Top 5 Best Scout Rush Civilizations | Aoe2
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 29 ก.ค. 2024
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Music in this video: • nothing really matters...
00:00 - 00:38 Intro
00:38 - 02:23 5
02:23 - 03:49 4
03:49 - 05:21 3
05:21 - 06:33 2
06:33 - 09:36 Honorable Mentions
09:36 - 11:07 1
11:07 - Final Talk & Outro
Edits by K1
/ @k1aoe - เกม
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Huns Probably deserved an honorable mention. I prefer all top 5 civs over them for sc rushes these days, simply because no houses forces u to wall more, and the faster stables are nice but not enough to win u fights consistently imo
After u said no one would guess N1, I thought u'd put Saracens there. If done correctly, it seems even slightly OP.
I disagree on Chinese because your reasoning does not support what you said earlier about talking about the first 3-5 scouts. The same would apply to the Turks because you would not be taking the armor bonus until 7+ scouts. I do agree the two villagers would work like the mongols in regard to having scouts on the field faster, I just don't see matches where casters say "omg, the Chinese player hit feudal so fast he will scout rush before the walls are up.
@AlHasan Sameh I cannot see Chinese being better than Mongols in regard to making and attacking with 3-5 scouts. Mongols will be up to Feudal faster and have scouts to the enemy base faster to disrupt wall building. If Mongols are up 1 minute faster, they can have two scouts on the field before Chinese hit Feudal. This is too great of an advantage if you are only counting the first 3-5 scouts. The Chinese are too hinder by their eco penalties to jump to Feudal quickly. Now in a protracted battle in Feudal, give me Chinese all day.
If it was for EW I would have gone with Bengalis and Poles.
Hi Hera! I think some unusual civs have strong eco bonuses and can perform decent scout rushes with a surprise factor too. Britons (sheep), malay (extra vils), ethiopians (extra food), for example. At my level it sometimes work 11
I was expecting aztec at #1, they got amazing eco bonus which kicks in right in dark age
Don't forget they also train faster!!
LOL amazing
Yeah,you just have to convert the stable, then you can pump Xolotols like no tomorrow. Tho in castle age.
For scout rush it didnt work bc they dont have scouts
Hera SLEEPING on Hindustani scouts dealing 66% more damage to palisade walls, means that they remain a threat even if your opponent is full walled, not to mention that they burn through houses, dealing 8 damage a hit in feudal age
actuallyt ur so right about that. Crazy bonus, lost a game to it today. Hindustani quite solid overall especially with that
Didnt even cross my mind
That bonus applies to Light Cav, not scouts; think Mongol HP bonus.
My favorite ew scout rush civ is Sicilians that damage reduction is huge against early spears.
@@luciangrand1943 scouts are considered a light cavalry unit, the bonus does apply
Khmer, the only civilization who has worked out what houses are actually used for
In hindsight, I understand the Chinese pick. This isn’t a strongest scout rush list but rather a ‘which civ is at their strongest one by going scouts in feudal’ list. As always, thanks for the vid!
Agree. It's like the top 5 civs you SHOULD scout rush with for overall value
Tatoh did mention that Chinese can open with scouts or archers, but not drush.
Scout rush really sets up China to transition wherever.
Not a fan of the sicilians but they should've at least had a mention
With the nerf not as much
not after the nerf. Still a good civ but way below top 5 sc rush civs
I love the ldyllic little towns for each of these videos.
what about lithuanians? the 150 food helps a lot for fast scouts with eco upgrades
That was my prediction for sleeper #1 pick.
@@thegoldengunman yeah I was thinking them and Turks since he said it would be someone that no one would predict
Huns be like: "Am I a joke to you?"
I'd expect the list to be almost entirely different it it regarded Post Imperial Hussar spamming.
Huns&Berbers not even in honourable mentions
@@faultier3215 Huns don’t have an eco bonus other than no housing. Berber’s discount doesn’t hit until castle age.
@@martytu20 I figured the no houses + 20% faster Stables would amount to something.
@@dennisjonker4804 well you do lose some wood and no houses makes it harder to wall up behind
For me its surprising, that you didnt even mention the Lithuanians. I would have put them in top 3. They do the same like mongols, but have to seed farms later, so they are the better Mongols for me!
2 less LOS. and they don't tech into 30% HP light calv Mongols main comp consists of light calv Light calv + lancers can even beat pikes without any range support on the rare occasion ur playing mongols and have no archery range in early castle.
@@michaeldunn8972 I think light cav are rarely seen, even with mongols more hp and the video is about scout rushing. The only thing, what is better for mongols in my opinion is the greater LOS on the scouts, but I would prefer Lithuanians slightly better eco over that vision.
loving these videos, learning a lot
I love these videos. It's very useful to undersand which civs are better for dark age / feudal /castle...
