I have a 22 ID4 and have software 3.1, No issues with car or software. One thing I would like is a slightly more aggressive regen braking. Ap is not great but love being able to pre-warm car in the morning.
My wife has a 2021 ID.4 PRO she got in July 2021, so a year and a half. We’ve taken it from Sacramento to the Bay Area, to Zion NP and the North Rim. She drove it solo from here to LA. No issues with charging - or software. All these miles and while, yeah, the software ain’t great and it’s kinda laggy, she’s never had any flags or warnings or anything. We got the TOU charging to (mostly) work, the cabin pre-heats in the morning. And most importantly, she LOVES her VW! But I’m kind of a believer in “If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it” approach. My wife can handle tech fine, but she’s not a tech nerd. I’m a bit concerned that, IF she updates the s/w, and if it starts throwing up random flags etc…, she’s going to go from loving her ride to detesting it. Is there any requirement that the car MUST be updated?
I think the 2022 is the most solid year to own with it being the last German year and already having 3.1 software. Mine has had zero issues. The faster charging would be nice but the EA chargers I use on trips are so unreliable it doesn’t even matter. Love how well built it is, priced really well, and I’ll put up with not great software. But yes plug and charge and improved app functionality seem like pretty basic things they need to work on.
From what I understand is the original 12v can’t handle the update. The 3.1 update is huge, and the initial software drop was causing major battery drain on the 12v
Kyle, you're the best VW ID expert! I own a 2021 ID.4 and everything you say is right on and simply exact. Just a note on the battery issue: With 34k km on it, I experienced one and only one event where the car freaked out because of an inconsistent 12V battery measurement. It does not happen frequently but since it does, and the battery happens to be the cause, VW has no choice other than replacing it. Finally, I live in Qc Canada and fast charging on winter trips really sucks, to the point that it took me more than 6 months (got it in November) before I could check out it could really fast charge at 125KW sometimes. Too bad, for the rest, I love that car.
I live in Southern California and noticed the charging speed slowed a bit in the 5 degree Celsius temps which not as cold as Canadian winters. After 7months of ownership, I’m averaging 50-70KW charging speed on 150KW chargers. I did get 82KW when is was at 20% but levels off to 50 after 60%.. Maybe the new software update will improve this.
Have had a 2023 awd ID.4 for two weeks in ct. have had no problems, the app does a wonderful job of heating the car before getting in, I just love the car, and I traded in a 2022 Santa Fe plug in, which was very nice, but this is a step up
I've had my ID.4 since Aug 21 with nearly zero issues. I watched this video this morning, and on my way to work a few minutes later I got all the lights: Airbag, Dynamic Cornering, Travel Assist, Park Assist, and a handful of others. Doomed!
Thanks for the info. Currently leasing a late 2021 AWD (US spec) December build model and so far had no major issues with the software. I received a email from VW in October stating that a software update with battery will be available before the end of the year. Still waiting for that call.. Not sure how reliable this new update for the earlier models. I read some UK owners had issues the software updates with their European builds.
I have an ID.4 - haven't really had any issues, and we take it on road trips all the time. As you point out, the main things still missing are preconditioning and plug-and-charge. I suspect they were in a deep hole with the old release - they need to make some significant changes before they could do some of the rest, and reports in Europe suggest that they had deployment problems where some cars wouldn't take an update - even at a dealer.
I have a 2021 AWD Pro S and have not had the "Christmas tree" lights being described here. That said, I am eagerly awaiting the 3.x update which VWoA has communicated to us 2021 owners via email and is beginning to roll-out starting with 2021 First Edition owners. Overall I love the car and, value-wise, nothing beats it. The 12V battery upgrade is necessary for some early builds because OTA/scheduled charging was draining the old battery and they needed to replace it with a higher capacity 12V to safely enable those features. Bottom line is VW released the car 1-2 years early (and paid the price for it).
Personally, I don’t think many manufacturers really understand ev yet. There’s nothing better than one peddle driving. Hopefully everyone will figure this out.
I received an email a week or so ago to call my local dealership and schedule the upgrade. Service said they'd order the parts and call me to schedule when they come in.. he had no idea how long that would be. My '21 1st edition has been almost perfect at this point.. only had 5 or so random false/warning issues that were resolved with a turning off of the car and back on in about 15 months of ownership/18k miles. I was really hoping for a cleanup/improvement in the user interface, plug and charge and 1 pedal driving.. looks like I'm only getting 1 of those. Darn.
In the beginning of the video, it was mentioned that the MY23 model gets "full credit", is that only for card delivered before end of this year? I heard from my dealer that the car delivering next year will only be qualified for half.
Could you do an update of this video in light of all the problems ID.4 owners are having with the 97ZZ (essentially the update featured here) recall? i.e., appointments a year out, dealers who won't perform the recall, cars taking aweek+ to be updated, problems after update, etc.
I received an AWD Pro S in December of 2021. I've had no issues with the software or the 12 volt battery. I've never had any warning messages except when driving in snow storms that the driver assist was not working. (Sensers & cameras blocked with snow!) Also, the VW apt has worked every time I've used it for starting charging or climate. I hope this update really is worth it because I like the way it works now.
Have only had a few very minor hiccups with my 2022 German ID4. 3 warning lights have came on, and they freaked me out but cleared within minutes. Nearly 10,000 miles on mine so far.
I agree with everything they said - except that 2021 AWD ID.4s do exist (I have a Pro S AWD - built in 12/21, delivered 4/22). The engineers that did software and UX should be fired. There are 4 arrow buttons on the right side of steering wheel to control audio. Do the up/down arrows make the sound louder/softer? No, you hit the left/right arrows. The up/down are for the preset stations, which on the screen are shown left to right. Arrrgh! I constantly have to think which button to use (even after 8 months) b/c it is so counterintuitive. I hope that this update is the start of many to come. My "wish" list: plug 'n' charge, faster DCFC, 1 pedal mode, OTA updates, battery pre-conditioning, and a much much much better app that actually does more than just show you the SOC. Absolutely fantastic car to drive, but with absolutely garbage SW (and slow garbage at that).
Huh. My wife drives a 2021 ID.4 PRO. She LOVES her VW! Taken it on long road trips with the family. And no SW issues. I like the vehicle - and yes the turning radius is amazing. It’s comfy, reliable, and easy to live with. I drive a Tesla Model 3 SR+ I got a few months before she bought her EV. While she liked the Tesla, it was (as Dad says) too unusual for her. She immediately liked the familiarity of the VW. Snap decision. I’m leery about her “upgrading” to 3.1. We’ve not had any issues with the ID.4. If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.
12volt battery, I replaced my 2020 Soul EV Limited 12volt battery only one year after getting that car, dealer said after 6 times of the battery going completely dead, that after charging said that the battery checked out, so I check out that crappy 12volt and replaced it with a fine AGM quality battery and no issues in a year that I did that!
Let me preface this by saying that I have a 2021 ID.4 1st Edition, and have put over 20k miles on it. I've taken it on two coast-to-coast trips, and I've found it to be an extremely competent transportation appliance and a comfortable road trip warrior, for the times I choose not to opt for a more exciting vehicle. On paper, it's a champ. Sure, I have my list of concerns -- the alarming amount of frame reinforcements under the hood, the eternally-obnoxious chorus of rattles that emanate from the rear of the vehicle, the bevy of inexplicable warning lights that have greeted me at random intervals -- I could go on, but I digress. I expect and tolerate a certain level of wonkiness from a first model year vehicle, particularly one on a new platform. That said, it should be an embarrassment to Volkswagen that the primary shortcoming of their first major foray into EVs has been the infuriatingly daft software package they've tied these vehicles to. At best, it was half-baked from the jump. At worst, VW should fire their entire team of UX designers. I get it -- Volkswagen is a legacy carmaker that survives on the business of making cars, not software (unlike Tesla, Rivian, Lucid, etc.). So then why not outsource the software piece of it to a company that knows software? The Android Automotive experience in the Polestar 2 is a perfect model of this, and I found it to be refreshingly intuitive and comfortable, even for an Apple fanboy like myself. Had the IONIQ5 or EV6 been available when I purchased the ID.4, the VW wouldn't have even had a chance. Both far outshine the ID.4 in terms of user experience and overall quality feel, even in their base trim levels. My ID.4 is scheduled for its software/12v battery upgrade tomorrow morning, and I can't say I expect much at this point.
