New shirts! ➡ teespring.com/stores/dcauwatchtower P.S. Look, I don't even know who MJF is, y'all. The track came from the same TH-cam stock music library I always use. I've used it in like 3 other videos before this. It doesn't have any significant meaning, I promise. 😆
I know I could be wrong but I always thought Tom Turbine was a mix between Mighty Mister Titan a cartoon character from thr 1960s around the Silver Age of Comics era and of course Ultra Boy from the Super Boy comics of the 1950s but also from the Silver Age era.
Hey James, AEW superfan here to take your hand and guide you through this. See, Maxwell Jacob Freeman (who is the current All Elite Wrestling World Heavyweight Champion) uses that TH-cam free-for-use theme as his entrance theme, and has just become synonymous with the theme being his own. I know that it’s a public domain theme, and frankly, loved hearing it in the video. Just…watch out for those wrestling fans. They be crazy…
Wish all of DC and Marvel and other people running these things cared about that. Otherwise we wouldn't get Jimmy Olsen getting executed in [SPOILERS] Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice Ultimate Edition or Classic Professor X and Black Bolt in [SPOILERS] Doctor Strange: Multiverse of Madness.
And it makes commercial sense: multiple times in DC's history, they've retired the '40s Justice Society and/or its family of characters in the comic books, only to find renewed interest driving a revival. Off the top of my head, there's the JLA crossovers in the '60s, the resurrection of _All-Star Comics_ in 1976, the Geoff Johns-led revival in the 2000s, and, if I've heard correctly, yet another revival in 2019. Since _Justice League_ would be many kids' introduction to much of DC's lineup, they'd want to hedge their bets on the JSA.
I've gone back and forth on the Justice Guild for a long time, but I think I'm okay with them being in the episode instead of the JSA. I do feel like a couple of their costume designs could've used a second pass though
Just the fact the Seven Soldiers of Victory and members of the JSA appeared in JLU makes me happy. Instead of making all new original characters, creatives of the JLU showcased actual existing DC comics characters. Even if most of them were in the background, they were there. And that made me happy.
Shining Knight and Wildcat were both given focus episodes despite them being so obscure. I think the Bat-embargo was one of the best features of the DCAU since it forced the writers to dig deeper into DC's character roster and lore.
@@affsteak3530 I really think that they could have treated Diana better though, but yes the Bat-Embargo did allow more creative stories and obscure heroes to be explored. Their mistreatment of Diana though was extremely gross. Especially since Unlimted was originally planned to be her show before arguments over Donna with the Teen Titans crew caused that embargo. Whoever wrote her episodes in League and JLU (which I think was MacDuffie or at least someone else who was familiar with the John Byrne run) should have been writing a WW:TAS concurrently or at least someone today who's familiar with the runs that were used to make the Earth-508 Wonder plots when they actually cared about her. I mean they really had something going there with alluding to the Byrne run...too bad post of the time it was Atomic Age Kanigher...yikes.
It's interesting to note that Catman is a character in the public domain. Originally spelled as Cat-Man, he was a hero, but later on, even the villain from DC Comics wore a similar costume. Over the years, many people have created their own versions of Catman.
I really enjoyed Black Canary and Wildcat's appearances in Unlimited, so I'm glad they went with new characters for the Guild. Besides, Tom Turbine has a sick design.
I will say I’m kinda miffed canary didn’t use her all black and yellow outfit from Gail Simone’s birds of prey designed by Ed benes. However the one shot drawn by Bruce timm is a nice alternative. I think my issue with it though is that BC in JLU is Dinah Lance and not Drake. Lance never wears the blue and black classic costume. Instead wearing the 80s and 90s jumpsuit or the Ed benes design. I get the dcau often goes for the classic designs but Dinah’s never makes sense because she’s a legacy character. She only wears that costume once or twice in the comics and it was directly related to her mom
Considering how it ended, I’m glad it wasn’t the real JSA. I love the episodes, some of my favourite from the whole DCAU, but had they introduced the JSA only to have them be dead the whole time wouldn’t have sat well with me. A brilliant love letter to the Golden Age, which doesn’t need the real characters to pay respects to it.
You mean like how Starman, Ted Grant, Rex Tyler, Jay Garrik, Alan Scott, Johnny Thunder (and presumably Charles McNider) all died before the events of the CW Stargirl show that took place on the post-crisis Earth-2 (Golden Age DC Universe in the post-crisis CWDC Multiverse like in the old comics (it's also gone by Earth 2 (no hyphen) and Earth-Two after the Crisis and Flashpoint reboots), although the pre-crisis Earth-3 Jay and his wife Joan returned in The Flash after the Paragons rebuilt Earth-1 as Earth-Prime and lived in Earth-Prime's Keystone City) and the show instead focused on Pat Dugan and their successors (all of which were in the comics) (Alan Scott's kids weren't focused on mind and The Flash's helmet remained unused by the time the show was canned and Jay never had a successor in the comics, which gives the implication he might have gotten stuck in the Speed Force, we'll never know though)?
@@BalderOdinson It's been a good while. Just double checked to be sure, that's not how that episode was originally meant to end, obviously. The show was canceled, it didn't end on its the production crew's own terms.
I just got done watching the first season of Justice League before it became unlimited and I'm half way through season 2 at the minute, and yeah. That was crazy when John Stewart found the headstones. Like WTF?!??! I was so confused for like a minute until I realised where they were going with it. Didn't remember those 2 episodes as it had been years since I watched them and I think I may have missed those episodes the first time around.
This was a legit gripping mystery!, Im so glad that I found this channel not only as a fan of the DCAU but because you guys put together great scripts and presentations about how these shows were made, the fanbases that they inspired, you all just go above and beyond. I was born in 2001 and so my memories of the 00s are really scattered but I still get such an awesome sense of nostalgia with the music, the technology that was popular and accesible, the TV promos, and the online message boards - thank you WTDB this was really cool to see. I'm totally cool with the Guild, we still got to see JSA members appear later on in JLU, I love how they handled Wildcat, and comics are up to the brim with pastiches, homages, and reinterpretations of classic characters - thats how we got Watchmen! And the show never came across as making fun of the JSA at least imo.
It's episode like this that made me see the importance and value of selflessness and sacrificing your wants and needs for the good of others. In short, a part of who I am today and my morals were influenced heavily by these cartoons.
I had a pretty similar experience a couple years ago where I was trying to track down the author a an extremely old bit of Final Fantasy fanfiction that took me across ancient archived websites and disused forums and crap too, so it's cool to see that sort of effort captured in a well edited video like this. I didn't find my guy either, despite coming super close too lol. It really makes you wonder how many people who made cool shit back in the day are just out there living their lives and have no idea people still care enough to try to find them.
I can relate. I helped someone track down the origin of the 'Mr. Skeltal' meme and found myself on some ancient forums and websites. I got really emotional when I came across a 20 year old website maintained by a kid. He was going through such a rough time I just hope he got better!
I think having the Guild being "JSA in all but name only/serial numbers filed off" works better in the episode than what was originally planned simply because it adds a bit of mythos to the DCAU. John was inspired to become a hero because of the comics, it's a natural and human detail that helps flesh out the DCAU on a bit more of a personal level a lot like the Grey Ghost in BTAS. As a bonus for lore nerds, it not only helps keep the possibility of the JSA being in the main universe, but could potentially help reinforce it since the JGA might've been an unlicensed, fictionalized version of them thought up by comic book creators residing in the DCAU to build upon/ride the wave of the living mythos of the JSA. It's happened enough in real life with public figures that gained legendary status.
