For those who are interested, I'll elaborate on what Eric said about these engines being in Mitsubishi Lancers. The basic tooling of these engines comes from the Global Engine Manufacturing Alliance, a joint venture between predominantly Chrysler, Mitsubishi, and Kia/Hyundai. This basic engine architecture has been used with various modifications in a litney of vehicles from all of these brands and possibly others(I cant remember) for the last 15 years or so. The Chrysler world engine which has been requested in the comments for a teardown video is very similar to this, as are the other engines from GEMA.
I would never have a chance to see these engines without your channel and your efforts. Thank you for the free education. Merry Christmas and be safe. Peace
Agree! I'd never seen the innards of a flat-four or a rotary. And the over-engineering of... certain manufacturers. And of course, the aftermath of complete destruction. For some reason, I find pieces of the engine falling to the floor when he takes off the oil pan totally amusing... 😁
I had a 2010 2.0T GT, it was amazing, only issue I actually had was a minor one, that turned into a big one at the dealership LOL! my pedal stopped working (electronic pedal) put me in limp mode, crawled to the dealer. They told me the pedal was dead, and would be weeks to replace. they called me that same afternoon and told me they would take a pedal out of one of their lot cars, and use it in mine. Apparently the pedal is coded to the engine it was installed with, and the pedal killed my ECU and some other things. 5 days later in disbelief, they called me and said my car was ready. they flew an engine and a crew of specialists from korea and worked on my car for 2 days. One of my favorite cars, and best dealership service so far.
Engineer 1 to Engineer 2: "Don't worry about the dipstick tube placement. Yeah it's in the way of some of stuff, but if they ever need to remove it, it means that the engine is already toast." Thanks for the video. Going to go check my oil now....
As an owner of the "bigger" Hyundai family turbo engine, I'd love to see you do a 3.3 Lambda II turbo V6 if you ever get the chance to get your hands on one. It'd give me new and exciting reasons to worry!
I'd like to see any Hyundai V6, mainly to see his thoughts on them. In my experience, the Lambda family is pretty well built, but that's based more on my knowledge of the 3.8 circa 2010. Forged crank and decent OEM bearing quality. Blocks are strong enough for being open deck design. Pistons and rods in the 3.8 were all cast units with the standard factory treatment and quality. Tendency for the ring lands to go first due to detonation in tuned engines, which will do in your cylinder walls. But stock tunes are pretty easy on the factory components. They run on the side of rich. But easy motors to work on. Easy PVC system. No EGR. Standard metric sizes. OEM parts are cheap. Aftermarket is not. Some complaints about chain guides wearing out and having timing chain noise/failures. But I'd hazard to guess that most of those issues are maintenance related. But yeah! You've got my vote. V6 teardown!
@@charleswp71 I think that might be maintenance related. My mains were on their way out at 90k km, but only because I had fuel oil contamination and cracked ringlands from a shitty tune after throwing boost at it LOL
I have a 2013 Genesis Coupe Rspec with this engine, and I have to say, I’m amazed with how reliable it has been. I have had 0 issues with it and it has been an amazing experience owning this car since new. I have 92k miles on it and it looks and drives brand new. (Not to mention I still have a warranty to 100k or 10 years :D)This engine is actually different from the other Theta engines Hyundai used for the Sonata and others, this engine is only made in Korea and it has Port injection while the other Engines that are made in America have direct injection (way dirty)and have a different Turbo, not to mention have FWD components. The Genesis version of this Engine is a Beast, the port injection really shines for keeping everything clean, although it gets a lot worse gas mileage than the direct injection version. I would still recommend doing 3k oil/filter changes, do them yourself it’s cheap, don’t believe the hype of 10k oil changes, all cars especially Turbo cars should do 3-6k oil changes if you want them to last 200k and beyond. I’m actually so in love with this car I may keep it for life, this car has really impressed me.
I have a 2011 2.0T and so far it's got 175k miles with no major repairs- just general maintenance. It recently developed an oil leak from a turbo line but that is the first issue I've had.
I got a 14 gen coupe with this same 2.0T but only 17k miles ... My wifes 15 sante fe with the fwd version of this motor seized at 86k miles. I did 17 oil changes from 5k miles to 85k mikes and it still seized due to rod bearing failure. Hyundai replaced the engine under warranty without question.
I'm with you 100% on checking your oil at every fill up. That said, with all the on board diagnostics they have on newer cars, why can't they have some way of warning drivers there is a lubrication problem. I mean if they aren't going to give you an oil pressure gauge, at least give you a dtc to warn you of oiling problems.
IT does but usually when the idiot light comes on it's already too low. German cars are pretty sensitive and will trigger a light when 1-2 qts low (out of 6-9 total), but there are still people that ignore that and they don't have dipsticks in those cars to verify the warning light or to know exactly how much to add
Lots of 90s gms like the infamous northstar and mercedes will tell you on the dash if the oil level falls below a certain level. You can probably guess what I drive.
It's amazing what keeping oil in the engine does for it. 407K miles on my 94' Honda Accord 2.2L. Only major work done to it was Valve Cover Gasket around 330-340K miles. Keep the oil in the engine folks.
As a Hyundai Palisade owner, just like all Tesla, BMW and Jeep owners, I must tell you that your findings were planted, not typical, your a meanie doo-doo head and I'm rubber, you're glue! That engine looks perfect. Those are just Hyundai things you don't understand.
I'm pushing 200,000 miles. I got mine new with 7 miles on the car. Doesn't burn any oil and no ticks. 7500 mile oil change intervals and still never have to add oil. I've been using castrol edge 5w40 since the first oil change.
Nice! I got about 128k on my BK2 2.0T. 5k change intervals and i just did some diff and transmission fluid servicing. Its all factory and has been an amazing car.
I have learned more about the overall architecture of engines, how they are designed, the common elements and also design differences, by watching your channel than from any other source.
Fun Fact: Hyundai is the second biggest chaebol (conglomerate) in South Korea. They make everthing from car too ships, toasters and clothing, they also own property development companies a chain of high end department stores and they're being tapped to build south korea's first aircraft carriers. Samsung and Hyundai are effectively responsible for around 50% of the south korean gdp.
@@ShainAndrews There was a huge bribery scandal in south korea that involved samsung back in 2015 that actually sparked fears that their entire economy might collapse.
I was thinking about that coolant line for the turbo going through that bracket, and my hypothesis is that one of the engineers saw that the hose would be routed next to/around it and thought "Hey, wouldn't it be clever if we designed the bracket to have a coolant passage in it so there isn't an extra length of hose taking up space in the engine bay?" and the team went with it. It does make the engine look a bit more neat/tidy, to me at least.
That top end being clean was the first clue that the rings were torched and mixing gasoline in the oil. Any non-mechanic would check the oil and see it full or over-full without noticing the smell, next longish commute would vaporize all that gas and suddenly starve it.
According to the internet, it seems that most of the problem isn't that there's a lack of oil in the pan, it's that the oil is blocked from going where it's supposed to because the passages are blocked due to poor practices during manufacture (mostly not cleaning properly following machining). It's a bigger problem in these KIA/Hyundai engines built in the USA than those from other facilities or other members of the GEMA family.
@@CaptainSpadaro Hyundai would rather replace 10% of the engines and lose customers than fix the same issues that have been going on for over a decade now.
@@mikem4633 cost/benefit analysis is a biiiiiiitch. Also I've been told that they've more or less stopped all gasoline engine development in favor of EVs, so if the problem hasn't been solved already (which I would hope it has, seeing as it sounds like a pure manufacturing problem), it likely never will be.
@@CaptainSpadaro I found a video online that the Theta-3 engines (aka smart-stream) are having problems in Korea due to design flaws. A Korean whistle blower is reporting the problems and you may be able to find the videos here on TH-cam.
@@tails300 Yep. Engine block is not sturdy enough for the DI engines and its higher temp and pressure, so the cylinder bore gets ever so slightly larger due to high temp and the oil penetrates through the rings to combustion causing oil loss from burning off in the combust chamber. Thus, ending with loss of oil and if not checked regularly, you will have a toasted engine due to oil loss. There are a few really good auto reviewers who raised the issues. There were huge controversies. I know all about it and will NOT buy any Hyundai cars because of it. All their DI engines in Kia and Hyundai are going to have issues, even the new Genesis v6's. It's really unfortunate because I think the Genesis cars are good otherwise.
Love your videos. There was a recall for this. The blocks were contaminated due to insufficient cleaning during manufacturing. This may have been the root cause for the bearing failure. I know because we got the notice in the mail and within 3 months we too had bearing failure. Changed the oil as per the manual and never abused the car. We got a new engine from the Manufacturer (Via Warranty) and sold the car soon after. It's possible the bearing materials are not made manufacturing specs, that's my theory because this has effected so many 4 cyl engines.
