3D Printing Engineer Reacts to Phone Stands: Design for Mass Production 3D Printing
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 13 พ.ค. 2024
- Today we're taking a look 3D printed phone stand designs. We meticulously examine each design, pointing out the nuances that make a design stand out, as well as the potential pitfalls that designers should avoid.
From aesthetic appeal to functional efficiency, no detail is left unexplored. Furthermore, we shed light on the vital considerations for mass production 3D printing, highlighting which designs are primed for scalability and which may pose challenges. Whether you're a 3D printing enthusiast, a designer, or just curious about the intricacies of product design, this video promises a comprehensive look into the art and manufacturing of 3D printed designs.
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0:00 Intro
0:40 Universal Phone Holder
cults3d.com/en/3d-model/gadge...
2:11 Dolphin and Penguin
cults3d.com/en/3d-model/home/...
3:17 Round Phone Dock
cults3d.com/en/3d-model/gadge...
4:39 Rocking Smartphone Stand
www.thingiverse.com/thing:159...
5:44 Phone Case with Integral Stand
www.printables.com/en/model/1...
7:06 No Support Phone Stand
www.printables.com/en/model/3...
7:58 Car Phone Holder
www.printables.com/en/model/4...
9:02 Tablet/Phone Stand
cults3d.com/en/3d-model/gadge...
9:45 Adjustable Phone Stand
www.thingiverse.com/thing:277...
11:15 Phone Stand For Use Without Case
cults3d.com/en/3d-model/gadge...
12:07 Yet Another Phone Stand
www.thingiverse.com/thing:459...
13:01 Mobile Phone Stand
www.cgtrader.com/3d-print-mod...
13:52 Planetary Phone Stand
www.myminifactory.com/object/...
15:55 Flat-Fold Phone Stand
www.myminifactory.com/object/...
17:08 Smartphone Timelapse Stand
www.thingiverse.com/thing:229...
18:55 Emoji Phone Stand
cults3d.com/en/3d-model/home/...
20:42 V2 Sound Amplifier
cults3d.com/en/3d-model/home/...
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About Slant 3D
🏭 High-Volume 3D Printing: Scalability Meets Flexibility
Slant 3D's Large-Scale 3D Print Farms utilize 1000's of FDM 3D printers working 24/7 to offer limitless scalability and unparalleled flexibility. Whether it's 100 or 100,000 parts, our system can handle it reliably, while still allowing for real-time design updates, ensuring products evolve with the times. This adaptability is key in today's fast-paced world.
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Embrace a system that drastically reduces carbon emissions by eliminating carbon-intensive steps in the supply chain, such as global shipping and warehousing. Our approach minimizes this footprint, offering a more sustainable manufacturing option.
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The more I watch you the more I feel to be the wrong public lol, but I understand, you talk from a mass production manufacturer point of view. Most of us bought a printer to have fun and make cool products, but your target audience is obivously not the hobbyist but the entrepreneurs. We learn a lot from you tho, and Im deeply grateful for all your inputs, thank you so much !
Thanks for watching
Oh, his technical knowledge has been very useful to me in my hobby printing which all have a function. So for everybody who designs 3D printable objects this is highly useful information - as well as for the hobbyist who wants to print pre-designed objects. It makes it easier to see what will be very hard to print, and what will probably work well.
This is one of the very best 3D print youtube channels in my opinion. Like the experience he shares when discussing the hexagonal through-holes. So obvious when explained, but it is the first time I have tought about it.
Great stuff.
Think of it as free tips to make the prints better
For real. I love that most of what he says challenges everything I have done in my design lol. A lot of the lessons I have learned have helped make my future functional designs stronger.
This is an amazing educational video, BUT, it's also an incredibly clever advertising video, the whole time you were mentioning the "oh, yeah, you can send us the files and we print them for you while you focus on the design", i was the whole time thinking "hmmmm. it sounds like a good idea"
Good Job!
Thanks.
Thank you featuring a few my designs. Learned some stuff that I will implement into my other designs. - U3dprintit
I would love to see a video or a series of videos from you on how you calibrate your 3d printers and the tolerances you expect afterwards.