Damn, no Tatars as honorable mention at least? They get a lot of food early and they have one of the best hussars lategame, so even investing in upgrades can be worth it. Cav upgrades help with Keshiks and bloodlines helps with their horse archers.
Was expecting Teutons as number one seeing as they're the only civ to still get scouts in the Imperial age smh
Crazy to think that without the khmer, none of us would be living inside a house today. Makes you appreciate history all the more!
You forgot to mention that the Hindustanis have a bonus against buildings, making it easier to break walls, if you end up walled out.
for me it's the Slavs, spamming stables without needing houses and faster farmers is huge
Nice video Hera. Chinese was a super unique number 1 since i never noticed anything special with the Chinese Scout Rush. But maybe it's better than what it seems. No honourable mentions for Huns, Sicilians, Lithuanians and my favourite Bulgarians made my slightly sadge 😬
Vikings maybe honorable mention. Wheel Barrel instant and decent transition to late games. Not the best not the worst. My three picks for your 1st pick were, Britons, Mongols, and Chinese. I choose three because I knew it would be a weird one and get it wrong. Nice video thank you
Really interesting video!!! Chinese are really surprising but make sense. You talked about a fast Mongol scout rush. Could you make a build order tutorial for that?
For 18 pop just send 2 vils to wood instead of normal 3, you dont even need to lure deer, the hunt bonus and the boars are enough to pull that of
For 17 pop up you need to lure and balance the vils a bit more in order to get enough wood for rax and stable but still pretty straight forward
Before watching the video I'm going to predict the civs Hera will mention:
Magyars. Mongols. Franks. Turks. Tatars.
See you in 12 minutes when I'm done watching.
Edit: Well damn I would have never guessed Chinese as n°1. I did think Tatars was a little bit of a stretch but the extra hunting food can give you a cheaper scout rush even if its not faster like the mongols'. I did land magyars, mongols, franks and technically turks (albeit honorably so) so I'm happy with my prediction even if it wasn't a 100%. If Hera reads this i would appreciate his opinion on tatar Scout Rush. Thanks!
Agreed, been having pretty good success with the Tatars scout rush lately. They're one of my favorite civs. The extra food bonus is very nice and it feels like they can counter almost everything in later stages.
tatar scout rush is amazing, especially into CA or xbow transition. Its just pretty generic, the extra food sounds better than it is, cuz collection rate on sheep isnt amazing
@@HeraAgeofEmpires2 Thank you for your answer!
An interesting video would be how to defend against a scout rush!
these videos are awesome hera, your an ultra chad
I thought that Magyares and franks would be the ones for the top 1 and 2 scout rush. But you are right. I usually find myself having problems with the transition from magyar SR to the castle age. Especially in team games where even thought the rush might Hurt them, is not a game ender.
Teutons are underrated in the scoutrush departement. Their literal Scoutrush is great. The Farmtransition is SO easy. you get to 18 farms so quick and you can afford anything else you want. the problem is how they fall off the cliff in Castle Age whent he scouts dont upgrade.
except they cant catch anything.....
@@booradley6832 In feudal age nobody has husbandry, so Teuton scouts are as fast as any others besides Cumans.
@@booradley6832 husbandry is a castle age tech so it doesn't make a difference in fuedal
Before watching #1: I'd guess Malay number 1. Especially with it being said to be a surprise. I like playing the 19 or 20 pop scout rush with them and it works out to something like a 16 or 17 pop rush of others plus extra eco. There's a nice build order online with that super quick rush and then cheap elephants and skirms behind it. Got to 1400 1v1 elo with that (now back to 1280ish).
EDIT: Wasn't Malay. I guess I get where Hera's coming from even with the defensive angle, like match the faster civs and you're ahead. But then I'd say the early scout rush if for a vill pick or two. Getting the tempo and pushing opponent's base rather than defending. Either way, interesting pick.
What about pole? Fantastic eco and + 1 against archers.
solid but a bit too slow cuz it takes time for eco to kick in
I would think lith should get an hon mention. they can do a similar uptime as mongol and their spears help them against incoming scout rush.
When going scouts with chinese, is it better to go 22pop+loom up or 21? I can manage it with 21 but i can't put more then 2 on berries and then have to transition a lot to wood for walling and early feudal.
Playing chinese really makes you appreciate the little dark age efficiencies you miss with other civs. Lure deer under the tc, not close to :)
The one that can work only because no one ever expects it is Goth scouts into knights. And just when they've committed to pikes, you go castle into husks. Always fun. Works well at 1k elo, probably wouldn't work much higher.
ty!
Kinda expected to see poles on the list somewhere.
Their farms are insane, but I guess on 1v1 arabia they are a vulnerability.
