What I like about ff14 is that I have the option to turn off my party's effects if they become too much of a hindrance. Yes it feels weird to see my allies do no spells but at the same time it gives me a choice.
@@Noobie2k7 Exactly. Before I had a good PC and was still playing WoW (BfA and early Shadowlands), it was getting hard to run it and it looked awful. No wonder I played so much League of Legends. It was the only game I could run without lowering graphics all the way down to playstation 1 lol
@@VAFranky Yeah, I have zero memory of this, it's been too long. Still, I remember struggling to run the game even with everything at low. Now, I never played ff14 with a shit PC, so I don't know if that's the same as well...
If the gameplay is good, then the graphics will be the cherry on top. If it’s not, the graphics won’t save it from feeling empty. Imo, sometimes art style > advanced graphics. Both is always best though. Let’s not pretend like we have to choose.
Imo Graphics dont matter at all. Theres lot of examples even to this day where a game has objectively terrible low quality graphics but the gameplay shines and people enjoy it on the merit of the gameplay alone. Graphics are incredibly temporary. But the core functions of a gameplay system are cemented forever. It's why millions of people will flock to games like OSRS, WoW, etc. because people enjoy the gameplay and dont care about how it looks. But devs nowadays think graphics are so core to getting people to play that they put 90% of their resources into how a game looks and completely forget to even make a playable and enjoyable game. I dont think AoC's gameplay (from the little they have shown) even looks remotely good. It looks similar to most korean trash so far (incredibly good graphics, terrible looking gameplay) so im keeping my expectations incredibly low for this game.
Music and atmosphere/tone play a huge role as well. Gameplay systems are by far the most important its why you can go back and play a super nintendo game right now and it still holds up as a great game (many of them)
@@daroaminggnome well I think hes talking about if it is a good game or not, its true that graphics dont matter at all to make a game good or not. it definately matters with how many people are willing to try it, Dwarf fortress is a good game CDDA is a good game caves of qud is a good game. Theres tons of other good titles from the 90's and early 2000's that are good that people will never try because of graphics/accesibility that are none the less great games ultima 7 and X-com come to mind immediately but you could name them for a long time.
@@daroaminggnome Take a look at something like the original Doom. It's graphics are shit, it's aesthetics are not. It's generally regarded as a great game even to this day. I think you are delusional. Another example is the original Dark Souls or Demon Souls. Graphically, they're complete ass, but the overall aesthetics and theme are what carry them to glory and is the reason why people love them. Those are not the only examples either. I do think the statement "Graphics don't matter and they don't make a game good" is really, really true. Look at Crysis, if you remember it at least. Highly regarded as the best graphics, at the time at least, but was regarded as a mediocre and overall boring game. GTA has terrible graphics but it's a beloved series and franchise and overall the games are considered good. Hell, a lot of games that look absolutely stunning tend to fail - a majority of them do. Saying that graphics are what carries a franchise is nonsensical and you're dumb for even saying that. No, graphics do not matter. Gameplay is way, way more important to have a successful game than graphics are by a huge margin.
@@jebalitabb8228 what does that even mean, why would what other people think of someone’s content affect how I think of them. Going by your logic every small channel is garbage
i think people that don't like narc are just jealous of his big pp he flashes around. Wish he would do less of that though lol. otherwise he's funny asf
I think reasons mmos were so good at the start was because it was a genere excuted well for its time. The scope and the idea was so new, advanced and out there, nothing compared. In our current time we have the same scope, old and played out with no real advancents. If we want something like that again it has to be something so far and beyond for our time... not the same formula from 10-15 years ago.
3:10 the game that broke the mold for graphical requirements in my mind was rimworld. I saw it and picked it up on sale some years ago and never really touched it. Played it out of boredom one drunken evening and didnt stop playing it until Id racked up like 200 hours. Then i discovered it had mods! I feel like the modding community is only so huge in Rimworld due to the basic-ish graphical style and thats a huge boon.
Rimworld mods are insane, I kinda feel bad for the dev, how is he supposed to make DLC's or any new additions that outshine what modders have already done
wows graphics were not insanely good for the time they came out. The thing that wow did differently is instead of going for a more realistic approach which would be very taxing on hardware performance, they went for a more cartoony approach with more vibrant colors. That was a huge departure from other games that were pushing in a different direction with the art style.
@@teresmajor7956 Yes exactly! Which is why i still play some games that are like 20 years old but still hold up looks wise, like Breath of Fire 🔥 IV! Style ages much better than realism as you say because realism is subjective and limited to the time periods hardware capabilities.
'blinded by flashbangs because hundreds of ppl casting spells' my immediate thought was my first time doing a world boss in bdo (and not having learned that i had to turn those spell effects down for it... suffice to say... it didn't go well
@@Monkeyswheelchair is it addicts or versions of our younger self? 16 yo become 18, and 18 becomes 20 and they all have the same lessons to learn as those before them
Imo the main cost of high quality graphics is development time and cost. A game with more rudimentary graphics can release a ton more content for a far lower cost than one with top tier graphics. This matters a lot in particular for MMOs precisely because they demand so much content.
@@ZekethePhoenix ? Vanilla WoW is stylized, it becomes way more forgiving because it never aimed to be realistic. EQ2 at the time looked amazing, it aged poorly because it wasn't stylistic and aimed to be more realistic, which ages worse than stylized games, because realistic games advance as technology advances, EQ2 was one of the most demanding games of the time (it still allowed potatos to play on lower settings though.)