Plus they probably wanted to use the JSA for a future episode that never was. Same reason Watchmen opted for new characters inspired by existing characters.
theres also a trope in comics that in universe comics are the writers and artists channeling visions of other universe that who you get comic stires that are errily close to in universe events they had no way of knowing details, they honed on on one of those multiverse that are just slighty off as Owlman put it in Crisis
I just think its weird they avoided doing the JSA but then they added characters later that were in the JSA. Justice League Unlimited had Dr. Midnight, Hourman, and Hawkman You can argue well these were just the new versions of them, a big plotline I very vaguely remember is the JSA had a big crisis that killed several of the members, most notably Dr. Midnight and Hourman. Now they did have successors, but Hourman in particular when I saw him on the show was the version that carried a staff. The JSA version was the one that had a staff. Also I had to look up hawkman, cuz I was super confused how he hid his wings, and in the comics originally back in the JSA, Hawkman and Hawkgirls wings were magical pieces of gear from their nth metal harnesses. They could strap their wings on, and take them off like equipment. When Hawkman reveals himself to Hawkwoman, he pops on his winged harness. Also too with the idea of them being reincarnated and all that, they new versions of Hawkman and Hawkwoman could have easily been apart of the JSA. I love the DCAU, but I think their biggest hangup was Crisis on Infinite Earths and the destruction of the multiverse. Anything too confusing or messed up from all the rectons they just took a wide step around. Like Supergirl was Superman's cousin and they created Argo for her, rather than her being a shapeshifting alien imposter brainwashed to think shes a kryptonian from CADMUS. Also I tried to follow the Brianiac rabbit hole... omg dont... Brainiac was so confusing before Crisis, Brainiac was more confusing after Crisis. Brainiac 5 makes even less sense (Brainiac 5 is special because he has a 12th level intellect, but Brainiac went crazy terrorizes the galaxy because he upgraded to a 12th level intellect. Also dear god what is a 12th level intellect) I love DC, it was my universe of choice long before the MCU took off. However, trying to follow the plotlines from the 1940s to the present day will give you an ulcer. Just imagine that Crisis happened, no one except Barry Allen is aware of it, and we just all look at the pretty colors and move on with our lives.
Keith David by the way is such a cool actor with a great deep voice. Goliath from Gargoyles was one of his best roles. He still sounded cool as him even in the non-canonical "The Goliath Chronicles". As for the video, it's interesting and entertaining as usual.
I like that it was an homage, rather than the real JSA. But I also wish it had been a bit more on the nose (that bad flash helmet lmao), and that it had a larger roster. Your videos fill me with joy and wonder, and continue to be engaging, thoughtful, fun, and sincerely touching. I always enjoy them, but this one hit really deep. Thanks for making me laugh, and then making me cry (in the best of ways). Please keep doing what you do. LEGENDS, every one of you.
The version of the episode they went with worked beautifully. That John Stewart quote about learning to be a hero from the comics is even more poetic as viewers can relate to that. Great vid dudes.
I think that it doesn’t matter that it wasn’t the jsa because the point of the episode was more about what the characters mean rather than the physical characters. It also added to the uneasiness of the episode because the characters weren’t 100% what we knew
I didn't expect the search for the original animator to be so entertaining! I hope they find out about this video, and you finally get a chance to interview them.
The JSA existing in the DCAU would have been nice, but it could have contradicted the idea of the Justice League being Earth's first permanent superhero ensemble. Same with the idea of the Justice Guild comics being inspired by the time traveling League shenanigans from "The Savage Time".
@@kylethefan6062 There's also Wildcat, and I count S.T.R.I.P.E. as well, since Pat Dugan was formerly Stripesy, the sidekick of the golden age hero, The Star Spangled Kid. Not technically JSA, but of that generation of heroes. Come to think of it, both Stargirl and Mister Terrific are legacy characters in the DC comic universe, and could well be in the DCAU if Starman and the original Mister Terrific existed. Maybe.
@@RogueTwo Don’t forget in JLU when Batman shouts “Clear the hangar!” Doctor Midnite and Hourman are two of the heroes who were previously talking that ran out of the hangar.
I liked the versions we got in the episode. My dad is a huge comic book nerd and would watch the cartoon with us kids. This was one of his favorite episodes. He loved explaining to my brother and I who they were based on and how awesome it was to see the inspiration come to life. He introduced kids to comic books and loved to explain it to us. To this day, it is my brother's and I favorite episode of JL because of that memory of us watching it over and over again with our dad. ❤
"I have traveled to a new dimension, and now I must bring my message to them." *Uploads JSA dimension hop episode promo* "It cost so much but maybe it won't be in vain."
@@PanAndScanBuddy😂 Pretty much. The whole dimension hopping thing with Mandela Effect believers is ridiculous. They just can’t admit that memories are faulty and that people are easily influenced by others.
This was such a great video, kept me on the edge of my seat from start to finish. Reminded me a lot of Defunctland's, "Who wrote the Disney Channel Theme?" video. I fucking love a good viral mystery to uncover the artist behind a small piece of meta nerd comic discussion trivia. Solving urban legends makes for the best content, this was FANTASTIC!
I actually prefer the Guild being as they are now, a solid JSA tribute act with their own incredible story and valuable moral lesson. However, I would love to see an alternate ending where the "real" JSA have just finished watching the same episode we just witnessed. They discuss the events among their membership, noting the similarities and differences to their own world. From offscreen, the voice of Tim Daly (Unrealistic at the time, I know, but I wanna do a mythos gag, darn it!) says to the assembled gathering of Golden Age greats, "That was a hum-dinger of a tale, but of course, they could never do justice to the time WE met up with those guys, eh?" The speaker steps into the room. It's the Golden Age Superman, exactly as Shuster used to draw him, costume, spit curl and all. He turns to the "camera," winks at us, cut to black. And the "real story" could've been a DC Universe Original Movie DTV a decade later! By the way, I noticed on the revived Toonzone forum post you showed, Lucho's signature reads, "Ja think I'm a cowboy?" That's remarkably similar to the very first line Popeye ever spoke in the comics. Not sure if that'd help in any future search, but I thought it worth noting anyway. Thanks, Hats Off Entertainment, for posting a video on the 1980 Popeye film, and for including the very panel in question early in the runtime!
I like how we have replacements. It's hard to explain but the fact that they are familiar but not quite what we remember adds to the surreal nature of the episode.
When the episode came out, I figured the justice guild was just a team I had never heard of. It's not crazy to think that there are multiple versions of similar characters. I mean there basically already are.
This might be your best video yet! The editing is so good. Informative, engaging, and hilarious. The build up/pay off around 24:40 in particular is a favorite of mine.
It's truly sad we never got an episode about the JSA, probably an incarnation from a different universe, meeting the JL. Heck, imagine Clark, Bruce and Diana meeting their 40's counterparts. It would be the SH*T!
@@jadenbryant9283 Earth-508 pretty much treated Diana as a bit of a "female brute" most of the time like Atomic Age Wonder Woman by Bob Kanigher who didn't even bother giving her a silver age update until 1958. The Marston Diana was the balance between Clark and Bruce and most modern WW writers are aware of this. That said...the Seikowsky WW was even worse than the Atomic Age Kanigher one.
