Volkswagen ID.4 62kWh RWD Takes On The 10% Challenge!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 พ.ค. 2023
- Kyle runs the Volkswagen ID.4 with the 62kWh SK battery pack in the 10% challenge. This simulates the typical driving range on a road trip between chargers if you're planning for 15 minute stops. Enjoy!
10% Challenge Spreadsheet: docs.google.com/spreadsheets/...
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Spreadsheet is in the description. Thanks for watching!
You spelled Handshake wrong. Details invalid (I kid, I kid)!!
Can you do 10% challenge on Ioniq 5 please. I almost went with Id 4 but the leg room was just better in Ioniq 5 back seat. My kids can fit.
I love how this test gives Out of Spec an opportunity to bring back some cars from the old catalog to benchmark them. Let’s see Bolt EV, Mustang Mach-E, the old Leaf, Kona, Niro, etc. Max and Ryan have some work to do!
I still say the name doesn't represent what the test is about. Calling the "15 minute charge challenge" would make much more sense.
Totally agree. Two variables - vehicle charging speed/curve and vehicle efficiency.
+
Especially because eventually this should probably become a 10 minute challenge, then a 5 minute one, while the 10% starting point will probably persist.
I have the 2022 Pro S RWD. Blue not gray and love it. I have not had any issues. 10 months in and 37k of road miles. The driver assist is really great. Best purchase I have done.
Amen. I'm 7K miles in after 3 and half months with our 2023 Pro S and we too love it.
Again I love these tests. This is what real world road trip is like. Much more relevant than the 0-100% and whatever other tests are done by you and other channels. Please continue these tests and I would like to see a spreadsheet with all the data.
Spreadsheet is in the description
@@KyleConner thanks I didn’t realize. That was dumb.
I think the small battery egmp is a very interesting test. I have a 58kwh ioniq 5 and it's super practical road trip car at a lower cost. Yes I stop more often, but each stop is 10 to 20 mins. It really just requires more stations along your route.
You might have your car in Europe since that battery size is not sold in the USA or Canada.
@@nevco8774 Hyundai sells a 58 kWh Ioniq 5 and soon a 53 kWh battery pack Ioniq 6 in the US.
Good test idea. I would still pick this car over TMY - VW is more quiet, has great suspension, blind spot indicators, doesn't have always-on sunroof (hot in summer), parking and rain sensors, lamp above back seats, build quality and many more features.
Oddly, I find there is more wind noise in the ID.4 than the Y -- but it sounds better over bumps than the Y, IMO. Lack of heat pump in the winter has a major impact on range though.
I had a 2021 for 14 months. The software was atrocious. The 2021 MY cars still have April 2021 software. VW is not holding up their end of the bargain on updates in the US. Their software is still inferior to most everyone else. Good build quality doesn't matter when you cant interact with the car because the screen, or voice control, isn't working. This is coming for a two decade long VAG fan.
@@jason5031 The new software is better. And like the Op stated VW give you better ride, and generally better build quality.
@@jonpetter8921 That's probably true, except for those pesky door mechanisms...
Looking forward for the IONIQ 5 test
I would like to see the EV6 GT-Line as well
Loving this year, definitely my new favorite. Really looking forward to the standard range model 3.
We have a RWD 2021 Pro S w/gradient. Had it a little over a year and zero issues. Our 2022 Tesla Model 3 with the LFP battery has it beat in many categories but Out of Spec gave us the idea to get our ID4 at the time and we absolutely love it. Great video Kyle! Thank you!!
And you did it again. Made a reasonable pricing comparison. Respect, Kyle
This should be an interesting one. One thing to consider, Kyle, is that you might run into an issue with these Delta chargers if someone else shows up and wants to charge because it will split power. Even split, it might still max out the ID.4, but some of the other faster charging EVs could be impacted if someone shows up during the 15-min charge.
Yes. I’m ready to open all the doors and block that spot should anyone pull in 😅 haha joking of course, would just have to unplug and re-drain battery
Stopping every 2 hours on a road trip is a common safety recommendation so about 160 of your miles in this test is the target. This is a really valuable real world comparison and makes the often quoted eGMP 18m 10-80% all the more relevant although I found I was charging every 2nd stop on my first road trip for no particular reason?
Love your tests! Thank you for your work. I enjoyed your Assisted Driving of BMW i4 test and would love to see same test of the IQ Sense from VW. Great content, keep it up!
Good to see content on a vehicle that's been around for a while
like thiis challenge kyle represents real world driving keep them coming
Waiting for this test with the KIA EV6 RWD. Would probably be comparable to the Taycan. I could do this test myself but I don't typically cruise at 80 here in Michigan.
