Exactly. I don't know how everybody can trust an automotive golden boy from California, no matter how long he's been an automotive journalist/TH-camr for Motor Trend. He never said where the source came from. He only said "a good source that he trusts." In other words, don't trust him if his quote unquote "good source that he trusts" isn't telling the truth. I've said this in a couple of other videos that heard about it and I'll say it here in the comments of this video like everybody else saying or thinking. "I'll believe it when I see it. If for some reason Subaru of Japan and Subaru of America Inc., and Subaru globally as a whole reversed course on the decision of not having a VB gen WRX STI and actually brings it back on the VB WRX platform, it's for one of 3 reasons: 1. Subaru has gotten fed up with all of the backlash that they gotten for a shortsighted decision that didn't need to be. 2. They saw what happened with the GR Corolla in terms of the two fires that 2 owners had in back-to-back weeks. 3. The WRX tS is officially going to be marketed, targeted, and noted as DOA and Subaru is all out of options with just having a WRX because now that they built a car with adaptive dampers, a digital gauge cluster, Recaro bucket seats, and added EyeSight to the manual transmission, they can add all of that on official STI version along with more power, DCCD with upgraded Intelligent, Sport, and Sport Sharp modes, and actually 1-up the GR Corolla.
Honestly, with how tunable the VB is, I'd be happy if they just gave us the current TR with the STI 6 speed + LSDs. Call it an STD for all I care, the only point lacking on this car is the transmission and trick differentials.
PLEASE if it gets announced officially and it has a STi 6speed but only 350hp… know that they’re keeping numbers low for emissions and tuners will be able to unlock the extra hp. And don’t bash Subaru about the power numbers.
Agree 100%. The cool thing about Subaru engines is how easily you can pump up an extra 100HP with tiny tuning and without jeopardizing the Brand. After all is up to the owner to tune and get the extra power he or she wants.
Every hot hatch rumor seems to _start_ at 400 HP then gets produced with less. Golf R a prime example, a test mule with rorty exhaust and ~400 HP got shown, then production car nope. A GR Corolla is within about 75 lbs of the old STI, (my 2006 is about 3300 in autocross-ready trim) and has the same 300HP with a smaller engine and more turbo. The STI /must/ have a performance delta from that. And they should not IMO do the BMW route, "we'll increase the weight to add a bunch of luxury features, but stuff another 100 HP in so it's all good" that ends up with 3700 to 4000 lbs. Still, they need BMW equalling performance, it's hard to push a 4.7 0-60 when BMW even 2WD are sub-4. Make it a lighter, stripper, not every feature. Though I would accept a DCT or other paddle-shifter. We'll still be screwed because it will be low production and dealers will be able to hose us, just like GR owners have gotten hosed due to the demand. Plan on $70K out the door for a year.
Great points. It is pretty clear that the performance of the STI has to increase significantly to justify bringing it back, and the question is how much more would it cost. And knowing that it will cost more than the WRX, it has some very stiff competition. For it to do well at all, it will have to compete with much more expensive cars. Time will tell. Thanks for watching and Stay Tuned!
As you mentioned, I also was waiting for the new STI for back in 2022, and had saved up for it , so they definitely lost out on a lot of Subaru enthusiasts and potential buyers. That being said, I would like to see a full ICE STI , no hybrid for me :D
Please make it so...2026 WRX STI with FA24 revving to 7,000 rpm, 350HP+, TY85 transmission and diffs plus Brembo. Remove the ugly rear bumper diaper thing and I will buy it to compliment my 2006 STI.
I don't trust Jonny Lieberman. He's just an automotive golden boy from California who says things only he can trust, but the rest of the general public shouldn't. Like I've said in the comment section of other channels, I'll believe it when I see it, and as it stands, I don't believe it. Even if the STI does come back and model year 2026 will be the refresh of the VB gen WRX, would the STI only be 2 years, or would it extended 4 years beyond its mid-cycle refresh for a secondary refresh until a VC gen WRX arrives? Those are the questions that need to be asked. If Subaru of Japan and Subaru of America Inc., and Subaru as a whole globally come out and say it is for real and it is true and it will come out by model year 2026 in late 2025 or early calendar year 2026 as a 2026 model year vehicle, I will apologize for my doubts on what Jonny Lieberman said about his good source and never doubt him again. From where I'm standing, I have -99.9999995% hope of hearing or reading Subaru reversing course on bring back the WRX STI on the VB gen platform and bringing back the STI Division to get their hands dirty again to make a VB gen WRX STI happen.
I bought my 2018 STI to upgrade from my 2015 WRX. The last one carried new tech and low gas milage, the STI had the rumbling sound, the full analog feeling of a car that was fun at any speed. That manual transmission paired with the EJ engine, the hydraulic steering, and the somewhat lightweight made it a wonderful experience, plus I bought it new below 40k. Yes, the world has changed but some things still make driving a car a fun experience: Fun experience = f ( driver, vehicle, road ) = A combination of the variables listed below. 1. Lightweight. 2. Analog feel, to feel that the driver is driving the vehicle. 2.1 Manual transmission. 2.2 Good feedback from the steering wheel. Why not even better than a hydraulic one? 2.3 Real Engine sound and running experience. How many people decided to put equal-length headers in the STI to improve the performance? Very, very few. 3. Tires. They have a big say in the driving experience, but it's out of the question that new tires help with the experience. 4. Reliability. The GT (Gran Turismo) name in cars started when those could run long distances. There was a time when programmed obsolescence wasn't required because buyers were looking forward to the new models, i.e. BMW M3 to the E46 generation, Porsche Boxter/Cayman when all engines were 6-cylinders, and Mustang GT when it came to the engine. Every new generation was more desirable than the last and that in itself brought the desire for an upgrade, while the used car went to other owners who started dreaming about the newer models. Yes, the world has changed. Electric cars can be fast, but they don't bring together crowds of car enthusiasts anywhere. Why? Because the experience is not about the connection between the driver, the vehicle, and the road, but about efficiency in energy consumption and even taking the driver out of the equation. Take a bullet train and you'll be on something electric that brings you extremely fast from point A to point B and the police will not be looking after anybody. The muscle cars have great performance numbers, but I see more BRZs/GR86s on the street even though many minivans are faster. There were many different buyers for the former STIs. For me, the magic was the balance between how it sounded and how it drove. The manual, no rev hang, the steering, and the relatively low weight.
At this point, give us another 305hp unit. It’s only been two decades of such. Just please for the love of everything this car is, don’t put the nail in the coffin and give us that electric garbage.
IM ALREADY HALF WAY TO BUILDING MY OWN 23 WRX STI (LOL) ..FOR ME, ONLY PARTS THAT REALLY MATTER ARE THE TRANS, DIFFS, AXLES, DCCD & BRAKES. YEAH IT WOULD BE COOL TO HAVE AN STI BUT I ALWAYS SHAVE THE BADGES OFF ALL MY STUFF ANYWAYS AND A 405HP/460TQ FA24 WITH THE STI DRIVETRAIN REALLY IS A DREAM. GEARING IS SO MUCH BETTER THAN THE SPLITCASE 6 SPEED AND MAPDCCD ALLOWS YOU TO REALLY TUNE INTO THE SETUP AND OPTIMIZE
One thing no one has mentioned. If I was to buy the new sti it would have to have port and direct. On current gen wrx and va you have to have motec in order to be able to go over 500hp due to injectors running out. I'd also like to see the sti have a manual trans still.
IF subaru does come back with the STI, it really needs to have a full exposed carbon roof like on the S209, it also needs better Recaro seats, i mean the Elantra N has better looking seats and its a kia... the new STI should also have those robust wide body fenders like the VB had. If its gonna be 50k+ they need to work on the aero and styling too not just the drivetrain....
