You Might Have Missed This Detail in Final Fantasy 7 Remake | Road to Rebirth Part 2
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 25 ส.ค. 2024
- Welcome to part 2 of my Final Fantasy 7 Remake mini series Road to Rebirth. In this series I am replaying through FF7R, recapping the story while adding in some theories regarding the events of the game. In part 1 I covered the start of the game up to Mako Reactor 5. In this part I am covering Mako Reactor 5 up to Wall Market. #finalfantasy7remake #finalfantasyviiremake #finalfantasy7
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I think when Cloud sheds the tear it's because seeing Aerith walking away from him triggers some sort of emotional memory from the original game - When he sees aerith in a dream in the sleeping forest, running away to go face Sephiroth. Even the begging of the scene with her peeking from behind a corner is a nice allusion to the original sleeping forest scene, where Aerith does the same movement
He' remembering Zack. Everything Cloud has a vision of Aeroth we as the player see it. But when Zack is mentioned we don't. Aerith walks away and we don't see it, Zack also walked away from him and has a connection to Zack, so I think when Cloud is remembering Zack, we as the player don't see it.
It's not about zack, it's about Aerith. The only time he has a seizure about zack is when he literally hears his name. It's clearly an allusion to the cloud and aerith sleeping forest scene
It is confirmed by developers
you know, her walking away reminds me of the the final scene from Advent Children where Aeris does the same thing and leaves with Zack.
Also don’t forget, when Reno busts into the church, Aerith declares Cloud as her bodyguard and a SOLDIER, which at this point, Cloud had not disclosed with her. She also try’s convincing him that bodyguard work isn’t so different from merc work, which yet again was something he had not shared. It is definitely the case that Aerith knows a lot more than she should.
My guess is she recognizes the buster sword as being zack's?
@@PlayerVersusGame you aren’t wrong, but even in OG, Aerith comments on how similar Cloud is to Zach in his actions and mannerisms. On the date, on the gondola she says she wants to know the real Cloud, which implies she is aware he isn’t really his own person, which is definitely shown late game.
@@PlayerVersusGame It was pretty obvious. As Jared already said she knows he's a merc without Cloud ever mentioning it. She also knows his name before he ever told her his name. On the Don Corneo questline she recognizes Tifa even though she never met her.
There are tons of situations where it's made pretty obvious that she knows stuff from the future by her words alone. And that's not even taking into account how the characters behave. Story writers aren't gonna just put things into a conversation without it serving a point. People being taken aback by Aerith randomly knowing stuff about them and her stuttering out excuses is not a coincidence or just there to have filler conversations. And that happens pretty often.
Also regarding Reno, I think the plate would've still fallen, because just as Tseng said, if they didn't do it, someone else would've completed the job.
@@Au_Ra804 Didn’t she saw Tifa on the carriage at the playground scene b4 Corneo scene.
@@MergedElement oh yeah, that could be it.
Aerith already knows Cloud from the beginning of the game, she gives him a flower as a memory of her reunion with Cloud, and this flower sets fate into action. But whispers sometimes take away her memories. I think a lot of people should stop bringing Zack into every interaction between Cloud and Aerith, because the relationship between Cloud and Aerith is very deep and important. If you're doing theories, I suggest reading Ultimania for the game, which explains the scenes. For example, a tear due to the fact that precious time with Aerith evokes feelings from the future, where she leaves him in the forest. His mom talks about girl like Aerith, it was in UT for OG. Many moments are written in Ultimania, for example one of the most important ones is when Aerith says not to fall in love, she contradicts her feelings, and this is connected with her future death.
10:00 I'm pretty sure that in the original game, the conversation between Cloud and himself is supposed to be referring to Cloud falling back at Mt. Nibel as a child. This is indirectly referenced in the OG game when Tifa and Cloud fall into the lifestream. Here's a line taken from the fandom wiki:
Cloud: I don't remember the path I walked. Tifa missed her step. I ran to her...but didn't make it in time. Both of us fell off the cliff. Back then, I only scarred my knees but......
The precise nature of why and how Cloud is talking to himself in that way in the OG isn't super clear to me. My understanding is that he's lost his memories because of Jenova's influence (who is actively rewriting his memories each time he gets a headache) together with the lifestream exposure (wherein a person may lose their sense of self because the lifestream is like a sea of consciousness or something) -- so it could be that part of his consciousness is in the lifestream and speaking to him or that he's momentarily breaking through Jenova's control, idk.