I have the same car with the same mileage. Curious how your tires held up. I personally had to replace my rear tires in less than a year with only about 10k miles.
@@fennter I tried to get the stock tires, but after doing the math I couldn't stomach the $600 for new rear tires in less than a year. I got the OHTSU FP8000 from amazon delivered to a local tire shop. Came in half the price of the stock tires. Reviews are decent and they are actually rebranded Falkens.
@@krysmar1 my ID4 is a ‘21 Oct built AWD Pro S, I picked up exactly a year ago in ‘21 Dec. Had the rubber chunks peeling on the front tires on the OEM Bridgestone Alenza like mentioned by other ID4 owner forums. Mine started peeling and cupping ~12K miles with 6/32” tread. My rear tires worn down to 4/32 at only 14K miles. I got a nail near the tire wall that was not repairable, so DiscountTire sold me two GoodYear ComfortDrive Plus for the rear. Those were 11/32” tread when new, still holding up well at 10/32” tread now at 19K miles. I replaced my front tires at 16K miles with a pair of Pirelli Scorpion Zero (I see new ‘23 ID4 ships with those) but they are 9/32” tread new since I got these as OEM takeoffs from eBay. They have the noise-cancelling foam on the inside, but the tread pattern may be susceptible to peeling eventually, hopefully not as bad as the Bridgestone Alenza. So far my first 2K miles looks fine, without noticeable impact to my range. Still 9/32” My ideal next tires (backed by many good reviews on all weather conditions) would be the Michelin CrossClimate 2. Their unique tread pattern all the way through the bottom of groves will provide the same handling throughout the life of the tires. Supposedly last much longer too (60K rate, so for EV say 50% we may get 30K out of them). But reportedly lose 5% range due to the aggressive tire tread pattern (poor Rolling Resistance).
I lease a 21 and we’ve got a few bugs and I’m just so disappointed with how VW North America has rolled this vehicle out. No software updates at all??? Two emails providing a promise of an appointment? I’m skeptical. Other than that the car has been great. Just ONE major flaw.
My dealer said VW of America is releasing the new update in batches of 1200 so a dealer won’t be overwhelmed. He said it would be coming very soon. Fingers crossed 🤞
This car was made for me. I have the 2023 model and a 80 mile round trip commute every day. My only problem is parking it in my garage. Lots of warnings.
I've had a 2023 ID4 for less than a week, and have noticed no software problems at all (knock on wood). I actually like the software. However, I spend most of my time in Android Auto. Android Auto in the ID4 has been rock solid. It takes a few seconds to connect, but once connected it's been rock solid, with no freezes or disconnects. I really like that it supports wireless Android Auto, so I don't need to take my phone out of my pocket, and I don't have problems with flaky cables, which was a problem with my old car.
Well, I own 2021 1st edition, been waiting 18 months for this update. Scheduled my update the minute I received the email on the 6th, earliest appt was December 19th. I've encountered several 'software glitches', the worst ones occurred when trying to use an OBDII dongle for 'live' updates when using A Better Route Planner or car scanner. If I forgot to remove the OBDII after turning off the car, the next time starting the car caused serious confusion with VW start-up cycle. That being said I really like the ID4, hopefully 3.1 will help, cautiously optimistic.
I have a 2021 ID4 and though I haven’t seen icons lighting up, there are some bugs that show up here and there. Charging is an issue - mainly working the app, and preconditioning of the battery, as stated. I haven’t been called in for a software update yet, but I really was hoping for a smoother experience with the update. Seems one may have to wait a little longer
The ID.4 was at the top of my list as a next buy coming from a Leaf. The test drives were great and we enjoyed the ride and features. With the issues that some were experiencing, the switch to US production and crazy markups we couldn’t come to terms. In January 2023 dealers were finally offering cars at a small discount on inbound units with cancelled orders. Then Tesla dropped the prices and we bought a Model Y. The ride isn’t a# nice as the ID.4, but the tech is rock solid. I drive past a VW dealer each day and there are 5 ID.4s for sale. Looks like demand is down.
the 12 volt is becuse during the update it need to be on but the drive battery is not connected so there is a chance that the battry will run out during the update.. we will be getting the new charging curve as well 125kw to 135kw. and aparantly the software is over 1TB in size
Its a car first. I love the car. Rarely use the software as I don't care about it. I use Android Auto. Yea its not great, but i rather have a car that drives and the wheels stay on and is comfortable. My 2021 is fine for the price I paid
i have a 2022 ID.4 with the 3.1 software. I have noticed very few errors. car overall has been very good. My 2021 ID.4 had a few issues but would get the errors come on. A good example was If it was raining hard or snowing, the assist errors would come on. .
Unfortunately the Chattanooga built ID.4's only have a 62kw battery, meaning in the cold winter expect at best 80 miles-100 miles. That leaves a lot of people with no capability to even use the car in the winter.
I had a 2022 ID.4 AWD Pro S on order 11mos. When it finally arrived, I test drove it, let the dealer keep it, and bought a truly amazing Model 3 RWD (for about same $$) to share garage with our Model Y Performance.
I owned a model y for a year and couldn't wait to unload it. The software is good for the most part but there are quirks about it I hated, such as not being able to select "avoid highways" in maps. Anyway the cars ergonomics are the worst of any car currently in production. Felt like I was driving an economy car. I traded it in for an ioniq 5 which I liked better than the Y and have now traded the ioniq in for a gv60 performance. Now THATS a nice vehicle. Also have a Polestar which is leaps ahead of the tesla in driving experience.
I just got my 3.1 software upgrade on my 2021 ID.4 today (11.20.2023) after scheduling the appointment in February 2023! 😏 BTW, the 2021 model year came with AWD option in 2022.
Funny thing I have a ice VW Tiguan that the battery drains below 75% after sitting for only 3days, not very cold out when this is happening too. I was waiting for a iD4 but now I’m changing my mind. Oh and there is no battery meter or even and indicator. Ps: when my battery gets low the software has a lot of glitches, sounds like the 22 Tiguan has the same software problems as the ID4 too.
Plug in charge would be nice, but I've charged over a 1000 kWh at EA and the couple of seconds it takes to open the app, select the charger, and start charging are not a big deal. I've done a few road trips and with planning, they were very easy. But, most of my charging is at home and preconditioning and fast charging are not all that important.
VW are changing to a different type of 12V battery that can take the use pattern of the car better. I believe it is the kind that is used for start and stop functions on petrol cars. The 12V going low has been one of the main reasons for strange errors on the ID cars. The 12V replacement has been going on in Europe for a while now, with upgrade to 2.4 software which then allows for over the air 3.0 update.
I own a 2022 ID.4 GTX in Europe. Got the battery upgrade and the 2.4 software. Less bugs, but also new ones. At this point I am not sure if I want 3.0 or 3.1. I am honestly afraid that it will make my care worse. To me it is clear that 1) Volkswagen has no idea what they are doing with regards to software development. 2) They do not care at all about customer and user experience.
I’d really love to buy one of these, but the bugginess, as well as the pre-conditioning are misses I can’t ignore. Bummer to hear the chat23 is seeing that problem too. Such a shame, too. I went to an EV show not long ago and, of ALL the cars I sat in and played with (Tesla, ev6, ioniq 5, Mach-e, bolt), this one just get right. Something about it made me so happy. Get it together vw.
One more thing to add.. I got prompted in the EA app to enable plug and charge on my 22 Id.4 plan. It said it would come OTA. Although, not sure when. Until then, I'm OK with activating myself. But, charging is still better w my Tesla.
