Overdrive ENGAGED | Fan Showdown S4E1
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 ม.ค. 2022
- Today is everyone’s favorite time, time to start a new season of the Fan Showdown, wipe the board clean and switch things up. This season the focus will be on airflow, the goal in season four is to make a fan that moves as much air as possible. Think case fans, forget static pressure and instead maximize CFM.
Fan Dims and reference models
www.thingiverse.com/thing:455...
My Twitch
/ majorhardware
Fan Showdown Instructions
• EVERYTHING you need to...
Submit your design (at least .STL file)
fanshowdown@gmail.com
Cameras used.
BlackMagic Pocket cinema 6k pro
amzn.to/3m2RLVw
Filament used (FormFutura Galaxy PLA Space Grey)
amzn.to/3rfK9Bi - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
Hey, if anyone is looking for the stl for my T33 fan, it's over on Prusa Prints, for reference or to use or whatever.
"Yeah, so I made a fan, that is at least as good as Noctua, just quieter, despite being 3D printed and not injection moulded, so yeah here it is and have fun!"
Man, you're the hero of engineering community!
@@Vatharian well now you're just making me blush!...
A man of Legends
You're a legend man!
I don't even have a 3d printer and I'm making a copy for personal use.
Use a drill to run the gears in for 10minutes or so. It loosens them right up.
@@user-ip3zi5mb6lprinted gears like these always need to be broken in first because of printing imperfections. Running the setup on a drill speeds up this process and ensures that any imperfections have been rubbed out by friction between the parts.
It's sad watching designs unable to give it their best shot because this host fails as a maker.
Hell yeah, I love this series. I'm a fan.
I...... See what you did there
XD
But you are not a... Fan!
Yeah it’s a breath of fresh air from other series, I’m blown away
Same lol
Different dyes in plastics can cause weakness. I vaguely remember Noctua saying they didn’t want to make black fans because the resin wouldn’t be as strong. So you’re probably not off base thinking it’s weaker.
case and point: Lime green lego was notorious for being brittle and breaking. something about the die messed up the plastic composition.
@@572089 Also, in 3D printing, each color will require slightly different process (temps, sometimes speeds as well if you’re really trying to nail it) and shrink rates in order to make consistent prints.
It should be noted that if they are using injection it has more to do in issues of keeping the machine running enough to make it worth the cost of stamping. I had more issues in keeping color controls for quality in mixing the color and it having the conditioning for the surface molding texture. Certain parts from the line we had would make a charcoal and swirl if there too little color and it would scorch in the mold and pit or bubble even. The clear stuff uses dyes more as they tend to be more for that purpose.
@@rallyfeind From my understanding with regards to Noctua, they’re using something more like a thermoset resin than a traditional thermoplastic, so they can hit tighter blade-to-frame tolerances. That’s once again from fuzzy memory from forever ago though. And yeah, I used to work in injection molding too. :) it’s what lead me into 3D printing. The biggest issues we’d see were lack of proper mixing with colorants as well, though something I noticed is even then there was some difference in barrel temps/pressures depending on the dyes and additives added to the resin for the more tolerance-picky customers.
@@underscorenul Yeah it is the resin part specifically. Nylons are a pain to not get contaminated in the same injectors as anthing if they aren't cleaned obsessively for example. It all matters what exactly is being used and fairly it was just a matter of they may have one of those pesky goldilocks zones in the pigment or dye area. The khaki and rust red were always a mess and would print scrap for sometimes an entire shift even on stuff because a batch shifted slightly too.
I think apart from fan geometry, the "Cheater" has two major advantages:
1. It has a proper inlet which has a remarkable impact on the flow. Almost all larger commercial flow machines from (subsonic) jet engines to industrial fans have similar shaped inlets.
2. It stabilizes the swirl created by the rotating fan blades, realigning the tangential velocity component and thereby creating a less divergent flow.
I think any fan design that could challenge the "Cheater" needs to have these two features too which would make it look very similar to the "Cheater".
And I think whoever designed it must have had some major knowledge in fluid dynamics :D
I'd like to see the T33 in the cheaters shroud.
The Autor called it Cheater BECAUSE of this, Also, dude has some great drawing skills.
Here is the episode. The fan appears on 4:40
th-cam.com/video/I2lxGYplpMA/w-d-xo.html
There should be a separate category for fans with accoutrement like the cheater. Using it as the baseline is bad. Set it to the side or every fan will have to have the cheater stuff on it or else lose.
