For the reason why stalkers go invisible I think that the bugs we see in game aren’t actually the ones that were farmed. I think humanity made a domesticated form of the bugs that were farmed until some manage to break out and return to a more natural habitat where their ability to quickly adapt causes them to rapidly evolve into what they were like before domestication like how pigs will turn into boars after a few generations in the wild.
This exactly I feel like the reason why the warriors and elite/hivegaurd aren't similar looking is because they are just evolved forms of the scavengers that are meant to take up the same roles that the other versions of them had
Exactly, notice how the bugs in the first game arent really as menacing as the second game. Right now the bugs environment is war. So their body adapted for more serrated claws, better anti weaponry, more effective invisiblity so enemies don't spot them. They're adapting to war which is messed up. Also in one of the PoI there's a note that says chargers are mutating and appear to be very aggressive when seeing a human. I think the bugs are mutating to be better at killing us which is even scarier lmfao
Impalers reemerged in the second galactic war not through genetic experiments but through the spores of the gloom cloud and Shriekers are mutated hunters who were created by exposure to termicide. They’re not all intentional creations or even accidental, a lot of them are just evolution after they escaped.
The genetic code of the impaler might be suppressed by the E710 farms but not completely removed out of their genome. This is the reason why we don’t see impalers a long time into the galactic war: only when the horde’s breeding is to be let loose, do some of the terminids start to reimerge as the impaler. Think of it like a stem cell, a sort of base terminid that can turn into the charger, bile titan and the impaler exists in the natural genome. But because the siper earth oil farms did not want impalers breaching the walls, they supressed the genes of that base terminid to turn into inpalers instead of splicing it completely out of the genome. Therefore, if the bugs ran loose for a while, they could redevelop the genetic traits as those genes were no longer manually supressed
i'm pretty sure that those are some kind of exoskeleton(?) that the hivelord takes off when they grow even bigger,so...we're gonna need some bigger guns.
One thing i noticed is that the Terminids from HD1 look a lot more aquatic (more heavily like crabs/crayfish/lobster) while HD2 Terminids look more akin to terrestrial armoured insects, with the forelimbs becoming more like mantis-arms, overall longer legs and more spindly. So im inclined to assume the primary mutation after the first galactic war, that was applied to the terminids as whole, was to convert them into a fully terrestrial species, loosing their aquatic heritage and as a result of that becoming 'leaner', but coincedentally also massivly improving their ability to not just jump/lunge, but to actually fly and to develop new bodyplans like the bile-titan which are horribly unsuited for an semi-aqautic/subterrestrial life. So for all intents and purposes, if there are still original HD1-populations surviving somewhere, i dont even think they would recognize their HD2 relatives as members of their own species bc the genetic divergance and mutation has by now effectivly rendered them something entirely different (ignoring the name)
A bike titan is just a deep sea crab that’s not in the sea. Other than its primary attack of spewing acid it would be Infinitely more suitable to an aquatic environment. Existing as a surface creature requires so much more “structure” to even withstand its own weight. It’s a giant crab. It makes up for its limited movement with its acid spew.
I firmly believe that all Bile bugs are single line of multiple life stages. Starts with small bile spitter, then they become bile spewer, and when these live long enough, they molt and become titans. Have you ever seen any bile spewer or titan on a mission without bile spitters?
Most of the terminids are in stages Scavenger, to warrior, guard, then commander Pouncer, hunter then stalker Bile spitter is noted like you said Then chargers have their own evolution where they can split off into three paths. Become more bulky, a behemoth charger. Become infested with spores, a spore charger, or lastly, swell up in size and become an impaler
I think you forget that a lot of these bugs are a result of mutations after they escaped the farms, like the shriekers, and that bugs such as the impailer and alpha brood commander are new variants that mutated naturally
@@Donnovo It might have been a suppressed epigenetic expression. Similar to how domestic pigs will revert to a wild boar-like appearance if released into the wild, domestic terminids might have reverted to their natural impaler state after breaching containment.
Shriekers are not a result of human bug-farming, but rather the failed TCS towers. I've heard people speculate before that the shriekers evolved the way they did because of the dangerous chemicals that the TCS was spitting out, so they built their nests, the shrieker nests, up higher, where the chemical gas that was most likely designed to sink into bug holes would not reach their eggs, which in turn would lead to a survival of the fittest situation and thus, more shriekers.
That actually makes a LOT of sense. Also, something interesting to note is they (shriekers) are clearly an offshoot of the hunter line, with stalkers also being an offshoot of the hunter line. I find it peculiar that both offshoots of the hunter have a unique nest designed specifically for them, and that no other bug type has special nests.
The genetic code for shreiker nest building behavior probably mutated from the instinct to build or grow spore spewers. Cz they share a similar structure with one housing spores and another housing shriekers
As a hd1 veteran i love this content! Biggest change for me is that skill prevents enemies from calling in backup, which is too hard in hd2, especially bugs. And call in bugs get harder to kill with harder levels. It had a beautiful arcade tier logic to it.
@@Whiskey5_The delay between a bug animating and the call being uncancelable is about 2 seconds, so honestly its more about having your autocannon be loaded by chance at the correct moment than skill some times. Or else how are you supposed to kill a full health hive commander in less than 2 seconds
If a bug breach is called, especially on higher missions, have someone have a "plug" strategem and make some distance from it. You are to get objectives done. Not kills.
What I find wild and always end up thinking about is that, since the bugs were actually friendly pre-domestication and communicate with humanity, the rogue labs and broadcast stations on bug maps could very well only be standing because the terminids still possess that intelligence and ability to discern between friends and enemies - and fend off any helldivers trying to take them down. While you can attribute a lot of the sheer big brain plays the bugs do in HD2 to AI, it's still a show of just how smart they are. The amount of times I was baited and pinballed or zeroed in on is insane, and if I had a nickel for every time I was teabagged or taunted by a bug, it'd have 25 cents. Which isn't a lot, but it's weird it happened five fucking times, so I think the terminids still possess a great amount of intelligence and ability to tell between ally and threat.
I could’ve sworn they weren’t very aggressive on launch. I know better now, but back then I thought their “suspicious/searching” state of patrols was just them giving me a chance to back off peacefully. They looked like they could see me and hissed at me warningly, but calmed down after I backed off. Now I know it was stealth mechanics at work, but back then… man that felt weird.
