Thanks so much for addressing this topic. I have been concerned that I might be imperiling my wife's kidney health with some of our plant based diet menu items. This is very helpful
Hi, unrelated question but wanted to know is the Shingles vaccine recommended/safe for CKD 3 patients? I'm considering getting the shot but wanted to ask you advice first. thank you!
Hi, I've been vegan for eight years, wholefood mostly. I developped a kidney stone 4 years ago, and now a second one has come up also. I drink my water, stopped eating spinach and almonds, so I am a bit bummed out 🙂I was wondering why calcium supplements were not recommended, whereas it is ok for us vegan to eat calcium fortified food to meet our needs? What is the difference between taking a pill of calcium carbonate (during a meal), and taking a product that is fortified with the same calcium carbonate? Is calcium citrate a better option? Thanks to both of you for all the info you're putting out there
It is generally because foods that naturally contain calcium and foods that are fortified with calcium come along with other nutrients. They are not just calcium carbonate or calcium citrate on their own. Would highly recommend you do a 24 hour urinalysis to check for what could be off and contributing to your stone formation as it can be different for everyone and an individualized approach is crucial1
@@PlantBasedKidneyHealth Thank you for you answer. But if you take a calcium supplement with your meal, it isn' t like taking a supplement on its own, is it? Especially if it's well balanced and plant based? I did a 24 urinalysis 4 years ago: 8,05 millimoles/24H of calcium (the normal range form the lab is between 2,5 and 7,5, so it was slightly above), and oxalate was 43 mg/24h; N : < 45 I'll take another one in order to find out. At any rate, thank you so much for your answer!
What food can decrease the formation of oxalate crystals? I saw a study saying that trigonelline can prevent their formation, so is fenugreek effective? Are there other foods that can do that?
Some years ago I remember a nutritionist saying juicing w/raw Spinach can elevate oxalates but they could be greatly reduced by slightly cooking the Spinach or reduced by some specific cooking method, is this correct and if so what are the cooking methods to use?
Cooking doesn't not reduce oxalate levels that much, boiling does a bit but take into account that cooking also reduces total net amount of that food as well. So basically you will have even more oxalates per gram.
Boiling does remove some oxalates. But as the person below mentioned, spinach wilts down so much that the amount consumed of cooked spinach would be a lot of raw spinach. For a food like potatoes that doesn't wilt down, more oxalates would be removed in the boiling process.
I am in stage 3 ckd since about three years and have 6 month Nepherologist check up. Though asked several times, he is unable to tell the exactly type of ckd. Frustrated of asking Questions since he seems snobbish.
Ugh that's horrible. So sorry you are experiencing that and aren't getting your questions answered. We are always advocates of getting second opinions and seeking out other providers if you aren't getting the care you want/deserve from your current one!
So probiotic yogurt, for the calcium and protein, not plant based I know, but that a low sodium low fat cheese is one way we cheat a bit to make meals more satisfying. Is low or non-fat yogurt the better choice? We use almond base cheese, but i was concerned about oxalates, so stopped.
The most important thing with yogurt is that it is plain and unsweetened. Low vs non fat does not make a big difference! It's important to pair with lower potential renal acid load foods (like fruit).
Unfortunately I still need to meet your calibre of nephrologist and Renal dietitian Sad to say. I am aHighly trained nurse so I know what I am talking about. Very superficial in treatment of CKD. I have it and get my information from you teachings. They don’t have a clue of when you ask questions. Given up on them. Will continue taking you advice Thank you.
Consuming spices in cooking are not a problem or high in oxalates. When some supplements (like turmeric) are in capsule/supplement form, they could be a problem for someone with high urine oxalate levels. But it would really depend on the indivudal.
Eating foods high in vitamin C is not bad for the kidneys! Foods rich in vitamin C are great. It's high dose vitamin C supplements that are not recommended for people with kidney disease or kidney stones.
@@PlantBasedKidneyHealth Thank you for replying. I'm at at a loss as to what to do here in the UK. I was recently told from a Dr Receptionist by chance that l had stage 3, and after making an appointment with the DR l discussed all my heart meds all of which shouldn't be taken with CKD, his only reply was " wait until you reach stage 4 and we will take it from there " no dietician, no regular blood test, surely his job is to try and prevent reaching stage 4, if it wasn't for you guys l wouldn't have a clue about about anything so thank you to both of you 🤗
Spinach does contain calcium. It is still a very high source of oxalates compared to the calcium it contains. This doesn't mean someone can't consume it. But if they have high urine oxalate levels, they may need to limit/avoid it while also ensuring adequate intake of calcium.