This is a major pet-peeve of mine. Aesthetics make a game look good. Graphics are what powers the Aesthetics. A good video game needs a good sense of Aesthetics whit the Graphics to support it. & for MMORPGs, you need your graphics to run smoother then butter to hold up those Aesthetics.
I have begun to loathe this guy. If you were to take a shot every single time he said "copium" your liver would tap out like it's in a chokehold in a UFC fight against paddy the baddie. It's like this dudes middle name is copium. Does he begin his day with copium chocolate chips? 100% copium and zero sugar?
I don't think I have heard anyone say there issue is that there hasn't been gameplay. I have heard people say, including me, what they have shown is bad. I like Narc but I feel like he is truly just huffing up hopeium on this game missing all the criticisms purposefully. Maybe I feel that way because I don't see this game delivering.
well the thing with spell affects is that people like their moves to look and feel impactful, as LAzyPeon often says in his videos. The other way to show impact is big numbers which is something maple story does a lot of. I think having flashy spells is fine as long as you have an option to turn it down. I personally enjoy seeing a boss mob get completely bombarded. As long as the flashiness doesn't hinder the visual of boss mechanics or mechanics in general, its fine.
This is the reason why I still play Anarchy Online, I enjoy the complexity of the systems over the graphics. Granting a player the ability to create their characters and classes any way they want while not limiting the vast majority of gear to level requirements or bind on pick-up. AO has stat requirements that may require a combination of 1-5 different skills and classes may buff them or others with said skills to OE or over equip gear. It gives the player the ability to equip items well before their intended level range, of course at a price as you must maintain said buffs or lose a % of the item's stats.
- The thing is, most of the old schoolers have been conditioned to accept dailies and other "player engagement incentives" while for the newer players dailies and login rewards and all that shit is the norm, they never knew a world without those mechanics. - Completely agree that spell effects are way over the top flashy and you don't know wtf is going on. And in PvP there's also the issue of ground effects not having clear borders and not beign able to tell if they are from friend or foe (DKs); GW2 does an excellent job in that department. - The only way for hyper-realistic graphics to not be outdated or feel bad from the getgo is to perfect physics, interractions, animations. Until those are of the same realism level as graphics, realistic graphics will feel shit to me.
As bad as you think WoW or ff or any other mmo is, I can guarantee that I’ll have more fun playing them in the next 2 years than I will THINKING about ashes while it’s still not out
3:46 When I heard these words I stood up in the dark corner of my room I reside in and started clapping my hands at my monitor. I hope my praise reaches you, Stephen.
Something I could never get past with other mmos besides wow is the animations, wow is so smooth to play. I don't even know exactly what it is. It just feels better imo.
I played WoW from vanilla through Legion, never ever, ever felt the need to turn down effects to play the game, got the mechanics, could see what was going on zero issues. I've been playing FFXIV since ARR and I HAVE to turn party effects to limited to see the much clearer mechanic markers, because if I don't, I can't actually see the ground as a melee.
My thing is is if you buy an expensive computer with expensive ass parts and aren't lucky to get it free like some of you streamers we want a game that has good visuals as well as gameplay
Pantheon graphics don't look great, but even as this video stats, whats behind it is important. I like some of the systems they are putting in place. And graphics may change as well. We shall see.
I am actually pretty excited about this one. If they don't screw it up it may re-establish standards we the people haven't forced our game developers to meet.
Just waiting for the perfect game. Getting stuck in a MMO, become a girl's boyfriend/savior in the game, and having to kill the final boss to get back to reality.
Graphics are not as important as these developers think. Look at all the games that have bad graphics that have a strong playerbase over 10+ years? Us players just want a good game that has developers who care and listen. Games nowadays are involved with greed and what will make them the fastest amount of money with no intention to make a title that will be a stable of the genre its in. We can all agree that we just want good genuine games.
The siege shown @15:45 was run on a 3070 @1080p. There was some confusion at the time of the initial showcase showing the siege footage. I admire the drive to make the game run on low end hardware, but it will take 5-10 years for a 3070 to be low end.
WOW graphics were not groundbreaking on release Asmon... that's silly, there were other MMOs released earlier that had better graphics. Everquest 2 is a great example. One of the biggest criticisms of WOW at release was how crap the graphics and art style were, for MMO vets.
In my physics class I had a buddy who would bring up the earth being flat just to get the prof off topic. imagine a tall lanky Eastern European middle aged man with a cloudy lazy eye and a thick Russian accent attempting to reason with a 19 year old who’s main vocab revolves around ‘uh’ and ‘dude’ and ‘bro’….. I was crying.
I think it's unfair to criticise wow for not updating graphics. When the game launched it used DX9c and only supported 1024x768. You could run it on Windows 98 with 32mb of video memory. It didn't even support wide screen monitors. I played wow on dual 15" CRT monitors, Wow on the right and Thottbot on the left!!
Graphics dont matter ≠ No Graphics. By your logic, the best game is simply a game written on a book, not even coded on an engine with click to progress inputs, since text fonts are still considered Graphics. You should take a second to think before trying to argue for the sake of arguing.
These days graphics are great, but more frequently than not, systems suck, which is what I felt was the problem with Final fantasy, I loved the graphics, but the systems didn't feel very fluent if I remember correctly.
Photo-realism is over-taking stylistic graphics in my book. Stylistic graphics had a more important role 10-20 years ago, but now is the time for realism to shine!