That's what I was thinking. Ducted airflow is always better. I bet every fan would perform 10-15% better when ducted
And it kinda defeats the purpose when dragging a fan into the next 2 seasons, because it will always be in the top. I wanna see new fans outcompeting each other. And maybe a winners special when we get to season 5.
I kinda feel the same way. The ducts that come with The Cheater are performance enhancements that are compatible with most other fans in the comp. Someone bothered to make them, with design not particularly unique to their actual fan, and gets a walk thereafter? Either remove them or make them the standard rig, at least an option for any entrant to choose to use, otherwise what we're comparing is how much people are willing to cad above and beyond making a fan.
Agreed. Need separate classes for shrouded vs non shrouded.
Would like to see bearings being used to create more complex designs (would definitely help Artem’s profan).
Perhaps if you suggest several standard bearing sizes for people to use/design for (e.g. 40mm, 22mm & 16mm?) then you can keep reusing them rather than having to buy different sized bearings for each design?
Yeah thats a good idea?
This
I guess thats only an option if destroying the 3d prints to recover the bearings is OK as the bearings would need to be press-fitted to work well ...
@@OldLukes just buy a bag of them, they are not that expensive..
Probably 608 bearings would be best to design around. It's the size used for skateboard wheels, and is very common in consumer and industrial applications. I've used them in my 3D printed projects. You can pick up a dozen of them for less than $20. They are 8mm ID, 22mm OD and 7mm width.
instead of using dremel to cut open the fan, use a soldering iron with a flat head to cut the fan,this way you won't mess up the beautiful metal hub
However you will mess up with your beautiful clean soldering iron :P
@@eisbarfan7716 couple pass with a sand paper and is good as new
@@V843v3r also you will be happier with less vibrations because of metal getting off a perfectly balanced cap.
Since they are fully encapsulating the hub in the new fan design, they needed vent holes to allow air to escape during the assembly process. That's my guess.
my guess is its a different manufacturer that's producing their motors for the new fan.
Going forward Cubic Feet per Minute should be the one you reference instead of Feet per Minute (you even have it on the spread sheet). Reason being that FpM is dependent on that particular test setup whereas, theoretically, CFpM isn't. I.E. if you retested a fan with a wind-tunnel twice the diameter then Feet per Minute would plummet but Cubic Feet per Minute (should) remain constant; same fan should result in the same metric. It's also the unit fans advertise themselves in.
I'm super hyped though.
Yea the fpm kinda confused me there.
i was thinking it should be cfm also.
As long as all the fans are tested with the same tunnel it doesn't make a difference, fpm with a constant setup is essentially just cfm with larger numbers.
Mind you, if you want to do it Properly you measure these things in cubic metres per second...
@@laurencefraser nocta lists m³/h for their fans. A12X25 is rated at 102.1 m³/h which would be equivalent to 60 cfm. 1cfm = 1.7 m³/h or 0.000471m³/s if you like that better
3:48 Those two holes in the Chromax hub are possibly to allow trapped air to escape when press-fitting the fully enclosed fan to the hub. This is not needed on the brown colorway because the center of the fan is open, allowing air to flow out freely when being pressed onto to the hub.
I 'm totally on board with the new testing method. Changing the game like that SHOULD inspire an entirely new group of fan designs. Noctua tries to balance both use cases so it new designs should overtake it pretty quickly when going for straight airflow. I speculate that thinner blades with more surface area will dominate this season.
I would really like you to go through the last 3 seasons' contestants (knowing what you do about them) & pick a few to rerun in the wind tunnel. Trying them in the new application. Call it a recap or honor guard etc.
my issue with this is that we dont get to compare it with the past 3 seasons in terms of temperatures and stuff, we just get airspeed.
New session, new rules!
Yes, it would be nice, to retest, say, the top 3 fans from each of the previous seasons using the new methodology for comparison.
I think that's part of the point. He can test fans more rapidly rather than needing to wait for a cooling system to reach equilibrium. Maybe doing an airspeed test with the wind tunnel as is, then another with a restricter plate between the fan and the stabilizing grid would give a slightly more realistic test point group.
He'll likely add some of the old ones if people ask for them, he's done it before.
Use a hand drill to run the geared fan for ~10 min all set up with graphite and everything. It takes some time to work it in + break down the plastic bits that don't mesh perfectly through friction.
I wanna see a special where you take some of the top fans/fan favorites and try resin printing them. Compare the different print types/surface texture to see what it does to the fan performance
With GN now having there new fan benchmarking tech in hand and are working out how to utilize it properly. I think it would be super cool if you guys were able to make some type of colab together. Maybe taking the winners from each season and there results, and comparing them to the best selling or highest rated fans on newegg from the last couple years
OH! Crossover episode for the season finale!