This is the comment I was looking for. I have two family members who own Hyundai's with the Theta II engine in them and one family member had theirs fail outright on the highway out of nowhere, they got the engine replaced under warranty. The other family member traded theirs in and bought a newer Tuscon instead. What I heard was the same, they never removed the deburred pieces that were left inside of the engine after manufacturing. That's more than likely why the bearing failed. Failed on my brother's.
That's what they said originally when this first started happening, but some folks have had the replacement engines fail also, and you'd have to think they learned from the first time. I just think these are cheaply engineered, cheaply built engines and it's pretty much a crapshoot whether they will last or not. I had a 2012 Sonata with the 2.4 and I always ran 10w30 in mine and never had any issues, but, I sold it before 100K miles despite the extended engine warranty, I just didn't trust it to be reliable long term.
Funny you mention class action lawsuits , my 2.4L GDI 2011 sonata was part of that mess and yes those four bangers are expensive almost $8,000 for a long block , all due to machining left in the engine when new !
Amazing seeing one of these torn down. I'd love to see the 5.0L Tau V8 out of the Genesis Sedan/Equus, especially with how the early models often burnt oil.
I would love to see a 5.0L Tau V8 from the Hyundai Equus/Genesis models around this same year. Would be interesting to see a failure point in the engine I have!
For the year or two I worked for Kia I replaced many Theta II engines although not this specific version, they were always the Direct Injected 2.0 Turbo and 2.4 engines and I worked there right when that rod knock recall came out. I also believe the Theta II has a shared design with the Chrysler "world engine" 2.0/2.4's found in things like Jeep Patriots and Dodge Journeys etc.
Yea I have a 13 Optima SXL 2.0t that's direct injected. Always use full syn 5w40, OEM filter every 3k miles, 93 octane gas and mine went at 50k miles. My aunt has a 13 Sonata 2.4 di. She has the dealer change her oil every 6 months or so no matter mileage, 108k, original engine. She does go through a lot of oil in between changes. But it's so weird how random these failures are. Like no matter what the maintenance is, it's a matter of when.
Chrysler / Kia / Mitsubishi Chrysler: world engine Kia: Theta II Mitsubishi: 4Bxx I had the Chrysler version which had a different timing cover, valve covers, and accessory brackets from the Theta II version
@@davidtryon1205 they seem to have fuel dilution issues based on your description, I'd recommend the thickest oil the pump can handle, and oil changes as often as you can afford, get the engine hot frequently too, if you can put the fuel residing in the oil out through the PCV that's the best case.
@@davidtryon1205 they have a lifetime warranty now with all the lawsuits and issues because of the issues. So really, it could be a good thing, if you look at it a certain way. You can buy a car with no issues and it lasts lets say 250k, then the engine is wore out. Or you have one with a lifetime bearing failure warranty. And maybe you get 150k out of it and the bearing fails. Then you get another one and the bearing doesnt fail and it lasts 250k. Well you just got 400k worth of engines for the price of one (plus the headache of getting them to honor your warranty and waiting for the engine replacement and possible the anxiety if you constantly worry about it failing)
I have a 12 KIA optima, that I bought new. At about 50k, it let loose. I believe the affected years are 11-13. Stay clear of these years. It is and isn't an oil issue. From the factory on affected models. The rod clearance is to tight. Creating oil starvation. And the engine will blow without notice. So even though you may have proper oil level. You can not help when a bearing eats himself, loses oil pressure. And chews up the cams. BTW, which is a awful design flaw to not have cam bearings! Hopefully they have fixed that of their newer designs. Another great video. Thanks! 😃👍
i have a 13 genesis 2.0t and had mine start knocking at 67k miles while driving home from work. was confused when it happened as i always changed my oil every 3k miles. got a new engine but worried itll go out again
@@miguelmaldonado9143 mine is currently at 107000. And knock on wood, no issues. Be true or not, I was told they fixed the bearing clearance issue when they replaced mine. Wish ya luck and many more miles
I'm finding your Saturday Tear Downs to be a rock of stability while the world turns to complete crap. Civilization may well end soon but at least we'll know why engines blow up. And thanks for that :)
I overheard a conversation between 2 Hobby Lobby employees. The were very young. A young lady was asking a young man if she should get her oil changed. I did my best to impress upon them the importance of oil, clean oil. I hope they listened.
Honestly they probably didn't. This younger generation and the ones after them won't listen to a single bit of advice given to them. I'm in my 30's, and try to give them some advice from a "younger" old man, and they blow it off or just go "ok boomer" or smile and agree and then continue doing dumb stuff. I've stopped giving advice or heads up now, and just simply step back and watch things explode in their faces. Much more entertaining.
Oil pump is a very good unit, problem comes from a small lower pan with very little baffling, running them low on oil and driving them hard. A extra half quart and not using the 5w20 from the factory goes a long way.
i had an engine with exact same destruction , looked new as this, but in a 2.3, and i pulled it's oil pump and in my case it wasn't bad at all. The pickup tube was where a lot of material collected, as well as the oil pan and the cam speed sensors seem to LOVE the bearing bearing material that pools together like the T9000 or whatever from Terminator 2. ya know the metal guy. oil pump was fine though. I'd imagine anything that went it would if anything just pit things up, but if you're at that point already it's not gonna be the major damaged area by the time u get to it
Engines like this are victims of starved oil that eventually tears everything up it's lack of maintenance if they would change the oil the oil pump and everything else was last nearly forever if not rodded
From what I have seen and heard, poor manufacturing...well lack of burr material from oil galleries on the crankshaft lead to oil starvation of the bearings. I think this lead to a class action lawsuit.
@@mikefoehr235 that was on a different version of the 2.0t, the ones used in the Genesis coupe seemed to a better quality that got some extra attention, mine has 140k miles on it without any problems, the key is regular oil changes with a good filter ( WIX XP or OEM only ) a quality and proper weight oil, these are turbo engines and the BK1 version , 2010-2012, did not have a oil cooler so oil temps stock stay around 200°f. Also the lower pan is pretty small so checking the level regularly is critical, I have always added a extra half quart. The other thing with these are the bottom end on the bk1 was not forged so piston and rod failure happened on allot once the boost got turned up past 300lbsft of torque
I have one of the "recalled" theta II engines in my 11 Hyundai Sonata, and while knocking on wood keeping it oiled and putting a magnet in the pan have kept it alive so far. I don't baby it, but I do keep the fluids and filters clean, and let it warm up before driving it. I would love to see one of my engines done, but bearing failure due to contamination isn't very exciting :) Cool getting to see a similar engine, thanks for sharing! Love the videos.
I had an oil starvation issue on my Kia Sorento at 105k. Changed regularly, but it decided to start consuming oil around 90k. That's pretty much "normal" from what I've seen from Kia/Hyundai engines.
Sounds like planned obsolescence that had surfaced earlier than anticipated. In comparison engines of the 80's and 90's particularly Toyota and Honda or any Japanese brands of the time never had the reputation of having oil consumption spikes after 90k. Many are still going around 30 years later still sealed from the factory on original piston rings with likely upwards of 400k miles swapped so many times or still with the same chassis from the factory.
Had a 2017 Kia Soul w 2.0 naturally aspirated engine. Used as a freeway commuter. Not hard use. Everything was OK for the first year and a half. Regular maintenance was done. Oil changes at the right intervals. Then, I was shocked to find the oil level was waaay down. So far down that the oil didn’t touch the bottom the dipstick. Took 1.5 litres to get oil to the dipstick.. From that time this engine was a heavy oil user. No oil puddles on my garage floor. So it was being used internally. But no smoky exhaust. Don’t know where the oil went. Used 3 litres of oil in between the regular oil change interval. Took it to Kia Dealer, confirmed the oil consumption and Kia said it was ‘normal’. Really… Your comment about small oil control rings in this engine perked up my ears. It appears to be an engineered chronic defect. I like your manner and commentary. Thanks.
@@frankieb7405 yes. Oil consumption was done. Definitely using oil as indicated. Dealer took my case to Kia and they refused to do anything about it. Kia said it was “normal”. I don’t have the Kia any more
Were you the original owner?? My 17 Elantra I bought new has 91.000 miles now and runs and sounds like new, uses no oil between 4000 mile oil changes..
