Hey there, folks, it's me -- Fredo from The Godfather. I edited this video and just made a small mistake throwing up Emboar's stats and abilities there because just beforehand it was spoken about, so I got a little crossed up. It was a long video and I just was being a little bit careless in the early parts. My bad!
I saw those stats and was shocked thinking: "Delphox is a physical attacker?????" Then I realised it HAD to be a simple mistake. Thanks for clarifying.
The problem is Torkoal's speed is low enough that it's actually fast......on a Trick Room team. That's the thing that makes the Pokemon useless in the campaign portion of the game, but broken in the VGC.
Plus it’s speed makes it perfect for setting up sun. It guarantees that it’s the weather that will be on the field since everything is set up in order of speed
Torkoal is widely considered to be the best sub-ubers sun setter due to its excellent physical bulk, access to stealth rock and rapid spin, access to body press to smack tyranitar and heatran, and its ability to inflict status with toxic/yawn/lava plume. Even that “problematic” low speed is a blessing in disguise, virtually guaranteeing that sun is set up when leading off against opposing weather. It’s excellent enough that it sees frequent use on many VGC teams, forming the infamous Venukoal core which provides power, speed control, defensive synergy, and team flexibility, as it functions well under trick room to fire off devastating sun-boosted eruptions. Compare that with Ninetales, who can only be used as a pure offensive Pokémon. With only a base 81 special attack, using it as a sweeper is essentially a waste of a teamslot. It doesn’t compress teamslots like providing stealth rock, providing secondary hazard control, etc. It arguably deserves to be on the top 10 strongest fire types list, as it is the backbone of an entire archetype and helps greatly to facilitate it. At the very least, it’s better than simisear, who has never seen usage as more than a joke.
Torkoal's low speed is actually an advantage for a weather setter. if it comes in the same turn with any other opposing weather setter the sun will prevail. Plus stealth rocks with rapid spin make it a hazard setter and hazzard controller 2in1. And lava plume 30% chance to burn and punish physical attackers who might want to take advantage of his limited attacking movepool make him even better.. It doesnt deserve to be in the list. But other than that, great video!!
The fact that he thinks that ninetales is a better sun setter than torkoal is pretty funny and sad at the same time. Torkoal is used to setup sun in : RU,UU,OU and even UBER it’s also the main sun setter in doubles and monotype teams, the only times you’ll use ninetales instead would be in the tiers torkoal isn’t allowed (PU,ZU)
@@WheelStart is used in competitive is just this guy dont play VGC where you know, this mon are designed, is the best sun seter in the game, have more used than groudon rigth now that is a gs cup
@@WheelStart He says in the beginning of this video and the water one that he is ranking it competitively. Also the way he talks about it is in a very competitive mindset.
Torkoal can be used on other teams than isn't just doubles the fact that he gets assault vest , body press , solar beam, support moves and invest in hp and SP Def and your good to go if u want to make a pokemon work u try your hardest to find something to make it useful but the fact is that torkoal has some benefits and DOES NOT BELONG ON THIS LIST
Ok but imagine this torkoal gets a evolution that turns its shell into a volcano BUT even better torkoal gets eviolite for its defences giving it a great role
bruh toarkel was one of the OU(Overused/ in competetiv pokemon battling) pokemon befor crown tundra was released and even saw usage in competetiv 2v2 at high tournament level. It IS much better than ninetails at setting up sun in the sword and shield meta. It can lay stealth rocks, yawn, rapid spin and you can easily switch it in against physical attackers to set up sun and you switch it out against special attackes
Not only to mention it's low speed makes sure that sun is set, and trick room has to think twice about setting up since toarkel is so slow it'll hit hard first
Oh, now I understand why Minun was so low on the electric list, below the likes of Pachirisu. Mystic doesn't understand support pokemon. He deadass put Torkoal on the list lmaooooooo
If Typhlosion isn't on the list, it really should be. It's directly outclassed by Delphox, who has better coverage and a secondary typing in top of being faster and hitting harder. The ONLY reason why people think that Typhlosion is at all a decent Pokemon is because it happens to be the best starter Pokemon choice in gen2 and their fourth gen remakes, and okay, in all fairness it is quite good. But in terms of it's competitive viability, it has never been that good, and it legitimately offers far and away the least out of any fire type starter.
@@matthewkuscienko4616 It had a place in UUBL before gen4, so I wouldn't say that it was "never good". Many of its moves became physical because of the P/S split that gen, and as Typh's physical attack is worse than its special, it was no longer able to take full advantage of most of its coverage attacks. A good example is thunder punch. Im not sure if Typhlosion really is the worst fire starter, too. I'd rather say its Emboar, though it has some things going for it that let it have a small edge over Typh.
@@Soso_LP Maybe Typhlosion has been okay in some generations in the past, but it still overall has been the worst fire type starter, and it still would more than likely be now. Charizard has the exact same stats, but it's better and has 2 good mega evos and a Gmax form, Blaziken has speed boost and is really powerful, Infernape was better than Blaziken before gen5 and has good attacking stats and speed, Emboar may be slow, but it's a really strong wallbreaker and has good coverage options, Delphox is literally just Typhlosion with better stats in the areas that matter and has a secondary type for more STAB, Incineroar has intimidate and is great in VGC, and Cinderace has good attack and speed and an ability that is essentially protean with a different name. Typhlosion's only advantage is eruption, which has it's power reduced as it takes damage, so entry hazards, priority (especially aqua jet), and faster Pokemon (with or without choice scarf) really hurt it's viability
I want to argue against Typhlosion being on this list because it's my favourite fully evolved starter out of all of them, but it just got fucked so badly by the physical/special split...
@@matthewkuscienko4616 yeah, Typhlosion is a joke. It gets extrasensory as its coverage. And I think that's it. Delphox is way better, without a doubt and the only thing Typhlosion has it going for it is eruption scarf spam until it gets hit once and dies
@@ni8mareassasin367 just because it has high physical attack doesnt make it good, it still gets worn down hard by things like stealth rocks, since its a fire type it needs a toxic orb to activate guts, and flare blitz will wear it dowm even more, plus it doesnt have a good movepool all it has to attack its flare blitz, facade, and superpower it needs more variety than that and its low speed is a problem too, many pokemon outspeed it While torkoal has much higher bulk, can set up stealth rocks, rapid spin them away, and has the ability drought. Torkoal has more utility and less problems to deal with than flareon
@@ni8mareassasin367 doesnt matter if torkoals special attack isnt good, like I said its a good support pokemon and the best sun setter in the game Also flareons issue isnt only speed, like I said being poisoned will kill ot easier making it useless, being slow and worn down by your own attacks or items makes it terrible, how can you make flareon good if it wont even get a chance to use its attacks against an opponent thatll knock it out when it outspeeds it?
