In general I really appreciate the work done on this channel. But sorry, but characterizing Tesla's move to open up chargers as something that "can only be seen as a philanthropic move" is naive at best and disingenuous at worst. It is what all businesses, driven by the profit motive, do when competition begins to enter their previously dominated market: attempt to lock in as big a part of the market as possible. And in this case building (some) new stations with NEVI funding that *might* have gone to competitors. Saying so is not Tesla hate, but understanding markets.
In a capitalistic motivation, the beneficial thing would of been to retain exclusivity to the premium CPO to your own customers, there-by creating an additional element of brand distinction. It is neither naive or disingenuous to suggest their surrendering their exclusive access as a philanthropic move. I respectfully disagree with your premise. Thx for watching.
Thanks, Walter! While it's still a problem that the latch can come loose on the Lectron adapter, which would allow someone to simply pull to disconnect it while the power is still flowing, the safety issue is actually on the charging provider side. The moment the latch loses contact, the charger needs to cut power. We're talking milliseconds, which means realistically, there's not enough time for someone to physically remove the plug from the connector before the connection is lost and the power has been cut. If the chargers are continuing to feed power (even for a fraction of a second) after that connection loss, that is a safety design flaw with the charger itself.
in a rain storm, I would personally be nervous with an adapter that can release the lock w/o cutting power due to the possibility of arching, but I understand what you are saying & appreciate you taking the time to point out the additional safety element of the pins loosing contact killing power too.
The SuperCharger to CCS adapter (OEM or third party) will not work on the full number of 27,000 SuperChargers that you mention. Only V3 and V4 stations, which are about 60% of the SuperChargers. Does not work on the V2 stations.
There are some Tesla v3 stations that are not NACS compatible. The v3 station in Lincoln, NE was incompatible until recently. The Limon, CO v3 station is not yet NACS compatible. There might be others.
@@larryhendren9111 Very good point also. I believe they are ultimately compatible, just Tesla hasn't opened up all V3 sites. Perhaps this is one of the busier ones?
GM has issued a press release that if there is damage to the vehicle because of the use of a non-GM adapter, the damage will not be covered by the warranty. Until the GM adapters become widely available it will be difficult to say you were not using a third party adapter.
@@thenetworkarchitectchannel I knew that several of the other charging networks had said that use of third party adapters were “not permitted” but was unaware Tesla had joined them. The odds of a faulty adapter damaging the car or the charging equipment is small and would be difficult to conclusively prove, but the potential of turning your $$$ EV into an almost worthless brick, or facing Tesla who has an army of attorneys on staff when you pay by the hour, should be carefully evaluated. (I will wait for the approved adapter, but YMMV.)
I ended up getting the A2Z adapter and worked like a charm on our Rivian R1S. Also heard that Lectron was not shipping the adapters in time and this issue just compounds more problems so I'll stay away from Lectron. I'm hoping we'll all be civil to each other when charging at Tesla superchargers as we figure this out. It seems like Tesla is also working on a NACS extension cable for EVs having their charge ports unconventional to Tesla port locations which I plan to get when available.
In my Volvo, the charge port is in the same location as Teslas, so I’ll blend right in. The Cadillac will likely use SC as a second option and EVgo primary. I guess we will see. Thx 4 watching
I'm eager to see how many Tesla drivers add a CCS1 adapter to their frunk as the chaos starts hitting busier Superchargers. Short cables, non-standard ports, and an influx of EVs with charge curves not optimized for Tesla's system is certainly going to be messy at select locations. An adapter the other way will give Tesla owners a way to escape that chaos and use lesser known CCS chargers nearby, even if they're lower power or unfamiliar territory. Let the Adapter Games begin! 👀
Me too. I am trusting the better angles of our nature will prevail. You make a valid point about folks fleeing the SC network. If I am a ride share driver in a Polestar 2 or a Bolt, I would likely sign up for SC membership to get discounted rates and than sit on them in-between fares. Rideshare-gate? Rideshare-pocalypses? Not quite sure what to call it. Anyway, those 62.5 kW CPE250s across the way will start to look pretty good vs a queue at at SC.
Unfortunately, the short cables on current Tesla dispensers do not reach most CCS cars making them park sideways or in the wrong parking position. Would be nice if Tesla would publish a list of cars scheduled to receive access to their SUC network and when. We travel to a location several times a year that is a CCS charging desert but has 3 Tesla SUC stations. Access to the Tesla SuC network for our Audi etron would be greatly appreciated.
Tesla has an extension cable in the works for current CCS-1 cars with the charge port in a poor position. Also, I am seeing many newer SC stations laid out with stalls to accommodate non-Teslas. Hopefully it wont be too much of an issue.
Tesla has four different charger versions appropriately called V1, V2, V3 and V4. The V1 and V2 are lower power and cannot be configured by software to accommodate non-Teslas. The V3 and the newer V4 can be and the V4 is supposed to have a longer charging chord to accommodate different vehicle charge port locations. Tesla may eventually make more money selling power to EVs than they do selling cars. They are using their expertise in solar panels, stationary battery storage and building low cost charging stations to buy or store power in off peak low cost times and selling it a peak rates. Their profit margins on cars may have temporarily suffered, but long term they may become the Exxon/Mobil of the electric age.