I've been playing the poles more often, and I feel like their eco bonuses are S tier, between the gold when mining stone, and the folwark, you can very quickly jump up an age by just slamming down some farms, I've caught a lot of players off guard with this, doing a semi-fast castle into knights+castle drop can be oppressive, but I'd say it's stronger on closed maps than open maps (which the stats seem to agree with, as poles are S tier on arena)
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I personally prefer sicilians and saracens in the top 5 primarily because sicilians can relocate wood villagers early since they know that once farms are up they won't be renewed for a while but mostly because their scouts fully upgraded stompe spears unless spears are fully upgradee, which is an investment that ppl don't ever do in spears.
Seracens however, they have more food to work with than any other civ mentioned above if they are willing to sell the stone. In fact double bit axe wood selling to gold then to food collection rate, and the 200 stone and discounted market. Seracen pull ahead in food by a LANDSLIDE
I have to admit though the complexity of the build might be a downside tuough
I guessed! I was thinking between Teutons and Chinesse.
Hi Hera, excellent video! At the moment I agree with Khmer, Franks , Magyars and Mongols . As mentioned by people in the chat, your argument for Chinese is compelling but isnt the tierlist about which civs pose the most threat with their initial scouts? Chinese might be one of the best civs to defend an enemy scout rush with scouts, walls, spears etc but if I am facing Chinese I probably am not that scared of their initial scouts (compared to say Mongols) and can wall slightly late, play a bit greedy...I don't know if this makes sense.
With Gurjaras, would a Camel rush (i.e. make more camel scouts instead of horse scouts) be more powerful than a classic scout rush?
camel scouts
- die a lot faster to tc- or archer- or even skirm-arrows
- do only 3 instead of 4 damage to vils, which makes it almost impossible to get vil kills
- are a lot more expensive, especially since you need an early mining camp
+ are a lot more resistant to spears, but you would still never want to take a fight
+ can hard-counter scout rush
My guess is Turks, I am at 2:17 of the video. The reason Turks is the +1 pierce armor. This helps against everything except infantry, and you can choose those fights. Also if a weak village is headed towards the TC you can jump in for the snipe. 2nd is Sicilians, still 5 less points of damage from spearmen, then Magyars attack bonus helps with villager kills and 15% cheaper and then French.
Yeah I was thinking Turks might be a possibility but he made it sound so crazy so I started thinking Teutons? Burmese? lol
I quite like teutons cuz they can easily place those farms to boom and make a lot of scouts but i can see that they dont have an eco bonus to push fast with their scouts
Archers. Just add archers.
No Huns?
Having only seen to #4 I'm gonna guess Chinese as Hera's #1. I wouldn't have guessed this without the statement that people wouldn't guess it, but their farm bonus is a similar bonus to the reason scouts are good for Khmer and their eco overall is kinda unmatched with the bonus vils and cheaper techs so I feel like scouts allow them to utillize that crazy eco. Plus this results in them being able to transition into any of their options later, not just scouts into knights. Could be completely wrong though.
Edit: Yoooooo let's go
Good video
Nice. Wasn't expecting Chinese. 👌
What about teutons ? There farming bonus and wood savings helps everytime
My strat in 11**. Is lituanians early scout Rush hit and run + 4or5 skirm (optional). No gold at first. Early Castle: kt spam
Turks is the first civ I won against extreme CD AI. Very smooth scout rush and free upgrade to light cav. One of the best civ to cheese CD AI.
I'm guessing turks for the extra pierce armor and free upgrade in castle age, keeping scouts relevant for a bit longer and enabling them to pick off an archer response. But that seems obvious so is probably not it.
While not economical, bulgarians benefit from faster research, by the time they are arriving they will have armor/attack and midway through their attack you will have some really buff scouts, if your enemy commits the huge mistake of fighting with vills (when there are tons of vills and surround the scouts) he will get a crippling surprise
Hera casually uploading to yt while playing a showmatch against vinch - what a chad
What about Huns and their fast working stables?
there was this teuton tactic that, while going feudal, you send 5 vills to gold (no mining camp) just to get bloodlines and start with 2 stables and cheap farms.
it was one of those secret '20 knights in 20 minutes' kind of tactic that nobody expected back then
My guesses were Chinese, Cuman, Poles, Gurjaras. Possibly Japanese for some strange reason, lots of wood savings and killer spears.
Where's Sicilians you frkn noob? xD haha I'm kidding throwback to by hater days but you've been consistently the best aoe2 content creator over the past 6 months
Can anyone explain how extended feudal scout all-ins naturally develop, and if I can force it
It's very tough to do thus but the main way to pull it off at low level is attack so much that they just can't go to next age (didn't make 2 building, or no market or cant get to gold). Or if they clicked next age your resources are so ahead that they have like all there eco inside the tc. Overall, I wouldn't recommend it since it's freaking risky. Even hera lost games where he though the opponent didn't click but then suddenly was castle age and then its gg. Few knights pretty much clean your whole feudal army
@@herotalib9556 yaaa, i remember trying cumans feudal all in with rams and everything, and if your a little late with pressure and your opponent clicked castle, some camels is all it takes, thanks for response
btw is all in feudal scouts a meme, or is it an actual strategy that is worth it to learn as an average elo player?