"as a leak" with Subaru doing it intentionally is an interesting theory. I don't think it hurts them, but i don't think it really gains them anything. They know their enthusiasts are leaving and aren't interested in a 50-60k STI with 300crank. They know what we want. We want a true modern STI with updated power and a reasonable price. Bump the VB to 375-400 wheel, add the typical STI desirables.
I drove an 05 STI for 13 years, before moving on to a Mk7.5 Golf R. I don't think Subaru really lost me, I think I just got old and my priorities changed. The Golf R is a better "fun up to eight tenths" street car than my old STI could have ever been. I don't need more power. I don't need a better AWD system. But I did get the itch to wrench and hit the track again, so I got a '23 BRZ, for reasons that are diametrically opposed to whan a WRX STI should be.
I'm happy they chose the FA24, one of the biggest selling points to me about the VA and VB, is the timing chain. It's arguably better for a car that's going to be a daily driver. I own an ej257, I can't deny not having to do a valve adjustment and timing belt maintenance at 100k would be pretty convenient and save me money.
They would have to make in a way that it can be competitive with the m340 cause in my area all the Subaru guys are going that route just based of basic mods and your in the mid 500
I really wish they would come out with a new STI. I have a VB and love it, but I want a new STI. But, it would probably be like $55k, which is too high. And, id they did release it, i’m not sure that they would win me back in that price range
They have to get back into WRC, that will be a big draw for many. The STI has to be NOT run of the mill. Cutting Edge gets people excited. It is not all about HP. That is why the STI was so popular for all those years with only 5HP difference.
Knowing Subaru, my prediction would be: ~300 hp tops (JDM WRX S4 is uptuned to 295 lb ft), maybe hybrid, LSDs front and rear, manual or CVT option, higher spring rates and/or adaptive dampers, all the interior luxury elements from the WRX TS, $55K or more, crazy markups. Subaru will probably lean more towards interior luxury and comfort than performance, which is sort of the opposite of the balance enthusiasts want. Hopes and dreams: 330-400 hp, 7,000 rpm redline, mechanical linkage 6spd or 7/8spd DCT (if Hyundai can do it, Subaru should too), some more leather and ultra suede where it counts, front and rear LSDs, DCCD, JDM STI draw stiffeners, beefier suspension components, high quality dampers (not just stiff springs; bonus points for ride height and 1-way damping adjustment from factory), sub-3500 lbs, maybe some kind of improved floor aero work, gloss black and slightly wider fender cladding, and a serious facelift to de-clutter the front and rear. I wouldn’t mind a hybrid if it means better city MPGs and crazy torque like Toyota’s iForce Max. A “track pack” or something would also be cool, if there isn’t going to be a USDM S210. It would also be super exciting and unprecedented if they offered a factory track-only STI, like the GR86 Cup. I think that could revitalize the image of the WRX as a performance platform instead of a sporty Outback. In terms of benchmarking, I hope they shoot for just above the GR Corolla and Civic Type R. Competing with the RS3, M340i, etc is asking for an undesirable performance to luxury balance, although they did benchmark the Cadillac ATS-V when developing the S209. Above all, let’s hope the rumors are true and they don’t bungle it completely - or at least that it takes time to grow on us like the VB has and isn’t a total disappointment.
If the STI comes back, please Subaru build a lot of them. I wanted a Golf R a couple years back but wasn't going to pay over MSRP, and our dealer was allocated ONE for all of NW PA. ONE. I went with the WRX for the raw, visceral fun factor and that I got mine for $2k under sticker. No reason you couldn't just take the current TR/TS models and add a beefy transmission and a mild hybrid to give it an extra 20-30 factory hp along with no turbo lag. Plenty of room for it at the back of the boxer engine. No reason it couldn't sell for $45k and make enough that they don't become profit cows for dealers and collectors. Cars are meant for drivers, put them in the hands of enthusiasts not profit pigs.
Created my own version of an S202, new car would be carbon fiber hood, roof and rear end. 6-spd with similar V7 internals.A real weekend track car. Hybrid, if you have to.
400bhp 2.4 with 100-150 bhp elec motor 6-7 speed paddle shift a-la the recent prodrive rebuild AWD with switchable diff launch control lol 18s with at least 356mm discs all round and 6 pots on the front and 4 pots rear ...stopping power is everything! and a wagon version bc rear boot space rules and trolling an Rs6 would be funny hehe
I dont think the STI competes with EVs at all. I think they are missing the mark on why Subaru does what they do. Even the guy who dailys the car on the panel. This car just needs a great STI transmission and badged up and it will do wonders. It seems like they dont want to tune the car anymore asking for all the luxurys the RS3 and other German cars have. You a Subi to build it yourself! why would you want 500hp STI with the perfect parts you dream of?? Would you still want to build it? I dont think so, which is why I believe that they will at most maybe do 350hp with room to tune. And all this talk about duel clutch lol come on fellas their market is enthusiast who want a 6 speed manual and they know this. No enthusiast car competes against EVs because EVs dont provide the same experience that the gas powered cars do. We hate fake engine noise for heavens sake lol. Anyways good video Gents, I hope that the STI does make a return it would be nice.
I dont think the drivetrain needs an update... a mechanical feeling shifter and the older gen mechanical awd is literally a blast from the past.. moar power baby and some fancy cruise control to handle the morning commute would be great
Heavy, direct injection and weaker blocks of the old EJ207 and 208s. It needs to be tunable - bullet proof bottom end, flow, direct injection can't cause clogging intake issues and the old 6 Speed feel will be the success factors imo. I miss the suby burble of the unequal length headers 🙁
All I hope for is a little more power stock, if they bring it out stock 400-450hp that would be cool. The STI already has enough braking power. Edit: questions #1 Subaru has not lost me yet (Thinking about a Lotus) own a STI Type RA and Tommy Kaira M20b GC8. #2 Stated above, although the powerplant should be able to withstand modifications to at least to 650hp stock internals reliably. let 650 be the new 400. #3 For me it has have nice looks from the factory. kind of like that concept art in the beginning of the video. just a nice stylish, sleek, aggressive look with enough power to prove it.
They would have to make in a way that it can be competitive with the m340 cause in my area all the Subaru guys are going that route just based of basic mods and your in the mid 500 I also feel like the sti would just need to have the drive train and port injection if they are stick with the fa24 The same way they have in the brz and just like most of the high horsepower fa20 wrx
What he said about using the TR suspension but no engine or trans yet would make sense. Due to Subaru buying rights to "STe," it would make sense that they are probably trying to figure out how to combine that 2.4 with a hybrid set-up. Some of us might not like it, but that would get you youre 400hp.
What I want a performance company to do is create a hybrid power supplement that’s easy to delete. Make it an option and easy for a person to retrofit to other older Subaru drivetrains or delete if you don’t like it. Easier said than done but imagine if a Subaru add-on hybrid power was as Lego-like as the other parts.
Give us what we all want, a closed deck flat-4 boxer, with forged crank/rods/pistons. A forged, closed deck FA24 would be one heck of a stout powerplant.
If Subaru makes a hybrid to get back in to WRC and makes an STI version, I'll snap that baby up. Let's be honest, any new STI model and I'll snap it up. Currently on my 3rd Subaru in a row and can't wait for their next leap.
Yes we want it. whatever it is. this is what I would do. DCCD with an electric motor assisted manual or dual clutch transmission both as options for torque of the line. The 2.4 would go to a 2.5L with a lower compression ratio and I would have dual turbos and dual intakes for each cylinder bank. Battery bank would be small and weigh just as much as the engine and trans on the rear axel for a true 50:50 weight distribution. Bingo the recipe for the perfect STI. oh and add regen braking for extra stopping power without eating up pads. oh and magnetic dampers with adjustable ride stiffness for track handling or street comfort. and of course the wing how about a robotic wing that adjusted angle for the speed.