I'm with you. Heatmor is actually my favorite pokemon alongside Sandslash, and I couldn't agree more with a statement like this. He might not be the greatest battleler but he surely knows how to warm my heart
@@itszyworn4874 totally agree. I just never thought it would be one that the majority dislikes, I just can’t see why. I love Heatmor, and with a fantastic shiny like his I figured he’d be nowhere near “hated”
Naaaah i used flareon with gust and toxic orb and just use flame charge and crush the entire enemy team it almost always happen when i get to use flareon
singles format in mind, that's it and even then. Torkoal is better than Ninetales as a sun setter with actual bulk, can set up rocks, remove hazards with Rapid Spin, and even make use of it's 140 Def with Body Press the main thing Ninetales has going for it is Nasty Plot
Torkal is actually the better sun setter. It’s lower speed allows trick room use and it will set up the sun after the faster sun setter which can give an early start. Torkal also gains access to stealth rocks and rapid spin. A sun boosted eruption in trick room allows it to be a strong hitter. Ever wonder why that Torkal is used more than Ninetales in both single and double battles?
@@LegendaryCaptain i think there is no bad dragon type exept of course in gen 1. Probably its gonna be “top 15 worst dragon type design” rather than their base stat
@@darkscorpion-donzaloog Lol. I was just trying to trigger someone. Also, I've never seen anybody so close to me on that political compass, I literally ended up just as right, but like 2 boxes above you.
Flareon? Based 130 atac' Guts Nice special defens and nice enough moves. Its not the Best but he doesn't deserve Be in the top i think :U IT is my favorito of all the eevee
@@megabladechronicles962 it can use toxic orb to get the guts boost. So boosted flare blitz can put out some insane damage. But It’s low speed means it’s really only good as a wallbreaker and magmortar might be a bit better overall at that, as it has better defense and speed. If flareon is top ten worst it’s probably number 10 or so IMO
@@justtkrl toxic orb is a terrible item for guts because toxic poison gets stronger every turn, flareon wouldn’t be able to stay on the field to do any worth while damage when it’s hp is drained from poison and thanks to its terrible defenses. Flareon is awful
Delphox should be like number 11 or 13 because yes it has a lot of weaknesses but it's also really fast so it can take out the competition before it's hit. also just letting you know when you where going over Delphox you put Emboar's stats and abilities instead so you should go fix that if you have a chance.
Why do you have such a vendetta about Delphox? It has great Sp Attack and uses that well with Fire/Physic typing. Just say you don't like its design or the X&Y games.
Delphox literally my fav starter from XY and yes its pretty strong. I enjoy using it during my games and quite shock to figure out people don't like it.
Radical red monkeys are pretty solid with their hidden ability, sage power. It's basically special gorilla tactics, so a choice specs. This is pretty good when coupled with choice scarf or choice specs to give a MONSTER special attack.
Delphox + Magician + Solar bear + Powerherb is a legitamately viable set. Switch in on a grass type, they switch into water/rock/earth type, u chunk/kill them and reap whatever item they have. A slight gamble, of course but works out more often than not and I personally think is good enough of a gimmick to carry the poke off this list entirely.
@@TheDragonstorm1993 I think talonflame should be here..I love talonflame but it sucks in play through..it only get flame charge until late of the game
Bro Torkoal could sweep u so quick with a trick room team plus it has she’ll smash which gives it insane attack stats plus white herb makes that 10x better so that’s mad disrespectful to gen 3
Actually ur both wrong . Torkoal is a GOD in competitive, but not at all as an attacker, its main function is utility . Its the best weather setter in the game due to, funnily enough , its abysmal speed . You see in pokemon the order in which abilities activate is based on speed , and since torkoal is such a slow mon , drought will always activate last , this is important if you were facing off against an opposing weather setter , for example if you faced off against a pelipper with drizzle , its ability activates first and sets up rain , then rorkoals ability activates second and replaces rain with sun , this simple fact makes torkoal the best weather setter in the entire game as it guarantees that as long as torkoal is still standing, your team will be the one controlling the weather Secondly torkoal ( unlike ninetales and politoed ) is not a one trick pony and isn't an exclusive weather setter , as it gets access to stealth rock to cripple the opponents team , yawn to force a switch out , and rapid spin to remove the opposing teams hazards. Unlike ninetals which is forced to only be an attacker since it gets 0 support moves and since its really physically frail and only has a mediocre 81 special attack stats , it won't really do you any good for offense It also gets curse and body press which can deal with a lot of bulky steel types . I'm conclusion , mystic really undersold how good torkoal is , but you yourself were a bit wrong in saying that torkoal is good at trick room and offense, cause on the contrary , you ideally always want torkoal to be the slowest pokemon on the field in order to monopolize the weather
While I don't deny some Fire types will be "worse" in some categories, I still love them all the same. Yes, even Simisear. His derpiness is just cute to me.
I would honestly put Typhlosion in the list, like Eruption is great, but Solar beam and Extrasensory for coverage? Just terrible. + Typhlosion is really restricted to playing choiced items to work well. And if the Oricorio forms get to be on the list, then maybe include Silvally-Fire. When have we ever seen it do work?
@@blecis74 Duh? I'm referring to 4:23, where it shows Reckless as the Hidden Ability. With the stats just a few seconds before it ALSO not matching Delphox at all.
Torkaol is really good with trickroom and having a great ability like drought. In singles it is a strong sun setting rapid spinner that is bulky on the physical side. So having it even considered for a worst list is bad.
The only Torkoal I've ever used was in an Emerald randomizer and it had Cute Charm for an ability instead of Drought. Sure, it lost the one thing that made it okay, but the novelty of a Torkoal immobilizing foes with infatuation was great.
I wished that certain Fire Pokémon like Pyroar were honestly better and I guess Hyper beam is a option for special attacking normal types but still, I wish it could of been buffed in some way.
I’m surprised that Flareon is not on the list. It’s defense and speed are terrible and it’s move set isn’t really that good. It’s really sad because it’s my second favorite eeveelution.