My dealer told me this week the software update takes 8 hours and I'll need to leave my 21 AWD Pro S there for the day :( plus they only have one computer available to manage upgrades so it's gonna take months to get an appointment. Not great
Got a similar disclaimer from my dealer. It seems that the service tech has to sit there and install all of the previous updates (2.4, 3.0, etc...) in order to get to 3.1
I wouldn't be surprised if the 12 volt battery is being replaced to stabilize the voltage. Many electronic devices really don't like unclean and low voltage.
I'm a hardcore car guy and former multi-car Volkswagen owner, and presently have a 2021 Model Y Performance only because at the time I was buying, VW didn't have AWD ID4 yet. But now I'm ADDICTED to the Tesla software updates, same as I'm addicted to iOS iPhone updates. I love getting new features, new cleaner interfaces with new ways to manipulate it. This latest update gave my car a Track mode - how cool is that? So if VW is not going to aggressively pursue software, I'm totally out. Glad I learned this the cheap way - didn't buy it.
We own a 2021 and have been eagerly awaiting the update. Today (Jan. 30, 2023) we received an email from VW saying that they will be delaying the roll-out of the software update because, after making their announcement in early December, they have “since identified software improvements to address important issues that have come to our attention. Updated software will soon be available. To improve the customer experience and avoid requiring additional customers to make repeat trips to Volkswagen dealerships, we have paused any further activities. We will be launching a new updated solution in short order, which will be available to all MY21 ID.4 customers.” Ugh.
I also own a 2021 Pro S. I got several notices that the update would be coming soon and I would have to take it to my dealer to get it done. Those notices started last October and since then I got the notice that there will be another delay for updated new software. I actually called my dealer and they dont have a clue when it will actually be available so we can take our vehicles in. I have given up on VW promises of software updates. But I will remember when it comes time to buy a new vehicle.
@@haroldbeanjr.2629 A couple of weeks ago our dealer told us that when our time arrives we will have to leave the car for two or three days(!) and that one of the reasons customers were not yet being invited in for this work is that the dealership is still acquiring more EVs to give out as loaners while this work is being done. We really like the car, but this software SNAFU is unacceptable.
We bought German made pro s rwd back in October '21. Seen phantom warnings but nothing major. Purchasing decision was largely influenced by the "excellent value" as recommended by Kyle. We've since traded in for a model 3 and the experience is night and day. Yes, the ID 4 is a solid vehicle....in my opinion though, mid as an EV - lacking all those things that are basic in other EVs.
I think this highlights a sea change in which automakers will be successful in the 21st century. In the mid to late 20th century, Toyota, VW, and other Japanese/German cars won the game with mechanical reliability and fuel economy. These were lacking amongst the American Big 3. Culturally, both the Germans and Japanese were well positioned to deliver on these attributes. But today, its software, software, software. When you look around the world at where the expertise is in that field, its USA all the way. Think about it, the US is home to basically every global scale tech company today between Apple, Meta, Google, etc. Going back to culture, the US with its greater emphasis on both individuality and creativity makes it the best incubator for software development. Writing code isn't "solve for x", it's develop a new way to get to x that nobody has done before. The podcast obviously mentions Tesla, but also how well Rivian and Lucid are doing when it comes to software and updates. But even our "second rate" American automakers - GM/Ford/Stellantis - still do a *FAR* better job with software compared with VW. I'm not saying VW can't solve this, just as the American automakers eventually figured out how to make cars that were reasonably reliable. But it's going to be a heavy lift and isn't likely to be fixed in six months.
All i can say I am glad VW did not deliver my pre-registered car when I put deposits down on EV6, Ioniq 5 and VW the pre-registered VW. I let the EV6 go in April this year and took delivery of my Ioniq 5 but with he unfortunate defective DC fast charging issue. Hyundai said call in 6 weeks which is 2 weeks away to see the status of the CCS socket / wiring harness back order status.
The new 12V battery is a type EFB + battery which can report-ably handle repeated cycling better than the current 12V battery due to tougher plate design. The EFB + battery was provided in all MY 2022 and 2023 ID.4s. The concern with the standard 12V battery provided in the MY 21 is that it could not withstand larger / long software download time and reach a discharge state killing the download process and keeping the car from starting. The MY 21 ID.4s also need about 10 hardware modules updated with new firmware before they car can be updated to version 3.1 software. The service department update is as follows: Update 12V Battery to EFB + Perform Firmware update on designated modules Update ID.4 to version 2.3 from 2.1 which will allow for over the air updates Update the MY 21 ID.4 to version 3.1 software All MY 21 ID.4s will than be able to receive over the air updates after the service is complete
I am itching to see how well the battery preconditioning work on my 2023 Ioniq 5 for fast DC charging, but I will be visiting only 150KW DC chargers unless they are tied up and the 350KW charger is available, that way I limit my battery pack to about a charge rate of 2C, yes I look after my EV's! Traded my 2019 Soul EV 30KWH with 28,500KM and only 3% battery battery degradation in 3 years.
Rivian is indeed smoking VW with tech. OEMs like the VW Group are very large and have a set way of doing things. They seem to have teams for different segments of the vehicle that have been doing the same thing for years, so they're not taking a fresh approach. The levels of teams something has to go through to make a small change is large and results in a lot of time before implementation. Unlike Tesla for instance. Elon and the team see an issue, its resolved stat! Rivian, as a fresh company, is looking at everything with new eyes starting with the premise of "What do we want this to do" as opposed to old ways and habits of someone that used to work on a Tiguan for instance. These are not fresh eyes for a new EV. I remember when IBM owned DOS and a little company named Microsoft bought it and saw that as a seed of something new and groundbreaking. IBM was a HUGE old company with thousands of employees doing the same ol' thing. IBM selling DOS, in retrospect, was a bit like Russia selling Alaska to us for near nothing. Yeah, then we found Gold, Silver, Oil etc, but I digress. We all know now that OEM's need new factories, specifically for EV production and they're slowly learning they need completely new and fresh people/teams working on these cars. We're inching closer to the time where it will become silly to buy an ICE car and I suspect that will be right around 2026 - 2027. Earlier here in California and Europe. Kids today were born with Tablets and other tech in their hands. This is the generation that will soon consider an ICE car something old people drive. A last note, worth noting: I think there needs to be a consortium SOON to decide on a charging standard AND start making the changes before too much ramping up. It's absolutely silly that we not only have various ways of plugging in, but no standard Plug And Charge. My motorcycle is and EV and I'm forced to use all the non-Tesla stations with several apps, many issues connecting to charge, too many out of order chargers, too few chargers at each station even here in Los Angeles. The charging infrastructure needs as much or more attention than the tech going into the cars or full EV adoption is going to take forever. Tesla's approach is they way to go. But will the collective corporate egos allow the adoption? I'm guessing they will stick with CCS which is really why I'm buying a Tesla in 2023. Really, the main reason.
The Software platform & distributed CPU system Volkswagen is using isn't really fit for purpose. And their Update cycle is woeful, with no over the air updates & glacial software update progress...
What to VW and Electrify America share besides ownership? Both have software problems. 12 V battery problems? Volkswagen AG has been buying and equipping 12 volt batteries since 1967. Sheesh.
I bought an ID.4 ProS in 2021, had it for less than a year and traded it in for a Model Y. The car itself was great in terms of ride quality, sound deadening and just being a normal car. The brakes sucked. The main reason I got rid of it is the software experience. straight trash.
I really want VW to get this right, but my history gives me doubts. My first car was a 2001 VW GTI. Like you describe with the ID.4, I loved the mechanics - how it drove, the seats, the clutch, and so on - but I sold it because the check engine light was constantly on. There was always an O2 sensor, a window regulator, or a sensor in the fuel line. The race to watch: can VW put out the software (and switchgear) fire before Chevy releases the Equinox EV? VW's got about nine months of runway.
What I was told is that the they need to replace the battery and also update/replace a module that will enable over the air updates. VW should be ashamed of themselves for delivering a car with a ancient software platform and phone app lacks many of the features in the CarNet app for their ICE cars. Pretty stupid. No more VWs for me.