I wish I had hype for Ashes of Creation. I don't see the WoW cultists to switch to it, nor appeal to the FFXIV or Runescape communities. I find it hard to believe if there are MMO players that haven't already found their MMO. AoC is a passion project that we all hope we'll enjoy, but from what has been shown IMO the game is destined to fail.
Asmon is right, I randomly looked up Pantheon the other day to see if it was alive and it was only then that I knew it was. No Hype for it at all. I'd play it when it comes out as well as Ashes but it's future doesn't look so bright
Pantheon's systems are looking amazing for both gameplay and progression. I hope Asmongold gives it a chance I think he will be impressed. I also feel that Pantheon has made a lot of effort to show off the systems that make it worthy of a new MMORPG.
Graphics matter, but not as much as some people want them to. In my opinion making a fantasy world is what matters and not the graphics by themselves. My issue is that many games look too much like the real world by trying to have good graphics and that's not what I need from a fantasy game. Give me incredible landscapes which can't be real, and then worry about making them "realistic"
I think you should be able to filter out the effects shown on the screen by effect type so you only see the effects you want or need to see. I dunno if UE5 can do that or if Intrepid is thinking along these lines at all, but that would make it a lot easier to see only what you want to see so you can see the boss' reveal of what they're about to do.
what steven said, is what i have been trying to say since 2004 about most rpg type games for graphics. spell effects is a different topic in is own right.
im not big on super stylized art these days, it was cool when we had to do it but we no longer need to, realistic is more immersive, cyberpunk I think was a GREAT example of very realistics with a bit of stylized but not so much that its un immersive
There are countless examples of good games, with basically no graphics what so ever. And plenty of good looking games, with crap gameplay and story. Personally, I think this is looking like its going to be a great looking game, but then the game play is going to be ruined by limitations of those systems and graphics they are working on so hard. Like, game mechanics are going to be simple, and uninteresting, while everyone looks great.
Yup, its even worse when the graphics hold back the gameplay because of ways in which the systems are limited by graphical limits. Its sad. Like want to make a 40v40 pvp game? Nope, game wont be able to handle it.
@@Keldiur I dont think thats true tho. I don't think the people who follow AoC want incredible modern graphics. They want an MMO they can finally latch onto.
10:40 stylized graphics is used to enhance readability. That's exactly the problem of WC3:R, they simply swapped assets with highly detailed one, and the battles turned into unreadable mess, because some units now are less distinct. Because now they has more details, and now you have to read more details to distinguish one unit from another.
what made wow good at launch was a game that didnt lag when going into a city or with many players around. yes gfx was very good but imo it was the quality of wow that made the game so good.
The graphics and art style for an MMORPG should 100% make optimization of performance as problem free as possible and also age well. This means cartoony looking stuff. It's just the right way to go for longevity.
There was the Ultima Online vs. Runescapers beef. I played UO, and was still playing it when Everquest came out. I played the Beta of EQ and saw nothing that made me want to switch to EQ from UO. But when I got an invite to the closed beta of WoW. . . Holy shit. I no lifed it, then did the same with the open beta. . . Then completely switched from UO to WoW on release.
2:00 that's untrue. A significant part of every dev stream is graphics and design and concepts. It takes at least a quarter of every stream. And even "gameplay" footages are focused on visual aspect. "But there was gameplay!" "Seriously?" "Yes! He chopped down... A tree!" Yes, while sperging about the graphics.
The thing is, you can drastically change the gameplay of a game, like New World for instance, but changing the graphics is something you can tweak and improve, but not completely change. There's no way Overwatch is going to start looking like Call of Duty, or visa versa. If you dislike either of their styles, you're going to have to suck it up or move along.
Asmongold isn’t right when he says WoW was ground breaking! DAoC was hands down the best game ever made in the genre; however, WoW surpassed it due to how WoW made the gameplay feel like an adventure game (like when you press a button, the action would happen, rather than wait with in a set timer with in the game). WoW lacked when it came to end game compared to DAoC, which was odd considering the war between 2 factions.! (Graphics we’re good in DAoC for it’s time)
@@xxJing it was groundbreaking in that it broke through to the mainstream. something EQ couldn't quite do. which is why wow has been successful for so long no matter where it is currently
@mystical being89 @Unimportant Account @xxJing DAoC had RvR when it came to end game though! There was a 3 faction system, with each faction having their own land and with their own relic keeps/relics. If one realm could take a relic from opposing faction and take it to their own relic keep, then the whole faction would get a + to either magic or melee. It would stay that way till some other faction took it. That game was fun as hell all around!
lol the last few days I 100000% thought this guy was Sliker and I was disappointed because I like the ending of his videos and how he creates new fun ways to say people are on copium... Glad this is not the same guy.
Graphics are a bonus. I would play Everquest Online Adventures Frontiers for the ps2 and that game-play and the mechanics were amazing! That game was legit better than WOW and unless you played it you probably wouldn't agree. Played that game for 10yrs. I wish they would bring it back even with the old graphics I don't care.
