another thing that happen when you have set them to CPU temp is that after the load is gone and the Cpu cools down, the fans will spin down, leaving the water temps high for a longer timeframe.
@@Mysteoa That is why it is a good idea to set a short delay before the fan speeds ramp up and a longer delay before the fans slow down, if your BIOS has that feature. First short delay (couple of seconds) so that the fan does not unnecessarly react to short heat spikes your CPU sometimes has when doing background tasks and a longer delay (maybe 10 seconds) before it allows to fans ramp down to let it cool the water down quicker after the load has ended. This way you are still reacting to CPU temps but on a slower pace which is a benefit of water cooling because the water is still acting as a heat soaking buffer, you do not have to have the fans ramping up and down every 3 seconds like in an air cooled system.
@@MaaZeus isn't it just the same result with extra steps? With my current setup, the CPU barely goes above 80C. I also don't have to adjust it for summer/winter.
@@Mysteoa Perhaps. This is falls between water temp controlled cooling and CPU temp controlled cooling. CPU temp is still the one controlling the fan speeds but it doesn't have to be so hyper reactive like air cooling needs to be.
After seeing someone one comment about the AMD 7800X3D it came to mind what may have happened. The case and the 120mm AIO is enough for the AMD 7800X3D, the other high performance gaming CPU, and the case was repurposed for the Intel, with out any design changes which explains the none optimal cooling.
You could probably fit a thermal right si100. Its a similar design to the noctua but is taller and comes with a 25mm thick fan.
My laptop has a 12th gen i9 in it and I've struggled with cooling until I used liquid metal. The liquid metal took 15C off of idle temps and about the same in extended gaming sessions with the fan curve lowered so it wasn't so noisy. If I ran the same aggressive fan curve I would expect to see a reduction of 20c when gaming, that liquid metal is pretty good stuff even if I had to liquid metal proof my laptop mobo.
Corsair really needs to send these units out to youtubers for quality beta testing. Can't believe they are selling this thing as is for the price they command with it. COMON CORSAIR!
Does the GPU have coverage on the memory? Or the VRM for that matter? It looks like it doesnt which is surprising, even with airflow throughout id feel like there isnt enough surface area to wick away the heat, but idk ive never pulled the trigger on AIO conversion kits for GPUs lol
I have gone back over to air cooled because it is much more reliable. And cost much less and does work very good. I have a Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120SE ARGB CPU Cooler that only cost me only $35.90, and it does the job for my AMD 9 5900X.
Nice!
14:23 - Chilling in the '90s?... The last time I did that was 25 years ago.
In my head that 120 aio is saying "im tired grandpa"
Love the thumbnail, guys🤣
1:19 Could fit a second 120 rad side by side in series with the reservoirs pointing up.
4:25 No, because you've overlooked that there isn't room for the endtank and tubes at the other end either; the stock cooler has the end tank and hoses on the lower edge!
Going to be trying adapting a prolima Mk-26 vga cooler onto lga 1700 for OC SFX workstation. No itx cooler has the required cooling.
Concerning electric radiator fans on cars, my experience was get a jet aircraft manufacturer to build the cooling system. My 1970 SAAB 99 had an electric rad fan that kept the car from overheating in summer, in Modesto.
I wish I could use Fan Control on my laptop. HP uses hardware sensors to control the fans. I had to solder the PWM wire from the second fan to the first fan since HP doesn't uses it. It spins on start up then turns off after windows boots. Never spins again even if the GPU and/or the CPU is throttling.
I'm using a Peerless Assassin 120 SE and it seems to work on my 14900, except for video encoding, things still bump up to 100C, but nothing else does. I use GPU/hardware encoding for that instead of CPU. Works fine.
I always find these experiments fascinating. You you "might" be able to squeeze a NH-C14S in there if you bottom mount the fan onto the cooler. There should still be clearance for the RAM. Or just start cutting and squeeze the 240 AIO in there.
The only reason I can imagine that they didn't just give the original case design a facelift was to use off the shelf parts to increase the profit margin. You get access to just one PCIE slot and it's the one on the very bottom. They're just not using as many bespoke parts. Hard to believe they still managed to bungle the cooling so badly.
I have that same cooler on a 5950X in a very tight ITX server and it is a champ
I like the aircooled gpu and watercooled cpu combo, you only need to worry about one stream of cool air.
Maybe you can squeeze a NH-C14S in the bottom fan configuration. But after that it's contact patch optimisation (lapping, socket kit and things like that)
Ok thats great and all and I'm very happy that it worked out.
That being said tho can you cut the case and try to fit that 240..........? 👀
Could you daisy chain 2 120mm rads with the end tanks on the bottom? That wouldn't make it a lot wider
Now, custom water cool it Jay!!!
Doubt we'll see another video about this but i'd love to see if you can fit the JIUSHARK JF13K cooler in there, i think it'd work in its native profile and would work a lot better with this particular case
I picture the air cooler giving the AIO that got removed the Troll face smile.
This is impressive. I have 13900 and same cooler with industrial noctua 3000rpm fan in my silverstone milo. I can only max at 130w in my 30 min stress tests with only hitting 90C. I thought this was impressive for that size cooler, but your results are insane! Over 200w?!?! It must be those extra fans on that door mechanism that helps.
I know you said it was the last video for this but could you in swap the GPU and CPU coolers so the CPU was using the 240 at the top and the GPU was using the 120?
I remember having my amd fx 8350 running rather cold because of the giant (and rather expensive) tower air cooler and the intake fans & the giant fan at the top sending all that hot air out. 😅
Would the Noctua C14 not fit in there?
that´s what I thought
I really L❤VE Noctua coolers ! 😍😍😍
Try using Noctua C12P SE14 that is down fire that can handle the tdp and make it fit 😅 just cut a big gaping hole on the side cover just for a 140mm fan and it sorted
It baffles me how loading up Cyberpunk on that rig throttles the cpu. I run a Intel Nuc 12 Extreme, and my Cyberpunk launches and plays just fine. From what I understand, something funky did go wrong with the cooling so that explains it.
Wonder if a 240mm aio on the front/right fan and bottom fan, so the aio is vertical instead of horizontal, could fit
Realized the GPU is wholey in the way. Never mind lol