Not that there isn't this information already out there, but because the people who make that information do not run a billion printers at once. So therefore YOUR calibration process must be fast and accurate and that is really interesting to me. I would love to see the approach you take to tuning one of your machines. Even if the result isn't translatable to a consumer printer.
have you seen his prints? they look like they were made on a reprap i3 from 2005
This was some great insight about design and printing. It would be cool to see one of these videos for each major holiday. Maybe desk organizers, cable organizers, headphone stands, or door stops. Great video!
Thank you for all the great design tips. Even though you are concentrating on mass production, many of those tips worked fine for us hobbies at home.
I've watched this a few times now and learn something new every time. I would love this to be a series. Review commonly made parts and highlight ways to improve them
Although I do not design for mass production, the tips you gave here can help us to produce better models.
Will be happy to see videos like this one.
Greetings from the Galilee.
I like your massively produceable critiques. I have been doing 3D printing for a while and so I have become quite good at making decent models, but mass production will have things that I will never know on my own. I have seen other videos where you talk about what is 3D printable and I feel like I usually leave learning nothing but in this I feel like I got a lot out of it. Didnt realize companies like yours ejects prints. It is an interesting thing to consider if I make more designs and post them publicly.
I have been using a print-in-place foldable design for a few years already and every year I have to print one more because I either lose one, somebody forgets to return it or I just give it away. It was not featured here but it is one of the top ones on thingiverse. The nice thing is that it folds flat (thin) so it's easy to stow away in a really small pocket and is adjustable for phone and tablet. A must-have when travelling.
Really great format, reviewing many designs in one video is very productive.
the guy whose print is in the video: waow
whenn the videoer says is not manufractable: 😥😥😥😢
Thanks for the insight! In my mind learning mass production design considerations helps us hobbyists make things more robust and reliable.
For a Christmas special you could have a look at print in place toys/gifts.
Not a bad Idea
The mechanical term, if I'm not mistaken, would be a knuckle where each segment interlock together. Great video and interesting lineup of parts for review. 👍
"Knuckles" confirmed. I was able to find a diagram. I would have guessed "teeth", because that's the anatomical term we use for zipper elements.
He may have been talking about the hing pin?
I loved it! It looked like at school when the teacher was correcting our works and he did all those sounds like "aaagh" "uuuh" "mmmhh" and we didn't even knew who's job he was actually watching 😅
This is an amazing video for a new person to FDM printing. There is sonmuch information on using thebprinter but so little on best practices. Please keep doin videos like this.
So many good advices, and ideas. Thanks.
Cool info. Lots to think about for mass scaling
I'd like to see one of these videos with shelf brackets to hold up a wall shelf. I could just get a metal one to hold up the shelf but there are so many designs out there for function, style, and strength.
Learning so much, thanks
Before I realized that you were referring to auto-eject i was thinking of the traditional cool down and grab as to because of bed adhesion issues hence why most design to maximize bed adhesion to reduce failures
Could you do the hex patterns with trickimg the slicer to put there infill?
What would you say is the minimum reasonable nozzle diameter for printing reliably in vase mode?
What sort of tips do you have for printing a bunch of thin disc shapes?
Hey so I'm actually curious; for your print farm, what do you do with the leftover plastic waste from support material or failed prints? do you have a way to recycle the filament back into the filament so it can be reused? It's one of my major pet peeves for 3D printing that we don't yet have a consumer-level way to recycle failed prints into filament.
Call your local recycling company and ask for them to consider. I did with my local company and they said they'd look into it, and said it was a good idea.
8:17 I just realized that those holes are probably more so the phone can cool off than being able to see it; not that I think they couldn't be done better for that application, but I wouldn't close them up entirely
For the car phone holder, the open cutouts are likely for cooling. If you have the phone charging or are using CarPlay/Android auto the phone can produce heat even with the screen turned off, so enclosing it could possibly overheat the phone.
Great video, learned lots. Makes me think "How can I do this in Fusion 360" and get it to print well.
You talk a bit about having the prints automatically removed from the print bed. How do you feel about conveyor belt printers like the Creality CR-30?