Systems aren't fun a spreedsheet is a system , windows is a system , but you wouldn't necesserily call it fun showing the flashing lights in ff14 like that is disingenious , there's an option to make them minimal in a way they don't ubstruct the gameplay. I don't even play ff14 and find the game rather dull , but I know it was intentionally poorly represented. I like this guys videos less and less , because at some point copium becomes severe fanboyism. They devs have absolutely nothing to show In my opinion , there's nothing even in the design that stands out. There's no reason to talk about it , to be copium about it. Let the team work and when it's released we will judge. Let's Be pragmatic about it. Science isn't really end all because some of the science is up to interpretation. For instance Planks lenght in scientific terms is "the smallest" thing. But in actually we don't know if it Really is, our "system" that is quantum mechanics is all we know at the moment and with that system everything points to planks lenght. There May be a time that we will go one step deeper and it will be no longer holding the title. Same way classical theory is only that a classical theory. You spend 10 years learning about Newtonian world, then first thing they do in University is laugh and telly you everything you know is wrong. I value the ability to say "I won't believe until I've seen" more than the ability to laugh at someone , despite yourself probably holding false notion about 90% of the modern science anyway. weather you know that 1% more is really irrelevant , you're both the same in grand scheeme of things. A bunch of headless chicken talking about things they don't know
@@luccienv The game is not even mid stage alpha they literally just did some combat animations in a controlled enviroment and adapted unreal 5 ... and this is not the first video too :) "just some fun" - idk if you've seen some of the previous ones
An issue with only focusing on graphics is that if you make it multiplayer then you BETTER be a god of optimization or else everyone's gonna stop playing because those that can't play due to unstable framerate will go first, meaning there's less players, meaning the rest go because there's just not enough people to play with.
I remember watching Narc early on like eventually people will take a shine to his content Also I just noticed this, Asmon got some Dumbledore looking hands 😂
Yea it’s good to see his content picked up … he’s been putting a HUGE amount of effort into edits since the very beginning of the channel. Dude used to be a bread maker & now he’s popping off
umm,. the ART STYLE of WoW was insanely good. EQ2 graphics was by FAR pushing the tech more AT THE TIME. So big FALSE on that one Asmon. *source - Me, a genuine old man.
Graphics matter. Like Steven said, they are the icing on the cake the cherry on top. However, a game withoug good solid game play burns up like a shooting star. Eye candy hooks you into taking a look but good game play keeps you playing.
seriously .... people compare future mmos with wow as standard but ignore that fact that DAoC or Warhammer Online or even Ultima Online had things in their games which WoW didnt have, that were groundbreaking and stil being ignored by new mmos. DAoC had the best pvp/rvr system ever.
What I like about ff14 is that I have the option to turn off my party's effects if they become too much of a hindrance. Yes it feels weird to see my allies do no spells but at the same time it gives me a choice.
@@Noobie2k7 Exactly. Before I had a good PC and was still playing WoW (BfA and early Shadowlands), it was getting hard to run it and it looked awful. No wonder I played so much League of Legends. It was the only game I could run without lowering graphics all the way down to playstation 1 lol
I wish you had more options. I want to see a bit of my party’s animation buuuut holy spam blinds me irl
@@Noobie2k7 this exactly this i wont buy a 4000$ pc just to play a mmo when theres still tons alive and well around
@@VAFranky Yeah, I have zero memory of this, it's been too long. Still, I remember struggling to run the game even with everything at low. Now, I never played ff14 with a shit PC, so I don't know if that's the same as well...
If the gameplay is good, then the graphics will be the cherry on top. If it’s not, the graphics won’t save it from feeling empty. Imo, sometimes art style > advanced graphics. Both is always best though. Let’s not pretend like we have to choose.
Imo Graphics dont matter at all. Theres lot of examples even to this day where a game has objectively terrible low quality graphics but the gameplay shines and people enjoy it on the merit of the gameplay alone.
Graphics are incredibly temporary. But the core functions of a gameplay system are cemented forever. It's why millions of people will flock to games like OSRS, WoW, etc. because people enjoy the gameplay and dont care about how it looks. But devs nowadays think graphics are so core to getting people to play that they put 90% of their resources into how a game looks and completely forget to even make a playable and enjoyable game. I dont think AoC's gameplay (from the little they have shown) even looks remotely good. It looks similar to most korean trash so far (incredibly good graphics, terrible looking gameplay) so im keeping my expectations incredibly low for this game.
There is gameplay of the alpha out there on YT. It is not hard to find.
Music and atmosphere/tone play a huge role as well. Gameplay systems are by far the most important its why you can go back and play a super nintendo game right now and it still holds up as a great game (many of them)
@@daroaminggnome well I think hes talking about if it is a good game or not, its true that graphics dont matter at all to make a game good or not. it definately matters with how many people are willing to try it, Dwarf fortress is a good game CDDA is a good game caves of qud is a good game. Theres tons of other good titles from the 90's and early 2000's that are good that people will never try because of graphics/accesibility that are none the less great games ultima 7 and X-com come to mind immediately but you could name them for a long time.
@@daroaminggnome Take a look at something like the original Doom. It's graphics are shit, it's aesthetics are not. It's generally regarded as a great game even to this day. I think you are delusional.
Another example is the original Dark Souls or Demon Souls. Graphically, they're complete ass, but the overall aesthetics and theme are what carry them to glory and is the reason why people love them. Those are not the only examples either. I do think the statement "Graphics don't matter and they don't make a game good" is really, really true. Look at Crysis, if you remember it at least. Highly regarded as the best graphics, at the time at least, but was regarded as a mediocre and overall boring game.
GTA has terrible graphics but it's a beloved series and franchise and overall the games are considered good.
Hell, a lot of games that look absolutely stunning tend to fail - a majority of them do. Saying that graphics are what carries a franchise is nonsensical and you're dumb for even saying that. No, graphics do not matter. Gameplay is way, way more important to have a successful game than graphics are by a huge margin.