One of the reasons why ID4s don't sell well in China. Very upsetting. I want to stay with German cars. I was so disappointed with IDs that I have been looking at he Audi Q4 e-tron that is just an upgraded ID4 but is way more expensive and the reason why I haven't placed an order for either. The interesting thing is, Audi doesn't seem to have those software issues (not the best anyway), but VW ID, being in the same group with Audi, can't even fix those issues in the ID line-up. How can that be the case? Well thanks for the update and I will take another look at the new ID4 and see if issues have been fixed.
Be honest, is it really a great car when your dad is disappointed that none of the core features are going to be addressed, the newest model on the latest software is still buggy and your Mum is trying to Lemon the car.
VW keeps screwing up. Up here in Canada they've maybe delivered 3 or 4k cars? Then they started jacking up the price. It maybe 6k dollars in the last year and a half. They dropped the premium stereo, folding mirrors, surround camera, heat pump... it's become stupid. The software is a joke. The interior materials are seriously subpar. Wake up VW.
Ok, so after this, I'm not buying an ID.4 . I need an all-around road tripping car. I love the Pro-S. It's comfortable, but that won't fix the aggravation of debugging a new expensive car. No way.
Well I had one of the first VW Rabbits in the country. Dealer had to go to the docks in Jacksonville and duke it out with all the others. With that experience (engine emissions...omg) there was NO WAY I would get an ID.4 in the first 2 years. Just sayin'.
It's NOT "small tweaks" as Kyle calls it! The software and battery electronics are what create a unique experience in an EV! Both of which; VW folks have failed miserably! VW has had more than 5 years to fix Plugin Charging and they are nowhere near delivering such an experience. The idiots at VW are selling EVs like they are ICE cars.
Kyle you asked in this why it can be that VW/Audi could have so many issues with software while other companies like Rivian (much smaller startup) can be smoking them. My experience, working with software development for years, us that software development structure is linked to corporate culture and corporate culture changes very slowly unless the company is willing to rebuild that from the top down and the bottom up. GM and Ford had similar issues with software development and at least Ford within the last several years realized that the only way to fix it was to gut that part of the workforce and bring in totally new blood. I can give you tons of examples of how this played out in several US and German companies if you ever want to discuss it.
Have a 2021 pull in at home at 45%. Set the car to charge to 70% by 5 am and warm the interior. Plug car in and go to bed. Next morning car doesn't charge overnight and can't make the trip I needed it to do. TOTAL FAIL. TESLA HE I COME TAKE MY MONEY!!!
LOL, as a 2019 VW e-Golf owner, I'm just laughing. ID.4 owners are as much a guinea pig as my fellow e-Golf owners were. VW hasn't even liked to update NAV maps in US cars during warranty, and you're begging for OTA updates?? Carnet 1.0 had the same issues, until 3G systems sunset on 2/22/2022, and VW said "sorry, no 4G solution for our devoted e-Golf owners, that feature and remote pre-heating is broken in your cars forever". As for the 12V battery replacement, VW recommends connecting a charger whenever you're working with ODIS or reflashing the onboard computers with firmware or revised software codings. Starting with fresh 12V batteries on the 2021 cars will just buy VW more time before they start bricking ID.4s in the customer's driveway.
I have a 2021 ID.4 and had no issues at all with the tech ( I must be very lucky). Charging at EA has been a thorn in my side (haven’t used it in months). Fortunately my VW dealer has a free fast charger that I use. Hopefully the issues with 3.1 will be fixed soon. The delay with OTAs is driving me crazy. It was one of reasons I bought the car, otherwise the car is wonderful. Hope springs eternal.
Crappy software in 2022 on an EV is just not acceptable. Tesla has been improving its software over the air for 10 years with a fraction of the resources of VW. VW should be embarrassed
I've had an ID4 2021 for 19 months and run 24,000 miles plus on it. Sweet ride, but buggiest software ever written and seems to have decayed. TERRIBLE as a daily commuter car. Promise of software upgrade was initially SUMMER of 2021...!!! So let's get that right. For all the accolades it got initially and the passerby interest, I stopped recommending it over a year ago. "Meh!" Fact is that I reached the end of my rope with VW... on a drive home: 45 miles with a blacked out screen.... AGAIN. They lost me. Now I can't wait to unload this puppy. Just too many drives interrupted by screen, sound, iphone connection failures that can't be fixed without a complete reboot post powerdown.... and even then, you're lucky it doesn't recur. Currently "interviewing" candidates for a replacement. Tesla Model 3 is so much better in Tech, but the seats... ugh... and can we say, "I might enjoy a Tesla spin, but there's just no chemistry there..... outside of the tech, supercharger network, etc. I'm just not a Tech Bro Elon Groupie. Elon's done an amazing feat of engineering and re-ordering minds from scratch.... but...nah. Glad he has fans though. And yet.... his engineering is five years ahead of the others! Feel like he's Henry Ford... all over again... and as long as you want a jelly bean, you're good. I prefer other candy. But would I buy another car from VW Group (VW, Porsche or Audi)? No. SoftwareGate is a reminder that the company that brought you Dieselgate hasn't really changed its stripes. Completely buffaloed by VW.... VW Germany acknowledged all of this fairly early. VW America? NEVER communicated on the issue until 1 year later. Not even a "Thanks for your patience.... we're busy working on it...."???? That said, no matter what anyone says, there is a LOT of demand for EV's that don't conform to having "the Elon Musk" (see the BMW sites on this as it's cited by many for why they ordered non-Teslas). Yipes! And the VW ID4 mechanically, stylistically, storage spacewise, comfortwise.... had SO much going for it. Does it question German manufacture in general? German attitudes toward their drivers? German consumer friendliness? Kind of. And that's a very BIG black eye. But it does it also question whether there's ANY alternative to a Tesla at this point, too? Yeah... kind of.
I have a 22 ID4 and have software 3.1, No issues with car or software. One thing I would like is a slightly more aggressive regen braking. Ap is not great but love being able to pre-warm car in the morning.
I was planning to buy the ID. 4, but I think I'll hold off to see what fixes are implemented that truly works.
My wife has a 2021 ID.4 PRO she got in July 2021, so a year and a half. We’ve taken it from Sacramento to the Bay Area, to Zion NP and the North Rim. She drove it solo from here to LA. No issues with charging - or software. All these miles and while, yeah, the software ain’t great and it’s kinda laggy, she’s never had any flags or warnings or anything. We got the TOU charging to (mostly) work, the cabin pre-heats in the morning. And most importantly, she LOVES her VW!
But I’m kind of a believer in “If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it” approach. My wife can handle tech fine, but she’s not a tech nerd. I’m a bit concerned that, IF she updates the s/w, and if it starts throwing up random flags etc…, she’s going to go from loving her ride to detesting it.
Is there any requirement that the car MUST be updated?
I think the 2022 is the most solid year to own with it being the last German year and already having 3.1 software. Mine has had zero issues. The faster charging would be nice but the EA chargers I use on trips are so unreliable it doesn’t even matter. Love how well built it is, priced really well, and I’ll put up with not great software. But yes plug and charge and improved app functionality seem like pretty basic things they need to work on.
I concur. received my 2022 in July with 3.1 and so far so good.
Agreed. My 2022 came with the 3.1 and I haven’t had any issues
Our 2022 ID4 Pro S with 3.1 software made in Germany is rock solid. No issues at all.
Same here! So far so good.
From what I understand is the original 12v can’t handle the update. The 3.1 update is huge, and the initial software drop was causing major battery drain on the 12v
I've heard that too.
LMFAO
Kyle, you're the best VW ID expert! I own a 2021 ID.4 and everything you say is right on and simply exact. Just a note on the battery issue: With 34k km on it, I experienced one and only one event where the car freaked out because of an inconsistent 12V battery measurement. It does not happen frequently but since it does, and the battery happens to be the cause, VW has no choice other than replacing it. Finally, I live in Qc Canada and fast charging on winter trips really sucks, to the point that it took me more than 6 months (got it in November) before I could check out it could really fast charge at 125KW sometimes. Too bad, for the rest, I love that car.