Tifa also talks about that fall to some extent in the Remake Novella "Final Fantasy VII Remake: Trace of Two Pasts". That novella has Tifa recounting her past to Barrett, Aerith, and Red XIII after traveling through Kalm. It's been a while since I read it but part of the story is about her childhood in Nibel and then about how she ended up in Midgar and was initially taken advantage of before eventually ending up at 7th Heaven. It also talks about Barret's past and how he ended up there and the whole thing is worth reading.
that scene is basically a hint that he has repressed memories (and a repressed personality really), it's foreshadowing that he took zack's persona. he's being spoken to by his true self from before the shinra mansion incident
An interesting factoid about Cloud's mom wanting him to have an older girlfriend. While it's not mentioned in game, according to the manual for the original game, Cloud is 21 years old, Aerith is 22, and Tifa is 20.
Yeah that scene was pretty much Cloud thinking that his mom wanted a girl like Aerith for him, I think he mostly thought about her personality wise because I don’t think he knew she was older than him.
@@Zero-fx8pc Its writting in ultimania for OG that Clouds mom talking about Aerith type of girlfriend
5:24 As far as I am aware, the Wutai War not won; there was only a ceasefire as Cloud explains in Belly Of The Beast.
10:35 I don't think Reno was going to take Aerith back to Shinra; I think Reno was sent to make sure Aerith was okay since Mako Reactor 5 *just* blew up above the church.
Back to that Cloud falling scene and the scene showing another Cloud/Sephiroth. In Advent Children, newly revived Sephiroth asks Cloud “What is it you cherish? Tell me so that I may take it away from you.”
Cloud replies “There’s nothing that I don’t cherish”, meaning “I cherish everything.”
Fast forward to FF7R and Cloud is falling. He asks who Sephiroth is. Sephiroth answers “I am your everything.”
Also in FF7R you fight the one winged Sephiroth, which first appeared in Kingdom Hearts but canonically first appeared in Advent Children and parallels when Bizarro Sephiroth (called “Reborn Sephiroth” in Japanese 😉) became Safer Sephiroth during the Lifestream’s event horizon and he becomes godlike/sprouts a wing.
I think all of this supports a continuation like you say.
Random fact of the day. Sephiroth in Kingdom Hearts 1 was voiced by Nsync member, Lance Bass.
if reno had been killed in the church it would've had no impact whatsoever on platefall. reno's just a grunt, he has no influence on shinra's decision-making. i don't think the whispers were acting in a cause-and-effect manner like that, they just stepped in to preserve events pretty much as they occurred originally, and originally reno survived the events of the game. it's only after the whispers are defeated that peoples' fates start to diverge, specifically with zack & wedge.
cloud's little moment when he falls into the church is a reference to him & tifa falling at mt nibel as children. outside of sephiroth making an appearance i think it serves the same purpose as in the original: to show that cloud has repressed memories. he's being spoken to by his younger self from before he was experimented on in the shinra mansion, before he locked away his old self and assumed zack's persona.
as far as aerith & sephiroth knowing the original game's sequence of events, yeah that's been accepted for ages at this point. aerith specifically seems to know things she shouldn't, and some of sephiroth's dialogue and actions appear to suggest that he knows he lost the first time around. he wants rid of the whispers because they're trying to preserve a reality where he's ultimately defeated, so he welcomes the party's destruction of them at the end of remake
Comment after I finished Rebirth, but back when I was playing Remake, it's hinted numerous times that Remake is like a second run for Aerith, Cloud and Sephiroth. Sephiroth obviously knows a lot more than his OG counterpart. Aerith has so many moments where she let things slip about things she could not have possibly known except for an Aerith that has gone through the OG events, and Cloud himself has so many flash-forwards to memories of events that has not happened yet, which is why I theorized that Remake is a stealth sequel to Advent Children.
Cloud most likely is going to sacrifice himself for aerith with the seven second hint that good sephiroth gave him. Jenova sephiroth has seven seconds to stab aerith which in turn dooms the world as what we know in ff7 original.
Cloud might succeed in saving her which ends in his death. But get revived by the jenova cells within him to attend the reunion. And end turn we play as Zack for a portion of the game to save cloud
They've already said that zero major plot points will change in the entire remake.