This will be the MMO ever
Lol, yes. It will surely be a game.
EVER.
And it will be one of the game ever made
Absolutely the ever.
@@thelightsilent 🧊 😂
Narc and asmon are such a hilarious duo my sides hurt after watching this. Both of them are too much lmao
@@beny988 asmon is also insufferable to certain people, to each their own I guess
@@jebalitabb8228 what does that even mean, why would what other people think of someone’s content affect how I think of them. Going by your logic every small channel is garbage
@@jebalitabb8228 id say narc is doing pretty well considering the niche content he makes
My sides are hurting, my coleslaw is in agony and my sweetcorn needs help.
i think people that don't like narc are just jealous of his big pp he flashes around. Wish he would do less of that though lol. otherwise he's funny asf
I think reasons mmos were so good at the start was because it was a genere excuted well for its time. The scope and the idea was so new, advanced and out there, nothing compared. In our current time we have the same scope, old and played out with no real advancents. If we want something like that again it has to be something so far and beyond for our time... not the same formula from 10-15 years ago.
3:10 the game that broke the mold for graphical requirements in my mind was rimworld. I saw it and picked it up on sale some years ago and never really touched it. Played it out of boredom one drunken evening and didnt stop playing it until Id racked up like 200 hours. Then i discovered it had mods! I feel like the modding community is only so huge in Rimworld due to the basic-ish graphical style and thats a huge boon.
Rimworld mods are insane, I kinda feel bad for the dev, how is he supposed to make DLC's or any new additions that outshine what modders have already done
Even the effects are "basic", damn, a lot of production goes into these videos! I kinda hope he saves some energy for when he gets monetized
He is?
wows graphics were not insanely good for the time they came out. The thing that wow did differently is instead of going for a more realistic approach which would be very taxing on hardware performance, they went for a more cartoony approach with more vibrant colors. That was a huge departure from other games that were pushing in a different direction with the art style.
@@teresmajor7956 Yes exactly! Which is why i still play some games that are like 20 years old but still hold up looks wise, like Breath of Fire 🔥 IV! Style ages much better than realism as you say because realism is subjective and limited to the time periods hardware capabilities.
By the time this game come out I’ll be 50 years old
'blinded by flashbangs because hundreds of ppl casting spells' my immediate thought was my first time doing a world boss in bdo (and not having learned that i had to turn those spell effects down for it... suffice to say... it didn't go well
I've been burned to many times. I'm cold on aoc until I see an actual game that I can actually play.
As far as AoC goes I'll pass until I can get my hands on it. The developers are saying nice things, but talk is cheap.
This should be the norm for gammers right now but to many addicts.
@@Monkeyswheelchair is it addicts or versions of our younger self? 16 yo become 18, and 18 becomes 20 and they all have the same lessons to learn as those before them
@@garlic6969Yes, addicts. Social media, new technology, and the chemicals in our food has made addiction far far worse.
Player: I want something new in an mmo.
AOC dev: So we have these elves….
Imo the main cost of high quality graphics is development time and cost. A game with more rudimentary graphics can release a ton more content for a far lower cost than one with top tier graphics. This matters a lot in particular for MMOs precisely because they demand so much content.
Asmongold "Wow graphics insanely good for the time" So says the man who never played EQ2
Have you gone back to eq2 lately? It's pretty outdated even vs vanilla wow.
I wish it was just EQ2, lmao.
are you really comparing EQ graphics to wow?
@@ZekethePhoenix ? Vanilla WoW is stylized, it becomes way more forgiving because it never aimed to be realistic. EQ2 at the time looked amazing, it aged poorly because it wasn't stylistic and aimed to be more realistic, which ages worse than stylized games, because realistic games advance as technology advances, EQ2 was one of the most demanding games of the time (it still allowed potatos to play on lower settings though.)
This is a major pet-peeve of mine.
Aesthetics make a game look good.
Graphics are what powers the Aesthetics.
A good video game needs a good sense of Aesthetics whit the Graphics to support it.
& for MMORPGs, you need your graphics to run smoother then butter to hold up those Aesthetics.
I would argue that aesthetics are not comparable to graphics and they are two separate things.
@@daroaminggnome Talk about words going over someone's head. Why are you replying to me with that?
@@daroaminggnome They aren't. The terms aren't even interchangeable.
I have begun to loathe this guy. If you were to take a shot every single time he said "copium" your liver would tap out like it's in a chokehold in a UFC fight against paddy the baddie. It's like this dudes middle name is copium. Does he begin his day with copium chocolate chips? 100% copium and zero sugar?
Bro I was dying at the "game looks like shyt i aint gonna play that" 🤣🤣
I don't think I have heard anyone say there issue is that there hasn't been gameplay. I have heard people say, including me, what they have shown is bad. I like Narc but I feel like he is truly just huffing up hopeium on this game missing all the criticisms purposefully. Maybe I feel that way because I don't see this game delivering.
the music from Valheim playing while talking about graphics is hilarious.
well the thing with spell affects is that people like their moves to look and feel impactful, as LAzyPeon often says in his videos. The other way to show impact is big numbers which is something maple story does a lot of. I think having flashy spells is fine as long as you have an option to turn it down. I personally enjoy seeing a boss mob get completely bombarded. As long as the flashiness doesn't hinder the visual of boss mechanics or mechanics in general, its fine.
There's only one real Narc, and that's the Orc Warrior legend on Venoxis EU. You fools.