@@zaniatnikGood thing you learned the truth, helldiver. There IS no such thing as a friendly terminid, they just have poor eyesight, and do NOT think like us. This information was provided by the Ministry of Information.
@@zaniatnik I still think they do. Even on higher difficulties, I notice that I don't always get the "on sight" treatment. They will look at me, and make wyrd vocalizations, and not attack. If I don't aim my weapon at them that is. If I just meander off, they don't really follow me, or attack me. Which is fine by me. Allows.me to finish my objectives when soloing. It never lasts tho. Lol. It is more of a chaotic neutrality than true "friendlieness".
@@mailcs06 Agreed. I have also noticed, recently more than ever, if I am NOT the one that attacked their nest...they just, ignore me and attack the team mate that did. I have literally been a Constitution Length away from warriors, and hunters alike, and my teammate was further from them than I was, but they ignored me. Chasing him relentlessly. I want engaging, because i only had secondary ammunition, and wasndesperstely trying to find an ammo box. Not to mention....it was kind of hilarious to hear him over the mic say "why are they ONLY AFTER ME?!" To which I said: "You are the one yelling and screaming in frustration my guy." And he said: "...that's true. I'm over here yelling and screaming, and your just chillin." Yep.
Your pouncer image is a hunter. Pouncers are scavengers with slightly different coloration and smaller wings. Also most every bug can call in bug breaches Not to be that guy, but the impaler also didn’t evolve due to human mutation. As the bugs have been out of captivity they are sorta starting to revert back to a similar state as they were with addons since we are putting them through the wringer. Remember that the tcs made the bugs rapidly mutate again at a rate of like 10x as fast. Also the impalers are capped at like d6 and above I believe if your looking for one .
I havent really played the original Helldivers but my suspicion that the bugs that dont quite match the original bugs might be due to the change of the bug colonies over time. Some real-life colonies tend to exist in a certain region for generations upon generations. Its less energy expensive for the bugs but every bug has to be able to sustain themselves more often. Its like trying to play solo in an mmo vs playing in a 12-man team. They also arent as fast-spreading as other bug types. Its asking too much energy out of these types of bugs to reproduce in the dozens especially with such small lifespans. Then there are the more nomadic bug colonies that have highly specialized colonies that have bugs with more specific roles. You won't see a Queen bee doing the job of a bumblebee because she is designed to lay eggs and not to lay it thick with our flora homies. I think HD2 is where the bugs turned more into the nomadic lifestyle as a way to evolve from their original forms. Nomadic means your colony can run around planet-to-planet more often, but it also explains why they were designed by humans to squeeze out 710. Like if you thought ants were able to 💩 out baby ants just wait until you realize that bigger bugs tend to have insanely longer lifespans. So combine being a baby (710) factory combined with a long lifespan and you be getting them Super scientists Super wet. It also follows the logic of the more specialized bugs being way older-looking and bigger. Humans dont wanna squeeze those guys, it just makes the colony feel safer. Why squeeze them if you can just have fewer, much older bugs to protect the colony? Its the equivalent of having some well-known old mall cop protecting a shop. He's less useful than a bunch if younger mall cops but he has experience and gives people a feeling of safety. Sounds like too much psychological tricks against the bugs but if theres one thing we know about Super Earth, they REALLY know how to psychologically affect the masses. Like if you think about it, all the big juicy bugs got even bigger and juicier. Bile spewers and bile titans look practically loaded with the stuff and the fact they are so much bigger means more bugs which means more squeezin'. Its a theory anyways but maybe it'll be a good read XD
while i think there were some good speculations in there it was focusing too much on the "why would super earth mutate them this way?" and completely ignoring potential evolutions/adaptations that just occurred naturally to the detriment of super earth
@@Ebola-Jones the bugs have an insanely volatile genome, shriekers adapted only within like a month of the tcs being deployed and alpha commanders appeared only a few months after
On the warriors being smaller, could be similar to the aurochs vs the modern cow: they were made smaller and less productive just as a means of decreasing how dangerous they were. This could also explain why all the bugs now lack the crustacean-eque claws they once had and had to adapt a pair of legs into their new weapons.
I don't think any of the bugs in hd2 are the ones that we farmed for element 710 but are either evolved versions of the ones from hd1 or evolved versions of the bugs we created that got loose and started evolving separately. It would actually make sense if these are the same bugs we were fighting in hd1 considering they are sentient. Shedding of armor, slimmer physiques and longer legs would all aid them in being faster, which they might see as a better strategy than investing in pure bulk.
Might be more likely that certain strains were eliminated and were replaced by convergently evolved adaptations. Most of the current bugs likely adapted from the scout/scavenger while the more lobster like warrior strains were eliminated due to difficulty in containing them.
Now do the same, but for bots and cyborgs Great vid, and the spewers come from Super Earth wanted to make bugs make more oil but they accidentaly made bile, which is highly corrosive, and well, not E-710
13:13 Now here me out, but I have a theory that the Hive Lords are in the game and are the little mutant larva we find that we have to extract with, but it's just them in the early stages of life and are trying to start a colony on another planet.
I headcanon that the nursery/bile spewers are the end goal they were looking for. Maybe their spew becomes the E710 but it also juices up all the rest of the bugs too.
I think it would’ve been more interesting for the HD2 hive guards to be a lot more protective of the actual bug holes. Like they only really attack once you get to close to the hole, and retreat when you reach a certain distance. Basically have the bugs do what they are meant to no matter what. IE make the stalkers have hive guards defending their layer
13:21 actually cool idea for a mission. Mission-exclusive enemies/elites would be crazy. I believing Arrowhead is developing a Terminid modifier for adding unique variants in applicable operations, but an entire mission for one enemy would be bad to the bone. Or... bad to the chitin. Or bad to the mandible.