I think I’m good with the JGA for story purposes. There are already enough retcons regarding the canon material and them being comic characters work well enough for the story. It was also a p cool to bring up the idea of multiple worlds at such an early stage of comic related content. The JSA on the other hand may have actually existed before JLA, but they probably didn’t officially call themselves the JSA or the media might have at some point. They’re def the inspiration for the JGA comics so they had to have teamed up for some significant event at some point.
DCAU was my introduction to the DC superheros, so I thought the Guild were the old old comic book characters. Wouldn't have known they were invented for the show.
I've reccently come to the conclusion that WB/DC are ineffectual helicopter parents when it comes to their I.P. The behind the scenes meddling was most apparent to me within the Snyder/Whedon debacle, but watching your videos crystalizes that perception for me. The writers and animators had so much love for the source material and they were prevented from fully expressing their admiration for the stories and art that came before. I hope Gunn can right the ship for the company and deliver quality entertainment with unabashed creativity. DC should have allowed the JSA to appear in the episode, introducing and paying homage to the characters for the younger generation.
That's always the case. Corporatism/corporate greed and public perception/opinion almost always beats anything even vaguely altruistic or sentimental. Similar situation with cars and really cool concept designs that get turned into boring SUVs and such.
On the other hand, if they had done that, we likely wouldn't have seen some of those same JSA characters later on in Justice League Unlimited. ("The Cat and the Canary" is one of my favorite episodes.)
I think the Justice Guild (and also those villains) here works better because even for those who know about the JSA it gives a feeling that everything is familiar but also kinda weird, wich fits the episode well. Fantastic video as always!
Remember kids, never ever under any circumstances ever post anything resembling or relating to your real name online or someone who's very interested in DC cartoons will find you.
A wild exploration into this weird bit of history! I forgot seeing this promo so long ago, even before I knew the story! It may have even been one of my early intros to the JSA, wild to see it all like this, I kinda miss that old era of the internet, was truly a wild west.
Its fascinating how quickly things can be lost on the internet. We like to think that the web helps archival, and while thats true, a lot of things can fall through the cracks just as easily.
I mean.. early internet *wasn't* made to archive.. back then it just kinda existed.. so it makes sense things could be lost, they weren't made to not be
These episodes were one of my favorites in the entire show. I’ve always been okay with them not being the JSA. It’s actually even cooler in my opinion. Original characters with similarities was always just cool I guess
TH-cam has become such a varied and interesting place that people can get 100's of thousands of views for a video about a deep dive into a fake fan made commercial for a nearly 20 year old cartoon show, and ostensibly, make a living doing it. As an OG nerd, i feel like the proud papa a I look over the worlds that Fandom has built and can't help but to smile. The guys who talk about the franchises are sometimes bigger than the franchises themselves, which can lead to a paradox. Keep up the good stuff! 👍🏾
I think it is overall better that the jsa weren't actually in the episode, it allowed new characters to inspire people and bring wonder into the world and it allowed jsa members to appear later on in the show without questioning why they weren't dead
I think its important that its its own metatextual fictional universe within a fictional universe. It makes the story more real for us and the idea that we might have a real chance to meet superman one day becomes more real.
Considering how the episode ended up, I'm okay with the Justice Guild as they were portrayed in the episode. The intention is clear without being explicit. It also frees up JSA members, as you mentioned. Also, I vaguely remember Lucho from the earlier ToonZone days. I wasn't expected him to be the answer (?) to this mystery.
To answer the question of the day, I personally didn’t mind the substitution of the Guild for the JSA. Because as long it still helps the writers to tell the story they want to tell, I can live with that.
This episode had me on the edge of my seat the whole time! I remember when this aired. I was always prepared for any DC premier and when I watched how the episode ended, I couldn’t stop crying. I was 8, but a part of me seeing the old classic references and knowing what happened to the Justice Guild, made me sad. My dad asked me why I was still so upset after the episode ended and I remember saying, “They’re gone now and they didn’t want to be. Everyone kept going(I meant to say moving on).” My dad said, “But Green Lantern was inspired by them. Like you’re inspired by the Justice League. That’s why they’re heroes.” That was the moment I think I had realized as a kid, truly, the saying about Heroes coming and going while legends never die. I would have loved to see the original JS as an homage but the JG was just as inspiring and amazing as an episode.
As much as I love the JSA, I do appreciate the homage team. They were able to incorporate some silver age stuff instead of straight golden age (like Catman also being inspired by Adam West’s Batman). If only Alan Scott really existed in the DCAU 💔💔💔 When John Trumbull popped up I thought the plot twist of the century was that he made it 😭 (your remake turned out INCREDIBLE James!!!)
I think the episode would have had a bit more emotional gravitas to it if it had been the JSA, but the episode is a fun throwback to a more innocent time in comic books and I like it very much.
Honestly I really liked what we got in the justice league episode. I still can’t help but want a different version with the original justice league society though. Awesome video I can’t believe how far back you could go with that research it really reminds me what you can do on the internet
I absolutely love this episode! It’s one of my favorites from the old JL show. And although I would’ve much preferred to see that of the original DC characters, so they could get proper attention in the grandiose DCAU, I’m more then content with what we got. Maybe it’s the fact that I’m starting to realize that my own generation is being quickly surpassed by a new, but my appreciation for the first generation of Superheroes has grown immensely, and much in due part to this love letter of an episode
The struggle of finding the original uploader just entertained the fuck out me! great content. Love the writing/edition just amazes me how u guys know the series so well that u can pick exactly the right scene for the moment u need xD.
If they had used JSA instead, that would mean they couldn't use The Atom, Black Canary or Wildcat, cause they'd be old, dead, and from another universe. Same for any older versions of current identities like Jay Garrick or Alan Scott. It'd be awkward when you have Green Arrow without Black Canary. I hope Lucho sees this.
What a great video! It’s amazing how you manage to make these otherwise trivial topics so compelling. And to answer the question: Yes, I would have preferred the JSA
I always love seeing bizarre internet rabbit holes like this. And to answer the question I am completely okay with the JGA being created as an homage but I would've preferred to see the JSA instead, I just generally prefer using underrated characters over creating new ones that serve the exact same purpose
Legends was my favorite episode of the show. As a kid, this was my introduction to at least the idea of the JSA. It wasn't until years later I learned this was meant to have the JSA, and it .ade me fall in love with it all over again. Glad you're covering this!
I THOUROUGHLY enjoyed this entire video! I am so pleasantly amazed at the amount of exhaustive research, time, effort, and emotion this required and yet the final product was so easy to consume as a viewer. Tremendous work folks at Watchtower! In my opinion. the Justice Guild was better for this episode. The way it was written preserves the JSA as a reality in my head Cannon, instead of an alternate world team up.
Regardless of anything I just wanna say this episode was one of my favorites from all of the dcau so well written an intriguing mystery even when you know what happens and just overall well done all around great video guys
What a detective story! It take a LOT of experience for someone to know enough about how the 'net, sites, archives, etc work to slog through this maze [or *is* it a labyrinth? I think maze is more correct]! Great work!
These “Big Mystery” videos always take you on an emotional roller coaster. Frustrating but fun. At least there’s an answer, even if you couldn’t get a hold of the original creator. I think I would’ve preferred the actual JSA, but since I’m not a DC aficionado, it probably would’ve been lost on me in its original airing. I’m a bit more knowledgeable on the DC universe now However. Lastly, I graduated in ‘04, so if James is ancient, that must make me a freaking skeleton! 😂
Im honestly okay with not having the JSA in this episode , as cool as it would be to have them on this episode it’s totally understandable why someone’s first introduction to JSA would be them being dead . I’m just glad that even if it’s not those exact characters it shares the same impact as a piece of media .