Tbh seeing ue5 and how it works has inspired me to want to try and learn game design (it's been a rough journey)
Whoever did that thumbnail is a genius.
Gameplay > Graphics
How can you tell? Because it's much easier to make a fun game pretty than it is to make a pretty game fun.
This is the reason why I still play Anarchy Online, I enjoy the complexity of the systems over the graphics. Granting a player the ability to create their characters and classes any way they want while not limiting the vast majority of gear to level requirements or bind on pick-up. AO has stat requirements that may require a combination of 1-5 different skills and classes may buff them or others with said skills to OE or over equip gear. It gives the player the ability to equip items well before their intended level range, of course at a price as you must maintain said buffs or lose a % of the item's stats.
People have forgotten that gameplay is king
- The thing is, most of the old schoolers have been conditioned to accept dailies and other "player engagement incentives" while for the newer players dailies and login rewards and all that shit is the norm, they never knew a world without those mechanics.
- Completely agree that spell effects are way over the top flashy and you don't know wtf is going on. And in PvP there's also the issue of ground effects not having clear borders and not beign able to tell if they are from friend or foe (DKs); GW2 does an excellent job in that department.
- The only way for hyper-realistic graphics to not be outdated or feel bad from the getgo is to perfect physics, interractions, animations. Until those are of the same realism level as graphics, realistic graphics will feel shit to me.
As bad as you think WoW or ff or any other mmo is, I can guarantee that I’ll have more fun playing them in the next 2 years than I will THINKING about ashes while it’s still not out
WOW will have three expansions before AOC moves on to UNREAL 6 and 7....haha
For me most important thing in mmo is snappy combat and movement, then other stuff like questing dungeons, crafting , zones and graphics.
3:46 When I heard these words I stood up in the dark corner of my room I reside in and started clapping my hands at my monitor. I hope my praise reaches you, Stephen.
Something I could never get past with other mmos besides wow is the animations, wow is so smooth to play. I don't even know exactly what it is. It just feels better imo.
I played WoW from vanilla through Legion, never ever, ever felt the need to turn down effects to play the game, got the mechanics, could see what was going on zero issues. I've been playing FFXIV since ARR and I HAVE to turn party effects to limited to see the much clearer mechanic markers, because if I don't, I can't actually see the ground as a melee.
Imagine if old school runescape had new world styled graphics id never touch another game again
They don't have any systems to show, or they would. Only Graphics.
My thing is is if you buy an expensive computer with expensive ass parts and aren't lucky to get it free like some of you streamers we want a game that has good visuals as well as gameplay
The clean, British version of Asmon. Even those pizza boxes look rather tidy.
Reverse Asmon, clean and bald
Old gigachad in the thumbnail was great lmao, good job thumbnail artist
Pantheon graphics don't look great, but even as this video stats, whats behind it is important. I like some of the systems they are putting in place. And graphics may change as well. We shall see.
That dailies part was masterful.
The MMO that never was
I LOVE the thumbnail. I can't wait for Old grandpa Asmon.
I am actually pretty excited about this one. If they don't screw it up it may re-establish standards we the people haven't forced our game developers to meet.
Just waiting for the perfect game. Getting stuck in a MMO, become a girl's boyfriend/savior in the game, and having to kill the final boss to get back to reality.
Mean while gt6 hasn't released anything but ashes has shown gameplay, art, bosses and etc and still disbelief about ashes of creation. 😱
I would care more about this game if I knew for sure it was coming out this decade.
Graphics are not as important as these developers think. Look at all the games that have bad graphics that have a strong playerbase over 10+ years? Us players just want a good game that has developers who care and listen. Games nowadays are involved with greed and what will make them the fastest amount of money with no intention to make a title that will be a stable of the genre its in. We can all agree that we just want good genuine games.
"If the earth is flat, why cant you see the mount everest?" Renderdistance.
The siege shown @15:45 was run on a 3070 @1080p. There was some confusion at the time of the initial showcase showing the siege footage. I admire the drive to make the game run on low end hardware, but it will take 5-10 years for a 3070 to be low end.
I mean, the game itself will probably release around 3070, so availability of the graphics card is not the issue here lmao
WOW graphics were not groundbreaking on release Asmon... that's silly, there were other MMOs released earlier that had better graphics. Everquest 2 is a great example. One of the biggest criticisms of WOW at release was how crap the graphics and art style were, for MMO vets.
Put an eq 2 model next to burning crusade , please
In fact one of the major pros of WoW was the fact that it could run in a shitty p3 (i remember playing it on a 300MHZ cpu and a riva tnt2 for gboard)
I love even GIGACHAD gets old AF 😂 on thumbnail
In my physics class I had a buddy who would bring up the earth being flat just to get the prof off topic. imagine a tall lanky Eastern European middle aged man with a cloudy lazy eye and a thick Russian accent attempting to reason with a 19 year old who’s main vocab revolves around ‘uh’ and ‘dude’ and ‘bro’….. I was crying.
Optimization is definitely a major part for me.
I think it's unfair to criticise wow for not updating graphics. When the game launched it used DX9c and only supported 1024x768. You could run it on Windows 98 with 32mb of video memory. It didn't even support wide screen monitors. I played wow on dual 15" CRT monitors, Wow on the right and Thottbot on the left!!
Ashes of creation is basically a promotion for rtx 4000 series rofl
If graphics don’t matter, then the best games would be text based. Graphics do matter in a balance with the other aspects of the overall game.