Potentially elites became hive guards as they were engineered to have a larger weakness however being unable to remove all the armour they just moved it too one side
I think the impaler is a failed experiment where they tried to get rid of armour but it gave it even more armour because in helldivers 1 you could see past the face armour and see fleshy bits now you cant at all unless your underneath it
“That bug has oil in it, quick squeeze it!” That made me laugh so hard and I’ve been having a real low day so thank you for the laugh and great video! ❤
The Shrieker I think actually is a mutation of the Pouncer due to the Termicide back in the day so they weren't made on the farms because why would we want to carch flying oil sacks lol
Personally I think the evolutions went something like this. First G-war ends -> bugs are kept as almost endangered species like. -> post war battlegrounds turn out with massive amounts of space fuel. -> Its from the weird bugs. -> Enclosures become farms, and thus making the OG bugs mutate into the weird insect shape they now have. -> They escape, G-war#2. For special mutations and recently added bugs, I think its like this. While the bugs were being farmed, not only did their rapid mutation rate cause them to shift into something unrecognizable from the original form. but also caused some newer strains to form as well: *Bile subspecies:* High amounts of E-710 exposure to the bugs would result in forms like the Bile species (I am getting this simply from the HD2 website breakdown of Bile Spewers). Where the high amounts of gasoline and oil exposure that was basically raw rocket fuel, caused them to form uncontrollable cysts, resulting in bile warriors growing into bile spewers and titans. *Winged evolution:* Stalkers were from the first war, and were most likely untouched by the farmers due to them quite literally being super skinny invisible freaks. But after their escape and freedom to planets like Heeth and Angels venture in the first moments of the first outbreak. They were able to rapidly evolve to hunting both human and wild life once more. Causing them to strain into their enhanced invisibility (also things like E-710 exposure and the later Termicide incident.) while shriekers were created from hunter strains and rapidly mutated to the airborne pathogen, causing them to...well...go airborne....And Pouncers and Hunters most likely stem from the same "vanguard" bug, but had their early moments end up in two separate generations, exposed to separate environments and different exposures to things like food source, hunting experience, and even life span. *Returning strains:* Really just the Impaler and alpha commander for now. The Impaler and alpha commander rose up to the awakening of the gloom spores. The Impaler was most likely an older generation strain that became majorly evolved by the gloom, resulting in spontaneous evolutionary traits.... While the alpha commander most likely may be a combination of the older strain, and its newer counterparts DNA. (This part is by far the most theoretical) *Behemoth and Charger:* This one is the weirdest evolutionary wise, but I belive that behemoths met their fate in the farms...and the strain died out, while Chargers evolved and were farmed more efficiently. which resulted in them being around for the escape...but after time went on and due to free territory to evolve in, they ended up evolving directly back into their original strain, with the downside of their weakpoint still being exposed... Again, these are just my thoughts and can be entirely wrong. which they most likely are, also great video 👍
10:44 hey just throwing this out there, salmon perish after their eggs are born so that their babies have nutrient rich water to grow up in, also traveling all the way up the stream to their spawning grounds is extremely exhausting for them, the transformation they undergo from standard fish to red horrible monstrosity requires a lot of energy for them. Great video ❤
It’s worth noting that the impalers tentacles were inspired by the squid tentacles from Half-Life 1. They’re almost identical but the HL ones have a gimmick where they need to feel and tap the ground to detect enemies through vibrations while the impaler just knows where you are at all times.
Watching this video, I could not help but think of that one scene from Spongebob. Where Spongebob finds out about Mr. Krabs' jellyfish factory, can just picture bugs instead of jellyfish.
I believe humanity's experiments stop around scavengers (and the farms probably kill them at that stage too) with higher ranks being hormonal mutations to better meet the colony's needs as a bug gets older. If you look at all the bugs in each game alone they all have very similar features like you can trace the tier of bug straight back down the ranks but not as well sideways. You can also see this happening in game with the new bug variants emerging after environmental changes, then spreading to other planets (shriekers after the TCS, impalers after a planet is touched by the gloom) which makes it hard to believe it's super earth's fault they came around.
a cool idea I've been thinking about is, what happens if both the automatons and the bugs territories meet on the same planets. will they fight, or are they allied, and when your on those planets for missions you have to fend off them both.
My take on the Bile titan is that initially it was supposed to just be an even larger bile spewer that would be basically immobile blob of To be oil but in their experiments it kept just sorta mutating to have less of a bile tank and more armor so they stopped but the evolutionary "Code" remained so when they eventually got out, they evolved further to finally become the bile titan
I feel SOOO bad for the terminid. All they did is basically offering us hug and we genocide them and mutated their flesh like we are the qu from all tomorrow
theory time: those bugs reproduce and evolve fast, + they kinda know whats going on, so maybe the attempt at farming led them to evolve to escape, like the warrior becoming tougher and the stalker becoming entirely invisible
15:23 I would have said warrior because in the opening scene to the game the bile titan and warrior bugs were together and seemed to be interacting with each other and you'd think that the bile titan would be with the brood commander or something more elite but no it's just hanging out with warriors
As a basically bot-exclusive diver, it would be interesting to see a comparison between the Cyborgs of HD1 and the Automatons of HD2. Especially if you take into consider that the Automatons use the exact same voice lines as the Cyborgs did... could be interesting to find which lines line up to which units from old and new!
I think the titans were suppose to be sewers but some mutated to have larger legs as a side effect but it was probably considered an isolated incident so they turned a blind eye on it rather than trying to figure out how to isolate and resolve the issue. By the time they realize it was occurring more frequently, it was probably too late and then the Titan just became a part of the terminid colony.
Super earth command suggests the shrieker comes from the seaf bugg spray that we had to activate, as the terminids are now mytating further under the affects.
I think the adult salmon kicking the bucket after laying its eggs has something to do with being out of saltwater. Yes its born in fresh water, but it matures in saltwater, which would make saltwater its native environment. but idrk.
Impalers were removed from the gene pool in between the games but the gloom in Helldivers 2 allowed them to re-evolve themselves into reality, warriors, brood commanders and elite/hive guard were mutated to lose their claws and lesser armour making them easier to kill and harder to be killed by Edit: Gargoyles also evolved narrativelly in HD2
note: there is winged scavengers in helldivers 2, making me think the hunters are an offshoot of stalkers themselves instead of being modified scouts. Meanwhile, I think the HD1 warriors and elites both became the hive guards (they keep more of the body structure and a softer-lookign behind while the front is heavily armored) while HD2 warriors are essentially bigger scouts instead (and would also explain why in helldivers 2 warriors and brood commanders can also create pheromone trails while the ones in helldivers 1 couldnt, essentially scouts evolved to replace the entire warrior line and their variants, which just became the hive guards) also, super-earth does NOOT squeeze bugs to extract E-710.... intsead they bury them in mass graves, let them decompose into oil, and then put oil pumps on top of it all, so the squeezability of bugs isnt really a factor
Elite's might actually have just received their direct comparison with the addition of elite warriors (summoned by Alpha commanders) which are faster and more health
Technically genetically engineering out heavy armor from bugs would be worse for E-710 production as it’s made by bug bodies *decomposing* not from squeezing them like an orange. All the bugs we fight in HD1 and HD2 I believe personally are actually the “wild” variants of them. What they would be naturally instead of the docile farmed ones. We know their DNA has an amazing ability to mutate in order to adapt and survive, so the bugs we fight actually mutated to fight “us” (as in humans) in order to survive. They no longer have their intelligence either, just hints of it in the hunter and stalker behavior.