@@robertoalexandermendezmore408 Doesn’t get used in high tier henceforth “okay” not god tier pokémon lol definitely better than nearly all on this list (bar Torkoal) It’s a fun pokémon that has a niche that can be used, and it’s usually the dark horse on my eevee teams
Are you being biased on not adding Flareon on the list? I love the Eeveelutions with a passion, Leafeon being my favorite. However, Flareon is just bad, though not as bad as Glaceon. It has a very limited movepool, with Flare Blitz as its best, and other moves like Superpower, Iron Tail, Dig, and a priority Quick Attack being its best diverse moves, the stat spread is pretty bad, with that horrible Speed, physical Defense, and HP, and while Guts is an incredible hidden ability, that can make it work with a Toxic Orb, other Pokémon who are faster than its base 65 Speed, packing moves like Stone Edge or Earthquake, can take it out before it even has a chance to let loose that power. And because it’s physical Attack is so much higher than Special, the only use I had for that stat was just to unleash an Overheat on physical walls. Other than that, Flareon is pretty bad.
@@chendror872 here some few fire & electric type moves. Fire moves Flare jump flip. Torch tail. Blame paw. Fiery slam / fiery ram Electric moves Zap headbutt. Electro chop. Tase jab.
Glaceon’s better than Flareon tho? Bad typing aside, it’s a really strong hitter with decent defenses. Can’t say the same for Flareon especially with its move pool
I agree with most of this list but not Torkoal. Torkoal is really good in VGC. It's been like top 3 most used firetypes. ATM he is at 11% usage. But he was used alot more before the dlc.
These are my guesses before watching the video: Simisear, Heatmor, Emboar, Typhlosion, Delphox, Oricorio-Fire, Magcargo, Ninetales, Houndoom and Pyroar. Also Flareon.
I'm sorry but Typhlosion, Houndoom and Ninetails are great pokemon to use. All 3 are very useful and all 3 have great stats. Plus Mega Houndoom is badass
@@ojnopulp4563 Houndoom is probably in top 15 weakest and Typhlosion is one of 5 weakest no doubt. Ninetales gets drought so it's probably in top 10/top 15
I definitely like magmortar way more then Magmar, actually magmar is one of my least favorite designed Pokémon while magmortar is one of my favorite and I’m an OG gen 1 fan
For those who are confused: this is Delphox's real base stats: HP - 75 Attack - 69 Defense - 72 Special Attack - 114 Special Defense - 100 Speed - 104 Total: 534
The stats he sword were Emboars though..... Delphox stats are: HP: 75 ATTACK: 69 DEFENSE: 72 SP. ATTACK: 114 SP. DEFENSE: 100 SPEED: 104 Although not the best special sweeper, it’s definitely far from bad with that good speed and special attack so I think it shouldn’t be on this list. Plus it’s got good cover with fire moves, psychic, shadow ball, calm mind, grass knot, dazzling gleam, and a lot of support moves that can be taken advantage of thanks to its good speed
torkoal is definitely the best sun setter that isnt a legendary he shouldnt even be on the list he had rapid spin, rocks, and can eat physical hits, its lack luster special def stat is whatever when u can pivot into a good specially defensive mons specially when he's enabling sun
I love your content, though I really disagree with Torkoal being on this list or even near it :( I say this because I feel you maybe don’t know what’s accomplished? And for fun! No judgment! Your opinion is your own but When you look at it from a VGC history standpoint and From a team building standpoint it’s an amazing anchor to both Sun teams and Trick room teams which have long been a very meta defining strategy regardless of the format. And this ignores that due to Torkoals own existence a new meta defining team Strategy called Sun-room was popularized and is one of the most if not the most dominant and defining team strategy’s in all of VGC. Cheers
@COOPER PENNINGTON that's the only logical explanation I can think of, because the thing if definitely trash when compared to at least half of the list
Fun fact, Delphox is actually my first starter and my first Pokemon EVER that I chose when I played through Pokemon Y, my first Pokemon game I ever owned.
Torkoal can set up sun and that's enough to make people consider it at lower tiers. There's nothing attractive or worthwhile for Simisear that makes it better than the turtle.
I have an idea to buff Magcargo Abillity changes Magma armor -> Evaporation(new ability) Weak armor -> Simple Base stat buffs HP: +60 Sp Atk: +10 Sp Def: +15 Spe: +10 New BST total 525 Evaporation makes the user and allied adjacent pokemon both immune to water type moves as well as making fire type moves super effective against water type Pokémon. If it’s raining when the abillity activates then the rain will stop Edith gave Magcargo it’s own unique ability
Nice video. 2 things I would do is replace Magmortar for Flareon, which is just bad with its non existent movepool, terrible bulk physically, and slow. And Torkoal being replaced for Nientales. Nientales is inferior to Torkoal as a sun setter since Torkoal has actual bulk, can set hazards, and remove them with Rapid Spin, and can make use of the 140 defense with Body Press, which is a blessing for Torkoal.
To be honest, Delphox was my signature starter Pokemon for some time before I switched to Primarina, with Cinderace or Greninja being temporary alternatives.
Delphox will still be one of my favourite Pokemon though. I would include it into my starter themed party with Primarina, Torterra, Venusaur, Greninja and either Cinderace or Inteleon
Hey there, folks, it's me -- Fredo from The Godfather.
I edited this video and just made a small mistake throwing up Emboar's stats and abilities there because just beforehand it was spoken about, so I got a little crossed up. It was a long video and I just was being a little bit careless in the early parts. My bad!
Why don’t you have any subs your awesome XD?
I saw those stats and was shocked thinking: "Delphox is a physical attacker?????" Then I realised it HAD to be a simple mistake. Thanks for clarifying.
Water type next my guy.
Torkoal is wayyyy better then you think man
rapidash gets morning sun it does have reliable recovery
The problem is Torkoal's speed is low enough that it's actually fast......on a Trick Room team. That's the thing that makes the Pokemon useless in the campaign portion of the game, but broken in the VGC.
Yeah I agree. In my opinion swap Flareon for Torkoal. And trust me when I say so shade on Flareon I love it. It’s just so not great
Plus it’s speed makes it perfect for setting up sun. It guarantees that it’s the weather that will be on the field since everything is set up in order of speed
True true, Torkoal doesn’t deserve to be on the list
Torkoal is a turtle so....do u really expect it to be fast?