Hyundai tech here: in my experience the 2.0 and 2.4 have the most issues with they were built in thr GA facility (VIN 5 1st digit) coupled with owners nit keeping up with oil changes and routine maintenance destroy these engines. Intake valves get gunked up quickly, not letting turbos cool down after a long or heavy drive, neglect, MFG defects are the majority of the failure points for these engines
Could this also be related to the 2.4 failures of not having a long enough dipstick, so engines were routinely starved of oil? I’ve heard stories of dealerships intentionally running engines without oil so that the owner gets a new long block under warranty after they lock up
@@deblackmon3 the 1st gen of thr theta ii 2.4GDI had short sticks and the campaign came out for short block rebuilds to have longer sticks. Long blocks that came from Hyundai had the updated dipsticks assembled at the factory. Now it was routine at alot if dealerships including mine that we would lock the motor up or blow it up whichever happened to get a rush on the warranty engine swaps. The main reason they would knock is because during assembly the chips weren't blown out of the engines after machining the crank journals and with chew the bearings up causing rod knock
My 2013 2.0T is in the shop right now because the engine seized a few days ago. The bearings look just as worn as the ones you have there. I checked the oil level every weekend, and changed it every 3,000 miles. Hyundai assured me that the G4KF was not affected by the lubrication issues that plagued some of the other Theta II engines... I'm surprised it lasted 10 years.
Always thought it was stupid to not have replaceable inserts in the head and cam caps but i guess they save $10 per head that way…..lets pass our lack of engineering costs on to the customers
I have owed a 2013 and 2015 Gen coupe and loved them both. I owed a 2015 Gen 5.0 and that thing ripped ass. The 15 coupe and 5.0 both could pull 60mph in under 6 secs. But the thing I could not get over was that the 5.0 got 25mph combo, with 420 horse power. If you would have told me back in the day that a 302 had that horse power with that mpg I would have called you a lair. I love my Gen's!!!!
@@papa45colt47 bro you in the middle somewhere with mileage and have too many horses to feed!🐎 My 377 Cleveland carbureted stroker Mustang with 375 horses gets about 8 mpg and my Honda Civic with 200 horses gets about 37 mpg. 400 horses at 25 mpg is pretty good
The cam caps are more worn than the lower journals because the force of the valve springs pushes upwards on the cam. There is only a bearing at the front because chain tension pulls down on the cam at that point. The wear on each cam cap is therefore less toward the front because the upward force on them is somewhat balanced out by the downward force of the chain tension.
I had a 2014 Genesis Coupe with the same 2.0T engine had never been opened up at 140k when I sold it had been tuned and ran relatively hard for at least 60k of those miles and it was still great. Always changed the oil at 3k with Mobil 1 and a Hyundai filter these things had a weird tick if you used a non Hyundai filter.
@@charleswp71 I had an oem equivalent filter on mine and ran 5w-30 super synthetic and my engine burned through the oil and I ended up having my rod bearings get worn down to where my rods are now knocking. Gotta do a engine rebuild 😪😪😪
Certain Hyundai/Kia engines got revised oil filters with an increased baffling, and design change to promote pressure. Had to stock them in the shop for these exceptions, never dug too much further into it though. Definitely cost more, standard stock filters were $2.89 cost, those were $8+ cost.
75,000 miles and these start to drink oil. They also have a turbo oil line and other leaks that are well known. Good news is that if you get the updated flash with a "new" knock sensor profile you will get a life time block warranty. They will also state that 1 quart of oil loss per 1,000 miles is normal and doesn't get a replacement. The only good news is the underside will not rust.
I love KDM cars since I've drove a 2012 kia optima 2.4l GDI sister got it used currently with 260,000 on the clock still running strong it's got small oil leak but gonna get it fixed cause it's time for another oil change
@@unprofessionalmechanic8466 the 2.4 GDI is N/A but it uses 5w-20 oil I've haven't had a lot of experience with the 2.0t found in the optima sx and the Sonata sport 2.0t but I've heard from a few owners that have put a lot of miles on theirs that it can last a long time if it's well taken care of
My mom's sonata 2.0 turbo spun rod bearings at 89k miles...fortunately, a new engine was covered by hyundai. But they should, because a motor going to junk sub 150k miles is completely unacceptable these days.
Hey Hyundai tech, my 2015 Sonata 2.0 is burning oil, should I just drive and continue to top oil and wait for rod knock then take to dealer or start the oil consumption process? Thanks!!
You'd have a field day with my wife's 06 Sedona and it's Lambda V6. PO never changed the oil and it's full of sludge. Made the mistake of flushing it and plugged the oil pickup several times... a few pan drops, a fresh pan, and a fresh oil pump later it's still shedding chunks that I'm seeing in the oil filter. Worst deal I've ever made on a used vehicle, and if I could afford to scrap it I would (heck, I have a car hauler, so I could even tow it out to you :D ). But I can't, so I'll keep changing the filter (and dropping the pan) as needed until it stops dropping chunks and becomes reliable... or until I get PO'd enough and toss the bastard anyway.
i used to have a 2.0t a few years back. upgraded the turbo and fueling system (on e85) and made 508WHP on a stock motor internals. i have a few clips on my channel. nothing ever broke
2012 and up Hyundai/Kia 4 cylinders. If I see a knock sensor code and it matches the TSB, i send it to the dealer. Most cases it's a engine replacement. There is an extension harness for the knock sensor they will try to stop possible EMI, but usually it's a rod knock issue and not EMI. You had me at Bluetooth connecting rod
Theta II engines had manufacturing issue with metal debris clogging oil holes. Hyundai had to give lifetime warranty on those engines to settle lawsuit. I think it was 2011-2018 or 19 model years.. Not the driver's fault. There may have been sufficient oil, it just wasn't getting circulated.
Doubt that in this case. The cam bearings and main bearings suffered quite a bit as well. And quite frankly, I think a lot of the failures of these engines, even the recalled ones, probably are closer to the same cause, rather than any manufacturing defect. They don't like getting oil changes done late and/or with junky oil.
My mom's '14 sonata seized with only 60k. They said it was a known issue that generation and It was replaced under warranty but it took over a month. I Still have my reservations on the long term with Hyundai/kia
@@snoofayy6150 Yeah I have an 09 5 speed optima, it pulls above 3 grand in third real well. I literally haven’t done a thing to that engine other than preventative maintenance and I have 152k and counting!
I don't know much about Auto engines but I loved watching this video. I was about to buy a used Kia Optima with a Theta engine and now I am having second thoughts. Thanks!
I'm just curious, if you don't sell dip stick tunes wouldn't it be easier to just snip the top part off to get it out of the way and take the rest out when you get down to it? I'm just asking...
my 2014 Kia Sportage SX went into limp mode, had to have the engine rebuilt/replaced, took 2 weeks to get the part(s). then there was a leak on the high pressure gas pump, good thing I smelled gasoline and checked under the hood, otherwise i'd of had an engine fire. also, several recalls, like knock sensor upgrade, and fuse box replacement. from the 1st oil change i used full synthetic oil every 5-6,000 miles. a lot of the engines had the oil lines clogged up by metal shavings that were left behind during manufacturing.
I work at Hyundai, and that's your typical Santa Fe and Sonata engine failure. Never seen it in a Genesis though. That's odd. We replace them in Sonatas and Santa Fe's about 10 times a month
Start recommending shorter oil change intervals and these things wont happen, People don't check their oil anymore and this is the end result after 6K or more on one OCI.
@@brandonpetrilla1731 100% agree! But it'd like pulling teeth to get them to do them at 6k even! They want to do them at 12k because in normal climate, that's what is recommended
OCI is one issue, they revised oil capacity a few times and change dipstick color to indicate to service department. The theta engine has been junk since 06
I have a Santa Fe 2.0t...with direct injection. I didnt know the genesis were Port injection. I wish mine was. Replaced Injectors, its under the intake manifold. Not too bad to get to, but you are correct in your comment on Intake Valve Buildup.
What would be an interesting challenge is to try and build a decent running engine out of a few cores and the only new parts that can be used are gaskets
If he did, I bet it would be some kind of LS engine. They seem to have a variety of failures and not a common weak spot. But there's probably more value in just selling the parts separately
@@sonofgars1074 that is true and LS engines are readily available but do sell quickly for a working one so a bonus challenge would be to do a valuable engine that isn't readily available but sells better as a complete engine than as parts
@@tashawegmueller1866 one thing I did think about is a really old ford V4 engine but in the UK they are rare as hens teeth and are more valuable complete than in parts but not sure how common they are over there
I also changed (at dealer) the engine block of my Kia Soul 2L GDI, 84000km, 2014, in 2021. Oil consumption, cold snapping. And at the end check engin. Fortunately it is taken under warranty.