I’ve always been about all cars being able to use all chargers. I imported a Korean CCS1 adapter for my Tesla the moment it became possible and did my own CCS ECU retrofit with parts I had to drive to a service center two states away to get. So I guess I’m saying, I totally understand your excitement with getting access to more fast chargers 😂
5:30 I've heard a number of people report that Ultium EVs do not use ISO 15118; however, that is is not correct. I'm not sure how the rumor got started, but it might be that they are confusing some combination of information from the Chevy Bolt EV (its charging system was designed prior to ISO 15118's adoption) and EVgo (they chose to use non-ISO 15118 methods for activating "Autocharge" through their system). Essentially, it's possible to use both MAC-based authentication and ISO 15118 in the same platform in order to implement plug and charge functionality.
@@thenetworkarchitectchannel You're welcome. The more I think about it, I'm guessing people are assuming that because GM hasn't yet enabled plug and charge using ISO 15118 that the vehicles don't have it, but they do. ISO 15118 is required for V2H and bidirectional charging, so we know for sure Ultium has it. EVgo is GM's primary charging partner, so they wouldn't need to use it for that, but I'm not sure why they haven't activated plug and charge for EA. It's possible that Ultium vehicles do have plug and charge on the Superchargers; we just know that the Bolt EV won't have it.
Have you tried telling your Tesla app you have a non tesla, a Ford Mach e and using it to charge your Lyriq by enabling it in the Tesla app, bypassing plug and charge requirement?
@billjohnson3344 Correct. Unless Tesla has approved it on their side, it won't work. Tesla is not EA or EVgo or ChagePoint or any other manufacturer or provider. They have the largest, most reliable charging network for a reason. They know what they are doing.
Yes, SoC vid confirmed it was working. CrazyPostman seemed to have gotten one from a manufacturing run where the locking clip was inserted backwards. Just check yours when you get it b4 using. Thx 4 watching.
In general I really appreciate the work done on this channel. But sorry, but characterizing Tesla's move to open up chargers as something that "can only be seen as a philanthropic move" is naive at best and disingenuous at worst. It is what all businesses, driven by the profit motive, do when competition begins to enter their previously dominated market: attempt to lock in as big a part of the market as possible. And in this case building (some) new stations with NEVI funding that *might* have gone to competitors. Saying so is not Tesla hate, but understanding markets.
In a capitalistic motivation, the beneficial thing would of been to retain exclusivity to the premium CPO to your own customers, there-by creating an additional element of brand distinction. It is neither naive or disingenuous to suggest their surrendering their exclusive access as a philanthropic move. I respectfully disagree with your premise. Thx for watching.
Thanks, Walter! While it's still a problem that the latch can come loose on the Lectron adapter, which would allow someone to simply pull to disconnect it while the power is still flowing, the safety issue is actually on the charging provider side. The moment the latch loses contact, the charger needs to cut power. We're talking milliseconds, which means realistically, there's not enough time for someone to physically remove the plug from the connector before the connection is lost and the power has been cut. If the chargers are continuing to feed power (even for a fraction of a second) after that connection loss, that is a safety design flaw with the charger itself.
in a rain storm, I would personally be nervous with an adapter that can release the lock w/o cutting power due to the possibility of arching, but I understand what you are saying & appreciate you taking the time to point out the additional safety element of the pins loosing contact killing power too.
The SuperCharger to CCS adapter (OEM or third party) will not work on the full number of 27,000 SuperChargers that you mention. Only V3 and V4 stations, which are about 60% of the SuperChargers. Does not work on the V2 stations.
Good point! U r exactly right. I should of mentioned that. Thx 4 chiming in.
There are some Tesla v3 stations that are not NACS compatible. The v3 station in Lincoln, NE was incompatible until recently. The Limon, CO v3 station is not yet NACS compatible. There might be others.
@@larryhendren9111 Very good point also. I believe they are ultimately compatible, just Tesla hasn't opened up all V3 sites. Perhaps this is one of the busier ones?
GM has issued a press release that if there is damage to the vehicle because of the use of a non-GM adapter, the damage will not be covered by the warranty.
Until the GM adapters become widely available it will be difficult to say you were not using a third party adapter.
True. Similarly, if the charging equipment is damaged as the result of a 3-rd party adapter in use, the customer can be held liable.
@@thenetworkarchitectchannel I knew that several of the other charging networks had said that use of third party adapters were “not permitted” but was unaware Tesla had joined them.
The odds of a faulty adapter damaging the car or the charging equipment is small and would be difficult to conclusively prove, but the potential of turning your $$$ EV into an almost worthless brick, or facing Tesla who has an army of attorneys on staff when you pay by the hour, should be carefully evaluated. (I will wait for the approved adapter, but YMMV.)
I ended up getting the A2Z adapter and worked like a charm on our Rivian R1S. Also heard that Lectron was not shipping the adapters in time and this issue just compounds more problems so I'll stay away from Lectron.