Well torkoal is a mon that's used in the top teir metas. Its not great for the typical player. Maybe this is why he doesn't like it.
Torkoal: *has drought, Yawn, Stealth Rock and Rapid Spin*
Mystic Umbreon: Trash
Yeah because he’s trash. Get over it kid.
But torkoal was my first shiny :( XD
It has been in NU in smogon since it was introduced
Torkoal is widely considered to be the best sub-ubers sun setter due to its excellent physical bulk, access to stealth rock and rapid spin, access to body press to smack tyranitar and heatran, and its ability to inflict status with toxic/yawn/lava plume.
Even that “problematic” low speed is a blessing in disguise, virtually guaranteeing that sun is set up when leading off against opposing weather.
It’s excellent enough that it sees frequent use on many VGC teams, forming the infamous Venukoal core which provides power, speed control, defensive synergy, and team flexibility, as it functions well under trick room to fire off devastating sun-boosted eruptions.
Compare that with Ninetales, who can only be used as a pure offensive Pokémon. With only a base 81 special attack, using it as a sweeper is essentially a waste of a teamslot. It doesn’t compress teamslots like providing stealth rock, providing secondary hazard control, etc.
It arguably deserves to be on the top 10 strongest fire types list, as it is the backbone of an entire archetype and helps greatly to facilitate it. At the very least, it’s better than simisear, who has never seen usage as more than a joke.
Don’t forget them sweet sunboosted eruptions
This...is all completely true.
Yea its definitely not that good on its own but its definitely a good support pokemon does its job.
Yup. It is one of the bulkiest and most strategically useful Pokemon in both Sun and trick room teams
Hey mystic should have used flareon or turtonator or coalossal
Pokémon: Has a base speed of less than 100
Mystic: So yeah this is straight trash...
Power Creep
@@thejuic3b0i64 Speed Creep.
I wonder if he ever head of choice scarf
*If he calls Hydreigon trash, I shall make this man the first of my victims.*
@@slyfox7452 ikr
Torkoal's low speed is actually an advantage for a weather setter. if it comes in the same turn with any other opposing weather setter the sun will prevail. Plus stealth rocks with rapid spin make it a hazard setter and hazzard controller 2in1. And lava plume 30% chance to burn and punish physical attackers who might want to take advantage of his limited attacking movepool make him even better.. It doesnt deserve to be in the list. But other than that, great video!!
The fact that he thinks that ninetales is a better sun setter than torkoal is pretty funny and sad at the same time. Torkoal is used to setup sun in : RU,UU,OU and even UBER it’s also the main sun setter in doubles and monotype teams, the only times you’ll use ninetales instead would be in the tiers torkoal isn’t allowed (PU,ZU)
It also gets eruptuion earth power and body press which is really all it needs with a protect
Torkoal is a beast
Torkoal with Curse can become a real problem too
Also flannerys torkoal should be enough to convince people that torkoal is op
The stats and abilities you showed for Delphox were Emboar’s stats
Magician was correct
I was so confused for a second lol. I was like "Delphox is a mage why does it have a higher PHYSICAL stat"
Yeah Frato (editor) goofed
Lol
Yeah. I was super confused
Torkoal is banned on Smogon doubles? There were soooo many other terrible Pokémon you could’ve chosen? What?
I know right? It’s the best non-Groudon drought Pokémon in the game.
@@dtexdarkus maybe he was thinking about the gen3 version
@@stompingpeak2043 yep, the one way before Gen 7, like he's been living under a rock whiling sleeping on Torkoal
@@stompingpeak2043 nope, he wanst considering all the options of torkoal fo being used
Torkoal actually gets quite a lot of competitive use.
He maybe ranking it by play through not competitive
@@WheelStart is used in competitive is just this guy dont play VGC where you know, this mon are designed, is the best sun seter in the game, have more used than groudon rigth now that is a gs cup
@@WheelStart He says in the beginning of this video and the water one that he is ranking it competitively. Also the way he talks about it is in a very competitive mindset.
@@moleman3708 yes
Not in Smogon format.
Why don’t we get water out the way, it’s always last
Torkoal shouldn’t be on this list
I got you 100 hundy likes
I got you 115 likes
Agreed
Haha, VGC players unite!
Torkoal can be used on other teams than isn't just doubles the fact that he gets assault vest , body press , solar beam, support moves and invest in hp and SP Def and your good to go if u want to make a pokemon work u try your hardest to find something to make it useful but the fact is that torkoal has some benefits and DOES NOT BELONG ON THIS LIST
Ok but imagine this torkoal gets a evolution that turns its shell into a volcano BUT even better torkoal gets eviolite for its defences giving it a great role
bruh toarkel was one of the OU(Overused/ in competetiv pokemon battling) pokemon befor crown tundra was released and even saw usage in competetiv 2v2 at high tournament level. It IS much better than ninetails at setting up sun in the sword and shield meta. It can lay stealth rocks, yawn, rapid spin and you can easily switch it in against physical attackers to set up sun and you switch it out against special attackes
Not only to mention it's low speed makes sure that sun is set, and trick room has to think twice about setting up since toarkel is so slow it'll hit hard first
Yea mystic umbreon these are you opinions my son camrupt idk if i spell it right but he def a power house
Its still good now, but as of tomorrow maybe groudon will outshine it as a drought setter
I think its just complicated abaut those things. If the pokemon have a good design then i use it
Excuse me, Rapidash can learn Morning Sun to recover HP
But he is extremely trash
@@itspheonix5181 rapidash carried my team in lg
@@jenajelema but he is trash
@@itspheonix5181 we don't care. The point is, what Mystic said wasn't true
@@bvd_vlvd I don't care about u too whatever anybody say rapidash is trash
I dunno if someone already commented this but Rapidash actually have recovery on Morning Sun, even in its Kantonian form...
Did anyone notice that Mystic put emboars base stats instead of delphoxs?
Bruh read the top comment.
@@banj4356 ???
And did anyone notice that @emental 64 put “beast stats” instead of “base stats”
@@allyowancy8037 Auto correct
Oh, now I understand why Minun was so low on the electric list, below the likes of Pachirisu. Mystic doesn't understand support pokemon. He deadass put Torkoal on the list lmaooooooo
Gonna have to completely disagree on toarkoal since it was and has been in the competitive meta !