The non GDI only makes 210hp. GDI makes 275hp As for coming from the EVO: Hyundai bought technical informations/knowledge from Mitsibushi to makes those engines. They do share basic stuff but they have a lot of differences
no, the bk1 version (09-12) made 210 bhp. the bk2 (13-16) makes 275 bhp from stronger internals that allowed a bigger turbo, and both are mpfi. the only gdi engine the gen coupe ever came with was the bk2 v6. the bk1 3.8 was also mpfi and made 310, but updated with gdi in the bk2 it made 350. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyundai_Genesis_Coupe#Engine,_Transmission,_and_Common_Specs also no, Hyundai didn't buy it, they were/are a part of a joint venture between them, mitsu and Chrysler to design and build standardized engines that they can all use and tweak as desired. in fact, Hyundai originally DESIGNED the base engine each company iterated on afterwards. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_Engine_Alliance
Had a1980 320i. Put a BAE turbo kit on it. Traded it in back in 1984. Have not seen another one in years. Good work getting it running again. Love your channel
Daughter worked for the company at a warranty center. They had a problem with metal in the engines for awhile. when the built motors they didnt clean a bunch of blocks and you know metal in a motor is a killer. so yep they had to replace thousands of them under recall and warranty. so there is a little history for you
Hyundai and Kia actually make solid cars, nowadays. Unfortunately, they keep selling them to the un-cast members of shows like "Live PD" and "COPS". They also always seem to be the cars parked in the passing-lane going 10 under the speed limit.
Except the engines. I know several Hyundai techs and they replace motors all the time. They suffer from sludge issues, and if theres no records of oil changes every 3k, Hyundai won't cover them.
@@MikeL-FL Unsure about the gasoline engines but the Hyundai turbodiesels are generally really solid, I have a car with their 1.6L diesel and they're known to be simple, reliable engines with no weakpoints other than the usual diesel bugbear of carbon buildup in the intake. The 15,000 km oil change interval might be a little long however, or at least my mechanic thinks so given he scheduled the next one to be after 10,000km instead.
PSA!!!: proud owner of a 2013 2.0 with this same engine, check oil very often, run 93 octane and do regular maintenance however my bottom end still spun a bearing at 90K MILES… these cars are notorious for this regardless the maintenance or not it sucks lmao
A while back, WhistlinDiesel bought one of those horrible squatted trucks, mulched it, and sold signed cups of truck mulch for like $40. I bet you could do the same with cups of piston McNuggets and engine gravel and that could help offset the cost of buying really detonated cores for our amusement. I’d buy one. Great video as always!
Theta lls are notorious for bearing failure. The settlement for the class action suit extends the shortblock warranty for LIFE so long as you get the knock sensor update done. Dont kid yourself thinking my car is running fine this comes on really fast when the bearings start to go. GET THE KNOCK SENSOR UPDATE DONE AT THE DEALER.
I really like the variety of engines you show on your channel. I'm an older guy, and maybe I'm wrong, but it seems like the same manufacturer creates new or highly modified engines every year. While I'm not against progress, it seemed like the economics of having engine models (e.g. Chevy 283) be used across more model years would be beneficial for manufactures as well as the mechanics who service them. Am I missing something?
It's not the engine manufacturer's choice: it's law. Emissions and fuel economy standards literally tighten every year, at least in the US and Europe. For example, CAFE fuel economy is increasing by ~2 MPG every year from now until 2025. Similarly, California NOx/PM emission standards tighten every model year from 2014 to 2028.
They do; they just incrementally evolve engine families every product cycle or two (most engine families are designed to be used in a wide variety of vehicles and are usually intended to last several product cycles). For example, Ford used the basic mod motor design until from 1991 until 2011, when they began phasing it out in favor of the 5.0 Coyote, 3.5 EcoBoost, and 6.2 Boss/Hurricane. GM used the LS engines from 1997 until 2020 in various applications. That length of time is an eternity in the auto industry.
The cycle is still very similar if not identical. If you sift through the teardowns on this channel, you'll start to notice that a lot of designs are very similar with few differences. For example, having no cam bearings on OHC engines, having 4-6 bolt main bearing caps, using two piece oil pans with the upper acting as a girdle of sorts to reinforce the bottom end and improve stability at high rpm, ditching gaskets in favor of RTV, list goes on. It was basically the same in the 60s and 70s with every ohv engine being almost the same design-wise, with the main differences being port placement, # of head bolts, distro placement, and a few other small details.
I just had a 2.4l non-turbo Theta 2 blow up on me. The oil level was full. Something about the deburring process on the crank i guess causes the bearing to wear prematurely and starve of oil. It was not a fun day, it just went with no warning what-so-ever.
For those who are interested, I'll elaborate on what Eric said about these engines being in Mitsubishi Lancers. The basic tooling of these engines comes from the Global Engine Manufacturing Alliance, a joint venture between predominantly Chrysler, Mitsubishi, and Kia/Hyundai. This basic engine architecture has been used with various modifications in a litney of vehicles from all of these brands and possibly others(I cant remember) for the last 15 years or so. The Chrysler world engine which has been requested in the comments for a teardown video is very similar to this, as are the other engines from GEMA.
I tip my hat to you sir and thank you for the data
That's very interesting - I was wondering why an engine from a Hyundai had Kia written on a casting.
I Know guys that have used the 2.4L KIA/Hyundai Engines in their High power Evo Builds.
@@stunimbus1543
Pretty sure Kia and Hyundai are sister companies as well.
@@MattyLight30 Hyundai owns Kia. Bought 'em years ago IIRC.
I would never have a chance to see these engines without your channel and your efforts. Thank you for the free education. Merry Christmas and be safe. Peace
Agree! I'd never seen the innards of a flat-four or a rotary. And the over-engineering of... certain manufacturers.
And of course, the aftermath of complete destruction. For some reason, I find pieces of the engine falling to the floor when he takes off the oil pan totally amusing... 😁
This really is a public service. This channel should be shown in auto classes
I had a 2010 2.0T GT, it was amazing, only issue I actually had was a minor one, that turned into a big one at the dealership LOL! my pedal stopped working (electronic pedal) put me in limp mode, crawled to the dealer. They told me the pedal was dead, and would be weeks to replace. they called me that same afternoon and told me they would take a pedal out of one of their lot cars, and use it in mine. Apparently the pedal is coded to the engine it was installed with, and the pedal killed my ECU and some other things. 5 days later in disbelief, they called me and said my car was ready. they flew an engine and a crew of specialists from korea and worked on my car for 2 days. One of my favorite cars, and best dealership service so far.
The sound the head bolts make when he breaks them loose is easily my most favorite sound of these teardowns
#headboltASMR
A lot like grinding teeth at night.
Grrriink
Why does he break them loose manually?
@@ceezedgerman As opposed to breaking them loose with an air impact?
Engineer 1 to Engineer 2: "Don't worry about the dipstick tube placement. Yeah it's in the way of some of stuff, but if they ever need to remove it, it means that the engine is already toast."
Thanks for the video. Going to go check my oil now....
"These look really nice!..." *Yeets part across the shop*
lmao. I suspect the Hyundai 2.0 used chain guide rail market isn't that strong.. acceptable casualty.
@@Stylemaster911 totally agree. Just had a good laugh when he launched them. 😆
I lol'd
I know, right?
I bet in India someone would have kept those rails and reused them
As an owner of the "bigger" Hyundai family turbo engine, I'd love to see you do a 3.3 Lambda II turbo V6 if you ever get the chance to get your hands on one. It'd give me new and exciting reasons to worry!
I'd like to see any Hyundai V6, mainly to see his thoughts on them. In my experience, the Lambda family is pretty well built, but that's based more on my knowledge of the 3.8 circa 2010. Forged crank and decent OEM bearing quality. Blocks are strong enough for being open deck design. Pistons and rods in the 3.8 were all cast units with the standard factory treatment and quality. Tendency for the ring lands to go first due to detonation in tuned engines, which will do in your cylinder walls. But stock tunes are pretty easy on the factory components. They run on the side of rich.
But easy motors to work on. Easy PVC system. No EGR. Standard metric sizes. OEM parts are cheap. Aftermarket is not. Some complaints about chain guides wearing out and having timing chain noise/failures. But I'd hazard to guess that most of those issues are maintenance related.
But yeah! You've got my vote. V6 teardown!
That was funny!
Like we don't have enough reasons to worry right now. :)
@@FonicsSuck them tuning rich would explain why their oil always smells like gasoline!
@@FonicsSuck the 3.8 in the coupe is notorious for rod knock, you hardly see any over 100k miles and whole bunch dead at 60k.
@@charleswp71 I think that might be maintenance related.
My mains were on their way out at 90k km, but only because I had fuel oil contamination and cracked ringlands from a shitty tune after throwing boost at it LOL
A normal mechanic worries that they'll find something wrong in an engine. You worry that you won't.
