It's deep! I like this topic. I think it matches the article I read before in certain aspects which is about researchers say people can have different personalities in each language. tbh, I do feel like I have a different way of logical thinking and my personality is slightly different while speaking English. Thanks Susie! Looking forward to more about this.
This is so interesting because I've definitely noticed how direct and specific I can be in Chinese and how many times I've heard my friends say "yes... I get it"
Language definitely plays a role in thinking. Sometimes it is easy and natural to express something by one language but hard by another. But we usually ignore the similarities between two cultures.
That really opens my mind. I’m a native Cantonese speaker and I lived in the UK for sometime. Since I’ve been back and forth these places that speaks different languages, it does take a while to get used to every time. I never thought about these culture differences, and how this is making one person understands the speaker differently, and what expectation of an audience may have. Inspiring.
When comparing different language, I found that we are focusing on different things and values. Since we use different logic and structure when making a sentence in different language, the item we want to emphasize are also different. That might be not only a linguistic different but a cultural different.
As a Chinese immigrated to Canada years ago, I find this topic is both fascinating and extremely practical in real life. Thank you Susie to bring it up! The benefits of clear and direct communications really shines in team work environments, scientific research and engineering. The use of Western language could be a part of the attribution to those areas as well. I am curious to know about the difference between poetries of Western Vs Eastern - do they behave the same as everyday languages? Are Western poetries more direct as well?
I regret I do not know enough about western poetries but have a feeling that they are much more direct. Many of those from the east are really subtle and demand extensive background on literature.
I share the same background as you, and in my opinion, western poem gives a more focus view to one subject(a portrait of something or a feeling) in the poem while eastern poem is a collective of hidden meanings. Also, if you read the English poem out loud, it is rather easy to sing it.
I totally agree your statement about what's different between Eastern and Western people's thinking. How to think a thing influences on distinct background. 孔子's thinking affected our thousands of years(not only China or the area speaking Chinese but most of eastern countries). When we were children, We were always taught older men, teachers, and bosses in your company weren't QUESTIONABLE. This is the reason why we are hard to present our ideas because, usually, we are not used to doing that! I think the most contradictory thing is the difficulty of Understanding and elaboration of our own ideas. When I was a child, Most of the time, my friend and I cared about what classmates thought and whether teachers would punish us if we did something "different"(as a result of school rules being really strict, such as you can't debate with your teachers, chat with classmates in class, have too long hair, or have dirty shoes because we are only limited to wear "white" shoes). It's a great video to elaborate on such a difficult topic. I think I can find someone to support my opinions as below comment!
Would love to watch more videos on this topic. Comparing the difference between Chinese, the only widely used logogram in the world, and other western languages, which are all phonograms. Also a fun topic is, what onomatopoeia is like in different languages? i.e. in English dogs go 'woof' while in Chinese dogs go '汪 waˋng'. I think it's because dogs' breeds vary in different part of the world.
Agree. English, especially in written form puts a lot of emphasis on structure and logic. Chinese writing is an art form which coveys a picture and relationship.
I’ve been living in UK and Ireland for 15 years now. I feel reading English articles is easier as there’s less information density, more logical with specific connecting phrases/wording.
I agree with that. When I tried studying a new skill on Coursera, I was surprised that I just understood it more than in Chinese, although Chinese is my mother tongue. I thought probably when people use English to explain something they will narrate it in a logical way.
Your insight about English and Chinese language is intriguing. As a Canadian Taiwanese, I was trained in college to write/speak as clear as possible to readers/listeners. I feel the reason of having ambiguity or vagueness in conversation could be the insufficient knowledge of writers or readers themselves. Most of elder Taiwanese, including my parents, did not have a opportunity to go to college. Sometimes it's hard for them to express their thoughts in an articulate fashion, I would have to reconstruct their sentences and maybe re-express for them in our conversation to confirm if it's what they meant. Thank you for bringing me a new perspective about my cultural background. great works.
learning math in English is much easier for me than in Chinese. yeah, the English textbook is much in details whereas the chinese textbooks are more of skipping-steps. the topic is very interesting. thank you! I have been actually thinking about this topic for a long time. the linguistic logic definitely impacts the speakings way of thinking as well as the depth of thinking.
These 11 minutes are well spent. So rich and practical. Very happy to see Susie is bringing this deep and thoughtful topic to the channel occasionally. You really can feel how elegant, intelligent and well educated Susie is. And what an enjoyment is that I’m listening to a young beautiful woman perfectly explaining something supposedly boring in a clear, logical and fun way. I’m in love~~
中文在寫作時會更注重微言大義，可以簡單理解為盡可能刪減不必要的部分，我認為是受到古代文言文的影響(當然可能有更多原因)，古代甚至還有專門來解釋各種文言文的注本；但是在現代中文口語上，普遍也盡量都是解釋得越詳細越好，所以可能會有一個特徵是，書本寫得較為精煉、精簡，但是實際口語教學或討論時，才會詳細的表達出來。這是我自己的感受，我認為書本也是寫得越詳細越有邏輯越好 In Chinese writing, there is a tendency to focus on the essence and "concise" expression, influenced by classical Chinese literature. In ancient times, there were even annotated versions specifically explaining various classical texts. However, in modern spoken Chinese, there is a general preference for detailed interpretations. As a result, written texts may be more concise, but in everyday conversations or oral discussions, people tend to express themselves in a more detailed manner. This is my personal observation, and I believe that detailed and logically organized writing is better in textbooks for the benefit of all.
Recently, I am reading some article about Buddhism. Actually, English version is easier than Chinese version for understanding. I was trapped in the language jungle of Chinese. Thanks for this video.
I’ve got so impressed after watching this video! 不僅僅是英文的解構，甚至觸碰到一些哲學的層次！我在自學英文的過程中也常常思考關於「思想與語言」的交互關係，不過我不是專家，只是自發性的有這個想法，這個影片進一步開啟我對這個議題的探索，可惜我對其他語言的了解跟掌握不像Susie這麽優秀😅，我想說的是我很喜歡妳的影片，不單單只有教英文，還多了一些可以思考的東西。最後，我大學念微積分的時候，因為常常翹課，所以只能在考前自己讀課本學習，然後我們使用原文書，所以當時查單字查得很辛苦，常常花了半個小時查完一頁單字之後發現這一頁只是引言⋯但是，透過英文來學數學，真的勝過以前讀中文參考書的說明！我當時的感想是，高等數學果然是西方發展出來的學問，用英文學才是正解👍🏾
Hitting a nail on the head. Fabulous observation and study, never thought the Chinese culture and way of thinking is still influencing me so much, especially at the UK work setting and hence the frustration at times. Brilliant and thank you.
@@Hope-ck6hy 英文跟中文一樣，是形容詞-名詞結構，所以原則上英文的名詞也是放前面的，如歐盟英文是European Union，可見其形容詞European是前置的，當然也有Union of Europe 這種用法，但是日常生活還是前者較多，像拉丁語族的語言則是名詞-形容詞結構，如法文的歐盟就叫Union européenne
相对于日语来说，中文和英语已经非常类似了，语序也非常类似，一般也都以主语开头。而日语不仅动词后置，而且肯定和否定放在句末，在对方说完一句话前，你是完全不知所云的。而且日语中大量省略主语和宾语，最典型的就是“我爱你，I love you”，而在日语中只有一个动词“愛してる“，因为日本人觉得：我讲”爱“的时候，除了对你表达，还会有什么意思呢？所以统统省掉，刚开始学日语的时候很不习惯，总觉得日本人讲话不完整，很容易引起误解
你在分析不同的地方文化，可以有效地反映當今世界各地的問題，我自己有多種語言的教養，我完全同意你的看法 You are fantastically analyzing the different cultures, that could effectively reflect the problem around the world these days, I myself had the multi-lingual upbringing and I totally agree with you
Agreed with the comments that sometime it is easier to read and understood the English article. But quite often, it is OTT. speaking from the 12 years experience of living in the UK as a Taiwanese.
hi Susie, many thanks for bringing up this topic as well as sharing your reads and thoughts! I was reading this book 'The culture map', it discussed this topic in the low-context vs. high-context scenario with exploring the historical background of western and eastern countries. I myself found the points very reasonable.