I got destroyed by a torkoal using body press holding a quick claw in the players cup 3 lol I was so proud
Dude this guy was wrong in that point, torkoal is in fact one of the best weater seter in the game and see to much use in vgc
No Typhlosion here so far, roger that.
*Thank you.*
If Typhlosion isn't on the list, it really should be. It's directly outclassed by Delphox, who has better coverage and a secondary typing in top of being faster and hitting harder. The ONLY reason why people think that Typhlosion is at all a decent Pokemon is because it happens to be the best starter Pokemon choice in gen2 and their fourth gen remakes, and okay, in all fairness it is quite good. But in terms of it's competitive viability, it has never been that good, and it legitimately offers far and away the least out of any fire type starter.
@@matthewkuscienko4616 It had a place in UUBL before gen4, so I wouldn't say that it was "never good". Many of its moves became physical because of the P/S split that gen, and as Typh's physical attack is worse than its special, it was no longer able to take full advantage of most of its coverage attacks. A good example is thunder punch.
Im not sure if Typhlosion really is the worst fire starter, too. I'd rather say its Emboar, though it has some things going for it that let it have a small edge over Typh.
@@Soso_LP Maybe Typhlosion has been okay in some generations in the past, but it still overall has been the worst fire type starter, and it still would more than likely be now. Charizard has the exact same stats, but it's better and has 2 good mega evos and a Gmax form, Blaziken has speed boost and is really powerful, Infernape was better than Blaziken before gen5 and has good attacking stats and speed, Emboar may be slow, but it's a really strong wallbreaker and has good coverage options, Delphox is literally just Typhlosion with better stats in the areas that matter and has a secondary type for more STAB, Incineroar has intimidate and is great in VGC, and Cinderace has good attack and speed and an ability that is essentially protean with a different name. Typhlosion's only advantage is eruption, which has it's power reduced as it takes damage, so entry hazards, priority (especially aqua jet), and faster Pokemon (with or without choice scarf) really hurt it's viability
I want to argue against Typhlosion being on this list because it's my favourite fully evolved starter out of all of them, but it just got fucked so badly by the physical/special split...
@@matthewkuscienko4616 yeah, Typhlosion is a joke. It gets extrasensory as its coverage. And I think that's it. Delphox is way better, without a doubt and the only thing Typhlosion has it going for it is eruption scarf spam until it gets hit once and dies
Should have replaced torkoal with flareon. Flareon is just a terrible fire type pokemon
it has guta and soo high physical attack stat whoch makes it slightly better
@@ni8mareassasin367 just because it has high physical attack doesnt make it good, it still gets worn down hard by things like stealth rocks, since its a fire type it needs a toxic orb to activate guts, and flare blitz will wear it dowm even more, plus it doesnt have a good movepool all it has to attack its flare blitz, facade, and superpower it needs more variety than that and its low speed is a problem too, many pokemon outspeed it
While torkoal has much higher bulk, can set up stealth rocks, rapid spin them away, and has the ability drought. Torkoal has more utility and less problems to deal with than flareon
@@bewarebewear1507 torkoal isn't specially that good and yeah flareon's only issue is the speed
@@ni8mareassasin367 doesnt matter if torkoals special attack isnt good, like I said its a good support pokemon and the best sun setter in the game
Also flareons issue isnt only speed, like I said being poisoned will kill ot easier making it useless, being slow and worn down by your own attacks or items makes it terrible, how can you make flareon good if it wont even get a chance to use its attacks against an opponent thatll knock it out when it outspeeds it?
@@bewarebewear1507 not special attack special defense
I genuinely like Heatmor. He’s got one of the best shinies in Pokémon, but yea he’s not a great Pokémon statistically
I'm with you. Heatmor is actually my favorite pokemon alongside Sandslash, and I couldn't agree more with a statement like this. He might not be the greatest battleler but he surely knows how to warm my heart
@@itszyworn4874 totally agree. I just never thought it would be one that the majority dislikes, I just can’t see why. I love Heatmor, and with a fantastic shiny like his I figured he’d be nowhere near “hated”
4th grade me was obsessed with anteaters so I liked it a lot haha
@@xord6286 yea that makes total sense lol but it’s just a cool mon so i still don’t know how it could garner any hatred whatsoever 🤷🏼 lol
its trash but its so cool looking though
Despite being hotter than the sun, Magcargo just got roasted.😂😂😂
Torkoal is a huge defensive tank, especially in VGC. Replace its slot with Flareon and it would be perfect.
Naaaah i used flareon with gust and toxic orb and just use flame charge and crush the entire enemy team it almost always happen when i get to use flareon
@@manyiahandret5119 flareon wouldn’t even last long enough to do any of that and....did you just say gust???
@@manyiahandret5119 you must be joking seriously gust?
@@samuell24 wait i Mean guts sorry
@@zohaibhossain821 sorry i Mean guts
Just throwing it out there, but Torkoal is one of the top tier pokemon in VGC in the last year, how is he even on this list?
And in this one still good, with be apectacular, but ia far from unusable
singles format in mind, that's it
and even then. Torkoal is better than Ninetales as a sun setter with actual bulk, can set up rocks, remove hazards with Rapid Spin, and even make use of it's 140 Def with Body Press
the main thing Ninetales has going for it is Nasty Plot
Torkal is actually the better sun setter. It’s lower speed allows trick room use and it will set up the sun after the faster sun setter which can give an early start. Torkal also gains access to stealth rocks and rapid spin. A sun boosted eruption in trick room allows it to be a strong hitter. Ever wonder why that Torkal is used more than Ninetales in both single and double battles?
Let’s get it out of the way early: Bugs!
On the opposite end Dragons like legit most of the worst dragons are better then the top 15 bugs 😂
@@LegendaryCaptain i think there is no bad dragon type exept of course in gen 1. Probably its gonna be “top 15 worst dragon type design” rather than their base stat
This is a interesting topic to get into. Also, I vote weakest Fairy types next.
Weakest of the strongest? Interesting
Xerneas is definitely the weakest fairy.
@@augustuscaesar8287 Weakest Legendary Fairy-Type?
Glorges
@@darkscorpion-donzaloog Lol. I was just trying to trigger someone.
Also, I've never seen anybody so close to me on that political compass, I literally ended up just as right, but like 2 boxes above you.
Me throughout the entire video: *FLAREON FLAREON FLAREON FLAREON FLAREON!!!*
Yeah he should have taken magmortar or torkoal off for flareon
Flareon?