I live in Southern California and noticed the charging speed slowed a bit in the 5 degree Celsius temps which not as cold as Canadian winters. After 7months of ownership, I’m averaging 50-70KW charging speed on 150KW chargers. I did get 82KW when is was at 20% but levels off to 50 after 60%.. Maybe the new software update will improve this.
Have had a 2023 awd ID.4 for two weeks in ct. have had no problems, the app does a wonderful job of heating the car before getting in, I just love the car, and I traded in a 2022 Santa Fe plug in, which was very nice, but this is a step up
I've had my ID.4 since Aug 21 with nearly zero issues. I watched this video this morning, and on my way to work a few minutes later I got all the lights: Airbag, Dynamic Cornering, Travel Assist, Park Assist, and a handful of others. Doomed!
On reservation - 2023 Pro S Plus - est deliver date 12/22-2/23. Salivating
Thanks for the info. Currently leasing a late 2021 AWD (US spec) December build model and so far had no major issues with the software. I received a email from VW in October stating that a software update with battery will be available before the end of the year. Still waiting for that call.. Not sure how reliable this new update for the earlier models. I read some UK owners had issues the software updates with their European builds.
I have an ID.4 - haven't really had any issues, and we take it on road trips all the time. As you point out, the main things still missing are preconditioning and plug-and-charge.
I suspect they were in a deep hole with the old release - they need to make some significant changes before they could do some of the rest, and reports in Europe suggest that they had deployment problems where some cars wouldn't take an update - even at a dealer.
I have a 2021 AWD Pro S and have not had the "Christmas tree" lights being described here. That said, I am eagerly awaiting the 3.x update which VWoA has communicated to us 2021 owners via email and is beginning to roll-out starting with 2021 First Edition owners. Overall I love the car and, value-wise, nothing beats it. The 12V battery upgrade is necessary for some early builds because OTA/scheduled charging was draining the old battery and they needed to replace it with a higher capacity 12V to safely enable those features. Bottom line is VW released the car 1-2 years early (and paid the price for it).
Not experiencing any of the bugs in my EU id4 GTX. 16K km atm.
Why do they add "Auto Hold" but not one pedal driving? Is there an engineering or safety reason for why one pedal seems to keep getting passed over?
Personally, I don’t think many manufacturers really understand ev yet. There’s nothing better than one peddle driving. Hopefully everyone will figure this out.
I received an email a week or so ago to call my local dealership and schedule the upgrade. Service said they'd order the parts and call me to schedule when they come in.. he had no idea how long that would be. My '21 1st edition has been almost perfect at this point.. only had 5 or so random false/warning issues that were resolved with a turning off of the car and back on in about 15 months of ownership/18k miles. I was really hoping for a cleanup/improvement in the user interface, plug and charge and 1 pedal driving.. looks like I'm only getting 1 of those. Darn.
In the beginning of the video, it was mentioned that the MY23 model gets "full credit", is that only for card delivered before end of this year? I heard from my dealer that the car delivering next year will only be qualified for half.
Could you do an update of this video in light of all the problems ID.4 owners are having with the 97ZZ (essentially the update featured here) recall? i.e., appointments a year out, dealers who won't perform the recall, cars taking aweek+ to be updated, problems after update, etc.
I received an AWD Pro S in December of 2021. I've had no issues with the software or the 12 volt battery. I've never had any warning messages except when driving in snow storms that the driver assist was not working. (Sensers & cameras blocked with snow!) Also, the VW apt has worked every time I've used it for starting charging or climate. I hope this update really is worth it because I like the way it works now.
I've owned a TN 23' ID.4 for about a month and already had one software update. So far, no software issues (knock on wood). [AWD Pro S]
Have only had a few very minor hiccups with my 2022 German ID4. 3 warning lights have came on, and they freaked me out but cleared within minutes. Nearly 10,000 miles on mine so far.
I agree with everything they said - except that 2021 AWD ID.4s do exist (I have a Pro S AWD - built in 12/21, delivered 4/22). The engineers that did software and UX should be fired. There are 4 arrow buttons on the right side of steering wheel to control audio. Do the up/down arrows make the sound louder/softer? No, you hit the left/right arrows. The up/down are for the preset stations, which on the screen are shown left to right. Arrrgh! I constantly have to think which button to use (even after 8 months) b/c it is so counterintuitive. I hope that this update is the start of many to come. My "wish" list: plug 'n' charge, faster DCFC, 1 pedal mode, OTA updates, battery pre-conditioning, and a much much much better app that actually does more than just show you the SOC. Absolutely fantastic car to drive, but with absolutely garbage SW (and slow garbage at that).
Huh.
My wife drives a 2021 ID.4 PRO. She LOVES her VW! Taken it on long road trips with the family. And no SW issues.
I like the vehicle - and yes the turning radius is amazing. It’s comfy, reliable, and easy to live with.
I drive a Tesla Model 3 SR+ I got a few months before she bought her EV. While she liked the Tesla, it was (as Dad says) too unusual for her. She immediately liked the familiarity of the VW. Snap decision.
I’m leery about her “upgrading” to 3.1. We’ve not had any issues with the ID.4. If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.
I'm glad I watched this. Was going to sell my Ioniq 5 for the 2023 ID4 Pro S. Thanks guys.
12volt battery, I replaced my 2020 Soul EV Limited 12volt battery only one year after getting that car, dealer said after 6 times of the battery going completely dead, that after charging said that the battery checked out, so I check out that crappy 12volt and replaced it with a fine AGM quality battery and no issues in a year that I did that!
Let me preface this by saying that I have a 2021 ID.4 1st Edition, and have put over 20k miles on it. I've taken it on two coast-to-coast trips, and I've found it to be an extremely competent transportation appliance and a comfortable road trip warrior, for the times I choose not to opt for a more exciting vehicle. On paper, it's a champ. Sure, I have my list of concerns -- the alarming amount of frame reinforcements under the hood, the eternally-obnoxious chorus of rattles that emanate from the rear of the vehicle, the bevy of inexplicable warning lights that have greeted me at random intervals -- I could go on, but I digress. I expect and tolerate a certain level of wonkiness from a first model year vehicle, particularly one on a new platform.
That said, it should be an embarrassment to Volkswagen that the primary shortcoming of their first major foray into EVs has been the infuriatingly daft software package they've tied these vehicles to. At best, it was half-baked from the jump. At worst, VW should fire their entire team of UX designers.
I get it -- Volkswagen is a legacy carmaker that survives on the business of making cars, not software (unlike Tesla, Rivian, Lucid, etc.). So then why not outsource the software piece of it to a company that knows software? The Android Automotive experience in the Polestar 2 is a perfect model of this, and I found it to be refreshingly intuitive and comfortable, even for an Apple fanboy like myself.
Had the IONIQ5 or EV6 been available when I purchased the ID.4, the VW wouldn't have even had a chance. Both far outshine the ID.4 in terms of user experience and overall quality feel, even in their base trim levels. My ID.4 is scheduled for its software/12v battery upgrade tomorrow morning, and I can't say I expect much at this point.
I have the same car with the same mileage. Curious how your tires held up. I personally had to replace my rear tires in less than a year with only about 10k miles.
@@krysmar1 I probably should have replaced them around 15k miles, but I’m shopping for replacements now. Out of curiosity, which ones did you go with?
@@fennter I tried to get the stock tires, but after doing the math I couldn't stomach the $600 for new rear tires in less than a year. I got the OHTSU FP8000 from amazon delivered to a local tire shop. Came in half the price of the stock tires. Reviews are decent and they are actually rebranded Falkens.
@@krysmar1 my ID4 is a ‘21 Oct built AWD Pro S, I picked up exactly a year ago in ‘21 Dec. Had the rubber chunks peeling on the front tires on the OEM Bridgestone Alenza like mentioned by other ID4 owner forums. Mine started peeling and cupping ~12K miles with 6/32” tread.
My rear tires worn down to 4/32 at only 14K miles. I got a nail near the tire wall that was not repairable, so DiscountTire sold me two GoodYear ComfortDrive Plus for the rear. Those were 11/32” tread when new, still holding up well at 10/32” tread now at 19K miles.