I preferred the justice guild over the justice society. I feel like being able to save the JSA characters for later episodes worked. It would have been confusing as more seasons aired.
Great video! I love the idea of the JSA on Earth 2, but the way the episode resolved would've made it difficult to go back to that well, so I guess I'm glad Legends was allowed to be the completely standalone Twilight Zone inspired story it was created to be, and that we got future stories with Wildcat, Alan Scott's child Obsidian, etc.
Well, this was a wild ride from start to finish. First I wasn’t expecting you to have graduated only a year before me, but that’s not the crazy thing. I was engrossed in this insane tale, basically ready to believe at every moment we were getting closer and ever closer to the answer. Funny thing is that I never grew up with this promo. Despite absolutely loving the DCAU and Justice League, my exposure to online communities was rather limited. I didn’t know this promo existed. It is an awesome piece of art and editing for the time, but there are two things I’ve never liked: lost media and lost attribution/credit. It’s a shame we may never know, but it’s nice that part of its history can be immortalized through this uh… Video feels like underselling but documentary feels like overselling? Investigative journalism we’ll call it.
Thanks for the kind words! Lucho is the creator of the piece. He even replied to my message on the forums, confirming I'd basically gotten all the "how"s and "why"s right! 😁
Along with my earlier message, your editing is absolutely Top Tier throughout each vid and the comedy sprinkled thoughout is perfect!😂🙌🏾 We need to continue to add to those Subs!
You definitely made me feel old. I graduated high school during the first season of Justice League. AND you made miss and feel nostalgic for pre-social media message forums. Excellent video. YOU are getting a sub.
There is something I kind of love about the people who manage to put something on the internet that last forever and then never take credit or get recognition. My Immortal is another great example of mystery internet legends.
Awesome video as always. Genuinely one of the MOST hardworking yotutubers on this platform. Literally any other content creator wouldve gave up or ended the video in just 25% of the efforts u guys did. And then on top of that making such a funny and interesting video, thank you.
I am 68, and have read comics my whole life. I had no problem with the substitution since it was a comics tradition. They would always pull the switcharoo whenever they wanted to dipict a character they couldn't really use, competing company, etc..., so, in a way, it felt natural to me. Great Video, very entertaining. Thank you.
JSA would have been a better way to have done that episode. But the knock off characters made me want to look at old comic books, I Remember begging my dad to take me to Half/price books to look at the old comics. Great video.
This is such a fun video. I personally wouldn't mind seeing the JSA in the show, but the episode was supposed to be a sendup to the Golden Age, so I am also fine with no JSA.
I saw this channel in the replies on a comment under a Mr. Sunday Movies tier rank of DC universes. I'm so glad I did! Justice League is so important to me and I didn't see this promo since I didn't have cable most of my childhood. So it's universe lore that I feel associated with but missed entirely and am happy to have learned about!
Also started your rewatch podcast which reminded me that Susan Eisenberg told me she was going to watch the Justice League show for the first time! (As if we're best friends, she told me at a con Lol) @@dcauwatchtower
My rewatch podcast, as in "Jump on the Bat-Wagon"? Thanks! Hope you enjoy it! Susan is indeed rewatching JL for the "Justice League Revisited" podcast she just started, too!
yes! Sorry forgot the name, similar to how ya'll didn't have a name in episode 1 😆 Well thanks to your podcast I remembered Susan was rewatching and I'm so excited! That's 2 new DCAU related podcasts for me! 🧡
Bless John Trumbull for his 11th hour contribution that gave us the connection to Lucho. I hope they do reach out one day, and that they mystery does get solved. I do love the cliffhanger, no doubt, but I am so invested in knowing the truth that i hope it does get discovered one day
Imma be honest here. I don't give a duck about the DCU animated series but the editing, the script writing and voice over quality of this channel is fantastic. Subbed
New shirts! ➡ teespring.com/stores/dcauwatchtower
P.S. Look, I don't even know who MJF is, y'all. The track came from the same TH-cam stock music library I always use. I've used it in like 3 other videos before this. It doesn't have any significant meaning, I promise. 😆
Which DC Characters really deserve their own animated series
It's nothing too interesting I'm afraid, just the theme song for a popular professional wrestler (the scripted kind of wrestling)
I know I could be wrong but I always thought Tom Turbine was a mix between Mighty Mister Titan a cartoon character from thr 1960s around the Silver Age of Comics era and of course Ultra Boy from the Super Boy comics of the 1950s but also from the Silver Age era.
He’s better than you and you know it!
Hey James, AEW superfan here to take your hand and guide you through this.
See, Maxwell Jacob Freeman (who is the current All Elite Wrestling World Heavyweight Champion) uses that TH-cam free-for-use theme as his entrance theme, and has just become synonymous with the theme being his own.
I know that it’s a public domain theme, and frankly, loved hearing it in the video. Just…watch out for those wrestling fans.
They be crazy…
The creepiness of John finding the fake books and destroyed subway was what made me remember the episode long after it aired.
It’s a crazy ass episodes like that one that makes Justice League still the best animated super hero show ever made
Thats what makes it a top 5 episode 4 me
900th like
I actually like DC's logic that the kids' first introduction to the JSA shouldn't be them seeing the Team be dead.
Wish all of DC and Marvel and other people running these things cared about that. Otherwise we wouldn't get Jimmy Olsen getting executed in [SPOILERS] Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice Ultimate Edition or Classic Professor X and Black Bolt in [SPOILERS] Doctor Strange: Multiverse of Madness.
Yeah, I can agree. I’m glad Brave and The Bold was my first exposure to Black Canary
And it makes commercial sense: multiple times in DC's history, they've retired the '40s Justice Society and/or its family of characters in the comic books, only to find renewed interest driving a revival. Off the top of my head, there's the JLA crossovers in the '60s, the resurrection of _All-Star Comics_ in 1976, the Geoff Johns-led revival in the 2000s, and, if I've heard correctly, yet another revival in 2019. Since _Justice League_ would be many kids' introduction to much of DC's lineup, they'd want to hedge their bets on the JSA.
I can respect that
That plot twist had me rolling😂 I started laughing as soon as I saw “that was from the original commercial”
that batman clip KILLED me 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
That Batman scream at 24:57 was just so accurate towards the situation.
I started crying laughing at that, it perfect
I've gone back and forth on the Justice Guild for a long time, but I think I'm okay with them being in the episode instead of the JSA. I do feel like a couple of their costume designs could've used a second pass though
For the sake of the story, the Justice Guild were a necessary invention.
@@kaiesstuff time travel and magic
@@kaiesstuffPatreon early access probably
Personally I prefere this way
Turbine looks better than his JSA counterpart in my opinion.
Just the fact the Seven Soldiers of Victory and members of the JSA appeared in JLU makes me happy. Instead of making all new original characters, creatives of the JLU showcased actual existing DC comics characters. Even if most of them were in the background, they were there. And that made me happy.
Shining Knight and Wildcat were both given focus episodes despite them being so obscure. I think the Bat-embargo was one of the best features of the DCAU since it forced the writers to dig deeper into DC's character roster and lore.