I have the similar feeling when I learn programming. The logic and chapters in English books/articles usually make me feel they are well-organized. While reading Chinese version, they are more likely a fraction of notes, but the connection of notes are loose.
I cannot agree more with your ideas. The only change I've done to make my Master essays improved from merely pass to 70+ is to clearly and bluntly explain my thinking process and create sort of a logical flow to guide the reader (the marker obviously).
Love this topic. As an Asian, it's really hard to imagine how western people think. But everytime I watch your video, I get to know more about western culture. If you were my teacher, I think I would be able to learn anything 😆
I started to watch your videos recently. I like your British accent, first of all, and love the topics you picked up. They answered some of my questions when I was in the UK. Thank you very much. Keep on good work!
@2:25 You’ve mentioned some Taiwanese think English textbooks are easy to understand the Chinese textbooks. I personally find English textbooks are much easier to understand and clear, particularly most abstract subjects such as math, science and music theory, etc… love to see you to make some example of those differences that it’s based on language differences.
I come from a society that is multi-cultural. Certain differences that I've observed from my fellow countrymen may be rude if I were to spell them out here. However, if there's a more private way of communication, I don't mind sharing. The objective is not to stereotype certain groups of people but we somehow could predict certain behavior of certain groups of people based on their ethnic, cultural, religious background.
Your point of "object focus vs context focus"/analysis vs holism , is quite interest. For my point of view, the different of thinking pattern between Eastern and Western are mostly likely caused by the different of culture development .
Thanks for such a brilliant review and sharing of ideas! This kind of logic or cognitive difference can also be seen perhaps in arts. E.g., In Chinese ink painting, you can often see empty space, that is usually understood or interpreted as solid space or imagined to be things like cloud or mist. It is implied and implicit.
very inspiring Susie! Could you make a video about self-deprecating humor and more importantly how people should properly respond to it? cuz my boss loves joking on himself, and I don't know what people in the West usually say to it. Stay safe and have fun in your bike trip!
Very impressive knowledge and study about 2 different culture and literature. To me, as a Hong Konger living in UK, I feel Brits are easy to chic chat with , but very difficult to turn into deep friendship. For literature, I am mixed in English school (95% English dominant environment) and Cantonese+Traditional Chinese Society and community for the rest of time. As a result, we are very simple and direct in expressing ourselves. In this point, we do not communicate and express ideas in the way that you regarding Chinese or Asian to be. However, we are less” Self-centred” or “Self” emphasis which is matching your study. 😂😂😂 I think that is a complicated issue as there are many influential factors including different cities, different education level, diversity of society, international exposure and so on , can shape the people there in a very different way.
Agree. I don't think it's purely a straightforward Western vs Eastern, especially now where people move a lot or have different cultural influences. It's more to do with the language, I think i.e., Germanic or Sanskrit, written or oral origin. With Germanic or written, it's more critical for the communication to be direct because the reader has no opportunity to seek clarification. Hence, the communicator needs to ensure the message is conveyed precisely. For languages originating orally, the listener has opportunities to interact with the communicator so the latter has no critical need to be clear. Moreover, the communicator would want to generate interest and interaction, so being vague or poetic would be more effective in garnering an audience.
就在今天，我的孩子对我说：Daddy, give me some water。我说，宝宝你应该说：Daddy, I need some water 或者说 I want to drink some water。一个真实的例子就发生今天下午，晚上又恰好看到你的视频！你的视频对我很有启发，让我更好地理解了英文的表达特征。谢谢！👍
2:26 I am a Taiwanese as well, and I also feel like Reading English is really easier than Chinese, especially when studying math or physics. I hate to guess Chinese meaning if I see something new, usually Chinese translation doesn't make any sense. I don't mean that which language is better than another, but I really feel like I truely understand the math after learning again in Khan online courses, of course in totally English.
Obviously you are more focus on English then Chinese. English could be classified for engineering, financing, Medic and so on. I'm Chinese, I couldn't explain to my daughter in chinese about the science because I learn that from English. My engineer friend always come to ask me about the meaning of the financial reports. Eg. Yield and returns. Sometime I wonder they purposely create the words to make themselves different or make it difficult so that look elegance or higher level or simply sound better... Lol
The issue IMO is Chinese writers ceased to invent new words, that's how to achieve precise definitions. Poets or literary authorities used to make new words to describe new things that become the standard for all to follow thereafter. The Chinese language, however, lost any literary authorities willing to develop it any further, esp ever since the 54 movement. The ensuing revolution even actively disintegrated the logic of the writing system. It is a castrated language devoid of spirit for growth. It is now limited to being utilitarian, and even then, the Chinese have a hard time keeping up with the quality and quantity of translations necessary for the ever-growing technical fields: without being precise, the sheer volume of specific concepts with similar words just make the whole thing a mess. IMO, this is due to the translators' lack the chops in their understanding of Chinese linguistic logic, and their lack of authority to be creative and inventive.
Personally, i feel Chinese writing resembles Chinese art, i.e. calligraphy, painting... etc, where the outline, or impression, or atmosphere, is more important than the content. It coincides with modern day art critics like Susan Sontag quoting Willem de Kooning "content is a glimpse,..... it's minimal, minimal".
So deep thoughts and much more analyzing on this topic make it worth to consider and repeatedly read your words. Thanks for your inspiration and profound point of view. I really love it!
Hi, Susie, your observation and thinking are in-depth. This topic is interesting. It involves a lot of factors such as religion, philosophy diversely practiced, history, culture, social type... But I think in thesis writing, western way of thinking and writing is considered more standard, as modern science originated in the west.
Having learned French before, I believe that language is even more "logical" than English as it uses more articles, conjunctions, and prepositions to describe relationship among words.
I absolutely agree with you. When my ELA teachers talk about stating topic sentence or reiterating key words throughout the paragraph in an essay, it gives me a sense of redundancy. Why do I need to do repetitive works when readers can get the meaning directly from the context? Now it makes much more sense. Thank you for sharing this video. Appreciation from a Chinese Canadian.
My mother language is chinese. But when I search for information, such as a new knowledge, I would prefer searching English materials. It's because most of the articles are much clearer in English, usually step by step. But in Chinese, it's usually not that straightforward. Perhaps it's because westerners love sharing more than easterners? Like my family always ask me not to tell people how much you know about anything.
Good observations! I totally agree with you that in Western communication, it is the speaker’s job to convey the message clearly. When questioned, a Chinese speaker often says “I’ve already explained earlier”, when what was “explained earlier” was several inferences away from explaining the questioned point. One more point: In Western communication, terms and concepts must be defined before they are used. This is not always the case in Chinese, see examples in many Chinese medical terms. Finally, the language used certainly affects thinking: “the limits of my language means the limits of my world”, “if we spoke a different language, we would perceive a somewhat different world” (Wittgenstein)
those ideas sharing video are excellent, no fancy pics, strong rhythm background music. i could feel those thoughts flow out from you to my brain. i have a feeling of gain.