Do this with Kia ev6 RWD wind. it might do 150 miles. I got 180 miles at 70 mph
I have what might be one of the last ID.4 big battery from Germany - took delivery in October 2022 - still got the tax credit. I never had the issues others have had, I think because mine came with the 3.1 software. It is a moonstone grey, but white interior - I love it! They are def things id like to change - like the plug and charge should be there, and battery precondition!!
I test drove the ID.4 back in 2021 and found it a *really* nice package...except for the software. Just during the 15 minute test drive, I encountered multiple glitches with the infotainment and controls. If VW can finally get their software sorted, I'd love to own one.
Thanks for the review. I'm a three and half month 2023 VW ID.4 Pro S owner and love it. Yes, had the Tesla Model Y then been priced at what it is now, I might have reconsidered. More tech than Tesla, no, of course not, or only when I'm dreaming 😅. Yet, far more stylist and distinguished. The infotainment system could be better. All in all, I could easily recommend this car for anyone. Again, thanks, and God bless,
I love the happy warrior. It seems it is so easy for people to just grump about everything. I have had my id4 for 6 months and put almost 100 miles on it every day. I could not be more happy with it. I bought the “wrong” one with awd and most of the bells and whistles. I regret nothing. I hope everyone out there with their ev is as happy as I am.
I know I am. I have an ID-4 AWD Pro "S" and I love it.
The 10% challenge should be part of the EPA rating i think.
I like these tests.
Thanks for all the testing you do! Very informative! Which car scan app are you using and does it require connected hardware?
The reason of the high voltage is that is has 108s2p configuration. The 77kWh pack has 96s3p. So it is 12 cells more x 3.6 volt in serial
Really like the spreadsheet. Probably worth having a column that shows "total" refuel time along with the "15 minutes" of charging. What is interesting is the ratio of time driven to time charging. You spend 15 minutes charging (need to add around 10min to get into the station, hooked up and then unhooked) to drive 60min to 90min, depending upon the car/configuration. Most every ICE based vehicle can get at least 4-6 hours of highway driving on a full tank of fuel with 10-15min of refueling time. Would be interesting to see how the EV's compare with the same 4-6 hours of highway driving.
Cant wait to see Dave's M3 on this test
Loves these test, thanks for all the work you do. Will you be doing any testing with the Cadillac Lyriq? I am really interested in that car and have one on order.
Kyle will test a Lyriq, iff Qadillac builds ONE…
Kyle, Keep up the great work and 2 thumbs up for saving the data in a spreadsheet for future reference. It would be great if this could be done with your historical range test, etc.
Keep on testing!!!
Any chance you could start adding a graphic at the end with all results so we can see how this compares to the other cars you’ve tested? Rankings? I LOVE THESE VIDEOS!!!!
As far as i have seen in your range test video, this car has a much better charging curve than my ID.3 with the 62kWh LG battery.
It would be great to have a comparable 10% test of a standard RWD Tesla model Y, also to see the difference of a long-range compared to a standard for roadtrips.
The Model Y AWD (standard range) would be a better test, seeing as the RWD is no longer available in the states
HI Kyle,
First 10% test I’ve watched. I like the concept. Not sure I’d push my EV to 80 for road tripping, just asking to waste range, but as a stress test, I guess you get an extra bump when a maker really values aero as well as charging!
Are you tabulating the results?
Thanks!!
Couple comments and suggestions.
1) Given the nature of this test (I.e. simulating a real world road trip w/ 15 min stops vs a controlled, scientific range / charge speed test), II would think that the 15 minutes should include wrestling the cable into the charge port, dealing with the port doors, payment, handshake, everything. If it takes a full minute to get plugged in, make a payment and wait for a long handshake before it actually starts charging, THEN you start the timer, it's actually a 16 minute stop. I know it's not much, but a plug-and-charge ev with a fast handshake should be rewarded for that good user experience rather than penalized and have to wait 45 seconds after the "charging stop" has begun.
2) I know it would add quite a bit to your editing work, but having a graphic overlay with the leaderboard at the end of the video would sure be nice as these roll out. it would gamify the 10% challenge and make me want to see the next one even more (I often watch these on my TV with a remote and getting to the description / spreadsheet is all but impossible
@Out_of_Spec, the 58kwh ioniq 5 and ev6 should give you almost 100miles.
Its a heck of a good deal and you should fine one to test.
Latest rumor is that the ID4 will be sharing ID7 motor and other attachments. Giving it more efficiency, range and power. Not to mention battery enhancements.