@@affsteak3530 I really think that they could have treated Diana better though, but yes the Bat-Embargo did allow more creative stories and obscure heroes to be explored.
Their mistreatment of Diana though was extremely gross. Especially since Unlimted was originally planned to be her show before arguments over Donna with the Teen Titans crew caused that embargo.
Whoever wrote her episodes in League and JLU (which I think was MacDuffie or at least someone else who was familiar with the John Byrne run) should have been writing a WW:TAS concurrently or at least someone today who's familiar with the runs that were used to make the Earth-508 Wonder plots when they actually cared about her. I mean they really had something going there with alluding to the Byrne run...too bad post of the time it was Atomic Age Kanigher...yikes.
@@Superlad9494I would've loved a series featuring Susan Eisenberg's Wonder Woman as the protagonist.
It's interesting to note that Catman is a character in the public domain. Originally spelled as Cat-Man, he was a hero, but later on, even the villain from DC Comics wore a similar costume. Over the years, many people have created their own versions of Catman.
Which is how and why he was in Fairly Odd Parents.
@@Anti-HyperLink Bingo and the same actor who played Batman played him. Perfect homage done right
@@NitwitsWorld I wonder if they asked Adam West to voice the JGA Catman.
@@shoresean1237 hmm 🤨 maybe but we will never know
@@shoresean1237 Might have. He did voice the actor in the Batman episode featuring the Gray Ghost.
I really enjoyed Black Canary and Wildcat's appearances in Unlimited, so I'm glad they went with new characters for the Guild. Besides, Tom Turbine has a sick design.
I will say I’m kinda miffed canary didn’t use her all black and yellow outfit from Gail Simone’s birds of prey designed by Ed benes. However the one shot drawn by Bruce timm is a nice alternative. I think my issue with it though is that BC in JLU is Dinah Lance and not Drake. Lance never wears the blue and black classic costume. Instead wearing the 80s and 90s jumpsuit or the Ed benes design. I get the dcau often goes for the classic designs but Dinah’s never makes sense because she’s a legacy character. She only wears that costume once or twice in the comics and it was directly related to her mom
"In seaboard city, crime doesn't pay".
Such an epic line.
Considering how it ended, I’m glad it wasn’t the real JSA. I love the episodes, some of my favourite from the whole DCAU, but had they introduced the JSA only to have them be dead the whole time wouldn’t have sat well with me. A brilliant love letter to the Golden Age, which doesn’t need the real characters to pay respects to it.
Yeah it would be kinda messed up
You mean like how Starman, Ted Grant, Rex Tyler, Jay Garrik, Alan Scott, Johnny Thunder (and presumably Charles McNider) all died before the events of the CW Stargirl show that took place on the post-crisis Earth-2 (Golden Age DC Universe in the post-crisis CWDC Multiverse like in the old comics (it's also gone by Earth 2 (no hyphen) and Earth-Two after the Crisis and Flashpoint reboots), although the pre-crisis Earth-3 Jay and his wife Joan returned in The Flash after the Paragons rebuilt Earth-1 as Earth-Prime and lived in Earth-Prime's Keystone City) and the show instead focused on Pat Dugan and their successors (all of which were in the comics) (Alan Scott's kids weren't focused on mind and The Flash's helmet remained unused by the time the show was canned and Jay never had a successor in the comics, which gives the implication he might have gotten stuck in the Speed Force, we'll never know though)?
@@mattwo7 Did you watch all of Stargirl?
@@BalderOdinson It's been a good while. Just double checked to be sure, that's not how that episode was originally meant to end, obviously. The show was canceled, it didn't end on its the production crew's own terms.
I just got done watching the first season of Justice League before it became unlimited and I'm half way through season 2 at the minute, and yeah. That was crazy when John Stewart found the headstones. Like WTF?!??! I was so confused for like a minute until I realised where they were going with it. Didn't remember those 2 episodes as it had been years since I watched them and I think I may have missed those episodes the first time around.
This was a legit gripping mystery!, Im so glad that I found this channel not only as a fan of the DCAU but because you guys put together great scripts and presentations about how these shows were made, the fanbases that they inspired, you all just go above and beyond.
I was born in 2001 and so my memories of the 00s are really scattered but I still get such an awesome sense of nostalgia with the music, the technology that was popular and accesible, the TV promos, and the online message boards - thank you WTDB this was really cool to see.
I'm totally cool with the Guild, we still got to see JSA members appear later on in JLU, I love how they handled Wildcat, and comics are up to the brim with pastiches, homages, and reinterpretations of classic characters - thats how we got Watchmen! And the show never came across as making fun of the JSA at least imo.
Emotional episode. "We died once saving this earth and we can do it again."
" if it wasnt for them, well, I might not be wearing this ring"
It's episode like this that made me see the importance and value of selflessness and sacrificing your wants and needs for the good of others. In short, a part of who I am today and my morals were influenced heavily by these cartoons.
@zmatthew91 that's what makes these shows so special. That's awesome to hear
I had a pretty similar experience a couple years ago where I was trying to track down the author a an extremely old bit of Final Fantasy fanfiction that took me across ancient archived websites and disused forums and crap too, so it's cool to see that sort of effort captured in a well edited video like this. I didn't find my guy either, despite coming super close too lol.
It really makes you wonder how many people who made cool shit back in the day are just out there living their lives and have no idea people still care enough to try to find them.
I can relate. I helped someone track down the origin of the 'Mr. Skeltal' meme and found myself on some ancient forums and websites. I got really emotional when I came across a 20 year old website maintained by a kid. He was going through such a rough time I just hope he got better!
I think having the Guild being "JSA in all but name only/serial numbers filed off" works better in the episode than what was originally planned simply because it adds a bit of mythos to the DCAU. John was inspired to become a hero because of the comics, it's a natural and human detail that helps flesh out the DCAU on a bit more of a personal level a lot like the Grey Ghost in BTAS. As a bonus for lore nerds, it not only helps keep the possibility of the JSA being in the main universe, but could potentially help reinforce it since the JGA might've been an unlicensed, fictionalized version of them thought up by comic book creators residing in the DCAU to build upon/ride the wave of the living mythos of the JSA. It's happened enough in real life with public figures that gained legendary status.
Plus they probably wanted to use the JSA for a future episode that never was. Same reason Watchmen opted for new characters inspired by existing characters.
theres also a trope in comics that in universe comics are the writers and artists channeling visions of other universe that who you get comic stires that are errily close to in universe events they had no way of knowing details, they honed on on one of those multiverse that are just slighty off as Owlman put it in Crisis
Oh shoot! That's a very good point!
I just think its weird they avoided doing the JSA but then they added characters later that were in the JSA.
Justice League Unlimited had Dr. Midnight, Hourman, and Hawkman
You can argue well these were just the new versions of them, a big plotline I very vaguely remember is the JSA had a big crisis that killed several of the members, most notably Dr. Midnight and Hourman. Now they did have successors, but Hourman in particular when I saw him on the show was the version that carried a staff. The JSA version was the one that had a staff.
Also I had to look up hawkman, cuz I was super confused how he hid his wings, and in the comics originally back in the JSA, Hawkman and Hawkgirls wings were magical pieces of gear from their nth metal harnesses. They could strap their wings on, and take them off like equipment. When Hawkman reveals himself to Hawkwoman, he pops on his winged harness. Also too with the idea of them being reincarnated and all that, they new versions of Hawkman and Hawkwoman could have easily been apart of the JSA.