I really appreciate your points here. I first encountered that when I took an international assignment to Japan. Prior to that, in all of my American education and work experience, it had always been what you described as "speaker oriented". But when I went to work in Japan, I had a lot of frustration related to that as I worked with the Japanese counterparts. One day, my then-girlfriend made it clear: the (Japanese) listeners are supposed to be well educated/informed to understand what I MEAN. If not, it's his/her fault. And the more I stress my points to make them "crystal clear", the more it is sending a "you-don't-seem-to-get-it" message to the receiver, which would be condescending... Later on, as I work-toured around the rest of "northeast Asia", including Taiwan, I found this to be soooooo true.
謝謝收看！你對此有什麼想法呢？
我觉得你说出了中文和英文的背后的文化的最精髓的区别！其实我不得不告诉你一个秘密，其实中文也可以非常精细化的表达，只是有时候更多的华人却更愿意含糊其辞，以显示其文化的高深！反而，却带来更多的误会和麻烦！
不错不错！
其實是因為你接觸的人，還是處於社會的某一個階層，倘若有機會接觸社會更高層的角色（這裡是指你跟他們有一些生意、互動）便會理解華語的精髓⋯⋯另外，影片所舉例的例子很不錯，道盡了眾多年輕學子站在本位主義角度看待世界......
It's deep! I like this topic.
I think it matches the article I read before in certain aspects which is about researchers say people can have different personalities in each language.
tbh, I do feel like I have a different way of logical thinking and my personality is slightly different while speaking English.
Thanks Susie! Looking forward to more about this.
"只可意会 不能言传". 您明白这8个字意思吗,从古到今. 语言特点,包括文字数量. 总之,中文就不是一个很精确的语言. 你说的诗意,是对的,但是带来一个问题,这种语言很难出现科学. 历史上中国大陆没有希腊那种科学,语言是一个重要因素.
非常有道理，还有一点更加深入的差异，就是：中国社会中，从小孩子们就被教育听到的话会有“言外之意”，讲话者尤其是领导人，话语不能太清晰，要语焉不详让人有领会的余地以及回旋的余地。这样环境中长大的人，习惯上就会自己也不说清楚话，在一来一回中猜测对方的想法，然后判断事情该如何处理。而这个习惯带入到科学研究中，就出现了问题，这是所有进入科研领域的国人应该注意的。
你说的太棒了 点赞👍
不只是科研领域，涉及到各种领域都会出现这样的问题，明明一两句话可以讲明白，但是思维方式偏向弯线，很多人都听不懂或者get不到重点问题。
是我本人没错了
现在想来，他们为啥不喜欢说清楚，1为防喷，2为装，3为本来自己就不是很清楚。
不敢苟同，中国人讲究一种意境美，不管是文学，绘画，或是语言，你所说的中国科研不行我就不明白了，科研真的那么牛逼吗？
太強了，結合思考性、學術性和文化方面共同探討語言這件事情，能做到這種程度的影片很難得。awesome!
yes beautifully summarized and reviewed in simple language.
在台灣，從小我們寫的作文（文章）總是被教導要寫的充滿詩意，越多隱喻，成語和引用越好，通常這樣的文章也會得比較高分，文章題目通常都很….感性，很少有批判性或者針對時事的題目。後來因為要出國，接觸到托福和雅思的寫作，才了解英文作文的架構，看了你的影片才了解，原來不是我們不會寫英文作文，而是因為思著重度點不太一樣，中文強調用詞優美，而英文強調邏輯和陳述。
要看你寫作的目的吧，不同目的有不同標準。
文體中有論說文這個類別喔！
很有趣的主題!!
最近正在看一本書叫"刪到只剩二十字"，作者是Natsuyo Nobumoto Lipschutz，一位從小生長在日本到讀完大學，後來在美國經過訓練後，連續五年得到國際演講協會（Toastmasters International）紐約地區演講大賽冠軍。她在書裡提到了"高語境"和"低語境"的事情我覺得非常有趣！"高語境"代表大部分的溝通都由非語言達成的文化，例如日本人在溝通時時常給予聽起來很模糊的回應，那些模糊就是"高語境"帶來的包袱，必須由聽者去揣測說者的意思。這本書主要是談演講、行銷、傳遞訊息的方式，所以她提醒的是藉由"低語境"，降低聽者的接收門檻。
東西方的溝通傳遞上真的很不一樣，是很有趣的主題，希望以後能再多拍影片討論這一塊!
感謝分享!!
这个视频对于我来说非常有价值。它让我忽然意识到我在美国留学的时候写论文时所遇到的表达问题。这不是语法这样的低级问题，也不是使用了冗长的从句（但是用中式思维写作很容易犯的问题）所导致的长难句。而是在表达的逻辑上自己作为中国人读起来合乎逻辑却又和英文其他参考文献完全不同的一种写法。直到毕业我都没能总结出问题所在。现在看下来似乎和东西方思考方式的差异有关。学习到了，感谢Susie!
This is so interesting because I've definitely noticed how direct and specific I can be in Chinese and how many times I've heard my friends say "yes... I get it"
抓到野生的劉沛！
我怀疑你在开车
贊同你的觀點，東方、西方的歷史、文化的不同，對應著語言描述的差異。西方文化描述的詳細 + 清晰 + 明確 + 縝密+ 周到，而且邏輯性強【邏輯性思維本身就是西方文化的根源之一】，西方文化更有助於人類發明和發現有規律的事務，事實也如此。我本人伴隨學習英文，閱讀英文書籍和資訊，越來越喜歡英文的表達方式。舉一個例子，當我們看中文的書籍時，很多時候會遇到難懂的地方，但是我們直接看英文的描述【儘管我的英文水平不高）會覺得更容易看懂文字的意思。謝謝你的這個視頻總結了東方思維和西方思維的差異。🙏🙏🌹
是的，以前學英文作文，寫論說文，都要這樣謝Fist of all ,second, in conclusion,一條一條寫得很清楚，透徹，中式的論說文比較像是舉幾個例子，再下結論，有時候觀點由讀者自己解讀，中式的寫抒情文也很喜歡用很多的暗喻和象徵
雖然在東方文化、母語中成長，但是我在台灣經歷的教育有很多部份受到西方思維影響，我覺得生在這個時代，能夠取自己喜歡的部份發展和閱讀是很棒的事喔！
我认为，由于地域文化的不同，人的思维模式都会有或多或少的不同。据我了解，尽管思维方式有多么的不同，凡是善良的人追求和平、安逸、幸福与爱的内心深处想法是一致的。
谢谢Susie戴舒萱提出这样深刻的话题！
喜歡舒萱的頻道，總是帶來有趣的主題。以下也提出我的想法。
中文與英文的差異之一，是中文以「字」作為語言的單位，而不是「詞」。在英文裡如果突然出現一個詞，卻沒有在一個主詞、受詞的結構裡面來表達，就是奇怪的、不合乎規則的。從這個小細節就可以看到，英文有一個不斷描述的更加清楚、強調結構的傾向。
但是中文裡每個字都是獨立的，中文字更像是一個個的化學元素，可以跟其他詞彙連結而衍生新的含義。甚至字的構成也時常是仰賴於字（部首）彼此之間的連結。中文的使用者，很習慣於去看到事物之間的連結，因為中文本身就是透過不斷到組合、連結而產生的語言。這就帶出中文的特點，當使用中文做出某些表達時，不求在結構上要完整，但求它提供足夠使人可以「完成聯想」的材料，這樣就可以表達意思。
很多唐詩也幫助我們發現，在中國文學的傳統裡，中文的表達的彈性之大，可能在西方讀者都覺得表達得非常不清楚。事實上中文讀者也不是天生就懂得那些很抽象的表達，但是在慢慢成長而學習中文的過程裡，就慢慢的可以理解中文的「聯想規則」，於是就往往可以相對輕易的「體會」那些看似朦朧曖昧的中文句子要表達的含義。最極端的狀況，主詞跟受詞可以省略，甚至可以連動詞都不要，只要幾個名詞堆起來，就可以帶出某些畫面或是情感。後續我們也發現中文很少敘事傳統，但卻有開展出了有別於西方文學的抒情傳統。
台大鄭毓瑜老師寫過一本《引譬連類》，此書就正適合舒萱或對此有興趣的朋友們開卷閱讀。
另外值得一提的是，所謂「清晰」、「精確」這些用詞已經帶有某些價值判斷，從文化批評的角度，這甚至有點歐洲中心的傾象，好像歐洲是更為文明、科學、理性的，甚至是這個世界應該以誰比較清晰為基準來判斷語言的特性或高低。這樣的價值觀理應加以反思。中文從一開始強調的是以表達者為中心的意思表達出發，如何以最精簡的方式，用最少的字帶出最大的意思。
即使中文的這種追求，使得它在邏輯的表述上相對於英文顯得曖昧許多（以英文強調的結構與邏輯角度觀之），但是中文可以做到許多英文無法做到的表達；在中文的古文寫作裡其實也都很有邏輯、層次，在描述上更可以相當精確的描述各種事物的特性。這也是一個更允許彈性與創造力的語言。
Language definitely plays a role in thinking. Sometimes it is easy and natural to express something by one language but hard by another. But we usually ignore the similarities between two cultures.