I managed about 10 of them at my internship. We have one that just constantly prints PCB covers, and when they're done the prints just roll off the ends of the conveyor into a pile
I've got a question regarding orientation. If I understood correctly, you always say aim to minimize the contact surface with the buildplate so you don't have different textures on bigger surface areas around the part and to make it easily removable automatically in mass production. Don't you have issues with bed adhesion when you print parts with such small contact area? How do you deal with that? What's the minimum contact area to keep the part properly sticked to the bed during the print?
I just purchased a 3-D printer, haven’t received it yet. The clockspring 3-D phone holder with all the gears would be neat to make. How do I get the file
Great breakdown of what makes something manufacturerable. It seems that you gave clockspring a pass on the large surface area on the bed, especially the thin folding one. But yes his designs are very well done.
The different considerations for mass manufacture vs one-offs are interesting. For example, I learned that you should print as "flat" as possible, to reduce the risk of the print detaching from the bed during printing. Printers in makerspaces get messed with by novices a lot so they're usually not very well calibrated. But when you're making more than a few, it makes way more sense to spend an extra hour or two making sure the printer is configured perfectly, so that you can print in an orientation where the head can knock the part off the bed at the end.
Great analysis.
As I’m new to this, am I correct to assume from what I’ve seen in this video, is that parts that need to being 3-D printed should have less material on the bed and more going up. Is that correct?
The last stand I think can be carved from wood in 2 parts and then wood glued together. Some postprocessing and it'll be impossible to tell it's from 2 piece of wood. It's more labor intensive but not impossible to build, and can be priced much higher than a 3D printed one (though as niche a product as it is, will not sell as many).
Do you mind making a video on how to design products for mass production
You have two slightly opposing criticisms/criteria and I do understand them both but have a question about them. You want to minimise bed contact area but on a few models you suggest having a solid or connected base, I understand you need to find a balance but which is more important? If you have a model that would logically be printed flat with a large contact area with the bed and you couldn’t print it with any other orientation, should you just leave the large contact area or should you try to reduce it with “cut outs”, or raised and bridged or ridged sections?
The only 3d printed consumer product I've ever purchased is an azeron cyborg computer gaming keypad. would love to see slant3d's opinions on it. there are something like 20+ printed parts that assemble the keypad.
If you have time, can you explain what you mean by ejected? Do the machines you use have a separate means of ejecting certain parts? And thank you for these videos they are quite informative.
He showed it at 9:41 The printer pushes the part off the bed using a "wall" on the printhead. Very interesting, I wasn't aware of the technique either.
@@dekutree64 Thank you I totally missed that. And right very interesting
I thought this was a really good look at what your expectations are from a mass production POV. Thanks!
Thanks
I just watched a man hold back a flood over that emoji one.
8:30 visually, the slots in the design do indeed not serve a function. But they might have some benefits thermally. Most cars these day seem to support phones to the point where the phone can run an app and the car's screen shows the output. So it'd be possible to use the phone for GPS navigation even without being visually "reachable".
And all my phones so far got somewhat warm while being used for that. I got a little "phone bag" for my bike in which I can shove it behind a see through cover, so I can use the GPS while biking too. And one of my older phones, stuffed inside that heat-trapping bag, got on one trip from a little sun and it's own heat output so warm, that the battery triggered an emergency standby to cool off.
I don't know if the heat output is drastically lower when the display can stay off, but if it is /not/, then those slots might be useful, depending on how hot the phone "runs".
And using TPU in that case could be even worse, but that's just my assumption based on what little material knowledge I have, which indicates that plastic is a bad thermal conductor, but rubber being an even worse one.
But this is pretty much "worst case" stuff. If the phone's just sitting in there, getting charged, maybe playing music at most, then those slots are definitely only aesthetical and therefore indeed optional.
I designed a foldable laptop stand with cutouts. It's a pain to print but required, since the laptop sits almost flat without it, meaning no airflow. It's a Lenovo Yoga if anyone cares. I simplfied the design so that it's larger squares instead of small triangles but still there's no reason to get rid of the holes. The fan induction area is small, not the whole width of the laptop, so every little bit of air helps.