Based 130 atac'
Guts
Nice special defens and nice enough moves.
Its not the Best but he doesn't deserve
Be in the top i think :U
IT is my favorito of all the eevee
@@alexw-_-4187 guts is a terrible ability considering that flareon is immune to burns
@@megabladechronicles962 it can use toxic orb to get the guts boost. So boosted flare blitz can put out some insane damage. But It’s low speed means it’s really only good as a wallbreaker and magmortar might be a bit better overall at that, as it has better defense and speed. If flareon is top ten worst it’s probably number 10 or so IMO
@@justtkrl toxic orb is a terrible item for guts because toxic poison gets stronger every turn, flareon wouldn’t be able to stay on the field to do any worth while damage when it’s hp is drained from poison and thanks to its terrible defenses. Flareon is awful
Delphox should be like number 11 or 13 because yes it has a lot of weaknesses but it's also really fast so it can take out the competition before it's hit. also just letting you know when you where going over Delphox you put Emboar's stats and abilities instead so you should go fix that if you have a chance.
Meanwhile (regular) Charizard and Typhlosion are both weaker and slower with Typhlosion having a horrendous movepool yet neither are on the video -_-'
@@V-Jes at least typhlosion has eruption
@@V-Jes flareon should be on this list tho
@@MatiGra32 Aand that gimmick falls flat if it gets hit by hazards, priority or pokemon with any speed higher than mediocre 100...
Read the top comment about the editing mistake.
Never knew why people hated delphox . In my opinion I always found more use out of it compared to other ootiond
I feel like Flareon could be on this list, but great video as always.
It not on the list because of its ability guts
@@bronzepkmn guts is good if you not are frail AND slow and most important fire type, guts in flareon is in fact bad ability in him
Why do you have such a vendetta about Delphox? It has great Sp Attack and uses that well with Fire/Physic typing. Just say you don't like its design or the X&Y games.
He loves Foxes, was waiting for a fox starter but doesnt like Braixen and Delphox's designs
@@graythaprince This dude *really* called Delphox "weak" cuz he was let down by its design? Bruh
@@LollyByDay Yeah...
Delphox literally my fav starter from XY and yes its pretty strong. I enjoy using it during my games and quite shock to figure out people don't like it.
@@sooqible I completely agree
Radical red monkeys are pretty solid with their hidden ability, sage power. It's basically special gorilla tactics, so a choice specs. This is pretty good when coupled with choice scarf or choice specs to give a MONSTER special attack.
Ya but thats fan game sadly
i am playing radical red and i CANT beat giovanni in silph co cause of that stupid excadrill
RAPIDASH GETS MORNING SUN... A RELIABLE RECOVERY WHEN DROUGHT'S UP
"when drought it up"
I see rapidash used ALOT
@@chendror872 It still works well without the sun. It only becomes weak in Hail, Sand, and Rain.
Delphox + Magician + Solar bear + Powerherb is a legitamately viable set. Switch in on a grass type, they switch into water/rock/earth type, u chunk/kill them and reap whatever item they have. A slight gamble, of course but works out more often than not and I personally think is good enough of a gimmick to carry the poke off this list entirely.
Torkoal definetly shouldnt be here
@@bobbynewman9321 I dont know its decent as well :/
@@bobbynewman9321 nah not Charizard but I think flareon should tho
@@TheDragonstorm1993 I think talonflame should be here..I love talonflame but it sucks in play through..it only get flame charge until late of the game
@@WheelStart it didn't suck in gen 6 that's the bad part about it
Unless it was flame body talon
Damn. Now I'm gonna use magcargo on every team I can
Bro Torkoal could sweep u so quick with a trick room team plus it has she’ll smash which gives it insane attack stats plus white herb makes that 10x better so that’s mad disrespectful to gen 3
Actually ur both wrong .
Torkoal is a GOD in competitive, but not at all as an attacker, its main function is utility .
Its the best weather setter in the game due to, funnily enough , its abysmal speed . You see in pokemon the order in which abilities activate is based on speed , and since torkoal is such a slow mon , drought will always activate last , this is important if you were facing off against an opposing weather setter , for example if you faced off against a pelipper with drizzle , its ability activates first and sets up rain , then rorkoals ability activates second and replaces rain with sun , this simple fact makes torkoal the best weather setter in the entire game as it guarantees that as long as torkoal is still standing, your team will be the one controlling the weather
Secondly torkoal ( unlike ninetales and politoed ) is not a one trick pony and isn't an exclusive weather setter , as it gets access to stealth rock to cripple the opponents team , yawn to force a switch out , and rapid spin to remove the opposing teams hazards. Unlike ninetals which is forced to only be an attacker since it gets 0 support moves and since its really physically frail and only has a mediocre 81 special attack stats , it won't really do you any good for offense
It also gets curse and body press which can deal with a lot of bulky steel types .
I'm conclusion , mystic really undersold how good torkoal is , but you yourself were a bit wrong in saying that torkoal is good at trick room and offense, cause on the contrary , you ideally always want torkoal to be the slowest pokemon on the field in order to monopolize the weather
While I don't deny some Fire types will be "worse" in some categories, I still love them all the same.
Yes, even Simisear. His derpiness is just cute to me.
Understandable
@@aquaffinity
Have a great day.
I think simisear don’t deserve it getting hated. It may be not that good but it still do a good job of its inspiration
I keep forgetting that Slugma and Maccargo aren't Hoenn Pokémon.
Same
Torkoal is a way better sun setter than ninetales.
facts cause ninatales is trash
The worst fire type is Heatmor because it hunts Durants and Durants are cool.
Based
Yes
@@GlazeBattleBorn we have a Pokemon Challenges fan. Why u commenting? The irony of commenting cringe when commenting is cringe.
@@mahfuzrahman913 ??????
Haha lol jk. Wanted to see your response lmao
I would honestly put Typhlosion in the list, like Eruption is great, but Solar beam and Extrasensory for coverage? Just terrible. + Typhlosion is really restricted to playing choiced items to work well.
And if the Oricorio forms get to be on the list, then maybe include Silvally-Fire. When have we ever seen it do work?
So many errors on Delphox. Shows stats that aren't Delphox's, shows abilities that aren't Delphox's...
Magician is Delphox’s hidden ability.
@@blecis74 Duh? I'm referring to 4:23, where it shows Reckless as the Hidden Ability. With the stats just a few seconds before it ALSO not matching Delphox at all.