Very interesting challenge. Looking forward to the 77 kWh battery. 🙂
Love my ID.4!!!
Friends of mine just bought a big battery RWD model. In our area AWD models don't exist at any dealers. They wanted an AWD but settled for a RWD.
Agreed on the ID.4 being much better than people give it credit for! If a sweet deal on a Polestar 2 hadn't come up this would have been the exact car we would have ended up with (except with the lighter interior).
2k more and you get a 279 mile awd Texas built model y though. More tech, more range, better safety, better charging etc.
And more places to service it to. The legacy oems are terrible for locations with more than 1 ev certified tech on staff&available.
This should be what vw originally said and start at 37k with decent options go up to maybe 40k.
It would be great if you could create a shared excel sheet with results like Bjorn does for his tests. That way we can refer to the results later and compare. Thanks!
It’s in the description!
@@KyleConnershow it on the screen at the end I never look in the description
I like the premise of this test. I wish the infrastructure was more consistent for it.
The Model 3 LR is probably the road trip king. Has access to the supercharger network and can easily go over 100 miles after a 15-20 minute top off. The Taycan has to rely on CCS networks 😬
Can’t wait to see the ioniq 5 77kw battery pack awd 10% test.
It seems the 2024 model addresses my concerns - much more powerful RWD, ventilated seats and better infotainment.
Other than the infotainment/control cluster I really like my ID.4. I may even like it more than my Mach e. It's really close between the two.
its nice to see that they've improved infotainment performance to a rate that's acceptable, its a shame it took them like 3 years, but hey, praise where its due
Not sure 80 is a good representation nationwide. Maybe in the west but here in Virginia for example, anything over 80 gets you a reckless driving ticket.
I think it's okay because it could just been seen as worst case/ extreme conditions .Would also give similar results at lower speed in very cold/hot weather.
Kyle drives 85 - though the Rockies - in winter - with no hands- while talking AND filming. Glad he doesn’t live near me. I’ve been dead: didn’t like it…
Have you done the rear wheel drive big battery 10% challenge yet? I have the 2023 ID.4 and was wondering 🤘🏼
I think you might also be impressed by the KIA EV6 RWD Wind. Based on my testing and the data I gathered when reviewing it, the EV6 should easily hit 150+ miles on this test in good conditions, but it was really designed with this exact style of travel in mind (i.e., the charger-hopping style of EV travel Tesla has really pushed with their trip planners).
what's not impressive is the price of that car (lack of federal tax credit)
@@nickbien How, exactly, is that the fault of the car?
@@nickbien When I reviewed it, the EV6 Wind was $48,000 sticker. Yes, the lack of a Tax Credit hurts, but it looks like that's being baked into the cost because most places look to be listing it for at least $4,000 to $5,000 less. Considering it has a much nicer interior and better build quality than the Tesla Model Y for a similar MSRP, I think many people would still consider it. And if long trip times are a major consideration, you can't really compare the EV6 to the ID.4.
@@newscoulomb3705 I had a 2022 Ioniq5 Limited. I really disagree with you on nice interior and quality of materials and construction. Had a MachE 4EX Premium and Tesla MYLR, both far superior to the Ioniq5.
@@DiscoveryOwners I'm talking about the EV6, not the Ioniq 5. I don't have much experience with the Ioniq 5 other than sitting in one, but based on my experience with the EV6 Wind, its interior is at least as nice as the Mach-E Route 1, so we could have a discussion about it versus the Mach-E Premium interior. Again, though, the Mach-E is not even in the same league as the EV6 in terms of travel times.
The Model Y, in my experience, has neither the built quality nor comfort level of any of the cars in this discussion. Maybe Tesla has improved recently, but they don't offer press cars for review, which makes it hard for a car reviewer to comment on.
Kyle, thank you and your entire team for all you do. Keep up the great work! If you know anyone who is willing to buy me a Tesla Model 3, let me know. I’d gladly accept it.
Would love to see you test the EV6!
It should be the rear wheel drive large battery. It would do quite well.
Would love to see the Ioniq 6 RWD performance on this test. I kind of feel it would blast beyond the taycan at a fraction of the price.
Will you do a spreadsheet for all of these tests?
What app are you using on your iPhone for the readings of information on the car? And what OBD2 reader do you use?
I’ve never gotten my id.4 below 15% 😂 I don’t know how you can roll up to a charger at 1% so calm
You should ask Winnebago if you can test out their eRV, make it a 2 part crossover video with your overlanding channel
I am holding out for a blue one :P
80mph is kinda fast for us east coasters. Maybe Tom can do that at 70mph for us east coasters
You would be pissed if you spent $17,000 USD MORE than it is today. WOW, I would be very angry at Tesla if that was me.