The VB Platform NRB racecar is working super well in the Nurburgring 24h series with the FA24. That possibly might be the development process for the new VB STi?
13:50 is exactly what I've been thinking since this hit car and driver a few months back. And what people want compared to what subaru is willing to produce has way too far of a gap. And making the STI automatic only would be an unholy sin. Plus it's going to cost an ungodly amount to make a 450-500hp turbo sedan that actually will take back what made an STI what it was. This coming from a person with a 2020 STI (that still only has 3200 miles on it).
Thank you for the video. I have a question - why does the fa24 in the 86/BRZ blow up from oil starvation on right turns, but this is not seen in the fa24dit VB WRX? My thought is that the VB is such a slow car that understeers too much, the slowness of the platform protects it from blowing up, unlike the faster, more superior gr86/BRZ fa24 that can corner faster, and in turn cause oil starvation. Thanks
I've seen stories (Grassroots Motorsports) that mention 2022 cars having issues with too much sealant restricting oil passages, and they suggested that in later years this quality control issue has been take care of.
@pault151 Yes, it does seem like this was somewhat isolated and has been corrected. FWIW, there were Outbacks with the FA24DIT engines that were leaking oil because not enough sealant was applied... Seems like they had to sort out the calibration across the models. Thanks for watching and Stay Tuned!
@TheLastS209 They are different oiling systems, but there may be some commonality. The issue definitely seems to be mainly with the BRZ though. Take a look at what Verus Engineering is doing to solve that problem : th-cam.com/video/eBHT5b3sf9o/w-d-xo.htmlsi=Fn3ApSxicp0-pKXa (hint: They may be coming on the podcast to discuss their progress very soon :-)
They should make it priced for the rich. A legit show stopper sTi requires deep pockets. If it’s too affordable then the value of them won’t stay up there. It has to be substantial. No Mickey Mouse stuff!!
I think if they bring back the STI, it may be like what dodge is doing with the charger and challenger. It would be like the final good bye. I see the WRX ending altogether, unless they learn from Mitsubishi
Even if the 5% chance there actually is another gasser STI Im sure production numbers will be limited just the GR cars and the Z. I also guarantee even adjusted for inflation it will be more expensive. Probably starting $52.5k and thats without markups that have become all to common with cars with hype.
Next Gen STi needs to be in the ballpark of 450HP and 400Lbft, Lieberman sais it will be using the current FA24 and for me most likely STi will pair this with hybrid technology, possibly raising the ICE HP up to 350 and the rest from the hybrid system. IMHO it also needs the advanced transmission to go along with this, AND yes dual clutch please.
That image is of the STI Viziv concept car that the 2022 WRX was based on. Figured it was a fitting reference of what the STI could look like. Thanks for watching and Stay Tuned!
@FlatironsTuning The concept STI Viziv looks pretty good honestly. It's just the production version aka 2022+ WRX that was a bit disappointing. I get there are manufacturer restrictions and general rules that they have to follow to get a car approved for mass production; just wish if a new STI does come out, it's not a 2022+ WRX with a wing on it and brembos haha. Like it was mentioned in the video, Subaru tends to play it a bit conservative and that won't cut it for the new model considering the expected price and competition it would be up against.
About the Toyota GR 3 cylinders high output; It will only last up to 3 years more. That engine is probing right now not a reliable engine. Already some customers have seem the engine blowing up. It’s crazy to put so much power in that little engine. The only other two real competitors are Honda Type R and the Gulf R. It makes good sense to bring back the king of the rally sport cars.
I was wondering what your guys thought on this. Did you noticed that Cobb and many other companies stopped selling their EJ-based GESI Downpipes! It feels like A LOT of our aftermarket options are getting away from us!
@@lucian7182 it not that easy like you change several part and tune it，EPA rule is wayyyy strict than all we thought，beside subaru also need to consider cost and warranty，you think it is easy that is because you don't care whether your car will blow up or not for long term use
My biggest concern is that the GT costs $46k. If they want to slot in an STI, it's going to be the mid-$50k range whereas the last STI we had was $44,307.46 adjusted for inflation. The current top WRX trim is already MORE than that. I really don't want an STI for Audi S4 prices.
Very true, they're going to get a lot of bad press if they're not careful with the pricing. But realistically speaking, we have to look at the market as a whole, not just the inflation numbers. If it's objectively worse than an S4 then it'll sell less than the S4. Also, market adjustment goes both ways. Most of WRX are selling under MSRP right now.
They would have me back immediately with a manual transmission Outback XT or a manual transmission WRX wagon. 400hp, brembos, blah blah - that's all noise. Practical, fun to drive vehicles are what made Subaru popular. They need to return to that for me to return to them. Simple as that.
A slap in the face for TR owners? Yes. And the TR was a slap in the face too. I bought a 23 limited. Need that manual transmission. Had to haggle with my dealer just to get MSRP and a couple months later they announce the TR. And now a TS too? And mabye an STI...geez
Why do you keep talking about a dual clutch? I get it, it would put down faster lap times. The problem is that the enthusiasts who actually buy the car want that manual trans. Additionally DCTs are expensive both to develop and to manufacture. With a DCT the STI would be in the 60-65k range. The STI has always been a raw driver's car and that is missing in most manufacturers model range. My bet is that the new STI will be the TS with a different turbo a tune and perhaps an upgraded 6 speed. With basic bolt ons people are tuning the current WRX to 450hp
I am Japanese and deeply rooted in the automobile industry here. There has been no such talk of even further performance STI version of VBH model. Actually there is not even 6MT setting for Japanese market. So it is improbable that there will be STI Complete Car like "S210". If you really believe such unfounded rumors from sources that cannot be confirmed, then you are just spreading unverified information.
Watched the rest of the vid. Someone mentioned the phrase, "gas mileage". 🤣The STI motor was a total loser at this - mine has never returned more than 25MPG, lifetime average is probably 22-23 with easy driving. I've rented Mustang GT's that returned /significantly/ better mileage! As far as dropping in hybrid features, you are basically buying another 4-600 lb for structure, motors, batteries. So you're negating the 400HP, but at least the weight will be down low. And while you can engineer in some straight line, I autocross so a 4000 lb car is a nonstarter, you can't put enough tire in to make that pay. What would get me back in? 400HP. It's gotta have headroom/helmet room, no sunroof. I'd love a DCT if it isn't a 150-200 lb weight penalty. Would not consider it at $70K, it needs to be well under 60 to make it competitive with Audi BMW and fast EV's, not to mention ponycars. Don't put in luxury features, this is your performance model not a BMW 7 series, in fact offer a stripped model that is significantly lighter. My two cents' worth there.
17:30 that is not true at all. From 15 to 16 there was a huge amount of change in chassis stiffness. The transmission went from simply sending power to front or rear to torque vectoring and on the fly spot tune changing
Do you guys know that the 2024 Porsche Boxer S uses a Subaru 2.5 turbo engine producing 350 hp, you guys talked about Dct trans. but failed to mention that Subaru already has tons of data and can easily adapt any engine to that Dct trans that is already developed and is used by Porsche, and if we know anything about a Porsche Dct trans is….. they are just the best in the market.