@@missionmetaverse5240 They Lied. Also though, I think there are actually gonna be two completely playable timelines. One in which the OG happens pretty much the same as it did and one in which things are completely, wildly different. A multiverse, if you will. They kinda showed hints of this in the trailer for Rebirth, and makes some sense given the ending bosses for Remake. If that turns out to be true, I wonder how the 3rd game (and beyond?) will make it all back into one canon timeline in the end...
@jacobwendlandt6357 , how can you say they lied? Absolutely nothing has changed in part one. The entire trailer is misdirection for Rebirth. They are doing this just to get people talking. I seriously doubt we are getting an alternate timeline. More likely, it's a world that exists post death in the lifestream.
@@missionmetaverse5240 they lied multiple times, they said the story will be the same before remake came out, come to find out it’s completely changed. What are you trying to say?? That the game is 100% the same? If so you are delusional
@@missionmetaverse5240 What about the Whispers, The Fate boss battles, and the declaration by Aerith that "Fate Changed"?? As far as the they lied comment, the developers have contradicted themselves at least twice when promoting Rebirth, and it's not just marketing. As far as the two timelines theory, how do you explain Zack being a major playable character then? Anyway I can't wait to find out!
Also in the conversation at the church, we can tell that she's just reciting the same lines as before and already knows what Cloud is going to say. Reno comes in a little earlier than expected, so she has to hurry up and bring up the date as exchange for him being her bodyguard and she also already knows that he's a mercenary without any prompts from him.
I like this. My only thing is about the mercenary comment, don't you think she took a wild guess based off of her recognizing the buster sword as zack's?
@@PlayerVersusGame I would think her first guess would be that he also works for Soldier, considering that he also has the same uniform, rather than being a mercenary.
I'm thinking her holy stone has a secondary ability, it grants the user a wish and maybe the remake is the reincarnation of all the characters.🤔
Thing alot of people sort of misunderstand, throughout the first half of dusc 1 aerith was aerith.
Once aerith reaches the ancient temple she changes massively,
This makes sense because of what she learned, but what she learned I believe was when we reached the room of rolling stones and there was a fountain of truth/memory.
This is where I believe aerith gets the info she needs, but in remake this seems to already be the case.
Maybe that fountain is a memory card for the planet.
In addition when the party is in Aerith’s room she tells them Shrina isn’t the real enemy. Tifa then asks Aerith “what are you not telling us”? Aerith then goes silent, followed by the Whipers showing up.
While you havent discussed it to the end of the game yet, the impression i got through playing remake was that aerith basically remembers the entirety of the original timeline, and would rarher not go through it again, cloud gets flashes of it, and sephiroth is actively trying to prevent a rehash, though whether he is hoping to win this timw or.not i cant entierly tell.
Yea makes sense. It's interesting playing it and making these videos as I go because I'll have so many thoughts/theories and then I read comments and in like "shit, they make more sense than I do"
Square confirmed on their "X" account last year that Aerith has "future memories" that she shouldn't have. How did she get them? Projecting them back to herself through the lifestream somehow probably seems like a good bet at this point. Lifestream Black and Lifestream White make it clear that AC Sephiroth is plotting within the lifestream and that Aerith is watching him - I think Sephiroth likely figured out how to do it, and then Aerith followed suit. I don't think Cloud's doing it though, I think it's more likely that he's picking up on the memories that Aerith has, as if she's emanating them somehow. Unintentionally at first, and then intentionally later on (Red XIII definitely, Marlene perhaps).
The episode Cloud has when Aerith says Zach's name I think is because Aerith is remembering him and Cloud picks up on the memory which is a direct contradiction/challenge to the false memory his own mind had constructed.
I have mixed feelings around Aerith's resolution scene in Chapter 14. I can't make up my mind whether it's Aerith projecting herself into Cloud's dream like she did in the OG in the sleeping forest, or whether it's lifestream Aerith manifesting herself (again in his dream). Either way, if you listen to her dialogue in that scene it seems very much like she has the future knowledge. "All the words, all the memories we've shared", she's only known Cloud for a few days at this point in the game... If this is Lifestream White-era Aerith then I think the dialogue makes much more sense.
People will get bogged down with whether this is a remake or a sequel. This is Nomura and Nojima we're talking about, it won't be THAT straight forward....lol
Really good Video.
In regards to if Cloud HAD killed Reno then Events might not play out the way they should with the plate. HOWEVER in this situation I'd imagine the Whispers would havejust used their Rez powers on him to bring him back to life.