I mean, have you seen runescape? Shit graphics but very popular. So it’s hard to believe your opinion when Runescape exists 😂
Guys, i found Sherlock
Bit of a reach, if it was text based then your factoring out gameplay but I get it.
Graphics dont matter ≠ No Graphics.
By your logic, the best game is simply a game written on a book, not even coded on an engine with click to progress inputs, since text fonts are still considered Graphics.
You should take a second to think before trying to argue for the sake of arguing.
These days graphics are great, but more frequently than not, systems suck, which is what I felt was the problem with Final fantasy, I loved the graphics, but the systems didn't feel very fluent if I remember correctly.
3.00 It is like a new relationship. The graphics will you make downloading the game but if you like the charakter you are willing to play it.
Photo-realism is over-taking stylistic graphics in my book. Stylistic graphics had a more important role 10-20 years ago, but now is the time for realism to shine!
I wish I had hype for Ashes of Creation. I don't see the WoW cultists to switch to it, nor appeal to the FFXIV or Runescape communities. I find it hard to believe if there are MMO players that haven't already found their MMO. AoC is a passion project that we all hope we'll enjoy, but from what has been shown IMO the game is destined to fail.
Asmon is right, I randomly looked up Pantheon the other day to see if it was alive and it was only then that I knew it was. No Hype for it at all. I'd play it when it comes out as well as Ashes but it's future doesn't look so bright
Kept waiting for this dude to open that third eye...
Pantheon's systems are looking amazing for both gameplay and progression. I hope Asmongold gives it a chance I think he will be impressed. I also feel that Pantheon has made a lot of effort to show off the systems that make it worthy of a new MMORPG.
taking some big hits of copium I see
@@wayfa13 Copium? is that a new trend word, what do you mean?
@@CoreChamber Youngest Pantheon andy
i'm looking forward to pantheon as well, but I do think it will have a smaller player base due to its "old school" philosophy.
Pantheon looks horrible ..wtf ... we already have old games .. .. why making an old game in 22
Graphics matter, but not as much as some people want them to. In my opinion making a fantasy world is what matters and not the graphics by themselves. My issue is that many games look too much like the real world by trying to have good graphics and that's not what I need from a fantasy game. Give me incredible landscapes which can't be real, and then worry about making them "realistic"
I think you should be able to filter out the effects shown on the screen by effect type so you only see the effects you want or need to see. I dunno if UE5 can do that or if Intrepid is thinking along these lines at all, but that would make it a lot easier to see only what you want to see so you can see the boss' reveal of what they're about to do.
Shoutout to Old Moonshine-brewing Asmongold from the thumbnail.
what steven said, is what i have been trying to say since 2004 about most rpg type games for graphics. spell effects is a different topic in is own right.
2:45 it's how people are, yet loop hero, vampire survivors and valheim are massively popular.
im not big on super stylized art these days, it was cool when we had to do it but we no longer need to, realistic is more immersive, cyberpunk I think was a GREAT example of very realistics with a bit of stylized but not so much that its un immersive
The courtship has began I see a friendship in the future
There are countless examples of good games, with basically no graphics what so ever. And plenty of good looking games, with crap gameplay and story.
Personally, I think this is looking like
its going to be a great looking game, but then the game play is going to be ruined by limitations of those systems and graphics they are working on so hard. Like, game mechanics are going to be simple, and uninteresting, while everyone looks great.
Yup, its even worse when the graphics hold back the gameplay because of ways in which the systems are limited by graphical limits. Its sad. Like want to make a 40v40 pvp game? Nope, game wont be able to handle it.
@@Keldiur I dont think thats true tho. I don't think the people who follow AoC want incredible modern graphics. They want an MMO they can finally latch onto.
oh thank god grass is gonna look better, then i can pretend to touch it
10:40 stylized graphics is used to enhance readability. That's exactly the problem of WC3:R, they simply swapped assets with highly detailed one, and the battles turned into unreadable mess, because some units now are less distinct. Because now they has more details, and now you have to read more details to distinguish one unit from another.
what made wow good at launch was a game that didnt lag when going into a city or with many players around. yes gfx was very good but imo it was the quality of wow that made the game so good.
The graphics and art style for an MMORPG should 100% make optimization of performance as problem free as possible and also age well. This means cartoony looking stuff. It's just the right way to go for longevity.
There was the Ultima Online vs. Runescapers beef. I played UO, and was still playing it when Everquest came out. I played the Beta of EQ and saw nothing that made me want to switch to EQ from UO. But when I got an invite to the closed beta of WoW. . . Holy shit. I no lifed it, then did the same with the open beta. . . Then completely switched from UO to WoW on release.
That thumbnail 😂
That Old Man Asmon thumb is too real
You gotta love how unapologetic Narc is, I too hope he doesn't stick to 1 game.
2:00 that's untrue. A significant part of every dev stream is graphics and design and concepts. It takes at least a quarter of every stream. And even "gameplay" footages are focused on visual aspect.
"But there was gameplay!"
"Seriously?"
"Yes! He chopped down... A tree!"
Yes, while sperging about the graphics.
The thing is, you can drastically change the gameplay of a game, like New World for instance, but changing the graphics is something you can tweak and improve, but not completely change.
There's no way Overwatch is going to start looking like Call of Duty, or visa versa. If you dislike either of their styles, you're going to have to suck it up or move along.
A graphic is a cover of a book. You take it because of a cover, but if a text (gameplay) is boring, you won't waste time on it.
The best part of flat-earthers is they accept every other planet and our sun is round, but only the earth is flat.