That really opens my mind. I’m a native Cantonese speaker and I lived in the UK for sometime. Since I’ve been back and forth these places that speaks different languages, it does take a while to get used to every time. I never thought about these culture differences, and how this is making one person understands the speaker differently, and what expectation of an audience may have. Inspiring.
英文寫作 尤其是學術寫作時 對於邏輯要求十分嚴謹 基本就是 A-B B-C C-D 中間通過 conjunctions 去體現邏輯的關係;
然而 在中文環境中 我們的思維訓練更像是 A-B B-C的路上可以經過D E F 三個不同的點 然而B-D以後可以有G和H 兩個選擇 但這兩個中 只有G能到的了E 最後的問題是 我們要從A 出發到C 有幾種走法？
所以 當我們在這個邏輯定式下用英語和母語者無論是口頭或者書面表達 會給母語者感覺 我們在繞啊繞~
還有一個很有意思的例子 比如 “我今天早飯吃的是饅頭 我得喝點水” 這在中文裡表達的是一種因果關係 大多數中文母語者都不會覺得這樣表達有什麼問題; 但翻成英語 這個因果邏輯關係就會很confusing. 中間缺了太多 應該是 我早飯吃了饅頭 (因為饅頭是幹的 所以吃了之後我的口很幹) 所以我得喝點水. 這才符合一個嚴謹的英語邏輯 精確連貫 而這個邏輯關係若”完整”用中文表達 中文母語者會認為 這人怎麼會那麼囉嗦…😂
你這個例字每個語言都一樣,很多大家同對認知的事情就不多論述
难怪看翻译本的书经常会觉得啰嗦😂
When comparing different language, I found that we are focusing on different things and values.
Since we use different logic and structure when making a sentence in different language, the item we want to emphasize are also different.
That might be not only a linguistic different but a cultural different.
舒萱問了一個語言學的大哉問，要回答你的問題，就能寫不只一篇論文了。
但是，我觉得那个问题，主要的还是在于听者与讲题的知识差距问题。比如，如果我给一般台湾人讲大陆生活中的问题，很多人会听不懂，因为他们没有那里的生活经历；但是如果我是讲给明居正教授听，他就很理解，因为他是这方面的专家。
@@过来人 我是覺得英文對於時間、空間、任何細微的動作和情緒都會有專屬的vocabulary，但中文沒有這些東西，古文用字精簡，白話文發展也沒幾年，解釋細節相對會比較困難
同意！就是差不多這個意思，
英文要怎麼講？big project?
@@zz-gq2tj 大計畫 大圖像不就是宏觀?
宏觀又跟摘要不一樣即使都有概括的結構
很有趣的議題，前面所說的"發話者為導向"和"聽話者為導向"我從未想過這個問題，聽完後感覺確實有這種傾向。
乍聽到這個見解，我第一個反應就是上級對下級宣布事情，在這種情況下"揣摩上意"被視為一種能力的表現，這非常符合聽話者為導向。但深入一想，"言簡意賅"這句成語也說明了，古人們認為語意的表達同樣重要。
在傳統文言文的文章中，講究字詞的優美與簡潔，盡可能用簡短的句子表達更多的含意。這也造成了同樣一本書，過了幾百年後反而出版了更多的"注本"去解釋原本的書籍。這可能是紙尚未發明的時代，用刀刻在竹簡上時留下的寫作習慣。
這種文學上的追求，在我小時候的教育中，確實總是強調文章的結構例如"起承轉合"這種標準的結構，如果文章寫得太過條列式會被嫌寫得太像"流水帳"，描述的太詳細會被認為文章過於擁腫。我認為這種發話者為導向或聽話者為導向的問題，並不是文字或語言導致的，而是學習和使用習慣上的不同。
最直观的感受，就是听英文歌和中文歌，英文歌，不管听多少，总给人一种普遍的感觉就是歌词真的太直白、太简单了，那么多歌，几十万的英语单词，总感觉都是在用最简单的英语单词在写歌，反观中文，常用的字其实也就那么一两千个，但是整首歌听下来，给人感觉就是更有内容，让更容易代入写歌人各种语句代入的情绪里。英文歌里的爱，总是那么直白，中文歌里的爱，总是那么婉转不言明。
感觉还是中文诗歌更好
是的，英文歌感覺太直白了，像對白了一樣
您說國語非常清楚、中國祖宗的中華文字繁體您也寫得非常簡潔、多謝分享。
完全同意你说的。如果学科学一定要看英文原版的书，尽量别看翻译过来的中文版书。这是个人体会。
totally agree
同一件事情，中国大学里的书本和教授讲起来云里雾里，国外的*教授则是从无到有抽丝剥茧的讲给你听
我反對這種說法，如果中文科學書看不懂，我的經驗有兩個原因
1. 譯者中文造詣差，英文又不太好，翻錯或直譯使文章難懂.
2. 若書籍是一本著作，但仍讓人看不懂，那是作者中文造詣不好，或作者邏輯思考不周延.
科學或數學的東西很嚴謹，一是一，二是二，不會因為語言的不同而無法說清楚.
如果我們中文的科學書籍有比英文書不容易看懂的問題，那麼學校裡應該加強中文及邏輯辨思的教育.
對了，外國書比較容易看懂的其中一個原因是他們認為很多基本的東西你可能不知道，所以從基礎開始講，所以令人感覺有點囉唆. 但我們中國人 "太聰明了"，所以常假設以聽者的學歷應該都懂了，所以基礎常跳過不講或隨便帶過，基礎好的就懂，不好的就會有鴨子聽雷的感覺.
但我認為這個跟語言無關，Susie Woo 有提到這 case.