Aerith definitely knows the events of the original game and who Cloud is. (Some Examples)
Just prior to the fight Aerith mentions that "Bodyguard work isn't too different from Merc Stuff" and she guessed "From the Sword" Cloud never mentions to her that he's a Merc prior to this.
Halfway through her sidequest line she mentions that he can't rely on her as she won't be around for ever.
At the conclusion of her sidequestline in the talking with flowers scene she mentions that "I've been working my butt off today because today is special" When Cloud ask's why it's so special she just leans forward and stares at him before laughing and walking away. It's special because she got to spend the time with him.
If she does indeed know the events of OG this has VERY different implications for the Playground scene.
OG she doesn't mention Zack by name but here she clearly mentions his name.......but not to hear about Zack but to try and break through Cloud's PTSD and alternate personality he has created and make him realize who he truly is. The disappointment she shows after not getting a response isn't because Cloud tells her nothing of Zack, but due to the fact she wasn't able to help him find himself.
Sorry for the long text wall but just some things I felt were relevant to mention. looking forward to the next Video.
You make excellent points and I'm editing part 4 as we speak!!
I'm not exactly sure how the Whispers could have justifiably resurrected Reno if Cloud either beheaded him or crushed his skull to a pulp with that Buster Sword of his tho. Probably why both Aerith and the Whispers protested loudly.
I think alot of people are going to be mindblown to find out at end of Rebirth we will learn Cloud has been in the lifestream in Mideel the whole time during Remake and Rebirth and all these “flashbacks” are happening while Tifa helps Cloud regain himself.
I've got a little theory that I've never heard anyone talk about. The cetra aka the ancients are supposed to find the so called "promised land" that's supposedly overflowing with mako. And that's why Shinra wants aerith. However, no one ever considers one simple theory. Maybe the cetra had already found the promises land i.e. Gaia. The planet they're already on might be the so called promised land and that's why no one can find it. Cuz everyone is already there and Shinra is already sucking up all the mako.
Yea when Zack dies, it's seen his life goes back to the lifestream, possibly at that moment where she opens her eyes after seeing the green lifestream. So it could actually be her knowing Zack just died.
Aerith is a whole bag of paradox during the church segment lol. She says she guessed hes a merc from the sword (plausible) but how does she know he's SOLDIER? (Well not technically but you know 😅). Also saying shall we mosey on over the rooftops like cloud did in northern crater after defeating sephiroth?
I really like the idea that Aerith knows whats happening by seeing it in the lifestream in the beginning but wouldn't that mean she had knowledge of events in OG as she starts the game by looking into that same exposed life stream? Maybe it's a continuous loop that potentially has many different variations that closely align with each other, each version of Aerith doing what SHE thinks they need to do. OG Aerith always seemed to know more than she let on and we pretty much put it down to her being an Ancient but remake Aerith seems to have a slightly different strategy. Maybe she's deliberately leaving breadcrumbs for him to find his way back sooner because she knows they need Cloud to defeat Sephiroth.
Sephiroth I believe has similar powers to Aerith and he also knows about the events of OG (maybe his direct connection to the lifestream showed him what it showed Aerith) though I'm not entirely convinced his motives are still exactly the same. Maybe they're just grander therefore requiring different methods for him to get what he wants.
A few ideas I've had while playing looking forward to what happens with rebirth. Already preordered 😊
I definitely think she knows of the og events when looking into the lifestream. I'm also inclined to believe remake sephiroth and OG spehiroth are one and the same. When we get to Shinra tower ill elaborate.
@@PlayerVersusGame I definitely believe that Sephiroth is powerful enough to project himself to Jenova clones across timelines
Did you talk about janovha cells and the ability to mimic. This also has a factor to why cloud has zaxks memories
I'll very transparent, I haven't covered the cells. I'm currently editing part 4 now and in it I do cover them to a degree. That said, I'm also doing research as I write out my outline to make sure I cover as much as I can in am effort to make some sense in my theories and also for the sake of sharing the lore. Until tofsy inwas ignorant regarding the cells but NOW a lot of things make sense. Particularly a scene with hojo. And thanks for the kind words, glad you liked the video!
The Crisis Core Reunion spoils why Cloud defeated Sephiroth: whisper smoke. It wasn't his win. So the plot ghosts filled the plot hole -- Cloud's super strength prior to his J cell infusion. Very good, Nomura.