I disagree with everything you are hoping for. Going for 400 horsepower and trying to compete with Audi and M series will make the car expensive. No one wants to pay high dollars for a Subaru. Maybe pro racers want a true sports car that’s ready out of the box but the average enthusiast wants something fun and affordable. It needs to compete with the GR Corolla and Civic Type R. Give me a refreshed 04-07 STI and I’ll be running to the dealer. It’s small, light, easy to mod….and then easy to fix, lol. That’s why the GR is doing so well. Look at the closed auctions on Cars and Bids. “Low-cost” STI’s are where the market is. No one wants an overpriced Subie! Keep it affordable and keep it as analog as possible. The after-market is already built for it. That being said, I love your channel and content.
It seems unrealistic to think that Subaru would develop a new chassis, engine and transmission for the same new model year. The new parts of an upcoming STI may be mostly an engine upgrade over the tS. They might be enthusiastic after the S209 ran out of development time/whatever for forged pistons. As long as we're writing letters to Subaru Santa, I want a manual Levorg (so close to the Mexico market WRX wagon) with this new STI powertrain. It's not likely. They'll leave the AWD performance car w/hatch segment to the GR Corolla. The hybrid style Subaru has used would be odd for a mainline STI. How heavy will the battery be to support a 20-minute lapping session? Would they want to race it in the N24h? How long would that CVT last? A hybrid makes more sense as one of the WRX sub-models, with lowered expectations on-track.
I want a 450 500hp Subaru WRX STI 6 Speed Manual AWD 2.4l Turbo rally inspired race car for the streets. It has tobrinf a kill shot, because subaru lost me and a major engine and drivetrain upgrade but still keepnit manual.
In a lot of ways Subaru has already lost me. I daily a 17 STI, and I've had so much fun learning and modifying this car. Sure, I wish I could get something a little bit newer, but the styling on the 2022 WRX did not sell me. While the stock performance seems to be good, the tune ability seems to be worse. And on a lot of other newer Subarus, things like HVAC being integrated into the touch screen are turning me off entirely. Meanwhile, I still have my physical HVAC, but then have an aftermarket unit to get my Android auto. Best of both worlds. I don't need all this driver assist, and there's no way I would accept a CVT in a daily fun car at this point. I enjoy my manual too much For Subaru to get me to actually sell or trade in this car that I put so much work into, and really gives me everything I want except for stock reliability, they would need to build an STI on an internal combustion drivetrain only, manual transmission, at least 350 horsepower from the factory, some ability to still tune the car, physical, HVAC controls, and slightly less ugly style. I'm not really too picky on price, so if it was around $45 or 50k, that's comparable to what it would cost to buy a lightly used current gen STI and do some light modification to it. Oh, and it would need to at least come with oil temperature and oil pressure sensors from factory
The biggest problem with Subaru WRX STi is its fanbase... and I'm saying it as someone who LOVES this car and always dreamed of owning one brand-new. You see, people whine and complain, but they don't have the guts to support their favorite brand or car model. I live in Poland, deep down in communist European Union, where we just don't get any "cool" new Subies. The most powerful car they offer here at their dealerships is a 165ish HP Subaru Outback (the 2.5i version, detuned compared to the US variant). Is it a quick car? Not really. But it still drives well and isn't slow by any means. It also comes packed with much more features than its competition. Yet all the "Subaru fans" whine and complain, and they always did - the thing is, I'm willing to bet that 90% of those loudly whining people have never even owned a brand-new Subie. God, I hope the rumors are true and that they will bring the car back, but it's annyoing to hear people whine, while they've never shown TRUE support to their favorite brand.
I don't think they're coming out with an STI it's just a rumour. The base GR corolla with the performance pack is already cheaper than the limited WRX and it's also a class above it in terms of performance. The new WRX only had a 3hp increase from the last generation I do not think an STI would jump to 400hp. The WRX TR also starts at $41K with the current pricing an STI would start closer to $50K which is ridiculous.
Had the 2018 STI Limited. Now have a 23 WRX premium. Great platform that would benefit from STI enhancements. HOWEVER.... Subaru have kinda screwed themselves now, as the TR is what 43K USD. This means the STI will likely be 10 to 15k more, which puts it out of the younger buyer range.
Winning me back with an STI? 350+ bhp. Everyone else has moved on.. the STI needs competing power. STI level suspension, ideally adjustable enough to remove the understeer bias they have from factory. DIFFS and selector and decent trans. A competitive price. A return to seats that actually have bolstering that work. Sub 50k ideally. They can remove the enormous screen and eyesight, go back to more manual controls. Frankly, I wouldn't be mad if they made the BRZ AWD and turbo lol. A crosstrek wilderness STI would also be hilarious, and I would likely buy it not a CVT. Hatch or sedan, doesn't bother me.
Oh and I forgot.. fix some of the bodywork to make it more sporty. The S4 is just not good enough styling, they need something changing that makes you stand apart from the regular WRXs.
It's interesting. I'm not sure how many have driven an STI right next to a WRX. Driving the WRX had electric steering and a more refined dive and feel. The STI was a more raw and connected car. I would absolutely hate to see that stupid tablet screen in the new STI. you don't see that garbage in premier cars
![When Is The Next Generation Subaru STI Coming? [Update]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/tOOFk1_eTng/mqdefault.jpg)
Jonny Leiberman started this rumor.... and everyone is running with it.. good grief..
Yup, total BS rumor
Jonny is all about EV's. He's probably just trolling.
Exactly. I don't know how everybody can trust an automotive golden boy from California, no matter how long he's been an automotive journalist/TH-camr for Motor Trend.
He never said where the source came from. He only said "a good source that he trusts." In other words, don't trust him if his quote unquote "good source that he trusts" isn't telling the truth.
I've said this in a couple of other videos that heard about it and I'll say it here in the comments of this video like everybody else saying or thinking. "I'll believe it when I see it.
If for some reason Subaru of Japan and Subaru of America Inc., and Subaru globally as a whole reversed course on the decision of not having a VB gen WRX STI and actually brings it back on the VB WRX platform, it's for one of 3 reasons:
1. Subaru has gotten fed up with all of the backlash that they gotten for a shortsighted decision that didn't need to be.
2. They saw what happened with the GR Corolla in terms of the two fires that 2 owners had in back-to-back weeks.
3. The WRX tS is officially going to be marketed, targeted, and noted as DOA and Subaru is all out of options with just having a WRX because now that they built a car with adaptive dampers, a digital gauge cluster, Recaro bucket seats, and added EyeSight to the manual transmission, they can add all of that on official STI version along with more power, DCCD with upgraded Intelligent, Sport, and Sport Sharp modes, and actually 1-up the GR Corolla.
Hope so without STI they have lost of die hard fans and the performance prestige they had
Subaru needs to do flat 6 TwinTurbo this next time around 🏁
Honestly, with how tunable the VB is, I'd be happy if they just gave us the current TR with the STI 6 speed + LSDs. Call it an STD for all I care, the only point lacking on this car is the transmission and trick differentials.
PLEASE if it gets announced officially and it has a STi 6speed but only 350hp… know that they’re keeping numbers low for emissions and tuners will be able to unlock the extra hp. And don’t bash Subaru about the power numbers.
Agree 100%. The cool thing about Subaru engines is how easily you can pump up an extra 100HP with tiny tuning and without jeopardizing the Brand. After all is up to the owner to tune and get the extra power he or she wants.
Every hot hatch rumor seems to _start_ at 400 HP then gets produced with less. Golf R a prime example, a test mule with rorty exhaust and ~400 HP got shown, then production car nope.
A GR Corolla is within about 75 lbs of the old STI, (my 2006 is about 3300 in autocross-ready trim) and has the same 300HP with a smaller engine and more turbo. The STI /must/ have a performance delta from that. And they should not IMO do the BMW route, "we'll increase the weight to add a bunch of luxury features, but stuff another 100 HP in so it's all good" that ends up with 3700 to 4000 lbs. Still, they need BMW equalling performance, it's hard to push a 4.7 0-60 when BMW even 2WD are sub-4. Make it a lighter, stripper, not every feature. Though I would accept a DCT or other paddle-shifter.