@@kenlin4468我認為gzeng21是在分享他的體驗，而不是在分析原因。他沒有說“學科學要看英文原版書的原因”是東西方思考模式不同，而是在分享看書的個人體會。所以如果要反對這種說法，論點應該是“學科學，讀英文原版書和讀翻譯過來的中文書沒什麼差別（甚至讀中文版更好）”。
完全同意，並且在讀科學以外領域的書時也會有這種感覺。
非常犀利的觀點，了不起！中國語言存在語境，同樣文字表達，不同語境下意思完全不同甚至竟然意思相反!這可能就是UP主觀察到的問題核心！
As a Chinese immigrated to Canada years ago, I find this topic is both fascinating and extremely practical in real life. Thank you Susie to bring it up! The benefits of clear and direct communications really shines in team work environments, scientific research and engineering. The use of Western language could be a part of the attribution to those areas as well. I am curious to know about the difference between poetries of Western Vs Eastern - do they behave the same as everyday languages? Are Western poetries more direct as well?
I regret I do not know enough about western poetries but have a feeling that they are much more direct. Many of those from the east are really subtle and demand extensive background on literature.
I share the same background as you, and in my opinion, western poem gives a more focus view to one subject(a portrait of something or a feeling) in the poem while eastern poem is a collective of hidden meanings. Also, if you read the English poem out loud, it is rather easy to sing it.
Poetry 没有复数形式
很有道理，事实的确如此。
一个是以人为本，以服务众人为本。一个是为了抒发而表达，以自我为本。
I totally agree your statement about what's different between Eastern and Western people's thinking. How to think a thing influences on distinct background. 孔子's thinking affected our thousands of years(not only China or the area speaking Chinese but most of eastern countries). When we were children, We were always taught older men, teachers, and bosses in your company weren't QUESTIONABLE. This is the reason why we are hard to present our ideas because, usually, we are not used to doing that! I think the most contradictory thing is the difficulty of Understanding and elaboration of our own ideas. When I was a child, Most of the time, my friend and I cared about what classmates thought and whether teachers would punish us if we did something "different"(as a result of school rules being really strict, such as you can't debate with your teachers, chat with classmates in class, have too long hair, or have dirty shoes because we are only limited to wear "white" shoes). It's a great video to elaborate on such a difficult topic. I think I can find someone to support my opinions as below comment!
謝謝Susie的分享~ 有兩點讓人感同身受，第一個是東西方的思考模式，舉例來說，我是從小接受東方教育，中文一直都是第一語言。直到上大學，需要用全英文的體系上課，我常常會覺得自己一直很難讀懂英文內的語言意涵；特別是我總是覺得某些語句有雙重意義，在考試的時候很經常會覺得老師出題怎麼模稜兩可，但那時我一直都覺得是自己英文爛的問題。後來看了你的文章，我深感到可能是我太習慣用中文比較廣義的語境意涵方式，去解讀英文的語境...
第二點是以發話導向跟聆聽導向，以我自己而言，在思考模式主要比較聆聽導向的：「從理解關鍵部分就好，從而大概知道大綱」；但在說話的時候比較偏向發話導向，也就是「說明時非常注重細節」，也常常導致我在跟別人（東方人）溝通的時候，他們會希望我講重點。我相信這種導向的邊界會越來越模糊，但個人覺得，要是語言學得不夠精深，反而會深受這種導向的誤解（像我一樣Q_Q）
第一點有時候讀原文書 基礎化學 也有這種
就是一個英語文單字也有複數意思
在不真正了解他到底是什麼的時候
也是要考靠前後結構去猜可能是哪一個
很喜歡你的影片，你所講的英國種種的事情，讓我回想起住在英國四年的生活，是一段非常美好的回憶，你的氣質表現出英國人的魅力，有機會希望可以再來台灣
超級同意，尤其是地位由上對下的對話中，時常發生，老闆常覺得:屬下怎麼都不照我說的做?、前輩總說:你們新人怎麼都跟不上?、女友總生氣:你怎麼都不知道我想吃甚麼?總結就是缺乏溝通，但台灣社會，多問兩句就會被罵(你都看過幾遍了怎麼還不會?)(這有道理的話，看就會了那我一定能灌籃，男生也能生孩子，畢竟每兩人平均都有一顆蛋蛋)，後來還有人專門研究這問題，叫做「知識象限」。而台灣這問題也普遍存在教學跟傳承裡面，總有人喜歡創造新名詞來用作教學，讓你原本不懂的知識，變得更難懂，比如英文課中的:「不及物動詞」、金屬加工的；「長料」「進給」、國軍的:「舉手答又(有)，ㄜ!」一個「有」說出三種以上的音...
這是一個很棒的影片，令人感興趣的內容，又有中英文字幕對照，加上你咬字清晰。當我看完你的影片，我感到很充實、快樂和富足。
難道你是日本人寫這樣的中文嗎？太強了
舔
你太客氣了，謝謝 🙂
It’s rare to see a linguistic topic covers difference of expressions. Thanks!
Would love to watch more videos on this topic. Comparing the difference between Chinese, the only widely used logogram in the world, and other western languages, which are all phonograms. Also a fun topic is, what onomatopoeia is like in different languages? i.e. in English dogs go 'woof' while in Chinese dogs go '汪 waˋng'. I think it's because dogs' breeds vary in different part of the world.
Agree. English, especially in written form puts a lot of emphasis on structure and logic. Chinese writing is an art form which coveys a picture and relationship.
I’ve been living in UK and Ireland for 15 years now. I feel reading English articles is easier as there’s less information density, more logical with specific connecting phrases/wording.
lol ye dae dinnae ken th'leid! so haud yer wheesht matey
博主还是在分析东西方文化差异的时候，很好地应用了辩证性思维去分析问题。这点就非常赞。
I agree with that. When I tried studying a new skill on Coursera, I was surprised that I just understood it more than in Chinese, although Chinese is my mother tongue. I thought probably when people use English to explain something they will narrate it in a logical way.
I think it's more about teaching tactics instead of language.
Your insight about English and Chinese language is intriguing. As a Canadian Taiwanese, I was trained in college to write/speak as clear as possible to readers/listeners. I feel the reason of having ambiguity or vagueness in conversation could be the insufficient knowledge of writers or readers themselves. Most of elder Taiwanese, including my parents, did not have a opportunity to go to college. Sometimes it's hard for them to express their thoughts in an articulate fashion, I would have to reconstruct their sentences and maybe re-express for them in our conversation to confirm if it's what they meant.
Thank you for bringing me a new perspective about my cultural background. great works.
記得歷史老師說過 地理位置 氣候溫度 除了會造成不同作物的生長 對民族的文化演進 文字發明 人民的思維 都是有影響的
思維主要靠政權影響，比如中國韭菜跟全世界任何人都不同
蛙蛙不是韭菜，为啥让你们吃莱猪
对你这集探讨的话题非常有兴趣，的确不同语言会”训练成“不同的思考模式，”思考模式“实际上是一群语言的表达方式规律的总结，包括逻辑结构。
中国人由于长期处于主奴或主仆或家长制的上下级关系当中，很多话出来并不想或者不敢明确意思，缺乏具体可操作细节，往往给人的感觉是”形式大于内容“，需要听者去”根据情况“揣度意思，主要还是不想为观点承担责任，这种模棱两可的话可以在事后不利于自己的情况下进行辩解的时候，才会有更加清晰明确的表达……
常此以往，同语系的人会形成一种习惯性说话行事的方式，所以说语言会影响人的思维模式。
而大多数英语语系的人长期生活在一个上帝之下都是兄弟姊妹的自由表达的环境，加之工业化进程让他们更早在数理科学等训系统练下，有敢于说明、善于辩论也凸现更加严谨的逻辑性；所以学习英语，你会跟有逻辑思维的人慢慢学习逻辑的严谨，这会使你对缺乏逻辑的事物重新判断发现问题，所以现在……
learning math in English is much easier for me than in Chinese. yeah, the English textbook is much in details whereas the chinese textbooks are more of skipping-steps. the topic is very interesting. thank you! I have been actually thinking about this topic for a long time. the linguistic logic definitely impacts the speakings way of thinking as well as the depth of thinking.