I love the DCAU, but I think their biggest hangup was Crisis on Infinite Earths and the destruction of the multiverse. Anything too confusing or messed up from all the rectons they just took a wide step around. Like Supergirl was Superman's cousin and they created Argo for her, rather than her being a shapeshifting alien imposter brainwashed to think shes a kryptonian from CADMUS. Also I tried to follow the Brianiac rabbit hole... omg dont... Brainiac was so confusing before Crisis, Brainiac was more confusing after Crisis. Brainiac 5 makes even less sense (Brainiac 5 is special because he has a 12th level intellect, but Brainiac went crazy terrorizes the galaxy because he upgraded to a 12th level intellect. Also dear god what is a 12th level intellect)
I love DC, it was my universe of choice long before the MCU took off. However, trying to follow the plotlines from the 1940s to the present day will give you an ulcer. Just imagine that Crisis happened, no one except Barry Allen is aware of it, and we just all look at the pretty colors and move on with our lives.
That’s a lot of mental gymnastics for the 8 year old demographic
Keith David by the way is such a cool actor with a great deep voice. Goliath from Gargoyles was one of his best roles. He still sounded cool as him even in the non-canonical "The Goliath Chronicles". As for the video, it's interesting and entertaining as usual.
I like that it was an homage, rather than the real JSA. But I also wish it had been a bit more on the nose (that bad flash helmet lmao), and that it had a larger roster.
Your videos fill me with joy and wonder, and continue to be engaging, thoughtful, fun, and sincerely touching. I always enjoy them, but this one hit really deep. Thanks for making me laugh, and then making me cry (in the best of ways). Please keep doing what you do. LEGENDS, every one of you.
Thank you! 🥰
I would have loved a sandman starman Dr midnight and hourman homage
I love that Flash helmet!
It’s a throwback!
Edit: oh! Oh. Nevermind. That baseball helmet is atrocious
The version of the episode they went with worked beautifully. That John Stewart quote about learning to be a hero from the comics is even more poetic as viewers can relate to that. Great vid dudes.
I think that it doesn’t matter that it wasn’t the jsa because the point of the episode was more about what the characters mean rather than the physical characters. It also added to the uneasiness of the episode because the characters weren’t 100% what we knew
Alternate earth -_- various ones this was just to seek handouts like a bum let’s be real
I didn't expect the search for the original animator to be so entertaining! I hope they find out about this video, and you finally get a chance to interview them.
I’m honestly fine with the guild being in the episode. But it would be cool to see if they JSA do exist in the DCAU.
There is obsidian and sand who are legacy characters of the jsa so there's that
They do
The JSA existing in the DCAU would have been nice, but it could have contradicted the idea of the Justice League being Earth's first permanent superhero ensemble.
Same with the idea of the Justice Guild comics being inspired by the time traveling League shenanigans from "The Savage Time".
@@kylethefan6062 There's also Wildcat, and I count S.T.R.I.P.E. as well, since Pat Dugan was formerly Stripesy, the sidekick of the golden age hero, The Star Spangled Kid. Not technically JSA, but of that generation of heroes. Come to think of it, both Stargirl and Mister Terrific are legacy characters in the DC comic universe, and could well be in the DCAU if Starman and the original Mister Terrific existed. Maybe.
@@RogueTwo Don’t forget in JLU when Batman shouts “Clear the hangar!” Doctor Midnite and Hourman are two of the heroes who were previously talking that ran out of the hangar.
I liked the versions we got in the episode. My dad is a huge comic book nerd and would watch the cartoon with us kids. This was one of his favorite episodes. He loved explaining to my brother and I who they were based on and how awesome it was to see the inspiration come to life. He introduced kids to comic books and loved to explain it to us. To this day, it is my brother's and I favorite episode of JL because of that memory of us watching it over and over again with our dad. ❤
That's awesome
I won’t be surprised if someone thought this was Mandela Effect thing
"I have traveled to a new dimension, and now I must bring my message to them."
*Uploads JSA dimension hop episode promo*
"It cost so much but maybe it won't be in vain."
@@PanAndScanBuddyK
@@PanAndScanBuddy😂 Pretty much. The whole dimension hopping thing with Mandela Effect believers is ridiculous. They just can’t admit that memories are faulty and that people are easily influenced by others.
@@PanAndScanBuddy something a dc character would do
The MJF theme just randomly hitting mid viewing was something.
1:41 for those who need it
I thought I was having a stroke
Something shit
I was gonna comment the same thing 😄
That's the power of MJF choosing production library music for his theme - anyone can use it, including him no matter where he goes 😄
This was such a great video, kept me on the edge of my seat from start to finish. Reminded me a lot of Defunctland's, "Who wrote the Disney Channel Theme?" video. I fucking love a good viral mystery to uncover the artist behind a small piece of meta nerd comic discussion trivia. Solving urban legends makes for the best content, this was FANTASTIC!
I was hoping it might remind folks of that! A fantastic video. Thank you!
I recall that video and I LOVE that comparison.
Who knows maybe lucho might show up this year. 😊
Your dedication yo this universe is UNMATCHED. You guys are incredible
I actually prefer the Guild being as they are now, a solid JSA tribute act with their own incredible story and valuable moral lesson. However, I would love to see an alternate ending where the "real" JSA have just finished watching the same episode we just witnessed. They discuss the events among their membership, noting the similarities and differences to their own world. From offscreen, the voice of Tim Daly (Unrealistic at the time, I know, but I wanna do a mythos gag, darn it!) says to the assembled gathering of Golden Age greats, "That was a hum-dinger of a tale, but of course, they could never do justice to the time WE met up with those guys, eh?" The speaker steps into the room. It's the Golden Age Superman, exactly as Shuster used to draw him, costume, spit curl and all. He turns to the "camera," winks at us, cut to black. And the "real story" could've been a DC Universe Original Movie DTV a decade later!
By the way, I noticed on the revived Toonzone forum post you showed, Lucho's signature reads, "Ja think I'm a cowboy?" That's remarkably similar to the very first line Popeye ever spoke in the comics. Not sure if that'd help in any future search, but I thought it worth noting anyway. Thanks, Hats Off Entertainment, for posting a video on the 1980 Popeye film, and for including the very panel in question early in the runtime!
yeah that would have been really fucking meta
I like how we have replacements. It's hard to explain but the fact that they are familiar but not quite what we remember adds to the surreal nature of the episode.
When the episode came out, I figured the justice guild was just a team I had never heard of. It's not crazy to think that there are multiple versions of similar characters. I mean there basically already are.
This might be your best video yet! The editing is so good. Informative, engaging, and hilarious. The build up/pay off around 24:40 in particular is a favorite of mine.
It's truly sad we never got an episode about the JSA, probably an incarnation from a different universe, meeting the JL. Heck, imagine Clark, Bruce and Diana meeting their 40's counterparts. It would be the SH*T!
Especially if you made JSA Clark the social crusader Clark that was in the early Golden age stories same for batman with him being a killer
I feel like establishing 1940s counterparts to the Trinity wouldn't work as well in the DCAU
@@jadenbryant9283 and the fact that compared to Earth-508 Diana the 1940's Diana actually was able to do something.
@@Superlad9494 well I dont know about that.
@@jadenbryant9283 Earth-508 pretty much treated Diana as a bit of a "female brute" most of the time like Atomic Age Wonder Woman by Bob Kanigher who didn't even bother giving her a silver age update until 1958.