Is interesting indeed, but can we have a video comparing the Helldivers Terminids vs the Gliphyds from deep rock galactic? I think that can be a really interesting video
IMO the reason the hd2 bugs would become so plump with weakspots and spindly limbs would be caused directly by human intervention. Breeding the big dangerous arms, antennae, and armor from the bugs into much weaker spindly arms, weak armor, and big bellies full of oil for easier farming and breeding. The reason the bugs regained their armor would be similar to how domestic pigs can turn into wild hogs, they escape from their captivity where they were domesticated and then quickly go through a transformation that regrows all of their armor and makes weak claws strong and sharp. Because even if they managed to regrow their armor and strengthen their weapons, the effects of domestication (big bellies (full of soup (full of oil)), spindly limbs) would still be present since they were basically irreversible. I would also like to add the possibility of the fact that the sentient bugs might be intelligent enough to naturally select for thicker armor and sharper claws, but that might be a bit of a reach. Still no idea how the stalkers learned to go completely invisible, but the effectiveness of it is certainly plausible for helping it survive and thrive in the wild. With the added interest that Stalker lairs are separate from normal bug lairs, and stalkers can ONLY come from stalker lairs, not from bug breaches which is more than likely important for the lore of how they have come to be as they are now.
I think a reason most the bugs in Helldiver 2 also look different is because the bugs themselves started adapting better to fight us. I assume they realize smaller faster targets are more deadly then bulbous armored snails. Also we cant juice them if they have no juice. And since the are heavily inspired from Tryranids who have crazy adapting skills such as literally changing mid war, these bugs wouldn't take to long to change either.
Not sure if this was mentioned- Bugs do have a planet of origins though not much lore is THERE regarding it.. said planet is named Kepler Prime. There are theories that state the planet was teleported away by the illuminate to safe guard the bugs because those two factions were allies
Imo, the bugs have just been evolving back to how they were in HD1 with the additions of the chemical change introduced in them in the farms I'm pretty sure we only had at most Scavengers and Warriors in farms because that's what we have in Helldivers training facilities We know they evolve fast and we also know that we have helped them by mistake with the Termicide which was supposed to keep them in check (flying bugs appeared because of that) So it wouldn't be too far fetched to think that the Impaler or even the Stalker would exist because of fast evolution/adaptability as they are at war with us and our big guns So yeah, I'm pretty sure some of the bug types we're seeing weren't use in farms but ever since they first escaped their captivity.
I find it very possible that the stalkers' cloaking ability is a result from the farming-related genetic engineering because of linked genes. Sometimes, when one gene is changed, a different, seemingly unrelated gene can also shift. A good example in the real world is dog domesticity and their floppy ears. The less aggressive/energetic the dog, typically the more floppy their ears will be. Maybe the more E710 a Stalker produces, the better its cloaking abilities become?
For the reason why stalkers go invisible I think that the bugs we see in game aren’t actually the ones that were farmed. I think humanity made a domesticated form of the bugs that were farmed until some manage to break out and return to a more natural habitat where their ability to quickly adapt causes them to rapidly evolve into what they were like before domestication like how pigs will turn into boars after a few generations in the wild.
😃😃😃
How did they get to their planets? Did they take a taxi?
@@Skullguy-w7b
This exactly I feel like the reason why the warriors and elite/hivegaurd aren't similar looking is because they are just evolved forms of the scavengers that are meant to take up the same roles that the other versions of them had
Exactly, notice how the bugs in the first game arent really as menacing as the second game. Right now the bugs environment is war. So their body adapted for more serrated claws, better anti weaponry, more effective invisiblity so enemies don't spot them. They're adapting to war which is messed up. Also in one of the PoI there's a note that says chargers are mutating and appear to be very aggressive when seeing a human. I think the bugs are mutating to be better at killing us which is even scarier lmfao
Impalers reemerged in the second galactic war not through genetic experiments but through the spores of the gloom cloud and Shriekers are mutated hunters who were created by exposure to termicide.
They’re not all intentional creations or even accidental, a lot of them are just evolution after they escaped.
The genetic code of the impaler might be suppressed by the E710 farms but not completely removed out of their genome. This is the reason why we don’t see impalers a long time into the galactic war: only when the horde’s breeding is to be let loose, do some of the terminids start to reimerge as the impaler. Think of it like a stem cell, a sort of base terminid that can turn into the charger, bile titan and the impaler exists in the natural genome. But because the siper earth oil farms did not want impalers breaching the walls, they supressed the genes of that base terminid to turn into inpalers instead of splicing it completely out of the genome. Therefore, if the bugs ran loose for a while, they could redevelop the genetic traits as those genes were no longer manually supressed
Fun fact you can actually see Hive Lord skeletons littered around bug maps in H2.
i'm pretty sure that those are some kind of exoskeleton(?) that the hivelord takes off when they grow even bigger,so...we're gonna need some bigger guns.
It’s not a skeleton, it’s it’s shedding
a molt*
@@JackalformerlyKnownasDjjjav ahh I see now
@@JackalformerlyKnownasDjjjavit’s weird we see its molts , its shedded exoskeleton, alllll the time but we never actually see them.
One thing i noticed is that the Terminids from HD1 look a lot more aquatic (more heavily like crabs/crayfish/lobster) while HD2 Terminids look more akin to terrestrial armoured insects, with the forelimbs becoming more like mantis-arms, overall longer legs and more spindly.
So im inclined to assume the primary mutation after the first galactic war, that was applied to the terminids as whole, was to convert them into a fully terrestrial species, loosing their aquatic heritage and as a result of that becoming 'leaner', but coincedentally also massivly improving their ability to not just jump/lunge, but to actually fly and to develop new bodyplans like the bile-titan which are horribly unsuited for an semi-aqautic/subterrestrial life.