這樣講起來好像從學中學教科書開始就有明顯不同
可又可能是教學結構計畫不一樣
國外的教師在 基礎講夠的教科書上再補充 例外與立論基礎
可國內 大部分除了頂尖學校
大部分教師都在混
首先非常敬佩你能在短短的7分钟内谈论到那么话题。我觉得你提到的每一个小点都可以作为一项课题来研究。从我个人的理解和经验我认为：
1. 我同意你的鸡生蛋蛋生鸡的观点。语言和思维模式的相互关系很难分出具体的因果关系。
2. 对于其他的oriental languages我不是很清楚，但是对于中文来讲。的确有在一定的场景下希望表达得稍微模糊一点的情况。但是在正式的场合下也是要追求逻辑和清晰的。我不太清楚台湾的朋友在接受语文教育的时候老师是如何教的。在大陆，我们在学习议论文撰写的时候，论点论据都要尽可能写得清晰明了。但是对于叙述文我们可以发挥一些“文艺”技巧以达到文章优美的效果。所以我不是完全同意Outliers里面的这个观点。
3. 我同意西方的文化追溯到古希腊，而东亚这边又非常受儒家思想的影响，从而造成了两边非常不同的文化语言习俗。我虽没有答案，但我觉得可以往下深挖一层也就是希腊文化本质是海洋贸易文化，而儒家的中国文化根植于农耕民族的生活习惯。（知识储备有限，所以这里讨论并不涉及其他文化和语言）
These 11 minutes are well spent. So rich and practical. Very happy to see Susie is bringing this deep and thoughtful topic to the channel occasionally. You really can feel how elegant, intelligent and well educated Susie is. And what an enjoyment is that I’m listening to a young beautiful woman perfectly explaining something supposedly boring in a clear, logical and fun way. I’m in love~~
Well, from your sentences, I can tell you are non-native, because your words and points are wordy and unspecific to express. 🙄
As to speak, your first spoken mindset affects you
Very good
@@morris4490 Ayo STFU
@@morris4490ugh get over yourself
中文在寫作時會更注重微言大義，可以簡單理解為盡可能刪減不必要的部分，我認為是受到古代文言文的影響(當然可能有更多原因)，古代甚至還有專門來解釋各種文言文的注本；但是在現代中文口語上，普遍也盡量都是解釋得越詳細越好，所以可能會有一個特徵是，書本寫得較為精煉、精簡，但是實際口語教學或討論時，才會詳細的表達出來。這是我自己的感受，我認為書本也是寫得越詳細越有邏輯越好
In Chinese writing, there is a tendency to focus on the essence and "concise" expression, influenced by classical Chinese literature. In ancient times, there were even annotated versions specifically explaining various classical texts. However, in modern spoken Chinese, there is a general preference for detailed interpretations. As a result, written texts may be more concise, but in everyday conversations or oral discussions, people tend to express themselves in a more detailed manner. This is my personal observation, and I believe that detailed and logically organized writing is better in textbooks for the benefit of all.
Recently, I am reading some article about Buddhism. Actually, English version is easier than Chinese version for understanding. I was trapped in the language jungle of Chinese. Thanks for this video.
I’ve got so impressed after watching this video! 不僅僅是英文的解構，甚至觸碰到一些哲學的層次！我在自學英文的過程中也常常思考關於「思想與語言」的交互關係，不過我不是專家，只是自發性的有這個想法，這個影片進一步開啟我對這個議題的探索，可惜我對其他語言的了解跟掌握不像Susie這麽優秀😅，我想說的是我很喜歡妳的影片，不單單只有教英文，還多了一些可以思考的東西。最後，我大學念微積分的時候，因為常常翹課，所以只能在考前自己讀課本學習，然後我們使用原文書，所以當時查單字查得很辛苦，常常花了半個小時查完一頁單字之後發現這一頁只是引言⋯但是，透過英文來學數學，真的勝過以前讀中文參考書的說明！我當時的感想是，高等數學果然是西方發展出來的學問，用英文學才是正解👍🏾
Awesome- Susie將東西方文學的邏輯思考寫作方式做了很好的詮釋👍
是文学和科学的文章不同点。文学如诗歌可以跳跃、发散，而科学都是要求条理清晰。
Hitting a nail on the head. Fabulous observation and study, never thought the Chinese culture and way of thinking is still influencing me so much, especially at the UK work setting and hence the frustration at times. Brilliant and thank you.
我在国外写博士论文的时候学到的指导思想是：
1. 把读者当作小孩子。因此语言必须足够直白准确，没有模糊的空间。
2. 读者应能跟随自己设置的逻辑链流畅地走下去--如果读者在某逻辑节点上需要停下来去思考，那么此节点很可能有疏漏或者不足够连贯。
作为一个在国外生活20年的中国人，我对视频中一些观点有共鸣。中文里常常爱描述“Big picture”， 但是英文和日语里偏重于具象化描述和阐明细化的观点。但是在学术会议，学社演讲的情况下，差异还是很小的。 个人观点
非常喜歡這一集的內容，感覺很有共鳴~
I can't agree with you more! It has been the big issue for my past decade of translating Chinese to English for a Mandarin writer.