TPU is not rubber and TPU is not that bad thermally, I believe I have seen articles about using some special TPUs for heatsinks.
@@conorstewart2214 Which is why I stated that I just assumed. Good to know that assumption wasn't accurate xD
How would you rate the manufacturability of the "phone stand in 47 minutes" on printables?
What's the name of the model in the thumbnail?
That clockspring one would be a great thing to produce if it was shipped flat as when printed so that the end user folds it up and assembles it. Kids would get a HUGE kick out of that.
Unfortunately like he said it isn’t good for mass production printing, due to the complexity and large contact area.
Awaiting a day one of my models appear haha. I think most of them are terrible for mass manufacturing :/
You've said at several points throughout the video about reducing bed contact area, and it does make sense in terms of print ejection, but how do you balance this with bed adhesion? Like in 'No Support Phone Stand' you proposed to taper both sides to a single line to make them indistinguishable, but wouldn't it just peel off the bed by third or fifth layer?
He seems to only talk about designs in terms of print farm considerations.
Most factors are universally beneficial, like designed with no support, but low bed contact area is the opposite of what you want at home.
@@cameltoast Prints peeling off the bed would have about the same impact in a print farm as prints that failed to eject, if not more so. Maybe he has some tips for finding that balance, or for improving bed adhesion
Slant does not utilize bed-slingers so only the print head moves. This means there is no acceleration forces on the part, or more importantly on the contact layer of the the part/print bed.
A combination of a non bed slinger printers, with well tuned printers and sticky beds probably means that they can get away with minimal bed contact.
The parts of a hinge are typically the pintle and gudgeon.
Nice!
Could you do a video on guitar picks and accessories
Thanks
Thank you so much.
8:27 Those are holes for heat dissipation I think, as it partially encloses the phone and provides USB, it's not a great idea to bake it in a plastic sleeve while charging.
Most phones would probably be fine, unless it was a hot day but if you are charging your phone you are probably in the car anyway.
If the holes are needed for heat dissipation then there are better ways to design them that would be easier and better to print.
Maybe the holes in many of the patterns are for venting? 🤷🏾♂️
Some people wanna be president, a professional athlete, or a doctor when they grow up. I wanna be this dude 😂
With a 0.4 mm nozzle you can easily print walls up to 0.8 mm in vase mode, just change your settings and tell it to print larger walls, it slows it down, extrudes it larger. I've got lots of sturdy vases I've printed with a 0.4 nozzle.
How reliable is it long term though? Also a lot of nozzles have a flat area on the end sized to work with the nozzle diameter, if you go too large you will exceed the size of that flat and you extrusion quality will suffer, but that is very dependant on the specific nozzles you use. A nozzle is designed for a specific diameter and hence specific line width and range of layer heights, using anything really but in this case nozzles, outside of their intended settings and configurations, whilst it may work, probably won’t be as good or reliable as just using a nozzle the proper size.
I just realized that I mostly watch for your sultry voice
8:26 It looks like it can hold a charging cable. I would presume the holes are for heat relief.
If they are then there are better ways they could be designed that would also allow it to be printed as a single piece vertically.
"Yet Another Phone Stand" - indeed if printed on the side there's obscene amount of support material waste. But what if you print it on the back? With "snug" supports style in PrusaSlicer, supports drop to
Strength of part
So glad my phone stand didn’t make it on the list 😅 in my defense, mine has a lot of support but with tree support it becomes negligible. Also, mine was made for the people with print farms in mind 😂 not the customers
The thru holes are useful because phones get hot while on a stand and charging.
Best thing about a simplistic design is it's easier to print and harder to break, which is a definite plus for something that's handled as much as something like a phone stand. Might revisit this video at some point when I get some time to make my own phone stand, lots of good ideas and feedback here
Hinge "tabs"? "segments"? "lobes"?" ears"? "fingers"? @16:33
Could you do a video on how your company came to be in the life story of it I would love to hear it also about the trials and tribulations you’ve had to face owning a big 3-D printing company?
already done
An interesting introduction to how your priorities as a mass producer are almost completely inverse to mine as a hobbyist. Especially your comments on orientation.