I have a 2013 Genesis Coupe Rspec with this engine, and I have to say, I’m amazed with how reliable it has been. I have had 0 issues with it and it has been an amazing experience owning this car since new. I have 92k miles on it and it looks and drives brand new. (Not to mention I still have a warranty to 100k or 10 years :D)This engine is actually different from the other Theta engines Hyundai used for the Sonata and others, this engine is only made in Korea and it has Port injection while the other Engines that are made in America have direct injection (way dirty)and have a different Turbo, not to mention have FWD components. The Genesis version of this Engine is a Beast, the port injection really shines for keeping everything clean, although it gets a lot worse gas mileage than the direct injection version. I would still recommend doing 3k oil/filter changes, do them yourself it’s cheap, don’t believe the hype of 10k oil changes, all cars especially Turbo cars should do 3-6k oil changes if you want them to last 200k and beyond. I’m actually so in love with this car I may keep it for life, this car has really impressed me.
Same !!!
I have a 2011 2.0T and so far it's got 175k miles with no major repairs- just general maintenance. It recently developed an oil leak from a turbo line but that is the first issue I've had.
@@Pktmpoo nice! Think it’s almost time to upgrade to a bk2
I got a 14 gen coupe with this same 2.0T but only 17k miles ...
My wifes 15 sante fe with the fwd version of this motor seized at 86k miles. I did 17 oil changes from 5k miles to 85k mikes and it still seized due to rod bearing failure.
Hyundai replaced the engine under warranty without question.
Dude same. Great car
I'm with you 100% on checking your oil at every fill up. That said, with all the on board diagnostics they have on newer cars, why can't they have some way of warning drivers there is a lubrication problem. I mean if they aren't going to give you an oil pressure gauge, at least give you a dtc to warn you of oiling problems.
It has to have a sensor somewhere for this. And warning.
IT does but usually when the idiot light comes on it's already too low.
German cars are pretty sensitive and will trigger a light when 1-2 qts low (out of 6-9 total), but there are still people that ignore that and they don't have dipsticks in those cars to verify the warning light or to know exactly how much to add
Yes! Hey NHTSA if you can mandate backup cameras then mandate this.
Lots of 90s gms like the infamous northstar and mercedes will tell you on the dash if the oil level falls below a certain level. You can probably guess what I drive.
@@yal100EXACTLY
It's amazing what keeping oil in the engine does for it. 407K miles on my 94' Honda Accord 2.2L. Only major work done to it was Valve Cover Gasket around 330-340K miles. Keep the oil in the engine folks.
As a Hyundai Palisade owner, just like all Tesla, BMW and Jeep owners, I must tell you that your findings were planted, not typical, your a meanie doo-doo head and I'm rubber, you're glue! That engine looks perfect. Those are just Hyundai things you don't understand.
You sir... made me laugh. Love it!
forgot subaru owners
@@BGGovedoto lol. I'm both a Jeep (4.0L) and Subaru (EJ) guy. I feel this.
I'm pushing 200,000 miles. I got mine new with 7 miles on the car. Doesn't burn any oil and no ticks. 7500 mile oil change intervals and still never have to add oil. I've been using castrol edge 5w40 since the first oil change.
Good man👍🏻
5w 40?
@@matthewramdin28265w 40 is t recommended by the owner manual for the 2.0t during summer 5w 30 winter.
Nice! I got about 128k on my BK2 2.0T. 5k change intervals and i just did some diff and transmission fluid servicing. Its all factory and has been an amazing car.
@@matthewramdin2826BK2's use 5w30 and 5w40. 5w40 has better heat protection. You will only lose about 2mpgs because it is thicker.
I have learned more about the overall architecture of engines, how they are designed, the common elements and also design differences, by watching your channel than from any other source.
Fun Fact: Hyundai is the second biggest chaebol (conglomerate) in South Korea.
They make everthing from car too ships, toasters and clothing, they also own property development companies a chain of high end department stores and they're being tapped to build south korea's first aircraft carriers.
Samsung and Hyundai are effectively responsible for around 50% of the south korean gdp.
LG is right in there. Maybe #3, but I doubt any lower than #4.
@@ShainAndrews
There was a huge bribery scandal in south korea that involved samsung back in 2015 that actually sparked fears that their entire economy might collapse.
"Went mining for gold and found bearings instead". Best line ever from these teardowns.
Sweet, another Saturday teardown. Goes really well with a beer. 🍺😅
Not really a big Hyundai guy, but my first thought is that engine is pretty tall.
Bro I’m literally drinking beer while watching this 🤣
I was thinking about that coolant line for the turbo going through that bracket, and my hypothesis is that one of the engineers saw that the hose would be routed next to/around it and thought "Hey, wouldn't it be clever if we designed the bracket to have a coolant passage in it so there isn't an extra length of hose taking up space in the engine bay?" and the team went with it. It does make the engine look a bit more neat/tidy, to me at least.
Shields the line from the turbo heating it, too.
That top end being clean was the first clue that the rings were torched and mixing gasoline in the oil. Any non-mechanic would check the oil and see it full or over-full without noticing the smell, next longish commute would vaporize all that gas and suddenly starve it.
According to the internet, it seems that most of the problem isn't that there's a lack of oil in the pan, it's that the oil is blocked from going where it's supposed to because the passages are blocked due to poor practices during manufacture (mostly not cleaning properly following machining). It's a bigger problem in these KIA/Hyundai engines built in the USA than those from other facilities or other members of the GEMA family.
Hence why there's a recall (or two, or three, I can't remember the exact number) for it.
@@CaptainSpadaro Hyundai would rather replace 10% of the engines and lose customers than fix the same issues that have been going on for over a decade now.
@@mikem4633 cost/benefit analysis is a biiiiiiitch. Also I've been told that they've more or less stopped all gasoline engine development in favor of EVs, so if the problem hasn't been solved already (which I would hope it has, seeing as it sounds like a pure manufacturing problem), it likely never will be.
@@CaptainSpadaro I found a video online that the Theta-3 engines (aka smart-stream) are having problems in Korea due to design flaws. A Korean whistle blower is reporting the problems and you may be able to find the videos here on TH-cam.
@@tails300 Yep. Engine block is not sturdy enough for the DI engines and its higher temp and pressure, so the cylinder bore gets ever so slightly larger due to high temp and the oil penetrates through the rings to combustion causing oil loss from burning off in the combust chamber. Thus, ending with loss of oil and if not checked regularly, you will have a toasted engine due to oil loss. There are a few really good auto reviewers who raised the issues. There were huge controversies. I know all about it and will NOT buy any Hyundai cars because of it. All their DI engines in Kia and Hyundai are going to have issues, even the new Genesis v6's. It's really unfortunate because I think the Genesis cars are good otherwise.
"That rail's really nice..." then proceeds to chuck it across the shop, made my day.
Love the fact you are a 'Petrol Head" Eric and loving your streams from UK. Keep up the great work.
Love your videos. There was a recall for this. The blocks were contaminated due to insufficient cleaning during manufacturing. This may have been the root cause for the bearing failure. I know because we got the notice in the mail and within 3 months we too had bearing failure. Changed the oil as per the manual and never abused the car. We got a new engine from the Manufacturer (Via Warranty) and sold the car soon after. It's possible the bearing materials are not made manufacturing specs, that's my theory because this has effected so many 4 cyl engines.
This is the comment I was looking for. I have two family members who own Hyundai's with the Theta II engine in them and one family member had theirs fail outright on the highway out of nowhere, they got the engine replaced under warranty. The other family member traded theirs in and bought a newer Tuscon instead. What I heard was the same, they never removed the deburred pieces that were left inside of the engine after manufacturing. That's more than likely why the bearing failed. Failed on my brother's.
This affected only US produced engines destined for products made in the US. So not the Genesis, which was sourced from Ulsan.
That's what they said originally when this first started happening, but some folks have had the replacement engines fail also, and you'd have to think they learned from the first time. I just think these are cheaply engineered, cheaply built engines and it's pretty much a crapshoot whether they will last or not. I had a 2012 Sonata with the 2.4 and I always ran 10w30 in mine and never had any issues, but, I sold it before 100K miles despite the extended engine warranty, I just didn't trust it to be reliable long term.
Just put neodymium magnets in the oil pan.
Funny you mention class action lawsuits , my 2.4L GDI 2011 sonata was part of that mess and yes those four bangers are expensive almost $8,000 for a long block , all due to machining left in the engine when new !
Amazing seeing one of these torn down.
I'd love to see the 5.0L Tau V8 out of the Genesis Sedan/Equus, especially with how the early models often burnt oil.
I would love to see a 5.0L Tau V8 from the Hyundai Equus/Genesis models around this same year. Would be interesting to see a failure point in the engine I have!
Yes I have one someone gave to me ( was his mechanic for it ) and man it’s a nice car
The GDI is a failure point, the MPI is actually pretty good.