With few exceptions plant food is not human food. All you need is unprocessed meat preferably form ruminants, fish, seafood, dairy, eggs, organ meats, most fresh fruits and honey. With the exception of some fruits this diet will pretty much be oxalate free and super nutrient dense. End of story.
That is not true. High animal protein intake changes the urine chemistry (urine calcium and citrate excretion) and at very high intake levels can increase urinary oxalate excretion. So eating mostly animal protein and a high intake of it (even though meat isn't high in oxalates itself) can actually make someone more susceptible to kidney stones.
@@PlantBasedKidneyHealth 1) Where in my post do I promote "high" intake of protein? I delineated categories not quantities. 2) I mentioned fruits which are high in electrolytes and alkalizing vitamins and minerals which keep the body chemistry in proper order and are designed by nature to actually be consumed so that fruit bearing plants can spread their seeds. Plants on the other hand are full of natural toxins and are not nearly as bioavailable to the body as animal based foods are. That is just an incontrovertible scientific fact. Before you get on your soapbox be sure to not put words in my mouth because you are hearing one thing when I am saying something else. Ideology has no place in nutrition. Only facts count.
Thanks!
Thank you! We appreciate it!
Thanks so much for addressing this topic. I have been concerned that I might be imperiling my wife's kidney health with some of our plant based diet menu items. This is very helpful
Our pleasure! We are glad you found it helpful!
Thank you for this excellent episode!
Thanks for tuning in! :)
Thank you both for this vital information!
Our pleasure! Thanks for tuning in!
How do you determine if there are oxalates in other parts of the body like the knees?
Hi, unrelated question but wanted to know is the Shingles vaccine recommended/safe for CKD 3 patients? I'm considering getting the shot but wanted to ask you advice first. thank you!
Hi, I've been vegan for eight years, wholefood mostly. I developped a kidney stone 4 years ago, and now a second one has come up also. I drink my water, stopped eating spinach and almonds, so I am a bit bummed out 🙂I was wondering why calcium supplements were not recommended, whereas it is ok for us vegan to eat calcium fortified food to meet our needs? What is the difference between taking a pill of calcium carbonate (during a meal), and taking a product that is fortified with the same calcium carbonate? Is calcium citrate a better option? Thanks to both of you for all the info you're putting out there
It is generally because foods that naturally contain calcium and foods that are fortified with calcium come along with other nutrients. They are not just calcium carbonate or calcium citrate on their own. Would highly recommend you do a 24 hour urinalysis to check for what could be off and contributing to your stone formation as it can be different for everyone and an individualized approach is crucial1
@@PlantBasedKidneyHealth Thank you for you answer. But if you take a calcium supplement with your meal, it isn' t like taking a supplement on its own, is it? Especially if it's well balanced and plant based? I did a 24 urinalysis 4 years ago: 8,05 millimoles/24H of calcium (the normal range form the lab is between 2,5 and 7,5, so it was slightly above), and oxalate was 43 mg/24h; N : < 45 I'll take another one in order to find out. At any rate, thank you so much for your answer!
What food can decrease the formation of oxalate crystals? I saw a study saying that trigonelline can prevent their formation, so is fenugreek effective?
Are there other foods that can do that?
Dear Dr, I would suggest you to look into Dr Brook goldener's method of treating Kidney diseases with high oxalate foods. Please make a video on it.
Some years ago I remember a nutritionist saying juicing w/raw Spinach can elevate oxalates but they could be greatly reduced by slightly cooking the Spinach or reduced by some specific cooking method, is this correct and if so what are the cooking methods to use?
Cooking doesn't not reduce oxalate levels that much, boiling does a bit but take into account that cooking also reduces total net amount of that food as well. So basically you will have even more oxalates per gram.
Boiling does remove some oxalates. But as the person below mentioned, spinach wilts down so much that the amount consumed of cooked spinach would be a lot of raw spinach. For a food like potatoes that doesn't wilt down, more oxalates would be removed in the boiling process.
We were both spinach addicts, as well as almonds and peanuts, so we cut them way back.
I am in stage 3 ckd since about three years and have 6 month Nepherologist check up.
Though asked several times, he is unable to tell the exactly type of ckd.
Frustrated of asking Questions since he seems snobbish.
Ugh that's horrible. So sorry you are experiencing that and aren't getting your questions answered. We are always advocates of getting second opinions and seeking out other providers if you aren't getting the care you want/deserve from your current one!