I mostly print in ABS, because most of what I print is intended to be joined, sanded, and painted to look something else. (A huge percentage of my printing has been full-size R2-D2 feet, for example.) All of these post-printing steps are much easier in ABS than in other common filaments. But of course, ABS warps very easily. Also, I live in a city that routinely reaches -20C in the winter and +30C in the summer. The spare room my printer is in vents to the outside and one of the walls is a concrete firewall, so the printer is more subject to weather effects than some places. So all of this taken together means I want very broad, very short parts - things that have a lot of area in contact with the bed and never get very far away. This does mean that I spend more time retrieving parts. But I have time to spare - this is not my job, I'm running a single printer for my own needs and those of my friends and acquaintances. And to minimise warping, I spent about 30 minutes waiting for the print chambre to warm up and then about 2 hours letting it slowly cool, so adding 5 minutes to manually retrieve the parts is a very minor additional cost. So this is basically the opposite of your needs, where you want a simple but small first layer that lets you put more parts on a build plate and lets you automate the extraction.
Skimming through the comments, I think a lot of people are having the same reaction I've had. And I think that a big part of it is how you kind of buried the lead on the bed surface question. You mention on one stand that "this uses too much of the bed, it should be oriented more vertically" on one stand, and then it's one or two examples later before you explain why. I offer this comment as hopefully constructive feedback: it's very cool to see how a manufacturer needs to think very differently from a hobbyist/small craftsperson, but I think a lot of your audience is in the latter category. I suspect the videos will land a little smoother if you watch out for the places where those differences exist, and make sure to pause and really highlight what the difference is and why it's different, before you dive on into the commentary. For myself, I spent several minutes asking "why is this guy saying the *exact opposite* of what every other TH-camr says about print orientation, and that sense of confusion lessened the impact and enjoyment of the video.
It did get cleared up, and to be clear I did enjoy the video and learnt things! If I were grading this video, I'd give it a comfortable B: pretty good, but making a few small tweaks to the way you present information, and staying aware of the disconnects between your assumptions and those of the audience, would make it even better.
I see for people discovering him with this video it makes sense. But he repeats that in almost every second video of his so maybe that's why he skimmed it a bit in this one, but definitely agreed with your points
Even and especialy for ABS you want minimal bed surface contact
I am a hobbyist and am the opposite of you in priority.
I hate doing any fiddling with the 3d printed object. When it finished printing, I expect it to be done.
I rather invest up front in designing objects and tuning the machine than to put in the labor to post process something into a finished product.
I'll do a lot of printing of multiple prototypes to make sure that it works, or test small part of the prototype. Once the design is done, it's not even done. I still have to write up documentations, which either tell you how to use it, or how to remix it into your projects, or both. If necessary, I'll include information on how to print it, but I want to make sure it's as easy to print as possible.
You do a lot of work in a different direction, but my focus is more on product design for a lack of a better term.
@@Killy10000 Fair. Most of what I'm printing is a prop or replica, so I *can't* change the final appearance. This, of course, has effects on how I design a printable part.
@@slant3d My experience is that the taller the object, the more likely it is to warp or otherwise fail, especially with ABS.
If I'm trying to print the panel that covers the access hatch in R2-D2's foot, I am essentially printing a 3mm thick trapezoid that is about 10 cm deep and with the parallel sides being around 15 and 25 cm long. I only need 2, so I can easily fit both on a 25x25 cm print bed.
If I lie them flat, about two hours later I'll have a nice pair foot panels.
If I stand them up on end, about two hours later I'll have a huge mess to clean up.
My experience and education on this subject is miniscule compared to yours - but my experience is also that maximum surface area on the bed and minimal practical height produces useable parts, and the other way around doesn't. So there is definitely a disconnect between what I've experienced and what you're saying.
completely flat parts should just be laser cut or CNC tbh
I wish you would have printed these all out. I feel there would be a lot more value to showing you interacting with the models versus just showing pictures
Wanna see a guy look at some pictures of other people's efforts on the internet and riff off the cuff for 22 minutes, instead of putting in any effort to print and test the things he's talking about, this video is for you!