@@othergrimm6592 right I thought maybe you missed the bit where magician was shown. My mistake.
Frado edited the video, he put up Embore’s stars and abilities by mistake
Torkaol is really good with trickroom and having a great ability like drought. In singles it is a strong sun setting rapid spinner that is bulky on the physical side. So having it even considered for a worst list is bad.
Is a monster in vgc, this guy get a brain fart
Maybe do the fairy type next. It'd be interesting to see what pokemon would be the weakest of the strongest type.
Xerneas and Glorges 100%
Probably Wigglytuff?
If it ain’t 100% accurate, it’s 50% accurate
Quiet, Mikey.
The only Torkoal I've ever used was in an Emerald randomizer and it had Cute Charm for an ability instead of Drought. Sure, it lost the one thing that made it okay, but the novelty of a Torkoal immobilizing foes with infatuation was great.
Now is better than emerald
You haven't faced a nightmare called doubles trick room eruption charkoal torkoal. Torkoal is really good!!!!
Pyroar should've benefited from the Meowstic treatment except the male would be Physical and the female be Special.
Nah, other way around. Look at that glorious mane; that is not the mane of a melee fighter
Huh, I’m quite surprised Flareon isn’t on here.
Have you SEEN it’s physical Attack?? If you can find the proper Fire type moves for it it’s a beast
@@gabrielleleasure5949 speed is bad, hp is 65, and defense is only 60. I would say it’s meh or bad
😡
He definitely deserves to be in here. Maybe Mystic is biased towards eeveelutions.
Torkoal and Magmortar shouldn't have been on this list, and in their places should've been Flareon and Typhlosion instead.
Good to see that more and more people are recognizing Emboar's power
I wished that certain Fire Pokémon like Pyroar were honestly better and I guess Hyper beam is a option for special attacking normal types but still, I wish it could of been buffed in some way.
I’m surprised that Flareon is not on the list. It’s defense and speed are terrible and it’s move set isn’t really that good. It’s really sad because it’s my second favorite eeveelution.
Flareon is okay in competitive though, flame charge with toxic orb and guts and you can easily get a couple KOs
Aye man don't say anything about my cute fire fox
Aye man don't say anything about my cute and fluffy fire fox, cat or dog!?
@@williammcintosh5204 false, is untiered and doesnt see use in hige ladder of VGC, only see it like a meme pick
@@robertoalexandermendezmore408 Doesn’t get used in high tier henceforth “okay” not god tier pokémon lol definitely better than nearly all on this list (bar Torkoal)
It’s a fun pokémon that has a niche that can be used, and it’s usually the dark horse on my eevee teams
Mistake in Delphox stats? Those look more like Emboar stats than anything
Yeah and ability. Emboar worst starter confirmed?
@@SS-ig9lj emboar was banned from NU in gen 7
Typhlosion delphox and base Charizard are weaker competitively
@@SS-ig9lj he was saying about it's stats just showed emboar
@@SS-ig9lj emboar is pretty good
99 speed pokemon
Mystic:this is trash 🗑
100 speed pokemon
Mystic:omg so strong 💪
His logic is just trash. Torkoal and Mega Camerupt are far better than Simisear and Delphox competitively.
I think Flareon is worse than Magmortar.
Also Heatmor does have a very nice shiny
I remember back in gen 5 I was so at aw over heatmor I used my master ball on him, he was perfect in every way
Are you being biased on not adding Flareon on the list? I love the Eeveelutions with a passion, Leafeon being my favorite. However, Flareon is just bad, though not as bad as Glaceon.
It has a very limited movepool, with Flare Blitz as its best, and other moves like Superpower, Iron Tail, Dig, and a priority Quick Attack being its best diverse moves, the stat spread is pretty bad, with that horrible Speed, physical Defense, and HP, and while Guts is an incredible hidden ability, that can make it work with a Toxic Orb, other Pokémon who are faster than its base 65 Speed, packing moves like Stone Edge or Earthquake, can take it out before it even has a chance to let loose that power. And because it’s physical Attack is so much higher than Special, the only use I had for that stat was just to unleash an Overheat on physical walls. Other than that, Flareon is pretty bad.
Good point
Yes they really need to make more physical fire-type move
@@majesticgothitelle1802 same with electric type moves
@@chendror872 here some few fire & electric type moves.
Fire moves
Flare jump flip.
Torch tail.
Blame paw.
Fiery slam / fiery ram
Electric moves
Zap headbutt.
Electro chop.
Tase jab.
Glaceon’s better than Flareon tho? Bad typing aside, it’s a really strong hitter with decent defenses. Can’t say the same for Flareon especially with its move pool
Torkoal is really good right now in the Doubles format - Trick Room is a thing.
Damn, I actually really like torkoal 😂😂
@@bobbynewman9321 you're literally comparing ninetales nowadays to torkoal "at some point"
@@bobbynewman9321 I never said ninetales is good (I love it but it's bad) I just said it's not fair to compare between the 2 in different times
@@bobbynewman9321 I never said I don't believe you you're missing my point
@@chendror872 Your wrong, he didnt compare ninetails now to torkoal at some point, they where both compared at their peaks
@@bobbynewman9321 ninetes is trash
I agree with most of this list but not Torkoal. Torkoal is really good in VGC. It's been like top 3 most used firetypes. ATM he is at 11% usage. But he was used alot more before the dlc.
Was ou before crown tundra
@@robertoalexandermendezmore408 and being NU is better than being untired like Ninetales
Torkoal blew Ninetales outta the picture
Torkoal is a freaking great mon, very ironic seeing it on this list!
These are my guesses before watching the video:
Simisear, Heatmor, Emboar, Typhlosion, Delphox, Oricorio-Fire, Magcargo, Ninetales, Houndoom and Pyroar. Also Flareon.
I'm sorry but Typhlosion, Houndoom and Ninetails are great pokemon to use. All 3 are very useful and all 3 have great stats. Plus Mega Houndoom is badass
@@ojnopulp4563 Houndoom is probably in top 15 weakest and Typhlosion is one of 5 weakest no doubt. Ninetales gets drought so it's probably in top 10/top 15
Houndoom is good, Typhlosion is great, and Ninetales is a bad one because of its shallow movepool, because it learns fire moves
Only
@@yaboidragonitehere1137 i mean typhlosion is even outclassed by delphox and magmortar competetively lmao it is far from being good it sucks sadly
You need to watch some VGC videos before some of these evaluations
To be fair that's always a good idea
Which entry is this in context to?