Subtracting the stock noctua fan frequency spectrum from the 3D-printed ones would give a neat curve that could show what frequency stands out, relative to each other.
I don't even own a computer and still watch this religiously. Keep it up man!
Whoever designs the next planetary gear should design the three rotating gears so that they have mini fans inside them that also help push air through as well and a true master would be able to stuff some in he center sprocket as well.
Already done. As major said in this video
yeah I typed the comment about a minute into the video. I feel like the gears add too much surface area to help though if you get a stronger motor that runs better slower it might be worth it. It might be nice to see them run with more power and more speed to see if we can tease out a few more nuances between the designs like what speeds are best for different things. The genius of the zig zag design though was that it acted like adding a duct to the fan blade but inside the radius of the blade!
Volume over time is a better indicator of airflow than airspeed.
I wonder if the industrial PPM Noctua fans would do better. They have a 4 pin 3000 rpm version that is incredible on its own for static pressure (1700rpm it out performs the browns ones). That might have enough juice for some new fan designs
I get what you're saying, but the whole series is based on "what if I made my own blades for the a12x25?"
Maybe a different series where the fan motor isn't the limiter will happen in the future or as a side series
At the end of the season, a colab with Gamers Nexus's fan tester for the top of the top would be amazing.
Best idea for years 🤞
Man, the improvements to this series are amazing.
I love how all of this have improved, from the gear you use to test to the details on each one of the fans presented in the show. Keep the good work, sir!
The memes.... I love em. All fantastic. Please keep delivering us all the holy memes
I can proudly say I designed the Polytex and it came dead last! pumped that it was even featured, thankyou all, roast me in the comments, cheers!
No such thing as last thanks for taking the time to draw something up and send it in much appreciated
I like the new direction with case fan designs. I'm glad you are keeping this interesting by doing something new.
@2:45 that owl has such a scowl… 😜
I'm excited to see what crazy designs people come up with this season!
That audio comparison is way better!!
Appreciate you putting all this together so we can geek out with you without all the effort lol 💜💜
That outro sequence with the green light through the mist is gorgeous, just needs some synthwave music over top and it's perfect.
that end card video was hauntingly awesome, great vids cant wait for the next one
I like the change-up in the format, keep it fresh!
The Michael scene was pure gold, nice vid!
Quality of the editing and humor in this is top notch.👍
The cool looking laser test at the end made me happy, please add this as a test for all the fans!
Love the look of the black filament!
Comparison between motors is alot more interesting as weve seen a ton of fan blades in several months now.
Like how many windings used, how thick the gauge used in the motor, what kind of materials used in the motor.
This is the most overlooked part of a fan.
3:52 Those are position holes. They're there to line up with the pins in the stamping die during manufacturing.
The dark room, lasor line, air flow, fan test clip at the end was pretty cool.
Finally you popped back into my feed.
A gear based "fan" that is an analog clock with hands similar to this would be interesting.
love last part with green laser😍😊👍🙏♥ thankyou :)
The holes in the hub may be to facilitate assembly. When pressing the fan body onto the drive the holes are an air escape so they can (possibly) achieve better bonding.
Ok I laughed when Michael Scott got involved in this. That was an excellent overlay xD
Thanks man, love your channel.
Dude the lose of hair and growth of you beard is the perfect look. Been watching since season one and I gotta say this look is the one brother.
New season, new rules. I am a fan of the fan show down, keep up the good work!
Great job! This season is going to be awesome.
HOLY CRAP the laser smoke test at the end was REALLY badass
That's a cool effect with the laser at the end. Makes me think of stream intermission backgrounds.
Wooooo, my favourite YT series are back with S4!
I'm looking forward to season 4! Thanks for the great content :D
The 4 way smoke test looked great .
The laser line at the end looks promising! Maybe it is ab bit more visible if it is mounted above the fan, so it shows the airflow before and after the fan?
Love the show!
Get it bro. This onrunning PC fanexperimentation has me subbing. Done.
I have covid right now and binging your channel is keeping me sane while I'm locked up away from my wife and kids. Thanks, bro!
Excited for this season!
The phantom pain in my non-existent fan blades really did fit the "no! god, no!" clip.
I was just watching a video about automatic transmissions and learned about overdrive just in time to see this in the recommended section!
_The Show that Tries to Blow!_
Shaved head is rockin bro. Went up a solid 2 points.
opening it to fans with bearings is gonna be a whole new beast.