So yes, Remake is a sequel where Aerith and Sephiroth are trying to change a remade timeline. And Rebirth reveals a multiverse going on, which will collapse (thus "saving the world") into a Reborn world. Cloud's memories are somehow suppressed in Remake, whereas in FF7, Zack's memories overwrote some of Cloud's memories. Stranger of Paradise shows a unique relationship between memory and the ability to change one's future, as Jack's memories are also suppressed as he repeats the same timeline cycle. Yeah, it's not coincidence. Narrative agency is the literary term for characters who can change the plot -- like how we easily understand Rufus can change things since he can see the whispers. So Remake explores this topic.
Bro. I love that theory that in the beginning of remake arieth is the original arieth. First time I heard it was a TH-cam content creator name Ray Coffman. (Check him out, he's awesome). I seriously think sepheroth and aireth is from the original game. I freaking love remake and the original. I subbed to ur channel. See u real soon
Thanks!!! I love remake and this (re)playthrough has been great!
@@PlayerVersusGame I still haven't beat the arbeners of fate on hard mode yet. Freaking hard
Hi there, Koniving again. Hopefully you saw my message on the first video. Again would love to collab and discuss. In the meantime...
About the Wutai war, as per the remake world preview which chronicles the events of Before Crisis leading into remake, the war occured and world preview edits the before crisis events to make thw war conclude several months after the original conclusion. Aside from this retcon, it is referred to by Shinra characters as a cease fire, and by civilians and NPCs as the war ended. In remake outside the Shinra building Cloud refers to it as a cease fire. However in the chapters before the few references you can find in random civilian conversations talking about avalanche and Wutai indicate the war ended, and they think Wutai is trying to start a new war.
White space is called "white world.". From Ultimania omega, this is supposed to be a mix of real Cloud talking to Zack Cloud (the one we play). In the Ultimania for remake, it's Cloud talking to himself, "he feels like he has heard this before but something is missing, something is wrong" then Sephiroth speaks.
To clarify the Sephiroth/Aerith dynamic....
Sephiroth--the one that obsessively speaks to Cloud (important because there is also a Sephiroth who like the OG does not know who the hell Cloud is, because it isn't Sephiroth it is Jenova), is dead and able to do things (LifeStream black, the book). Aerith is unable to follow him, but has tied her feelings and hopes to a spirit. (LifeStream white). Spirits of the cetra that Aerith enlist for help turn pink, she calls them whispers (flower maiden).
In remake, Aerith tells us she gets 'feelings'. But each time she is touched by the whispers she feels these are being stripped away from her. So at best she gets deja-vu and impressions.
You can identify future Sephiroth by his obsessive need to say Cloud and the way he says it, almost adding an extra syllable to it. Per LifeStream black, he needs to say it...or he may fade into the lifestream. He needs Cloud to remember, he needs Cloud to obsess, or he will never be able to manifest a body.
Jenova Sephiroth doesn't know his name, it doesn't care. It's just another vessel, another puppet, another tool. What a touching reunion. Jenova Sephiroth does not need a wing to fly, for its entire appearance as a Sephiroth is an illusion. It can manifest the sword from its palm, because the sword is just a Jenova tentacle. It is Jenova Sephiroth that kills Barret. And when defeated, 49 is sacrificed and Jenova's physical body appears beside him, where it was set down to attack Shinra. Number 2 then takes Jenova's body... Note the lack of anything said; Jenova has no reason to speak. It has no obligation to.
Sephiroth, like all the Soldiers in the soldier program, must sprout a wing before they are able to fly.
Where the Jenova and Sephiroth dynamic gets interesting, is the whispers are trying to preserve a future where Jenova ultimately wins, despite Sephiroth's repeated losses.
Yet four whispers seem to always act against the interests of the rest...
After defeating the whispers, four still participate in the fight with Sephiroth, always emerging from Sephiroth's chest...
@@Koniving A couple things to add to this. There's some debate about whether Lifestream White and Lifestream Black are canon. I think that they essentially are canon, in the sense that even if the precise details aren't, the overall concepts, ideas, etc.. are.
In the Japanese, Sephiroth uses different pronouns for himself at different times. When he's a SOLDIER he uses "ore" which is an informal version of "I", then when he becomes a puppet for Jenova he starts using "watashi" which is a formal version of "I", kind of like saying "one" or something. This change in pronoun usage occurs in both the OG game and Remake (as well as other games) and is referenced in the Ultimanias. One really interesting thing is that in Remake he seems to go back to using "ore" during the Edge of Creation scene in particular, indicating that that's actual Sephiroth there and not Jenova.