I’d love to see this as well! Never seen one out of a car before!
I said the same thing, but the 4.6 tau v8.
The V8 is a pretty reliable engine and since they came in the more expensive cars that likey got better maintenance you don't see many bad ones.
For the year or two I worked for Kia I replaced many Theta II engines although not this specific version, they were always the Direct Injected 2.0 Turbo and 2.4 engines and I worked there right when that rod knock recall came out.
I also believe the Theta II has a shared design with the Chrysler "world engine" 2.0/2.4's found in things like Jeep Patriots and Dodge Journeys etc.
Yea I have a 13 Optima SXL 2.0t that's direct injected. Always use full syn 5w40, OEM filter every 3k miles, 93 octane gas and mine went at 50k miles. My aunt has a 13 Sonata 2.4 di. She has the dealer change her oil every 6 months or so no matter mileage, 108k, original engine. She does go through a lot of oil in between changes. But it's so weird how random these failures are. Like no matter what the maintenance is, it's a matter of when.
Chrysler / Kia / Mitsubishi
Chrysler: world engine
Kia: Theta II
Mitsubishi: 4Bxx
I had the Chrysler version which had a different timing cover, valve covers, and accessory brackets from the Theta II version
@@davidtryon1205 maybe you should try GF-6A oil. most close to 5w-40 would be 5W-30.
@@davidtryon1205 they seem to have fuel dilution issues based on your description, I'd recommend the thickest oil the pump can handle, and oil changes as often as you can afford, get the engine hot frequently too, if you can put the fuel residing in the oil out through the PCV that's the best case.
@@davidtryon1205 they have a lifetime warranty now with all the lawsuits and issues because of the issues. So really, it could be a good thing, if you look at it a certain way. You can buy a car with no issues and it lasts lets say 250k, then the engine is wore out. Or you have one with a lifetime bearing failure warranty. And maybe you get 150k out of it and the bearing fails. Then you get another one and the bearing doesnt fail and it lasts 250k. Well you just got 400k worth of engines for the price of one (plus the headache of getting them to honor your warranty and waiting for the engine replacement and possible the anxiety if you constantly worry about it failing)
I have a 12 KIA optima, that I bought new. At about 50k, it let loose. I believe the affected years are 11-13. Stay clear of these years. It is and isn't an oil issue. From the factory on affected models. The rod clearance is to tight. Creating oil starvation. And the engine will blow without notice. So even though you may have proper oil level. You can not help when a bearing eats himself, loses oil pressure. And chews up the cams. BTW, which is a awful design flaw to not have cam bearings! Hopefully they have fixed that of their newer designs. Another great video. Thanks! 😃👍
i have a 13 genesis 2.0t and had mine start knocking at 67k miles while driving home from work. was confused when it happened as i always changed my oil every 3k miles. got a new engine but worried itll go out again
@@miguelmaldonado9143 mine is currently at 107000. And knock on wood, no issues. Be true or not, I was told they fixed the bearing clearance issue when they replaced mine. Wish ya luck and many more miles
I'm finding your Saturday Tear Downs to be a rock of stability while the world turns to complete crap.
Civilization may well end soon but at least we'll know why engines blow up. And thanks for that :)
And for the postapocalyptic, Mad Max world, we'll know that the most important thing is to check your oil!
They got the covids of course.
@@ohioplayer-bl9em the election virus
@@kowalskidiazdegeras9190 I'm definitely going to hoard engine oil, if the end times come!
WOW those valves were clean. so jealous, I'm stuck in DI land
I overheard a conversation between 2 Hobby Lobby employees. The were very young. A young lady was asking a young man if she should get her oil changed. I did my best to impress upon them the importance of oil, clean oil. I hope they listened.
Honestly they probably didn't. This younger generation and the ones after them won't listen to a single bit of advice given to them. I'm in my 30's, and try to give them some advice from a "younger" old man, and they blow it off or just go "ok boomer" or smile and agree and then continue doing dumb stuff.
I've stopped giving advice or heads up now, and just simply step back and watch things explode in their faces. Much more entertaining.
It is really nice to see these teardowns, especially when you're reassembling one someone else took apart!
2:58 i absolutely love my gearwrench quad box wrenches
I see you are a man of culture
You got a pretty cool job, dude. Love the content.
It would be good to see the oil pump in these engines that were starved of oil, check to see if the oil pump internals weren’t the failure point 👍
Oil pump is a very good unit, problem comes from a small lower pan with very little baffling, running them low on oil and driving them hard. A extra half quart and not using the 5w20 from the factory goes a long way.
i had an engine with exact same destruction , looked new as this, but in a 2.3, and i pulled it's oil pump and in my case it wasn't bad at all. The pickup tube was where a lot of material collected, as well as the oil pan and the cam speed sensors seem to LOVE the bearing bearing material that pools together like the T9000 or whatever from Terminator 2. ya know the metal guy.
oil pump was fine though. I'd imagine anything that went it would if anything just pit things up, but if you're at that point already it's not gonna be the major damaged area by the time u get to it
Engines like this are victims of starved oil that eventually tears everything up it's lack of maintenance if they would change the oil the oil pump and everything else was last nearly forever if not rodded
From what I have seen and heard, poor manufacturing...well lack of burr material from oil galleries on the crankshaft lead to oil starvation of the bearings. I think this lead to a class action lawsuit.
@@mikefoehr235 that was on a different version of the 2.0t, the ones used in the Genesis coupe seemed to a better quality that got some extra attention, mine has 140k miles on it without any problems, the key is regular oil changes with a good filter ( WIX XP or OEM only ) a quality and proper weight oil, these are turbo engines and the BK1 version , 2010-2012, did not have a oil cooler so oil temps stock stay around 200°f. Also the lower pan is pretty small so checking the level regularly is critical, I have always added a extra half quart.
The other thing with these are the bottom end on the bk1 was not forged so piston and rod failure happened on allot once the boost got turned up past 300lbsft of torque
Thank you for showing us one of these Hyundai engines. I have learnt a lot about engines, also how important it is to always check the oil. 😀❤🇨🇦
I have one of the "recalled" theta II engines in my 11 Hyundai Sonata, and while knocking on wood keeping it oiled and putting a magnet in the pan have kept it alive so far. I don't baby it, but I do keep the fluids and filters clean, and let it warm up before driving it. I would love to see one of my engines done, but bearing failure due to contamination isn't very exciting :) Cool getting to see a similar engine, thanks for sharing! Love the videos.
I find it oddly satisfying every time I hear Eric loosen head bolts! lol
I had an oil starvation issue on my Kia Sorento at 105k. Changed regularly, but it decided to start consuming oil around 90k. That's pretty much "normal" from what I've seen from Kia/Hyundai engines.
Sounds like planned obsolescence that had surfaced earlier than anticipated.
In comparison engines of the 80's and 90's particularly Toyota and Honda or any Japanese brands of the time never had the reputation of having oil consumption spikes after 90k. Many are still going around 30 years later still sealed from the factory on original piston rings with likely upwards of 400k miles swapped so many times or still with the same chassis from the factory.
Had a 2017 Kia Soul w 2.0 naturally aspirated engine. Used as a freeway commuter. Not hard use. Everything was OK for the first year and a half. Regular maintenance was done. Oil changes at the right intervals.
Then, I was shocked to find the oil level was waaay down. So far down that the oil didn’t touch the bottom the dipstick. Took 1.5 litres to get oil to the dipstick.. From that time this engine was a heavy oil user. No oil puddles on my garage floor. So it was being used internally. But no smoky exhaust. Don’t know where the oil went.
Used 3 litres of oil in between the regular oil change interval. Took it to Kia Dealer, confirmed the oil consumption and Kia said it was ‘normal’. Really…
Your comment about small oil control rings in this engine perked up my ears. It appears to be an engineered chronic defect.
I like your manner and commentary. Thanks.
Compression ring blow by cooks the oil rings and they quit doing their job.
Did they perform an oil consumption test?
@@frankieb7405 yes. Oil consumption was done. Definitely using oil as indicated. Dealer took my case to Kia and they refused to do anything about it. Kia said it was “normal”. I don’t have the Kia any more
Were you the original owner?? My 17 Elantra I bought new has 91.000 miles now and runs and sounds like new, uses no oil between 4000 mile oil changes..