So for all intents and purposes, if there are still original HD1-populations surviving somewhere, i dont even think they would recognize their HD2 relatives as members of their own species bc the genetic divergance and mutation has by now effectivly rendered them something entirely different (ignoring the name)
I love this take!!! They really did look more like crayfish and lobsters in HD1 and now they are more terrestrial. Thanks for sharing!
I hope on certain planets we get different looking bugs.
A bike titan is just a deep sea crab that’s not in the sea. Other than its primary attack of spewing acid it would be Infinitely more suitable to an aquatic environment. Existing as a surface creature requires so much more “structure” to even withstand its own weight.
It’s a giant crab. It makes up for its limited movement with its acid spew.
I firmly believe that all Bile bugs are single line of multiple life stages. Starts with small bile spitter, then they become bile spewer, and when these live long enough, they molt and become titans.
Have you ever seen any bile spewer or titan on a mission without bile spitters?
Most of the terminids are in stages
Scavenger, to warrior, guard, then commander
Pouncer, hunter then stalker
Bile spitter is noted like you said
Then chargers have their own evolution where they can split off into three paths. Become more bulky, a behemoth charger. Become infested with spores, a spore charger, or lastly, swell up in size and become an impaler
@@Joemama-xw2wyin helldivers1 impalers were actualy smaller and weaker than chargers, in hd2 chargers changed and became smaller
this fr, i agree lol
I think you forget that a lot of these bugs are a result of mutations after they escaped the farms, like the shriekers, and that bugs such as the impailer and alpha brood commander are new variants that mutated naturally
impaler isnt new tho or am i missing smth
@@Donnovo It might have been a suppressed epigenetic expression. Similar to how domestic pigs will revert to a wild boar-like appearance if released into the wild, domestic terminids might have reverted to their natural impaler state after breaching containment.
Shriekers are not a result of human bug-farming, but rather the failed TCS towers.
I've heard people speculate before that the shriekers evolved the way they did because of the dangerous chemicals that the TCS was spitting out, so they built their nests, the shrieker nests, up higher, where the chemical gas that was most likely designed to sink into bug holes would not reach their eggs, which in turn would lead to a survival of the fittest situation and thus, more shriekers.
That actually makes a LOT of sense. Also, something interesting to note is they (shriekers) are clearly an offshoot of the hunter line, with stalkers also being an offshoot of the hunter line. I find it peculiar that both offshoots of the hunter have a unique nest designed specifically for them, and that no other bug type has special nests.
The genetic code for shreiker nest building behavior probably mutated from the instinct to build or grow spore spewers. Cz they share a similar structure with one housing spores and another housing shriekers
As a hd1 veteran i love this content! Biggest change for me is that skill prevents enemies from calling in backup, which is too hard in hd2, especially bugs. And call in bugs get harder to kill with harder levels. It had a beautiful arcade tier logic to it.
@@Whiskey5_The delay between a bug animating and the call being uncancelable is about 2 seconds, so honestly its more about having your autocannon be loaded by chance at the correct moment than skill some times. Or else how are you supposed to kill a full health hive commander in less than 2 seconds
You don't, you stagger it and interrupt the animation.
If a bug breach is called, especially on higher missions, have someone have a "plug" strategem and make some distance from it. You are to get objectives done. Not kills.
Bile spewers design: squishy water balloon
Bile spewer ingame: light tank
@@zaiz6018orbital airburst shreds them
What I find wild and always end up thinking about is that, since the bugs were actually friendly pre-domestication and communicate with humanity, the rogue labs and broadcast stations on bug maps could very well only be standing because the terminids still possess that intelligence and ability to discern between friends and enemies - and fend off any helldivers trying to take them down.
While you can attribute a lot of the sheer big brain plays the bugs do in HD2 to AI, it's still a show of just how smart they are. The amount of times I was baited and pinballed or zeroed in on is insane, and if I had a nickel for every time I was teabagged or taunted by a bug, it'd have 25 cents. Which isn't a lot, but it's weird it happened five fucking times, so I think the terminids still possess a great amount of intelligence and ability to tell between ally and threat.
I could’ve sworn they weren’t very aggressive on launch. I know better now, but back then I thought their “suspicious/searching” state of patrols was just them giving me a chance to back off peacefully. They looked like they could see me and hissed at me warningly, but calmed down after I backed off. Now I know it was stealth mechanics at work, but back then… man that felt weird.
@@zaniatnikGood thing you learned the truth, helldiver. There IS no such thing as a friendly terminid, they just have poor eyesight, and do NOT think like us. This information was provided by the Ministry of Information.
@@zaniatnik
I still think they do. Even on higher difficulties, I notice that I don't always get the "on sight" treatment. They will look at me, and make wyrd vocalizations, and not attack.
If I don't aim my weapon at them that is. If I just meander off, they don't really follow me, or attack me.
Which is fine by me. Allows.me to finish my objectives when soloing. It never lasts tho.
Lol.
It is more of a chaotic neutrality than true "friendlieness".
“I don’t care if the bugs think or not they’re still trying to kill me!”
@@mailcs06
Agreed.
I have also noticed, recently more than ever, if I am NOT the one that attacked their nest...they just, ignore me and attack the team mate that did.
I have literally been a Constitution Length away from warriors, and hunters alike, and my teammate was further from them than I was, but they ignored me. Chasing him relentlessly. I want engaging, because i only had secondary ammunition, and wasndesperstely trying to find an ammo box.
Not to mention....it was kind of hilarious to hear him over the mic say "why are they ONLY AFTER ME?!"
To which I said:
"You are the one yelling and screaming in frustration my guy."
And he said:
"...that's true. I'm over here yelling and screaming, and your just chillin."
Yep.
Your pouncer image is a hunter. Pouncers are scavengers with slightly different coloration and smaller wings. Also most every bug can call in bug breaches
Not to be that guy, but the impaler also didn’t evolve due to human mutation. As the bugs have been out of captivity they are sorta starting to revert back to a similar state as they were with addons since we are putting them through the wringer. Remember that the tcs made the bugs rapidly mutate again at a rate of like 10x as fast. Also the impalers are capped at like d6 and above I believe if your looking for one .
Like how pigs kinda revert to hogs if they’re left in the wild for long enough.
hive lord is technically in game rn. You know the new larva side mission, take a look at the larva. It looks exactly like a hive lord.
Hive lad
there’s also a bunch of what i assume are molts
@@ra1nyran i know about the bones, but molts?
@@coredefect6134 there are molts of smaller ones on certain dry planets. you can probably find some images online if you look for them
14:50, actually, it mutated because of the Terminid Pesticide, which was supposed to kill all bugs. Turns out it mutated them.