I'm not entirely sure that there is a full consensus on what the deal is with Sephiroth illusions/transformations but I think it may be a subtle, possibly important, plot point (only Cloud sees illusions but everyone sees transformations). In the OG, Sephiroth fell into the lifestream with Jenova's head during the Nibel Reactor incident. I think we can expect the same is true in Remake. In both games we have Jenova's body at Midgar and Sephiroth copies walking around.
In the OG, Sephiroth fully becomes a puppet for Jenova with his body drifting to the North Crater via the lifestream and all the Sephiroth copies start traveling to the north crater. After Jenova's body is moved to Midgar it seems that Sephiroth somehow murders Shinra and steals Jenova's body (whether it's a copy in the form of Sephiroth or if Jenova's body itself transforms into Sephiroth, it's unclear). In the OG we encounter Sephiroth copies in the as Sephiroth several times. The first two times he flies away and drops a Jenova body part (which turns into a Jenova boss). The third Sephiroth copy transforms into Jenova Death and is seemingly killed, we also see this copy (as Sephiroth) killing other copies before saying that "this is the end of this body's usefulness". I don't know if this means that this is the same copy that you've encountered the previous two times (and he's just been dropping different pieces of Jenova's body each time). I am also not sure if everyone else in the party also sees them as "Sephiroth" or if it's just Cloud. It could be that only Cloud sees Sephiroth (due to Jenova messing with his mind) but it's been a long while since I played the game and the cutscenes I can find online seem ambiguous.
In Remake, things seem to work slightly differently. Here Sephiroth is encountered in two distinct ways. Either it's a Sephiroth copy that only Cloud sees as Sephiroth (due to Jenova messing with his mind) or it's a Sephiroth copy transformed into Sephiroth. Before the copies obtain Jenova's body they only appear as illusions that only cloud sees, it's only afterwards that they start transforming. Additionally, Copy 49 first transforms into Sephiroth and then transforms into Jenova Dreamweaver before being killed only to have Jenova's body appear nearby and get picked up by a second Sephiroth copy.
In Advent Children, Kadaj requires a piece of Jenova's body to physically transform into Sephiroth. In Lifestream Black, it's said that Sephiroth needs his remnants to encounter someone who has memories of him to learn who he was, and Jenova's body parts to become fully real. My question is, why exactly does he need Jenova's body part does he require it in order to shapeshift or does he just require the Jenova's memory reading abilities (to obtain memories of his physical form)? I feel like if it's the latter then they wouldn't have bothered to have Sephiroth appear as an illusion in Remake at all.
I think this is what makes the most sense: Sephiroth copies cannot physically transform into Sephiroth without access to a Jenova body part -- however, Jenova can make Cloud "see" copies as Sephiroth through mental manipulation. From the description we get of Jenova, we know that it can read the memories of others, alter the minds/memories of those infected with its cells, shapeshift those infected with its cells and/or transform them into monsters. I don't think it can mentally manipulate people who aren't infected with its cells, but it's possible I'm wrong Jenova is crazy OP and actually kind of terrifying.
@@Ekce @Ekce it's worth noting that Sephiroth changes his pronoun after absorbing the meteor in the singularity. LifeStream black says to summon meteor, Sephiroth sacrificed everything unnecessary. Memories of friends, childhood, past, emotions, his life, everything that didn't have to do with the task at hand. All sacrificed and put into the meteor. In the singularity he absorbs the meteor, and starts saying Oure.
Kadaj is one of three monsters created like the dogs in advent children, he has no genuine substance in the sense of being a Jenova limb. More projection of the mind than actual person, a figment. He, it, needs Jenova cells to become something real. This is why the body dissolves later, real people die by leaving corpses. Kadaj wasn't even a person, or a thing. He was just a LifeStream projection. What's funny is in the Kids are Alright... Kyrie is who named Kadaj, and while Tseng saw the sephiroth-like kid, Kyrie saw a boy with orange hair named Kadaj. The name stuck. (Unrelated, I'm sad we didn't see Evan when Yuffie was in sector 7. He was there hours before the platefall. He confirms..nobody survived. So the mass exodus of survivors are a new altered event, likely having to do with the new way the plate fell.