Hyundai tech here: in my experience the 2.0 and 2.4 have the most issues with they were built in thr GA facility (VIN 5 1st digit) coupled with owners nit keeping up with oil changes and routine maintenance destroy these engines. Intake valves get gunked up quickly, not letting turbos cool down after a long or heavy drive, neglect, MFG defects are the majority of the failure points for these engines
Could this also be related to the 2.4 failures of not having a long enough dipstick, so engines were routinely starved of oil? I’ve heard stories of dealerships intentionally running engines without oil so that the owner gets a new long block under warranty after they lock up
@@deblackmon3 the 1st gen of thr theta ii 2.4GDI had short sticks and the campaign came out for short block rebuilds to have longer sticks. Long blocks that came from Hyundai had the updated dipsticks assembled at the factory. Now it was routine at alot if dealerships including mine that we would lock the motor up or blow it up whichever happened to get a rush on the warranty engine swaps. The main reason they would knock is because during assembly the chips weren't blown out of the engines after machining the crank journals and with chew the bearings up causing rod knock
My 2013 2.0T is in the shop right now because the engine seized a few days ago. The bearings look just as worn as the ones you have there. I checked the oil level every weekend, and changed it every 3,000 miles. Hyundai assured me that the G4KF was not affected by the lubrication issues that plagued some of the other Theta II engines... I'm surprised it lasted 10 years.
Is Hyundai replacing for free? My 2015 2.0 started burning oil around 110k miles @ 126k now..sucks
Always thought it was stupid to not have replaceable inserts in the head and cam caps but i guess they save $10 per head that way…..lets pass our lack of engineering costs on to the customers
The sound of the air impact is just sooo satisfying
I have owed a 2013 and 2015 Gen coupe and loved them both. I owed a 2015 Gen 5.0 and that thing ripped ass. The 15 coupe and 5.0 both could pull 60mph in under 6 secs. But the thing I could not get over was that the 5.0 got 25mph combo, with 420 horse power. If you would have told me back in the day that a 302 had that horse power with that mpg I would have called you a lair. I love my Gen's!!!!
mpg???
@@jamesmedina2062 yeah mpg. Sorry about that..
Lol
@@papa45colt47 bro you in the middle somewhere with mileage and have too many horses to feed!🐎 My 377 Cleveland carbureted stroker Mustang with 375 horses gets about 8 mpg and my Honda Civic with 200 horses gets about 37 mpg. 400 horses at 25 mpg is pretty good
The cam caps are more worn than the lower journals because the force of the valve springs pushes upwards on the cam. There is only a bearing at the front because chain tension pulls down on the cam at that point. The wear on each cam cap is therefore less toward the front because the upward force on them is somewhat balanced out by the downward force of the chain tension.
You do know if you remove the oil pan and tap the dip stick tube it will come out ALOT easier
And a lot less destructive, too. But, in all seriously-ness, how many people are looking for a dipstick tube? It's probably a slow mover.
I own a genesis. I can confirm, that coolant line is fun in the car. So much fun. Best day ever.
I had a 2014 Genesis Coupe with the same 2.0T engine had never been opened up at 140k when I sold it had been tuned and ran relatively hard for at least 60k of those miles and it was still great. Always changed the oil at 3k with Mobil 1 and a Hyundai filter these things had a weird tick if you used a non Hyundai filter.
Good maintenance does wonders, have 134k on mine right now, good quality 5w30 and WIX XP filter and a extra half quart every 4k.
Yeah... the tick comes from oil starvation
@@charleswp71 I had an oem equivalent filter on mine and ran 5w-30 super synthetic and my engine burned through the oil and I ended up having my rod bearings get worn down to where my rods are now knocking. Gotta do a engine rebuild 😪😪😪
Certain Hyundai/Kia engines got revised oil filters with an increased baffling, and design change to promote pressure. Had to stock them in the shop for these exceptions, never dug too much further into it though. Definitely cost more, standard stock filters were $2.89 cost, those were $8+ cost.
@@blakerohrs157 8
Its the simple things in life. Your "UH OH" is the greatest.
Oil is so cheap and engines so expensive. I’m impressed by the technology of this engine.
75,000 miles and these start to drink oil. They also have a turbo oil line and other leaks that are well known. Good news is that if you get the updated flash with a "new" knock sensor profile you will get a life time block warranty. They will also state that 1 quart of oil loss per 1,000 miles is normal and doesn't get a replacement. The only good news is the underside will not rust.
I love KDM cars since I've drove a 2012 kia optima 2.4l GDI sister got it used currently with 260,000 on the clock still running strong it's got small oil leak but gonna get it fixed cause it's time for another oil change
2.4 GDI is most likely not boosted and you probably use 5w30 or 5w40 oil regularly changed..
@@unprofessionalmechanic8466 the 2.4 GDI is N/A but it uses 5w-20 oil I've haven't had a lot of experience with the 2.0t found in the optima sx and the Sonata sport 2.0t but I've heard from a few owners that have put a lot of miles on theirs that it can last a long time if it's well taken care of
That crank is 100% save able. Mine was alot worse and just did one over sized on all the journals and had no issues.
My mom's sonata 2.0 turbo spun rod bearings at 89k miles...fortunately, a new engine was covered by hyundai. But they should, because a motor going to junk sub 150k miles is completely unacceptable these days.
Have a 2021 Jeep Wrangler with the 2.0 I4 turbo, would enjoy seeing one of these teardowns.
I'm a master Hyundai tech, I could write a book about the Theta II engine failures and everything I've seen with them lmao
Should I buy one? I was really looking to get one until I heard of all the problems.
Hey Hyundai tech, my 2015 Sonata 2.0 is burning oil, should I just drive and continue to top oil and wait for rod knock then take to dealer or start the oil consumption process? Thanks!!
You'd have a field day with my wife's 06 Sedona and it's Lambda V6. PO never changed the oil and it's full of sludge. Made the mistake of flushing it and plugged the oil pickup several times... a few pan drops, a fresh pan, and a fresh oil pump later it's still shedding chunks that I'm seeing in the oil filter. Worst deal I've ever made on a used vehicle, and if I could afford to scrap it I would (heck, I have a car hauler, so I could even tow it out to you :D ). But I can't, so I'll keep changing the filter (and dropping the pan) as needed until it stops dropping chunks and becomes reliable... or until I get PO'd enough and toss the bastard anyway.
The best part about Hyundai engines is how simple they are.
The worst part about Hyundai engines is how simple they are.
it could be vastly simpler and be better from focus on quality
Really love this since i have a g4kf myself
i used to have a 2.0t a few years back. upgraded the turbo and fueling system (on e85) and made 508WHP on a stock motor internals. i have a few clips on my channel.
nothing ever broke
How many miles
Send me the clips
Yeah in the car is pretty difficult to work on Thanks for the recognition👍🏾
If you ever decide to get a sponsor may I recommend pigmat
They can make an extra large one for you and call it pig in a blanket.
2012 and up Hyundai/Kia 4 cylinders. If I see a knock sensor code and it matches the TSB, i send it to the dealer. Most cases it's a engine replacement. There is an extension harness for the knock sensor they will try to stop possible EMI, but usually it's a rod knock issue and not EMI.
You had me at Bluetooth connecting rod
Theta II engines had manufacturing issue with metal debris clogging oil holes. Hyundai had to give lifetime warranty on those engines to settle lawsuit. I think it was 2011-2018 or 19 model years.. Not the driver's fault. There may have been sufficient oil, it just wasn't getting circulated.
Guess what the theta engines were garbage from 2006 on, price out an engine for 06 sonata optima rondo etc
Doubt that in this case. The cam bearings and main bearings suffered quite a bit as well.
And quite frankly, I think a lot of the failures of these engines, even the recalled ones, probably are closer to the same cause, rather than any manufacturing defect. They don't like getting oil changes done late and/or with junky oil.
From what I read debris problem was not present on genesis coupe engines
My mom's '14 sonata seized with only 60k. They said it was a known issue that generation and It was replaced under warranty but it took over a month. I Still have my reservations on the long term with Hyundai/kia
Same here. 2013 Sonata. 115,000 miles. Replaced under warranty.
You should do the 2.4 theta 2 with port injection
had one in my 2010 forte sx manual! the MPI made in Korea 2.4s are pretty damn bulletproof and had gobs of mid range tire frying TORK
@@snoofayy6150 Yeah I have an 09 5 speed optima, it pulls above 3 grand in third real well. I literally haven’t done a thing to that engine other than preventative maintenance and I have 152k and counting!
I don't know much about Auto engines but I loved watching this video. I was about to buy a used Kia Optima with a Theta engine and now I am having second thoughts. Thanks!
\We're still looking forward to a 1997 Ford 7.3 powerstroke
Really liking the close ups
I'm just curious, if you don't sell dip stick tunes wouldn't it be easier to just snip the top part off to get it out of the way and take the rest out when you get down to it? I'm just asking...
my 2014 Kia Sportage SX went into limp mode, had to have the engine rebuilt/replaced, took 2 weeks to get the part(s). then there was a leak on the high pressure gas pump, good thing I smelled gasoline and checked under the hood, otherwise i'd of had an engine fire. also, several recalls, like knock sensor upgrade, and fuse box replacement. from the 1st oil change i used full synthetic oil every 5-6,000 miles. a lot of the engines had the oil lines clogged up by metal shavings that were left behind during manufacturing.