The Marston Diana was the balance between Clark and Bruce and most modern WW writers are aware of this. That said...the Seikowsky WW was even worse than the Atomic Age Kanigher one.
I think I’m good with the JGA for story purposes. There are already enough retcons regarding the canon material and them being comic characters work well enough for the story. It was also a p cool to bring up the idea of multiple worlds at such an early stage of comic related content. The JSA on the other hand may have actually existed before JLA, but they probably didn’t officially call themselves the JSA or the media might have at some point. They’re def the inspiration for the JGA comics so they had to have teamed up for some significant event at some point.
DCAU was my introduction to the DC superheros, so I thought the Guild were the old old comic book characters. Wouldn't have known they were invented for the show.
I legit didn't know about the fake trailer, but I remember the real episode! It's one of the only episodes that openly acknowledges racism 😂
I've reccently come to the conclusion that WB/DC are ineffectual helicopter parents when it comes to their I.P. The behind the scenes meddling was most apparent to me within the Snyder/Whedon debacle, but watching your videos crystalizes that perception for me. The writers and animators had so much love for the source material and they were prevented from fully expressing their admiration for the stories and art that came before. I hope Gunn can right the ship for the company and deliver quality entertainment with unabashed creativity. DC should have allowed the JSA to appear in the episode, introducing and paying homage to the characters for the younger generation.
That's always the case. Corporatism/corporate greed and public perception/opinion almost always beats anything even vaguely altruistic or sentimental. Similar situation with cars and really cool concept designs that get turned into boring SUVs and such.
On the other hand, if they had done that, we likely wouldn't have seen some of those same JSA characters later on in Justice League Unlimited. ("The Cat and the Canary" is one of my favorite episodes.)
if the guy said it was a commerical that means it is a cartoon network lost media ad
thou i doubt it...
Gotta hand it to ya, you're a good storyteller. This whole saga plays out similarly to some of the best lost media hunts.
I think the Justice Guild (and also those villains) here works better because even for those who know about the JSA it gives a feeling that everything is familiar but also kinda weird, wich fits the episode well.
Fantastic video as always!
Remember kids, never ever under any circumstances ever post anything resembling or relating to your real name online or someone who's very interested in DC cartoons will find you.
A wild exploration into this weird bit of history! I forgot seeing this promo so long ago, even before I knew the story! It may have even been one of my early intros to the JSA, wild to see it all like this, I kinda miss that old era of the internet, was truly a wild west.
Its fascinating how quickly things can be lost on the internet. We like to think that the web helps archival, and while thats true, a lot of things can fall through the cracks just as easily.
I mean.. early internet *wasn't* made to archive.. back then it just kinda existed.. so it makes sense things could be lost, they weren't made to not be
These episodes were one of my favorites in the entire show. I’ve always been okay with them not being the JSA. It’s actually even cooler in my opinion. Original characters with similarities was always just cool I guess
TH-cam has become such a varied and interesting place that people can get 100's of thousands of views for a video about a deep dive into a fake fan made commercial for a nearly 20 year old cartoon show, and ostensibly, make a living doing it. As an OG nerd, i feel like the proud papa a I look over the worlds that Fandom has built and can't help but to smile. The guys who talk about the franchises are sometimes bigger than the franchises themselves, which can lead to a paradox. Keep up the good stuff! 👍🏾
I appreciate it!
@@dcauwatchtower Any time. Love what you do.
I think it is overall better that the jsa weren't actually in the episode, it allowed new characters to inspire people and bring wonder into the world and it allowed jsa members to appear later on in the show without questioning why they weren't dead
Bro this is like the Defunctland for comic books channel, I really love it - going to watch another one of your videos now
I think its important that its its own metatextual fictional universe within a fictional universe. It makes the story more real for us and the idea that we might have a real chance to meet superman one day becomes more real.
Considering how the episode ended up, I'm okay with the Justice Guild as they were portrayed in the episode. The intention is clear without being explicit. It also frees up JSA members, as you mentioned.
Also, I vaguely remember Lucho from the earlier ToonZone days. I wasn't expected him to be the answer (?) to this mystery.
To answer the question of the day, I personally didn’t mind the substitution of the Guild for the JSA. Because as long it still helps the writers to tell the story they want to tell, I can live with that.
This episode had me on the edge of my seat the whole time!
I remember when this aired. I was always prepared for any DC premier and when I watched how the episode ended, I couldn’t stop crying. I was 8, but a part of me seeing the old classic references and knowing what happened to the Justice Guild, made me sad. My dad asked me why I was still so upset after the episode ended and I remember saying, “They’re gone now and they didn’t want to be. Everyone kept going(I meant to say moving on).”
My dad said, “But Green Lantern was inspired by them. Like you’re inspired by the Justice League. That’s why they’re heroes.”
That was the moment I think I had realized as a kid, truly, the saying about Heroes coming and going while legends never die.
I would have loved to see the original JS as an homage but the JG was just as inspiring and amazing as an episode.
As much as I love the JSA, I do appreciate the homage team. They were able to incorporate some silver age stuff instead of straight golden age (like Catman also being inspired by Adam West’s Batman). If only Alan Scott really existed in the DCAU 💔💔💔
When John Trumbull popped up I thought the plot twist of the century was that he made it 😭 (your remake turned out INCREDIBLE James!!!)
Now some kid 20 years later will repeat the cycle
I think the episode would have had a bit more emotional gravitas to it if it had been the JSA, but the episode is a fun throwback to a more innocent time in comic books and I like it very much.
I was about to say, I don't think The Atom has ever been in an animated anything I've seen, I do remember seeing the Justice League cartoon.
Honestly I really liked what we got in the justice league episode. I still can’t help but want a different version with the original justice league society though. Awesome video I can’t believe how far back you could go with that research it really reminds me what you can do on the internet
What a fucking roller coaster of emotions. Top-tier storytelling. Definitely among the best comic book related contents I have ever seen in my life
I absolutely love this episode! It’s one of my favorites from the old JL show. And although I would’ve much preferred to see that of the original DC characters, so they could get proper attention in the grandiose DCAU, I’m more then content with what we got. Maybe it’s the fact that I’m starting to realize that my own generation is being quickly surpassed by a new, but my appreciation for the first generation of Superheroes has grown immensely, and much in due part to this love letter of an episode
It was Me BARRY!
The struggle of finding the original uploader just entertained the fuck out me! great content. Love the writing/edition just amazes me how u guys know the series so well that u can pick exactly the right scene for the moment u need xD.
If they had used JSA instead, that would mean they couldn't use The Atom, Black Canary or Wildcat, cause they'd be old, dead, and from another universe. Same for any older versions of current identities like Jay Garrick or Alan Scott. It'd be awkward when you have Green Arrow without Black Canary.
I hope Lucho sees this.
Looking back at this episode I can say with out a doubt, the Justice Guild fits perfectly with the story they were trying to tell.
What a great video! It’s amazing how you manage to make these otherwise trivial topics so compelling. And to answer the question: Yes, I would have preferred the JSA
I always love seeing bizarre internet rabbit holes like this. And to answer the question I am completely okay with the JGA being created as an homage but I would've preferred to see the JSA instead, I just generally prefer using underrated characters over creating new ones that serve the exact same purpose
I've never seen or heard of this fake version, but that Animation and art style is spot on I can see why it would've fooled some
This was incredibly entertaining, guys. You are always putting consistenly amazing content!