But I do not agree completely. #49 confronted and attacked Cloud in the lab before removing Jenova from her restraints. It appeared as Sephiroth to Palmer. It pulled the holodeck trick show. That said, I do agree it's more illusion than reality. On the holodeck we see the sword do stuff but nobody else saw it experienced it. Perhaps proximity is sufficient, as on the bridge the sword worked and in the office with Jenova in tow, stabby. However we don't know how consistent the rules are... What we do know is per Ultimania Omega written by Nomura, every voice from the OG...is shown in remake as a Sephiroth scene hinting Zack is already out of Cloud's head, and Jenova broke herself out. In remake, a black cloak came under the control of Jenova, and broke her out. In both cases it appeared as Sephiroth.
Per LifeStream black, a future Sephiroth has to obsessively say Cloud's name... 49's Sephiroth never says it. Neither does 2's Sephiroth. This is consistent, as Jenova will ask Cloud who he is on the cargo ship.
Nomura has effectively said the entire compilation is canon. Before Crisis is littered all over the world preview and will play a pivotal role in rebirth for Zack. Seeds for it have already been planted in both remake and the dlc. Marlene is in sector 5 because Barret said in the resolution he was there months ago, when he cut ties with the rest of the team there; as it happens between September 17 (Zack's death/not death) and October 4th (the day Cloud is found with the buster sword in sector 7)... Avalanche has a civil war. Ten+ Turks save the world by jumping into a grey/blue ball in the sky called a pocket dimension in fan translations, or a singularity if you localize it; after which all those Turks are launched all over the world in an instant. Jade Weapon awakens and flies around like a jet until defeated on the night of the bombing mission. Aerith is scolded by Reno for disappearing a few months back, saying that she caused a lot of trouble. Zack has no signs of actually finding Aerith... That room is not where you think it is. Cloud on the chair is also in the guest room, not Aerith's room. Where wedge was rested. There is a woman who lost consciousness with a bad man coming for her, it's the avalanche leader Elfe, who Barret was coming to see and in before crisis he doesn't end up finding her, because anti-soldier Ravens are hunting her. Cissinei is attacked by some at the church on October 1st or 2nd...
During the entire time, Cloud in before crisis was making his way into Midgar through sector 5, but he frequently and constantly had lapses of consciousness, and was often incoherent. His tale wrapped up with some chocobo service relocating him to a popular train station in the hopes that someone who knew him would find him. (It wasn't named, but it was thecm chocobo carriage from the OG).
If you notice throughout every compilation title there are hexagons everywhere. In the menu systems, on the key art, on...everything. these all tie into genetic memory. Where this gets interesting is this goes from before crisis where it's presence is extremely limited due to being a phone game, all the way to remake and ever crisis... It's on all the books (except for flower maiden). And then we hit rebirth and suddenly...it's all gone. Instead we have clocks, clocks...glyphs, all sorts of stuff pointing to the temple of the ancients and not a single hexagon to be seen...
We are finally away from the memories, away from past, present, and future memories. Now we have clocks. Time is ticking... ticking....ticking...
First off, these first two videos are amazing!
I beat the original FF7 2 days after it launched back in 1997. Ever since that day, I felt the ending implied that we lost. We were a bit to late for Holy to stop the end of the world, mainly due to the Red XIII scene. I feel that people are over thinking the remake. It could be as simple as the story proceeds as planned until the crater. I don't think Zack is in another timeline. I think Zack is in the lifestream, along with Biggs and soon to be Aerith. I think we will see our fallen comrades have their own journey to the crater where they will join us in the final fight via the lifestream.
Thank you very much!!! On the ending of the original, as a kid I never though muxh into it. We best sephiroth and the world was saved. Even with the redxiii scene, I took that as humanity having lived out its life after the events of the game. I am more inclined to believe though that og 7 aeris "projected" a recap to remake aerith (also why difference in name spelling?). But only time will tell
@@PlayerVersusGame I also think we probably had a very poor translation in 1997. I'd guess a lot of things we think are changes could just be corrections. As for the scene where Cloud falls, this is probably not a change at all, but rather something that wasn't possible due to technical limitations in 1997.
Sephiroth knows who cloud, is he didnt on the junon ship in the original so he also knows
FF7 remake is a sequel of the ending of original game,at least for me.
Answer a question with a question. Is Reno in Advent Children?