We'll still be screwed because it will be low production and dealers will be able to hose us, just like GR owners have gotten hosed due to the demand. Plan on $70K out the door for a year.
Great points. It is pretty clear that the performance of the STI has to increase significantly to justify bringing it back, and the question is how much more would it cost.
And knowing that it will cost more than the WRX, it has some very stiff competition. For it to do well at all, it will have to compete with much more expensive cars.
Time will tell.
Thanks for watching and Stay Tuned!
Don’t go faster than 85 mph in a GR. Rumor is the ECU will rat the owner out and void the warranty. The owner drives too fast 😱 it’s being abused.
As you mentioned, I also was waiting for the new STI for back in 2022, and had saved up for it , so they definitely lost out on a lot of Subaru enthusiasts and potential buyers.
That being said, I would like to see a full ICE STI , no hybrid for me :D
same thing for me
Please make it so...2026 WRX STI with FA24 revving to 7,000 rpm, 350HP+, TY85 transmission and diffs plus Brembo.
Remove the ugly rear bumper diaper thing and I will buy it to compliment my 2006 STI.
Thanks for watching and thanks for the comment. We will just have to wait and see...
Stay Tuned!
Do you think the whole engine will be transparent? Or will it just have glass pistons?
I don't trust Jonny Lieberman. He's just an automotive golden boy from California who says things only he can trust, but the rest of the general public shouldn't.
Like I've said in the comment section of other channels, I'll believe it when I see it, and as it stands, I don't believe it.
Even if the STI does come back and model year 2026 will be the refresh of the VB gen WRX, would the STI only be 2 years, or would it extended 4 years beyond its mid-cycle refresh for a secondary refresh until a VC gen WRX arrives? Those are the questions that need to be asked.
If Subaru of Japan and Subaru of America Inc., and Subaru as a whole globally come out and say it is for real and it is true and it will come out by model year 2026 in late 2025 or early calendar year 2026 as a 2026 model year vehicle, I will apologize for my doubts on what Jonny Lieberman said about his good source and never doubt him again.
From where I'm standing, I have -99.9999995% hope of hearing or reading Subaru reversing course on bring back the WRX STI on the VB gen platform and bringing back the STI Division to get their hands dirty again to make a VB gen WRX STI happen.
350hp is not enough. It’s 2024. It should be 450hp + standard.
Ew no, the new STI needs to be an H6
I guess I’ll just be saving up for the next two years
Right there with you 🙂
Thanks for watching and Stay Tuned!
I bought my 2018 STI to upgrade from my 2015 WRX. The last one carried new tech and low gas milage, the STI had the rumbling sound, the full analog feeling of a car that was fun at any speed. That manual transmission paired with the EJ engine, the hydraulic steering, and the somewhat lightweight made it a wonderful experience, plus I bought it new below 40k.
Yes, the world has changed but some things still make driving a car a fun experience:
Fun experience = f ( driver, vehicle, road ) = A combination of the variables listed below.
1. Lightweight.
2. Analog feel, to feel that the driver is driving the vehicle.
2.1 Manual transmission.
2.2 Good feedback from the steering wheel. Why not even better than a hydraulic one?
2.3 Real Engine sound and running experience.
How many people decided to put equal-length headers in the STI to improve the performance? Very, very few.
3. Tires. They have a big say in the driving experience, but it's out of the question that new tires help with the experience.
4. Reliability. The GT (Gran Turismo) name in cars started when those could run long distances. There was a time when programmed obsolescence wasn't required because buyers were looking forward to the new models, i.e. BMW M3 to the E46 generation, Porsche Boxter/Cayman when all engines were 6-cylinders, and Mustang GT when it came to the engine. Every new generation was more desirable than the last and that in itself brought the desire for an upgrade, while the used car went to other owners who started dreaming about the newer models.
Yes, the world has changed. Electric cars can be fast, but they don't bring together crowds of car enthusiasts anywhere. Why? Because the experience is not about the connection between the driver, the vehicle, and the road, but about efficiency in energy consumption and even taking the driver out of the equation. Take a bullet train and you'll be on something electric that brings you extremely fast from point A to point B and the police will not be looking after anybody.
The muscle cars have great performance numbers, but I see more BRZs/GR86s on the street even though many minivans are faster.
There were many different buyers for the former STIs. For me, the magic was the balance between how it sounded and how it drove. The manual, no rev hang, the steering, and the relatively low weight.
At this point, give us another 305hp unit. It’s only been two decades of such. Just please for the love of everything this car is, don’t put the nail in the coffin and give us that electric garbage.
Flex fuel being standard would be interesting
I agree
Would be nice but largest part of the world doesn't have E85.
I would give it a fair shot. I’ve never financed a vehicle… but I’ve been looking to make that jump. And this would be just the push I need.
Thanks for watching and thanks for the comment.
Stay Tuned!
IM ALREADY HALF WAY TO BUILDING MY OWN 23 WRX STI (LOL) ..FOR ME, ONLY PARTS THAT REALLY MATTER ARE THE TRANS, DIFFS, AXLES, DCCD & BRAKES. YEAH IT WOULD BE COOL TO HAVE AN STI BUT I ALWAYS SHAVE THE BADGES OFF ALL MY STUFF ANYWAYS AND A 405HP/460TQ FA24 WITH THE STI DRIVETRAIN REALLY IS A DREAM. GEARING IS SO MUCH BETTER THAN THE SPLITCASE 6 SPEED AND MAPDCCD ALLOWS YOU TO REALLY TUNE INTO THE SETUP AND OPTIMIZE
One thing no one has mentioned. If I was to buy the new sti it would have to have port and direct. On current gen wrx and va you have to have motec in order to be able to go over 500hp due to injectors running out. I'd also like to see the sti have a manual trans still.
IF subaru does come back with the STI, it really needs to have a full exposed carbon roof like on the S209, it also needs better Recaro seats, i mean the Elantra N has better looking seats and its a kia... the new STI should also have those robust wide body fenders like the VB had. If its gonna be 50k+ they need to work on the aero and styling too not just the drivetrain....
I don't want a dual clutch or a hatch! Dual clutch transmissions are for brochure readers not drivers
I will also mention that the S210 will come out soon as well, Japan market only. Thanks for the video!
That will definitely be something to watch.
Thanks for the comment and Stay Tuned!
S210の情報なんて聞いたことがありません
そしてS209はアメリカ限定でした
Where did you get this information? A credible source and not Torque News?
@@QuintonLeister a credible source that I will not mention. It is very credible indeed
@@TheLastS209 lol okay
"as a leak" with Subaru doing it intentionally is an interesting theory. I don't think it hurts them, but i don't think it really gains them anything. They know their enthusiasts are leaving and aren't interested in a 50-60k STI with 300crank. They know what we want. We want a true modern STI with updated power and a reasonable price. Bump the VB to 375-400 wheel, add the typical STI desirables.
Another great episode with awesome ideas! I love the creativity and will manifest the power of YET to make this car appear for us all!
Thanks for watching and thanks for the comment DP!
Stay Tuned!
I drove an 05 STI for 13 years, before moving on to a Mk7.5 Golf R. I don't think Subaru really lost me, I think I just got old and my priorities changed. The Golf R is a better "fun up to eight tenths" street car than my old STI could have ever been. I don't need more power. I don't need a better AWD system. But I did get the itch to wrench and hit the track again, so I got a '23 BRZ, for reasons that are diametrically opposed to whan a WRX STI should be.