Legends was my favorite episode of the show. As a kid, this was my introduction to at least the idea of the JSA. It wasn't until years later I learned this was meant to have the JSA, and it .ade me fall in love with it all over again. Glad you're covering this!
I THOUROUGHLY enjoyed this entire video! I am so pleasantly amazed at the amount of exhaustive research, time, effort, and emotion this required and yet the final product was so easy to consume as a viewer. Tremendous work folks at Watchtower!
In my opinion. the Justice Guild was better for this episode. The way it was written preserves the JSA as a reality in my head Cannon, instead of an alternate world team up.
Thank you!
I love this video, and I genuinely hope Lucho sees it. We all deserve an update on this mystery!
At first he was gonna say the Justice Guild episode wasn’t real and I was about to legit freak out lmaooo
Regardless of anything I just wanna say this episode was one of my favorites from all of the dcau so well written an intriguing mystery even when you know what happens and just overall well done all around great video guys
What a detective story! It take a LOT of experience for someone to know enough about how the 'net, sites, archives, etc work to slog through this maze [or *is* it a labyrinth? I think maze is more correct]! Great work!
I loved the Batman levels of detective work done lol 😆
I LOL when I first came upon Captain Tootsy Roll in a book years ago and I still chuckle just thinking about him. Thanks for that.
I need like a full ten minutes to stop laughing at the wallet bit😂😂
These “Big Mystery” videos always take you on an emotional roller coaster. Frustrating but fun. At least there’s an answer, even if you couldn’t get a hold of the original creator. I think I would’ve preferred the actual JSA, but since I’m not a DC aficionado, it probably would’ve been lost on me in its original airing. I’m a bit more knowledgeable on the DC universe now However. Lastly, I graduated in ‘04, so if James is ancient, that must make me a freaking skeleton! 😂
Im honestly okay with not having the JSA in this episode , as cool as it would be to have them on this episode it’s totally understandable why someone’s first introduction to JSA would be them being dead . I’m just glad that even if it’s not those exact characters it shares the same impact as a piece of media .
This was the first time I'd ever seen or heard of this fake promo.
This was a fun watch!
I preferred the justice guild over the justice society. I feel like being able to save the JSA characters for later episodes worked. It would have been confusing as more seasons aired.
I love how in your videos you literally are the embodiment of The Question. It makes staying focused a lot more enjoyable 😊
Great video! I love the idea of the JSA on Earth 2, but the way the episode resolved would've made it difficult to go back to that well, so I guess I'm glad Legends was allowed to be the completely standalone Twilight Zone inspired story it was created to be, and that we got future stories with Wildcat, Alan Scott's child Obsidian, etc.
Shoutout to Aunt Laura for getting the channel started years ago
I think it would have felt kinda weird for the justice society’s appearance to have them be dead. Ultimately I think I prefer the analogue
Well, this was a wild ride from start to finish. First I wasn’t expecting you to have graduated only a year before me, but that’s not the crazy thing. I was engrossed in this insane tale, basically ready to believe at every moment we were getting closer and ever closer to the answer.
Funny thing is that I never grew up with this promo. Despite absolutely loving the DCAU and Justice League, my exposure to online communities was rather limited. I didn’t know this promo existed. It is an awesome piece of art and editing for the time, but there are two things I’ve never liked: lost media and lost attribution/credit.
It’s a shame we may never know, but it’s nice that part of its history can be immortalized through this uh… Video feels like underselling but documentary feels like overselling? Investigative journalism we’ll call it.
Thanks for the kind words! Lucho is the creator of the piece. He even replied to my message on the forums, confirming I'd basically gotten all the "how"s and "why"s right! 😁
@@dcauwatchtower oh thank goodness we have answers, I am so glad to hear that!
You can't just jumpscare me with MJF's theme like that
the way I scrolled straight to the comments the moment I heard it
@@TheGhxstRoguesameeee
What a fantastically produced video! Reminds me of Defunctland’s stuff, I can tell how much love and craft you put into this. Awesome work
THE BEAVER SAW IMAGE IN THE COMMUNITY POST FINALLY MAKES SENSE!!
The Manray bit is the kind of youtube content that makes paying for internet every month worth it
Along with my earlier message, your editing is absolutely Top Tier throughout each vid and the comedy sprinkled thoughout is perfect!😂🙌🏾 We need to continue to add to those Subs!
You definitely made me feel old. I graduated high school during the first season of Justice League.
AND you made miss and feel nostalgic for pre-social media message forums.
Excellent video. YOU are getting a sub.
I graduated high school in 1985 while the Superfriends were on tv so, I'm already old.
Honestly the idea of "fictional media for a fictional setting" is one of my favorite parts as a grown up, heck it makes things relatable yet different
There is something I kind of love about the people who manage to put something on the internet that last forever and then never take credit or get recognition. My Immortal is another great example of mystery internet legends.
Awesome video as always. Genuinely one of the MOST hardworking yotutubers on this platform. Literally any other content creator wouldve gave up or ended the video in just 25% of the efforts u guys did. And then on top of that making such a funny and interesting video, thank you.
Ironic how DC did not want these characters to be killed off on their introduction, when SSKTJL introduced the Justice League only to be killed off
The Justice Society would've been appearing in motion for the very first time
I would be fine with Legends being the Justice Guild, if we had seen more than just Wildcat in JLU. Great video, and great detective work
I am 68, and have read comics my whole life. I had no problem with the substitution since it was a comics tradition. They would always pull the switcharoo whenever they wanted to dipict a character they couldn't really use, competing company, etc..., so, in a way, it felt natural to me. Great Video, very entertaining. Thank you.
I think it's stronger to have the comic book character rendition of the team as separate identities is dope. The more the merrier imo
JSA would have been a better way to have done that episode. But the knock off characters made me want to look at old comic books, I Remember begging my dad to take me to Half/price books to look at the old comics.
Great video.
5:11 Imagine DC comics actually caring about how their characters are portrayed in tv and movies. How things change.
This is such a fun video. I personally wouldn't mind seeing the JSA in the show, but the episode was supposed to be a sendup to the Golden Age, so I am also fine with no JSA.
Definitely want to see a full JSA video. Loving the work.
I saw this channel in the replies on a comment under a Mr. Sunday Movies tier rank of DC universes. I'm so glad I did! Justice League is so important to me and I didn't see this promo since I didn't have cable most of my childhood. So it's universe lore that I feel associated with but missed entirely and am happy to have learned about!
Eyyyyyyyy!
Also started your rewatch podcast which reminded me that Susan Eisenberg told me she was going to watch the Justice League show for the first time! (As if we're best friends, she told me at a con Lol) @@dcauwatchtower
My rewatch podcast, as in "Jump on the Bat-Wagon"? Thanks! Hope you enjoy it! Susan is indeed rewatching JL for the "Justice League Revisited" podcast she just started, too!
yes! Sorry forgot the name, similar to how ya'll didn't have a name in episode 1 😆 Well thanks to your podcast I remembered Susan was rewatching and I'm so excited! That's 2 new DCAU related podcasts for me! 🧡
Bless John Trumbull for his 11th hour contribution that gave us the connection to Lucho. I hope they do reach out one day, and that they mystery does get solved. I do love the cliffhanger, no doubt, but I am so invested in knowing the truth that i hope it does get discovered one day
Imma be honest here. I don't give a duck about the DCU animated series but the editing, the script writing and voice over quality of this channel is fantastic. Subbed