Asmongold isn’t right when he says WoW was ground breaking! DAoC was hands down the best game ever made in the genre; however, WoW surpassed it due to how WoW made the gameplay feel like an adventure game (like when you press a button, the action would happen, rather than wait with in a set timer with in the game). WoW lacked when it came to end game compared to DAoC, which was odd considering the war between 2 factions.! (Graphics we’re good in DAoC for it’s time)
so it was groundbreaking lol
He was talking about graphics tho and DAoC did not even look good for its time if you consider L2 came out 2 years after DAoC and WoW 3 years after.
@@xxJing it was groundbreaking in that it broke through to the mainstream. something EQ couldn't quite do. which is why wow has been successful for so long no matter where it is currently
@mystical being89 @Unimportant Account @xxJing
DAoC had RvR when it came to end game though! There was a 3 faction system, with each faction having their own land and with their own relic keeps/relics. If one realm could take a relic from opposing faction and take it to their own relic keep, then the whole faction would get a + to either magic or melee. It would stay that way till some other faction took it. That game was fun as hell all around!
damn hope im still alive when this game finally releases can't wait to play it
People also tend to forget that you can turn other player's spell and ability effects off in ffxiv.
lol the last few days I 100000% thought this guy was Sliker and I was disappointed because I like the ending of his videos and how he creates new fun ways to say people are on copium... Glad this is not the same guy.
Graphics are a bonus. I would play Everquest Online Adventures Frontiers for the ps2 and that game-play and the mechanics were amazing! That game was legit better than WOW and unless you played it you probably wouldn't agree. Played that game for 10yrs. I wish they would bring it back even with the old graphics I don't care.
I absolutely love your coverage of Narc's videos. I'm a huge fan of his and it only makes me a bigger fan of yours.
I like how instead of going bald, his remaining hairs go grey.
im probably a minority but im so tired of this Narc dude trying to be funny all the time.
Graphics don’t make a game fun. Breakpoint is a perfect example of that
Systems aren't fun a spreedsheet is a system , windows is a system , but you wouldn't necesserily call it fun
showing the flashing lights in ff14 like that is disingenious , there's an option to make them minimal in a way they don't ubstruct the gameplay. I don't even play ff14 and find the game rather dull , but I know it was intentionally poorly represented.
I like this guys videos less and less , because at some point copium becomes severe fanboyism.
They devs have absolutely nothing to show In my opinion , there's nothing even in the design that stands out. There's no reason to talk about it , to be copium about it. Let the team work and when it's released we will judge. Let's Be pragmatic about it.
Science isn't really end all because some of the science is up to interpretation. For instance Planks lenght in scientific terms is "the smallest" thing. But in actually we don't know if it Really is, our "system" that is quantum mechanics is all we know at the moment and with that system everything points to planks lenght. There May be a time that we will go one step deeper and it will be no longer holding the title. Same way classical theory is only that a classical theory.
You spend 10 years learning about Newtonian world, then first thing they do in University is laugh and telly you everything you know is wrong.
I value the ability to say "I won't believe until I've seen" more than the ability to laugh at someone , despite yourself probably holding false notion about 90% of the modern science anyway. weather you know that 1% more is really irrelevant , you're both the same in grand scheeme of things. A bunch of headless chicken talking about things they don't know
@@schism2k9 Took alot of brainpower to come up with that 1 liner I bet ... let me wipe your brow for you :)
You’re thinking about it too hard, he just provides content which is just some information with entertainment
@@luccienv The game is not even mid stage alpha they literally just did some combat animations in a controlled enviroment and adapted unreal 5 ... and this is not the first video too :) "just some fun" - idk if you've seen some of the previous ones
An issue with only focusing on graphics is that if you make it multiplayer then you BETTER be a god of optimization or else everyone's gonna stop playing because those that can't play due to unstable framerate will go first, meaning there's less players, meaning the rest go because there's just not enough people to play with.
I play WoW only for the PVP. I'm loving Lost Ark for my PVE adventure because I don't mind playing the free version, so it's kind of guiltless fun.
I remember watching Narc early on like eventually people will take a shine to his content
Also I just noticed this, Asmon got some Dumbledore looking hands 😂
Yea it’s good to see his content picked up … he’s been putting a HUGE amount of effort into edits since the very beginning of the channel. Dude used to be a bread maker & now he’s popping off
Just give me a moment while I cry onto my keyboard at the realization that LOTR is 20 years old.....God damn it, I'm so old....
LOTR is like 75 years old
@@sann6346 I'm on about the films CGI that was mentioned but yeah, Did you read the book by any chance? was thinking about picking it up.
umm,. the ART STYLE of WoW was insanely good. EQ2 graphics was by FAR pushing the tech more AT THE TIME. So big FALSE on that one Asmon.
*source - Me, a genuine old man.
Wows graphics werent groundbreaking. They where stylised and chonky. Surprisingly appealing to a younger audience.
Graphics matter. Like Steven said, they are the icing on the cake the cherry on top. However, a game withoug good solid game play burns up like a shooting star. Eye candy hooks you into taking a look but good game play keeps you playing.
seriously .... people compare future mmos with wow as standard but ignore that fact that DAoC or Warhammer Online or even Ultima Online had things in their games which WoW didnt have, that were groundbreaking and stil being ignored by new mmos. DAoC had the best pvp/rvr system ever.
Dont worry, when the game is released, your gonna have plenty of time to be disappointed.