I replaced my front tires at 16K miles with a pair of Pirelli Scorpion Zero (I see new ‘23 ID4 ships with those) but they are 9/32” tread new since I got these as OEM takeoffs from eBay. They have the noise-cancelling foam on the inside, but the tread pattern may be susceptible to peeling eventually, hopefully not as bad as the Bridgestone Alenza. So far my first 2K miles looks fine, without noticeable impact to my range. Still 9/32”
My ideal next tires (backed by many good reviews on all weather conditions) would be the Michelin CrossClimate 2. Their unique tread pattern all the way through the bottom of groves will provide the same handling throughout the life of the tires. Supposedly last much longer too (60K rate, so for EV say 50% we may get 30K out of them). But reportedly lose 5% range due to the aggressive tire tread pattern (poor Rolling Resistance).
I lease a 21 and we’ve got a few bugs and I’m just so disappointed with how VW North America has rolled this vehicle out. No software updates at all??? Two emails providing a promise of an appointment? I’m skeptical. Other than that the car has been great. Just ONE major flaw.
If they aren't fully offering over the air updates will they still continue to update them at the dealer as they come up with new versions ?
Thanks for posting this. Any news yet on the 2021 software update & 12v battery swap will be a available at dealerships?
My dealer said VW of America is releasing the new update in batches of 1200 so a dealer won’t be overwhelmed. He said it would be coming very soon. Fingers crossed 🤞
Does the update to 3.1 include the addition of OTA?? Didn’t see any mention of OTA capability in the letter as you scrolled it.
This car was made for me. I have the 2023 model and a 80 mile round trip commute every day. My only problem is parking it in my garage. Lots of warnings.
Good morning guys. Thanks for update
What is plug in charge? Just plug car and it charges without any additional steps?
I've had a 2023 ID4 for less than a week, and have noticed no software problems at all (knock on wood). I actually like the software. However, I spend most of my time in Android Auto. Android Auto in the ID4 has been rock solid. It takes a few seconds to connect, but once connected it's been rock solid, with no freezes or disconnects. I really like that it supports wireless Android Auto, so I don't need to take my phone out of my pocket, and I don't have problems with flaky cables, which was a problem with my old car.
Well, I own 2021 1st edition, been waiting 18 months for this update. Scheduled my update the minute I received the email on the 6th, earliest appt was December 19th. I've encountered several 'software glitches', the worst ones occurred when trying to use an OBDII dongle for 'live' updates when using A Better Route Planner or car scanner. If I forgot to remove the OBDII after turning off the car, the next time starting the car caused serious confusion with VW start-up cycle. That being said I really like the ID4, hopefully 3.1 will help, cautiously optimistic.
What email did you get? The one announcing the updates or one specifically saying your car could get the update now?
@@RonRattie The email that I could get the update now. Which will be Dec 19th, they are also going to provide a loaner.
@@ct2nc421 a loaner too? I hope it’s an ID.4 also.
My Europe Finland 2021 ID4 (1st edition Max) is now getting SW 3.2 installed :)
What other EV's offer preconditioned batteries?
I have a 2021 ID4 and though I haven’t seen icons lighting up, there are some bugs that show up here and there. Charging is an issue - mainly working the app, and preconditioning of the battery, as stated. I haven’t been called in for a software update yet, but I really was hoping for a smoother experience with the update. Seems one may have to wait a little longer
The ID.4 was at the top of my list as a next buy coming from a Leaf. The test drives were great and we enjoyed the ride and features. With the issues that some were experiencing, the switch to US production and crazy markups we couldn’t come to terms. In January 2023 dealers were finally offering cars at a small discount on inbound units with cancelled orders. Then Tesla dropped the prices and we bought a Model Y. The ride isn’t a# nice as the ID.4, but the tech is rock solid. I drive past a VW dealer each day and there are 5 ID.4s for sale. Looks like demand is down.
It's nice to know that even the latest software upgrades is failing in the 2023 models. There was a reason I canceled my ID4 Reservations TWICE!
the 12 volt is becuse during the update it need to be on but the drive battery is not connected so there is a chance that the battry will run out during the update.. we will be getting the new charging curve as well 125kw to 135kw. and aparantly the software is over 1TB in size
Its a car first. I love the car. Rarely use the software as I don't care about it. I use Android Auto. Yea its not great, but i rather have a car that drives and the wheels stay on and is comfortable. My 2021 is fine for the price I paid
i have a 2022 ID.4 with the 3.1 software. I have noticed very few errors. car overall has been very good. My 2021 ID.4 had a few issues but would get the errors come on. A good example was If it was raining hard or snowing, the assist errors would come on. .
Kyle, you are overreacting about plug and charge for new owners. ICE cars don't have plug and fill up.
Unfortunately the Chattanooga built ID.4's only have a 62kw battery, meaning in the cold winter expect at best 80 miles-100 miles. That leaves a lot of people with no capability to even use the car in the winter.
I had a 2022 ID.4 AWD Pro S on order 11mos. When it finally arrived, I test drove it, let the dealer keep it, and bought a truly amazing Model 3 RWD (for about same $$) to share garage with our Model Y Performance.
I owned a model y for a year and couldn't wait to unload it. The software is good for the most part but there are quirks about it I hated, such as not being able to select "avoid highways" in maps. Anyway the cars ergonomics are the worst of any car currently in production. Felt like I was driving an economy car. I traded it in for an ioniq 5 which I liked better than the Y and have now traded the ioniq in for a gv60 performance. Now THATS a nice vehicle. Also have a Polestar which is leaps ahead of the tesla in driving experience.
They are using a different battery to enable the software updates. I don't understand why but that is what they told us over 2 months ago.
Hardware wise.. is the '21 ID.4 capable of 1 pedal driving?
I just got my 3.1 software upgrade on my 2021 ID.4 today (11.20.2023) after scheduling the appointment in February 2023! 😏 BTW, the 2021 model year came with AWD option in 2022.
I really dislike the VW app. Pure trash.
Agreed. It's unfortunate that those of us in NA don't get the app that the most of the rest of the world gets, which has much more functionality.
The 12v couldn't last long enough for doing the OTA updates in cold weather in Canada! ;)
Funny thing I have a ice VW Tiguan that the battery drains below 75% after sitting for only 3days, not very cold out when this is happening too. I was waiting for a iD4 but now I’m changing my mind. Oh and there is no battery meter or even and indicator. Ps: when my battery gets low the software has a lot of glitches, sounds like the 22 Tiguan has the same software problems as the ID4 too.
Plug in charge would be nice, but I've charged over a 1000 kWh at EA and the couple of seconds it takes to open the app, select the charger, and start charging are not a big deal. I've done a few road trips and with planning, they were very easy. But, most of my charging is at home and preconditioning and fast charging are not all that important.
I am watching this in 9/26/23 and I just got a 2023 ID 4 Pro S RWD. It is running 3.1. Any idea if VW plans on announcing software updates for 2023?
I’m nervous saying this, but my ‘23 ID4 hasn’t had any bugs. Seems memory/profiles are a bit off at times tho.
VW are changing to a different type of 12V battery that can take the use pattern of the car better. I believe it is the kind that is used for start and stop functions on petrol cars. The 12V going low has been one of the main reasons for strange errors on the ID cars. The 12V replacement has been going on in Europe for a while now, with upgrade to 2.4 software which then allows for over the air 3.0 update.
I own a 2022 ID.4 GTX in Europe. Got the battery upgrade and the 2.4 software. Less bugs, but also new ones. At this point I am not sure if I want 3.0 or 3.1. I am honestly afraid that it will make my care worse. To me it is clear that 1) Volkswagen has no idea what they are doing with regards to software development. 2) They do not care at all about customer and user experience.
I’d really love to buy one of these, but the bugginess, as well as the pre-conditioning are misses I can’t ignore. Bummer to hear the chat23 is seeing that problem too.