認同！英文還是一個很科學性的語言，時間、地點、主詞、單複數、甚至是時態都有明顯的規定，所以常常英文思考的人會具有邏輯一點。但是中文就是比較詩意的語言，沒有什麼文法和規定，所以常常有話中有話（沒說死有空間去詮釋）的時候。比較論文而言，我也是覺得英文比中文寫作容易一點，因為比較有邏輯 ：）
謝謝你分享你的經驗！
Wow!! What an incredible Brit who can speak fluent Chinese 😯Respect 😌👍👍(from HongKong🇭🇰)
由於日韓語的文法和中文有點不同
以中文來說，與英語或其他類似的西方語言比起來
最大的差別就是在一句話中，英語會把重點擺在前面 細節或形容詞擺後面，中文則是把形容詞都寫完之後才把被形容的事物本體寫出來。
這點還體現在日期和姓名上。
中文會把姓寫在前面 形容這個人是這個家族的，後面才是代表個人的名子。
英語和其他西方國家則是把名字(Given name)寫在前面。
日期則是 2021/7/15 和 15.07.2021的差別。
但對於英語比中文好懂我覺得見仁見智，妳說的主要是邏輯的表達差異。
不過在文字方面
西方國家是拼音文字為主體，漢字則是象形文字發展出來的表義文字。
中文漢字的特點就是光是"一個漢字"本身就代表了一定的資訊量 同時也比較密集 整段長度較短，在同樣空間裡，中文的閱讀熵含量較高，甚至掃過去就能大概知道這段在講啥。
這同時也是日文還使用漢字，以及在少數情況下韓文依然搭配漢字做註解的原因之一。
我覺得東西方的姓名、地址、日期先後順序也體現了個人主義跟集體主義的思維差異，比如名字，西方人把代表個人的given name擺前面，然後才是代表群體的surname，反之東方人姓氏在前，表示先有家族，才有個人
@@brianliu1996 同意，以歷史脈絡和邏輯來說十分合理。不知道有沒有相關的論文資料。
可是形容词放前面也会意味着形容词不会太多，否则就会"累赘"，不符合语言的习惯了。英文则是想加多少形容的东西在后面都可以的感觉😉
@@Hope-ck6hy 英文跟中文一樣，是形容詞-名詞結構，所以原則上英文的名詞也是放前面的，如歐盟英文是European Union，可見其形容詞European是前置的，當然也有Union of Europe 這種用法，但是日常生活還是前者較多，像拉丁語族的語言則是名詞-形容詞結構，如法文的歐盟就叫Union européenne
相对于日语来说，中文和英语已经非常类似了，语序也非常类似，一般也都以主语开头。而日语不仅动词后置，而且肯定和否定放在句末，在对方说完一句话前，你是完全不知所云的。而且日语中大量省略主语和宾语，最典型的就是“我爱你，I love you”，而在日语中只有一个动词“愛してる“，因为日本人觉得：我讲”爱“的时候，除了对你表达，还会有什么意思呢？所以统统省掉，刚开始学日语的时候很不习惯，总觉得日本人讲话不完整，很容易引起误解
很喜欢这期讨论的主题，你主持节目过程就很能体现到西方注重逻辑表达的特点，提出问题、列出观点、围绕观点举例子、做对比，最后总结及期待进一步讨论。最可贵的是能主动转换视角，为各方做出阐述，这一点比很多专门做新闻传播媒体的素质要高了。非常👍。
我的看法是一個地方的語言，將會對這個地方的文化產生深遠的影響，這個因素有很多，不太好總結，但這個是肯定的
總結一句話：
西方人的腦細胞和東方人的腦細胞，
“ 我們長得不一樣！”
你在分析不同的地方文化，可以有效地反映當今世界各地的問題，我自己有多種語言的教養，我完全同意你的看法
You are fantastically analyzing the different cultures, that could effectively reflect the problem around the world these days, I myself had the multi-lingual upbringing and I totally agree with you
單一的一個中文字，背後有很多意思，每個意思，又有更多的漢字解釋該字的意思。
不過單單的一個漢字，就算有同義的字可以互換使用，本身也有它的獨特性。
所以中文有很多表現，或解讀的方式。
這個語文的世界真是神奇。
作为一个中国人说句实话，语言就是人与人之间交流的，如果像儒家这样隐含的说话，有时候里面带有一种诡诈和欺骗，所以，这样的文化就是世界走向更高文明的绊脚石。
Agreed with the comments that sometime it is easier to read and understood the English article. But quite often, it is OTT. speaking from the 12 years experience of living in the UK as a Taiwanese.
hi Susie, many thanks for bringing up this topic as well as sharing your reads and thoughts! I was reading this book 'The culture map', it discussed this topic in the low-context vs. high-context scenario with exploring the historical background of western and eastern countries. I myself found the points very reasonable.
我在TH-cam尋找 電影：
異星入境，ARRIVAL，
and 語言相對論 相關影片的時候，
看到妳的影片點進來看，發現
哇~~！妳的語言能力好強！！
中文說的很棒，英文更是沒話說！
讚！！
Love this one, particularly, so informative and educational. Thank you for making this one!
I have the similar feeling when I learn programming. The logic and chapters in English books/articles usually make me feel they are well-organized.
While reading Chinese version, they are more likely a fraction of notes, but the connection of notes are loose.
我反而覺得西方的”以發話者為導向“是說話人的責任跟義務，也是一種禮貌，”以聽話者為導向“會訓練出很會理解的聽眾，也代表隨便一個阿貓阿狗也能來演講，這不是一個好現象。
針對你提到的“英文比中文容易理解”，這點我也同意，但對我來說，覺得是因為單字的關係。
中文太多冗言贅字，也比較死，單字的意思沒那麼多變化，反觀一個英文單字在不同情況有不同的解釋，相比之下，中文要準確地使用才容易理解。
I cannot agree more with your ideas. The only change I've done to make my Master essays improved from merely pass to 70+ is to clearly and bluntly explain my thinking process and create sort of a logical flow to guide the reader (the marker obviously).
殊途同归，两种语言都可以表达的很清楚，也有只有意会不可言传的境界。主要还是看具体使用的人和使用时的背景，语言始终只是一种工具。西方语言如果是逻辑自洽，具体精细，就不会有很多很多沟通上的问题了，职场上这些表现的最明显。
完全同意，是个人的问题。在古希腊，文辞及逻辑的训练、教育，是西方文明的基础。在古代中国，厚古薄今和没有逻辑，是一个硬币的两面。
我是在台灣土生土長。在我的體會和經驗中，中文的表達方式，受到中國幾千年來傳統的文化影響很大，從小教育及生活中就常常在會接觸到古時候的文章包含詩、詞、成語和所謂的古文即文言文。中文的表達自古以來崇尚並強調"意境和含蓄之美" 喜歡留空間讓接收者去細細品味，較少清楚直接陳述訊息。久而久之大家就一直深受到這種文化而影響了我們的表達方式(我記得學生時代念古文或文言文時真的很頭痛很難)。
從你所表達的方式已經很清楚的示範西方社會注重細節與以字句引導下一句要表達的意思。希望你可以多分享更多像這樣有深度且有reference 的科學、思想或社會心理學的題目。
謝謝。
合理 中文一大特色就是同義詞/替代說法很多
例如 英文"Don't" 中文就有"不要..." "別..." " "勿..." "莫..."等講法
因為我們的概念就是"聽得懂就好。"
Love this topic. As an Asian, it's really hard to imagine how western people think. But everytime I watch your video, I get to know more about western culture. If you were my teacher, I think I would be able to learn anything 😆
You might learn something, but not anything.
I started to watch your videos recently. I like your British accent, first of all, and love the topics you picked up. They answered some of my questions when I was in the UK. Thank you very much. Keep on good work!
@2:25 You’ve mentioned some Taiwanese think English textbooks are easy to understand the Chinese textbooks. I personally find English textbooks are much easier to understand and clear, particularly most abstract subjects such as math, science and music theory, etc… love to see you to make some example of those differences that it’s based on language differences.
完全同意! 英文很重視A->B->C, 所以A->C, 但是中文常常很跳tone,所以外國人聽不懂我們在講什麼~~
Absolutely. One's assumption on the readers' knowledge base and understanding often be misleading. It is best to be detailed than overly simplified.
有中英文字幕耶！對從影片學英文和跟讀，還有幫助！而且英國腔好好聽，找這樣的英國腔頻道很久了。
I come from a society that is multi-cultural. Certain differences that I've observed from my fellow countrymen may be rude if I were to spell them out here. However, if there's a more private way of communication, I don't mind sharing. The objective is not to stereotype certain groups of people but we somehow could predict certain behavior of certain groups of people based on their ethnic, cultural, religious background.
This is the most useful opinion during my English study journey
以我自己淺薄的了解，邏輯起源於希臘。西方受此訓練多達數千年。其它地區，包括東方印度（據說中文因果一詞與起源於印度的佛教相關）我還未有聽說能善用邏輯的文化存在。我也傾向語言作為思想的載體反映思維的方式和邊界。這是一個非常fascinating的主題，謝謝博主精彩的視頻！
Your point of "object focus vs context focus"/analysis vs holism , is quite interest. For my point of view, the different of thinking pattern between Eastern and Western are mostly likely caused by the different of culture development .
Thanks for such a brilliant review and sharing of ideas! This kind of logic or cognitive difference can also be seen perhaps in arts. E.g., In Chinese ink painting, you can often see empty space, that is usually understood or interpreted as solid space or imagined to be things like cloud or mist. It is implied and implicit.
Nice views
相當不錯的分析。學問豐富 你的閱讀也很豐富 you do read a lot and know a lot. The books you mentioned in the clips are excellent. Great
very inspiring Susie! Could you make a video about self-deprecating humor and more importantly how people should properly respond to it? cuz my boss loves joking on himself, and I don't know what people in the West usually say to it. Stay safe and have fun in your bike trip!