For fans with gears making a test bed hooked to power drill type power could allow the gears to get rid of the friction so it’ll work when powered by the fan motor. A lot of geared 3D printing things I’ve done I’ve had them run on a higher power source to let them smooth/round out and then they work flawlessly on lower power
That laser at the end. Nice.
THERE'S NO RULES! Lmfao I love that commercial
The two holes are there to expel the air caught in between the fan and the hub, because they are also using adhesive. To prevent glue displacement while pressing the fan onto the hub.
The holes are probably attachment points for the fan. Plastic or adhesive may squeeze down into the holes or maybe the fan blade has nubs that fit down in holes. Maybe for positioning or alignment.
Ooo green smoke. Looks sick
miss you sir.
dope videoo, love the idea
the laser smoke. I liked that alot
I think at this point we all need to petition Noctua to just send you a couple of fan hubs only just so they can help play along and maybe they too could send you a wild fun design or two that they know they would never use commercially
I would like to see a counter-rotating fan here one day
STOP THAT WAS MY IDEA!!!
I’ve had this idea since season 2, but it’s way beyond my capabilities of design. Someone out there can design it, I know it.
Oh shoot, I didn't know such thing exist, Now I'm excited
Major Hardware please see this
@@markzaikov456 most likely if they work...they could be the most Efficient fan.
Yep someone made it 4 weeks ago on the r/FanShowdown subreddit, not sure if they've finished it enough to submit but I hope we see it this season.
Through the previous 4 seasons, the delta of the temperature was to me the most important part, the thing all were based on. Now that the CFM is the biggest concern. My submitted design which was made regarding cooling may not be as useful. I'd like the temperature to return.
PLEASE SHOW MORE LASER SMOKE!
I've been thinking that seeing a cross section of the airflow would be super interesting and informative!
I think the geared fan needs a redesign with a bit less of a gearing advantage, possibly just a 2 or 3:1 with the addition of some bearings. Id love to see one with some high speed bearings out of a fidget spinner or something because the would be cheap
YES YES YES!!! New season! I love it.
The holes are probably for reference for a machining step or to lock the plastic from the blades in place in the case the blades are over moulded that is
The ending was amazing
Id like to hear a blank fan motor before the read outs for sound on each fan. I know i can hear a baseline sound in there but cant quite figure out which sound it is. Also stoked for another season. havnt missed one yet, keep it up man.
too funny! Love your work!
Perhaps the holes in the hub are to let air out as the blades are being fitted since now it'll be sealed from the front side.
thumbs up for the tear down
4:13 It is because the fan blade assembly they put on top is closed. And it looks like a tight fit, especially with the glue, but also without.
And if you put those two together, the trapped air needs someplace to go.
Big fan of this series
It would be interesting to see the differences between positive pressure vs negative pressure (push vs pull). Maybe test if there is an air flow difference and a cooling difference.
You have tested both style fans in the showdowns, but it has not been established if one style is better than the other. Or if it even makes a difference at all…
Keep up the good work and always look forward to the next episode!
God i loved that comercial when i saw it 🤣🤣
Love the unrestricted competition!
I really like the laminar flow of the slimfan
i watch this for the meme references only. you could say I'm a fan.
My thought: Props dude, props.
I like the tune during the Noctua Fan disassembly: it's the same tune from tv show Black Sails (0:50s in).
It's possible that the addition of the black pigment to the plastic made the material more brittle than it is in the normal brown fan. I recall in a previous episode when you were talking about them working on a black version of the fan that was one of the reasons that noctua gave for not having made them yet.
note on the planetary gears: if they are involute gears then the assembly has only one configuration in which it will assemble properly (if the tooth number on each gear isn't even- it shouldn't)
Season 25: "Brought to you once again by JPL, we're testing for heterogynous aero baffle thrust vectoring and bilge recidivism in innert gasses for each of the planets in our solar system, our rig is a warehouse with atmosphere controls supplied by AirGas and Boeing, before we get started lets go through the various test atmospheres, their Navier-Stokes coefficients, and how that relates to Bernoulli's principle with regard to planetary physics..."
I want to see more geared Fans, please add a bearing to the design options
Edit: Also, woah! That part at the end with laser
already adjusted the design for use with 3x7x11mm bearings for the axes and trying the planar one for the sun gear
great start to season 4
Smoke and lasers, nice👌.
the planetary gear fan is behaving as expected actually. it's obeying laws of physics. The more complicated you make something, the more energy it takes to spin.