Such a shame, too. I went to an EV show not long ago and, of ALL the cars I sat in and played with (Tesla, ev6, ioniq 5, Mach-e, bolt), this one just get right. Something about it made me so happy.
Get it together vw.
I’m going to pick up a 21 id4 tomorrow and it looks like I might have to take it straight to the vw dealer to make sure it’s up to date 😩
Maybe new 12 V to support OTA?
One more thing to add.. I got prompted in the EA app to enable plug and charge on my 22 Id.4 plan. It said it would come OTA. Although, not sure when. Until then, I'm OK with activating myself. But, charging is still better w my Tesla.
My dealer told me this week the software update takes 8 hours and I'll need to leave my 21 AWD Pro S there for the day :( plus they only have one computer available to manage upgrades so it's gonna take months to get an appointment. Not great
Got a similar disclaimer from my dealer. It seems that the service tech has to sit there and install all of the previous updates (2.4, 3.0, etc...) in order to get to 3.1
Soooo I shouldn’t get rid of my Atlas and get an id 4 ?
I wouldn't be surprised if the 12 volt battery is being replaced to stabilize the voltage. Many electronic devices really don't like unclean and low voltage.
22 orders are automatically transferred to a 23. Locked orders are opened for that.
I'm a hardcore car guy and former multi-car Volkswagen owner, and presently have a 2021 Model Y Performance only because at the time I was buying, VW didn't have AWD ID4 yet. But now I'm ADDICTED to the Tesla software updates, same as I'm addicted to iOS iPhone updates. I love getting new features, new cleaner interfaces with new ways to manipulate it. This latest update gave my car a Track mode - how cool is that? So if VW is not going to aggressively pursue software, I'm totally out. Glad I learned this the cheap way - didn't buy it.
At 12 minutes in it was disclosed the new software has bugs. In the interest of viewer's time please say that first.
Im confused, I think I already have all those features in my 2021 1st edition. Strange.
We own a 2021 and have been eagerly awaiting the update. Today (Jan. 30, 2023) we received an email from VW saying that they will be delaying the roll-out of the software update because, after making their announcement in early December, they have “since identified software improvements to address important issues that have come to our attention. Updated software will soon be available. To improve the customer experience and avoid requiring additional customers to make repeat trips to Volkswagen dealerships, we have paused any further activities. We will be launching a new updated solution in short order, which will be available to all MY21 ID.4 customers.” Ugh.
I also own a 2021 Pro S. I got several notices that the update would be coming soon and I would have to take it to my dealer to get it done. Those notices started last October and since then I got the notice that there will be another delay for updated new software. I actually called my dealer and they dont have a clue when it will actually be available so we can take our vehicles in. I have given up on VW promises of software updates. But I will remember when it comes time to buy a new vehicle.
@@haroldbeanjr.2629 A couple of weeks ago our dealer told us that when our time arrives we will have to leave the car for two or three days(!) and that one of the reasons customers were not yet being invited in for this work is that the dealership is still acquiring more EVs to give out as loaners while this work is being done. We really like the car, but this software SNAFU is unacceptable.
We bought German made pro s rwd back in October '21. Seen phantom warnings but nothing major. Purchasing decision was largely influenced by the "excellent value" as recommended by Kyle. We've since traded in for a model 3 and the experience is night and day. Yes, the ID 4 is a solid vehicle....in my opinion though, mid as an EV - lacking all those things that are basic in other EVs.
I disagree. How can it be a wonderful car with so many issues??? Most people want basic transportation that just works.
It does "just work" some people have issues but most don't. I haven't had issues with my "bug ridden" my21.
Almost all EVs have issues on the first year they’re made, cars in general. 2022 and 2023 seem to be fine.
I think this highlights a sea change in which automakers will be successful in the 21st century. In the mid to late 20th century, Toyota, VW, and other Japanese/German cars won the game with mechanical reliability and fuel economy. These were lacking amongst the American Big 3. Culturally, both the Germans and Japanese were well positioned to deliver on these attributes.
But today, its software, software, software. When you look around the world at where the expertise is in that field, its USA all the way. Think about it, the US is home to basically every global scale tech company today between Apple, Meta, Google, etc.
Going back to culture, the US with its greater emphasis on both individuality and creativity makes it the best incubator for software development. Writing code isn't "solve for x", it's develop a new way to get to x that nobody has done before. The podcast obviously mentions Tesla, but also how well Rivian and Lucid are doing when it comes to software and updates. But even our "second rate" American automakers - GM/Ford/Stellantis - still do a *FAR* better job with software compared with VW.
I'm not saying VW can't solve this, just as the American automakers eventually figured out how to make cars that were reasonably reliable. But it's going to be a heavy lift and isn't likely to be fixed in six months.
Buggy software and the app connectivity were the two reason why I sold my ID4.
I don't think this update is going to bring the older cars up to date. This is 2.4. After this update, the 3.0, 3.1 will come OTA later.
The update in North America is going straight to 3.x.
"consistency is a good thing" - :)
All i can say I am glad VW did not deliver my pre-registered car when I put deposits down on EV6, Ioniq 5 and VW the pre-registered VW. I let the EV6 go in April this year and took delivery of my Ioniq 5 but with he unfortunate defective DC fast charging issue. Hyundai said call in 6 weeks which is 2 weeks away to see the status of the CCS socket / wiring harness back order status.
The new 12V battery is a type EFB + battery which can report-ably handle repeated cycling better than the current 12V battery due to tougher plate design. The EFB + battery was provided in all MY 2022 and 2023 ID.4s. The concern with the standard 12V battery provided in the MY 21 is that it could not withstand larger / long software download time and reach a discharge state killing the download process and keeping the car from starting.
The MY 21 ID.4s also need about 10 hardware modules updated with new firmware before they car can be updated to version 3.1 software.
The service department update is as follows:
Update 12V Battery to EFB +
Perform Firmware update on designated modules
Update ID.4 to version 2.3 from 2.1 which will allow for over the air updates
Update the MY 21 ID.4 to version 3.1 software
All MY 21 ID.4s will than be able to receive over the air updates after the service is complete
I am itching to see how well the battery preconditioning work on my 2023 Ioniq 5 for fast DC charging, but I will be visiting only 150KW DC chargers unless they are tied up and the 350KW charger is available, that way I limit my battery pack to about a charge rate of 2C, yes I look after my EV's! Traded my 2019 Soul EV 30KWH with 28,500KM and only 3% battery battery degradation in 3 years.
Rivian is indeed smoking VW with tech. OEMs like the VW Group are very large and have a set way of doing things. They seem to have teams for different segments of the vehicle that have been doing the same thing for years, so they're not taking a fresh approach. The levels of teams something has to go through to make a small change is large and results in a lot of time before implementation. Unlike Tesla for instance. Elon and the team see an issue, its resolved stat! Rivian, as a fresh company, is looking at everything with new eyes starting with the premise of "What do we want this to do" as opposed to old ways and habits of someone that used to work on a Tiguan for instance. These are not fresh eyes for a new EV. I remember when IBM owned DOS and a little company named Microsoft bought it and saw that as a seed of something new and groundbreaking. IBM was a HUGE old company with thousands of employees doing the same ol' thing. IBM selling DOS, in retrospect, was a bit like Russia selling Alaska to us for near nothing. Yeah, then we found Gold, Silver, Oil etc, but I digress.
We all know now that OEM's need new factories, specifically for EV production and they're slowly learning they need completely new and fresh people/teams working on these cars. We're inching closer to the time where it will become silly to buy an ICE car and I suspect that will be right around 2026 - 2027. Earlier here in California and Europe. Kids today were born with Tablets and other tech in their hands. This is the generation that will soon consider an ICE car something old people drive. A last note, worth noting: I think there needs to be a consortium SOON to decide on a charging standard AND start making the changes before too much ramping up. It's absolutely silly that we not only have various ways of plugging in, but no standard Plug And Charge. My motorcycle is and EV and I'm forced to use all the non-Tesla stations with several apps, many issues connecting to charge, too many out of order chargers, too few chargers at each station even here in Los Angeles. The charging infrastructure needs as much or more attention than the tech going into the cars or full EV adoption is going to take forever. Tesla's approach is they way to go. But will the collective corporate egos allow the adoption? I'm guessing they will stick with CCS which is really why I'm buying a Tesla in 2023. Really, the main reason.