I'm happy they chose the FA24, one of the biggest selling points to me about the VA and VB, is the timing chain. It's arguably better for a car that's going to be a daily driver. I own an ej257, I can't deny not having to do a valve adjustment and timing belt maintenance at 100k would be pretty convenient and save me money.
For me I want a lightweight manual wagon!
That would be pretty good for sure.
Thanks for watching and Stay Tuned!
They would have to make in a way that it can be competitive with the m340 cause in my area all the Subaru guys are going that route just based of basic mods and your in the mid 500
I really wish they would come out with a new STI. I have a VB and love it, but I want a new STI. But, it would probably be like $55k, which is too high. And, id they did release it, i’m not sure that they would win me back in that price range
They have to get back into WRC, that will be a big draw for many. The STI has to be NOT run of the mill. Cutting Edge gets people excited. It is not all about HP. That is why the STI was so popular for all those years with only 5HP difference.
I'll believe it when I see it
Knowing Subaru, my prediction would be: ~300 hp tops (JDM WRX S4 is uptuned to 295 lb ft), maybe hybrid, LSDs front and rear, manual or CVT option, higher spring rates and/or adaptive dampers, all the interior luxury elements from the WRX TS, $55K or more, crazy markups. Subaru will probably lean more towards interior luxury and comfort than performance, which is sort of the opposite of the balance enthusiasts want.
Hopes and dreams: 330-400 hp, 7,000 rpm redline, mechanical linkage 6spd or 7/8spd DCT (if Hyundai can do it, Subaru should too), some more leather and ultra suede where it counts, front and rear LSDs, DCCD, JDM STI draw stiffeners, beefier suspension components, high quality dampers (not just stiff springs; bonus points for ride height and 1-way damping adjustment from factory), sub-3500 lbs, maybe some kind of improved floor aero work, gloss black and slightly wider fender cladding, and a serious facelift to de-clutter the front and rear. I wouldn’t mind a hybrid if it means better city MPGs and crazy torque like Toyota’s iForce Max. A “track pack” or something would also be cool, if there isn’t going to be a USDM S210. It would also be super exciting and unprecedented if they offered a factory track-only STI, like the GR86 Cup. I think that could revitalize the image of the WRX as a performance platform instead of a sporty Outback.
In terms of benchmarking, I hope they shoot for just above the GR Corolla and Civic Type R. Competing with the RS3, M340i, etc is asking for an undesirable performance to luxury balance, although they did benchmark the Cadillac ATS-V when developing the S209.
Above all, let’s hope the rumors are true and they don’t bungle it completely - or at least that it takes time to grow on us like the VB has and isn’t a total disappointment.
Just bought a wrx today. Subaru sales reps and managers said they wont bring it back cuz they are going toward ev
If the STI comes back, please Subaru build a lot of them. I wanted a Golf R a couple years back but wasn't going to pay over MSRP, and our dealer was allocated ONE for all of NW PA. ONE.
I went with the WRX for the raw, visceral fun factor and that I got mine for $2k under sticker.
No reason you couldn't just take the current TR/TS models and add a beefy transmission and a mild hybrid to give it an extra 20-30 factory hp along with no turbo lag. Plenty of room for it at the back of the boxer engine. No reason it couldn't sell for $45k and make enough that they don't become profit cows for dealers and collectors. Cars are meant for drivers, put them in the hands of enthusiasts not profit pigs.
Created my own version of an S202, new car would be carbon fiber hood, roof and rear end. 6-spd with similar V7 internals.A real weekend track car. Hybrid, if you have to.
400bhp 2.4 with 100-150 bhp elec motor
6-7 speed paddle shift a-la the recent prodrive rebuild
AWD with switchable diff
launch control lol
18s with at least 356mm discs all round and 6 pots on the front and 4 pots rear ...stopping power is everything!
and a wagon version bc rear boot space rules and trolling an Rs6 would be funny hehe
I dont think the STI competes with EVs at all. I think they are missing the mark on why Subaru does what they do. Even the guy who dailys the car on the panel. This car just needs a great STI transmission and badged up and it will do wonders. It seems like they dont want to tune the car anymore asking for all the luxurys the RS3 and other German cars have. You a Subi to build it yourself! why would you want 500hp STI with the perfect parts you dream of?? Would you still want to build it? I dont think so, which is why I believe that they will at most maybe do 350hp with room to tune. And all this talk about duel clutch lol come on fellas their market is enthusiast who want a 6 speed manual and they know this. No enthusiast car competes against EVs because EVs dont provide the same experience that the gas powered cars do. We hate fake engine noise for heavens sake lol. Anyways good video Gents, I hope that the STI does make a return it would be nice.
I dont think the drivetrain needs an update... a mechanical feeling shifter and the older gen mechanical awd is literally a blast from the past.. moar power baby and some fancy cruise control to handle the morning commute would be great
Manual shift or bust!!
Heavy, direct injection and weaker blocks of the old EJ207 and 208s. It needs to be tunable - bullet proof bottom end, flow, direct injection can't cause clogging intake issues and the old 6 Speed feel will be the success factors imo. I miss the suby burble of the unequal length headers 🙁
WRX STIが出せない事とGRカローラの存在は関係ありません
スバルにはSTIを出せるほどの企業燃費に余裕がありません。
ただFORESTERとCROSSTREKにTHSが搭載されるので、それにより企業燃費が改善されSTIが出る可能性はあります。
そしてこの間、スーパー耐久のスバルの参戦車両がBRZからWRXベースの車両に変更になり性能アップの試みが始まりました。
Don’t get too excited - it is a rumour and nothing more.
I'm torn. I get the argument for hybrid. But that adds complexity. I kinda want raw turbo motor in a hatchback.
If they bring back the sti (which i hope), MAKE IT LOOK LIKE THE CONCEPT!!!!!!!
if they do a new STI, it better be a good tuner platform.
What do you think it’s going to cost with all the bells and whistle??
Gonna be sweet if this happens. GD for life! 07sti
Source is “trust me bro”
I found this conversation interesting and thought provoking, thanks for sharing!👍🏼
All I hope for is a little more power stock, if they bring it out stock 400-450hp that would be cool. The STI already has enough braking power.
Edit: questions
#1 Subaru has not lost me yet (Thinking about a Lotus) own a STI Type RA and Tommy Kaira M20b GC8.
#2 Stated above, although the powerplant should be able to withstand modifications to at least to 650hp stock internals reliably. let 650 be the new 400.
#3 For me it has have nice looks from the factory. kind of like that concept art in the beginning of the video. just a nice stylish, sleek, aggressive look with enough power to prove it.
Would love to see a Dual Clutch Transmission with Good front and rear diffs still please Subaru!!!!
They would have to make in a way that it can be competitive with the m340 cause in my area all the Subaru guys are going that route just based of basic mods and your in the mid 500 I also feel like the sti would just need to have the drive train and port injection if they are stick with the fa24 The same way they have in the brz and just like most of the high horsepower fa20 wrx
What he said about using the TR suspension but no engine or trans yet would make sense. Due to Subaru buying rights to "STe," it would make sense that they are probably trying to figure out how to combine that 2.4 with a hybrid set-up. Some of us might not like it, but that would get you youre 400hp.
What I want a performance company to do is create a hybrid power supplement that’s easy to delete. Make it an option and easy for a person to retrofit to other older Subaru drivetrains or delete if you don’t like it. Easier said than done but imagine if a Subaru add-on hybrid power was as Lego-like as the other parts.
Give us what we all want, a closed deck flat-4 boxer, with forged crank/rods/pistons. A forged, closed deck FA24 would be one heck of a stout powerplant.