I havent really played the original Helldivers but my suspicion that the bugs that dont quite match the original bugs might be due to the change of the bug colonies over time.
Some real-life colonies tend to exist in a certain region for generations upon generations. Its less energy expensive for the bugs but every bug has to be able to sustain themselves more often. Its like trying to play solo in an mmo vs playing in a 12-man team. They also arent as fast-spreading as other bug types. Its asking too much energy out of these types of bugs to reproduce in the dozens especially with such small lifespans.
Then there are the more nomadic bug colonies that have highly specialized colonies that have bugs with more specific roles. You won't see a Queen bee doing the job of a bumblebee because she is designed to lay eggs and not to lay it thick with our flora homies.
I think HD2 is where the bugs turned more into the nomadic lifestyle as a way to evolve from their original forms. Nomadic means your colony can run around planet-to-planet more often, but it also explains why they were designed by humans to squeeze out 710. Like if you thought ants were able to 💩 out baby ants just wait until you realize that bigger bugs tend to have insanely longer lifespans. So combine being a baby (710) factory combined with a long lifespan and you be getting them Super scientists Super wet.
It also follows the logic of the more specialized bugs being way older-looking and bigger. Humans dont wanna squeeze those guys, it just makes the colony feel safer. Why squeeze them if you can just have fewer, much older bugs to protect the colony? Its the equivalent of having some well-known old mall cop protecting a shop. He's less useful than a bunch if younger mall cops but he has experience and gives people a feeling of safety. Sounds like too much psychological tricks against the bugs but if theres one thing we know about Super Earth, they REALLY know how to psychologically affect the masses.
Like if you think about it, all the big juicy bugs got even bigger and juicier. Bile spewers and bile titans look practically loaded with the stuff and the fact they are so much bigger means more bugs which means more squeezin'.
Its a theory anyways but maybe it'll be a good read XD
That was indeed a good read, thank you
while i think there were some good speculations in there it was focusing too much on the "why would super earth mutate them this way?" and completely ignoring potential evolutions/adaptations that just occurred naturally to the detriment of super earth
The previous war was only 100 years ago
@@Ebola-Jones the bugs have an insanely volatile genome, shriekers adapted only within like a month of the tcs being deployed and alpha commanders appeared only a few months after
Hd1 bugs look more like crustaceans while hd2 bugs look more like ants
They both look like arthropods tbh. The HD 1 version just have Lobster claws while these ones have rending claws.
Have you ever seen ants?
@@ssassb just the closest comparison I can make tbh
Hd2 ones look more like antlions from half life 2
The shriekers are literally just mutated hunters
This is confirmed they came from the TCS
On the warriors being smaller, could be similar to the aurochs vs the modern cow: they were made smaller and less productive just as a means of decreasing how dangerous they were. This could also explain why all the bugs now lack the crustacean-eque claws they once had and had to adapt a pair of legs into their new weapons.
fun fact, hive lords are in hd2, both as fossils and now as larva in the escalation of freedom update
Those arent fossils, they are molts, fossils can only form under the ground
@@lavish_hair8378 they are fossils, why would molts cover teeth
0:15 “yep 🗿”
"yep"
"yep"
"Yep"
"yep.🗿"
I don't think any of the bugs in hd2 are the ones that we farmed for element 710 but are either evolved versions of the ones from hd1 or evolved versions of the bugs we created that got loose and started evolving separately. It would actually make sense if these are the same bugs we were fighting in hd1 considering they are sentient. Shedding of armor, slimmer physiques and longer legs would all aid them in being faster, which they might see as a better strategy than investing in pure bulk.
The impaler was a natural mutation from the gloom spore cloud.
Ummm, Nate? You used the model for the hunter, not the pouncer.
frankly i find the idea of a bug that thinks offensive
Might be more likely that certain strains were eliminated and were replaced by convergently evolved adaptations. Most of the current bugs likely adapted from the scout/scavenger while the more lobster like warrior strains were eliminated due to difficulty in containing them.
Now do the same, but for bots and cyborgs
Great vid, and the spewers come from Super Earth wanted to make bugs make more oil but they accidentaly made bile, which is highly corrosive, and well, not E-710
13:13 Now here me out, but I have a theory that the Hive Lords are in the game and are the little mutant larva we find that we have to extract with, but it's just them in the early stages of life and are trying to start a colony on another planet.
I headcanon that the nursery/bile spewers are the end goal they were looking for. Maybe their spew becomes the E710 but it also juices up all the rest of the bugs too.
There is the hivelord larva that you get for side objectives
I think it would’ve been more interesting for the HD2 hive guards to be a lot more protective of the actual bug holes. Like they only really attack once you get to close to the hole, and retreat when you reach a certain distance. Basically have the bugs do what they are meant to no matter what. IE make the stalkers have hive guards defending their layer
13:21 actually cool idea for a mission. Mission-exclusive enemies/elites would be crazy. I believing Arrowhead is developing a Terminid modifier for adding unique variants in applicable operations, but an entire mission for one enemy would be bad to the bone. Or... bad to the chitin. Or bad to the mandible.
bro is underrated, great video
@JulianHawthorn Agreed.
@JulianHawthorn Agreed.
@JulianHawthorn Agreed.
@JulianHawthorn Agreed.
@JulianHawthorn Agreed.
Definitely would be interested in a video covering the automatons and cyborgs
5:45 Despite the jokes... Yeah this sums up the difference of the bugs and terminids: The bugs were more akin to Crustaceans compared to actual bugs.
Potentially elites became hive guards as they were engineered to have a larger weakness however being unable to remove all the armour they just moved it too one side
"Dat boi Rotund" caught me off guard well play sir 🤣🤣
Good research. Good editing. Good narration. Have a sub.
I think the impaler is a failed experiment where they tried to get rid of armour but it gave it even more armour because in helldivers 1 you could see past the face armour and see fleshy bits now you cant at all unless your underneath it
Finally! I’ve been waiting ever since Hell divers came out for lore content
helldivers bugs vs deep rock bugs please i NEED IT IM BEGGING YOU
you can find hive lord skeletons scatered around bug planets in hd2
“That bug has oil in it, quick squeeze it!” That made me laugh so hard and I’ve been having a real low day so thank you for the laugh and great video! ❤
The Shrieker I think actually is a mutation of the Pouncer due to the Termicide back in the day so they weren't made on the farms because why would we want to carch flying oil sacks lol
I'm surprised you didn't mention that we can find skeletons of the hive lords on some planets.