同意+1~ 最开始是在学习雅思作文的时候感受到的，写中文议论文，也是通过论据来推导论点，但是从没想过需要一点一点去扣逻辑。然后写雅思作文的时候老师嘱咐我们，阅卷的是外国人，对写作的逻辑很严格，推导论点的时候不要有逻辑上的gap，一定需要一环扣一环。然后我可能接受了这种不要有逻辑gap的思想，后来到讲话的时候也注意不要有逻辑gap以防产生歧义，但是发现好像就变得有些啰嗦了，会经常被听的人(中国朋友)用频繁的点头或者"我知道我知道"打断，我现在在努力使自己说话精简，不重要的逻辑就跳过😂
Very impressive knowledge and study about 2 different culture and literature. To me, as a Hong Konger living in UK, I feel Brits are easy to chic chat with , but very difficult to turn into deep friendship. For literature, I am mixed in English school (95% English dominant environment) and Cantonese+Traditional Chinese Society and community for the rest of time. As a result, we are very simple and direct in expressing ourselves. In this point, we do not communicate and express ideas in the way that you regarding Chinese or Asian to be.
However, we are less” Self-centred” or “Self” emphasis which is matching your study. 😂😂😂
I think that is a complicated issue as there are many influential factors including different cities, different education level, diversity of society, international exposure and so on , can shape the people there in a very different way.
Agree. I don't think it's purely a straightforward Western vs Eastern, especially now where people move a lot or have different cultural influences.
It's more to do with the language, I think i.e., Germanic or Sanskrit, written or oral origin. With Germanic or written, it's more critical for the communication to be direct because the reader has no opportunity to seek clarification. Hence, the communicator needs to ensure the message is conveyed precisely. For languages originating orally, the listener has opportunities to interact with the communicator so the latter has no critical need to be clear. Moreover, the communicator would want to generate interest and interaction, so being vague or poetic would be more effective in garnering an audience.
就在今天，我的孩子对我说：Daddy, give me some water。我说，宝宝你应该说：Daddy, I need some water 或者说 I want to drink some water。一个真实的例子就发生今天下午，晚上又恰好看到你的视频！你的视频对我很有启发，让我更好地理解了英文的表达特征。谢谢！👍
2:26 I am a Taiwanese as well, and I also feel like Reading English is really easier than Chinese, especially when studying math or physics. I hate to guess Chinese meaning if I see something new, usually Chinese translation doesn't make any sense.
I don't mean that which language is better than another, but I really feel like I truely understand the math after learning again in Khan online courses, of course in totally English.
Obviously you are more focus on English then Chinese. English could be classified for engineering, financing, Medic and so on. I'm Chinese, I couldn't explain to my daughter in chinese about the science because I learn that from English. My engineer friend always come to ask me about the meaning of the financial reports. Eg. Yield and returns. Sometime I wonder they purposely create the words to make themselves different or make it difficult so that look elegance or higher level or simply sound better... Lol
The issue IMO is Chinese writers ceased to invent new words, that's how to achieve precise definitions. Poets or literary authorities used to make new words to describe new things that become the standard for all to follow thereafter. The Chinese language, however, lost any literary authorities willing to develop it any further, esp ever since the 54 movement. The ensuing revolution even actively disintegrated the logic of the writing system. It is a castrated language devoid of spirit for growth. It is now limited to being utilitarian, and even then, the Chinese have a hard time keeping up with the quality and quantity of translations necessary for the ever-growing technical fields: without being precise, the sheer volume of specific concepts with similar words just make the whole thing a mess. IMO, this is due to the translators' lack the chops in their understanding of Chinese linguistic logic, and their lack of authority to be creative and inventive.
这是白话文 简化字还有电脑字库的灾难 @@masquerade41120
This video differ yourself from regular english teaching channel. Great job!
Personally, i feel Chinese writing resembles Chinese art, i.e. calligraphy, painting... etc, where the outline, or impression, or atmosphere, is more important than the content. It coincides with modern day art critics like Susan Sontag quoting Willem de Kooning "content is a glimpse,..... it's minimal, minimal".
1. 有書法沒思想。
2. 書法要寫的好，官大是前提。（留意因果關係）
雖然我英文不錯，但是面對你的 “... Susan Sontag quoting Willem de Kooning...” 時，我就瞬間變文盲了，你說，這是文化問題？還是人品問題？
It is more art than communication tool, that’s it
So deep thoughts and much more analyzing on this topic make it worth to consider and repeatedly read your words. Thanks for your inspiration and profound point of view. I really love it!
Hi, Susie, your observation and thinking are in-depth. This topic is interesting. It involves a lot of factors such as religion, philosophy diversely practiced, history, culture, social type... But I think in thesis writing, western way of thinking and writing is considered more standard, as modern science originated in the west.
你說的很對，我以前一直沒有想過為什麼美國人寫書，前面總是要花了很多篇幅介紹很基本的觀念。現在終於懂了。
Having learned French before, I believe that language is even more "logical" than English as it uses more articles, conjunctions, and prepositions to describe relationship among words.
I absolutely agree with you. When my ELA teachers talk about stating topic sentence or reiterating key words throughout the paragraph in an essay, it gives me a sense of redundancy. Why do I need to do repetitive works when readers can get the meaning directly from the context? Now it makes much more sense. Thank you for sharing this video. Appreciation from a Chinese Canadian.
My mother language is chinese. But when I search for information, such as a new knowledge, I would prefer searching English materials. It's because most of the articles are much clearer in English, usually step by step. But in Chinese, it's usually not that straightforward. Perhaps it's because westerners love sharing more than easterners? Like my family always ask me not to tell people how much you know about anything.
Good observations! I totally agree with you that in Western communication, it is the speaker’s job to convey the message clearly. When questioned, a Chinese speaker often says “I’ve already explained earlier”, when what was “explained earlier” was several inferences away from explaining the questioned point. One more point: In Western communication, terms and concepts must be defined before they are used. This is not always the case in Chinese, see examples in many Chinese medical terms. Finally, the language used certainly affects thinking: “the limits of my language means the limits of my world”, “if we spoke a different language, we would perceive a somewhat different world” (Wittgenstein)
順帶一提，韓文跟日文很像，也是有敬語而且有委婉及隱諱的特性。
因此歷史上曾有機員(資淺)提醒機長(資深)航空隱患不成功而導致撞機的事件。
自此韓國航空的工作用語一律改為英文。
我至今不理解敬语是什么，日韩独有的吗
those ideas sharing video are excellent, no fancy pics, strong rhythm background music. i could feel those thoughts flow out from you to my brain. i have a feeling of gain.
I really appreciate your points here. I first encountered that when I took an international assignment to Japan. Prior to that, in all of my American education and work experience, it had always been what you described as "speaker oriented". But when I went to work in Japan, I had a lot of frustration related to that as I worked with the Japanese counterparts. One day, my then-girlfriend made it clear: the (Japanese) listeners are supposed to be well educated/informed to understand what I MEAN. If not, it's his/her fault. And the more I stress my points to make them "crystal clear", the more it is sending a "you-don't-seem-to-get-it" message to the receiver, which would be condescending... Later on, as I work-toured around the rest of "northeast Asia", including Taiwan, I found this to be soooooo true.
這個主題很好看！我覺得是語言邏輯在型塑大腦想事情的方式。
相同的差異展現在繪畫和藝術方面。
水墨與寫實主義嗎？
100% agree.Your life experience such as your education level greatly affects how you understand what you have heard.