Close deck doesn't pass emission
If Subaru makes a hybrid to get back in to WRC and makes an STI version, I'll snap that baby up. Let's be honest, any new STI model and I'll snap it up. Currently on my 3rd Subaru in a row and can't wait for their next leap.
Yes we want it. whatever it is. this is what I would do. DCCD with an electric motor assisted manual or dual clutch transmission both as options for torque of the line. The 2.4 would go to a 2.5L with a lower compression ratio and I would have dual turbos and dual intakes for each cylinder bank. Battery bank would be small and weigh just as much as the engine and trans on the rear axel for a true 50:50 weight distribution. Bingo the recipe for the perfect STI. oh and add regen braking for extra stopping power without eating up pads. oh and magnetic dampers with adjustable ride stiffness for track handling or street comfort. and of course the wing how about a robotic wing that adjusted angle for the speed.
The VB Platform NRB racecar is working super well in the Nurburgring 24h series with the FA24. That possibly might be the development process for the new VB STi?
I don’t think anyone would be mad if it came with fb with a slightly bigger turbo, brembos and dccd.
$42k
13:50 is exactly what I've been thinking since this hit car and driver a few months back. And what people want compared to what subaru is willing to produce has way too far of a gap. And making the STI automatic only would be an unholy sin. Plus it's going to cost an ungodly amount to make a 450-500hp turbo sedan that actually will take back what made an STI what it was.
This coming from a person with a 2020 STI (that still only has 3200 miles on it).
For how much? 50 stacks?
Thank you for the video. I have a question - why does the fa24 in the 86/BRZ blow up from oil starvation on right turns, but this is not seen in the fa24dit VB WRX? My thought is that the VB is such a slow car that understeers too much, the slowness of the platform protects it from blowing up, unlike the faster, more superior gr86/BRZ fa24 that can corner faster, and in turn cause oil starvation. Thanks
Completely different oil system
I've seen stories (Grassroots Motorsports) that mention 2022 cars having issues with too much sealant restricting oil passages, and they suggested that in later years this quality control issue has been take care of.
@pault151 Yes, it does seem like this was somewhat isolated and has been corrected. FWIW, there were Outbacks with the FA24DIT engines that were leaking oil because not enough sealant was applied... Seems like they had to sort out the calibration across the models.
Thanks for watching and Stay Tuned!
@TheLastS209 They are different oiling systems, but there may be some commonality. The issue definitely seems to be mainly with the BRZ though. Take a look at what Verus Engineering is doing to solve that problem :
th-cam.com/video/eBHT5b3sf9o/w-d-xo.htmlsi=Fn3ApSxicp0-pKXa
(hint: They may be coming on the podcast to discuss their progress very soon :-)
They should make it priced for the rich. A legit show stopper sTi requires deep pockets. If it’s too affordable then the value of them won’t stay up there. It has to be substantial. No Mickey Mouse stuff!!
I think if they bring back the STI, it may be like what dodge is doing with the charger and challenger. It would be like the final good bye. I see the WRX ending altogether, unless they learn from Mitsubishi
My bet is that the new STI will just be a "modified" WRX TS, with STI trans, STI wing, wider painted flairs and a different set of wheels.
Even if the 5% chance there actually is another gasser STI Im sure production numbers will be limited just the GR cars and the Z. I also guarantee even adjusted for inflation it will be more expensive. Probably starting $52.5k and thats without markups that have become all to common with cars with hype.
Next Gen STi needs to be in the ballpark of 450HP and 400Lbft, Lieberman sais it will be using the current FA24 and for me most likely STi will pair this with hybrid technology, possibly raising the ICE HP up to 350 and the rest from the hybrid system. IMHO it also needs the advanced transmission to go along with this, AND yes dual clutch please.
@4:40. The styling....primarily the rear of the car and the plastic fender pieces. Definitely make you go "oh no"
That image is of the STI Viziv concept car that the 2022 WRX was based on. Figured it was a fitting reference of what the STI could look like.
Thanks for watching and Stay Tuned!
@FlatironsTuning The concept STI Viziv looks pretty good honestly. It's just the production version aka 2022+ WRX that was a bit disappointing. I get there are manufacturer restrictions and general rules that they have to follow to get a car approved for mass production; just wish if a new STI does come out, it's not a 2022+ WRX with a wing on it and brembos haha.
Like it was mentioned in the video, Subaru tends to play it a bit conservative and that won't cut it for the new model considering the expected price and competition it would be up against.
About the Toyota GR 3 cylinders high output; It will only last up to 3 years more. That engine is probing right now not a reliable engine. Already some customers have seem the engine blowing up. It’s crazy to put so much power in that little engine. The only other two real competitors are Honda Type R and the Gulf R. It makes good sense to bring back the king of the rally sport cars.
I’d be happy with a wrx body refresh that comes with sti diffs and trans
I was wondering what your guys thought on this.
Did you noticed that Cobb and many other companies stopped selling their EJ-based GESI Downpipes! It feels like A LOT of our aftermarket options are getting away from us!
They should start using forged internals on allll turbo models 🙏🏻 forge the ej!
Make the front end similar to the 2007. I’ll trade in my VB today.
If it over 350hp it definitely a hybrid at least，it is literally impossible to make over 350hp for that fa24 with EPA compliant
I don’t see why not there are 350-400whp sti builds that are technically epa compliant.
@@lucian7182 it not that easy like you change several part and tune it，EPA rule is wayyyy strict than all we thought，beside subaru also need to consider cost and warranty，you think it is easy that is because you don't care whether your car will blow up or not for long term use
My biggest concern is that the GT costs $46k. If they want to slot in an STI, it's going to be the mid-$50k range whereas the last STI we had was $44,307.46 adjusted for inflation. The current top WRX trim is already MORE than that. I really don't want an STI for Audi S4 prices.
Very true, they're going to get a lot of bad press if they're not careful with the pricing. But realistically speaking, we have to look at the market as a whole, not just the inflation numbers. If it's objectively worse than an S4 then it'll sell less than the S4. Also, market adjustment goes both ways. Most of WRX are selling under MSRP right now.
Theyre trying to be a premium brand without premium brand things
They would have me back immediately with a manual transmission Outback XT or a manual transmission WRX wagon.
400hp, brembos, blah blah - that's all noise. Practical, fun to drive vehicles are what made Subaru popular. They need to return to that for me to return to them. Simple as that.
A slap in the face for TR owners? Yes. And the TR was a slap in the face too. I bought a 23 limited. Need that manual transmission. Had to haggle with my dealer just to get MSRP and a couple months later they announce the TR. And now a TS too? And mabye an STI...geez
I’ve been saying since the sti died that Toyota had a part in killing it off. And damn Subaru for allowing it to happen.
Why do you keep talking about a dual clutch? I get it, it would put down faster lap times. The problem is that the enthusiasts who actually buy the car want that manual trans. Additionally DCTs are expensive both to develop and to manufacture. With a DCT the STI would be in the 60-65k range. The STI has always been a raw driver's car and that is missing in most manufacturers model range. My bet is that the new STI will be the TS with a different turbo a tune and perhaps an upgraded 6 speed. With basic bolt ons people are tuning the current WRX to 450hp
I know right? If I wanted an M3 I would've just got an M3. Why ask Subaru to get into this unfamiliar territory
Of course, since Toyota majority stock owner has released all their performance variations. Subaru can return to their STI line.
I am Japanese and deeply rooted in the automobile industry here. There has been no such talk of even further performance STI version of VBH model. Actually there is not even 6MT setting for Japanese market. So it is improbable that there will be STI Complete Car like "S210". If you really believe such unfounded rumors from sources that cannot be confirmed, then you are just spreading unverified information.