Glad you said skeletons, some pretty dumb people say it’s molts, why would molts include the teeth
Personally I think the evolutions went something like this.
First G-war ends -> bugs are kept as almost endangered species like. -> post war battlegrounds turn out with massive amounts of space fuel. -> Its from the weird bugs. -> Enclosures become farms, and thus making the OG bugs mutate into the weird insect shape they now have. -> They escape, G-war#2.
For special mutations and recently added bugs, I think its like this. While the bugs were being farmed, not only did their rapid mutation rate cause them to shift into something unrecognizable from the original form. but also caused some newer strains to form as well:
*Bile subspecies:* High amounts of E-710 exposure to the bugs would result in forms like the Bile species (I am getting this simply from the HD2 website breakdown of Bile Spewers). Where the high amounts of gasoline and oil exposure that was basically raw rocket fuel, caused them to form uncontrollable cysts, resulting in bile warriors growing into bile spewers and titans.
*Winged evolution:* Stalkers were from the first war, and were most likely untouched by the farmers due to them quite literally being super skinny invisible freaks. But after their escape and freedom to planets like Heeth and Angels venture in the first moments of the first outbreak. They were able to rapidly evolve to hunting both human and wild life once more. Causing them to strain into their enhanced invisibility (also things like E-710 exposure and the later Termicide incident.) while shriekers were created from hunter strains and rapidly mutated to the airborne pathogen, causing them to...well...go airborne....And Pouncers and Hunters most likely stem from the same "vanguard" bug, but had their early moments end up in two separate generations, exposed to separate environments and different exposures to things like food source, hunting experience, and even life span.
*Returning strains:* Really just the Impaler and alpha commander for now. The Impaler and alpha commander rose up to the awakening of the gloom spores. The Impaler was most likely an older generation strain that became majorly evolved by the gloom, resulting in spontaneous evolutionary traits.... While the alpha commander most likely may be a combination of the older strain, and its newer counterparts DNA. (This part is by far the most theoretical)
*Behemoth and Charger:* This one is the weirdest evolutionary wise, but I belive that behemoths met their fate in the farms...and the strain died out, while Chargers evolved and were farmed more efficiently. which resulted in them being around for the escape...but after time went on and due to free territory to evolve in, they ended up evolving directly back into their original strain, with the downside of their weakpoint still being exposed...
Again, these are just my thoughts and can be entirely wrong. which they most likely are, also great video 👍
We do have Hive Lord *Skeletons*. It's likely we killed off their evolutionary chain. However, it might grow out of the Impaler, which is concerning.
I think the larva is a hive lord
@MicheleKisel-x6u That's been speculated too. Honestly if we ever lose the research center they might show up there.
imagine fighting the flood
10:44 hey just throwing this out there, salmon perish after their eggs are born so that their babies have nutrient rich water to grow up in, also traveling all the way up the stream to their spawning grounds is extremely exhausting for them, the transformation they undergo from standard fish to red horrible monstrosity requires a lot of energy for them. Great video ❤
Great vid really enjoyed!
Theses type of vids are so well made
It’s worth noting that the impalers tentacles were inspired by the squid tentacles from Half-Life 1. They’re almost identical but the HL ones have a gimmick where they need to feel and tap the ground to detect enemies through vibrations while the impaler just knows where you are at all times.
As far as I have heard, the scout armor even makes you semi-invisible but the other divers don't see it
Watching this video, I could not help but think of that one scene from Spongebob. Where Spongebob finds out about Mr. Krabs' jellyfish factory, can just picture bugs instead of jellyfish.
I believe humanity's experiments stop around scavengers (and the farms probably kill them at that stage too) with higher ranks being hormonal mutations to better meet the colony's needs as a bug gets older. If you look at all the bugs in each game alone they all have very similar features like you can trace the tier of bug straight back down the ranks but not as well sideways.
You can also see this happening in game with the new bug variants emerging after environmental changes, then spreading to other planets (shriekers after the TCS, impalers after a planet is touched by the gloom) which makes it hard to believe it's super earth's fault they came around.
a cool idea I've been thinking about is, what happens if both the automatons and the bugs territories meet on the same planets. will they fight, or are they allied, and when your on those planets for missions you have to fend off them both.
My take on the Bile titan is that initially it was supposed to just be an even larger bile spewer that would be basically immobile blob of To be oil but in their experiments it kept just sorta mutating to have less of a bile tank and more armor so they stopped but the evolutionary "Code" remained so when they eventually got out, they evolved further to finally become the bile titan
Many of these mutations could be the result of the Bugs having the sentience bred out of them.
The next logical step would be for them to turn feral.
I feel SOOO bad for the terminid. All they did is basically offering us hug and we genocide them and mutated their flesh like we are the qu from all tomorrow
Now you have to do cyborgs Vs automatons
Oh I totally am! It’s in process rn
theory time: those bugs reproduce and evolve fast, + they kinda know whats going on, so maybe the attempt at farming led them to evolve to escape, like the warrior becoming tougher and the stalker becoming entirely invisible
15:23 I would have said warrior because in the opening scene to the game the bile titan and warrior bugs were together and seemed to be interacting with each other and you'd think that the bile titan would be with the brood commander or something more elite but no it's just hanging out with warriors
Noice, now do the Cyborgs and Automatons
As a basically bot-exclusive diver, it would be interesting to see a comparison between the Cyborgs of HD1 and the Automatons of HD2. Especially if you take into consider that the Automatons use the exact same voice lines as the Cyborgs did... could be interesting to find which lines line up to which units from old and new!
Drink every time you hear "squeeze" while watching this video
FINALLY SOMEONE POINTED IT OUT
I think the titans were suppose to be sewers but some mutated to have larger legs as a side effect but it was probably considered an isolated incident so they turned a blind eye on it rather than trying to figure out how to isolate and resolve the issue. By the time they realize it was occurring more frequently, it was probably too late and then the Titan just became a part of the terminid colony.
In my opinion the shadow just like the shrieker is on the box art of the game and we never realized it and it will eventually be added to the game.
Super earth command suggests the shrieker comes from the seaf bugg spray that we had to activate, as the terminids are now mytating further under the affects.