I'm thankful my german built '22 came with 3.1
The Software platform & distributed CPU system Volkswagen is using isn't really fit for purpose. And their Update cycle is woeful, with no over the air updates & glacial software update progress...
What to VW and Electrify America share besides ownership? Both have software problems.
12 V battery problems? Volkswagen AG has been buying and equipping 12 volt batteries since 1967. Sheesh.
I bought an ID.4 ProS in 2021, had it for less than a year and traded it in for a Model Y. The car itself was great in terms of ride quality, sound deadening and just being a normal car. The brakes sucked. The main reason I got rid of it is the software experience. straight trash.
I really want VW to get this right, but my history gives me doubts. My first car was a 2001 VW GTI. Like you describe with the ID.4, I loved the mechanics - how it drove, the seats, the clutch, and so on - but I sold it because the check engine light was constantly on. There was always an O2 sensor, a window regulator, or a sensor in the fuel line.
The race to watch: can VW put out the software (and switchgear) fire before Chevy releases the Equinox EV? VW's got about nine months of runway.
What I was told is that the they need to replace the battery and also update/replace a module that will enable over the air updates. VW should be ashamed of themselves for delivering a car with a ancient software platform and phone app lacks many of the features in the CarNet app for their ICE cars. Pretty stupid. No more VWs for me.
One of the reasons why ID4s don't sell well in China. Very upsetting. I want to stay with German cars. I was so disappointed with IDs that I have been looking at he Audi Q4 e-tron that is just an upgraded ID4 but is way more expensive and the reason why I haven't placed an order for either. The interesting thing is, Audi doesn't seem to have those software issues (not the best anyway), but VW ID, being in the same group with Audi, can't even fix those issues in the ID line-up. How can that be the case? Well thanks for the update and I will take another look at the new ID4 and see if issues have been fixed.
Having to swap the 12v battery is pretty bad and short sided. my battery will be between 10-14 months old when they replace it. Such a waste
Be honest, is it really a great car when your dad is disappointed that none of the core features are going to be addressed, the newest model on the latest software is still buggy and your Mum is trying to Lemon the car.
VW keeps screwing up. Up here in Canada they've maybe delivered 3 or 4k cars? Then they started jacking up the price. It maybe 6k dollars in the last year and a half. They dropped the premium stereo, folding mirrors, surround camera, heat pump... it's become stupid. The software is a joke. The interior materials are seriously subpar. Wake up VW.
Ok, so after this, I'm not buying an ID.4 . I need an all-around road tripping car. I love the Pro-S. It's comfortable, but that won't fix the aggravation of debugging a new expensive car. No way.
If Kyle's own family members ditch the ID4 because of software issues, then maybe it's not very good.
Dave just likes to change cars he had a ionic 5 for a few months then a Tesla s and then another Tesla s plus 3 id 4’s
He constantly changes cars, he had ID.4, then on to IONIQ 5, then GV60
Well I had one of the first VW Rabbits in the country. Dealer had to go to the docks in Jacksonville and duke it out with all the others.
With that experience (engine emissions...omg) there was NO WAY I would get an ID.4 in the first 2 years. Just sayin'.
It's NOT "small tweaks" as Kyle calls it! The software and battery electronics are what create a unique experience in an EV! Both of which; VW folks have failed miserably! VW has had more than 5 years to fix Plugin Charging and they are nowhere near delivering such an experience.
The idiots at VW are selling EVs like they are ICE cars.
Kyle you asked in this why it can be that VW/Audi could have so many issues with software while other companies like Rivian (much smaller startup) can be smoking them. My experience, working with software development for years, us that software development structure is linked to corporate culture and corporate culture changes very slowly unless the company is willing to rebuild that from the top down and the bottom up. GM and Ford had similar issues with software development and at least Ford within the last several years realized that the only way to fix it was to gut that part of the workforce and bring in totally new blood. I can give you tons of examples of how this played out in several US and German companies if you ever want to discuss it.
Have a 2021 pull in at home at 45%. Set the car to charge to 70% by 5 am and warm the interior. Plug car in and go to bed. Next morning car doesn't charge overnight and can't make the trip I needed it to do. TOTAL FAIL. TESLA HE I COME TAKE MY MONEY!!!
The 2023’s use SKI batteries the older ones use lG batteries. You can only polish a turd so much.
LOL, as a 2019 VW e-Golf owner, I'm just laughing. ID.4 owners are as much a guinea pig as my fellow e-Golf owners were. VW hasn't even liked to update NAV maps in US cars during warranty, and you're begging for OTA updates?? Carnet 1.0 had the same issues, until 3G systems sunset on 2/22/2022, and VW said "sorry, no 4G solution for our devoted e-Golf owners, that feature and remote pre-heating is broken in your cars forever". As for the 12V battery replacement, VW recommends connecting a charger whenever you're working with ODIS or reflashing the onboard computers with firmware or revised software codings. Starting with fresh 12V batteries on the 2021 cars will just buy VW more time before they start bricking ID.4s in the customer's driveway.
You're not wrong, but my ID.4 really makes me miss my e-Golf. I'm baffled by how many bizarre steps backward they took with this vehicle.
I have a 2021 ID.4 and had no issues at all with the tech ( I must be very lucky). Charging at EA has been a thorn in my side (haven’t used it in months). Fortunately my VW dealer has a free fast charger that I use. Hopefully the issues with 3.1 will be fixed soon. The delay with OTAs is driving me crazy. It was one of reasons I bought the car, otherwise the car is wonderful. Hope springs eternal.
Crappy software in 2022 on an EV is just not acceptable. Tesla has been improving its software over the air for 10 years with a fraction of the resources of VW. VW should be embarrassed
Still needs more 3.1 is ok but …..
I've had an ID4 2021 for 19 months and run 24,000 miles plus on it. Sweet ride, but buggiest software ever written and seems to have decayed. TERRIBLE as a daily commuter car. Promise of software upgrade was initially SUMMER of 2021...!!! So let's get that right. For all the accolades it got initially and the passerby interest, I stopped recommending it over a year ago. "Meh!"
Fact is that I reached the end of my rope with VW... on a drive home: 45 miles with a blacked out screen.... AGAIN. They lost me. Now I can't wait to unload this puppy. Just too many drives interrupted by screen, sound, iphone connection failures that can't be fixed without a complete reboot post powerdown.... and even then, you're lucky it doesn't recur. Currently "interviewing" candidates for a replacement. Tesla Model 3 is so much better in Tech, but the seats... ugh... and can we say, "I might enjoy a Tesla spin, but there's just no chemistry there..... outside of the tech, supercharger network, etc. I'm just not a Tech Bro Elon Groupie. Elon's done an amazing feat of engineering and re-ordering minds from scratch.... but...nah. Glad he has fans though. And yet.... his engineering is five years ahead of the others! Feel like he's Henry Ford... all over again... and as long as you want a jelly bean, you're good.
I prefer other candy.
But would I buy another car from VW Group (VW, Porsche or Audi)? No. SoftwareGate is a reminder that the company that brought you Dieselgate hasn't really changed its stripes. Completely buffaloed by VW.... VW Germany acknowledged all of this fairly early. VW America? NEVER communicated on the issue until 1 year later. Not even a "Thanks for your patience.... we're busy working on it...."????
That said, no matter what anyone says, there is a LOT of demand for EV's that don't conform to having "the Elon Musk" (see the BMW sites on this as it's cited by many for why they ordered non-Teslas). Yipes! And the VW ID4 mechanically, stylistically, storage spacewise, comfortwise.... had SO much going for it. Does it question German manufacture in general? German attitudes toward their drivers? German consumer friendliness? Kind of. And that's a very BIG black eye. But it does it also question whether there's ANY alternative to a Tesla at this point, too? Yeah... kind of.