You’d be even more pissed is the Twitter guy that sold all his stocks to buy just one stock: Tesla, only to watch it fall off a cliff. And he bought a Tesla at its highest price. Lol life’s not that bad
Wondering how this stacks up vs a Bolt on a road trip: like 60 less miles range but like twice the charging speed. Wondering also if the dead-base ID.4 actually exists at dealers.
Ha! Tried to find this model. It's MSRP is $38,995 for the ID.4 Standard with 19" wheels and $43,995 for the ID.4 S with the 20" wheels (the one in the video). None in inventory. There wasn't a single ID.4 in inventory under $50,000.
Would the upcoming Chevy Equinox be a competitor of this base ID4?
LG pack at 10% and warm temp will pull close to 170-180 KW max with the 3.1 update
What would you recommend vw id4 gtx vs skoda enyaq iv 80x sportline
EGMP test please!
That’s where my wife and I charge ours! We have two of those hahah
Are we getting a 0%-100% charging video on this car? I'm curious to see the charging curve throughout the entirety of the session. Thanks!
Anyone done a 0-60 test on the small battery ID4? Thinking it should be quicker with the weight reduction...
About the same price as a Model Y. Think I will take the Y.
So what I’d like to see is a playlist specifically dedicated to public charging only. Help those of us who don’t have access to home charging make that decision. See what that experience is like. Tesla vs those other brands.
Will you share a google doc with your findings?
are you going to do the 10% challenge with the R1T?
It's not the ID4 that's the issue. It's a nice car with good reviews. The problem, like you said before, is some drivers of the ID4 that give the car a bad name.
To generalize, "they" seem inconsiderate at both charging stations and on the road. Kinda like drivers of certain higher end German cars.
This video is loading at 360p to me, in the TV... Super weird pixels! 😢
Has the big battery Kia RWD EV6 been tested with this test? I would think that it would do about 180 miles after 15 minutes of charge wouldn’t it?
It hasn’t yet, the gv60 or gv70 did 10-70 in 15 minutes so I would estimate the Kia ev6 rwd would get 125-140 miles off of 46kwhr
Is this LFP battery pack or NCM ?
All VWs are just what a car should be.
11:52 FYI..."This ones a Pro S" - actually it's an S, minus the Pro part. Reference 3:55 for a window sticker shot.
They have changed the steering wheel to animal free, this is why it feels different. The refresh with the big screen and the 280 horsepower Motor will be perfect.
From my limited experience the travel assist is actually better to use than Tesla's auto-pilot. No phantom braking, capacitive touch steering wheel, doesn't put a death grip on the car (have both Y and the ID.4 in our household).
Yeah, I own an ID4 and rented a model Y for a week while my ID4 was being repaired after hitting a deer. The Model Y was good in terms of charging speed and range, but I found the ID4 to be much more comfortable overall. Travel assist is better, the speedometer is in a better spot, seats are perforated so you don't sweat as much, there's a cover for the sunroof so you don't bake on a sunny day, capacitive steering wheel is so much better than the finicky torque based autopilot, the ID4 absorbs bumps so much better, and the list goes on. The Model Y is certainly impressive if you just look at the spec sheet, but the ID4 is just so much nicer to actually drive.
Hmmm... looking at the spreadsheet the 10% challenge is significantly influenced by peak charging speed - 99% of chargers in Australia are 150kw or less - I think there are fewer than 10 chargers in the whole of Australia capable of 250kw+
tesla model 3 base did:
260 Wh/mi = 3.84 mi/kWh
and 106 miles in total
this vw id.4 did 23:25 :
400 Wh/mi = 2.5 mi/kWh
and 60 miles in total
Should be rating cars based on highest possible total road trip travel speed. For example, ID.4 here only went 60mph.
Great video! Can you do Alyssa's E Tron in the 10% challenge? I think that would be a good baseline for all these newer EVs to go against 4 year old technology.
Whatever is sitting on the binnacle looks like a Raspberry Pi DIY project.
You have to include handshake time from the 15 minute charge, otherwise its just a pointless test. In the real world you are always going to have to wait for those handshakes as part of your charging time, not including them is biased against any company that put effort into reducing them as part of their charging strategy.
Wow, the Volkswagen ID.4 is truly impressive!