I think the adult salmon kicking the bucket after laying its eggs has something to do with being out of saltwater. Yes its born in fresh water, but it matures in saltwater, which would make saltwater its native environment. but idrk.
Nah, they just die from overexertion more or less. It takes alot to swim upstream from the ocean to tgeir mating grounds
Impalers were removed from the gene pool in between the games but the gloom in Helldivers 2 allowed them to re-evolve themselves into reality, warriors, brood commanders and elite/hive guard were mutated to lose their claws and lesser armour making them easier to kill and harder to be killed by
Edit: Gargoyles also evolved narrativelly in HD2
note: there is winged scavengers in helldivers 2, making me think the hunters are an offshoot of stalkers themselves instead of being modified scouts. Meanwhile, I think the HD1 warriors and elites both became the hive guards (they keep more of the body structure and a softer-lookign behind while the front is heavily armored) while HD2 warriors are essentially bigger scouts instead (and would also explain why in helldivers 2 warriors and brood commanders can also create pheromone trails while the ones in helldivers 1 couldnt, essentially scouts evolved to replace the entire warrior line and their variants, which just became the hive guards)
also, super-earth does NOOT squeeze bugs to extract E-710.... intsead they bury them in mass graves, let them decompose into oil, and then put oil pumps on top of it all, so the squeezability of bugs isnt really a factor
Now wishing for a cloaking stratagem would definitely help with stealth gameplay especially on solo runs
You can find Hive Lord corpses on some planets
Elite's might actually have just received their direct comparison with the addition of elite warriors (summoned by Alpha commanders) which are faster and more health
I definitely agree with the bile Titan being a second stage mess up
A lot of these mutations were not done by super earth. The bugs are releasing their own mutative spores now.
The fact that bassicly the only reason the bugs are our enemies is because of us
Technically genetically engineering out heavy armor from bugs would be worse for E-710 production as it’s made by bug bodies *decomposing* not from squeezing them like an orange.
All the bugs we fight in HD1 and HD2 I believe personally are actually the “wild” variants of them. What they would be naturally instead of the docile farmed ones. We know their DNA has an amazing ability to mutate in order to adapt and survive, so the bugs we fight actually mutated to fight “us” (as in humans) in order to survive. They no longer have their intelligence either, just hints of it in the hunter and stalker behavior.
Is interesting indeed, but can we have a video comparing the Helldivers Terminids vs the Gliphyds from deep rock galactic? I think that can be a really interesting video
IMO the reason the hd2 bugs would become so plump with weakspots and spindly limbs would be caused directly by human intervention. Breeding the big dangerous arms, antennae, and armor from the bugs into much weaker spindly arms, weak armor, and big bellies full of oil for easier farming and breeding.
The reason the bugs regained their armor would be similar to how domestic pigs can turn into wild hogs, they escape from their captivity where they were domesticated and then quickly go through a transformation that regrows all of their armor and makes weak claws strong and sharp.
Because even if they managed to regrow their armor and strengthen their weapons, the effects of domestication (big bellies (full of soup (full of oil)), spindly limbs) would still be present since they were basically irreversible.
I would also like to add the possibility of the fact that the sentient bugs might be intelligent enough to naturally select for thicker armor and sharper claws, but that might be a bit of a reach. Still no idea how the stalkers learned to go completely invisible, but the effectiveness of it is certainly plausible for helping it survive and thrive in the wild. With the added interest that Stalker lairs are separate from normal bug lairs, and stalkers can ONLY come from stalker lairs, not from bug breaches which is more than likely important for the lore of how they have come to be as they are now.
The bugs evolve without any help .
There was even a major order telling us to kill a lot of the bugs because they evolve faster when stressed
shiekers actually evolved recently from our termicide attempt earlier last year
Any other bugs in video games: “Uh oh. I have a sound cue if I’m near you. Ooooooooo spooky.”
HellDivers bugs: “We’re going to fucking kill you.”
They need to add the Shadow. It will be funny
I think a reason most the bugs in Helldiver 2 also look different is because the bugs themselves started adapting better to fight us. I assume they realize smaller faster targets are more deadly then bulbous armored snails. Also we cant juice them if they have no juice. And since the are heavily inspired from Tryranids who have crazy adapting skills such as literally changing mid war, these bugs wouldn't take to long to change either.
Those old bugs look way more like crustaceans than the current dragon-like terminids...
The cloak also got worse for a while. They were very visible for a bit.
if the next comparsion is gonna be cyborgs is that i noticed some automatons have HD1 cyborgs voicelines distorted,the berzerker is more noticable
Not sure if this was mentioned- Bugs do have a planet of origins though not much lore is THERE regarding it.. said planet is named Kepler Prime. There are theories that state the planet was teleported away by the illuminate to safe guard the bugs because those two factions were allies
The shriekers mutated from an attempted use of an experimental pesticide and they look as if the scavenger grew wings to me
Imo, the bugs have just been evolving back to how they were in HD1 with the additions of the chemical change introduced in them in the farms
I'm pretty sure we only had at most Scavengers and Warriors in farms because that's what we have in Helldivers training facilities
We know they evolve fast and we also know that we have helped them by mistake with the Termicide which was supposed to keep them in check (flying bugs appeared because of that)
So it wouldn't be too far fetched to think that the Impaler or even the Stalker would exist because of fast evolution/adaptability as they are at war with us and our big guns
So yeah, I'm pretty sure some of the bug types we're seeing weren't use in farms but ever since they first escaped their captivity.
Can’t wait for the Illuminate version
May the lobster gods have mercy on your soul
I suspect the bugs have done some mutating of their own when out of containment. Like how shriekers were not made on purpose.
Dude do this for the automatons and the cyborgs!!
In Helldivers 2, pretty much all bugs are able to call for reinforcements, so no shadow is needed like in part 1
Dude, I LOVE lobsters!
Oh, neat.
There is hive lords in HD2.
The large skeletons. Even got the massive mandibles.
You should do this but the cyborgs vs automatons
I find it very possible that the stalkers' cloaking ability is a result from the farming-related genetic engineering because of linked genes. Sometimes, when one gene is changed, a different, seemingly unrelated gene can also shift. A good example in the real world is dog domesticity and their floppy ears. The less aggressive/energetic the dog, typically the more floppy their ears will be. Maybe the more E710 a Stalker produces, the better its cloaking abilities become?
awesome video!
if i recall, salmon fry themselves after mating is so as to prevent themselves from competing with their offspring for survival.