@@banj4356 Torkoal
I definitely like magmortar way more then Magmar, actually magmar is one of my least favorite designed Pokémon while magmortar is one of my favorite and I’m an OG gen 1 fan
I wonder if a Pokémon trainer in Unova would bypass the Starter Pokémon and got all three Unova Elemental Monkeys instead
@PANG HSIEN LOONG Moe they are
Lol that’s what I’m going to do when I get black, I’m going to get all the because cuz I like them even though they are hated.
@@6ix_Wins good for you
Macargo also gets thrown into the dump.
Simisear: OMG YASSS ANOTHER FRAND WOOO
Let’s see what bullshit list Mystic comes up with again
When you say torkoal is one of the worst fire pokemon of all time it really makes me question if you actually know what the hell you are talking about
Cover the worst of the worst: the ice type
If you have already then my bad
Really because to him Bug is the worst typing
I'm going to make it my mission to make Magcargo great in my team. Can't wait to see the next list.
Have you ever thought of doing a video on the best type or types for each game/region?
For those who are confused: this is Delphox's real base stats:
HP - 75
Attack - 69
Defense - 72
Special Attack - 114
Special Defense - 100
Speed - 104
Total: 534
Honestly that's not to bad :/
4:18 ah yes I remember when delphox had emboar’s stats
Read the top comment about this.
Seeing Delphox here hurts. That’s one of my faves.
The stats he sword were Emboars though.....
Delphox stats are:
HP: 75
ATTACK: 69
DEFENSE: 72
SP. ATTACK: 114
SP. DEFENSE: 100
SPEED: 104
Although not the best special sweeper, it’s definitely far from bad with that good speed and special attack so I think it shouldn’t be on this list.
Plus it’s got good cover with fire moves, psychic, shadow ball, calm mind, grass knot, dazzling gleam, and a lot of support moves that can be taken advantage of thanks to its good speed
torkoal is definitely the best sun setter that isnt a legendary
he shouldnt even be on the list
he had rapid spin, rocks, and can eat physical hits, its lack luster special def stat is whatever when u can pivot into a good specially defensive mons specially when he's enabling sun
It doesn't get drought in the older game which is sucks
@@WheelStart hes talking about the pokemon in their newest game
otherwise camerupt wouldnt be on their
I love your content, though I really disagree with Torkoal being on this list or even near it :( I say this because I feel you maybe don’t know what’s accomplished? And for fun! No judgment! Your opinion is your own but When you look at it from a VGC history standpoint and From a team building standpoint it’s an amazing anchor to both Sun teams and Trick room teams which have long been a very meta defining strategy regardless of the format. And this ignores that due to Torkoals own existence a new meta defining team Strategy called Sun-room was popularized and is one of the most if not the most dominant and defining team strategy’s in all of VGC. Cheers
I think this can be awesome series and it would good to go in same way how strongest went.
I think steel, fairy or dragon, because those are the types people put most highly so that would be interesting
Am I supposed to believe that sun form Castform isn't on the list?
@COOPER PENNINGTON that's the only logical explanation I can think of, because the thing if definitely trash when compared to at least half of the list
Fun fact, Delphox is actually my first starter and my first Pokemon EVER that I chose when I played through Pokemon Y, my first Pokemon game I ever owned.
Lol Flannery's Torkoal was something else
Don’t bully my man magcargo. They had to nerf him or else he would be as hot as the sun canonically
Thermodynamically its possible to have 1800 degree celsius
Magmortar is my favorite fire type. I love the whole evolution line, but magmortar is the best one for me.
Torkoal can set up sun and that's enough to make people consider it at lower tiers. There's nothing attractive or worthwhile for Simisear that makes it better than the turtle.
Dude this guy got a brain fart, torkoal is far from bad pokemon in fact was and is very used
Delphox can steal if it lost focus sash I used it and it stole the opponent's leftovers.
I can’t believe he did that Melvin... On his birthday no less!
I'm sure more people would like Magmortar if it had a Mega form.
Also they should've given Magcargo an evolution in Gen 4
I have an idea to buff Magcargo
Abillity changes
Magma armor -> Evaporation(new ability)
Weak armor -> Simple
Base stat buffs
HP: +60
Sp Atk: +10
Sp Def: +15
Spe: +10
New BST total 525
Evaporation makes the user and allied adjacent pokemon both immune to water type moves as well as making fire type moves super effective against water type Pokémon.
If it’s raining when the abillity activates then the rain will stop
Edith gave Magcargo it’s own unique ability
The best thing about heatmor is it's shiny.
Indeed. One of the best shinies and it's wasted on heatmor. Ouch.
Nah. The best thing about it is it's exhaust pipe asshole.
I like Heatmor. I treasure the 6 IV Shiny I got.
Damn the thumbnail is so funny. Instantly clicked !😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Bro you are actually crazy I can't stand these videos you are soooo wrong. Torkoal is phenomenal.
Lol
Eh he get a brain fart with torkoal, i can see in mater hi doesnt play smogon or vgc
@@robertoalexandermendezmore408 yeah
Nice video. 2 things I would do is replace Magmortar for Flareon, which is just bad with its non existent movepool, terrible bulk physically, and slow. And Torkoal being replaced for Nientales. Nientales is inferior to Torkoal as a sun setter since Torkoal has actual bulk, can set hazards, and remove them with Rapid Spin, and can make use of the 140 defense with Body Press, which is a blessing for Torkoal.
nah, at least Flareon has Guts and Facade
Also, Ninetails gets Nasty Plot which is a huge thing
I was guesting magcargo was the weakest fire type and HOW WAS I RIGHT
Simisear has the same stat model as infernape it’s total is just less by 36 points
Yeaaaaa you used Emboar's stats when showcasing Delphox. Might wanna fix that.
To be honest, Delphox was my signature starter Pokemon for some time before I switched to Primarina, with Cinderace or Greninja being temporary alternatives.
Delphox will still be one of my favourite Pokemon though. I would include it into my starter themed party with Primarina, Torterra, Venusaur, Greninja and either Cinderace or Inteleon
Heyo, first I’ll juxtapose saying I love the list, however I do feel that torkoal should find itself higher due to its usage in a trick room team!
That thumbnail is brilliant!! 🤣🤣🤣