" What type of CKD" l didn't know there was more than one 🤔
Can you take Calcium Citrate if you are dairy intolerant?
So probiotic yogurt, for the calcium and protein, not plant based I know, but that a low sodium low fat cheese is one way we cheat a bit to make meals more satisfying. Is low or non-fat yogurt the better choice? We use almond base cheese, but i was concerned about oxalates, so stopped.
The most important thing with yogurt is that it is plain and unsweetened. Low vs non fat does not make a big difference! It's important to pair with lower potential renal acid load foods (like fruit).
How does eating 1-2 oranges (not juice) or kiwi a day play into this issue? Is the vitamin C too much or do other benefits overshadow it?
The vitamin C content of whole fruit is not an issue! It's high dose vitamin C supplementation that is recommended to be avoided.
@@PlantBasedKidneyHealth Thank you!
@@PlantBasedKidneyHealthwait so would lemon juice if your going to consume lots of things with oxalates be helpful?
What @nathaniel asked...
Bicarbonates?? Like the baking soda thing?
Unfortunately I still need to meet your calibre of nephrologist and Renal dietitian Sad to say. I am aHighly trained nurse so I know what I am talking about. Very superficial in treatment of CKD. I have it and get my information from you teachings. They don’t have a clue of when you ask questions. Given up on them. Will continue taking you advice Thank you.
I have kidney disease and am a conspicuous consumer of many spices, does that mean i am one of those oxalate monsterm'n you guys are talking about?
Consuming spices in cooking are not a problem or high in oxalates. When some supplements (like turmeric) are in capsule/supplement form, they could be a problem for someone with high urine oxalate levels. But it would really depend on the indivudal.
Are carrots bad for kidneys aren't they high in vitamin C
Eating foods high in vitamin C is not bad for the kidneys! Foods rich in vitamin C are great. It's high dose vitamin C supplements that are not recommended for people with kidney disease or kidney stones.
@@PlantBasedKidneyHealth Thank you for replying. I'm at at a loss as to what to do here in the UK. I was recently told from a Dr Receptionist by chance that l had stage 3, and after making an appointment with the DR l discussed all my heart meds all of which shouldn't be taken with CKD, his only reply was " wait until you reach stage 4 and we will take it from there " no dietician, no regular blood test, surely his job is to try and prevent reaching stage 4, if it wasn't for you guys l wouldn't have a clue about about anything so thank you to both of you 🤗
Spinich is high in oxilates but isn't also high in calcium?
Spinach does contain calcium. It is still a very high source of oxalates compared to the calcium it contains. This doesn't mean someone can't consume it. But if they have high urine oxalate levels, they may need to limit/avoid it while also ensuring adequate intake of calcium.
@@PlantBasedKidneyHealth thank you, I don't know my oxalate levels. I will ask next doctor visit.
What's funny is that many of the vegan foods with high calcium also are high in oxalates.
Yep, exactly. Many foods high in oxalates are also higher in calcium and magnesium. Making the oxalate less absorbed.
How high is high vit.c supplement? 500mg?,1000? I take a 200mg capsule a day.
Typically 500 mg or more is considered high dose for a vitamin C supplement.
@@PlantBasedKidneyHealth Thanks!
@@PlantBasedKidneyHealthHi, what effect do carrots have on the kidneys are they also high in vitamin C thank you
With few exceptions plant food is not human food. All you need is unprocessed meat preferably form ruminants, fish, seafood, dairy, eggs, organ meats, most fresh fruits and honey. With the exception of some fruits this diet will pretty much be oxalate free and super nutrient dense. End of story.
That is not true. High animal protein intake changes the urine chemistry (urine calcium and citrate excretion) and at very high intake levels can increase urinary oxalate excretion. So eating mostly animal protein and a high intake of it (even though meat isn't high in oxalates itself) can actually make someone more susceptible to kidney stones.
@@PlantBasedKidneyHealth 1) Where in my post do I promote "high" intake of protein? I delineated categories not quantities. 2) I mentioned fruits which are high in electrolytes and alkalizing vitamins and minerals which keep the body chemistry in proper order and are designed by nature to actually be consumed so that fruit bearing plants can spread their seeds. Plants on the other hand are full of natural toxins and are not nearly as bioavailable to the body as animal based foods are. That is just an incontrovertible scientific fact. Before you get on your soapbox be sure to not put words in my mouth because you are hearing one thing when I am saying something else. Ideology has no place in nutrition. Only facts count.