Is reno not in advent children? (Haven't seen it since release)
they talk about the war has happen, and there a seize fire.
Turn your mic up, respect.
Yeahh makes sense
7 seconds ubtil the end, time enough for you perhaps....
Love this series but you should number the titles it’s kinda hard to know what this is about in terms of a breakdown
Good call!
@@PlayerVersusGamejust saw you added that thank you so much I’m using this series to make sense of this all for a friend so this helps a lot love the videos man looking forward to your thoughts on rebirth
Cloud thinks he’s Zack, Aerith knows Zack. “Stop acting like you know me.” She doesn’t. He just reminds her of the guy he thinks he is.
The second Cloud is Zack.
In crisis core you play as Zack a fight wutai right?
Haven't played it but I do know the last mission is the end of the war I believe
@@PlayerVersusGame you could not be anymore wrong
That's not the OG Cloud, that's the "Real" Cloud speaking to him. In the OG Cloud's real self is shown to be a kid that was who was talking to him in these segments.
It's no different here. That isn't the "OG" Cloud from the original, that is Cloud's "real" self. What makes this scene different is Sephiroth shows up to see how much he can influence Cloud without the whispers getting invloved.
If Rebo died the sector 7 plate still would have fallen. Keeping him alive i think isbsomething that happens further down the road after the events of Remake. For instance Advent Children as he is one of the people who finds Jenova's head, and "kills" one of the Sephiroth bros.
Having just played Crisis Core before replaying Remake, I think Cloud sees zack, not aerith. And here is my reason why;
Whene ever Cloud sees something about Aerith we as the player see it. But when Aeroth brings up Zack he has that headache but we dont see what he sees. We already saw a glimos of Aerith at the forgotten capital and again see her die in the final battle, i think when Aeroth walks away Cloud's memories of Zack walking away before he dies is triggered. Considering Aeroth's connection to Zack and even she pi ked up some of his manerisms, i think Aerith subconsciously reminds Cloud of Zack.
I do believe that Aeroth knows things she doesnt... but im not convinced she knows everything. There are times she gleans that she knows things she shouldnt but she also admits that she doesnt have all tge pieces in chaoter 17.
Although Cloud is 21, he is mentally 16. The way he acts isnt "like zack" like most people think. Cloud acts like what Cloud thinks is a cool 1st class Soldier would be, what is Cloud's idea of what he wants people to look at him.
Zack is energetic, easy going, focused on helping people, and brash. Cloud acts too cool for school, restrained, concice, and confident. Aerith even calls him out when the meet again when cloud acts "cool" and Aerith responds with "So cool."
Cloud is not Zack or even acting like Zack, Crisis Core makes this apparent.
I don’t think Cloud has Zack’s memories or personality per se he just took Zack stories and the Nibelheim incident as a basis to create his fake persona but as stated in the ultimania he does act like Zack sometimes like when he gave Tifa the flower or danced with Andrea he did those things because he thought Zack or his fake persona would do it to look cool.
He is mostly Cloud but sometimes would do things out of character for him (mostly when he acts cool or smooth) and that’s when you notice him trying to imitate Zack behavior outside the mannerism and fighting style.
Pretty good analysis btw.
Cloud was infused with Jenova cells, Jenova has the ability to manipulate memories, during the original death of Zack, his Jenova cells transplanted Zack's story and persona onto cloud. Whenever he hear's or remembers his actual memories it causes the headaches because its conflicting with the Jenova-Zack memories.
@@outlander004 Jenova cells reacted to Tifa not Zack that was stated in the original when Cloud was weak in the train station and she found him that’s why his childhood memories are affected and that’s why he thinks Tifa was his childhood friend despite barely knowing each other, because Tifa thinks that was the case and it overwritten Cloud own memories of their childhood (him being bullied, not truly being close to Tifa, never getting into soldier).
Jenova cells reacted to Tifa ideal vision of Cloud, Cloud own idea of what a soldier was and Zack stories that he told Cloud, all of that made that fake persona, Jenova blocks Zack’s name because it’s not convenient for him to know the truth yet.
Cloud only acts like Zack when he tries to be cool but it’s not because Jenova transferred Zack persona into him but because Zack (at least in Clouds eyes) is the ideal Soldier/hero he wants to be so he subconsciously imitates him.
Nice theories, but I’m sure your 💯 off
Haha obviously really high probability I'm definitely 💯 off. What are your thoughts?