Depends on the map and how open your opponent's base is. If they're full walled or can get there easily enough then don't do it.
Since it's a weird guess, i'm going to say sicilians. Personally I don't think they are number one but hey, i'm going for it just in case lol
idk but i was really expecting Poles to be number 1 with the early folwark insta-food.
Guess No 1. Aztecs 11
what about the mayans ? okay they dont get scouts but eagle warriors are produced from barracks, so no need to build extra building saves wood
my guesses:
5: Saw it in Video
4: Huns
3:Lithuanians or Mongols
2:Magyars
1: Franks
my for #1 was Slavs or Tatars
Berbers could be in the honourable mentions, because of their eco bonus. Not great, not terrible.
I would have guessed Mongols or Magyars but since no one will guess I would say Cumans.
No Cumans? :O Very cheap stables + fastest moving scouts!
Can chase down any damaged unit and pick it off including scouts, and can run away safely to avoid a bad fight. Really good! No?
you really need to be doing a feudal tc or early siege workshop if you are playing cumans, 5% faster move speed is nice but nothing crazy
Discord link?
My guess was 100% the mongols
Yup yup. Super solid. Haven’t even watched the video yet.
I am not sure about the Chinese. I understand your logic but you said you were going to rank the civs based on the first 3-5 scouts. The advantage of Chinese is that they build up their advantage later. I am not questioning your reasoning, but there is a contraddiction with the definition that you gave for your ranking.
Is mongols a good onetrick for 1v1 AND teamgames?
Yup. Super strong civ
It depends... as a flank you need to do damage and get ahead in early feudal, or you will be behind against an S/A-Tier archer Civ very fast.
As a pkt you need to get ahead before mid imp - and thats difficult because you dont have any castle age bonuses- because its way easier for the opponent to upgrade Knights up to Paladin then its is to get Elite Mangudai rolling for Mongols. In that case, I recommend going for a little faster imp into Hussar spam and raid the other pkt then trying to go to mangudai directly.
Thanks guys, I like mangudai and hussar. What are similar civs to mongols that might be good?
@@johnzenc1984 Berbers, Magyars, Tatars, Turks, if you like a Cav Archer Unit + Hussar combination
@@johnzenc1984 Cumans aswell
Not gonna lie, I was expecting poles to make the list with the food boost
The problem with chineses is that everyone tries to lame you, so scouts might not come as fast.
Britton is my guess for number 1.
One time in a 2v2 my friend and I got killed by the biggest scout rush I've ever seen... from Teutons
Slav, Hun, Bulgar, Lithuania and Poles should be in honorable mention ;)
guesses before watching:
1.mongols
2.magyars
3.khmer (for me they are 1.)
4.franks
further considerations: lithuanians, hindustanis, cumans, japanese, maybe vietnamese, celts, britons
if noone guesses no1, id say you consider chinese
ha nice
No. 1 Mongols cause hunt bonus op if you bring in 5 boar
Huns #1 guess
My guess is Mongols
Before watching the video until the end, I think you'll pick the Chinese, sounds crazy but Chinese is the only civilization in the game that can go scout versus any civilization be completely fine and pull ahead. Just a guess.
11
oh man I really though mongols would win this thing. interesting list as always.
don’t tell me your #1 pick is the Aztecs due to their faster producing Eagle Scouts??
Guessing Franks is #1
No joke, I expected Chinese or Huns to be number one, especially after seeing Franks and Magyars discussed out of the way early.
No Cumans? They feel strong on scout rushes
no Lituanians and Sicilians?
Would love to see Spirit of the Law make the low-mid ELO version of this!
My guess for n 1 is Vietnamese (before seeing it)
THOUGHT IT WAS teutons cuz of cheap farms
My guess is malay for the uptime.
teutons!!!
Wat about Portuguese and the 6 seconds they save on loom!!!!!!
I'm putting my money down on Byzantines #1
My guess was Mongols.
Cumans also are good….
LIthuanians! Iwas going to say Magyars but then they were number 4 instead of 1. So I say Lithuanians!
as per your reason, chinese are a top scout/knight/archer opening.
I would guess the top 5 archer rush civs will be tartars, Vietnamese, Chinese, Ethiopians, and Mayans😏
I guessed Huns as no 1
My guess is Gurjaras
Number one civ, I guess should be either Mongols or magyars
Mayans?