If a bigger feature consists of smaller features that are functionally identical to the bigger one, you can use the "sub" prefix. Sub-hinges.
@@dtylerb Knuckle yes
It's for a stylus not a pen
First View! First Thumbs Up, First Comment! OH YA!
Boom!
Printing engineer?? Is that a degree?
Can't access the phone or swipe the screen while on the stand with any of them so they're all pretty useless for my case
"3D Printing Engineer Reacts to Phone Stand Designs Not Intended for Mass Production" While I think some of your criticisms are valid, i'd rather see you make observations on parts that were actually intended to be mass produced, and how to improve the designs. This is just content for contents sake.
A lot of the things he points out are just about designing for manufacturability and making the model more optimal for 3D printing, so they are applicable for a lot more than just mass production.
Why would you use 0.4 nozzles? With the latest slicer software tech 0.6mm is absolutely superior for 90% of applications. Unless you are printing figures, use 0.6mm. You keep basically the same details but print much faster.
Incorrect
@@slant3d you are 1000% wrong. With arachne's variable width system there is no reason to use 0.4mm nozzles anymore for functional prints. 0.6mm is superior in every way unless you are printing miniatures or small fonts. If you are going to correct people at least explain what you are talking about.
@@LazorzPewPew if you are going to say something is better then explain how it is better. You say it is superior for 90 % of applications but don’t elaborate. You say it is superior in every way when not printing miniatures but again you don’t elaborate. You say he is 1000 % wrong but don’t elaborate and are just throwing in large numbers for effect.
It doesn’t matter what size nozzle you use if you are limited by flow rate, which a lot of modern fast printers are. You can use 0.4 mm line width and print faster in terms of linear speed or you can use 0.6 mm line width and print slower in terms of linear speed, but then for both you can end up at a similar flow rate. The statement that 0.6 mm nozzles are faster is missing some details.
I don't mean to be rude, but you kinda come across in this video as being a bit judgemental towards these parts (and their designers) for being unfit for mass production, even though the designers probably didn't have mass production in mind at all when designing them.
Unrelatedly, your "About Slant3D" section in your description has an extra space in between "allows clients" and "to manufacture".
I kinda feel bad for the original uploaders if they didn’t ask for the bulk manufacturing criticism.
I mean if you don't want your work to be criticized, don't put it out into the world....🤷
TBH, a lot of the designs out there are poorly designed anyway. No tolerances, lots of support, "some manual finishing required", etc. I'm not a mechanical engineer, but that seems like basic stuff. Not going into the more advanced stuff like stress risers, gear geometry. No offense to the original creators, they probably built one and it worked for them.
Another way to view this: is how could an existing 3d print design be made mass producible? Even if it wasn't the original intent.
BTW: this is the back story to how he launched on a path into a mass production business. He designed a simple product on the weekend. Made a bet with coworkers it wouldn't sell, so created a kick-starter as a joke, then had to produce 1000's of his design.
(paraphrased. there is a video on this channel that explains it better)
I remember hearing that slant3d was accepting submissions for videos like these. So I'm guessing most if not all of these were submitted by their author
I haven't confirmed this though
If it’s submission based, then it’s no big deal because then it’s asked for. But if it’s an upload to share with no intent to mass produce, then it seems unkind to insult their work. It’s like measuring a fishes intelligence by its ability to climb trees. I have made a few things and tossed them on similar sites for the purpose of sharing with a friend, family member, or small community; I’d be annoyed if I was featured in a video like this, especially if it was nothing nice said. Especially in this modern era where people will just flood the OP with negativity. People seem to forget that there’s a human with feelings, life, and emotions on the other end
I could feel you kind of be eaten alive, especially with it saying University of Minnesota on it you like? I don't want to shit on this guy. Too bad considering he probably did this for a school project and got a grade on it but.... Or even worse, this is the teacher demonstrating what you can do with 3D printing 😬
It's constructive criticism, a normal person should be able to handle it, be glad that some expert has an opinion and use it to improve themselves. Or ignore it and go to a big televised talent show where they will receive a lot more criticism.
If you're reviewing 3d print designs you should actually print them and point to your copies when explaining things instead of gesturing around an imaginary copy