I'm hoping we'll all be civil to each other when charging at Tesla superchargers as we figure this out.
It seems like Tesla is also working on a NACS extension cable for EVs having their charge ports unconventional to Tesla port locations which I plan to get when available.
In my Volvo, the charge port is in the same location as Teslas, so I’ll blend right in. The Cadillac will likely use SC as a second option and EVgo primary. I guess we will see. Thx 4 watching
th-cam.com/video/Twd3uMP9KFQ/w-d-xo.html more information on CCS to NACS adapters
I'm eager to see how many Tesla drivers add a CCS1 adapter to their frunk as the chaos starts hitting busier Superchargers. Short cables, non-standard ports, and an influx of EVs with charge curves not optimized for Tesla's system is certainly going to be messy at select locations. An adapter the other way will give Tesla owners a way to escape that chaos and use lesser known CCS chargers nearby, even if they're lower power or unfamiliar territory. Let the Adapter Games begin! 👀
Me too. I am trusting the better angles of our nature will prevail. You make a valid point about folks fleeing the SC network. If I am a ride share driver in a Polestar 2 or a Bolt, I would likely sign up for SC membership to get discounted rates and than sit on them in-between fares. Rideshare-gate? Rideshare-pocalypses? Not quite sure what to call it. Anyway, those 62.5 kW CPE250s across the way will start to look pretty good vs a queue at at SC.
The Chevrolet app says that my Bolt is plug and charge capable, but it has not yet worked at the few supposedly supported chargers I have used.
Unfortunately, the short cables on current Tesla dispensers do not reach most CCS cars making them park sideways or in the wrong parking position. Would be nice if Tesla would publish a list of cars scheduled to receive access to their SUC network and when. We travel to a location several times a year that is a CCS charging desert but has 3 Tesla SUC stations. Access to the Tesla SuC network for our Audi etron would be greatly appreciated.
Tesla has an extension cable in the works for current CCS-1 cars with the charge port in a poor position. Also, I am seeing many newer SC stations laid out with stalls to accommodate non-Teslas. Hopefully it wont be too much of an issue.
Tesla has four different charger versions appropriately called V1, V2, V3 and V4. The V1 and V2 are lower power and cannot be configured by software to accommodate non-Teslas. The V3 and the newer V4 can be and the V4 is supposed to have a longer charging chord to accommodate different vehicle charge port locations.
Tesla may eventually make more money selling power to EVs than they do selling cars. They are using their expertise in solar panels, stationary battery storage and building low cost charging stations to buy or store power in off peak low cost times and selling it a peak rates. Their profit margins on cars may have temporarily suffered, but long term they may become the Exxon/Mobil of the electric age.
I’ve always been about all cars being able to use all chargers. I imported a Korean CCS1 adapter for my Tesla the moment it became possible and did my own CCS ECU retrofit with parts I had to drive to a service center two states away to get.
So I guess I’m saying, I totally understand your excitement with getting access to more fast chargers 😂
Oops.....you just lost your car warranty since you used an unapproved adapter to charge on a Tesla Supercharger !!
Tesla was required to open it's network to non-Tesla's if it wanted some of the money from the Inflation Reduction Act
Yeah, for sure part of their thoughts. Thx for watching.
5:30 I've heard a number of people report that Ultium EVs do not use ISO 15118; however, that is is not correct. I'm not sure how the rumor got started, but it might be that they are confusing some combination of information from the Chevy Bolt EV (its charging system was designed prior to ISO 15118's adoption) and EVgo (they chose to use non-ISO 15118 methods for activating "Autocharge" through their system). Essentially, it's possible to use both MAC-based authentication and ISO 15118 in the same platform in order to implement plug and charge functionality.
Thx for adding some color here. I did not know it was capable.
@@thenetworkarchitectchannel You're welcome. The more I think about it, I'm guessing people are assuming that because GM hasn't yet enabled plug and charge using ISO 15118 that the vehicles don't have it, but they do. ISO 15118 is required for V2H and bidirectional charging, so we know for sure Ultium has it.
EVgo is GM's primary charging partner, so they wouldn't need to use it for that, but I'm not sure why they haven't activated plug and charge for EA. It's possible that Ultium vehicles do have plug and charge on the Superchargers; we just know that the Bolt EV won't have it.
Have you tried telling your Tesla app you have a non tesla, a Ford Mach e and using it to charge your Lyriq by enabling it in the Tesla app, bypassing plug and charge requirement?
No not yet. I intend to though, but I suspect the Volvo & GM announcements will be soon
Others have tried this and it doesn't work.
@billjohnson3344 Correct. Unless Tesla has approved it on their side, it won't work. Tesla is not EA or EVgo or ChagePoint or any other manufacturer or provider. They have the largest, most reliable charging network for a reason. They know what they are doing.
I went with the lectron Will check it out on a Tesla charger. State of charge and others say there lectron locks
Yes, SoC vid confirmed it was working. CrazyPostman seemed to have gotten one from a manufacturing run where the locking clip was inserted backwards. Just check yours when you get it b4 using. Thx 4 watching.