I think this is the S trim. Pro S have the better materials
Everybody keeps talking about how cheap the model Y is now, but when I checked with my insurance, the model Y would cost me $1200 per year more than an I’d.4. Is that normal? I mean, paying that much more for insurance is going to feel like paying an extra $10,000 on the purchase price, and that extra cost doesn’t go away when when the loan is paid off☹️ Am I the only one getting outrageously higher insurance quotes on Teslas vs similar cars from other brands?
Sandy Munro described it best as a grandfathers car 😂
That sandy guy is an absolute beating to listen to. Repeats himself over and over, EVERY video.
VW is finally just now getting their software straightened out … not sure I’d want to wait for “their new and improved” software 😂
Love this testing method Kyle! I have hopes for the Aptera. It might only charge at 40+kw, but that could get it over 100+ miles due to incredible aerodynamic efficiency of 10miles/kwh. I guess we will have to see if the first Aptera builds achieve those goals and how little 80mph effects the Aptera efficiency.
Why is the 10% test a look style test if it’s meant to mimic a road-trip? Wouldn’t it just need to to go one direction?
It more or less offsets if you have headwind going out with tailwind coming back. It would be difficult to have to find days with similar wind conditions for all cars.
Great video but I was told by local car dealer that if an EV goes under 20% the car just stops 🤔
You realize that the salesdolt thinks your name is Stuart Pidd…
Walked past an ID.4 this morning and I noticed it had drum brakes. How do you feel about that?
I had one, they're terrible. The pads would rust and seize to the drums when it rained or snowed. Other than that issue, not a big deal. You had regen braking on the rear axel.
Makes no difference. Almost all braking is regen anyway. My front pads look brand new 9,000 miles in and the rear wheels are dust free.
Havnt had an issue with the wet winters of the Pacific Northwest. They're fine, primary stopping happens on the front wheels anyway. My understanding is they went with drums to circumnavigate the common rotor corrosion associated with lack of physical braking usage.
@@wzDH106 As I understand, the early cars had shoes with too much iron. Which caused the shoes rusting/siezing to the drums. I had to press on the accelerator to make the shoes break loose. Had to drop the car off to service 3 times before they'd replace the shoes with newer ones.
The pro s is awd now
Good test but is it representative to use an ultra rare 350kw charger?
I don't think it will matter.. the car never pulled more than 133KW. So it would get the same on a 150KW charger. He mentioned the high pack voltage helping on lesser chargers due to there AMP limitations.
Also he is testing what the car is capable of.. and many of the cars can pull well over 150KW.. so he will need that lever of charger to make those cars get the best score they can. Better to try and use the same charger for all the test.
@@kens97sto171 you are totally right. I more was talking about the top test results of the taycan. I live in one of the largest cities in the country and have not seen a 350kw EA charger.
@@dyhppyx
I would say for city use you don't really need one. You would be charging at home most of the time.
There are 350 kW chargers spread all the way across the country at every EA station. Whether they're online and working that's a whole different question. EA's had some definite reliability problems over the last couple years.
But every station has it least two 350 kW chargers.
On a long road trip going across country that's where you would want the really high speed charging.
But I imagine there are people in dense cities that don't have a place to plug in at home and so they're dependent upon public charging networks.. that would kind of suck.
I think if that was my situation I would just stick with gasoline or a hybrid.
@@kens97sto171 I understand what you mean. I know that the 350s would be best used in the boonies but my point was that they can’t be that ubiquitous if I can’t even find one. Or maybe I’m just an idiot.
@@dyhppyx
There may not be any in the dense city environments. That's where a lot of the chargers went in first and a lot of them were pretty low power and haven't been replaced yet. I hear stuff like that from people that live out in California also except for the Tesla supercharger network.
There's still a lot of 50 kilowatt chargers around in the urban environments.
But if you take a look at electrify America's network they all have at least two 350 kW chargers.
But reliability is definitely questionable.. at least for now.
I'm in the market in the next year or so, and while I don't really love the interior on Teslas I think they're pretty boring. This is mostly a work vehicle for me. And so you need to pick the best tool for the job. Tesla has a lot they've done right. Plus I do take road trips and I don't really want to deal with the hassles of coming upon a charger that isn't working and strands me. So I'm probably going to be looking at a Tesla even though I don't particularly love the interior design. But it is eminently practical...
I am one of them that I don’t want to buy a Tesla. Why? I was part of Phase 1 installation in Tesla, Austin, TX and I wasn‘t impressed of the Tesla management to say the least. Nope, I had it, I don’t buy a Tesla.
What is “Phase 1?”
@@FrunkensteinVonZipperneck Phase 1 was 1000 vehicle per week, Phase 2 was 5000 vehicles per week and Phase 3 is 10,000 vehicles per week.