Guess imma sell my GR COROLLA soon 😂. I need mine in sliver to match my 07 sti ❤
Aint no way
What card did you buy that wasn't the nonexistent STI?
Thanks for watching and thanks for the question.
Stay Tuned. It will be revealed soon.
Watched the rest of the vid. Someone mentioned the phrase, "gas mileage". 🤣The STI motor was a total loser at this - mine has never returned more than 25MPG, lifetime average is probably 22-23 with easy driving. I've rented Mustang GT's that returned /significantly/ better mileage!
As far as dropping in hybrid features, you are basically buying another 4-600 lb for structure, motors, batteries. So you're negating the 400HP, but at least the weight will be down low. And while you can engineer in some straight line, I autocross so a 4000 lb car is a nonstarter, you can't put enough tire in to make that pay.
What would get me back in? 400HP. It's gotta have headroom/helmet room, no sunroof. I'd love a DCT if it isn't a 150-200 lb weight penalty. Would not consider it at $70K, it needs to be well under 60 to make it competitive with Audi BMW and fast EV's, not to mention ponycars. Don't put in luxury features, this is your performance model not a BMW 7 series, in fact offer a stripped model that is significantly lighter. My two cents' worth there.
They need to sell 450+ hp wrx from dealership already!!! 600hp vb wrx I wanna see them.
17:30 that is not true at all. From 15 to 16 there was a huge amount of change in chassis stiffness. The transmission went from simply sending power to front or rear to torque vectoring and on the fly spot tune changing
If they bring the STI back, I just hope it has dual injection.
Do you guys know that the 2024 Porsche Boxer S uses a Subaru 2.5 turbo engine producing 350 hp, you guys talked about Dct trans. but failed to mention that Subaru already has tons of data and can easily adapt any engine to that Dct trans that is already developed and is used by Porsche, and if we know anything about a Porsche Dct trans is….. they are just the best in the market.
I just wish the wrx had an sti trans option and i would be happy.
I disagree with everything you are hoping for. Going for 400 horsepower and trying to compete with Audi and M series will make the car expensive. No one wants to pay high dollars for a Subaru. Maybe pro racers want a true sports car that’s ready out of the box but the average enthusiast wants something fun and affordable. It needs to compete with the GR Corolla and Civic Type R. Give me a refreshed 04-07 STI and I’ll be running to the dealer. It’s small, light, easy to mod….and then easy to fix, lol. That’s why the GR is doing so well. Look at the closed auctions on Cars and Bids. “Low-cost” STI’s are where the market is. No one wants an overpriced Subie! Keep it affordable and keep it as analog as possible. The after-market is already built for it. That being said, I love your channel and content.
What about the gr auto instead of a DCT
For the love of God, we need Manual!! If you loss manual, you lost me 100%
It seems unrealistic to think that Subaru would develop a new chassis, engine and transmission for the same new model year. The new parts of an upcoming STI may be mostly an engine upgrade over the tS. They might be enthusiastic after the S209 ran out of development time/whatever for forged pistons.
As long as we're writing letters to Subaru Santa, I want a manual Levorg (so close to the Mexico market WRX wagon) with this new STI powertrain. It's not likely. They'll leave the AWD performance car w/hatch segment to the GR Corolla.
The hybrid style Subaru has used would be odd for a mainline STI. How heavy will the battery be to support a 20-minute lapping session? Would they want to race it in the N24h? How long would that CVT last? A hybrid makes more sense as one of the WRX sub-models, with lowered expectations on-track.
Its gonna be a crossover. Like the Eclipse cross
I want a 450 500hp Subaru WRX STI 6 Speed Manual AWD 2.4l Turbo rally inspired race car for the streets. It has tobrinf a kill shot, because subaru lost me and a major engine and drivetrain upgrade but still keepnit manual.
In a lot of ways Subaru has already lost me. I daily a 17 STI, and I've had so much fun learning and modifying this car. Sure, I wish I could get something a little bit newer, but the styling on the 2022 WRX did not sell me. While the stock performance seems to be good, the tune ability seems to be worse. And on a lot of other newer Subarus, things like HVAC being integrated into the touch screen are turning me off entirely. Meanwhile, I still have my physical HVAC, but then have an aftermarket unit to get my Android auto. Best of both worlds. I don't need all this driver assist, and there's no way I would accept a CVT in a daily fun car at this point. I enjoy my manual too much
For Subaru to get me to actually sell or trade in this car that I put so much work into, and really gives me everything I want except for stock reliability, they would need to build an STI on an internal combustion drivetrain only, manual transmission, at least 350 horsepower from the factory, some ability to still tune the car, physical, HVAC controls, and slightly less ugly style. I'm not really too picky on price, so if it was around $45 or 50k, that's comparable to what it would cost to buy a lightly used current gen STI and do some light modification to it. Oh, and it would need to at least come with oil temperature and oil pressure sensors from factory
I'll believe it WHEN I see it!! and if it looks like the VB WRX, NOPE! If it has an FA, NOPE! And if it doesn't come with THE STi 6MT, NOPE!!!
The biggest problem with Subaru WRX STi is its fanbase... and I'm saying it as someone who LOVES this car and always dreamed of owning one brand-new. You see, people whine and complain, but they don't have the guts to support their favorite brand or car model. I live in Poland, deep down in communist European Union, where we just don't get any "cool" new Subies. The most powerful car they offer here at their dealerships is a 165ish HP Subaru Outback (the 2.5i version, detuned compared to the US variant). Is it a quick car? Not really. But it still drives well and isn't slow by any means. It also comes packed with much more features than its competition. Yet all the "Subaru fans" whine and complain, and they always did - the thing is, I'm willing to bet that 90% of those loudly whining people have never even owned a brand-new Subie. God, I hope the rumors are true and that they will bring the car back, but it's annyoing to hear people whine, while they've never shown TRUE support to their favorite brand.
I don't think they're coming out with an STI it's just a rumour. The base GR corolla with the performance pack is already cheaper than the limited WRX and it's also a class above it in terms of performance. The new WRX only had a 3hp increase from the last generation I do not think an STI would jump to 400hp. The WRX TR also starts at $41K with the current pricing an STI would start closer to $50K which is ridiculous.
Had the 2018 STI Limited. Now have a 23 WRX premium. Great platform that would benefit from STI enhancements. HOWEVER.... Subaru have kinda screwed themselves now, as the TR is what 43K USD. This means the STI will likely be 10 to 15k more, which puts it out of the younger buyer range.
Winning me back with an STI? 350+ bhp. Everyone else has moved on.. the STI needs competing power. STI level suspension, ideally adjustable enough to remove the understeer bias they have from factory. DIFFS and selector and decent trans. A competitive price. A return to seats that actually have bolstering that work. Sub 50k ideally.
They can remove the enormous screen and eyesight, go back to more manual controls. Frankly, I wouldn't be mad if they made the BRZ AWD and turbo lol.
A crosstrek wilderness STI would also be hilarious, and I would likely buy it not a CVT.
Hatch or sedan, doesn't bother me.
Oh and I forgot.. fix some of the bodywork to make it more sporty. The S4 is just not good enough styling, they need something changing that makes you stand apart from the regular WRXs.
The new STI has to have at least 400 HP with a manual 6 speed
For me to buy it, it would need a manual transmission but I'm old school.
If they did bring back the STi, my question is going to be how dumb is the price going to be. A TR is 42-44k, which is high...
It's interesting. I'm not sure how many have driven an STI right next to a WRX. Driving the WRX had electric steering and a more refined dive and feel. The STI was a more raw and connected car.
I would absolutely hate to see that stupid tablet screen in the new STI. you don't see that garbage in premier cars