Great video! I have an old Elantra with a Beta II so it's interesting to see how completely different these engines are. Thanks :)
This channel and South Main Auto are all a guy needs.
I work at Hyundai, and that's your typical Santa Fe and Sonata engine failure. Never seen it in a Genesis though. That's odd. We replace them in Sonatas and Santa Fe's about 10 times a month
Start recommending shorter oil change intervals and these things wont happen, People don't check their oil anymore and this is the end result after 6K or more on one OCI.
@@brandonpetrilla1731 100% agree! But it'd like pulling teeth to get them to do them at 6k even! They want to do them at 12k because in normal climate, that's what is recommended
I could imagine no one wants to spend any money on service today, 12k is outrageous for an oil change….
@@brandonpetrilla1731 yup! I just bought a 2011 Sonata Limited 2.0T from work . I'll be doing oil changes every 5k kms
OCI is one issue, they revised oil capacity a few times and change dipstick color to indicate to service department. The theta engine has been junk since 06
I have a Santa Fe 2.0t...with direct injection. I didnt know the genesis were Port injection. I wish mine was. Replaced Injectors, its under the intake manifold. Not too bad to get to, but you are correct in your comment on Intake Valve Buildup.
What would be an interesting challenge is to try and build a decent running engine out of a few cores and the only new parts that can be used are gaskets
If he did, I bet it would be some kind of LS engine. They seem to have a variety of failures and not a common weak spot. But there's probably more value in just selling the parts separately
@@sonofgars1074 that is true and LS engines are readily available but do sell quickly for a working one so a bonus challenge would be to do a valuable engine that isn't readily available but sells better as a complete engine than as parts
@@186scott probably a 4.6 2v engine lots of them, but not a demand engine..99-04 era
@@tashawegmueller1866 one thing I did think about is a really old ford V4 engine but in the UK they are rare as hens teeth and are more valuable complete than in parts but not sure how common they are over there
@@186scott not many V4s in the states, the 4.6 was used in many fleet vehicles cars, trucks
I also changed (at dealer) the engine block of my Kia Soul 2L GDI, 84000km, 2014, in 2021. Oil consumption, cold snapping. And at the end check engin. Fortunately it is taken under warranty.
Nice one! Do an Italian Fiat 1.4L multi-air turbo!
I second this.
I third this...MOTION PASSED ERIC
@@chrisfreemesser5707 awesome!
Lol, “I was kinda worried I wasn’t going to see anything wrong with but I’m no longer worried about that”
The non GDI only makes 210hp. GDI makes 275hp
As for coming from the EVO: Hyundai bought technical informations/knowledge from Mitsibushi to makes those engines. They do share basic stuff but they have a lot of differences
no, the bk1 version (09-12) made 210 bhp. the bk2 (13-16) makes 275 bhp from stronger internals that allowed a bigger turbo, and both are mpfi. the only gdi engine the gen coupe ever came with was the bk2 v6. the bk1 3.8 was also mpfi and made 310, but updated with gdi in the bk2 it made 350.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyundai_Genesis_Coupe#Engine,_Transmission,_and_Common_Specs
also no, Hyundai didn't buy it, they were/are a part of a joint venture between them, mitsu and Chrysler to design and build standardized engines that they can all use and tweak as desired. in fact, Hyundai originally DESIGNED the base engine each company iterated on afterwards.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_Engine_Alliance
Had a1980 320i. Put a BAE turbo kit on it. Traded it in back in 1984. Have not seen another one in years. Good work getting it running again. Love your channel
6:50 It always bothers me when a skilled professional does something that I would have tried.
Also, first gen RX spotted at 25:00
Daughter worked for the company at a warranty center. They had a problem with metal in the engines for awhile. when the built motors they didnt clean a bunch of blocks and you know metal in a motor is a killer. so yep they had to replace thousands of them under recall and warranty. so there is a little history for you
haste makes waste!
Hyundai and Kia actually make solid cars, nowadays.
Unfortunately, they keep selling them to the un-cast members of shows like "Live PD" and "COPS".
They also always seem to be the cars parked in the passing-lane going 10 under the speed limit.
Except the engines. I know several Hyundai techs and they replace motors all the time. They suffer from sludge issues, and if theres no records of oil changes every 3k, Hyundai won't cover them.
@@MikeL-FL Unsure about the gasoline engines but the Hyundai turbodiesels are generally really solid, I have a car with their 1.6L diesel and they're known to be simple, reliable engines with no weakpoints other than the usual diesel bugbear of carbon buildup in the intake. The 15,000 km oil change interval might be a little long however, or at least my mechanic thinks so given he scheduled the next one to be after 10,000km instead.
PSA!!!: proud owner of a 2013 2.0 with this same engine, check oil very often, run 93 octane and do regular maintenance however my bottom end still spun a bearing at 90K MILES… these cars are notorious for this regardless the maintenance or not it sucks lmao
"not all that glitters is gold." -Robert Plant
"Let he who is without oil pressure, thow the first rod." -Compressions 11:1
"Thou shalt not neglecteth thy maintenance intervals...."
A while back, WhistlinDiesel bought one of those horrible squatted trucks, mulched it, and sold signed cups of truck mulch for like $40. I bet you could do the same with cups of piston McNuggets and engine gravel and that could help offset the cost of buying really detonated cores for our amusement. I’d buy one.
Great video as always!
Wow, a BMW engine with a dipstick...been a while since I saw one of those ;)
Theta lls are notorious for bearing failure. The settlement for the class action suit extends the shortblock warranty for LIFE so long as you get the knock sensor update done. Dont kid yourself thinking my car is running fine this comes on really fast when the bearings start to go. GET THE KNOCK SENSOR UPDATE DONE AT THE DEALER.
Knock sensor update?
Is the warranty extended only for 1st owner?
I really like the variety of engines you show on your channel. I'm an older guy, and maybe I'm wrong, but it seems like the same manufacturer creates new or highly modified engines every year. While I'm not against progress, it seemed like the economics of having engine models (e.g. Chevy 283) be used across more model years would be beneficial for manufactures as well as the mechanics who service them. Am I missing something?
I'd be happy if they didn't invent new ways to attach windshield wipers every 3 weeks. Honestly, what's with those guys/gals.
It's not the engine manufacturer's choice: it's law. Emissions and fuel economy standards literally tighten every year, at least in the US and Europe. For example, CAFE fuel economy is increasing by ~2 MPG every year from now until 2025. Similarly, California NOx/PM emission standards tighten every model year from 2014 to 2028.
They do; they just incrementally evolve engine families every product cycle or two (most engine families are designed to be used in a wide variety of vehicles and are usually intended to last several product cycles). For example, Ford used the basic mod motor design until from 1991 until 2011, when they began phasing it out in favor of the 5.0 Coyote, 3.5 EcoBoost, and 6.2 Boss/Hurricane. GM used the LS engines from 1997 until 2020 in various applications. That length of time is an eternity in the auto industry.
The cycle is still very similar if not identical. If you sift through the teardowns on this channel, you'll start to notice that a lot of designs are very similar with few differences. For example, having no cam bearings on OHC engines, having 4-6 bolt main bearing caps, using two piece oil pans with the upper acting as a girdle of sorts to reinforce the bottom end and improve stability at high rpm, ditching gaskets in favor of RTV, list goes on.
It was basically the same in the 60s and 70s with every ohv engine being almost the same design-wise, with the main differences being port placement, # of head bolts, distro placement, and a few other small details.
I just had a 2.4l non-turbo Theta 2 blow up on me. The oil level was full. Something about the deburring process on the crank i guess causes the bearing to wear prematurely and starve of oil. It was not a fun day, it just went with no warning what-so-ever.
So... the oil you drained out at the start was all that was in it when it failed?... 🤔
Otherwise, it looked like a well maintained engine...
It was "drained" before he got it
Dip stick tubes and this guy are worst enemies 🤣
It must be Saturday
I build these all day! Cool video! And yes hard to find !! Better not let your rod knock last to long or you won’t be able to save the crankshaft !!
Great job...from Argentina...
Takes off the first timing chain guide.... "That looks really nice..." ...chucks it across the shop... LOL!
Why would coolant run through that bracket? The same reason that coolant ran through the belt tensioner on many GM 3.8 engines. Engineers are sadists.
it was also right next to the exhaust
Or oil running through the alternator bracket on BMW's.
TBH they probably did that because the cores for the coolant passages in the block were too difficult to make/support otherwise.
oh yeah fresh download 😎